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Kilter Board (Read 9331 times)

petejh

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Kilter Board
October 13, 2019, 04:09:35 pm
Just noticed the Beacon are installing a Kilter Board, should be ready tomorrow. Anybody used one? Good/bad?

Mandatory horrible promo film.. hadn't realised there were so many professional climbers. Skip to 4.03 - 'the wolfpack ninjas'  ... :look:


abarro81

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#1 Re: Kilter Board
October 13, 2019, 04:26:04 pm
Think the Wolfpack ninjas thing relates to an American ninja warrior (i.e. the TV show) team or something along those lines?

Never used one so can't on the board..

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#2 Re: Kilter Board
October 13, 2019, 06:45:59 pm
It's the first in the UK Pete, so maybe ask a yank?

I'm quite psyched but haven't waded through all the info yet. You run it off your phone via a bluetooth app, again this week is learning week. We should have a tablet set up for those without posh phones.
I also think we've still got a week or so before its public ready

remus

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#3 Re: Kilter Board
October 13, 2019, 09:10:00 pm
From what I've heard it isn't that good, the major weak point being the app and a lack of surrounding community. Sounds like a bit of a chicken and egg problem...needs good problems to attract people, but people don't want to use it if there's not a good selection of problems.

The above seems fixable though, so maybe in a few years it'll be the dogs bollocks.

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#4 Re: Kilter Board
October 13, 2019, 09:18:27 pm
Iíve had maybe five sessions on them. My favourite board (apart from traditional woodie). So much better than a moon board. Holds so much nicer and the LED system is really good. Change in angle is handy and I havenít found an issue with number of problems or community. Very large number of problems and lots of Instagram videos linked into the app (I think this feature Moon has just copied into its app).

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#5 Re: Kilter Board
October 14, 2019, 05:08:37 pm
My issue is the pricing.  They're off the charts.  Means it'll be really rare for home users to be able to afford one. 

I've heard very good things about the holds though, and most seem to like that it goes super steep. 

petejh

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#6 Re: Kilter Board
December 05, 2019, 11:04:59 am
So after a long delay the Beacon finally had their kilter holds delivered. Had my first sesh on the board last. Thoughts:

Good points
The holds are brilliant. Texture is perfect, interesting shapes, joint-friendly, the sizes of hold are perfect for the 45 angle the Beacon have chosen to go with (it's not an adjustable set-up). Maybe a lack of pure boning holds like the Moonboard yellows but at 45 angle they aren't required.
Size of board is massive! 12'x12' - loads of room for creative problem-setting and you can make 2-3 big moves and still have room to spare. The moonboard feels cramped in comparison.
The size means it will also be a brilliant tool for training savage short PE - I reckon if you locked Shark in a room for a month with a bag of creatine and a Kitler board he'd emerge to crush the Oak with plenty of energy to spare to tow up a tight rope.
Variability of setting footholds works really well - you can set screw-ons only / feet follow hands / mixture - makes it easier to set interesting cool problems.
Quickly creating new problems is simple and quick with the app, and having loads of hold options for feet means you can easily tweak the difficulty up or down.
The lighting system is perfect - easy to see from below and above.
The 45 angle works well for a range of hold sizes from jug to small. Wouldn't want to go steeper.
It looks plush! Feels like you're using a deluxe expensive piece of equipment.
App is very good, bug-free from what I could tell, easy to use. Problems in the app have a beta symbol next to them where if you want you can watch an embedded vid of the problem.
Loads of problems in the app, you won't run out.
Grades of the probs I tried (up to low 7s) seemed fair, no silly 'warmup 6s' that are 7b but no doubt they exist.
Large grade range - the warmup 6s are just as fun as the harder problems.

Bad points
It's expensive..but not my problem.
that's it!


Well impressed. I'm a fan of the moonboard and I'm a little sad to say the Kilter is just miles better, the next step. The beacon finally, for the first time in their history, has a good board and decent training room :) Think I'll be purchasing a subscription for winter.. Now all they need to do for another first time in their history is to turn on the hot water for paying customers to use.. stingebags.

« Last Edit: December 05, 2019, 11:10:06 am by petejh »

Paul B

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#7 Re: Kilter Board
December 05, 2019, 01:02:26 pm
Now all they need to do for another first time in their history is to turn on the hot water for paying customers to use.. stingebags.

