[Tommy]

Info: T'other day I abseiled down from the Embankment ledge at Millstone, and went down the line of 10000 Maniacs / Elm Street. Obviously would never consider leading it so had a look on the way down out of (very) idle curiousity. Not sure if this is regarded as a protectable route or not but I saw possible placements for sliders (placed one to check), small cams (probably BD C3s) and *maybe* Peenuts and smallest tri-cams. Don't know how well some of it would hold nor how feasible it would be to place but combined with a stack of pads this would seem pretty ripe for a ground-up pad-point.

Question: 6b "wall" direct start to Twikker, where does it go?? Cheers.

Elm St - protection doesn't work. I presume you placed the slider in that very small shallow 2 finger crimpy pocket? It takes up a vital hold in that case. There's small nut near the top, but it's 6a by then so no point. Having come off this route at the crux earlier in the year onto a couple of pads and the subsequent 1 month's layoff of hard climbing and 6 months ankle fixing, I'd not recommend it! Adrian was certainly ahead ahead of his time with this.

6b start to Twikker goes up the rightward slanting steep flake below the ledge. It's a pretty pointless start to an already classic route.

[nik at work]

I thought the crux was the first move, good effort to sprockle yourself on that .
With a LOT of mats it could be ground-up soloed by a suitable talent I would have thought...

On the point of gear the route was originally claimed as a lead called 10000 Maniacs by Chris someone at E7 (I think) but for some reason the claim was discounted. I have heard (and this could all be bollocks) that this guy was fiercely strong but really short, apparently he could lock out either arm at waist height!?! Then Mr Berry came along several years later and soloed elm st. So yes it can be done on gear if this Chris guy is to believed, but I can't think how you could place gear and climb the route (by saying that I am in no way disounting his ascent) as every hold (i.e. potential gear placement) is needed for hands/feet so nothing spare for gear. Mind you I'm not strong. Anyway it makes sense as a solo to me.

Get to it fiend, I'll lend you a mat.....

[Tommy]

ha ha!    Wish the first move was the crux..... be easy then eh? 

[nik at work]

Well if you're me it is the crux. Mind you the rest is still pretty tricky.....

[andy popp]

It was Chris Parker I think. I remember meeting him. He wasn't just short but had some sort of condition - not dwarfism I think but something. Certainly had v. short levers but he was seen as a bit of dubious character when it came to claims. This one was never accepted - though on what basis it was rejected I never knew.

[nik at work]

I heard that he suffered from polio as a child which affected his development. Again this could just be a maggotty apple that has fallen from the rumour tree so apply the usual quantity of salt...

[andy popp]

No, I think that's right now you mention it. Seemed nice enough but this route would have been very, very futuristic at the time he claimed it.

[Fiend]

Elm St - protection doesn't work. I presume you placed the slider in that very small shallow 2 finger crimpy pocket? It takes up a vital hold in that case. There's small nut near the top, but it's 6a by then so no point. Having come off this route at the crux earlier in the year onto a couple of pads and the subsequent 1 month's layoff of hard climbing and 6 months ankle fixing, I'd not recommend it! Adrian was certainly ahead ahead of his time with this.

6b start to Twikker goes up the rightward slanting steep flake below the ledge. It's a pretty pointless start to an already classic route.

Errr the slider and possible cams were in vertical peg scars. The horizontal crimpy pocket slightly right of the seam didn't look so protectable.

I don't really know it's well out of my league, I just thought it might be useful to mention so that potential ground-uppers could go up and have a look to see whether they liked the pro situation, rather than assuming there wasn't any.

[Fiend]

Impossible Slab...

i don't remember putting gear in the crack to the right on the bottom half of impossible. i may however have cocked a foot over there though, dunno if it was the nutcrack or what though.

I remember shitting myself at the start of impossible slab. Also that it was one of the worst routes I've ever done on grit. Absolute shite.

it was one of the worst routes I've ever done on grit. Absolute shite.

second that...

second that...

thirded. a complete waste of time.

I seem to recall that a nut in the lower crack on the right of impossible slab lowered the grade to E2, though exactly where I read that I'm not sure.

I think it's gear in the crack to the right higher up that reduces it to E2. Or somethnig contrived like that.

