UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => bouldering => Topic started by: Fiend on March 31, 2004, 09:48:05 am
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There you go dave & Bubba.
One for starters...
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ticks1.jpg)
...the pocket tick mark being particularly essential as it's not visible from The Stride or anything :roll:
BRUSH THEM OFF YOU FUCKERS (OR DON'T DO IT IN THE FIRST PLACE).
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I'd like to nominate myself:
(http://www.yorkshiregrit.com/yg/photos/brimham__the_anchor.2.jpg)
What a twat!
And Andy Swann:
(http://www.yorkshiregrit.com/yg/photos/deer_gallows__kojak.jpg)
He shouldn't be allowed on the rock!
I can't see why covering holds in chalk is fine, but drawing a line in chalk is an unforgivable sin. Someone please explain.
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(in reply to Fiends post) :: Weird - why do you hell would anyone need tick marks on the starting holds and the huge jug on the arete :?
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I can't see why covering holds in chalk is fine, but drawing a line in chalk is an unforgivable sin. Someone please explain.
its cos for the most parts its just totally unnecessary and lazy, especially if no attempt has been made to brush them off. also a distinct bright white line stands out to the casual observer far more than a softer whiteish area of chalk.
i know we can't post up bleau.info photos, but you need to see this:
http://bleau.info/images/honorez/aerodynamite.jpg
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I can't see why covering holds in chalk is fine, but drawing a line in chalk is an unforgivable sin. Someone please explain.
It's all about where you draw the line (ho ho ho!):
On some problems, a tick mark is useful where you've got a hard to hit hold. That's not the issue - the problem is:
- often they are vastly over the top; huge double lines pointing to holds that often are pretty obvious to see anyway.
- you don't need them on the obvious starting handholds to problems
- but, the main issue is that it takes a few seconds to brush them off afterwards, leaving a nice clean problem for the next person. The same goes for vast amounts of chalk.
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i've found its actually very difficult to brush off the big tickmarks you see, where the person has used a big chunk of chalk to draw the line cos it grind the chalk into the grain of the rock and the lichen, and you're doing extremely well if you can remove it.
much better to just indicate a blind hold with say a light dab of chalk from your finger or chalkball, especially useful in low light, and is easy to brush off.
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because a hold wi chalk on is pleasin to the eye n a big tick is not. nowt against tick marks per se but when they're left they look like someones bin defacin the rock. they also make the climber look like a punter. i personally can't look at a photo with tick marks n think that the prob looks nice. i am also aware that u n andy r no punters, so no pun (ter intended)
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http://bleau.info/images/honorez/aerodynamite.jpg
thats comical
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Not my tick marks, but would have been hard to brush off from ground. Not even on best bit of the top, so useless. Maybe they were training and wanted to grab the shit bit :roll:
(http://server6.uploadit.org/files/alincoln-DSCF0058.JPG)
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she looks like she's goin to use 6 holds more than necessary.
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not u adam, the link. :wink:
should be some good tick shots of hurricane out there?
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i thought it was a him (the cuvier one), but sometimes it can be hard to tell (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=2338).
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Hard to tell?? That's clearly a girl. At least I've never seen a man with such a shapely arse :up:
Mind you, I guess there aren't many that good :wink:
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There you go dave & Bubba.
One for starters...
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ticks1.jpg)
...the pocket tick mark being particularly essential as it's not visible from The Stride or anything :roll:
BRUSH THEM OFF YOU FUCKERS (OR DON'T DO IT IN THE FIRST PLACE).
Fiend you posted that photo on RT ages ago!
I'll get you a Policemans Helmet.
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Ticks are all very well, but can lead to confusion over exactly which foot to use. :wink:
(http://www.adamlongphotography.co.uk/portpage/climb/idiot.jpg)
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was at cuba last night and went up to try walk on by (again :roll: ) - some bell end had tick marked the fuck out of every little foothold and put a huge white football sized circle of chalk on and around every handhold. sorry i have no photogenical evidence.
the appeal is that you can't see the holds - it's not the same when you can.
tossers
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Cuba! Thats a long way for an evenings action :D
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if you really need to mark the holds on a problem then use little strips of finger tape, which then can be pulled after your effort - this happens a lot at camp 4 - i remeber jerry doing this when he was trying dominator and it was critical to see the middle edge
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The finger tape idea is a good one....except for then loads of people just leave the spent tape underneath the problem instead of on it.
Well, they *might* not, but judging by the amount of finger tape / chalk balls that get junked at the crag, it's a big possibility.
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Cuba! Thats a long way for an evenings action :D
i get around...
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The finger tape idea is a good one....except for then loads of people just leave the spent tape underneath the problem instead of on it.
Well, they *might* not, but judging by the amount of finger tape / chalk balls that get junked at the crag, it's a big possibility.
\
oops - good point
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This issue seems to have become a problem relativly recently. I may be wrong, but even 1 year ago I don't think I ever noticed many tick marks, or heard about them in polite conversation.. What was the pivitol tipping point for this behavior?
I am aware of the general augument that wall climbers introduced to the outdoors might have a different expectation of hold visability. But I am not convinced that this group have been taking to the outdoors at an especially greater rate than over the preceding 4 years, for instance.
So what happened? How has this meme propagated so efficiently?
Certainly the recent tales of holds with entire circles around them and stating holds being ticked have only become common of late and point to the idea of ticking behavior taking hold at orders of magnitude greater levels than earlier.
Crop circles have gone quiet over the last few years. I propose that the artisitcally driven aliens behind that endevour have found a new form of self expression.
I am not convinced that the hyper ticking of eg. the cratcliffe arete is as artistcally valid as the wiltshire cornfields, but who am I to judge.
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Apart from the parents I blame videos. All that violence and stuff warps the minds of these young ruffiens. :oldgit:
Seriously though, I can think of a few vids that have excessive tick marks. Monkey see monkey do. :temptation:
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I go for the 'negative' tick myself. Simply gozzle spit all over yer toothbrush, then use it to clean a line through the chalk surrounding the hold. Works a treat, and the end result is less chalk on the rock :wink:
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i thought it was a him (the cuvier one), but sometimes it can be hard to tell.
Shouldn't that be in the Fit Birds Who Go Climbing thread?? :wink:
much better to just indicate a blind hold with say a light dab of chalk from your finger or chalkball, especially useful in low light, and is easy to brush off.
Yer that's what we do, all about the light finger dab rather than the heavy chalked line.
P.S. FH stay away from my helmet :?
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if i have to mark anything i find that a dot of chalk pushed on with the thumb works just as well if positioned correctly. and much easier to get rid of when your finished
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I think this is what we'all is railin against.
The mighty nine shows his displeasure at boybage.
(http://www.adamlongphotography.co.uk/portpage/climb/donkey.jpg)
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I saw a guy using tip ex at minus ten. :shock: he was french.
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fiddy pennells looks quite rightly a bit pissed there - thats fucking horrendous. don't people turn round when leaving the crag and see what shit they've left?
any idea who did it?
i got some snaps of badass tickmarks in font, i can post up of theres a demand.....
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...come on then Dave, get your ticks out for the lads... :roll:
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yeah, false promises are no good, dave :lol:
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i'll post em up when i get home, wiggaz.
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just to follow this up, my tickmark phtots didn't come out very well so i didn't post them.
found this on tinternet though:
(http://www.ropeless.de/upload/bilder/563_g_Amras1.jpg)
david blunkett climbs 7c+
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that problem looks awesome. any ideas dave? like wot hold would u use after the first right hand sloper?
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its summert in germany. i think theres a hold on the top somewhere.....
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I reckon scrubbing off tick marks is good for your karma.
I was having a lacklustre session at Back Bowden on Wednesday, so spent an hour wandering round cleaning loads of tick marks off the problems (that never get washed off because of the steepness), then miraculously got a burst of enthusiasm and went on to have a crackin night and left the crag after dark (always a good sign).
I think another hour of brushing would have prevented me from tooling my arm again too!
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Not exactly hall of shame material, but it's hardly helpful for Planetfear.com to recommend putting tick marks on the top out of Strapiombante, is it?
(http://www.planetfear.com/climbing/training/beta/strap-2.jpg)
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Not exactly hall of shame material, but it's hardly helpful for Planetfear.com to recommend putting tick marks on the top out of Strapiombante, is it?
good to see they're maintaining that traditional british ground-up ethic ain't it....
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oh my god.
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White spray paint works better as it does'nt get washed off in bad weather. word.
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hmm, i wonder where my knee goes again? :? :D
(http://www.ukbouldering.com/media/images/lowRider02.jpg)
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Bastard! Knew i should have photoshopped those pics. To be fair i was washing all the chalk off the prob with water after trying it (primarily 'cos i was paranoid someone would spot the line and steal it before i got the FA)
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what the fuck shoes are them lovejoy?
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Some crazy-ass things called Rock Pillars, had to buy them when in NZ as there was nothing better. They where quite good as it goes. Lowrider trashed the tops and the heels tho.
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he has to keep gettin the name of the prob in, n the fact that it was a first ascent. look at me! :soapbox: :wink:
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You never know, if i keep banging on about it for long enough someone might actually take a day out of their busy Plantation/Burbage schedule and give it a go.
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I have a friend who walked along and saw it recently and said it was one of the most inspiring problems he'd seen.
Then again he has quite esoteric tastes and only likes burly grit sloper problems :P
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You never know, if i keep banging on about it for long enough someone might actually take a day out of their busy Plantation/Burbage schedule and give it a go.
doubt it, you know what they're like :twisted:
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Shocking amount of chalk in this picture:
http://www.8a.nu/cgi-bin/scorecard/pics/presentation/resize/resize1076547011_2214.JPG
:shock:
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People shouldn't be allowed to get away with this kind of desecration.
(http://www.yorkshiregrit.com/yg/photos/brimham__boat_rock_arete.2.jpg)
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Is Big Frank losing his eyesight?
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i hear stevie wonder did that problem without tickmarks.
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We had great fun drawing massive long tick marks and numbering the holds on Alien Nation, but unfortunately they didn't show up on the photos very well.
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Is Big Frank losing his eyesight?
Hang on a minute you lot, I think you should be asking the tit mark mystro him self about what you see.
:oldgit:
The evidence for the prosecution looks good but it's not enough to convict me! :chase:
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(http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0PgDhAswSR09I*yy!vHcNf2agFowv7ujpx9tfJlzt43ac3hx2b5A5gGiLkPz!eu28jsyZseOQFkYwGj2Zm1CItP2pPmsPnMhS/donky.jpg?dc=4675484436396250538)
Anyone whose been to the tor recently will recognize these little beauties. These have been adorning Hubble for a good month now. I've managed to track down the owner as a Mr Markus Bock no-less, I shit you not! :lol: :lol:
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Wonder if Mr Gaskin's needed tickmarks that big :D :lol:
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Found at the tor:
One white cane
One pair dark glasses
One Labrador Golden Retriever
One stevie wonder LP.
name inscribed on cane: "M B".
PM me with decription to return.
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How would a tick mark help if you're totally blind? Surely some kind of bleeper would be more appropriate.
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i wager even blind people would be able to see those.
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You could have like brialle marks or something, but then i'm thinking that if you're blind, hubble probably isn't on your list.
Anyone been on Sheffield dryslope and seen that blind woman skiing - respect is due.
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How would a tick mark help if you're totally blind? Surely some kind of bleeper would be more appropriate.
...or holds with little bells in them?
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Where I worked in the US was the ski centre for the NSCD (National Sports Centre for the Disabled). I would have blind skiers getting on my chairllift on a daily basis, massive respect to them, as well as the sit skiers and the guys skiing on one leg. One guy could get on our fixed grip lift (ie ones that dont slow down as they enter the terminal) without us needing to slow it down. He used to go in the terrain park, ride in trees and the half pipe too.
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(http://northumberlandbouldering.co.uk/photos/Gallery/northumberland/monkearl.jpg)
Andrew Earl on Monk Life.
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weird picture, looks like it's photoshopped really badly. climber n rock have been put together at a moments notice
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is it just me or does his left arm look 'wrong', for want of a better word (all short and stumpy like) too
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yeah, looks like quarto, out of total recall :whip:
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bad tickmark here:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=17722
i've been on that thing and a tickmark there is LAME. :roll:
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found this:
(http://bleau.info/images/gueguen/rencontre_thierry.jpg)
nice markage. not sure if those are tickmarks of it a large bear slapped for the hold with claws :shock:
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thats pretty bad
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Freddy Kruger goes bouldering :lol:
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EXPLAIN YOUR SELF MR. CHAPMAN :evil:
(http://www.lakesbloc.co.uk/sei/s/1284/393.jpg)
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Looks like a crying face to me...:(
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(http://northumberlandbouldering.co.uk/photos/Gallery/northumberland/monkearl.jpg)
how did he get the tick marks there in the first place!
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I assume that Greg had the sense to rub them off when he finished (oh er missus)
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theres a cragx style wooden ladder kicking about in the bushes at kyloe in..
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(http://bleau.info/images/montrouget/coupdepatte.jpg)
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there was once a massive three point tick mark on directissima, brownstones. each point was 1.5m long and the centre was ythe left hand slot that most people only use for feet, when you can see it fine.
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(http://server6.uploadit.org/files/alincoln-DSCF0058.JPG)
what problem is that? looks nice
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Ange naif at 95.2, font. Much higher than it looks, and for the full tick the heel out left is banned. Not a very nice crimp either, font has much better to offer.
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crimp busted my tip open after 3 goes - damn straight. like JB sez 7c or + for a bad blinkers sequence, 7b/+ for the pictured heel ting. not feally an amazing problem but a good one to never have to try again.
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The 7a version is good though (haven't tried the crimp approach)
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ain't a wigga gotta use the crimp on the 7a+ version, only with the other hand?
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best sequence is to continue walking past 95.2, which is overcrowded and badly eroded, to gros sablons and do some class probs (bibop, la liberte, l'oeil de cyclone) in a stunning setting probably without a soul about
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good point, conversely just stay off the shit "gotta do" ticks n then ask yourself why in the name of all that's holy is le yaniro thing given 6c+/7a when in reality it's gotta be 7c
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I think you must have to dislocate your hip to static that.
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Just been out to Almscliffe this afternoon and was greated by this on the Keel (sorry, Fin)!!
(http://usera.imagecave.com/nick_fletcher/climbing/Picture30-copy.jpg)
I mean, how blind do you have to be not to be able to see that pocket from 18 inches away! And just to finish it off, Matts roof had a similar sized mark pointing out the obvious crimp. Maybe this guy had a photographer over at Caley or something and he needed directing to the correct holds.
Whoever did this, get some glasses or stop climbing. Youre ruining the place
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you did well holding that camera still shakerman. :wink:
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should have gone to specsavers.
reminds me of the clockface you always see on aerodynamite.
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The two huge lines to the top holds on Matt's were there on tuesday as well. The worst i've seen recently is the overchalking of DWR left hand since it appeared on yorkshiregrit - it seem someone has to have 4" diameter chalk cirles around all of the crimps to make it possible.
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Is it just me, or do these ludicrous tick marks almost invariably appear on extremely bloody obvious holds that are already drenched in some much chalk they're visible from outer space anyway??
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you did well holding that camera still shakerman. :wink:
We'll see who's doing the shaking at about 5pm on saturday. Ive heard youre speach is going to be really really funny. The anticipation is killing me..
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:lol: hope you're going to walk that fine line between humour and offence clm...
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fuck off you cunt....ha ha
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Fiend, If you think the tick marks at font were bad, you should see em at magic wood. The euro's love it
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Go on Gym, tell us about the problem with the tick mark in the wrong place (the worst part of the hold). Whats it called again? How hard was it...?
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err... I don't know what your talking about
pirajna, 7c+
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Go on Gym
:lol:
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Hey Control Freak - Have you moved to Cliche-beaches yet? If so, give us a shout if you want the tour.
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a bunch of spaniards left these for me to clean up today at curbar:
(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10003/tickmarks_gorilla.jpg)
these were like crosstown traffic - THICK. I needed a bucket and spade to shift them without filling up the pit. Thanks hombres.
on the not of the pit, some pillock put a pointy monitor-sized block under where you land off hurricane (why?) that i had to move and also i swear that block behind GW is further away from the backwall than it used to. might just me my imagination. why do people feel the need to fucking shift rocks about?
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Cheatstones?
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why do people feel the need to fucking shift rocks about?
Isn't it obvious?
(http://photos14.flickr.com/13991358_9deb608949_m.jpg)
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:lol:
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http://img.ukclimbing.com/i/33101.jpg
On the starting handholds? . . .. .
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saw some foreigners leaving higgar yesterday and got to the crag to see one of the biggest tick marks ever on the top hold on the warm-up arete to the left of pooh. why?
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http://img.ukclimbing.com/i/33101.jpg
On the starting handholds? . . .. .
I think this might be more viewable Slopes.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=33101
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strangely enough the foreigners leaving higgar were spanish
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strangely enough the foreigners leaving higgar were spanish
a couple of dark beardy looking ones and a lass or two?
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that being them
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From 8a.nu - Redpoint tactics
"4. Tick marks/prolonged quickdraws/brushing of holds
Mark your hand and foot holds with chalk where needed. If it's a complicated sequence you might even want to use L and R ti indicate which hand to use."
Oh dear. :roll:
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i find writing left and right on the back of my hands useful too.
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To be fair to 8a...... no wait a bit, who wrote that shizzle, if anyone i climb with did that on either a route or problem i won't call it cheating, i would insist on an iq test, dicks. :?:
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i find writing left and right on the back of my hands useful too.
I like this idea a lot. All you need to do is then match up the R or L drawn next to the holds with the ones on the backs of your hands and hey presto, you arrive at the top, which just to be safe should be marked STOP.
The logical extention of this is to get someone to take photos of you on every move, which you can then stick on the rock in sequence, next to the holds, lest you get confused about what to do next.
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I also like this idea a lot, but I think it needs further refinement.
Aside from the L and R labels, I reckon that the would-be red pointer should clearly label his forehead with the word: COCK written in waterproof marker pen (in case it rains or they break sweat), just so that there is no confusion should any sane people turn up at the crag and wonder what is going on.
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:lol:
What about your feet..which 1 is left and which 1 goes...left? sh*t this is getting confusing.
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surely for clarity it should be RH on right hand, LH on left hand, RF on right foot, LF on left foot...it's easy to get confused out there...
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And maybe to assist the redpointer a "move countdown" could be painted onto each route so that you know how far you've gone and how much is left.
Further to this, an individual move grade could be painted on the rock between each hold, thus enabling the "on-sight" climber to avoid over-reaching or not putting enough effort into a move.
And human variation (eg height) could be included in this tickmark-a-thon by using different coloured tickmarks/numbers etc etc. Red paint for those under say 5'10. Yellow for those between 5'10 and 6'0. Blue for those 6'0 to 6'2 and no paint for the really lanky tw*ts because they don't need them, they can reach the chain anyway.
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And maybe to assist the redpointer a "move countdown" could be painted onto each route so that you know how far you've gone and how much is left.
Further to this, an individual move grade could be painted on the rock between each hold, thus enabling the "on-sight" climber to avoid over-reaching or not putting enough effort into a move.
And human variation (eg height) could be included in this tickmark-a-thon by using different coloured tickmarks/numbers etc etc. Red paint for those under say 5'10. Yellow for those between 5'10 and 6'0. Blue for those 6'0 to 6'2 and no paint for the really lanky tw*ts because they don't need them, they can reach the chain anyway.
Very creative for 7:38 am... shure you haven't been up all night??
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I also like this idea a lot, but I think it needs further refinement.
Aside from the L and R labels, I reckon that the would-be red pointer should clearly label his forehead with the word: COCK written in waterproof marker pen (in case it rains or they break sweat), just so that there is no confusion should any sane people turn up at the crag and wonder what is going on.
not sure about that. his forehead might be facing the rock. a better idea might be a big yellow pointy hat, with COCK written over it at a selection of angles so that whatever position he might be in, it would leave bystanders in absolutely no doubt that he is a bit of a knob...
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(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10003/tickmark.jpg)
biggest tickmark i found in font. as you can see its pretty long, and about as thick as a slim panatella.
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Hi-tech comparative size investigation there. Do you work for Scotland Yard?
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it was the only thing i had to hand of a comparative size. I was going to use my johnson but I was worried it would make the tickmark look too small. :wink:
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at least the girth would have been right... :wink: :lol:
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must...resist...urge...to...photoshop...
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Put it up on b3ta, and lo and behold... :lol: :lol: :lol:
http://www.b3ta.com/board/archive/24295/
Edit:link had changed
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The next level, grade and direction of travel tick marked. Just do it at Dame Jouanne est. only in france
(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10165/donkey%20lines.JPG)
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And maybe to assist the redpointer a "move countdown" could be painted onto each route so that you know how far you've gone and how much is left.
Something like a document page numbering system; L; hold 3 of 5, R; hold 5 of 6, then in big letters "END OF PROBLEM" at the top, in case you get confused.
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And in a range of languages to avoid confusion.
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guilty.
(http://www.aschiodofisso.com/forum/files/2005_1120ceriola0019_bis_381.jpg)
i have to admit that its a really blind dyno, tho.
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good looking problem. That's not jimbo kimber is it?
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Put it up on b3ta, and lo and behold... :lol: :lol: :lol:
http://www.b3ta.com/board/archive/24295/
Edit:link had changed
is yours that pink? see a doctor lad.
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The next level, grade and direction of travel tick marked. Just do it at Dame Jouanne est. only in france
Not only in France. Theres a new cave venue here and because its got no guide/topo, the grades are chalked at the starts. No directions are needed - You just follow the white route. :wink:
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yeah, but this one is in the guide with a grade and a full description (and is pretty log anyway, just ask unclenobody!) still the french thought it warrented chalking its grade and direction of movement anyway
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good looking problem. That's not jimbo kimber is it?
johnny,
i doubt i know who jimbo is, apart from the former tennis player jimmy connors.
the prob is a sandstone area in northern italy, where we thrashed ourselves for two days last weekend. great. worth the driving. gotta get back: unfinished business.
damn, my palms are already sweating.
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good looking problem. That's not jimbo kimber is it?
No I have bigger arms than that thankyou very much!
JIMBO
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(http://forums.climbing.com/photopost/data/503/medium/DSCF2073.JPG)
Speciality tickmark-to-bottom-of-hold-and-completely-missed-anyway tickmark.
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:D
but the problem is so beautiful and complex!
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Garth on an 8C in the Blues
(http://web.8a.nu/images/firstPageImages/garthvert.gif)
Wonder where this one goes?
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Aaaah, the white route - Plenty of those in the Blueys. Chalk always shows up nice and bright against that lovely orange sandstone.
Funnily enough, Garth is making the trip to England so I hope the he'll get a good tour from the 'right' folk.
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freaks been in oz for 2 minutes n it's garth already :wink:
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Any one want to own up to this attrocity? Must have occurred yesterday, when it was drizzling :roll:
Problems like this should not be attempted when damp as they have fragile holds and pebbles which are weak when wet.
And as it has now been climbed ground-up, top-roping should be out, particularly to the ludicrous extent evidenced below.
