[Bonjoy]

ElMo: I'm really not enjoying sport climbing enough to start travelling to yorkshire for it. Bottom line is its a lot of faff in return for some deeply unmemorable climbing.

That is a very good reason to go to Yorkshire. Few would accuse routes like Dominatrix, Pierepoint or New Dawn of being unmemorable even the ones (and you'll meet plenty at Malham/Kilnsey) who agree with your assessment of Peak Limestone sport routes.

[Andy F]

Could I chuck in a couple at Chapel Head Scar. I know it's not Yorks or th3 Peak, but it is a stunning, easy to reach venue.

Both of these are worth 7c and 3* in my book (Serps, shut it before you even start).

Super Duper Dupont - As good as New Dawn
Phantom Zone - a 'mini Raindogs', no hard moves, no easy moves, now with an independant finish to the top of the crag for added fun.

[Adam Lincoln]

Sunset Boulevard - Hollywood Bowl, 7b+/7c depending on who you ask. Excellent climbing.

[Pantontino]

I too have been on a quest to climb 7c.

The first one I managed was Lightweight at Two tier. Fingery boulder problem to start (shade and cool temps make a huge difference) to a slabby groove, decent rest, then burly moves out left over a small roof.The top feels desperate until you have a sequence, but all felt fine on redpoint. I'm fascinated by this talk of an easier right finish, when I tried it as part of the E5 I thought a hold had come off. Steady E5 then a uk 7b move.

Since, I've been trying Body Machine. I don't what this talk off frigging is, I've just been climbing from the ground. One tricky move at twenty foot, then nice climbing. I can't touch the crux traverse above the break without a hang though. Last redpoint was worse than my first...

JB this is both funny and strange in equal measure. I'm bemused by the thought of someone like yourself who can boulder/climb at such a high standard on grit not walking up Body Machine. I was probably bouldering about V6 when I did that in the early 90s (first redpoint as well, after one half hour bolt to bolt session).

Have you got a stamina bypass or something? I guess all that traversing back and forwards at West Vale did me some good then.

Anyway, good to see that you've finally seen the light. What next, indoor comps and eliminates on Tom's Roof?

[Adam Lincoln]

What next, indoor comps and eliminates on Tom's Roof?

He will be a regular in the cave next 

[Andy B]

Shirley Arch Enemies should be on this list, by the sounds of it.

[Bonjoy]

Arch Enemies is  great, but pretty hard as 7cs go

[uptown]

I too have been on a quest to climb 7c.
I can't touch the crux traverse above the break without a hang though.

JB this is both funny and strange in equal measure. I'm bemused by the thought of someone like yourself who can boulder/climb at such a high standard on grit not walking up Body Machine.
Have you got a stamina bypass or something? I guess all that traversing back and forwards at West Vale did me some good then.

  Some things come back to haunt... From shuffles...

Tell me this is a joke.

Traversing around buildings is all very well when you're sixteen and stuck in a town, but quite frankly once you've acquired a car and can choose where to go its time you grew up and got on with some proper climbing.

  Remember that the Joker is actually quite short.

[uptown]

Oh, I forgot I should be recommending a 7c or two -

Try Metal Guru at Kilnsey, very good and a dream at the grade.
Second what Andy F says about Super duper dupont - 7c in my book and one of a kind in the UK at the grade.
JB's right as ever recommending Stone the loach, Sturgeon is also worthy there though again a dream at 7c.

[Jerry Morefat]

useless punter - It was only a week or two ago. The obvious glue covered crimp was in place, I think it's another hold further up that has come off. Maybe it hasn't, but if not then it's a very hard 7c and not one i'd recommend to someone pushing the grade. If you describe how the crux should climb then i'll know if anything is missing, I'd be interested to find out! Is Hallowed Be Thy Name not 7c+?

As I remember you get the obvious glue covered crimp with your left and rock up to a gaston in a shallow recess for your right. You then put your left foot on the hold with Sika all over it (there's a theme emerging here!) below the obvious glue covered crimp and rock up again to a gaston for your left. You then undercut the top part of the hold your left hand is on with your right hand and put your right foot on the obvious glued covered hold and stand up. Once established there here you can use a couple of crimps to get you to the break. I hope this makes sense.

I forgot to add that the the prow (p1+p2) makes an excellent 7C. Steep climbing on good holds that feels pretty straight forward if you're fit.  Adding the direct body machine start into it would make it even better and harder.

