[Danny]

Just back from by first trip to Font in quite a few years. Quite shocked by how blown out some of the footholds are compared to when I was last there. Are there any hold stabilisation initiatives on the go, like the stuff we're seeing on the luck based scrittle over here? If not there absolutely should be. Bloody hell!

[Bradders]

Can you give some examples?

When were you last there?

Personally I went in March and honestly thought that everything looked in very good shape! Was impressed by the general lack of litter, tick marks, erosion, excessive chalk and hordes of people, including at popular areas like Canche aux Merciers, Cuisiniere and Isatis.

[Moo]

I was thinking that this year. Considering the popularity of cuvier even some of the classics there are holding up relatively well.

[36chambers]

The only shocking ones I've noticed recently were on some of the easy problems at L'Elephant.

Some of the footholds wouldn't look out of place at Bridestones. 

[Danny]

Can you give some examples?

When were you last there?

Personally I went in March and honestly thought that everything looked in very good shape! Was impressed by the general lack of litter, tick marks, erosion, excessive chalk and hordes of people, including at popular areas like Canche aux Merciers, Cuisiniere and Isatis.

2012. One that really shocked me was the foothold on L'Oeuf at Petit Bois which, IIRC was a little dink last time and now is a 20 cm channel. Loads at Buthiers. I recall Formis Rouge was bad last time but didn't get anywhere near Cuvier this time.

[Danny]

Buthiers: that 7A ramp thing and the Lady Big Claque starting footholds. Stuff around the Coccinelle. I realise a lot of the stuff in the south is softer, which is exactly why it needs a bit of TLC. IMO.

[reeve]

I was told that the foothold on l'oeuf used to be a smear but was chipped - so maybe that's why it has eroded so dramatically. Either that or I was royally sandbagged as I avoided using it and struggled to get off the floor

[Plattsy]

There's a video of L'Oeuf on Bleau.info from July 2015 for comparison. The chip doesn't appear on another earlier video (maybe from 2007)  where they don't appear to use that foothold for the start anyway. So you weren't that sandbagged reeve 

[Fiend]

All the footholds I found were totally solid....


.....and ex-poffed and polished to fuckery!

[Johnny Brown]

Pof and polish are surely preferable to blown-out channels? 

[Will Hunt]

Is there any factual comparison anywhere between pof and chalk. In particular, the effects of pof usage on the rock?
There was an absolute shitshow of a thread on the Yorkshire Grit Bouldering Facebook group recently where Saltbeef posted a photo of The Drey, said that he'd cleared up some rubbish from beneath it and noted that "morons" had graffiti'd the rock and had a fire.

The photo showed the Drey with what I thought was a fairly normal amount of chalk on it - by no means no chalk, and with one moderate donkey line which looked to have been brushed. The graffiti looked like it'd been done in coloured marker pen (i.e. fine tipped as opposed to sprayed on) and had been done only onto the patches of chalk. Saltbeef asked whether anybody knew how this graffiti might be safely removed.

A parade of specimens then fell over each other in a desperate, hand-wringing bid to signal their own virtue. They queued up to say how disgusting the chalk on the boulder was, that it was caked on, that chalk was graffiti in it's own right, that the graffiti wouldn't have been there were it not for the disgusting chalk, that it was abhorrent to label as "morons" the people who had fires under boulders, left their litter there, and graffiti'd the rock and nearby trees etc etc. Eventually somebody piped up to say that this wouldn't happen in Font because they use "natural chalk" there which is applied by whacking the rock with a cotton rag. At no point did a single person say, "thank you for picking up their rubbish".

It was only when I started to reply to this that I realised that, although I know that we all agree that pof shouldn't be used, I don't actually fully understand why this is the case, other than some vague chat about it polishing the rock. How does this happen? A build up of resin over the texture of the rock that is difficult/impossible to remove?

[tomtom]

So about 8-10 years ago some tool poffed key holds around Demon Wall Roof. Notably the crimps on the face and the nice slopers and crimpy edges on Dreamland.

This left them (and the rock around them) shiny and slick for probably 2-3 years (you could certainly see the sheen in sunlight around the holds a couple of years on).

[Bradders]

I've always wondered why the Dreamland holds are so flipping shiny and frictionless! They're still bad now!