(http://www.zen59200.zen.co.uk/Adam/Galleries/Climbing/careless.jpg)
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I've got a similiar photo, which I was going to post when I got round to uploading it. It was like that on Saturday though - so not necessarily attempted in the wet, as Saturday was very sunny. Was one of the few bits of rock that didn't seem to be affected by snow melt.
A bit over the top with the chalk. Though the anti top-roping thing is a bit elitist.
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A bit over the top with the chalk. Though the anti top-roping thing is a bit elitist.
This isn't brownstones. Problems don't need covering in chalk to make them look like good problems. The amount of chalk in that photo is totally unnecessary and an eyesore. You clearly agreed if you thought it worth photographing.
How is the 'anti-toproping thing' elitist? It has been long established that once style has been improved subsequent ascents should follow suit.
Or are you suggesting climbers not good enough to do the start should still be allowed to enjoy trying the top section in safety? Bullshit. Enough routes have already been damaged by punters scrabbling about on the safety of a tight rope.
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Do all those holds need chalk on them too? Some look a bit unnecessary.
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also have same shots in my digicam, and was going to post but you beat me to it JB. i was up there saturday, and i assume it wasn't done then (didn't see any sun, it was minging and no-one around, although i was up in the afternoon)
it was like seeing the best looking girl in school shagging the geography teacher behind the bike shed!
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it was like seeing the best looking girl in school shagging the geography teacher behind the bike shed!
Genius :lol: My feelings exactly
Do all those holds need chalk on them too? Some look a bit unnecessary.
No. About half of them are either footholds or not used, which is another reason why I think they were trying to climb it whilst damp. The fact that the chalk has also survived two days drizzle is testament to the amount on each hold. All of the ticks are also unnecessary - for the crimp on the left wall (gaining which is the only vaguely blind move) there is a pebble on the arete which acts as a perfect marker - you can actually see it just below the tick. The fools.
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geography teacher
A particulary old and ugly one?
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i ain't done more than 2 moves on this problem and even i can count at least 6 chalked holds on there that you don't use on the start at least. must be a bloody toproper's sequence for sure. :roll:
climbing is an elitist activity by nature. if people don't like it then sucks to be them!
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it was like seeing the best looking girl in school shagging the geography teacher behind the bike shed!
You got some shots of that too?? ;)
The ticks - another "classic" example of tickmarks to holds that are so covered in chalk they can be seen on Google Earth anyway. Why oh why?
The ethics - well....I don't know if the precedent is going to change any time soon because of one improved ascent. But, I'm glad there are people in JB's elevated position who are taking a strong ethical stance.
Why the hell are you called JB anyway?
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This isn't brownstones. Problems don't need covering in chalk to make them look like good problems. The amount of chalk in that photo is totally unnecessary and an eyesore. You clearly agreed if you thought it worth photographing.
You're right, it isn't Brownstones. What exactly does Brownstones have to do with it? How odd.
And yes, I did agree that it was excessive. I said so.
Or are you suggesting climbers not good enough to do the start should still be allowed to enjoy trying the top section in safety? Bullshit.
No, I'm pretty sure I didn't say that. I can't imagine anyone wanting to anyway. But one person's highball is another person's E number, don't see what's so wrong with practicing the top moves on a rope. Not everyone is trying to stay at the forefront of climbing ethics - some people just want to enjoy the moves and avoid injury. Why is that so wrong? That's the spirit of bouldering isn't it? Each to their own, as long as they don't ruin things for others, and I can't really see CT ruined by hordes of topropers...
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But one person's highball is another person's E number, don't see what's so wrong with practicing the top moves on a rope. Not everyone is trying to stay at the forefront of climbing ethics - some people just want to enjoy the moves and avoid injury. Why is that so wrong? That's the spirit of bouldering isn't it?
But we're not just talking about another route here are we - this is a significant and hard boulder problem which is well within modern standards for a high ball with lots of pads. Andy Brown fell from the top and was fine and in light of current ground up ascents, there isnt really and need to top rope this
And if said wouldbe ascentionist is not trying to stay at the forefront of climbing then why would they be trying to climb a route such as this - theres hundreds and routes up on the edge, go do one of them.
Its people bringing things down to their own level which holds climbing back - people are too soft these days, wanting to take the easy route for a big number.
We only have so much rock in England - lets not ruin it for future generations
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But we're not just talking about another route here are we - this is a significant and hard boulder problem which is well within modern standards for a high ball with lots of pads.
Look, if someone can do the bottom bit, surely they aren't going to take that long top-roping the top bit. It's hard, but it's four grades easier or something like that (8a+ and 7b+?). I don't really see how the few people that will want to try it on a top-rope are going to ruin it.
Chances are some people will try it ground-up, and well done to them, but I don't see anything wrong with a few (and it will only be a few, compared to the millions thrashing around on most problems) people who want to get the top wired on a rope.
Andy Brown fell from the top and was fine so the only reason for wanting to pre-practice the moves is a lack of ability.
This of course means that everyone who falls from the top will be fine...
And if said wouldbe ascentionist is not trying to stay at the forefront of climbing then why would they be trying to climb a route such as this
Um... Am I missing something here? Because it's an amazing line that most people would love to climb. Surely the experience of climbing it is why people want to climb it... The line, the challenge, the moves... not because they are "trying to stay at the forefront of climbing"
Its people bringing things down to their own level which holds climbing back - people are too soft these days, wanting to take the easy route for a big number.
Holds climbing back? :shock: How exactly is someone climbing a route for their own personal satisfaction holding climbing back? And CT surely isn't an easy route for a big number. Most E6s must be technically miles easier. Or E8s. Or E10s?
We only have so much rock in England - lets not ruin it for future generations
Right. And we can start our crusade by preserving Careless Torque. Would people stop climbing it in mucky trainers, that really annoys me. At least bring a carpet to wipe your feet on.
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The point is that the great thing about climbing, in all its forms, is that you get the same experience whatever your level of ability. If you are climbing at your limit you are getting the same experience. There are very few sports for which that is true.
Sadly grades and ego mean folk forget this and run around chasing after bigger numbers by whatever means. I'd say the majority of young climbers who leave home and move to sheffield go through a phase of this. Get ahead of the game - you get a lot more out of climbing an easier route in good style than you do by sieging a hard one. Becoming an "E7 man" by whatever means is not all that fullfilling.
I fell into the same trap; the week I got my driving licence I went to the Roaches on my own and set up a shunt line on Piece of mind. I'd never been on an E6 and wanted very much to climb hard grit routes. I warmed up and then got on it... and flashed it. Sat on top I've never felt so hollow. I knew I wasn't good enough to climb it, I felt like I'd raped the route. I've been trying to forget the moves so I can go back and enjoy it but ten years later and I haven't. Bummer.
With gritstone we have a few more factors too consider. The rock, especially on harder routes, is fragile. Beau Geste, Benign Lives and Braille trail, all now harder after pebbles were knocked off by clumsy top-ropers. And thats just the routes that start with a B. Second, the rock is running out. Apart from a few lines at Black rocks and Wimberry there really isn't much left in the future of grit new routes. They will become fewer and farther apart.
The future of grit is in style. The hard routes of the eighties and nineties will become testpieces for onsight climbing; this started years ago but has really come of age in the last two seasons with the young generation coming through. They aren't wasting their time digging out crap new headpoints on Kinder, they are out there making ascents of the classic lines in improved style. This approach really opens up gritstone - so much to go at. Get wid the programme y'all.
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Come now, climbing is just a hobbie you guys!
Imagine if stamp collectors were to have similar debates...
Sadly rarities and watermarks mean folk forget this and run around chasing after bigger numbers by whatever means. I'd say the majority of young philatelics who leave home and move to sheffield go through a phase of this. Get ahead of the game - bulid up your collection slowly. Becoming a "penny black man" by whatever means is not all that fullfilling.
The future of stamp collecting is in style. Those rare stamps of the eighteen fourties and fifties will become testpieces for keen young philatelists; this started years ago but has really come of age in the last two seasons with the young generation coming through. They aren't wasting their time digging out crap from bin bags at oxfam, they are out there onsighting those two penny blues at high brow markets in improved style. This approach really opens up their collection - so much to go at.
After reading over this i might be convinced that they actually would. I wouldn't tho....
Don't mean to flame you here Adam (i agree with some of what you say and respect your passion for climbing) but gritstone purists are never gonna win this ethical crusade cos they dont have a birth certificate with that rocks name on it. Some folk argue that anti-top roping ethics holds back climbing, and the rationale behind this is obvious. Saying someone shouldn't toprope something like CT is as stupid as saying dwi ddim yn hoffi cig to an iranian pig farmer though!
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my two cents, from a country where ethics are perhaps sometimes left apart.
i would like to try the moves of careless torque, or many other that have already been grounded up. i cant see any harm in it: not to the rock, nor to the climbing, nor to the ethic. i can say that a top roped ascent sits a step behind a headpoint, and that last behind the ground up, sure.
why should one be deprived of the joy of trying beautiful moves? i mean, nobodys putting bolts on the top to practice with rope.
i reckon alot depends also in the climbers attitude: making ones name big or having pics on the mags makes alot of difference from who just climbs for self pleasure, or for pleasure.
the tickmarks and chalk are ugly to see and prolly useless, of course.
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i have been waiting years for ground up ethics to be adopted by climbers on grit, and am excited that it is dawning on climbers that there is far more to be gained from such styles.
there has been nothing more depressing than the headpointing years - it sucks all the adventure and discovery out of climbing, and makes numbers a priority.
i think the media has played a large role in gloryfying these ascents in a bid to headline ever bigger numbers - i think we all know that the well known 'stars' of this type of climbing have never been the true talents, just climbers operating way above their standard using such techniques.
(new routes are an exception here, and it will always need the ground to be broken before the styles get better, but as far as i'm concerned every subsequent ascent should be ground up, otherwise why bother?)
thats why i like bouldering so much - ain't no ropes to pull on :)
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Word to that Al.
Nibile, I can see its hard to understand from your viewpoint, but these routes are fragile. Top-roping, particularly by climbers who aren't really good enough, can and does damage the rock. Pebbles are especially vulnerable.
If you want to try hard 'beautiful' moves there are plenty to go at without roping CT.
Once a route has been climbed ground-up the bar has been raised. Have some ambition; if you don't feel up to it then go elsewhere until you are good enough.
i reckon alot depends also in the climbers attitude: making ones name big or having pics on the mags makes alot of difference from who just climbs for self pleasure
This might not be clear if you've only been following grit climbing for a couple of years, but as Al said; the big egos who wanted to be famous went for the big numbers in bad style and fame. The guys who climbed for themselves settled for smaller numbers in better style, and obscurity.
but gritstone purists are never gonna win this ethical crusade
I think you're wrong here, and past events back me up. Why don't we have bolts on grit? Pegs? Points of aid? All have been used and later eliminated by the climbing community. Headpointing will go the same way; its the only way for grit to have a relevant future. No one will have to stop anyone or lay down rules, it will just slowly become deeply unfashionable.
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ive always been a great fan of grit climbing, dunno why. perhaps cos it has the fascination of something "more" than just pulling on small edges.
i know your ethics very well, and if you say that "bulls attitude" toproping can damage the rock i cant say anything in response.
but, again and more in general, i think that little differences in attitude can have enormous consequence in practice. its after all a matter of respect, a respect that should tell you if its time to pull off the rope and leave CT in peace, instead of slapping everywhere just relying on the rope.
i also think that the line between ethic and elitism is thin. i dont think to climbing as being an elitist sport. in fact its not even a sport, its a discipline to me.
to preserve the rock and our environment is a primary need, and even if it would have been a bummer, i would have happily respected the stanage ban, if it was up when i was there.
again, respect.
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The point is that the great thing about climbing, in all its forms, is that you get the same experience whatever your level of ability. If you are climbing at your limit you are getting the same experience. There are very few sports for which that is true.
Sadly grades and ego mean folk forget this and run around chasing after bigger numbers by whatever means. I'd say the majority of young climbers who leave home and move to sheffield go through a phase of this. Get ahead of the game - you get a lot more out of climbing an easier route in good style than you do by sieging a hard one. Becoming an "E7 man" by whatever means is not all that fullfilling.
I fell into the same trap; the week I got my driving licence I went to the Roaches on my own and set up a shunt line on Piece of mind. I'd never been on an E6 and wanted very much to climb hard grit routes. I warmed up and then got on it... and flashed it. Sat on top I've never felt so hollow. I knew I wasn't good enough to climb it, I felt like I'd raped the route. I've been trying to forget the moves so I can go back and enjoy it but ten years later and I haven't. Bummer.
With gritstone we have a few more factors too consider. The rock, especially on harder routes, is fragile. Beau Geste, Benign Lives and Braille trail, all now harder after pebbles were knocked off by clumsy top-ropers. And thats just the routes that start with a B. Second, the rock is running out. Apart from a few lines at Black rocks and Wimberry there really isn't much left in the future of grit new routes. They will become fewer and farther apart.
The future of grit is in style. The hard routes of the eighties and nineties will become testpieces for onsight climbing; this started years ago but has really come of age in the last two seasons with the young generation coming through. They aren't wasting their time digging out crap new headpoints on Kinder, they are out there making ascents of the classic lines in improved style. This approach really opens up gritstone - so much to go at. Get wid the programme y'all.
Excellent post (Al's post is good too).
If Mick_Rockfax is going to take any post from UKB and make it into a UKC "news item", it should be that one.
Unfortunately, from repeated and bitter experience, taking a strong and principled standpoint like that tends to attract plenty of abuse and knee-jerk actions without people actually looking seriously at the nature of climbing and the nature of it's personal challenges. Thankfully not too much on here though.
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Apparently Marrowbone Jelly at Caley had received some similar treatment on saturday - anyone want to own up :?:
Agree with the sentiments about ground up climbing. With the advent of bouldering mats, and the fact that now most people own at least one I would prefer to see routes being attempted ground up with lots of mats, rather than on a toprope.
How do the ethical purists feel about padpointing?
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I'm not making any judgement here, just speaking for myself.
I've been doing bouldering, trad and sport climbing since about 1989, but with the exception of the odd new route i've never got into the headpointing thing at all. It just leaves me cold, for much the same reasons given by Al. Perhaps that's just an excuse for cowardice on my part, but it just seems a slightly boring, lonely sort of climbing. Once you decide to seige a route, it becomes an almost forgone conclusion you will climb it, bar a slim margin of risk.
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As an ex-headpointer, I'm sat wondering whether I should be feeling a bit guilty. I was probably an early adopter of headpointing alongside people such as Seb operating (just?) behind the lead set by people such as Nick and the two JDs and I dont remember our climbing being so soul-less and ego driven (though maybe I'm in denial). I gave up headpointing quite quickly (with a late exception for new route at Helsby in 2001) because it did pall after a while. E7s that were hard to onsight could be headpointed very easily - but I can't deny it also delivered some great experiences along the way as well.
But - to get to the point - context is important and in this sense it might be possible to see headpointing as a necessary (and now hopefully finished) interlude. Progress isn't always smooth and leaps forward rare and sometimes wrong turns are taken in trying to move things on. Headpointing was probably far less detrimental than other potential paths that could have been taken - such as bolting. It is true though that it should now be recognized as having had its day
peace and love etc.
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what's so wrong with practicing the top moves on a rope.
That's the spirit of bouldering isn't it?
:lol: that's dynamite tony.
what about practicing the top moves of the following on a rope?: NTBTA, crescent arete, west side story, yellow desert scream, kaizen... the list goes on.
on a seperate note we need to make huffy more angry. grr.
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As an ex-headpointer, I'm sat wondering whether I should be feeling a bit guilty. I was probably an early adopter of headpointing alongside people such as Seb operating (just?) behind the lead set by people such as Nick and the two JDs and I dont remember our climbing being so soul-less and ego driven (though maybe I'm in denial). I gave up headpointing quite quickly (with a late exception for new route at Helsby in 2001) because it did pall after a while. E7s that were hard to onsight could be headpointed very easily - but I can't deny it also delivered some great experiences along the way as well.
But - to get to the point - context is important and in this sense it might be possible to see headpointing as a necessary (and now hopefully finished) interlude. Progress isn't always smooth and leaps forward rare and sometimes wrong turns are taken in trying to move things on. Headpointing was probably far less detrimental than other potential paths that could have been taken - such as bolting. It is true though that it should now be recognized as having had its day
peace and love etc.
Context is everything. Headpointing was breaking new ground back then, plus a lot of what you did was new routing (arguably a more justifiable reason to headpoint), plus pads hadn't taken off yet.
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As has also been pointed out elsewhere; almost without exception the repeats of these early hard grit routes were in worse style than the first. Dawes being the best example - he got to the top move of End of the Affair ground-up before resorting to inspection for the last move, Gaia's top half was not practiced cos he thought it would be easy (hence the crying described on stone monkey).
The early days were often just abseil inspection, a few moves practiced at a time. Problem was, you give the masses an inch, they take a mile. By the mid nineties it had got to the ridiculous point of Seb talking about cleanly roping a route six times in a row before he would consider a lead, or Nick Dixon talking about a 'robotic' state of mind when executing bold but wired-in moves.
All got called headpointing, with very few folk being in a position where they were able to distinguish between what was actually cutting-edge climbing and mindless grade-chasing by any means. The magazines certainly couldn't - a fact I'm sure is at least partly responsible for the current generations disaffection with the mags.
I don't want to feel like a robot on grit.
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Thanks Bonjoy. I wasn't really thinking about myself so much as the whole scene when headpointing began. Just think some of the more dictatorial statements painting it as a mortal threat to grit climbing are exaggerated. The pad point is obvious but undoubtedly significant on some routes. And, as JB himself pointed out on the thread on Ryan flashing TEOTA, there's headpointing and there's headpointing
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Just think some of the more dictatorial statements painting it as a mortal threat to grit climbing are exaggerated
i guess that's me - hopefully the last post explained it a bit. I don't think its that big a deal, after all I've held ropes and photographed friends on their headpoints. As Bonjoy said, it was relevant at the time, but lost its way.
I do think its time to move on whilst there is some stuff left for the future, though. What does wind me up is the gormless who haven't got the vision to see thats the case :roll:
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Apologies for the dictatorial bit, unintentionally a bit too strong there. As ever, I think there's more agreement than disagreement here. Yes, its time to move on, which is why I so enthusiastically greeted Ryan's flash of TEOTA, but I didn't think the point about it serving a purpose at one time had been made. Its just wrong to tar all headpointing with the same brush. I would be unashamedly elitist about this though - headpointing is only valid at or near the cutting edge.
Dont accept the idea that Nick is one 'the masses' though.
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Anyone else collect stamps? :wink:
Adam: You go strong girl!
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i would like to try the moves of careless torque, or many other that have already been grounded up. i cant see any harm in it: not to the rock, nor to the climbing, nor to the ethic.
I would wager that if you did try the moves of say the top half of CT on a rope then you'd probably find them as good as any number of problems of a similar grade. I doubt they would be anything out of this world - which brings me to my point. Gritstone to me is about more than just the moves, or the setting,, the rock, or the history, or the social aspect or the danger. Gristone is one of those things which is greater than the sum of its parts. Careless Torque is not a classic simply because of the moves, its a classic due to a special combination of moves, difficulty, line, danger, history and setting. To take just one or two of those aspects in isolation (like on a toprope just to experience the moves) is to miss out on what things like this are funadmentally about, the essence of it all - hence JB's hollow feeling on the top of POM. If all you want is to experience top quality 7b+ moves or whatever in total safety then luckily the crags are full of problems that fit the bill. There is simply no need to strip CT down to the lowest common denominators. And that ignoring the oft-discusses issue of rock damage etc.....
Forgive me if this sounds all a bit pretentious, but I'm sure we all recognise that climbing is as good as it is because of the interplay of all those special aspects. If all we were bothered about was the strength then we'd just be meat heads down the gym. If all we wanted was danger we'd be out playing russian roulette. If one facet of climbing crystalises this combination of factors better than any other then it would seem to be gritstone. Thats the magic "zing", that certain je ne sais quoi. we all have felt it, and know it, yet its so hard to put a finger on, which is why only the more easily quantifiable factors get pimped in the media. The grade chasing etc. and then its easy to become blinded to what draws us to grit in the first place.
the great thing about grit of course is the variety. So if you want a safe hard boulder problem then you've got it. If you want a dangerous route with technically easy moves at any grade you've got it. If you want hard moves with gear at your feet then fill your boots. Theres enough safe quality climbing to try on grit to go at without robbing yourself of one of the great all-round challenges like CT. And so what if you save a route for the onsight and never get on it? big deal. I can't imagine many people go to their death bed wishing they'd toproped more routes. half of the best bit of grit is the mystery.
Sorry if that got a bit heavy.
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And so what if you save a route for the onsight and never get on it? big deal. I can't imagine many people go to their death bed wishing they'd toproped more routes. half of the best bit of grit is the mystery.
Exactly - like Grimer said in Stanage Through The Grades Some routes it would be good to climb, some routes it would be good never to climb at all
I think this encapsulates perfectly what gritstone climbing is all about. With the exception of a few, technical difficulty on most grit climbs isnt hard, by modern standards. Its the combination of all the factors, like Dave siad, which gives grit ts unique experience.
It you can master all of these parts then the personal experience is amazing. Im sure everyones made a hard onsight where you get to the top and you cant really remember what happened - everything just flowed. When you get something on a rope, it may as well just be another boulder problem.
Going back to the quote, it can sometimes be better never to have experienced something and just dream about yourself high up on moves that you think you should be able to do but arent sure, than it is to ruin that dream.
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Good posts! This thread is starting to reaffirm one's faith in climbers...
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Sheer Poetry Dave, sheer poetry.
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the best bit of grit is the mystery.
hit the spot dave
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I agree. This is the essence of the way of the boulderer. Let's hope that some major corporate footwear company doesn't pick up on this viewpint and cheapen it in some cheesy ad campaign!
And I thought these new posts were just gonna be photos of horrendous chalk marks!:wink:[/quote]
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When you get something on a rope, it may as well just be another boulder problem.
Perhaps this is your experience, it is certainly not mine. Some of my headpoints have had me unable to sleep beforehand, too full of fear and anticipation. Then completely elated after. These have been some of my most intense climbing experiences.
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I quite like headpointing sometimes. So there.
[Edited because I can't be bothered getting into a convoluted debate.]
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thats cos you're a bad man mark
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i can smell those joss stiks from here. see you all at yoga.
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I read your post mark, and, fair enough, some people are going to make headpointing a less sterile experience than others.
I think people are referring to this sort of thing:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=174252&v=1#2502892
...some kid thinking top-roping Psycho @ Caley is the way forward :roll:
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No, Fiend, I don't think so. Al talked about the 'headpointing years' (dates?) and JB named specific, well-known climbers from the 80s/90s. There's a whiff of revisionism about this that threatens downgrade a very important decade on grit from about 84 onwards. Jesus, it was better than the 60s when they toproped and pegged. Maybe things got worse from the late 90s with people headpointing with no track record in onsights, I don't know. I'd be genuinely interested to know what the state of play is now and not just at very top. Is the Peak now rammed with climbers regularly onsighting grit E6 or even E5?
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Well, I was referring to trains of thought like this...
