[Moo]

F*cking Bitch

[Oldmanmatt]

You must have room to put up a few Logos?

[Nick B]

A National comp, of National importance, supported by the walls that benefit from the sport's increased profile?

I don't even perceive it as being an important competition any more. The BMC have cocked it up by putting it on the same weekend as a world cup, half way through the season. Shauna, for instance, won't even be able to defend her title. It used to be the selection event for the team, but it's not that either. It seems daft that anyone would organise the comp at such a pointless time of the year. Another in a long line of fuck ups from the BMC when it comes to competitions.

[a dense loner]

The same as last year. How can you have the bbc's when the top comp climbers are away? I don't care about comps but it's a bizarre state of affairs !

[Nigel]

Like Dense I couldn't give a monkey's ballsack about comps, but having a "British Champion" culled from a crop of also-rans while the best comp climbers are away doing the WC's seems mental. I propose the BMC just give the £500 to Shauna and fuck the comp off.

[Paul B]

The same as last year. How can you have the bbc's when the top comp climbers are away? I don't care about comps but it's a bizarre state of affairs !

How the hell does that even happen?

[Doylo]

Sounds shite

[rodma]

I hadn't realised there was a clash again.

Not much reason for it either, given it's not actually part off cliffhanger.

Ah well, got my entry in anyway.

Sent from my phone using piss other highly strung ukbers off

[Oldmanmatt]

I didn't realise either, seems a tad daft.

[GraemeA]

Great over reaction there chaps. When this years Cliffhanger date was picked, from a limited range of options, Haiyang was a Lead and Speed WC in August.

Dense, lay of the meth, its fucking your memory up - the clash was ages ago, 2011. It was BBC one week then WC the following week.

[GraemeA]

I hadn't realised there was a clash again.

Not much reason for it either, given it's not actually part off cliffhanger.

But it is part of Cliffhanger! The link is very much still there, at least in the Council's mind. They are obviously hoping to have the BBC back in a big tent next year.

Haiyang became a BWC in June around about the end of January (1st email I have is 30/1/2014) so it was too late to look at moving Cliffhanger and the BBC.

It was not a deliberate choice by the BMC Comps Com this, other dates changed.

[rodma]

Tenuous link to cliffhanger.

I like your wall graeme and am happy to do a comp there, but it's not really going to feel the same as climbing on a stage in the park with loads of random food stalls, stinking blue cubes of death etc.

Actually, perhaps just rent in some blue cubes for effect

I realise that it's never intentional for there to be a clash, it's just a shame.

[GraemeA]

But if the tenuous link was broken it would make it even harder to get back in a big tent at Cliffhanger.

I wish we weren't at the Works, its more work for me

[rodma]

I'm sure you're right graeme and it will be good to see it return to the park, even though I'll probably be too old by then to take part.

At least it'll be easy to get good coffee on the day and the conditions surely can't be any worse than a marquee in full sunshine.

Sent from my C6833 using Tapatalk

[Oldmanmatt]

Again, funding is the issue. Otherwise the link to Cliffhanger wouldn't be important. I understand that Sheffield is an important part of the British climbing scene, but it it isn't exclusive to Sheffield.
The BBC's SHOULD be an important NATIONAL event and there are enough walls throughout the land to support the event, without council funding. Why let it die? Just as our Boulderers are reaching the top of the international comp circuit?
We've spent the last year working to find and develop local talent and looking at our progress we might have some rising stars in a year or so.
On the other hand, the BMC has been nothing but dismissive (to the point that when I contacted the BMC wall officer during our build phase, looking for specific advice and affiliation; we were told (in these words) that "we weren't important" that "no one in the South West could even be bothered to be an area officer" and "what do you want me to do about it".
I'd been out of the country or otherwise occupied, until a few months before that call, so had no clue of any "crisis" in the BMC SW.
And after that call, we decided not to affiliate to the BMC (though we still give the BMC youth squad free entry).
So.
I read a lot of the above as Sheffield-centric arrogance.
Oh, and I'd have offered to stand for SW  BMC, if the BMC realised the country extends more than a hundred miles past Bristol.

Wow.

That might be my angriest rant ever on the forum.

I've been a climber for over 30 years and a BMC member since I was 16.

[GraemeA]

The link to Cliffhanger is important as the concept was to have the BBC at some kind of event that would draw large crowds. And it has worked since 2007 when Cliffhanger was started.

IMHO the BBC is not a big enough draw on it's own, it needs to be part of something else. This was shown in 2011(?) when the BBC was the weekend before the Cliffhanger/World Cup weekend. Yes people turned up to watch the BBC but a couple of 100's, not the 5000+ rammed to capacity that turned up for the World Cup during Cliffhanger. 2013 was a total scorcher and Andy Murray was in the Wimbledon final, yet at Cliffhanger the BBC still had a fairly packed tent to watch the finals.

Your are correct, Sheffield doesn't have the exclusive rights to the BBC. If you can find an event that will allow us to have the BBC in front of a big crowd, will fund the wall build etc then let us all know.

And just to add one further thing into the mix - the mats required for the BBC cost around £30,000 and are owned by the Council. They will not rent them out for less than a few grand.

Your suggestion about the walls funding the BBC is an interesting one. However, having spent 7 years working as Walls & Comps Officer at the BMC and being involved with the ABC for 20ish years I suspect that it would be akin to herding cats some of which have very large egos.