[Bonjoy]

As I remember you get the obvious glue covered crimp with your left and rock up to a gaston in a shallow recess for your right. You then put your left foot on the hold with Sika all over it (there's a theme emerging here!) below the obvious glue covered crimp and rock up again to a gaston for your left. You then undercut the top part of the hold your left hand is on with your right hand and put your right foot on the obvious glued covered hold and stand up. Once established there here you can use a couple of crimps to get you to the break. I hope this makes sense.

Is the gaston/undercut combo hold directly above the crimp and very poor with a sharp tooth of a thumb catch which help for undercutting? If so I worked a sequence which got the undercut from a poor slopey gaston out left, but it was then brick hard to stand up in balance.

[Jerry Morefat]

Is the gaston/undercut combo hold directly above the crimp and very poor with a sharp tooth of a thumb catch which help for undercutting?

That's the bad boy. I guess coming into the gaston/undercut combo from the right, rather than the left may put your body in a better position to allow you to stand up. The key for me was to use my ring and middle finger on the undercut with the sharp tooth, rather than my index and middle finger. For some reason it made a huge difference. I still found it pretty hard mind, I think it took me two sessions just to get that move and I never managed the route in one push from the ground before the hold came off.

[Bonjoy]

Seems bloody hard for 7c to me!

[Johnny Brown]

JB this is both funny and strange in equal measure. I'm bemused by the thought of someone like yourself who can boulder/climb at such a high standard on grit not walking up Body Machine. I was probably bouldering about V6 when I did that in the early 90s (first redpoint as well, after one half hour bolt to bolt session).

Well yes, very impressive, though not strictly comparable to Body Machine now the tree has gone...

I have no stamina and never have had. Why do think I'm a slab specialist? I did it in overlapping halves in a similar time frame to you though, so it really is just lack of stamina. And motivation, all I want to do at that crag is leave.

[dave]

forgive me for asking but why do you not then just get on something short and good thats going to challenge you on a move-for move basis rather than just taxing a weakness that you've got no interest in improving - lifes too short to be doing shit that you're not motivated for. there's a reason i've never so much as set foot on body machine or sardine you know, despite having been to the tor 1000 times.

[Bonjoy]

there's a reason i've never so much as set foot on body machine or sardine you know...

You've been trying to do them with Bennet's beta? 

[dave]

they are campus routes, right?

[Fiend]

LOL @ you lot.

Thanks for the suggestions, the Chee Dale ones seem the most suitable for convenience, Yorkshire ones all noted too.

[Johnny Brown]

Dave, I'm trying to get fit, that's all. Body machine is ideal for this and supposedly as good as anything south of Leeds. I'd rather never climb again than get on some of that shit at Raven tor's right hand end...

[Baron]

Anyone find out the identity of the raven tor tree killer yet? And now what's done is done, should they get a pint or a slap?

[Palomides]

Is Sturgeon really F7c? Maybe that's the 21st century grade, as it was never more than F7b+ in the 90s (OK, peak limestone so it's probably on a completely different set of holds by now, and possibly about 2m further back...)

From the list of "Quality 7cs that I never managed to redpoint" then the two which stand out are Comedy (bit bouldery at the start, but excellent above - the best thing Mick Ryan ever did?) and I've been a bad, bad boy at LPT, although that certainly doesn't win any prizes for location and accessibility. It's possible to get a summer evening session in from Manchester if the tides are right though.

If you end up at Malham, then I can wholeheartedly recommend Obsession - "only" 7b+, but brilliant climbing and situation.

[Fiend]

Had a look at Kilnsey, Metal Guru looks okay, Comedy looks good in it's style, Biological Need looks the most appealing, nice and direct, Dominatrix looks good but a bit complex. Spent a bit of time working 50 For 5 which seems pretty underrated and a well balanced route I thought. Was too tired for the redpoint in the end tho. I'd go back there for projects I think.

[Duncan Disorderly]

I'd go back there for projects I think.

Now there's something I never thought I'd ever hear!!!

My work is done it seems!

:D

PS. Cheers for letting the whole world know my plan - gonna have to do one now aint I   

[Fiend]

CHOAD
Forgot to add "I'd go back there for projects....if it's still too wet and showery to get on Welsh and Cornish trad"

[nik at work]

Dunc/Fiend

Give me a shout if you're headed back up that way, if I'm free I'll be keen for swapsie belays and the like.