Sadly grades and ego mean folk forget this and run around chasing after bigger numbers by whatever means. I'd say the majority of young climbers who leave home and move to sheffield go through a phase of this. Get ahead of the game - you get a lot more out of climbing an easier route in good style than you do by sieging a hard one.
The impression I get from the last few pages is that the pre-Hard Grit headpointing era had it's role to play and was fine at the time, but things need to move on from that era, and with modern protection, modern training etc etc, improving style is the way forward.
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OK fair enough, its partly about that, trying to run before you can walk. But some of its been meant more broadly - if not, why name Seb or Nick? Otherwise I think we're in agreement pretty much - of course, improving style is the way forward, always has been
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i think he named them names cos everybody will have heard of them
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Except that's not a very good reason when your real target is meant to be barely competent E4 leaders who want to claim they lead E7
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If there is a whiff of revisionism about this, it isn't intended. I, and I'm sure the others, have plenty of respect for the likes of yourself who pushed standards at the time.
In many ways I think the need for a new, purer ethic is because headpointing has proved too effective. There really isn't the plethora of lines and gaps that existed in '86. That isn't just a jaded, blinkered view - ther are loads at Wimberry and a couple at Black Rocks, plus a few scattered over yorkshire but we really are running out of rock. 'Last great lines' like elder arete at curbar have turned out to be non-lines - the groove at cratcliffe will be the same - a couple of hard moves in fifteen metres. The change in style is needed to keep grit alive and relevant.
I think also the headpointing style was adopted in an effort to help trad keep up with the sudden push in standards on lime as a result of the discovery of sport climbing. Along with that then came the 'anything goes' attitude, and we went form the likes of Dawes checking moves on abseil for routes he had already tried ground-up, to Seb and his siege ascents. The headpoint did evolve into something that involved less and less real risk, and then its influence filtered down and led to a lot of E3, E4 headpointing. I don't see them as a problem though - they are just copying the guys at the top. The hypocrisy of saying 'oh you can't do that until you're as good as us' is obvious and, to me, unacceptable.
I think now there is an acceptance that grit has a difficulty of its own - no matter that the supposed french-grade is so low to be irrelevant. Hence we can take it on its own terms rather than trying to create hard routes by any means. Plus, of course, the bouldering and highballing boom that has changed the way we view routes.
Second, as has been said earlier - these routes are fragile and are getting worn. I've seen people kick pebbles on toprope to make sure they're solid enough to trust for the headpoint. That, to me, is disrespectful to the rock. Accept the risk or go clip bolts.
Maybe things got worse from the late 90s with people headpointing with no track record in onsights, I don't know. I'd be genuinely interested to know what the state of play is now and not just at very top. Is the Peak now rammed with climbers regularly onsighting grit E6 or even E5?
Yeah I think they did. There were a few folk who were only interested in 'Hard grit', and just went round headpointing E6-E8 routes. I don't think they even tried to on-sight E5s - not 'Hard' enough. There were also a lot who jumped straight from bouldering to headpointing - James Pearson for example climbed E10 before he'd onsighted E6.
There are a lot of climbers who regularly on-sight E5s - though I think there always have been.. There are a lot of E6s which are now ground-upped with pads all the time. What has been kept quiet is a select bunch who are onsighting E6s and E7s regularly, and now E8 is being broken into . For some reason they aren't interested in the mags and the mags don't seem to be interested in them.
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Dear Johnny. Thanks for that post. I never wanted an argument about this, and certainly not to shore up some spurious rep, but just to get some balance that was originally missing - and I think we've achieved that now. If things changed a lot in the late 90s then that would explain the differences in our perspectives as by then I wasn't climbing in the Peak. Three cheers for a good debate. Its a shame the really exciting sounding stuff going on is missing from the news, I'd love to hear it all because I love grit and the poople who like to climb on it
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Al talked about the 'headpointing years' (dates?)
here's my moral high ground:
i suppose i was thinking from the mid 80's to late 90's, when it was really in vogue, and although i get the drift re. 'context', headpointing always seemed like a con to me, and speaking personally always fealt like an expression of need (as opposed to climbing skills).
i agree though andy, the best thing about it is that it doesn't physically alter the rock, although with regard to this thread, it does mean the routes get a bigger kicking/ticking! (although having made guidebooks, i can't justifiably winge about increased traffic)
also think that pads, and the influence of bouldering, have made 'ground up' on grit totally viable, both of which weren't around during that era.
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But aren't we all expressing some sort of need every time we climb
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But aren't we all expressing some sort of need every time we climb
yep, for sure, i just think the rock needs a bigger chance than headpointing gives it, thats my opinion
however AP, the last thing i mean to do is take anything away from your climbing legacy, having personally witnessed some of your feats
respect
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One thing that grates on me is the way that some people seem to label what, in their opinion, is the right and wrong way to climb, and then scorn anyone that does different. I may have got the wrong end of the stick but that is what comes accross, to me, when reading a few of the previous posts.
So, being careful not to do what I have just passed comment on, here is my opinion.
Climbing is really good fun! It can be frustrating, stressfull, scarey annoying...etc...etc but most of all, it is fun. Looking back through history, you can see that at different points in time, different "disciplines" have been in vouge but just because "everybody" is doing it, doesnt mean you have to. To me there is no right or wrong, it is afterall just climbing. I get vastly different feelings and emotions from headpointing as I do from onsighting, just like I get a different buzz out of bouldering than I do sport climbing. This year I have hardly tied on at all, but that doesent mean that bouldering is the thing to do, and that routes are evil, just that I wanted to go bouldering when I woke up each morning. During my shortish life, I have developed my own set of ethics and ideas, they may not be the same as someone elses, but does that make them any less worthy and vice versa. Do what makes you happy, enjoy yourself, be considerate.
BTW I had onsighted a few E6's before I did Equilibrium
:wink:
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i think it is fine that there are strong opinions on this matter - its a bit of passion - as to the scorn maybe not so nice :?
Do what makes you happy, enjoy yourself, be considerate.
again agree, especially with regard consideration, which was the original point of this thread, and the relevant lack of said consideration on careless torque
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Al, I've pm'd you
Andy
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Time to dig this up:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=37276&v=1
A lot of ranting on this very subject between errrr, myself, and various other people including but not limited to Keen Youth, Unclemullet, nik at church, Stu 8a Littlefair, Bubba....crikey it's good I don't post like that any more :shock: :roll: :?
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It makes me cringe reading old posts, I had some silly ideas and said some silly things, my favourite quote from that thread has to be Feind to Bubba:
F*ck you too you mindless retard.....
A little harsh, things getting a bit to much :wink: I know that feeling on CT re the recent threads about "the liar" Feels like you are banging your head against a wall, the punters just dont see the truth!
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Lordy :shock:
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Am grateful for but rather embarrassed by the expressions of respect etc. from Al and JB. Honestly, guys, theres no need - I know nothing was aimed at me and haven't taken anything as though it were. Everyone enjoy themselves
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Lordy :shock:
I know. Sorry, I obviously got carried away.
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Lordy :shock:
I know. Sorry, I obviously got carried away.
If that isn't fishing for an apology, then my name is Sayyid Abul Ala Maududi.
Is that a welsh name?
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Aye, commonly shortened to Gruff.
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I think that whole thread is a bit :shock: really.
Anyway, http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=174812&v=1#2508671
Kids, again. Running before they can walk?
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All highly entertaining.
James, sorry I got the facts wrong. Should have E7. Though I think doing kaluza as your second lead makes the same point! This is not meant as a criticism in any way - just trying to illustrate to Andy that the way folk get into hard grit has radically changed since he was on the scene.
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Lordy :shock:
I know. Sorry, I obviously got carried away.
It's ok, it was CT
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oh my god, what have we become? can we get back to the original jist of the thread which is taking photo's of probs with huge ticks on them.
maybe another thread can be started with the title "it's really ok to top-rope downhill racer?"
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BTW I didn't link that thread to get at Keenus, just to show a prior example of the debate. Hope that's clear.
Dense, I started another thread, but it dropped down pretty quick :?
Besides with the current weather most tick marks will be dissolved and floating half-way to the coast already :wink:
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trop d'ethique tue l'ethique.
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oh my god, what have we become? can we get back to the original jist of the thread which is taking photo's of probs with huge ticks on them.
(http://0friction.com/pix_51/zero_friction_pic_11727.jpg)
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that's much better
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(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10250/normal_KnockTick.jpg)
Anyone recognise the sequence for The Knock... I hope they aren't claiming E4.
Where has this ethic come from?
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WTF?
Is my computer displaying images wrong?
Is this a rare troll by an otherwise sound UKB member?
Am I fucking hallucinating?
I am having a lot of difficulty believing that is real, I can't comprehend such idiocy! That is about as far removed from the simple act of "climbing routes" as it gets!
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Was there a note by the break to remind them what size gear they needed too? ???
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Maybe a flock of tiny birds were resting on the various edges and they all shat at the same time, leaving little white trails down the route?
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Imagine how confused I was when I saw it. All I had to take the picture was my phone.
And I was giving a really strong euro wad a tour of all the inspiring hard routes at Burbage, he was so psyched by Equilibrium and Parthian then...
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Where has this ethic come from?
Probably from seeing photos and videos of people doing similar things on hard problems / routes.
Who cares so long as they clean it off afterwards. That's my only beef with it, that people are too fucking lazy to wipe their shit off afterwards.
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Who cares so long as they clean it off afterwards. That's my only beef with it, that people are too fucking lazy to wipe their shit off afterwards.
too right, i spent an age in monday scrubbing peoples drawings off of some problems down here at stone farm. twats.
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[/quote]too right, i spent an age in monday [/quote]
Fuck that must have been boring?
or
who was monday? fit?
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I think it's a typo.
I'm sure he means Mandy.
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Wow i just read this thread cover to cover (skipped some of the boring bits admitedly). As some of you may know I recently undertook a few interviews with climbers as part of my dissertation, naturally style did come up quite frequently in my interviews but few saw it as being linked fully with the proggression of climbing, though all noted that there was a definite influence on it. I believe there is probably more to the proggression of climbing as a sport, particularly trad climbing, than the style in which new routes are ascended. Respect for the postings though its good to see a well conducted debate. (I'm shitting myself about this karma thing ever since earl came on tv).
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My cross-posting old thread-bumping rampage continues....
Back from page 4, and back on topic with this multiple-angle tickmark delight
(http://www.udini.de/gallery/OZ/XIFF/images/ammagamma01.jpg)
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(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10250/normal_KnockTick.jpg)
Anyone recognise the sequence for The Knock... I hope they aren't claiming E4.
Where has this ethic come from?
FRANCE!
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(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10169/normal_donk.JPG)
From sabots. Apparently visible with the naked eye from space. :o
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(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10250/normal_KnockTick.jpg)
Anyone recognise the sequence for The Knock... I hope they aren't claiming E4.
Where has this ethic come from?
FRANCE!
Nooo! it's the septic tanks! :wank:
(sorry to any non ticking americans I just wanted to use the emoticon...)
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http://img.ukclimbing.com/i/47606.jpg just incase ur blind! :-\
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(http://ukbouldering.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10169/normal_donk.JPG)
From sabots. Apparently visible with the naked eye from space. :o
Is that the hard-to-see foothold on Sal Gosse? I would have thought it'd be easier to see the hold itself than the the chalk above it cos of the rock angle...
probably find it's a totally different problem now...
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If there was ever a hold that didn't need a tickmark....!
(http://www.blokkatinemilia.com/public/photo/essai/Home/anello.jpg)
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Is that the hard-to-see foothold on Sal Gosse? I would have thought it'd be easier to see the hold itself than the the chalk above it cos of the rock angle...
probably find it's a totally different problem now...
Sorry, totalyl missed this when you asked. Haven't got a scooby what the problem is, not very good with naming problems in Font.
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If there was ever a hold that didn't need a tickmark....!
(http://www.blokkatinemilia.com/public/photo/essai/Home/anello.jpg)
how you dare????? ;)
that hold needs to be ticked, it has at least two different spots where to be held.
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Very sad but true, there was at least one donkey line at the climbing wall this evening! :jaw:
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well im guilty on this point.
last week i tickmarked a hold, but hey wtf the keep setting problems with blind dynos to holds behind corners and other bigger holds.
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Very sad but true, there was at least one donkey line at the climbing wall this evening!
What's the problem with that? Spoiling the asthetics of it? Ruining your photos? Damaging the paint? ;)
There's quite frequently ticks at BUK because you have to gets holds on volumes that you can't see, or get holds round aretes, or footholds under volumes, or under the lip of a roof. It's annoying to fall off because you missed the hold rather couldn't hold it.
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Very sad but true, there was at least one donkey line at the climbing wall this evening!
I don't have a problem with that - it's not creating an eyesore in a natural environment.
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Very sad but true, there was at least one donkey line at the climbing wall this evening! :jaw:
i do this all the time.its good practice for doing it outside. :whistle:
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I dont see this being a big problem, as long as you make sure to get rid of them before you leave.
Anyone agree?? :shrug:
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the problem with then outside is the thickness of the chalk tends to bind to the rock leaving a mark whatever you do to try and remove it. I had to use water and a toothbrush to remove some off the easy little slab across from the Face of Busness. Big fat 1 inch fuckers as well, muppets :wall:
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Yeah true, I take your point and aslong as you have some water with you there should be no resaon to leave anything behind. :thumbsup:
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the problem with then outside is the thickness of the chalk tends to bind to the rock leaving a mark whatever you do to try and remove it. I had to use water and a toothbrush to remove some off the easy little slab across from the Face of Busness. Big fat 1 inch fuckers as well, muppets :wall:
objectively speaking, what is the difference between leaving a one inch tick mark behind and leaving a bunch of handholds covered in white chalk? I have never, ever, ever seen anyone washing handholds with water when they are leaving... but why? is a little tick so much more unsightly than a spreadout section of chalk on a hold?
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i think chalk is accepted or more acceptable cos it represent a "normal" use of the hold. the excess should be brushed away anyway.
but imagine arriving at your project and finding the holds completely soaked by a mixture of chalk and water...i surely would wait for them to dry, killing the necessary time by torturing the criminal who had done it ;)
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as my eyesight gets steadily worse with my increasing age will i need a note from my doctor/optician to allow me to draw an increasing number of donkey lines that will be needed for me to bumble up problems in the future.
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Yeah true, I take your point and aslong as you have some water with you there should be no resaon to leave anything behind. :thumbsup:
In all my time bouldering, I have never seen anyone remove excessive chalk, be it build up, donkey marks or whatever once they have finished doing/working a problem. Nice to talk about it, but never actually witnessed it (a nd to be honest even done it) myself. I've removed excess chalk before trying them, and usually leave them with less chalk than before in these cases, but never actually cleaned them before moving on. Have never really donkey makred much, so can't comment.
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True, I have to say I've only ever really cleaned holds on a couple of projects that were fresh where I didnt want the holds to become gunky with repeated visits!!
Just an idealism I suppose and I agree that chalked hand holds are acceptable, and if excess is brushed away before moving on everyone should be happy!
:thumbsup: Smiles all round??
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objectively speaking, what is the difference between leaving a one inch tick mark behind and leaving a bunch of handholds covered in white chalk? I have never, ever, ever seen anyone washing handholds with water when they are leaving... but why? is a little tick so much more unsightly than a spreadout section of chalk on a hold?
err never said I washed handholds, only tick marks. Chalk on holds is in my opinion bad but at least its a slightly more subtle eyesore than tick marks which can be seen from a lot further away. The slab I was reffering to is english 5a, if you cant see the hold you shouldnt be bouldering or you should go to your nearest optician for an immediate check up
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Surely the daft thing about ticking holds indoors is that if you practise being precise on blind holds indoors, you become better at it, and thus need less tickmarks outside. Ticking holds indoors is just a missed opportunity to become better at climbing.
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I put the biggest tick mark indoors last night. about a meter long and an inch wide with an old chalk ball. kept getting wrong foothold on an eliminate so did that. didn't get it wrong again thats for sure.
who cares about indoors, its only practice for the real thing
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I have no objection to tickmarking indoors, except for the worry that people will get used to relying on a tickmark (and not needing to brush it off) and then automatically do it outdoors without thinking.
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i have to be honest, i've cleaned holds with water at cragx and other slippery places. if you've tried a problem and are going back to it soonish, they'll feel a lot better when you get back to it. no for aesthetics, that's for sure. on the grit, surely most holds get cleaned by the rain soon enough?
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The problem with donkey lines inside are as follows.
1. It's seen as associated with 'hard climbing' which means that f--kwit students / aspiring climbers (take your pick I sadly have to go to warwick wall) will think is necessary to climb hard outside.
2. The point about climbing inside is that it's fun and or training, in either case donkey lines aren't required and actually in my view degrade both,
3. The idea 'it's ok for me I climb Vx and brush them off afterwards' is about as valid as saying I'm a responsible cleaner of holds, you damage them with your wire brush, they chip'.
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bringing this thread back from the dead;
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e129/unclesomebody/ticks.jpg)
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Jesus Christ! Are they completely blind!? Correct me if I'm wrong, but it doesn't exactly look a blind slap to an ill defined shelf or crystal!
How did the trip go then Uncle? Welcome back to insanely shite weather mate.
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did you wash them off after using them? good few days you had over there
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(http://woodsfamilyclimbs.com/albums/album135/051105_Tripple_Crown_Horse_Pens_40_025.jpg)
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Throw me a frikkin' bone here!!
That must be a pisstake.
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Better than chalk, shirley? You just peel the tape off after.
Is thet Cofe?
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It would appear to be from the Horse Pens leg of the Triple Crown comp, I guess comp climbers can't read topos ;)
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i certainly don't remember that. ;D
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Okay so the cave is not the most scenic location in the world or even the Peak but this sort of stuff, entirely unnecessary on the galaxy's biggest toehook, doesn't help.
Before:
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/cavetick1.jpg)
30 seconds after:
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/cavetick2.jpg)
I was only able to completely this monumentally challenging and innovative task due to a combined PHD in Rocket Science and Brain Surgery which gives me the necessary mental skills to know to brush the fucking tickmarks off.
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That really is shitty, and wasn't there at 14:30 ish yesterday. Good job removing it Fiend
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Not sure how offensive I find these things but here's another example
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=60167
In fairness that hold is pretty hard to spot given that it is about head hight when stood at the bottom of the problem!!
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gives me the necessary mental skills to know to brush the fucking tickmarks off.
and that's the point isn't it, if you really need a tick mark fine, but put it on softly and brush it off before you leave....
as fiend implies it ain't rocket science or brain surgery....
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Someone tell me this is uncannily accurate and white birdshit...
(http://www.zen59200.zen.co.uk/Adam/Galleries/Climbing/RyanCratcliffeprow.jpg)
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Yes its birdshit. Is this a new record for most copied and posted pic on the forum? Are you after a job as UKB's very own Mick Ryan?
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What problem is it?
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Sparrow/My Best Friend The Watermelon
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Looks high but good, where abouts is it? Rough grade?
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cratcliffe, font 7c
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Check the discussion in chuffing>Last Great Routes/Highballs thread for details.
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Cheers guys! Awesome just noticed i have become a player, i am going up in the world!
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Is this a new record for most copied and posted pic on the forum?
Errrrr....one could also stick it in the Quality Bouldering Pics thread :)
Are you after a job as UKB's very own Mick Ryan?
Oh dear god no >:(
Nice pic BTW, quite an entertaining scenario it shows.
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Decided to try and haul my ass across Wrights Traverse in the Churnet this afternoon and found this little lot. Whatever next !
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o285/brooksism/DSC07756.jpg?t=1173988927)
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o285/brooksism/DSC07757.jpg?t=1173988963)
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o285/brooksism/DSC07758.jpg?t=1173989016)
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o285/brooksism/DSC07759.jpg?t=1173989052)
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Either you're joking or this is climbing by numbers? Makes good beta for the flash I guess!!!!
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What do R and L mean?
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Reft and Light?
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Rest, Lock off.
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Not Robert and Lindsay? Apparently he's very good in the new stage version of The Producers. The perpetrator might be a fan.
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All that tickmarking and they got the sequence wrong. punters.
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Nice... someone actually carries a stick of chalk about marking up holds :wank:
I wonder if they have R and L written on the backs of there hands aswell !?
Must be a maths teacher, its important to show your working out... right?
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All that tickmarking and they got the sequence wrong. punters.
Thats what I thought to. There was even a foot hold marked with a L as well. The bit after the glued flake was unmarked and its there when you're running out of juice you need to remeber the sequence.
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damn right, i got there and thought i was fucked cos i'd totally missed a deep 2finger pocket, but luckily spotted it as the last minute.
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That's the most spannerish thing I have seen in a while. Unless it's a pisstake.
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I think we may have a candidate for the worst tick marking award 2007. Truly terrible and no wonder non-clibers complain about our impact on the crag. Made slightly better (for comedy reasons) by getting the sequence wrong though.
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IMHO there's nought wrong with the odd tick line if it's really needed so long as it's put on lightly so that you can completely remove (brush it off) before you leave otherwise it's a antisocial as mindless graffiti and people that leave tick marks (and worse sequences) are wankers...
(rant over, kids playing up at school... nearly easter holidays... thank fuck)
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I managed to really piss off a german guy on Bishop by brushing a similar set of tick marks off the iron man traverse. He came over just as we were leaving and said 'I had a great sequence worked out, I had put an L for my left, an R for my right and an M on the hold I was to match, now I will have to start all over again' ::)
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Shame you didn't know he was still there. You could have changed them all to Rs and watched the fun :lol:
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(http://www.fortcollinsacupuncture.com/climbing/Moab%203-9-1.JPG)
(http://www.fortcollinsacupuncture.com/climbing/MOab%203-9-2.JPG)
(http://www.fortcollinsacupuncture.com/climbing/Moab%203-11-1.JPG)
Last week's trip to Utah
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Don't see many donkey lines there El Blunko...
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wrong thread dab!!!
;D
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Now how the hell did I manage to do that?!? I was looking right at Bonjoy's latest pic when I posted! :-[
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Nicve pics regardless. Are those the Bend Boulders near Moab? Did you fnally succeed on your 20 year (or so) nemesis?
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Yes, it is Big Bend, and no I didn't get my nemesis. I think I'm going to give up on it finally, it's too far to keep driving out there now that we have kids and work is more demanding. Oh well, it's not like I didn't have fun trying it!
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(http://tkak.mine.nu/bimbo/bilder/464_mrhallontarta_hans.JPG)
:o
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Spotted on the Hard Grit Slackjaw website - http://www.slackjaw.co.uk/climbingfilms/hgtfbtl.html - scoll to the bottom to see the guilty party!
Guess we are just following our heroes!
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http://upload.pbase.com/chris_craggs/image/77453901 (http://upload.pbase.com/chris_craggs/image/77453901)
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at least those tickmarks are there to save ones life.
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And it's not exactly like you can just brush them off once you have used them.
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I have this vague suspicion that on leads of Meshuga (where the ticks might save one from injury), one might well be abseiling off for the cam in the break, and thus able to clean them then.
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But that it were vertical, you probably could.
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A couple of beauties here. But then Nowra is one big tickmark.