As an example of why I suspect your idea might flounder:

Over 2 years ago I suggested to the BMC that the walls would happily support the Team, after a bit of the BMC heading up cul de sacs it all went quiet. It got resurrected this year and finally something started to happen, a 3 tier system was proposed, a gold supporter would donate £500 and let the Team, great I said, we want to be the 1st, send an invoice. So we are a fully paid up Gold Supporter of the GB Climbing Team. Have been for a month. Apparently the Castle have also signed up. But where is the acknowledgement? https://www.thebmc.co.uk/sponsors--supporting-british-competition-climbing?s=1 is 2 years out of date 

Matt - has your wall heard of this scheme?

[Paul B]

The link to Cliffhanger is important as the concept was to have the BBC at some kind of event that would draw large crowds. And it has worked since 2007 when Cliffhanger was started.

Maybe this is just me, but I declined to spectate at Cliffhanger when I found out that to watch Quali's / Semi's and the finals you need to purchase two days entry to Cliffhanger (as a weekend ticket didn't seem available).

I can understand why the link to a big event is seen as favourable but it undermines the importance of the competition if by the nature of the clash the top competitors are absent, that removes any significance of winning the event (shirley?). What comes first, the competition or the crowd?

[abarro81]

Similarly, I've never bothered to watch cos I had no desire to pay.. But then I guess climbers aren't really the target audience, which presumably is actually those considering going climbing but who haven't done it before.
P.s. good luck getting 500 quid out of Bentley

[GraemeA]

Similarly, I've never bothered to watch cos I had no desire to pay.. But then I guess TIGHT climbers aren't really the target audience, which presumably is actually those considering going climbing but who haven't done it before.
P.s. good luck getting 500 quid out of Bentley

Fixed that for you.

Paul was objecting to there not being a weekend pass available, not about having to pay. he is/was happy to pay once but not twice.

[GraemeA]

What comes first, the competition or the crowd?

The bigger picture with all of the elements, including budgets, history and future plans etc etc, all laid out before you 

[Oldmanmatt]

The link to Cliffhanger is important as the concept was to have the BBC at some kind of event that would draw large crowds. And it has worked since 2007 when Cliffhanger was started.

IMHO the BBC is not a big enough draw on it's own, it needs to be part of something else. This was shown in 2011(?) when the BBC was the weekend before the Cliffhanger/World Cup weekend. Yes people turned up to watch the BBC but a couple of 100's, not the 5000+ rammed to capacity that turned up for the World Cup during Cliffhanger. 2013 was a total scorcher and Andy Murray was in the Wimbledon final, yet at Cliffhanger the BBC still had a fairly packed tent to watch the finals.

Your are correct, Sheffield doesn't have the exclusive rights to the BBC. If you can find an event that will allow us to have the BBC in front of a big crowd, will fund the wall build etc then let us all know.

And just to add one further thing into the mix - the mats required for the BBC cost around £30,000 and are owned by the Council. They will not rent them out for less than a few grand.

Your suggestion about the walls funding the BBC is an interesting one. However, having spent 7 years working as Walls & Comps Officer at the BMC and being involved with the ABC for 20ish years I suspect that it would be akin to herding cats some of which have very large egos.

As an example of why I suspect your idea might flounder:

Over 2 years ago I suggested to the BMC that the walls would happily support the Team, after a bit of the BMC heading up cul de sacs it all went quiet. It got resurrected this year and finally something started to happen, a 3 tier system was proposed, a gold supporter would donate £500 and let the Team, great I said, we want to be the 1st, send an invoice. So we are a fully paid up Gold Supporter of the GB Climbing Team. Have been for a month. Apparently the Castle have also signed up. But where is the acknowledgement? https://www.thebmc.co.uk/sponsors--supporting-british-competition-climbing?s=1 is 2 years out of date 

Matt - has your wall heard of this scheme?

No.

And if it wasn't for Phil Waterhouse, who seems indefatigable, we would have no way to support the sport at all.
Matting is a very valid point and I was unaware of the ownership (thinking it was the BMC).
But crowd draw? Surely primarily a matter of publicity.

It's not as if the BMC have even supplied a poster to put up at the wall...

Oh yeah, I forgot, they weren't interested in our affiliation...

My sour grapes don't run as deep as this thread might imply, eventually we will get around to paying for BMC affiliation; but in the meantime (as money is tight) we'd rather spend the money developing the wall and hiring people or contributing to the youth squad kit etc.

How hard would it be for the BMC to email a poster? I'm a member as are my partner and kids. I don't recall receiving anything, let alone the wall.

For the comp to become truly National and important enough in it's own right to draw the crowds, then the walls and clubs need to come together to support it. Relying on elected local Gov is pretty rickety and subject to sudden withdrawal.

I'd be more than willing. Now I find myself with time to think and look beyond immediate horizons perhaps I should find something more proactive than forum ranting, to contribute.

[account_inactive]

So apart from the cost of the mats what are the other figures?
Payment by competitors?
Money from spectators?
Advertising and sponsors etc
BMC flat rate payment?

I'm hear a lot of "this is just the way it is so we will hold the comp in Sheffield at a not great time of year" and not any solutions. Plenty of walls would like to host this or not? When would be a better time of year?

[rodma]

To be honest I like that the comps are in Sheffield.

The ones that were held at the outdoor show in its unexciting locations were not a lot of fun to take part in.

[GraemeA]

So apart from the cost of the mats what are the other figures?
Payment by competitors?
Money from spectators?
Advertising and sponsors etc
BMC flat rate payment?

I'm hear a lot of "this is just the way it is so we will hold the comp in Sheffield at a not great time of year" and not any solutions. Plenty of walls would like to host this or not? When would be a better time of year?

I hear a lot of questions and whinging without a single positive comment (eg thank you Sheffield City Council for giving us a great bouldering event every year since 2007).

[account_inactive]

That's a clever and incisive comment not missing the point entirely