[Bonjoy]

http://www.ldmountaincentre.com/category.aspx?id=438&sale=false&subproducts=false&manufacturer=-1

Very useful bit of trad gear. Really good for very narrow parallel sided cracks and breaks. Crucial gear on The Promise. Normally stupidly expensive >£50. Sale item at above address at £26, bargain!

[Drew]

That's stupidly cheap! Their store price is cheap enough anyway.

[Fiend]

£32-ish was what I was playing at Hitch And Hike, I'm sure Outside weren't much more expensive.

[Ethan]

Pretty good that. Found some on a US site not long ago for £21 inc P&P.

[dave]

do they sell ballnut whips?

[Bonjoy]

£32-ish was what I was playing at Hitch And Hike, I'm sure Outside weren't much more expensive.

The important word there being was, since the pound weakened against the euro they (and most other bits of kit made in europe) shot up in price,  now listed at £50 on website - http://www.outside.co.uk/cgi-bin/psProdDet.cgi/2646||~@c~Cams~@b|0|user|1,0,0,1|14|

[Teaboy]

Does anyone carry these as part of their normal rack? Presumably they are best suited thin gritstone breaks. Are they much use for more irregular cracks, e.g Gogarth?

[Fiend]

Ah right Bonnington, I hadn't known about such a drastic increase, good call.

Teaboy, I, at E2.5 punter level, don't carry them on most routes, but only on routes that are likely to be particularly bold - and in such circumstances I've found them very useful. I haven't found them so useful in thin gritstone breaks due to the general roundedness ("crisp" grit like Amber Valley aside), nor on most Gogarth cracks although the particularly bold stuff e.g. North Stack could be suitable. They're good on bolder mountain rock routes and a lot of quarried stuff too (the latter having more parallel cracks). Oh and anything like Culm Sandstone / Greywacke, maybe slate too. Think "thin and parallel"

[Somebody's Fool]

If you ever do Police and Thieves at Dovedale it's worth taking a pair. And if you do take them, try to remember they're on your harness and actually place them.

They strike me as being very useful on limestone trad, if anyone still bothers?

[RichK]

 Mmm.....I have microcams(aliens to smallest) so which size would best complement my rack......i.e. smaller than smallest alien/or other micros?
 
Presumably they work well in the right placement?

[nai]

I did this comparison earlier, the blue Alien has a lowest range of 10.2mm so sizes 1 & 2 are smaller than what you've already got and a 3 overlaps. 

    * Size 1 Weight 29g, Range 3-6mm, 8kn
    * Size 2 Weight 37g, Range 4.5-9mm, 8kn
    * Size 3 Weight 54g, Range 6-12mm, 8kn
    * Size 4 Weight 57g, Range 8-14mm, 8kn
    * Size 5 Weight 73g, Range 10.5-18mm, 8kn

http://www.outside.co.uk/knowledge/camming-size-chart.html

[RichK]

Nice one.

[Bonjoy]

Also relevant is the fact that Ballnuts are rated for a higher force than standard camming devices of comparable size and they fit in much narrower placements. If you have the luxury of a double rack you can often stack two side by side in the same slot, hence making something worthwhile where otherwise you'd only get one very small cam.
The critical sizes are 1 to 3, above this I just use standard camming devices.

[Fiend]

You could also superglue them back to back so they could fit in more squarish slots