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/222/485803150_604b3fd1e4.jpg?v=0)
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does a chipped tickmarked hold count as double?
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This hold must be hard to see from a multitude of directions
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/206/501951650_cd6daf8f09.jpg?v=0)
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Just seen this on UKC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHQ9pWEG9dE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHQ9pWEG9dE)
talk about climbing by numbers... :shrug:
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No! The youtube version doesn't have the scream on it!
https://www.posingproductions.com/video.php?form_action=play&video_id=77
much better and less techno.
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(http://joost.climbing.nl/rest/fredopium)
What a mess
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I meant to post sooner about this, but last weekend I noticed that Parthian Shot was donkey lined up good style, with lines so big you could see them from the Burbage South boulders...is that really necessary?
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There was some horrendous donkey ticking at Thorn Crag last week. No need for it at all >:(
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Andy, I think you'll find those are sheep up at Thorn Crag, not donkeys. Either way we shouldn't be defacing dumb animals.
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There's not much that needs a mark at Thorn. What problems were ticked, Andy? Would have taken 2 minutes to brush off I bet. At least this rain will clean them.
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Lots of stuff on the crag boulders, those slab problems were particularly badly ticked up.
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As in Fire Wall? Jeez, someone needs new glasses.
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Aye it was ticktastic last week :furious: but most of it should wash off apart from yon steep 7b+ prow thing below the crag which needed some brushing. We coulda but didn't :spank:
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(http://joost.climbing.nl/rest/fredopium)
where and what is this please? looks good (apart from the ticks!)
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I think its opium in font.
It is
http://bleau.info/recloses/974-23322.html
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I find Finnish boulderers particularly disrespectful to the rock:
(http://www.slouppi.net/contents/pics/Foto/E75_JamaicaRoof_Anton.jpg)
Jamaica Roof E75, Lahti. The only sandstone in their country and they kill it with chalk, looks reasonably tick-free here.
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Those lines on the left look particularly ugly and pointless as there are four of them pointing to every part of a big hold that is already very obvious. As it's covered in chalk. :shrug:
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Dude, you could berth the Enterprise on that hold.
And they do it everywhere, I've not ever seen any attempt to remove chalk, post-climb.
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http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=78632 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=78632)
These two are just missing a circle in the middle for the full cats arse effect.
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now that's unbelievably unecessary.... all this stuff that's from abroad is poor, but THAT, THERE is soo out of order.
name and shame the perp I say.
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or use the perp's face to scrub away the mess perhaps? I am sure that the rural artist involved will have cleaned their work off as soon as they had done the problem.
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It is bollox.
The thing is....marking holds can be pretty useful. That's why people do it.
But what I don't fucking get is, why the hell do people think they need these fucking harsh enormous scraped on lines?? What is wrong with a little finger smudge or a single faint line, drawn with your finger rather than smeared on with a whole chalk lump?? It seems so fucking obvious to just put a little dab by the hold instead of an huge graffitied target....doing the latter would take some special effort to actually think of, let alone think it was a good idea...
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I am sure that the rural artist involved will have cleaned their work off as soon as they had done the problem.
That's just the thing. Like Fiend says they do help. Just many people can't seem to be arsed cleaning them off afterwards. Not sure if they think they are doing everyone else a favour by leaving it there?
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If I ever leave any on its purely forgetfullness
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Surely they only help when you can't actually see a hold, or need to hit a specific bit of a hold. I mean if you can see it why do you need to tick it?
If you as forgetful as me, and Jim, then you're onsighting every problem every go anyway, so you shouldn't have any ticks because you would blow the onsight every go!
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are you ryan?
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with my age and general decrepiside.i can't see things so mark them up also i then forget rub them off.sometimes i even forget what i've gone to the crag for and just walk round drawing little lines.
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http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=78630
Spot the pebble
fuck me sideways...
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http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=77456
Christ - it gets worse - and he's not even off the ground!
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At least he's trying to get off the ground eh. I don't think one needs a witch-hunt with other photos.
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At least he's trying to get off the ground eh. I don't think one needs a witch-hunt with other photos.
irony never your strongest point Fiend - at least those donkey's are pretty lookin...
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with my age and general decrepiside.i can't see things so mark them up also i then forget rub them off.sometimes i even forget what i've gone to the crag for and just walk round drawing little lines.
with the other sort of white powder?
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this is wrong on so many levels:
not only it is a horrible way to tick a foothold, but also it means the most idiotic sequence to do that problem (unless you are 2 meters tall).
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2163/2195244746_3c680c83e4.jpg?v=0)
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maybe thats advanced donkey lining.you mark the holds that you don't use.
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this is wrong on so many levels:
not only it is a horrible way to tick a foothold, but also it means the most idiotic sequence to do that problem (unless you are 2 meters tall).
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2163/2195244746_3c680c83e4.jpg?v=0)
That's not been ticked, it has been crossed out to prevent people from using it by mistake - a stroke (well 2 really) of genius.
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It's a starting handhold... :spank:
(http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/8241/picture002dl8.jpg)
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thats fucking awful. why? you don't even put your foot in there
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It's a starting handhold...
Not if you're doing the sit start.
It's still unnacceptable though, as was the amount of tickage left on DWR after the weekend.
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Yeah DWR was fucked on friday. It was as if CAMP's factory had exploded and the fallout had settled on almscliff...
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Yeah DWR was fucked on friday. It was as if CAMP's factory had exploded and the fallout had settled on almscliff...
I have a vision of bits of axes & harnesses all over the place. I suspect that's not what you mean though ... ;D
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Thats some of the worst tick marks i have seen and too not brush them off. Whoever it is should be shot! I thought Hueco was bad but fuck me!
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I tried to brush them off two days in a row but they just wouldn't budge...
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Time for a resurrection
Is he trying to count to 5 or something...
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2175/2374308967_4080711a35.jpg?v=0)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3190/2377058028_af3f5208e8.jpg)
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RE: The above.
1st pic looks difficult, V10/V11+, those holds look small and the terrain is steep; accuracy required. Rock looks granitesque & grey (none too difficlut to clean afterwards).
Sandstone pic is a travesty, not the ticks which are tiny but the holds. They look terrible and I think that rock as gorgeous and rich as this should be treated better and receive a thorough washing once in a while. Why did sandstone/ferrous-coloured chalk die out? It's better than that white stuff.
Climbers talk the talk about respecting the rock but I hardly ever see them whack their muck off afterwards, nevermind wash holds.
Don't get me started on cigarette butts either! >:( Not cool!
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Don't get me started on cigarette butts either! >:( Not cool!
I find the zip pocket on my chalk bag particularly handy for these. Makes the chalk stink, but that in itself discourages me from using so much :P
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What we have here is the development of a ritual. The extension of an initially ad hoc and almost certainly quite useful indication of "where the fucking hold is" to something done to invoke the hold's presence after the 300th failure to do the problem. Ticking a hold is now like chalking up: you don't do it because you need to but because it is part of the psyching for doing the problem.
You could PhD's on this shit
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It's obscene . . .
. . . that climbers believe they are the most appropriate guardians of rocky places, and that perhaps they are the only group to use them. I wonder what other people - in the Peak, for example - think of the filth we leave on such gorgeous brown and green rocks? The fag and joint stubs; chalk wrappers; empty cans etc.. Climbers are extraordinarily selfish in this respect ie: the lack of. Not to say we are the only abusers of special places, but really - so much of this destructive behaviour is avoidable.
And yes, I do have a hangover! :furious:
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It's obscene . . .
. . . that climbers believe they are the most appropriate guardians of rocky places, and that perhaps they are the only group to use them. I wonder what other people - in the Peak, for example - think of the filth we leave on such gorgeous brown and green rocks? The fag and joint stubs; chalk wrappers; empty cans etc.. Climbers are extraordinarily selfish in this respect ie: the lack of. Not to say we are the only abusers of special places, but really - so much of this destructive behaviour is avoidable.
And yes, I do have a hangover! :furious:
As on outdoor user group we do ourselves little favour I agree..
I too have the effects of a rather good evening resonating through my skull. Now remember why I rarely drink red wine...
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Coloured chalk?
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I seem to remember coloured chalk was tried years ago but never took off. I guess you'd need a different colour for each different rock type etc etc
A lot easier to use less chalk and brush it off afterwards.
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Coloured chalk?
Jus Kiddin!
Think they tried coulored bolts too, in Heuco?
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I've seen (or not seen) coloured bolts in a few places.
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What we have here is the development of a ritual. The extension of an initially ad hoc and almost certainly quite useful indication of "where the fucking hold is" to something done to invoke the hold's presence after the 300th failure to do the problem. Ticking a hold is now like chalking up: you don't do it because you need to but because it is part of the psyching for doing the problem.
You could PhD's on this shit
:agree:
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(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2416/2388726127_13b4c68862_o.jpg)
It's a f*cking jug you C*NTS
This sort of crap always happens when it's been dry for a while and people think caley might be a go. Respect the crag.
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I can understand a small tick for the top but not one massive one on that bit! :spank:
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I think you rarely need more than a spot to indicate direction. why do you need the marks to go all the way to the hold? you can't see it anyway. has nobody else thought to use a bit of finger tape instead of chalk - i did this on the keel to universal derision. until i peeled it off leaving No Mark Whatsoever...
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RE: The above.
1st pic looks difficult, V10/V11+, those holds look small and the terrain is steep; accuracy required. Rock looks granitesque & grey (none too difficlut to clean afterwards).
Sandstone pic is a travesty, not the ticks which are tiny but the holds. They look terrible and I think that rock as gorgeous and rich as this should be treated better and receive a thorough washing once in a while. Why did sandstone/ferrous-coloured chalk die out? It's better than that white stuff.
Climbers talk the talk about respecting the rock but I hardly ever see them whack their muck off afterwards, nevermind wash holds.
Don't get me started on cigarette butts either! >:( Not cool!
Its schule des lebans (8a+/b) or no mystery (8a/+) at chironico!
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ps, have you seen the 'arrow' down to the toe hook in the ju ju club picture? who is this retard?
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Went to have a look at Arabesque and Eclipse the other day. I have never seen such a fucking mess. It was quite depressing. The pocket round the lip on Arabesque had about ten thick chalk lines pointing to it and everything else was also ticked to fuck. We talked about taking a picture for this thread but I forgot.
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Went to have a look at Arabesque and Eclipse the other day. I have never seen such a fucking mess. It was quite depressing. The pocket round the lip on Arabesque had about ten thick chalk lines pointing to it and everything else was also ticked to fuck. We talked about taking a picture for this thread but I forgot.
The whole block had a dirty, graffitied, shat-on urban look to it that made me glad to walk away from it. Very dissapointing (and my arms hurt too much to pull on anyway).
Edit - some of the mess was actually graffiti about stopping using chalk. :shrug:
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Shame. When I was there in Dec' a Japanese party were sieging the bloc in the damp. The amount of chalk used was horrific. You can see why it pisses-off Bleausards.
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Edit - some of the mess was actually graffiti about stopping using chalk. :shrug:
Yeah written in some sort of orange crayon right accross the white slab of rock on Eclipse. What the fuck? :thumbsdown:
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We too were out last week - the orange graffiti said "STOP MAGNESIE" and we saw it in a variety of places - the Toit De Cul De Chien roof, L'Autre Toit Roof and on a random bloc next to Le Flippeur at 91.1. Some wag had covered the TDCDC writing in chalk.
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RE: The above.
1st pic looks difficult, V10/V11+, those holds look small and the terrain is steep; accuracy required. Rock looks granitesque & grey (none too difficlut to clean afterwards).
Sandstone pic is a travesty, not the ticks which are tiny but the holds. They look terrible and I think that rock as gorgeous and rich as this should be treated better and receive a thorough washing once in a while. Why did sandstone/ferrous-coloured chalk die out? It's better than that white stuff.
Climbers talk the talk about respecting the rock but I hardly ever see them whack their muck off afterwards, nevermind wash holds.
Don't get me started on cigarette butts either! >:( Not cool!
I use a great little pocket-sized device called a stubbi for disposing of my tab ends , available to all at www.stubbi.com ....... Considered giving up the filthy habit but I'm still cold turkeying from lack of alcohol and I'm no good at multi-tasking .....
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May be not the most offensive, but this has really got my goat!
Went to Wrights rock last weekend to see tick marks on almost every foot and handhold. Me and Andi brushed them all off, but on returning today they were back with a vengence! And back on A BLOODY JUG! AAAAHHHHHH! WHY!!!!
Can whoever it is please stop it, use your bloody eyes, theres enough chalk on the hold itself to see where it is, and the marks didn't even point to the best part of the jug!!!!
At least its not as bad as last years R and L being chalked on Wrights traverse ;D
(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa21/martind_02/Climbing%20stuff/DSC00217.jpg)
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It's obscene . . .
. . . that climbers believe they are the most appropriate guardians of rocky places, and that perhaps they are the only group to use them. I wonder what other people - in the Peak, for example - think of the filth we leave on such gorgeous brown and green rocks? The fag and joint stubs; chalk wrappers; empty cans etc.. Climbers are extraordinarily selfish in this respect ie: the lack of. Not to say we are the only abusers of special places, but really - so much of this destructive behaviour is avoidable.
And yes, I do have a hangover! :furious:
don't get me started on this... the amount of crap climbers leave behind both disappoints and really pisses me off.. I've started taking a plazzy bag with me whenever I go out just to pick other peoples rubbish... so far this week I've picked up sweet wrappers at the base of brad pit, fag ends, tape and crisp packets from two squirrels / the drey.. clearly in this instance its boulderers.. but I can't for the life of me understand it.. I stopped thinking dropping litter made me cool when I was about thirteen..
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Glad to here someone is clearing up the crags out there.
Me and a mate filled 2 plastic bags with litter in the summer at Almscliff.
I sound like an old bastard but litter and graffiti at crags drives me fucking mad!!!
:rtfm:
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Pointless marking at New Mills Tor...
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2399/2415067293_a01b21ca1c.jpg?v=0) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/slackline/2415067293/)
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Are you sure that isn't Anasazi artwork?
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We too were out last week - the orange graffiti said "STOP MAGNESIE" and we saw it in a variety of places - the Toit De Cul De Chien roof, L'Autre Toit Roof and on a random bloc next to Le Flippeur at 91.1. Some wag had covered the TDCDC writing in chalk.
And one month on it's still there. Anyone know what the deal is? Some person with a beef? Or just kids. I noticed in true graffiti style it said "STOP MAGESIE" in one place. never saw it other than in that area though.
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"STOP MAGESIE"
I would've loved to have been there a la Life of Brian in my centurion uniform w/ spear and caught them red-handed: given the illiterate cunts a lesson they'd never forget in Gallic spelling . . .
(http://www.romaneseuntdomus.net/forum/templates/lunazstyle/images/logo_phpBB.gif)
Now write it out a hundred times!
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people called romans they go into the house?
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The Nose at Burbage West had huge tick marks on every hold the other night. Each mark was at least 4 inches long and an inch wide. I could see them clearly from the road as I drove past at 39mph (and no more officer). Ridiculous.
Hopefully they'll have been washed off now by the rain.
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WTF do you need to tickmark on the nose? You can see all the holds. Maybe this is due to people climbing on grit when it's hot and humid (eh saltbeef :lol:)
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people called romans they go into the house?
romanii eust unt?
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CENTURION: Now, wash it off a hundred times.
Punter: Yes, sir. Thank you, sir. Hail Caesar, sir.
CENTURION: Hail Caesar. If it's not done by sunrise, I'll cut your balls off.
I paraphrase ;)
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CENTURION: Now, wash it off write it out a hundred times.
Punter: Yes, sir. Thank you, sir. Hail Caesar, sir.
CENTURION: Hail Caesar. If it's not done by sunrise, I'll cut your balls off.
I paraphrase ;) (badly)
:)
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It was a toss up ... to go with the original or something just slightly related to bouldering, after all we wouldn't want the little buggers chalking up a hundred more donkey stripes ::)
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Last week I saw a tick mark on the pocket of Hank's wall. Luckily I brushed it off, and later it rained and washed it away.
Then I went back yesterday and it was back:
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2137/2535561009_06c22868c1.jpg)
WTF?? It's an obvious pocket, even when doing Hank's.
I doubt it was anyone on here, but whoever did it- please don't.
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maybe its some jesus-heads. or some patriotic swiss attempting a crude rendition of their national ensign.
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I'm more concerned about the amount of chalk leaking out of Layback, WTF?
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It isn't leaking, someone had marked the arete 'cos it's not at all obvious normally ::)
There's a guy that regularly puffs each hold with a chalk ball, this is partly what you can see on Parr's. No advantage to doing it, I've no idea why he wastes his chalk.
Idiots.
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(http://www2.snapfish.co.uk/slideshow/AlbumID=238717960/PictureID=5678860097/a=72146871_72146871/t_=72146871)
Check out this dog show. You travel halfway around the globe some of the best sandstone on the planet and are confronted by this. Ulan Batar, a classic 7b of Rocklands defaced thus. My companion's expression tells it all.
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Does anybody know how to make my image work properly? I have tried putting the Snapfish web address inbetween two 'img' marks above but it didn't work :-\. the web address is:
http://www2.snapfish.co.uk/slideshow/AlbumID=238717960/PictureID=5678860097/a=72146871_72146871/t_=72146871 (http://www2.snapfish.co.uk/slideshow/AlbumID=238717960/PictureID=5678860097/a=72146871_72146871/t_=72146871)
Thanks in advance.
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Does anybody know how to make my image work properly? I have tried putting the Snapfish web address inbetween two 'img' marks above but it didn't work :-\. the web address is:
http://www2.snapfish.co.uk/slideshow/AlbumID=238717960/PictureID=5678860097/a=72146871_72146871/t_=72146871 (http://www2.snapfish.co.uk/slideshow/AlbumID=238717960/PictureID=5678860097/a=72146871_72146871/t_=72146871)
Thanks in advance.
(http://render-2.snapfish.com/render2/is=Yup6aQQ%7C%3Dup6RKKt%3Axxr%3D0-qpDofRt7Pf7mrPfrj7t%3DzrRfDUX%3AeQaQxg%3Dr%3F87KR6xqpxQQeoxPJlxaePxv8uOc5xQQQlee00lQlQJqpfVtB%3F*KUp7BHSHqqy7XH6gX0Qooe%7CRup6lQQ%7C/of=50,480,360)
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Thanks Adam. I can only see a big red square where the picture should be but maybe my PC is not configured properly.
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It is a red, 4 sided shape for me also.
(http://render-2.snapfish.com/render2/is=Yup6aQQ%7C%3Dup6RKKt%3Axxr%3D0-qpDofRt7Pf7mrPfrj7t%3DzrRfDUX%3AeQaQxg%3Dr%3F87KR6xqpxQQeoxPJlxaePxv8uOc5xQQQlee00lQlQJqpfVtB%3F*KUp7BHSHqqy7XH6gX0Qooe%7CRup6lQQ%7C/of=50,480,360)
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Works in preview though :shrug:
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Kudos wall was a right mess on Friday. Tsunami / BSD were ticked to fuck with big smeary chunks of chalk on everything that might have been a foothold and the top of Hot Fun looked like a bird had been shitting all over it.
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and the top of Hot Fun looked like a bird had been shitting all over it.
Maybe she got scared ....
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T - Crack also looked bad last weekend- the top slopey dish had a 3 foot line down to the break! Absolutely no need >:(
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Dr F with some of his own handy work.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3092/2889645523_69ef0fdde3.jpg)
And the problem is?
(Jim that question is not open to you).
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Was climbing with an austrian bloke the other day. Apparently they call them "landing strips" over there. Gives some idea of their thinking eh...... :thumbsdown:
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And the problem is?
Jerry's arete at the bridey's - is that a recent pic? haven't been up for years because the rock's getting so fucked by climbing.
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It's a disgrace up there. I live 5 mins drive away and have been probably less than half a dozen times in the last twelve months, it's just depressing....
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Taken on Wednesday. It is pretty sandy, we had a good day though.
Luckily we had a team flash of everything we tried, keeping erosion to a minimum.
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Some beauties from the much discussed 'Cornelius' at Ina's Rock. It looks like they've been brushed clean, but as the crag gets no direct rain they'll probably remain til the next ice age!
(http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr13/andi_turner/DSC00719.jpg)
Oh, and perhaps for a different thread, belayer of shame! Hang your head :spank:
(http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr13/andi_turner/DSC00734.jpg)
Good job the rock's solid up there! :lol:
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:o Good job I didn't look down
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:o Good job I didn't look down
to find he was dressed like a woman? he looks like he's about to tell you denial is not just a river in egypt.
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someone toproping a boulder problem?
whatever next
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My bad. We forgot to brush them off.
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someone toproping a boulder problem?
whatever next
No. Leading a route
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Or effectively soloing one, with that belay! ;)
The link??
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check this shit
some fuker, has no sense on a piss easy problem at sabots today
to the biggest jug off all aswell
(http://www.maisonbleau.com/tickmark.jpg)
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to need a tick mark that big for that hold you must be either blind or reatarded
...or both
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The worst thing is (if that's the 6B+ thing I think it is) you can't see that hold when you're reaching round for it anyway, the ridiculous tick mark wouldn't even help! :wall:
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The worst thing is (if that's the 6B+ thing I think it is) you can't see that hold when you're reaching round for it anyway, the ridiculous tick mark wouldn't even help! :wall:
yes it probably is the 6b you are thinking of, complete waste of time, I was so fucked off when I saw it. The worst thing is it was a very fresh mark as it was raining and the rocks were saturated
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The worst thing is (if that's the 6B+ thing I think it is) you can't see that hold when you're reaching round for it anyway, the ridiculous tick mark wouldn't even help! :wall:
I thought that just looking at and haven't even been/climbed the problem.
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::) shows how much you lot know about bouldering. Those tick marks are there to help with Chapeau Chinois Super Direct. The jug is in, but you are not allowed to use common sense, beta or technique. L2+. This is a long term project so I hope no one has stolen that carfully placed chalk render.
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I took a photo of a couple of tick marks I found at Sabots earlier this year but deleted it by mistake. It was a double wammy. I think it was on a roof problem to the left of red #2. There was a massive arrow of chalk pointing down to a little hole at the base of the boulder, I guess for a toe hook. There was also a massive arrow along the roof to the hold pass the lip. Crossing the arrow was a line of chalk and the following words "Ici 30cm".
:spank: :thumbsdown:
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"Ici 30cm".
from a teachers perspective that's almost encouraging the kids are generally poor at remembering to include their units......
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Ok so his arm's in a cast (or something), but still. Three massive ticks, pointing at what exactly?
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/116/255017635_17fa8fe20e.jpg?v=0) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/wiklund/255017969/in/set-72157594303552170/)
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is that helicopter?
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looks like it
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is that helicopter?
Yus. I think I made the pic into a link to the page too.
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In Albarracin (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,9027.0.html) of all places :spank: :rtfm:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3239/3043266694_85974121e2.jpg?v=0) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/redchili/3043266694/)
To be fair I think the arrow does add to the composition of the photo, but to do so in an area where there are access issues which in part stem from over use of chalk is just plain ignorant, but who knows, maybe they are good boulderers and brushed off their tick marks and arrows afterwards :shrug:
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he's also on that dyno wall that as far as I'm aware you're not allowed to climb on cos its in plain view of the road and only about 15ft from said carriageway.