Don't building regs require them to provide hot water (for the basins near to or adjacent to their loos)?

petejh

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#8 Re: Kilter Board
December 05, 2019, 01:23:25 pm
I don't know. I know that construction industry regulations certainly require provision of hot water in welfare facilities on construction sites.
During the time I've been going to the Beacon, from the 90s at their old premises to now at their current one, I can't remember the hot water taps in the men's toilets ever working. No water comes out. I've always thought it's a stingy attitude towards people who are paying ten quid to use your otherwise pretty good facility.

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#9 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 04:58:45 pm
Had my eye on the Kilter Board for a while, looks incredibly well done! Does anyone know how much it actually is?!

tk421a

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#10 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 05:45:55 pm
https://rockcity.co.uk/kilter-board-holds-and-leds/

11,760 Inc vat for the holds + LEDs.

Or about 4x a moonboard set.

petejh

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#11 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 07:06:24 pm
Crazy  :blink:  And that's just for the holds and LEDs.. Need to add on 12x12 of panels, plus T-nuts and bolts. Plus the not inconsiderable time to drill and fix all those T-nuts and possibly paint the panels.

The Moonboard price includes the panels, which come painted, pre-drilled and T-nutted, plus bolts.

Duma

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#12 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 09:00:06 pm
That's mental!

Think they don't really fulfil the same function - a MB is a feasible option for individuals and smaller walls, this just isn't - for both cost and size constraints. They do look well plush though. Really wish the MB just had a better thought out set of holds - all the rest is just fluff really, now its got screw on feet etc.

tomtom

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#13 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 09:06:12 pm
Donít underestimate how much mark up RockCity have on that... :D

Oldmanmatt

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#14 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 09:22:08 pm
Crazy  :blink:  And that's just for the holds and LEDs.. Need to add on 12x12 of panels, plus T-nuts and bolts. Plus the not inconsiderable time to drill and fix all those T-nuts and possibly paint the panels.

The Moonboard price includes the panels, which come painted, pre-drilled and T-nutted, plus bolts.

Plus, for the money you could get two Moonboards, a 20 and a 40; giving you a much more versatile set up.

Or, like I did, get a Moonboard (40) and a Lattice board (30), then add wooden holds to the Lattice.

In fact, all the wood and holds, in my main bouldering room...

And you still need matting. I think youíre looking at 5-6K there...
(Our main room cost ~26K for matting and that was Semi ďhome madeĒ rather than branded).

Nah.

Deffo rather turn on the water heaters.

Coops_13

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#15 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 10:22:42 pm
Crazy  :blink:  And that's just for the holds and LEDs.. Need to add on 12x12 of panels, plus T-nuts and bolts. Plus the not inconsiderable time to drill and fix all those T-nuts and possibly paint the panels.

The Moonboard price includes the panels, which come painted, pre-drilled and T-nutted, plus bolts.

Plus, for the money you could get two Moonboards, a 20 and a 40; giving you a much more versatile set up.

Or, like I did, get a Moonboard (40) and a Lattice board (30), then add wooden holds to the Lattice.
I'd probably disagree and say one of the big kilter boards that Pete mentioned would be more versatile if you get the changing angle one (10 - 70 deg possible I think).

IMO ranking of boards I like:
Old school woodie with 60-40 ratio wood to resin holds (45 or 50 deg)
Variable angle Kilter Board
Variable angle Tension Board
Moon Board
Resin-only board...

Oldmanmatt

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#16 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 10:25:05 pm
Crazy  :blink:  And that's just for the holds and LEDs.. Need to add on 12x12 of panels, plus T-nuts and bolts. Plus the not inconsiderable time to drill and fix all those T-nuts and possibly paint the panels.

The Moonboard price includes the panels, which come painted, pre-drilled and T-nutted, plus bolts.

Plus, for the money you could get two Moonboards, a 20 and a 40; giving you a much more versatile set up.

Or, like I did, get a Moonboard (40) and a Lattice board (30), then add wooden holds to the Lattice.
I'd probably disagree and say one of the big kilter boards that Pete mentioned would be more versatile if you get the changing angle one (10 - 70 deg possible I think).

IMO ranking of boards I like:
Old school woodie with 60-40 ratio wood to resin holds (45 or 50 deg)
Variable angle Kilter Board
Variable angle Tension Board
Moon Board
Resin-only board...