Yes, on impossible slab, put in runners wherever you like. This really isn't the sort of route where you'd be pleased if you hurt yourself, with continually bland moves in a painfully contrived position with artificially enforced danger.

That's the description for the next Stanage guide sorted then 

Imposible Slab E3 5c - This really isn't the sort of route where you'd be pleased if you hurt yourself, with continually bland moves in a painfully contrived position with artificially enforced danger.

LOL

So.

I did it this weekend. Did the first tricky move to stand in the break. Leant right and with some difficulty due to sweating fingers, slodged a friend in the crack. Did the hard crux move up to the vertical flake. Continued up to the wide breaks, overcammed as many friends as I could fit in. Briskly leapt onto the top slab. Realised I was committed, the holds hard run out, and the gear was quite distant. Got scared and swore a lot. Found a little nothing to pull on and finished.

I'll take E3 5c ** for that. I thought it was actually rather good. Although the gear situation low down is a bit odd (it is still obviously not E3 to do it without a side-runner there), the moves were cool. And the upper bit was as good - and as uncontrived - a gritstone slab experience as any.

So there we go.

As is traditional with me, a question:

Dark Entries - this is the route right of Soyuz @ Apollo buttress on Curbar. Basically it looks very good. However, I need to know one thing - is there serious deck-out potential after one moves away from the finger flake on the left?? Don't want to know gear type, sizes, position, or any of that. Just: Is it really serious or is it a survivable proposition??

Ta in advance.

[andy popp]

Can't really remember (sorry) but Forbidden Planet is much, much better.

[Fiend]

Can't really remember (sorry) but Forbidden Planet is much, much better harder.

Well maybe just a bit harder. It does look good but is somewhat beyond me for now. Maybe in the future.

[Tommy]

Dark Entries is runout, but not that dangerous. You could possibly deck it but you'd be very unlucky I suppose. Good sustained slopey climbing.

[Fiend]

Hmmm, gotta get stronger at it I guess. More stamina training on slopers.

[Jaspersharpe]

Fiend you probably know but there is a photo of someone doing this route with preplaced gear on the Cocktalk database thing. I'll not post it but it looks to be rather well protected unless the gear he has in is all shit.

[Fiend]

Cheers Jasper, couldn't resist checking it out. Sport route eh!! Those breaks didn't look great from the plethora of angles I checked them out from. I'll take that as "there is something and it may or may not be good".

[Fiend]

Some knowledge for the esotericists:

Jelly Ache E3 5d ***, Cocking Tor - somewhere in between the old BMC and new Rockfax grades, but a mightly good route. Only a 2 move wonder but each is worth a star, as is the line. Classic gritstone.

The Phantom E4 5c ***, Gradbach Hill - file under "safe but scary"! If one is not too distracted by fear, this offers rather good moves in addition to the "classic Staffordshire head game" vibes. And the all-important summit experience.

[Fiend]

Knowledge please.

The Wasteland, E4 5c **, Charnel Stones, Chew Valley...

Total death-on-a-stick or very-bold-but-possible-to-avoid-ground-with-fast-belayer-or similar??*

(* There is a picture of Andy Perkins on it in the Chew 4x4x4x4 On The Edge article, showing gear in a break that, when tallied with the guidebook diagram, looks possibly like it could save you)

I'm not over enthused with the idea of trekking up there (and driving over there) to find out it's too terminal. Obviously if it was Curbar nor Charnel Stones I'd go look myself. But it isn't.

[Fiend]

Dark Entries is runout, but not that dangerous. You could possibly deck it but you'd be very unlucky I suppose. Good sustained slopey climbing.

Hmmmm. In the Curbar script at tough E3 5c, with the line joining Soyuz....does that make more sense??

[paul hesketh]

Knowledge please.

The Wasteland, E4 5c **, Charnel Stones, Chew Valley...

was up there afew years ago, there is gear and it would save you...though not after a long tumble first

might be worth giving it a brush first

Ste_d posting as Paul_h

[Fiend]

was up there afew years ago, there is gear and it would save you...though not after a long tumble first

might be worth giving it a brush first

That's the sort of knowledge I'm after, ta.