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and from this angle it looks like something very nasty has happened to his left arm
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and from this angle it looks like something very nasty has happened to his left arm
Live in hope, if he is really somewhere where he shouldn't be.
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It seems the inspiration of Master's Edge being onsighted fairly regularly recently hasn't filtered down to the unwashed masses as much as it should. So it's back to headpointing by numbers for numpties. Or is that headpointing by numpties for numbers????
Crap phone photos btw.
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/metickslower.jpg)
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/meticksupper.jpg)
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Found this "little" beauty on my phone last night - I think that it was in the Congo Corner area at Stanage. Quite why this was donkey ticked in such a garish fashion is unknown as the hold is at eye level while stood on the ground and is quite probably big enough to see from the road!
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3051/3060369085_59a8d1a034.jpg?v=0)
bluebrad
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Found this while deleting phone photos.
(http://www.photobox.co.uk/my/photo?album_id=91061691&photo_id=1569441899)
It was on that 6a on the side of the dog at Burgbage South. As usual it doesn't even look as if it'd any use, it took bloody ages to brush it off, longer than it did to belly flop/side roll the top out.
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... it took bloody ages to brush it off...
Well you did a grand job of brushing it off there Rich as I can't see it :P
There ya go....
(http://img3014.photobox.co.uk/38615674679b968cef8b27ebaa3d4f0e8d9236df62634b37f452fe2fa193612691336bdd.jpg)
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cheers :oops:
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It is the year 2009. Grit E8 is now being flashed and even onsighted. No doubt E7 onsights are more common-place. Old-skool death solos are often highballed.
It's over a decade since Dave Jones fell off Braille Trail and got away unscathed. More recently a teenage boy has fallen off near the top of Grandad's Slab (closer to the inital ledge) unscathed, and effectively done the top crux of Braille Trail solo.
So what are people doing this days, in this climate of climbing progress and increased stylistic quality??
(http://www.fiendy.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/brailletraildickmarks.jpg)
Tick marks?? Dick marks more like.
Also a big yawn goes out to the people dogging the hell out of the multiply-ground-upped Messiah :yawn:
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It was Katy "should be in DFBWGC" Whittaker, as she is a lass and headpointing E7 is still cutting edge-ish for the ladies does that make it ok?
:shrug:
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Certainly the same ticks can still be seen in the photo of her doing it over on UKC. Nonetheless another good 'tick' in what is turning out to be a classic season.
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It was Katy "should be in DFBWGC" Whittaker, as she is a lass and headpointing E7 is still cutting edge-ish for the ladies does that make it ok?
It alleviates the irritation a little bit, yes, solely for the reason you give. Even so, I personally would expect / hope (and indeed enthusiastically praise) better things in this day and age, given her flash of Nosferatu, and given the aforementioned falls off this bit of rock. The above is all a bit....join the dots.
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The above is all a bit....join the dots.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Paul Worsdale at Burbage West yesterday, 'appalled' at the treatment of West Side Story.
(http://www.zen59200.zen.co.uk/Adam/Galleries/Climbing/wess_mess.jpg)
Its a fucking disgrace.
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Is Mr Worsdale sporting a goaty these days??!! Tell him that's more appalling than the state of WSS!!! ;)
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who's this Paul Worsdale?
yes it was a fucking disgrace (worms beard attempt and wss)
that photo doesn't really do it justice tbh, it was a fuckin disgrace,
It looked like mini-me had been sieging percy's sit start
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(http://www.zen59200.zen.co.uk/Adam/Galleries/Climbing/wess_mess.jpg)
Is that grief of a sailor, or Cornish guilt?
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In Katies defence she had nowt to do with the ticks, some cock muncher, had put them on before we arrived, Let it be said he knew he was in the wrong by the time he left! "fuck me mate you won't fuck your feet up will you." And "your not thinking of leaving them on are you?, and "oh it's ok that nice girls going to ab down and clean up your mess." "you dick" think he got the message. Would have taken his pic if i'd have had a camera.
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(http://www.zen59200.zen.co.uk/Adam/Galleries/Climbing/wess_mess.jpg)
I assume you used photoshop to make him look taller.
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You think he looks tall there? His hands are level with the starting FOOTholds.
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You think he looks tall there? His hands are level with the starting FOOTholds.
Point proven!
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i don't really understand. what is all the fuss about? it looks like it always does except with 2 more holds chalked.
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You think he looks tall there? His hands are level with the starting FOOTholds.
I'm more taken aback by the ground erosion, Worms knees are nearly where the ground used to be!
Mind you, he's probably a bad stick to measure from ;D
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I'm more taken aback by the ground erosion, Worms knees are nearly where the ground used to be!
Hadn't noticed that until you poited it out. I'm sure when I was there (late 90s) the rocks by his right foot were a mere lump.
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I took a photo of a couple of tick marks I found at Sabots earlier this year but deleted it by mistake. It was a double wammy. I think it was on a roof problem to the left of red #2. There was a massive arrow of chalk pointing down to a little hole at the base of the boulder, I guess for a toe hook. There was also a massive arrow along the roof to the hold pass the lip. Crossing the arrow was a line of chalk and the following words "Ici 30cm".
:spank: :thumbsdown:
Found them.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3483/3795855508_882b8c8316.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/41040072@N07/)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2638/3795856110_9763c214fa.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/41040072@N07/)
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Must be a pisstake. Amazing if not.
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Any one want to own up to this attrocity? Must have occurred yesterday, when it was drizzling :roll:
Problems like this should not be attempted when damp as they have fragile holds and pebbles which are weak when wet.
And as it has now been climbed ground-up, top-roping should be out, particularly to the ludicrous extent evidenced below.
(http://www.zen59200.zen.co.uk/Adam/Galleries/Climbing/careless.jpg)
Just had a report that the idiots are back - apparently this time the mess is even worse.
I'll pre-empt any idiot's retort with this:
The top of Careless is fragile. The holds are easily damaged, especially when damp.
The start is a knack move - if you do it once you will be able to do it again.
You do not need to worry about the top until you have proven you can do the start. Several folk have now climbed this ground-up - to climb it in any other style is POOR STYLE.
Covering it in chalk and ticks off a rope is totally unneccessary. Toproping the top in the vain hope you may one day fluke it through the start and wobble on to glory is for feeble-minded fools who need to take a long hard look at their own ability and lack of ambition.
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Good thread rzarection.
Copped this on the weekend. No tickmakrs but a ridiculous amount of chalk. I can only assume this also is the work of toproping since its hard to imagine anyone good enough to hang around on this thing on the lead long enough to cake it in chalk this badly would need to much chalk at this time of year. we tried to clean all the lower stuff off but short of using a jetwash i couldn't make any headway.
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/Abkb_chalk.jpg)
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Found the culprit...
(http://inapcache.boston.com/universal/site_graphics/blogs/bigpicture/agwc_10_14/a04_20712315.jpg) (http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/10/artistic_gymnastics_world_cham.html)
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bloody gymnasts.
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I can only assume this also is the work of toproping
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/Abkb_chalk.jpg)
I'd have thought that if it was chalked from a top rope, the undercut out left would be similarly caked?
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possibly, it was chalked you just can't see it in that photo. maybe it was topropers who were a bit shit? on the same day we saw 2 german guys seiging norferatu on a rope and struggling with the moves.
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There were two people struggling to top rope Nosferatu last weekend too. I seem to see far more people top roping on Burbage South than other crags (not that I have any particular beef with people top roping).
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maybe it was topropers who were a bit shit?
:lol:
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There were two people struggling to top rope Nosferatu last weekend too. I seem to see far more people top roping on Burbage South than other crags (not that I have any particular beef with people top roping).
I think its the aspiring/wannabee hard grit climbers crag of choice.
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Newstones today;
(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa21/martind_02/Climbing%20stuff/DSC_1980.jpg)
Similar ridiculous markings were found on The Vein and The Ripple problems. Idiots!
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Freshers! :spank:
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That's runic script for "front bottom"
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Freshers! :spank:
Assumptions?
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Just heard UKC have received a few pics of Careless last week (not from me). Prepare to be appalled - I think a new lowpoint has been reached here.
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Freshers! :spank:
Assumptions?
Guesstimated... Mini and I went up there last w/end and the place was swarming with 30+ students/young folk (Liverpool uni minibus in layby) so we passed thro to Baldstones.
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Just heard UKC have received a few pics of Careless last week (not from me). Prepare to be appalled - I think a new lowpoint has been reached here.
saw it at the weekend. fucking horrendous.
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(http://cdn.ukclimbing.com/i/127920.jpg)
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(http://cdn.ukclimbing.com/i/127920.jpg)
Nice looking problem (with the exception of the tickmarks that are blighting it) - what is it?
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Careless torque, some esoteric offering
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Careless torque, some esoteric offering
I am attributing that monumental show of stupidity by myself down to being ill at the minute. :'(
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The double tickmarks on the jug after the finishing jug are the real icing on the cake!
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From that angle you can't see the donkey lines on the left hand side - 2, each a foot long. Still there yesterday.
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Its not exactly an obvious line is it!!!
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That is a fucking travesty!
Freshers! :spank:
Assumptions?
Guesstimated... Mini and I went up there last w/end and the place was swarming with 30+ students/young folk (Liverpool uni minibus in layby) so we passed thro to Baldstones.
Fair-do's I just hate the way some people trout out "bloody students" who are just normal people who happen to be spending part of their life studying for a degree. Really it should be "twats who can't work problems without daubbing chalk all over them and neglect to brush off any tickmarks they have put on when they've finished" (but I acknowledge thats a few more keystrokes :P )
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I hate it when people trout it out too :)
The CT pics are so sad it's almost funny. Almost.
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It's one of the consequences of the ethic of working routes, eg headpointed HVS's.
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OK so lets get down to the real question. Who did this? Someone must have seen this happening so what do people know?
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You're right, let's name and shame, because you know anyone boneheaded enough to do this won't be too far away from over zealous use of a wire brush or chisel.
My bet it we'll find a clue on red tips, or am I just being nasty? I'll report back in 5
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It has to be someone clueless, foreign or both
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Why foreign?
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Sorry, did I steal your line? ;)
Take a look around Font, Magic Wood, Albaracin, etc... I don't know why, they just do.
It's hard to imagine a local having reached the standard needed to be doing CT without becomeing aware that this sort of thing is a disgrace. It's easier to believe someone might have got that strong somewhere where heavy tickmarking is not frowned on and then taken their bad habits on holiday.
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Yeah its the chinese gymnasts (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,1942.msg224521.html#msg224521).
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Shirley you're all wrong. This must be a piss take......double tick marks?? This has to be a wind up. :shrug:
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Sorry, did I steal your line? ;)
Take a look around Font, Magic Wood, Albaracin, etc... I don't know why, they just do.
It's hard to imagine a local having reached the standard needed to be doing CT without becomeing aware that this sort of thing is a disgrace. It's easier to believe someone might have got that strong somewhere where heavy tickmarking is not frowned on and then taken their bad habits on holiday.
I may be many things but a xenophobe or racist I am not, nor am I accusing you of this.
I too have seen plenty of donkey lines in font, often drawn by Brits and I've seen donkey lines all over the trackside boulder to the degree that it made me think David Blunkett had been out for a lantern session without the lantern.
I imagine that many of the new school of young hardmen would think that a few donkey lines are a price worth paying, either that or it's some deluded Walter type who's working the top session so they'll be ready when the get good enough to do the start.
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Holy fucking ringpiece.
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You're right, let's name and shame, because you know anyone boneheaded enough to do this won't be too far away from over zealous use of a wire brush or chisel.
My bet it we'll find a clue on red tips, or am I just being nasty? I'll report back in 5
i reckon you on the right street there
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It's like the grafitti of the countryside. I gotta say, what the fuck must non-climbers be thinking about this?
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More pics on the other channel (http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=50009).
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All quite bizarre and unnecessary.... hopefully word will filter down to who-ever it is via here or from cocktalk...
Personally I doubt its the PGtips crowd - they may have been economical with the truth in the past regarding what was climbed etc.. but I would have thought they'd climbed at enough places to know whats what.. You've got to be really dense to not see anything wrong with these tick marks....
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You've got to be really dense to not see anything wrong with these tick marks....
Oh i am sure Dense would have plenty to say :lol:
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Can we have a general agreement that tick marks are not OK?
I mean - state it in all guide books that it makes an ascent not count and let everyone know that videos of people doing first ascents with tick marks will be ridiculed? Light tick marks are fine while you are working a problem, but if you can see the mark the send doesn't count.
I see this as the only way to stop front bottoms drawing on the crag.
I do worry about how much erosion might happen due to extinguishing tick marks.
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I may be many things but a xenophobe or racist I am not, nor am I accusing you of this.
Sorry, it was a cheap come back. No accusation intended.
Lager – Personally I wouldn't go so far regards tick marks. Using them makes you look stupid but doesn't invalidate an ascent. Using them for working something or ‘sending’ is the same in my eyes. The key issue is being minimalist with them so that on the odd occasion when you might feel you really need one a prob doesn't look horrific while you are on it and more crucially, properly removing them when you move on, even if you intend to come back later in the day.
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I may be many things but a xenophobe or racist I am not, nor am I accusing you of this.
Sorry, it was a cheap come back. No accusation intended.
Lager – Personally I wouldn't go so far regards tick marks. Using them makes you look stupid but doesn't invalidate an ascent. Using them for working something or ‘sending’ is the same in my eyes. The key issue is being minimalist with them so that on the odd occasion when you might feel you really need one a prob doesn't look horrific while you are on it and more crucially, properly removing them when you move on, even if you intend to come back later in the day.
:agree:
I'm guilty of using the odd tickmark, but only on a blind hold or hard to see foothold. I'm certainly not for puting huge tick-lines to every single hold on a problem, that's reeeeeeeeeedickyouluss
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I may be many things but a xenophobe or racist I am not, nor am I accusing you of this.
Sorry, it was a cheap come back. No accusation intended.
Lager – Personally I wouldn't go so far regards tick marks. Using them makes you look stupid but doesn't invalidate an ascent. Using them for working something or ‘sending’ is the same in my eyes. The key issue is being minimalist with them so that on the odd occasion when you might feel you really need one a prob doesn't look horrific while you are on it and more crucially, properly removing them when you move on, even if you intend to come back later in the day.
I know it wasn't an accusation and as for cheap come backs, I'm to tight to go for anything but.
Anyway, I'm sure at times all our ethical copy books are blotted, however it's about degree; and this abortion is so extreme as to amount to a total breach of accepted standards.
The problem is what is seen as acceptable for the elite will, in the eyes of the chorus of idiots be seen as acceptable for the uber punter. See the morons on COcktalk who think that because you can headpoint a serious grit E8 which has never been onsighted (or onsited in CT land) then it's equally valid to top rope Three Pebble Slab.
As such the onus is on the elite ( and of course us all) but particularly the media to be more responsible and adopt higher ethical standards, the first step would simply to not publish any photo's with donkey lines.
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not wanting to point any fingers but check out the tick marks here and the recent careless torque fiasco.http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=127987 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=127987)
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I was up there last monday and those ticks (on BP) were there. I gotta say it was like join the dots for the right foot hold.
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OK, I've not tried BP - but there are only 4-5 holds used? yes?
Are ANY of them blind (i.e. might need a mark)?
Sigh. it only takes a few seconds to brush the ticks away afterwards if you make any...
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not wanting to point any fingers but check out the tick marks here and the recent careless torque fiasco.http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=127987 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=127987)
to be honest i dont think these are particularly bad, im pretty sure i ticked the 1st sidepull on bp wen i did it, the only problem is if u dont brush them off after, of which this photo offers no evidence.
seems exactly like finger pointing to me
careless torque photos are an absolute disgrace
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http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=127987 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=127987)
awesome, I lowered down off the top into this position for a photo in my trainers. Look at me!!!!!!!!!
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To be fair with over 25 years of climbing I have fewer than 10 decent climbing pictures, it is however a bit sus that no sub cocktalk red twats pictures ever have them actually nailing the moves.....
FFS BP is only about one move,
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To be fair with over 25 years of climbing I have fewer than 10 decent climbing pictures, it is however a bit sus that no sub cocktalk red twats pictures ever have them actually nailing the moves.....
FFS BP is only about one move,
from the blog, a guy took pictures of the whole ascent, but only emailed the one were he actually downclimbed onto the jug :-\
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awesome, I lowered down off the top into this position for a photo in my trainers. Look at me!!!!!!!!!
My thoughts exactly!
Their happy to video themselves climbing a rusty fire escape but I see none of them completing any of the hard climbs they claim!
Sorry boys but :wank:
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Come now guys, this isn't a thread devoted to slagging off Red Tits, this is a thread about the monstrosities like CT as pictured previously. We can have an entire Red Tips Sucks Ass! thread if we want. Personally I'd rather just ignore them, and if they do anything stupid, then allow hell to break loose!
However I'd rather take a slightly more subtle approach to tickers. We were all beginners once upon a time (I know it was back in the annals of history Sloper), and the only way people learn what is right, and what is wrong, is by being told. I have ticked before, and not even thought about brushing them off (a long time ago), I have a friend who still doesn't understand why they should be unobtrusive, and brushed off afterwards. However we do both clear up after ourselves properly, and I have subtly asked people if they want to borrow my lapis to brush off the tickmarks they've left, just before they go.
I reckon it's better than slagging them off after they've left, complaining that they should know better, and posting photos on an internet thread, which they probably don't even look at.
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to be honest I don't really care if he's done it or not, just looks
a bit very suspect and I thought it'd be rude not to take the piss.
Infact I am going to start climbing on my own more often and ticking some big numbers. Seems to work for saltbeef
I do tick-mark and still tick, small and only the minimum needed and I try to remember to brush off afterwards although I seem to forget quite often but luckily the rain will take care of what I forget. Must try harder
With regards to piss taking out of red tips etc... it seems most of us are approaching middle age and I for one am quite jealous of their yooffullness. Most of it is harmless and I think as yoofs they can take it, they just need to be carefull when starting claims about very big numbers as I (and many others) like the history books to be correct
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Lager – Personally I wouldn't go so far regards tick marks. Using them makes you look stupid but doesn't invalidate an ascent.
Sadly being a berk doesn't mean you haven't actually climbed something, although it's quite a nice idea.
Also I'd use them if I couldn't sight something, although my short-sightedness isn't quite as bad as the photo-examples. And I'd probably clean them off too.
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awesome, I lowered down off the top into this position for a photo in my trainers. Look at me!!!!!!!!!
My thoughts exactly!
Their= they are= they're happy to video themselves climbing a rusty fire escape but I see none of them completing any of the hard grammar they claim!
Sorry boys but...
You can do better than this.
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awesome, I lowered down off the top into this position for a photo in my trainers. Look at me!!!!!!!!!
My thoughts exactly!
Their >< they are = they're happy to video themselves climbing a rusty fire escape but I see none of them completing any of the hard grammar they claim!
Sorry boys but...
You can do better than this.
Shurely?
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Sorry, I get wound up easy by this type of thing. Their only cheating themselves at the end of the day.
I vow never to look at their site again.
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Just a quick one back on the RT, LC, BP topic, I know it's not definitive (I got to this position about half a dozen times before finally doing it), but he is at least most of the way up it.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=128063 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=128063)
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I think the lines are getting blurred here. Let's leave the conjecture and bollocks about who's done what aside and look at the big picture.
The abuse of one of the greatest rock climbs in the Peak District is a disgrace that needs to be publicised.
This is firstly a beautiful piece of rock which has become a beautiful highball boulder problem.
The actions of whoever has done this have not only made a fucking mess, made climbers look like ruinous uncaring cunts and given more ammunition to the next landowner who wants to bar us from their property. They've also risked destroying the chance of someone climbing the problem in much better style than they are attempting to do by breaking holds on the fucking thing when it's dampness is making it even more fragile than it normally is.
This is wrong and a very big deal. Unlike the rest of the bollocks people are getting distracted by.
Someone must know who did this........
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Well said Drew & Jasper.
Sorry, I get wound up easy by this type of thing. Their only cheating themselves at the end of the day.
I vow never to look at their site again.
Their != they are
:lol:
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Their != they are
:lol:
That's coding language isn't it? I believe I went down the mathematical line of things with the >< (can also be written <> but looks a bit too much like parentheses).
EDIT: Sorry, that was :off:
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What Jasper said. In fact, exactly what Jasper said.
Jibing youths smacks of jealousy to me. I've no reason to think they're lying, nor connected to CT anymore than anyone else. In fact, Brad Pit in two sessions after climbing for 18 months smacks only of being a fucking massive talent.
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anyway back on topic
8a key to success :-\
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3033/3002487024_2dc6e5f972.jpg)
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Their != they are
:lol:
That's coding language isn't it? I believe I went down the mathematical line of things with the >< (can also be written <> but looks a bit too much like parentheses).
EDIT: Sorry, that was :off:
Keepig things :off:, yes it is coding for "not equal". The thing about >< or <> is that it implies its a range either between two points or outside of two points. The formal mathematical way (as opposed to coding) is to use ≠ (see here for more really boring mathematics crap (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_mathematical_symbols)).
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What Jasper said. In fact, exactly what Jasper said.
Jibing youths smacks of jealousy to me. I've no reason to think they're lying, nor connected to CT anymore than anyone else. In fact, Brad Pit in two sessions after climbing for 18 months smacks only of being a fucking massive talent.
I rather think that the proposition that they're lying stems from the fact that got caught out bullshitting about their claims in North Wales, that the fact that the photo is easier to stage than the problem is to climb and that there's aboslutely no photographs of them actually 'doing' anything hard.
I don't claim to be a top climber, but I can if challeneged *usually* repeat problems that I've done (unless it was years ago when I was younger, stronger, thinner, better etc) one exception was my thing at the Roaches and I was unable to even pull on the start, luckily SA Chris was there when I did it and did take some photo's and I can name at least one of the spotters.
Not being able to repeat things when there's mounting evidence that you're less than honest does nothing other than reinforce the validity of the accusation.
I'm not out to piss on anyone's chips, I just do, like Jim think that the historical record should be accurate. Climbing BP within 18 months of starting climbing is a massive achievement which if true should be lauded, if it is not true it damages the value of the genuine achievements of truly talented people just as the use of doping in athletics erodes the awe in which we view people like Usain Bolt.
Anyway off to the gym
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one exception was my thing at the Roaches and I was unable to even pull on the start, luckily SA Chris was there when I did it and did take some photo's and I can name at least one of the spotters.
Sam Hurt was the other, if the issue ever comes up, which I doubt it will.
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Sloper, are you not confusing the Copley brothers with Scott Mac? There's no doubt they are doing a lot of climbing at the mo, at that age that means improving fast.
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It would appear that he is unless I'm missing something. :shrug:
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I agree with JB ans Jas on this one. The Copleys are seemingly very motivated and talented, Brad Pit in 18 months is impressive. Nice one lads, and one of them appears to have thrown laps on it, fuckin' show pony. We were all prone to bouts of "being a tit" when we were 18, fuck some of us still are in our middle years. Cut this pair a bit of slack. They climb Brad Pit and tick marks appear on CT in the same year, obviously they did it, WTF??
