[shark]

Eva say that for optimal gains sessions should be preceded by a day of rest so that you can get the required intensity and hopefully response with 48-72hrs before the next deadhang session. These recommendations might not be relevant to Elite climbers.

Eva might say that, but how sure is/are she/you that it's actually right? I'd agree that the optimal gains from strength will be when you're fresh, but e.g. is it better to get optimal gains from 3.5 sessions a week or slightly depressed gains from 5 sessions a week? (I don't know the answer to that, but it doesn't leave much time to fit everything else in - bouldering, an cap etc)

I know that having a day of rest before weighted deadhangs gets me results and day on day off has been working well. I have either been doing the dual session weighted deadhangs + campusing or having a day at eatswood. As my shoulder is sore from campusing I'm taking a week or two off from it and do a final 2 or 3 week cycle of campusing to the end of Dec then concentrate on bouldering in January then phase PE in around February.

You seem to want to be "everything at once" to use that catchy line from the microsoft ad which certainly isn't optimal.

[tomtom]

Does this mean you'll be making more appearances on the scrittle brown limestone again?

[nai]

Indeed it is but I was planning on doing it on Sunday which would be day 4 on. This is outside the approved sequence for weighted deadhangs which requires 48hrs between sessions, I thought this meant weighted deadhang sessions not just bouldering so the rebuke was probably deserved

Ok, I see, max hangs fourth day on probably not ideal, depends how intense the previous sessions have been I suppose but they sound pretty testing (btw, I know lots of taller folk that struggle with Piss)

You could always try some Repeaters rather than max-hangs, I find 4-reps works well, 7on-4off, possible to perform them at 85-90% of max so still fairly intense.

Guess you need to look forward though and work out when you'll next be able to train and whether resting might just be the best thing?

[nai]

You seem to want to be "everything at once" to use that catchy line from the microsoft ad which certainly isn't optimal.

Wasn't that Self Coached Cimber Dual-Factor Theory?  Has it been proved to be wrong?

[shark]

You seem to want to be "everything at once" to use that catchy line from the microsoft ad which certainly isn't optimal.

Wasn't that Self Coached Cimber Dual-Factor Theory?  Has it been proved to be wrong?

Its a while since I've read it but I would be surprised they would advocate the same bit of everything each week.

[i_a_coops]

Training everything doesn't sound very optimal, but isolating just one thing and letting everything else go completely doesn't sound like a good idea either? I'm currently doing mainly bouldering practice and ancap, but I'm still doing 2 or 3 aerocap sessions per week (after bouldering/ancap sessions) as fitness has never been my strong point, and the occasional session of aeropow or indoor routes (i.e. mixed energy systems) for maintenance. Presumably there's a happy medium, and as always if what I'm doing sounds daft I'd really appreciate any input.

Also, I'm having a week off for Christmas followed by two weeks in Font. Should it be ok to go into another base phase after those three weeks, but shifting the bias towards aerocap? Or is 3 weeks not long enough to turn around from one base phase to another?

[abarro81]

Its a while since I've read it but I would be surprised they would advocate the same bit of everything each week.

Was I advocating a bit of everything? I hadn't even mentioned aerocap/aeropow/anpow maintenance, just bouldering and ancap. I don't think bouldering + directed strength exercises + ancap will confuse your body. If you're doing double sessions that should work fine though - you'll get as many sessions as before just in a different configuration. My point was just that what Lopez says isn't necessarily right (e.g. Ramon apparently puts hangs at the end of strength work rather than the start as basic work is supposed to be better done after exercises requiring coordination) and there's always going to be a trade off between being as fresh as possible (to optimise gains from each session) and having a high frequency of sessions.

Anyway, strength work 4th day on would be hard unless the 3 first days were short. I'm not sure there's anything magic about weighted hangs though - the same principles that apply to that would apply to short boulders, campusing etc.

[shark]

Its a while since I've read it but I would be surprised they would advocate the same bit of everything each week.

Was I advocating a bit of everything? I hadn't even mentioned aerocap/aeropow/anpow maintenance, just bouldering and ancap. I don't think bouldering + directed strength exercises + ancap will confuse your body. If you're doing double sessions that should work fine though - you'll get as many sessions as before just in a different configuration. My point was just that what Lopez says isn't necessarily right (e.g. Ramon apparently puts hangs at the end of strength work rather than the start as basic work is supposed to be better done after exercises requiring coordination) and there's always going to be a trade off between being as fresh as possible (to optimise gains from each session) and having a high frequency of sessions.

Anyway, strength work 4th day on would be hard unless the 3 first days were short. I'm not sure there's anything magic about weighted hangs though - the same principles that apply to that would apply to short boulders, campusing etc.

I forgot about all that other stuff - training is so much simpler without it. If (magic) max finger strength gains is your priority then you do it first after being fully rested so as not to compromising gains. And the initial gains can be remarkable.

[Stubbs]

Shark, after several months of this, now you can hang this small edge with n more kg hung off you than you could before, have you seen any improvements in actual outdoor climbing? For example any advancement in overall bouldering grade, or problems that were once hard feeling easier?

[tomtom]

Shark, after several months of this, now you can hang this small edge with n more kg hung off you than you could before, have you seen any improvements in actual outdoor climbing? For example any advancement in overall bouldering grade, or problems that were once hard feeling easier?

Tsk...  details, details

[shark]

Shark, after several months of this, now you can hang this small edge with n more kg hung off you than you could before, have you seen any improvements in actual outdoor climbing? For example any advancement in overall bouldering grade, or problems that were once hard feeling easier?

Yes and yes. Definitely stronger on Weedkiller (last Winter's project) when I had a play on it mid October - in fact I nearly repeated it. Weedkiller is the hardest problem I've done at 7A+/B. Currently spent 7 sessions on eatswood Traverse and got to the last few moves and feel confident I can do it. That's meant to be hard 7B+ even with a kneepad

[Stubbs]

Cool good to hear it's giving direct results!