Yes,
However, thatís even more pricey (£18K inc VAT).
AKA 4x Moonboards 40,30,20 and 10⁰ and a Lattice board and almost all the required matting.

So, to edit again...
Thatís £38160 (inc VAT).

The Bunker (in itís most basic iteration, at opening) with 126m≤ matting, 250m≤ bouldering wall, a fully furnished cafe, fully equipped training room (12m x 7m), ~2000 shiny new Core holds and so on; cost ~£56K including hiring a pro to do the heavy carpentry (Somebodyís fool, really good, and knocked off Cider soak in a couple after work sessions. Hey Simon).
« Last Edit: December 06, 2019, 10:57:01 pm by Oldmanmatt »

teestub

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#17 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 10:36:16 pm
The amount of Moonboards one has at varying angles does not make their choice of holds any better!

I understand the attraction of the Moonboard being first on the market and the price point, but the Kilter board seems like an all round better product.

What does the cost difference equate to for a wall, 5k is what 500-600 entry costs, so a few days for one of the big walls.

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#18 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 10:39:49 pm
My issue is the pricing.  They're off the charts.  Means it'll be really rare for home users to be able to afford one. 

I've heard very good things about the holds though, and most seem to like that it goes super steep.

Yup - As I said earlier.  It's just off the table for home users. 

Oldmanmatt

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#19 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 10:59:15 pm
The amount of Moonboards one has at varying angles does not make their choice of holds any better!

I understand the attraction of the Moonboard being first on the market and the price point, but the Kilter board seems like an all round better product.

What does the cost difference equate to for a wall, 5k is what 500-600 entry costs, so a few days for one of the big walls.

Thatís just the holds!
The complete set up is £38K

Yossarian

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#20 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 11:07:54 pm
A Lattice board is £2k and has zero fun problems. On that basis a massive multi-angle Kilter board looks like a bargain...

petejh

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#21 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 11:08:21 pm
I think most walls would choose to do what the Beacon have, which is to just buy the kilter holds and LEDs and put them on an own-build fixed angle board rather than blowing the budget on purchasing the kilter adjustable board. The 45 angle feels spot on to me. Works out as £10,000 plus panelling, matting and build cost this way.

edit: surely you could build a lattice board for a couple of hundred quid by cnc'ing some timber banisters and screwing them on in a criss-cross pattern..

Oldmanmatt

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#22 Re: Kilter Board
December 06, 2019, 11:48:35 pm
I think most walls would choose to do what the Beacon have, which is to just buy the kilter holds and LEDs and put them on an own-build fixed angle board rather than blowing the budget on purchasing the kilter adjustable board. The 45 angle feels spot on to me. Works out as £10,000 plus panelling, matting and build cost this way.

edit: surely you could build a lattice board for a couple of hundred quid by cnc'ing some timber banisters and screwing them on in a criss-cross pattern..

Shhhh!

SA Chris

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#23 Re: Kilter Board
December 09, 2019, 09:07:45 am
I'm sure given the hundreds of designs there out there, no need for the cnc-ing

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#24 Re: Kilter Board
December 09, 2019, 10:21:46 am
Got the honor of jumping on the brand new, crispy kilter board just as beacon pulled the ropes back.

My thoughts:
- Holds are far nicer than MB, and with great texture. They are well rounded in places you want them to be and dont have that horrible habit of being sharp in unexpected places the MB has.
- BIG
- very easy to see where you are going because of the lighting system, this was a superb idea.
- Suffers from MB syndrome, in that a lot of the holds are, realistically, too big and good. What this meant is that a lot of the problems requires enormous moves between good holds. Now this is not necessarily a problem at all if you like that, but for me it transfers less well to outdoor (particularly NW) bouldering than less enormous moves between worse holds. I also suspect that it will result in the same madness that I have seen in the MB, where for every decent problem there are 2 or 3 with ridiculous contrived movements, usually requiring a campus/rose-move/awkward pogo shoulder dyno with no feet.
- As a counterpoint to the above, apparently there is a 'harder' hold set to go with the board. This may alleviate the aforementioned problems, though I suspect it will be prohibitively difficult for most people and will never be seen. The current set is probably a better choice for maximum usability.

I really enjoyed my 20 minute play on it, but I don't train on a 45 ever (don't have on at my local) so the novelty value was doubly high.

 

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