As for the tick marks on CT, they are obviously a disgrace.
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I now have an image of Dogtanian cutting some slack for the Copley’s with his rapier. Much like the apple which he so skilfully cuts to wafers in mid air. What a guy/dog!
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Even Dogtanian doesn't have what it takes to waferise an orange. I pity the apple.
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Apple, orange or Pear. Fruits firm, soft or citrus. Dogtanian can waferise them all.
(except for plums, stony bastards)
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Apple, orange or Pear. Fruits firm, soft or citrus. Dogtanian can waferise them all.
(except for plums, stony bastards)
Apricots?
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He can be my fucking guest with pears. I hate those sand-apple motherfuckers.
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sorry my fault for the yoof jibing scene, I was just taking the piss out of the photo - not intented to start all that stuff up again.
Fruit aside, I saw CT the other day and it looked awful, should put the pic in the new guide with FAIL written under it
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I rather think that the proposition that they're lying stems from the fact that got caught out bullshitting about their claims in North Wales, that the fact that the photo is easier to stage than the problem is to climb and that there's aboslutely no photographs of them actually 'doing' anything hard.
We weren't happy with Mclellans claims not the Copley bros. I saw one of them do Rockatrocity.
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Ooops, getting all confused as to who has been 'spinning' about what.
Apologies to those concerned.
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Had an after work sesh at gardoms tonight and G THANG looked a mess.for fooks sake who chalks up foot holds?i mean more chalked than hand holds.discarded finger tape ect!!!!it looked like dr who had poached it via tardis and transported it to a brush/bin/sense free zone.was a little pissed to see my local circut thoughtlessly abused.on the up side we sent two new lines.one 10m left of barry seen "swift nick"font 7a a cheeky but powerful little sitter and"the john player special"font7a+on the near side of the tunnel to iann,s 7c arete.this eliminates the right hand block but uses the left block for feet.slightly highball but sweet at the grade.
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I'm not out to piss on anyone's chips, I just do, like Jim think that the historical record should be accurate. Climbing BP within 18 months of starting climbing is a massive achievement which if true should be lauded, if it is not true it damages the value of the genuine achievements of truly talented people just as the use of doping in athletics erodes the awe in which we view people like Usain Bolt.
OT: but I'm not the only one. I was down stanage when said brothers did BP. I realised it was them so went over for a chat, they are infamous after all. Liam, who is the one in the pics, repeated it to help his brother with the beta. Have to say he made it look piss.
They were friendly lads and look to be getting very strong. They come across a bit annoying on the internet but I can think of few other people who also come across as gits online :whistle:
Didn't want to have to post this cos I don't want to also be accused of being a liar as well, I'm not JB or at work and I don't have 32427 posts on here so why should you believe me. but I do think these guys should be cut some slack.
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for fooks sake who chalks up foot holds?
Apparently Gaz does. According to a friend of his, a chalked foothold looks like a bigger foothold. I personally think it reduces the friction (especially on Grit, or Sandstone), but what do I know in comparison to an E9, Font 8a+ (?) monster!
I'm not JB or at work and I don't have 32427 posts on here so why should you believe me...
+7 Karma is prob enough ;) ::) :P
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so why should you believe me.
Cause your opinion is held in high repute? :P
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There's a big difference between being annoying and saying dumb stuff, and being a liar.
It's not like the Copleys are claiming anything cutting edge, so let them get on with it. Good effort to them getting up 7c/+ in their first couple of years of climbing.
I'm not JB or at work
Are you on drugs? Noone believes a word that gnome says :lol:
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are these guys using climbing chalk or something a bit more heavy duty:
(https://www.popular.com.sg/images/product/stationery/16178.jpg)
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(https://www.popular.com.sg/images/product/stationery/16178.jpg)
Thats chalk for Linux users :P
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(https://www.popular.com.sg/images/product/stationery/16178.jpg)
Thats chalk for Linux users :P
Where can I get some?
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Where can I get some?
No one knows, that's the problem Lagers. It's free though :kiss2:
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Where can I get some?
No one knows, that's the problem Lagers. It's free though :kiss2:
Though you may have to compile it first before you use it ;)
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
I echo everyones sentiments that this is a new low & we need to find the culprets. This cannot go on...
Si
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
Why Si?
I'm not suggesting we brush (no pun intended) under the carpet but what is telling Bill going to add? We ought to be sorting this out ourselves rather than pointing out to the wardens another example of how stupid the climbing community is.
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
Why Si?
I'm not suggesting we brush (no pun intended) under the carpet but what is telling Bill going to add? We ought to be sorting this out ourselves rather than pointing out to the wardens another example of how stupid the climbing community is.
Exactly.
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
Why Si?
I'm not suggesting we brush (no pun intended) under the carpet but what is telling Bill going to add? We ought to be sorting this out ourselves rather than pointing out to the wardens another example of how stupid the climbing community is.
Exactly.
Precisely.
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Why Si?
It'll give him something to do other than actually climbing ;)
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
Why Si?
I'm not suggesting we brush (no pun intended) under the carpet but what is telling Bill going to add? We ought to be sorting this out ourselves rather than pointing out to the wardens another example of how stupid the climbing community is.
Exactly.
Precisely.
Verily
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It'll give him something to do other than actually climbing ;)
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/63/203128945_eda8531579.jpg?v=0)
;)
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The BMC work very well with Bill & he tends to know more than most about the going on's at Stanage - It was just a thought...
Si
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
We ought to be sorting this out ourselves rather than pointing out to the wardens another example of how stupid the climbing community is.
I completely agree - how though?
I have a thread to start soon as I caught someone chipping at a grit crag yesterday - I did remain calm...
si
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Spill the beans Jaques. Now.
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Si, I had a chat with Bill yesterday. I considered mentioning it but didn't, he monitors UKC so will no doubt read about it. We've discussed the subject before and he knows what is normal and what is OTT. I'd rather let him worry about the more important stuff he has to do at the mo...
Sorting it ourselves means stuff like this thread and the UKC news item - raising awareness of what is excessive and the fact that the community finds it unacceptable.
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Sloper, Si is talking about some non-climbers carving names I think.
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Look I'm half way through organising the lynch mob, you can't just stand these folk down, maybe's well just have to lynch a top roper.
I bloody hope you're right.
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It was a family chipping names at a vey small crag near Birchover - calm Sloper... It got sorted...
si
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I wonder if Bill the Stanage Warden know anything about this? I will enquire.
We ought to be sorting this out ourselves rather than pointing out to the wardens another example of how stupid the climbing community is.
I completely agree - how though?
By raising it on here and UKC and someone taking a rope, a water spray and a brush down the plantation and going to wash it off?
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It was a family chipping names at a vey small crag near Birchover - calm Sloper... It got sorted...
si
No top, no tick.
I want blood, I want proof.
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Tomtom's just clocked this crap on the Pebble....
(http://img687.yfrog.com/img687/4551/ttu.jpg)
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that's just overuse of chalk cos it was probably damp when it was tried. some of those footholds are fragile enough.
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Seeing as you asked so nicely Tom
http://www.flickr.com/photos/simonjacques/4057399679/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/simonjacques/4057399679/#)
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Seeing as you asked so nicely Tom
http://www.flickr.com/photos/simonjacques/4057399679/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/simonjacques/4057399679/#)
So is that engraving, rather than chipping?
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It was using a hammer & chisel & it soon stopped.
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It was using a hammer & chisel & it soon stopped.
I'm sorry but what the fuck kind of family walks around with a hammer and chisel? This ain't Texas...
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It was using a hammer & chisel & it soon stopped.
I'm sorry but what the fuck kind of family walks around with a hammer and chisel? This ain't Texas...
Ones from Norwich... says it all really...
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It was using a hammer & chisel & it soon stopped.
I'm sorry but what the fuck kind of family walks around with a hammer and chisel? This ain't Texas...
Texas being known as a place where rock is in profusion (with some exceptions) and name chisseling is commonplace?
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very thickly caked on tick mark on sit down arete on the Tanks boulder at Burbage South yesterday.
I've not particularly got much against tick marks per se when used proportionately as they can be useful sometimes but I don't understand why people can't BRUSH THE MARKS OFF afterwards. Or otherwise why not try to remembering where the holds are??????
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Tomtom's just clocked this crap on the Pebble....
(http://img687.yfrog.com/img687/4551/ttu.jpg)
Cheers for posting that Slackline. It actually looked far worse than the picture showed, and it took a good 4-5 mins of brushing before the holds were usable as they were so caked and greasy with chalk. Cofe - looks like you were right someones been using chalk to dry the holds. Daft really, why not use a towell or cloth?? and its only 4+ warm up line anyway!
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Tomtom's just clocked this crap on the Pebble....
(http://img687.yfrog.com/img687/4551/ttu.jpg)
saw that on wed.didnt have camera with me.a lad who was talking about it with me said brass monkey was plastered but i couldnt be arsed walk that way.
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Texas being known as a place where rock is in profusion (with some exceptions) and name chisseling is commonplace?
No, Texas being a place full of freakin weirdos with hammers, you obviously haven't seen the cult classic (sorry for going :off:)
texas chainsaw massacre:hammer time! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3T8rOQ3tuik#)
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Ah yes, recall there being a hammer occasionally involved in a film better known for the title tool.
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very thickly caked on tick mark on sit down arete on the Tanks boulder at Burbage South yesterday.
I've not particularly got much against tick marks per se when used proportionately as they can be useful sometimes but I don't understand why people can't BRUSH THE MARKS OFF afterwards. Or otherwise why not try to remembering where the holds are??????
I disagree, tick marks should never be more than a very light SPOT. Tick marks do not completely brush off. Whether this is worse with 'superchalk' type stuff I don't know, but there is always some mark left behind. A line is NOT acceptable. It is grafitti. It looks awful, and detracts from subsequent ascents. It is also easy to forget to brush them off, or leave them as someone else is trying the problem, and then they're there to stay.
That's my take on it anyway.
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It's not just the grit. For a while now i've been warming up at the Langdale boulders by vigorously brushing tick marks ( the sausage is right, they don't disappear easily), somebody round our way is combining being blind as a bat with the memory of a goldfish. I turned one evening to find literally every conceivable foothold on the overhang face marked up. Has anybody got any theories as to why it's becoming more prevalent? Indoor walls? trips abroad?
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I quite liked the idea of using bits of tape to mark holds apart from the fact that most people would just chuck them on the floor or leave them stuck on, so chalk maybe the lesser of two evils?
Has anybody got any theories as to why it's becoming more prevalent?
Its a jug now?
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"Its a jug now?"
you've lost me,what's a jug now? anyway, why is irrelevant i guess, stopping it is the issue.
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Stone love. Jerry tick marks the hold on Le Proue and exclaimes "its a jug now". In every dvd and at every crag problems are covered in tick marks so people copy that behaviour.
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Ah,with you now.Sounds about right. Same reason we've got folks headpointing HVS. That's a bit of a bugger.
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A bugger indeed. But I tick holds, as I am sure most of you do/have done. Bit like blow torching and wire brushing, in theory doesn't matter if you are careful and don't go over the top. Then you get to the point where you can see the holds on the minimum from the roadside, cos somebody didn't think they were clean enough. This is the sort of issue that will become more and more difficult to manage because of more people starting to climb. We all just have to point out the error of their ways as and when we see people doing these things.
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Wasnt the Troll chalk bag called the 6a because you weren't supposed to need chalk on anythig easier? How about a nationally approved V12 tickmark? ;)
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Some one out there has been trying the statesman and seems to have a problem remembering where the holds are. With a bit of luck todays wind and rain will have tidied it up.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2505/4064241014_7cc00076ee.jpg)
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FWIW someone has been leaving me more than a bit frustrated whenever I pop into Pex with holds utterly caked in chalk, makes the photo of the Pebble chalking look discreet. As many are jugs, and quite a few below knee-level it's a bit baffling. The work of a retard. I did wonder if it might be an over-zealous parent identifying holds for a child... Whatever, still a retard, and an eyesore.
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What's wrong w/ making chalk a dark shade?
Grey would work much better.
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What's wrong w/ making chalk a dark shade?
Grey would work much better.
That is a very good idea...
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I'm sure I've read mention of this idea in one of the Intro sections to a guide, possibly the Purple Font circuits guide (but then it also mentions inflatable air-pads that you wear and will inflate when falling!).
You'd also need a wider range of colours too, e.g. grey would stand out just as starkly at St Bees/Hueco as white would.
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grey would stand out just as starkly at St Bees/Hueco as white would.
I don't think it would. A generic 18% grey would blend in much better than white on most rocks, except maybe some very pale granites.
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what would be the point in tickmarking in an colour that blends in? you wouldn't be able to see it, whihc is the whole point of tickmarking. The issue is not with the colour of chalk, the issue is with people not brushing them off afterwards. And given even the most well-meaning human being's capacity for forgetfullness this means since people are prone to forgetting, people should be trying very hard to not tickmark in the first place, and if they do, do it in a very subtle and easy-to-remove way.
I'm sure I've read mention of this idea in one of the Intro sections to a guide, possibly the Purple Font circuits guide (but then it also mentions inflatable air-pads that you wear and will inflate when falling!).
The font guides/sites are a bit useless/hypocritical when it comes to tickmarks. They all espose minimal use of chalk and not donkeylining, but then you flick through the blue off-piste guide and bleau.info and you see some of the worst examples of tickmarking you're likely to see - no wonder font is covered in them. People in a position of influence need to lead by example. I'd certainly like to see mags/guides/news-sites/sponsors having a blackout on publishing photos of shit with heavy-duty tickmarks. Sounds harsh but something has got to change, or we'll have more french idiots painting "stop magnesie" with paint on every boulder in font.
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what would be the point in tickmarking in an colour that blends in? you wouldn't be able to see it
BOOM
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You used to be able to get chalk in a range of yellows to greys. Although I can't ever remember seeing it in British shops, the american mags used to advertise it.
I think mags and websites refusing to use pictures with tick marks is a good idea.
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Name and shame. 13secs GUILTY
Brimham Bouldering (http://www.vimeo.com/2751234)
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people should be trying very hard to not tickmark in the first place, and if they do, do it in a very subtle and easy-to-remove way.
Exactly. A tick mark is a helpful little indication of an obscure to see hold, it doesn't have to be a massive glaring stripe to a well chalked jug. I sometimes use a tickmark - a fingertip smudge of chalk, invariably less chalk than what's on the main body of the hold anyway.
Also correct about Font - the spiritual home of the tickmark from what I've seen!
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you want to get yourself to ticino
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you want to get yourself to ticino
Is that a pun? ;D
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You used to be able to get chalk in a range of yellows to greys. Although I can't ever remember seeing it in British shops, the american mags used to advertise it.
I think mags and websites refusing to use pictures with tick marks is a good idea.
If taken to the letter this would preclude the use of modest tickmarks by those who will always remove then, on occasions where the climber feels them necessary, perhaps on a hard FA. And/or having to pose a shot after the real ascent when the tick has been removed. The fact you could easily get round it with photoshop may be a good or bad thing depending on how you look at it. I do agree that perhaps mags/books could veto pics with excessive tick marking on local crags, but censoring a pics of the latest 9b from Outer Mongolia because it has a tick mark on it…?
I agree with Dave that even the most well intentioned climber may occasionally forget to remove a tickmark, but the balance can easily be rectified if conscientious climbers made a concerted effort to rub off other people’s tick marks when they see them. Much like the occasional bit of litter which falls out of your pocket and gets taken by the wind can be offset by picking up a few bits of other people’s litter.
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I can see your point, and I too use an occasional tick mark, but many people will copy what they see in mags and videos, and so I would be prepared to miss out on seeing a few good shots of problems or routes if it helped reduce the amount tick marks being left. There are many more controversial practices which occur, with much more positive intentions and outcomes than tick marks, that aren't made explicit in the media.
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Seeing as you asked so nicely Tom
http://www.flickr.com/photos/simonjacques/4057399679/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/simonjacques/4057399679/#)
I recommend you don't go to look at the mess at the top of End Of The Affair then. The size of a large dinner table of name chipping, all bordered in a sun rays effect. Fresh in last few weeks i would say.
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look at the size of these thuckers we found on the madarine
the thing is you dont even need them as when you do the move its a blind slap ;D
I tried the route and could not do the move with the tick marks there casue they were throwing us out, We scrubbed the tick marks of and I did the moves next try without them :-\
(http://www.maisonbleau.com/tick.jpg)
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Neil, you're my hero :hug:
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look at the size of these thuckers we found on the madarine
the thing is you dont even need them as when you do the move its a blind slap ;D
I tried the route and could not do the move with the tick marks there casue they were throwing us out, We scrubbed the tick marks of and I did the moves next try without them :-\
How were they throwing you out if you can't see them on the move? Did you find a better part of the hold or something? ???
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well you just cant see them, its a blind slap, vid soon, and yes they were in the wrong place, I found a way of using the holds better, and by putting a little tick mark above the hold means you can actually see were you heading for
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(http://www.maisonbleau.com/tick.jpg)
The man in the foreground has an ArcTeryX Gamma MX hoody on. Nice colour.
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Thus spake the Sugar Ape.
What's hot for the coming fall collection?
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Snappy duds!
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He also has a collection of mobile phones he stole off children by the looks of things...
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Has anyone seen "Dose at Albarracin" on the UKB vimeo group? If not, prepare to be appalled.
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Not specifically tick marks but chalk, the top holds of Gorilla Warfare were an absolute disgrace thismorning, it looked as if someone has poured chalk over them all and not brushed any of it off - clean up after yourselves please!! I cleaned it up as much as possible and hopefully the rain will finish the job. The (unchalked) crimps on Early Doors were no harder to hold despite not being plastered in the white stuff so I'm not sure it even helps.
As an aside - do any locals know how you are supposed to start the full Gorilla Warfare? I stepped off the block near the end, matching the sloping rail of GW, did the normal GW finish, hand traversed the lip left to the offwidth, went down this and finished back up Extended Warfare. Is this right?
cheers
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No, it's very wrong.
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normal gorilla warefare/earlydoors/extended warefar start on the low flake rigth of the offwidth. The historical original GW starts on the left end of the block, traverses the lip, down the offwidth, along extended warefare then finishes across the vertical end face to the far arete.
what you've done is some fucked up rocher-canon style figure-of-eight linkup.
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Ahh OK - thanks for that. I don't know where I got the idea that it traversed the lip leftwards from the top of GW. :oops:
Oh well, only need to figure out how to work Early Doors in now for some wacky stamina links ;)
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any one checked out the tick line of all donkey marks from the s7 guru on page 101 of the peak bouldering guide. :-\
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Thats disgusting, never noticed that before, its like uv played a weird darren brown trick on me! News Flash - Tick marking - down to Ben Moon's subliminal messages aired by the media!!!!!!!!! Everybody is a victim (apart from JB, who 'spits' instead) ;)
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Forgot to repost the Paul Mitchell eliminate pic (clickable thumb):
(http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk163/CyLwiki/th_IMG00181-20100831-1821.jpg) (http://s280.photobucket.com/albums/kk163/CyLwiki/?action=view¤t=IMG00181-20100831-1821.jpg)
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:o
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That pic reminds of that Myra Hindley portrait made using children's hand prints... on more than one level
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Forgot to repost the Paul Mitchell eliminate pic (clickable thumb):
(http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk163/CyLwiki/th_IMG00181-20100831-1821.jpg) (http://s280.photobucket.com/albums/kk163/CyLwiki/?action=view¤t=IMG00181-20100831-1821.jpg)
I'm almost tempted to register on photobucket.com just to ask which of the holds were eliminated!!!
Fucking atrocity :spank: :read: :furious:
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I am told that the characteristic vein features are out. Makes sense.
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the hardest eliminate is to climb that problem with out touching anthing that is chalked up
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Paul has a decent climbing pedigree and isn't a fool, whcih makes the excess of chalk particularly surprising.
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Paul has a decent climbing pedigree and isn't a fool, whcih makes the excess of chalk particularly surprising.
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let's see if this works.....
(http://gallery.me.com/jessedavies/100012/Image014/web.jpg?ver=12858388070001)
horrific donkey marks (one underneath as well!) on the nose opposite Morel's Wall at Almscliffe on sunday night. For Shame!
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FFS, that's pathetic, they haven't even numbered them or said whether it's a slap with the left of the right hand . . . .then again you can probably watch a you tube video on your Iphone so perhaps they were being senstivie. :wank:
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horrific donkey marks (one underneath as well!) on the nose opposite Morrell's Wall at Almscliffe on sunday night. For Shame!
I know it's a common theme on this thread, but you couldn't actually see the majority of that line from where you do the first move from (and if you could see the line, it's blindingly obvious where the hold is anyway). Some tick mark crimes on Patta's Arete last week as well. Definitely getting more common at the 'cliff and Brimham.
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Presumably because they are used to aiming for something yellow, or red, or blue.....
I blame the climbing walls. If they used natural grit coloured holds these donkey's wouldn't have to use tick marks?
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At Craggy2, you sometimes get indoor tick-marks, so this isn't 100% true...
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Not a donkey tick as such unless it has been breeding on the side of the Trackside boulder - more an exercise in caking the hold with as much chalk as humanly possible. :o
(http://lh6.ggpht.com/_aNxgdyXs8ug/TKteG_pD13I/AAAAAAAAAVQ/V8VS4PFlVD4/s400/Image146.jpg)
NB - the pic was taken after I had spent two or three minutes brushing chalk off it but it was still in an absolutely disgusting state.
Quick question - would water have been beneficial in removing the eyesore?
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Quick question - would water have been beneficial in removing the eyesore?
Urine would be better. Apply liberally at the same time as the chalk.
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They start the tickmarkers pretty young down Endcliffe Park these days:
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/ep_tickjpg.jpg?t=1286309990)
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Not a donkey tick as such unless it has been breeding on the side of the Trackside boulder - more an exercise in caking the hold with as much chalk as humanly possible. :o
(http://lh6.ggpht.com/_aNxgdyXs8ug/TKteG_pD13I/AAAAAAAAAVQ/V8VS4PFlVD4/s400/Image146.jpg)
NB - the pic was taken after I had spent two or three minutes brushing chalk off it but it was still in an absolutely disgusting state.
Quick question - would water have been beneficial in removing the eyesore?
Was at curbar, both last sunday and this morning. I can honestly say i have never seen some much chalk on so many holds on both trackside boulder and gorrilla warfare block. I spent ages just randomly brushing holds to try clean them up, but they were still as mess.
This problem seems to be getting worse.
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I think the recent dry weather has made it worse. We need a good downpour to clean it all off. Won't make a difference to GW, but Trackside will look less shit.
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It's the period of damp, almost dry, weather that's been the problem.
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plus when it has been sunny its been boiling.
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and chalk helps people adhere to the rock better
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and chalk helps people adhere to the rock better
Well it did me fuck all good that day - two badly grazed knuckles as a result of trying the problem after trying to clean it. From what I have heard since it was done on the Saturday when conditions were pretty greasy and so the slot was liberally smeared in chalk - problem was that the chalk was left all over it and it then sucked up all the moisture in the air turning it into a doughy mess. :wank:
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Someone should take a container (or you own choice) of water and a brush up there and wash the lot off last thing at night.