[SA Chris]

How does this happen? A build up of resin over the texture of the rock that is difficult/impossible to remove?

Pretty much. Imagine layer upon layer of resin dust applied to the rock. For 5 minutes it is sticky, but as soon as it is loaded or slipped off, the pressure applied bonds it to the rock, or the layer already there. It is then left to cure (heat and cool) over a period of time, before more is applied. The cumulative result is like a glaze on a piece of pottery. Frictionless and hard to remove. Although I would suspect that enough of an appropriate solvent  / acid would clear a lot of it.

[AlistairB]

2012. One that really shocked me was the foothold on L'Oeuf at Petit Bois which, IIRC was a little dink last time and now is a 20 cm channel. Loads at Buthiers. I recall Formis Rouge was bad last time but didn't get anywhere near Cuvier this time.

That one on L'Oeuf is quite fucked, I thought it looked fairly blatantly chipped and assumed this was why. It was the bit after that that gave me problems though!

Formis Rouge is a bit sandy on the very first hold but I don't think it's getting any worse, not on the timescale of my Big 4 siege anyway. Needs a bit of care with where / how you stand on it when you get higher, I'm not sure how this could be reinforced though?

I thought it was sad to see a number of recent (past few years) hold breaks that have changed problems (Tigre et Dragon, Big Dragon and Surplomb Statique are the ones I saw). The first two of those were only vague long-term aspirations for me but it was sad to see that all of these have got harder (and seemingly less good) by hold breaks within the past few years. I don't know how true it is but there's some chat in the bleau.info comments about people not letting holds dry properly being the cause, either way I hope this trend doesn't continue.

[Fiend]

Pof and polish are surely preferable to blown-out channels?

Yes, true. Although a happy medium of normal solid rock is ideal (I did find plenty like that too).

One thing apparent at most areas was the vast discrepancy between over-used, over-chalked, over-tickmarked problems and neglected, mossy, dusty problems, scarcely a pof-rag's flick away - the same honeypotting and myopia that's happening at most venues, I guess. I must confess that I didn't do so much to redress the balance apart from failing on a few under-used problems and brushing a few over-used ones, but spreading the load could certainly be encouraged more.

[spidermonkey09]

I've always wondered why the Dreamland holds are so flipping shiny and frictionless! They're still bad now!

Wonder why DWR has recovered and Dreamland hasn't? Clearly need to send Vybz to start doing innumerable eliminates in the area around Dreamland. He's got the magic touch.

[Paul B]

I was told that the foothold on l'oeuf used to be a smear but was chipped - so maybe that's why it has eroded so dramatically. Either that or I was royally sandbagged as I avoided using it and struggled to get off the floor

Ditto, but I wasn't avoiding anything (so hopefully pre-chip).

[Will Hunt]

I've always wondered why the Dreamland holds are so flipping shiny and frictionless! They're still bad now!

Wonder why DWR has recovered and Dreamland hasn't? Clearly need to send Vybz to start doing innumerable eliminates in the area around Dreamland. He's got the magic touch.

You're too late!
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=512643

"Sitter doesn't add much". *Records SDS as 2 grades harder than the stand*
 

[36chambers]

"Sitter doesn't add much" <= opinion
*Records SDS as 2 grades harder than the stand* <= the grade given elsewhere
 

Not everyone goes around waving their willy and calling it facts.


edit: I call mine the truth, but that's a different joke entirely...

[tomtom]

I've always wondered why the Dreamland holds are so flipping shiny and frictionless! They're still bad now!

Wonder why DWR has recovered and Dreamland hasn't? Clearly need to send Vybz to start doing innumerable eliminates in the area around Dreamland. He's got the magic touch.

Probably because on DWR it’s in two sharpish crimps and on dreamland polished slopers/little edges.

[andy_e]

I thought Dreamland suffered from being the footholds of a Severe?

[tomtom]

I thought Dreamland suffered from being the footholds of a Severe?

I've never seen anyone on that S - but probably... anyway the trick to holding THAT sloper on Dreamland is to have your hand(s) angled in at 45 degrees (as in elbows sticking out) and it suddenly becomes a bit easier. Love - I mean really love the next move stepping up from that...

[Fiend]

Severes have rights too!!

[SA Chris]

The Severe was there first!