I remember a french guy doing that on El Poussah , when we got there the holds were nice and clean and almost dry. My mates wanted to climb it and hadn't realised the reason for the damp patches. I can't imagine the Frenchman was too happy on return to some damp holds caked with chalk!
(Next time I'd stop my mates doing it - hadn't really twigged at the time)
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Someone should take a container (or you own choice) of water and a brush up there and wash the lot off last thing at night.
Had brushes in abundance at the time but no water or I probably would have done so.
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Found this on the rock at Kyloe yesterday. F*cking disgrace. (sorry for fb link)
(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs891.snc4/72429_10150275695370076_751930075_15243851_5076839_n.jpg)
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at least they got the words right shame about all the chalk though.
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As I can't believe someone from here were be cuntish enough to graffiti like that, others would appear to have been wound up by UKC.
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I always try to give any caked holds a bit of a wash and brush up at the end of a sesh if I have water left, but I must admit that the quantity of chalk being used on some holds seems to be increasing. Is it really neccessary to chalk the holds? Is it fuck.
I do recall on some American bouldering video an organised cleanup at the happies, there was a load of folk with those back mounted water pump sprays and brushes blitzing the problems. Maybe a practice to be encouraged.
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I agree that the chalk looks a mess but is it a good idea to brush wet sandstone?
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can't speak for many areas but from my experience of the churnet valley and the fact that everytime i see the rock bits seem to have crumbled a bit more, it should be left well alone when wet/damp, its cohesion is seriously compromised...
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I agree that the chalk looks a mess but is it a good idea to brush wet sandstone?
(http://www.buickperformance.com/cowl9b.jpg)
Maybe not
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(http://img403.imageshack.us/i/004mr.jpg/)
Cratcliffe top on Sunday ...... We weren't sure if the chalk was being used to indicate which holds were in or which were out :lol: .......
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I honestly don't get some people.
I was recently working an indoor problem and had spent a couple of mins brushing chalk off the key sloper to improve friction (virtually no-one brushes holds down in the beacon, it gets pretty bad).
I took a quick break and watched a guy walk up to it, get his chalk ball out and smash chalk all over the hold before getting on it.
I wouldn't mind so much if he was a novice but he was obviously strong(er than me) and experienced. What the hell?
Fucking unnecessary, god knows what he does to actual rock. If people can't even be respectful on plastic, what hope do they have!?
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sam you've just wrote that you cleaned a hold and someone else put chalk on it after
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Cratcliffe top on Sunday ...... We weren't sure if the chalk was being used to indicate which holds were in or which were out :lol: .......
(http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/3271/004mrc.jpg)
but is it art?
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That's one low start :wank: :wank: :wank: :wank: :wank: :wank: :wank:
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The descent was similarly chalked.
As you say :wank: :wank: :wank:
It even looks like gritstone bukkake :wank: :wank: :wank:
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(http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/3271/004mrc.jpg)(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_SJ5S43VGz5Q/SSIv6vmuQgI/AAAAAAAADeY/7diXA3LjOAs/s400/orion.jpg)
but is it art?
I noticed this had a similar patter to a Mirrored Orion formation. Using this, I consulted some of my storytelling archaeologist colleagues and they informed me that this indicated some sort of ritual. These markings were probably to do with some form of sacrifice, worship or the alignment of rune stones in Narnia. Failing that it could be due to the partial eclipse or work from the Cratcliff branch of the 'constellation tick mark crew'.
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The slab just below Razor Roof (?) was in a similar state . They seemed to have only chalked the chipped holds , maybe in some kind of protest :-\
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If it was then it sounds about as sensible as those choads in Font printing NON MAGNESIE!! all over the boulders in massive bright pink lettering.
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AHA! found more evidence of what those strange tickmarks may mean!!
(http://thehairpin.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Picture-9.jpg)
http://thehairpin.com/2011/01/decoding-the-bird-death-maps/ (http://thehairpin.com/2011/01/decoding-the-bird-death-maps/)
Its all related - I'm telling you!
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Cratcliffe top on Sunday ...... We weren't sure if the chalk was being used to indicate which holds were in or which were out :lol: .......
I saw this, too. What a joke. The boulder in LSF's picture wasn't even the worst!
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(http://i.ukc2.com/i/163810.jpg)
???
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(http://ukc2.com/core/theft.gif)
Holy crap, that's hideous!
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If it was then it sounds about as sensible as those choads in Font printing NON MAGNESIE!! all over the boulders in massive bright pink lettering.
I really don't want to get into that debate... but I feel I have to point out that the above only fails to make sense if you imagine that climbers objections to chalk at
Bleau are anything to do with the Aesthetics.
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Just seen this thread! amazing stuff.
I once drew a big cock and balls at the bottom of Empire Wall with a stick of chalk someone (tourist?) had left at the crag, but i didnt take a picture. next time i'm there i'll do another one and post it up.
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Just seen this thread! amazing stuff.
I once drew a big cock and balls at the bottom of Empire Wall with a stick of chalk someone (tourist?) had left at the crag, but i didnt take a picture. next time i'm there i'll do another one and post it up.
Unless sarcasm hasn't translated well over t'internet again.....you've missed the last word in the title of this thread.
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Just seen this thread! amazing stuff.
I once drew a big cock and balls at the bottom of Empire Wall with a stick of chalk someone (tourist?) had left at the crag, but i didnt take a picture. next time i'm there i'll do another one and post it up.
Is this your house?
(http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/About/General/2009/3/24/1237906734712/A-house-near-Hungerford-t-001.jpg)
;)
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I wish it were - that makes the Cern Abbas giant look a bit inadequate!
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And i've just noticed I got puntered and wadded for my previous post. It just goes to show how divided people can be over the chalk cock and balls issue.
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And i've just noticed I got puntered and wadded for my previous post. It just goes to show how divided people can be over the chalk cock and balls issue.
Its more a case that some humor (particularly sarcasm) don't translate well in forums, some people thought you were joking, others thought you were being serious.
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:wall:
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A cock and balls drawn anywhere IS funny.
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A cock and balls drawn anywhere IS funny.
I'm glad you said that, I was starting to feel bad that I'd puntered you for making a joke.
Now I'm glad I did.
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sam you've just wrote that you cleaned a hold and someone else put chalk on it after
Precisely. Why? Are they doing this in the mistaken belief that it will in some way improve the friction? It only ever reduces the friction. There's surely no excuse for spanking your chalk ball out all over a hold to chalk it up!? It screws you and more importantly everyone else.
All chalk does is remove damp/sweat. This is why it goes on ze hands. Now, if he put pof on the hold, that actually would improve friction. In fact, maybe i'll try that next week. Makes more sense no?
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A cock and balls drawn anywhere IS funny.
Get a permanent marker and draw them on your forehead then.
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I don't think I have a forehard.
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You know exactly what I meant to say.
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I with you three nine to an extent. A big cock and massive pair of balls is the bed rock of British smut humor and I for one will never forget the time I first drew a cock and pair of balls in school.
However, once I had drawn a few sets of cocks and balls my smut humor quickly developed away from this into more intelligent smut humor like 'are your labs open today' to the Science Lab technician, and such like. May I suggest that you too develop your cock and balls humor a little more to prevent such puntering and general distain for the drawing of such things on rock? There is so much more than just drawing cocks and balls.
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sam you've just wrote that you cleaned a hold and someone else put chalk on it after
Precisely. Why? Are they doing this in the mistaken belief that it will in some way improve the friction? It only ever reduces the friction. There's surely no excuse for spanking your chalk ball out all over a hold to chalk it up!? It screws you and more importantly everyone else.
All chalk does is remove damp/sweat. This is why it goes on ze hands. Now, if he put pof on the hold, that actually would improve friction. In fact, maybe i'll try that next week. Makes more sense no?
Just in the off chance you're not a troll
Some people (me included) put a little chalk on a newly brushed hold, so that when they actually get to it, after cutting through, the new chalk on the hold goes some way to absorb the sweat.
I can't believe I just replied, I managed to resist for ages. I'm so weak. :wall:
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sam you've just wrote that you cleaned a hold and someone else put chalk on it after
Precisely. Why? Are they doing this in the mistaken belief that it will in some way improve the friction? It only ever reduces the friction. There's surely no excuse for spanking your chalk ball out all over a hold to chalk it up!? It screws you and more importantly everyone else.
All chalk does is remove damp/sweat. This is why it goes on ze hands. Now, if he put pof on the hold, that actually would improve friction. In fact, maybe i'll try that next week. Makes more sense no?
Just in the off chance you're not a troll
Some people (me included) put a little chalk on a newly brushed hold, so that when they actually get to it, after cutting through, the new chalk on the hold goes some way to absorb the sweat.
I can't believe I just replied, I managed to resist for ages. I'm so weak. :wall:
So, science:
Chalk has two purposes in gymnastics, where the usage came from.
- to absorb sweat
- to reduce friction, and reduce skin tears/blisters.
The effects vary with the amount of chalk. Too much chalk just creates a massive mess, but other than that has both the effects above. So a gymnastic can use loads, up to a point - although maybe there is a point where too much will reduce the friction too much and they won't be able to hold on... but they're depending mostly on grip strength to hold their hands hooked closed on the ring/bar/whatever rather than friction to stop their skin slipping off.
As a rock climber, we don't grab the hold like a handle - and thus need max friction to not slide off. We use chalk to absorb the sweat - but what are looking to maximise friction. Too little chalk = too much slippage from sweat, too much chalk = too much slippage from chalk.
So... we want to use the minimum amount of chalk possible to absorb the sweat.
So here's where I struggle to connect the science dots. Does a mechanism by which you put chalk on a sloper and then onto your hand result in an effective *minimum* delivery of the chalk to the sweaty parts?
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with every move chalk comes off your hands what if said sloper is 5moves in, you do the math
in fact if someone didn't use chalk on newly cleaned holds i'd think they were a cock and had no concept of what they were doing
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Why do I have a little bag clipped round my waist to hold chalk? :shrug:
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because you are also tied in and are climbing a route?
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There's surely no excuse for spanking your chalk ball out all over a hold to chalk it up!?
This is just silly. If you look at the original statement it implies that it is a mistake to get a whole chalk ball out and to aggressively cover a freshly brushed hold in chalk.
Dense argues that perhaps a careful application to a hold a few moves into a problem is appropriate because having wet hands is always worse than having hands that are a bit too chalky.
Lund is making the point that chalk reduces friction on surfaces that are already dry but that having wet hands is always worse than having hands that are a bit too chalky. This is pure SCIENCE.
Seeing as you are both trying to make the same point but are managing to argue about it you can both stop now.
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because you are also tied in and are climbing a route?
Its there when I boulder too (it means that I don't lose it, it also means it doesn't get in others way lying on the floor).
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Seeing as you are both trying to make the same point but are managing to argue about it you can both stop now.
What are you, some kind of relationship counsellor?
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I was thinking more a Billy Crystal type figure?
(http://www.grouchoreviews.com/content/films/3700/1.jpg)
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Lund is making the point that chalk reduces friction on surfaces that are already dry but that having wet hands is always worse than having hands that are a bit too chalky. This is pure SCIENCE.
I know it's not SCIENCE but the science (what little there is) showed that under some conditions of temp, humidity hold smoothness etc ( the ones they tested under) that too chalky is considerably worse than wet.
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Another bit of science like that evolv rubber giving the best friction story, where I'll take years of field testing over lab conditions.
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Lund is making the point that chalk reduces friction on surfaces that are already dry but that having wet hands is always worse than having hands that are a bit too chalky. This is pure SCIENCE.
I know it's not SCIENCE but the science (what little there is) showed that under some conditions of temp, humidity hold smoothness etc ( the ones they tested under) that too chalky is considerably worse than wet.
So...how would one go about putting together an experiment that tests this more comprehensively and scientifically? given the amount of variables - humidity, skin loss, temperature, hand size and everything else.
I personally feel that chalk on dry hands gives one a little extra grip. What about chalk mixed with drying agents and other additives?
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Its there when I boulder too (it means that I don't lose it, it also means it doesn't get in others way lying on the floor).
You'd lose your chalk bag if it wasn't tied to you?
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I've lost a few over the years, mainly forgetting to pick it up when leaving somewhere (whether thats the crag, or the wall). I tend to not bother taking it off and until I sit down in the car covering my back and the seat in chalk, that way I know I've got it and not left it at the crag.
I gave up buying Nalgenes after loosing my third one at the climbing wall as I'm forever putting it down at the base of a climb and forgetting to pick it up when I move to another (not a single one was handed in!).
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You dick.
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[
So...how would one go about putting together an experiment that tests this more comprehensively and scientifically? given the amount of variables - humidity, skin loss, temperature, hand size and everything else.
Well extending the work the guys at Brum did to a range of different temps & humidities should be easy (apart from getting funding :-) ).
Quantifying the amount of chalk is trickier.
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The main reason that I see for chalking holds is due to them being wet normally caused by previous users having damp hands when they get to that hold.
But I normally brush the chalk off again since it's only being used to soak up the existing damp.
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Oh god, i feel i just made us a little bit too much like the other channel.
In my view, as little chalk as possible never involves chalking a hold unless it's actually damp(outdoors). If an indoor hold is too greasy to use that day from too many sweaty hands, I prefer to leave it for another day. To me, the short-term benefit doesn't outweigh the long-term consequences of coating holds in chalk.
Maybe if you've got very sweaty hands, it could be worth using some liquid chalk in addition to you usual.
Despite this, i can at least understand applying a small amount of chalk to a hold indoors if it's high/a good few moves in on a problem as one of you said. Everyone has their own ethics.
However, the hold in question at the time was the second hold on the route. The first was a crimp. If his hand was sweaty it wasn't the poor little holds fault.
:spank:
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Oh god, i feel i just made us a little bit too much like the other channel.
Is it only me that finds it odd that any discussion of how best to use one of the two tools we have in bouldering is somehow not allowed? :shrug:
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Is it only me that finds it odd that any discussion of how best to use one of the two tools we have in bouldering is somehow not allowed? :shrug:
So do you believe that having no chalk on your hands or the rock, or maybe a little bit of water on your hands is better than chalk, and that everyone who uses chalk is wrong?
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So do you believe that having no chalk on your hands or the rock, or maybe a little bit of water on your hands is better than chalk, and that everyone who uses chalk is wrong?
I believe that we as climbers have no idea how or when to use this tool. There seem to be at least four mutually contradictory theories, two have cropped up in this thread. (neither of them inconsistent with the results in that Birmingham paper).
& I for one would like to know the answer/s.
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Personally, I think there's a thing as too much chalk. And too little chalk. I definitely doubt that spanking chalk on a sloper indoors makes it easier to hold. Unless you're an extremely sweaty cunt.
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& I for one would like to know the answer/s.
I think taking an overall view there are probably easier ways to improve one's climbing success than worrying about the optimum chalk distribution on each hold for the given variables. Like getting stronger.
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Can someone post a link to the research in question.
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this is the most tedious thread i have ever read.you train at the wall to get strong.if a greasy git like stom is on before you clean the hold.otherwise go outside
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Can someone post a link to the research in question.
If its been published in a journal then try Google Scholar (http://scholar.google.co.uk) to find it.
I've no idea whether it has or not though.
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Sorry for taking the bait in the first place.
This thread is now seriously :off:
& I for one would like to know the answer/s.
I have no idea how you manage to get to sleep at night, with such weighty subjects on your mind.
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:agree:
I'm an old git so I'll chip in my own ethical position on moron donkey marks/chalking holds.
Donkey marks are cheating. Use your eyes and memory; if you can't find the holds or remember where they are then go climb something easier. Or do some yoga.
Chalk is there to dry the sweat from your hands. I use it for that and blow/dust off any excess so as to leave as little trace as possible on the rock.
Does anybody else remember the idea "Thou shalt not wreck the place"?
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(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v272/67/61/540521791/n540521791_990615_5101.jpg)
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I think everyone who was involved in that chalk discussion should be thoroughly ashamed
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bet you did that phil ;)
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(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5257/5419047591_6ef774df87.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/climberrick/5419047591/)
IMAG0180 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/climberrick/5419047591/#) by rickginns (http://www.flickr.com/people/climberrick/), on Flickr
Woodhouse Scar Cave Buttress.
Pointless tickmarks, the holds are bloody massive.
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I meant to get a photo but didn't end up taking one, by last weekend there was not a tickmark, but a chalk circle round one of the starting crimps of Gypsy at Almscliff.
The mind boggles.
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I did have/have got somewhere a picture of the low traverse at Burbage West with every hand and foothold marked with a massive thick chalk circle.
I was literally speechless when I saw it. Off to see if I can locate it.
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i know its indoors but still,i thought that is worth taking a pic of
http://www.flickr.com/photos/37935700@N08/5441455532/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/37935700@N08/5441455532/#)
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that's just the 2"Cru tagging again
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I did have/have got somewhere a picture of the low traverse at Burbage West with every hand and foothold marked with a massive thick chalk circle.
I was literally speechless when I saw it. Off to see if I can locate it.
Maybe related, but on tuesday there was a huge (about 1ft diameter) circle of thick chalk all over the hold you rock onto on Remergence. There's trying to dry out holds, and there's creating a mess. This was definitely the latter and was easily visible from B.West. I forgot to take a picture though...
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that's just the 2"Cru tagging again
there aint no way they can reach that high to tag
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2" does not refer to their height...
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(http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/184025_10150392068855012_878480011_17105451_2585895_s.jpg)
Apologies for the (mini) crackbook link
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This excess of chalking baffles me frankly. For the last two or three years about half the times I've gone to Pex there's been a solid ring of chalk, obviously from a ball, pasted over footholds on traverses, lines of easy problems etc. It's almost as if some over-zealous parent hasd been trying to mark holds out for a youngster, it's that excessive and unnecessary. Surely if people have the intelligence to find the quarry that's about all they'd need to understand the pointlessness of this chalking? It's just crass.
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At Stanage Plantation a couple of weeks ago on a quiet afternoon at the Green Traverse boulder, a couple of young lads came over to join me, both relatively inexperienced but had a couple of attempts. One asked which foothold I was using to pop off the crimp rail and after I pointed it out he whipped out a chalkball from his bag and poffed it all over the hold. I immediately bushed it off and explained politely that you don't chalk footholds (or handholds for that matter). They were both quite surprised/dumbfounded but I think they understood.... (fingers crossed).
I don't know where this habit has come from either.....
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It's not like you can't see that foothold though. It there was a slot under an overlap I could understand it, but to mark something you can see is just bizarre.
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At Stanage Plantation a couple of weeks ago on a quiet afternoon at the Green Traverse boulder, a couple of young lads came over to join me, both relatively inexperienced but had a couple of attempts. One asked which foothold I was using to pop off the crimp rail and after I pointed it out he whipped out a chalkball from his bag and poffed it all over the hold. I immediately bushed it off and explained politely that you don't chalk footholds (or handholds for that matter). They were both quite surprised/dumbfounded but I think they understood.... (fingers crossed).
I don't know where this habit has come from either.....
indoor
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As posted on YYFY was at Cratcliff yesterday Jerry's Traverse area was in a poor state. We then went over to Burbage & under The Nose & Western Eyes some one had done graffiti in blue chalk. Finally to Curbar where some one had bled all over the holds of Trackside, Strawberry's & the big pocket thing on the end.
I was honestly shocked at how little of a shit people seem to give now for boulders & areas in general. Rant over.
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I doubt climbers use blue chalk.
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I doubt climbers use blue chalk.
Fair point.
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The Nose & Western Eyes some one had done graffiti in blue chalk.
Doesn't the Western Eyes graffiti say 'I love chalk'? I thought that was pretty profound...
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Hmm... Blue chalk.... Strawberries.... could this be some sort of tick mark dirty protest by the long lost Sloper? ;)
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I was honestly shocked at how little of a shit people seem to give now for boulders & areas in general.
Hopefully this new "indoor" bouldering stuff will take off in a big way and attract chalk daubers away from the natural stuff.
Maybe someone should set up a forum or web site for this new alternative to rock climbing?
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I was honestly shocked at how little of a shit people seem to give now for boulders & areas in general.
Hopefully this new "indoor" bouldering stuff will take off in a big way and attract chalk daubers away from the natural stuff.
Maybe someone should set up a forum or web site for this new alternative to rock climbing?
http://www.lagerstarfish.com/forums/indoorbouldering (http://tinyurl.com/6ytnzn8)
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Not tick marks, but I visited Chasecliffe for the first time this evening and was dismayed to find fresh-looking vertical scratches all down the left hand side of the easy side of the boulder:
(http://i.imgur.com/A1dLa.jpg)
Surely not from dry tooling? The only other explanation I can think of is someone climbing it in nailed boots or running spikes. >:(
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Certainly looks like it. First time you have been there since the snows?
Cunts.
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Might have been one of the Lycan Club members sharpening their claws before geting stuck in to the local population.
Any signs of torn/discarded clothing?
I'll have a word with Wolfie; he might know.
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Any signs of torn/discarded sheep's clothing?
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Not tick marks, but I visited Chasecliffe for the first time this evening and was dismayed to find fresh-looking vertical scratches all down the left hand side of the easy side of the boulder:
(http://i.imgur.com/A1dLa.jpg)
Surely not from dry tooling? The only other explanation I can think of is someone climbing it in nailed boots or running spikes. >:(
FBSF eyeballed what looked very much like crampon scratches on Wednesday climb at burbage the other week. fucking idiots.
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There seems to be a lot of this going on at the moment, possibly not helped by morons on UKC claiming it's OK. But let's not dig that all back up again.
Please note, anyone that I catch dry tooling at a summer crag will have a crampon suppository.
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Dry tooling is becoming worryingly popular and people seem desperate to get out on real rock to practice their new "skills" no matter where it is. A mate in the Lakes said that the lower section of a 7c sport route at Tilberthwaite he was trying has been trashed with crampon scars and one of the holds destroyed by an axe.
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There were scratches all over one of the routes at Castle Inn Quarry off the A55, apparently been there a year or so according to others climbing there who are local. :thumbsdown:
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Is it worth having a specific thread to record where/ when this occurs?
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:agree:
Yes.
Denham, Stronstrey, Chasecliffe, Castle Inn, Tiberthwaite...etc etc
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I've sent an email to the Climbing Walls Officer at the BMC asking whether a concerted campaign for crag etiquette would be suitable given the increase in popularity of the sport/activity (it would). Time the climbing wall industry, which is benefiting so much from this increase in participation, steps up and pulls it's weight in promoting ethical crag use. I'm sure UKC will do it's (big) bit if asked too. Clearly, some people just do not get that tools on rock, excessive ticking and litter are not on. This can probably be attributed to misplaced enthusiasm and a lack of education. Get emailing folks.
Sam
Zig Zag Climbing Walls
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I'll start a thread, and try to recall when things went on.
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Yeah, it was just over the roof on wednesday climb and also on the top slab of Mutiny Crack where you traverse across from the hollybush.
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As I dropped down off Flying Buttress tonight I was quite shocked to see the right-hand route (looking in), has chalk circles on each hold and ticks on all the footholds. These are numbered (!) and denoted with L and R.
There was a large, noisy, blissfully-unaware university group on the buttress when we arrived, everyone else there had beards and a large collection of hexes.
Unfortunately I didn't have a brush but I guess it'll rain soon.
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everyone else there had beards and a large collection of hexes
.
I was around that area last night and dont have a beard or own any hexes........
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me neither...
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As I dropped down off Flying Buttress tonight I was quite shocked to see the right-hand route (looking in), has chalk circles on each hold and ticks on all the footholds. These are numbered (!) and denoted with L and R.
Not Kirkus's corner, Shirley?
first climbed in the 1930s
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That was my thought but apparently it's the E4 right again, Sparticus Articus?
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Oh FFS. This kind of attitude is typical of some University clubs out there. Hopefuly we won't all be tarred with the same brush.
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Some Uni club members just like trying to solo HS's at the cliff to show off to the younger members ;)
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:-[
Surely you must have forgotten this by now?! I must protest the point about showing off. It was just me and a friend there that day if I remember right.
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Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I am not on trial here today, society is on trial. Oh fuck it, I'm on trial, aren't I?
But I'm not in contention with the prosecution's version of events. On that we agree. There was a student, he was acting up, he got a slap. But I was under severe provocation.
There I was, having a quiet climb, when a student walked past and put tick marks all over the route next to me. I did what any fine, upstanding citizen would do. I followed him to the decent path and kicked his head in. Perhaps I should have stopped kicking him when he was in the ambulance. But I did what I did because I want to live in a world where we can do a route without fear of it being chalked by a student. I that a crime? Is it a crime to want to live in a world of peace and harmony? Is it a crime to live in a world of love? Is it a crime to hit a student across the back of the head with a snooker ball in a sock?"
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Surely you must have forgotten this by now?!
I thought I was going to watch someone take a groundfall from about 8 m right in front of me: that may happen regularly when you go climbing, but it doesn't to me, so no I haven't forgotten. I seem to remember you had a serious fall soon after.
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Yes, but that was quite unrelated. On lead and with good kit in the rock. Sometimes shit just happens!
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/37935700@N08/5671842027/#in/photostream (http://www.flickr.com/photos/37935700@N08/5671842027/#in/photostream)
spotted on staffs flyer last week.the line was over 12 inches long :wall:
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No photos, but just got back from Font and I couldn't believe how many more tick marks there are compared to previously.
I spent quite a bit of time brushing them off.
Some problems had a tick mark on every concievable usable edge. Surprise at Isatis was pretty bad.
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No pics but Ousal Low, at Churnet, was ticked to death when I got there yesterday morning. I cleaned some of it but couldn't get it all off. I heard that Virgin Wall was, too.
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Must be all the dry weather, Wimberry was shocking the other day, Local Hero wall on the Sugarloaf boulder had marks on every hold and 6 inch long chalk lines on the footholds in the first break which are easily visible!
Sloping top and groove boulder bad also. Fish arete was caked in chalk, well all the way up the arete, no chalk at all on the top hold. :-\
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Went up to Curbar today, ticks all over gorilla warfare block were extraordinary.
After me and my mate had done I forgot to get them brushed off. If someones about, take a look, it's mental.
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...Wimberry was shocking the other day
:agree: I was there at the weekend. Sloping Top was a mess, especially the lower moves on The Slot and Fat Slapper, which were caked. Tried and failed to brush some off.
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I was at Ilkley today, some Cunt has etched "L. Copley" at the bottom of first arête.
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Is that a joke?
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Is that a joke?
cracker almost the full length of the roof of Dolphin Belly Slap at the minute. i think it's in case you forget which way you're supposed to be climbing
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Sadly, Dylan, it is no joke.
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I was at Ilkley today, some Cunt has etched "L. Copley" at the bottom of first arête.
as in etched or chalked word? either is retarded obviously, but...
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Is that a joke?
cracker almost the full length of the roof of Dolphin Belly Slap at the minute. i think it's in case you forget which way you're supposed to be climbing
Yeah the whole demon wall roof area is a state. I don't even know why the marks are there, you can see which holds you want to be going for anyway! If it's hard and you're working it, the moves end up getting wired so theres no need for marks. :no:
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Must be a Yorkshire ting at the momentt!
Just got back from a session pottering a Calog and The Horn was a state - ticks, dots next to the humungous pebble(!), all sorts. Did the best I could with my little toothbrush but was pretty taken aback.
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Photo from DWR / DBS on tuesday pm.
(http://www.flickr.com/photos/roblonsdale/5737824536/)
Seriously... :spank:
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I was at Ilkley today, some Cunt has etched "L. Copley" at the bottom of first arête.
as in etched or chalked word? either is retarded obviously, but...
Scratched into the rock.
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I was at Ilkley today, some Cunt has etched "L. Copley" at the bottom of first arête.
as in etched or chalked word? either is retarded obviously, but...
Scratched into the rock.
WTF? either L. Copley dafter than I thought possible or someone has done it as some kind of strange joke/frame up...?
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You'd have to be an idiot to scratch your own name into the rock. Like leaving your name on a murder weapon.
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You'd have to be an idiot to scratch your own name into the rock. Like leaving your name on a murder weapon.
exaggemerate much?
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A couple of photos on The LankyTwat Blog. (http://lankytwat.blogspot.com/2011/05/accurate-weather-forecast.html)
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I thought I heard somewhere that the Copley's had moved to New Zealand?
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Possibly, but I don't think anyone is suggesting it was Liam that did this anyway.
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A couple of photos on The LankyTwat Blog. (http://lankytwat.blogspot.com/2011/05/accurate-weather-forecast.html)
I was there yesterday avo and didn't even notice the L Copley tag; I was obviously distracted by my total inability to climb First Arete...
The ones over at Olicana Wall are far more obvious/intrusive
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I noticed some idiot had drawn numbers next to the holds on a problem at Pleasley Vale yesterday.
(http://i.imgur.com/j74Sb.jpg)
Hopefully you can make out the '5' to the left of the lower-right sidepull. The holds are perma-chalked due to the steepness anyway and the sequences are fucking obvious.
I got rid of the lower ones but I couldn't lock off long enough to get rid of the top three. I'm assuming this means they were drawn on a top rope as the idea that climbers who are better than me think that this behaviour is OK is too depressing to contemplate!
I was joined by an intrigued local fella who had no idea about bouldering at one point. One of the questions he asked me was "you draw numbers on to find your way do you?" An insight into the damage these chalked-wielding pricks do to our reputation. >:(
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Possibly, but I don't think anyone is suggesting it was Liam that did this anyway.
Unless you assume the Jasper in the other pic is Mr Sharpe.
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I got rid of the lower ones but I couldn't lock off long enough to get rid of the top three.
Turns out I was just using a shit sequence for the problem in question. Numbers now removed.
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Maybe it was an eliminate? :)
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I walked past T crack at cratcliffe last night and it's covered in lines and marker points, looks a right state. I didn't clean anything in the absence of any kit, couldn't really reach either
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(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/252574_10100205380225159_197815253_55271822_4615009_n.jpg)
Spotted at Portlethen, drawn to a jug you can see from anywhere on that shore.
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(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/252574_10100205380225159_197815253_55271822_4615009_n.jpg)
Spotted at Portlethen, drawn to a jug you can see from anywhere on that shore.
Andy, where is the bouldering in relation to the village of portlethen? heard about the bouldering but never actually seen any
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Head to NE corner of Portlethen, following signs for Medical Centre. Head past medical centre and follow signs for old Portlethen. Park on right opposite pub is probably best. walk towards sea and take second right cul de sac, and follow path that looks liek you are going into someones back garden. turn left towards coast and cross fence on right at small block stile. Follow path south until you see an obvious muddy path / ramp heading down to shoreline. You will know you are in the right place as there are some short bolted routes on the right. Explore up and down the coast in that area. Expect short problems and bad landings - decent padding is advisable.
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I've been having to brush off a lot of tick marks at The Tor and Blackwell Dale recently. Including a 2 foot long banana on the Low Start to Red or Dead. Can people please make a little effort to brush off any ticks they've made, and any others they see, as the amount left on crags seems to be reaching ever uglier levels.
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Ditto i had to brush a load off kudos wall. Pretty amazing given there aren't any blind holds on that entire wall.
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old cheese- What Chris said. give me a shout if you're available evenings and weekends for a session.
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Did you manage to meet up with the Coolboy? Getting much done? I went once and got spanked!
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I've been dozens of times and still get spanked.
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No, he's always busy. Watched his videos for beta plenty of times though.
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Brushed all the ticks that I could reach off the Tor yet again on Tuesday and half of them were back on by Thursday. Also picked up a carrier bags worth of litter from around the base of the crag. All very disappointing really.
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Similarly i had an eyeball of Dogs Dinner buttress last weekend and pretty much every single handhold was ticked. Annoyingly i hadn't got a brush on me.
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You had your tongue with you though? :P
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Brushed all the ticks that I could reach off the Tor yet again on Tuesday and half of them were back on by Thursday. Also picked up a carrier bags worth of litter from around the base of the crag. All very disappointing really.
Can someone else go and do the handholds.
Seriously, this is very shit. :spank:
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I used to think, and felt I had reasonable annecdotal evidence to back up my thinking, that climbers were a bunch of altogether decent chaps and chapesses (with the odd bad apple no doubt)
What with chalk everywhere, litter, in-situ draws, shit parking and people pissing in car parks I am developing the opinion the climbing population is increasingly comprised of selfish inconsidererate people...
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There does seem to be a lot of this type of shit about at the moment (it may just be because it is publicised better due to UKB) with the common theme being laziness / selfishness.
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What with chalk everywhere, litter, in-situ draws, shit parking and people pissing in car parks I am developing the opinion the climbing population is increasingly comprised of selfish inconsidererate people...
Look you fucking hippie, if thats what it takes to get me up F8c then thats what I'm gonna do and fuck everyone else. Afterall if its good enough for the spanish then its good enough for me.
I'm off for a dump under mecca.
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Can someone else go and do the handholds.
Oi! I'm secretly tall me. Just not as tall as the lanky buggers I climb with.
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http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack?xg_source=activity (http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack?xg_source=activity)
Saw some writing on the other channel.
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A fucking joke surely?
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Remember this(http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk163/CyLwiki/IMG00181-20100831-1821.jpg)
Take a bow Mr Mitchell for your efforts on Wellington Crack: http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=466637 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=466637)
How can someone who's been climbing for as long as he has still get it so wrong?
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this'll be what you'd want to click:
http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack (http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack)
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Is that for real or a wind up 'cos I am ready to take the bait and swim over to the other channel?
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http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack?xg_source=activity (http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack?xg_source=activity)
Saw some writing on the other channel.
Unbefuckinglievable. 'Climber in selfish act shocker'.
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That's Bhuddists for ya...
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"Climbing is an art,sometimes a transcendental art.It is best performed as dance,or as near dance as you can.
If you can't do the move,then become the person who CAN do the move."
That's from his UKC profile. Amazing, something not quite right upstairs me thinks. :no:
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"Climbing is an art,sometimes a transcendental art.It is best performed as dance,or as near dance as you can.
If you can't do the move,then become the person who CAN do the move."
'That's from his ukc profile...'
He's certainly an artist; and I guess 'becoming the person who CAN do the move' is always possible when there's crib notes written on the rock telling you which part of your body to move. ::)
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Word is he had a walkman giving him beta on breathing in and out too
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It's rather sad that we are up to 32 pages on this topic. :spank:
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Well I'm going to carry on making tickmarks because they are convenient to me and make the climb easier to do, plus it's too much effort to clean them off at the end of the day. I don't think other climbers or non-climbers find them visually unattractive either, because they don't bother me.
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Yes. Unless you can give me clear proof that ticking up Ilkey Quarry causes access problems I cannot see what the issue is.
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The sooner climbers lose access rights to the quarry, the sooner I can crack on with my plan to seal it off with a big sheet of polycarbonate and turn it into Yorkshires biggest outdoor dolphinarium. I'm hoping to train the inmates to reenact the first aid ascent of Wellington Crack - only underwater and with real dolphins putting in the pegs.
The chalk that is on there at the moment should wash off when the quarry is flooded.
Obviously, the proposed cable car from the railway station will be very useful for lazy climbers who depend on public transport.
Everyone's a winner!
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You know, Lagers, I can't see a single downside to that plan!
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It was bollocks?
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What, you don't think Dolphins could hold a peg hammer?
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It was bollocks?
no, I'm pretty sure the chalk will come off
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The top station for the cable car will be next to, and level with, the back of The Calf for easy access.
On the days when the dolphinarium is cleaned out, the water level in the quarry will be adjusted to allow DWS ascents of the chalk free routes.
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Bugger. I was hoping to turn the quarry into Yorkshires very own Rathro
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Well I suppose the guys on Wellington crack probably thought "well if it is good enough for leo houlding......."
(http://www.berghaus.com/community/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Leo-houlding-The-Prophet.jpg)
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It seems pretty obvious he like trying to wind people up.myself,I could give a fuck about the fat fake bhuddist.it sums him up that he is too wank to climb gumshoe at ramshaw,so climbed to half height and escaped up a vs.then claimed it a F.A ! I spoke more sense when I had a key load of ketamine
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.myself,I could give a fuck about the fat fake bhuddist.it sums him up that he is too wank to climb ...
Classy diatribe. Just a tiny bit overboard.
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was at the cliff last nite, seems to be blathered in chalk since last visit, keel boulder especially bad. almost looks like liquid chalk has been poured / brushed into holds. and a MASSIVE tick line has appeared which i couldn't scrub off with any of my brushes...
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/825/photohm.jpg/ (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/825/photohm.jpg/)
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Spotted this on the other channel - there's some pretty low handholds there
Pete Whittaker on FA of Silent Scream (http://vimeo.com/27434955)
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I think it's time we stopped promoting the growth of the number of people climbing in the uk and started educating the current crop better. We haven't got enough rock for this kind of thing to start happening regularly.
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was at the cliff last nite, seems to be blathered in chalk since last visit, keel boulder especially bad. almost looks like liquid chalk has been poured / brushed into holds. and a MASSIVE tick line has appeared which i couldn't scrub off with any of my brushes...
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/825/photohm.jpg/ (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/825/photohm.jpg/)
Agreed. The use of chalk has been more than excessive. It's really unnecessary and looks horrible. Some of the tick marks are feet long, I just can't understand it. Some holds have been caked in chalk. I think it may be some one who thinks that, because it's warm and sweaty, holds need to be plastered to get the best grip.
If anyone sees the person(s) plastering the place in chalk try to explain why it's not appropriate. It can be tricky pulling people up on these things as they can get very defensive. Hopefully they won't take offence and listen
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Burbage bridge today. Nigh on every hold on the block left of wobble block had a small THICK finger mark of chalk on it today. Anyway I did my bit and whipped the brush out, swearing and cursing the perpetrators as I went. I got all I could off but there are some gay looking soft white lines left... >:(
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ilkley yesterday,looks like there has been a team attempt on the new statesman,photo doesnt show how bad it looked and the extent of tick marks and the sheer amount of chalk (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v335/beastofackworth/2011-09-23142314.jpg)
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I saw that today, horrid overchalking!
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We spent a few minutes cleaning chalk off ringpiece too.everywhere with a close by carpatk seems to attract the chalk whores
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I believe a Swiss team guided by a local are responsable!
https://twitter.com/#!/stevehoneyman (https://twitter.com/#!/stevehoneyman)
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Maybe he needs to show them how to clean up after themselves too.
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I believe a Swiss team guided by a local are responsable!
https://twitter.com/#!/stevehoneyman (https://twitter.com/#!/stevehoneyman)
And maybe you need to get your facts straight before you use my titter feed to suggest that any of us were responsible.
I'm the 'local' in question and the line was like this before we got there.
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BOOM!Good day out?
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Ha ha! Yes thanks Rob, it was..
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Maybe he needs to show them how to clean up after themselves too.
Funny, we're laughing at your post right now.. or rather laughing at you..
Seriously, get your facts straight before you start spraying about people and situations you seemingly know nothing about - or maybe you'd like to come and explain to us where we're going wrong? The Swiss are here for a week after all, and they're keen to discuss crag ethics..
To be honest this kind of shit, ie posts such as your's really bug me.. I've lost count of the times I've picked shit up from blocs as diverse as Two Squirrels, Brad Pit etc - places only climbers go, are you gonna blame me or the pesky Europeans for this? I take it you're beyond reproach? Like me you take a litter bag up to pick other peoples shit up when you go out right? clean off other people's tick marks?
Comical really to think that these were the same guys who, that day, cleaned up a load of shit from around the crag that wasn't theirs, challenged a bunch of kids for throwing litter round the moor and as activists at places such as Magic and Chironico spend their time trying and reduce the impact of often foreign climbers who threaten access to their crags.
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Laugh all you want fella,my fact are perfectly right that the new statesman is covered in chalk and tick marks and wasn't cleaned off before it was left by the people who were working it.I never stated it was you,I never supplied the twitter link etc but regardless even if you didn't do it but went.on the route afterwards you should have cleaned it off as I'm sure some of the chalk was yours.I too pick up litter that's other peoples,most climbers do,you don't have a monopoly on that!
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Oh and boo hoo at giving me negative e karma you baby,grow up!
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I find it strange that you spout that you and your team were challenging kids for littering and were cleaning after others yet you can't clean after yourself
I find it strange that you can draw that from a post where he clearly says he does clean up after himself.
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Have changed my post as I missread his innitial post
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god you guys get a room. shortly i'm gonna walk to brad pit, put even more chalk on it n have a shit. just to liven the internet up a bit.
i'm glad this came up tho, it didn't go the way i'd been expecting over the last few years of everyone trying to bum each other to death over the net. what i expected was oooh i went for a walk holding daisies n saw a lot of chalk, i had to have a moment to myself in the lovely gritstone morning. when this passed i found myself stood near some poo, after coming back round i picked this up using one of the smaller of the 2 plastic bags i carry for such emergencies. i noticed the sweetcorn and suspected the guilty parties couldn't be from around these parts.
but this didn't happen, like i said it was a pleasant surprise.
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at least something cheering you up
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I know it's 8C, but still...
http://j.ukc2.com/i/182969.jpg (http://j.ukc2.com/i/182969.jpg)
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You'll need to put in the URL of the page, as UKC don't allow embedding.
I'm guessing it's the pic in Thomas Willenburg article though.
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Yes it is. Horrendous. Although the holds don't exist without a layer of chalk to make them bigger.
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This article (http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=64154), but the image in question seems to have died.
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Only in your cache...
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Shame, it was an eyesore.
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Posted this on t'other channel. I'm not sure I can be arsed climbing much longer if this is the way its going.
Nipped out for a couple of hours at lunchtime to the plantation and was dismayed by several very visible tick marks, arrows and chalk lines on what are relatively easy problems. Worst of all, someone's been using coloured blackboard chalk (yes someone actually bought a pack of chalk sticks that we used at school to the crag to write on the rock!) to put circles and squares around hand or foot holds.
It took me and Brian a good 10 minutes to scrub a bright blue square off the Bullworker and there was an enormous foothold on the arête on the pebble that had been coloured in with pink and blue chalk and a massive f*ck off line with an arrow pointing to the hold. This was the starting foothold so it had clearly been decorated for someone incapable of getting off the ground.
We then spent half an hour cleaning various symbols and lines off the lone boulder. These are f*cking slab problems where you can see where you have to put your feet and hands.
If whoever did this is reading this post I hope you think next time before drawing lines everywhere.
I despair, I really do.
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I don't believe anyone here would be guilty of such stuff. But last time we attempted to discuss tick marks I seem to remember that people thought it was all a bit armchair and the other channel, so we'll just shut up about it then.
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check this out from 0:50
Adele - Rolling In The Deep (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYEDA3JcQqw#ws)
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:-\
She looks like a donkey? :shrug:
Anyway, cheers for that. Never seen an Adele video before. Now I'm off to bleach my eyes and cut off my ears.
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I must be doing something wrong, I usually put chalk on my hands http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=185106 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=185106)
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I must be doing something wrong, I usually put chalk on my hands http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=185106 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=185106)
That's nothing. A big bunch of lads (nationality unidentified) turned up on my last Bleau trip to try something we were working on so we moved away.
Their first action, before putting shoes on or anything was to literally fill all the holds with chalk using a brush as a spoon.
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But did they then post pictures of them doing it on a climbing site?
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I must be doing something wrong, I usually put chalk on my hands http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=185106 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=185106)
I'm pretty sure Ben is a user of this forum and can defend himself adequately. However, I highly doubt he left the problem in a bad state.
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I think he is (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=1108), and I'm sure he tidied up afterwards. It just seems a little odd to post a picture "chalking up 7 Ball" on UKC where most of the users will then go forth and do the same, then not tidy up afterwards :shrug:
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I think he is, and I'm sure he tidied up afterwards. It just seems a little odd to post a picture "chalking up 7 Ball" on UKC where most of the users will then go forth and do the same, then not tidy up afterwards :shrug:
I know we're not a fans of the other channel over here on the smug side but seriously, I'm sure they're not all sheep.
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No, but UKC has a far higher number of users and I suspect there are more sheep there than here meaning numbers are higher.
But you're right I suppose, it's not anything we should be concerned about.....
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Whatever, introducing into anyone's mind that the rock ever needs 'chalking up' is a very bad thing.
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Perhaps it's a long term plan to turn it into Lime...
Slight flaw though, what with it being the wrong carbonate...
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Up at Brideys yesterday and someone has been using what looks like bottles of sids jizz to put donkey marks up. On the indian head and a bit around the bridestone. Just squirting the shit in big lines. Luckily i think as its been a bit wild up there lately its starting to wash off. Fucking dicks, ill squirt the stuff in their eyes if i catch em. :wank:
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I've got a genuine question, and I'm willing to try and change my ways if folks think my approach is...unacceptable...
When trad climbing at my limit, I sometimes give potential footholds a wee clean with a little rag that stays in my chalk bag. (to get rid of any lichen/greasyness) Obvisously chalk reduces the grip levels of bare rock, but a lot of the stuff I climb on in Scotland gets a bit grubby, so cleaning does help. I also sometimes leave a tiny chalk dot to help identify a potential foothold that may be hard to spot.
Just for clarity, I'm talking about doing this mid route, mid onsight, when potential footholds for the upcoming sequence are at waist to above-head height.
Clearly, I could use a brush instead, but fiddling around with a brush mid route is tricky.
Should I leave the rock clean, risking blowing an onsight, but then leaving the onsight more pure for the next suitor?
:-\
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Have I strayed onto UKC? :)
Surely a bit of chalk and a rub to clean some footholds is a community service?
Given the weather in Scotland, if a route is dirty enough that you need to clean some holds, then what is the likelyhood that it's going to get climbed again before your chalk is washed away?
Surely what you do is a milion miles away from donkey lines and tickmarks?
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All this UKC bollocks about onsight winds me up. What matters is your state of mind not a dab of chalk on a foothold. Making the definition of onsight so strict only serves to make the so-called 'flash' cover ever more shades of grey.
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Sorry! :chair:
I'll keep on making my life easier with discreet chalky dabs! I find it really helps me to visualise the moves and focus mor eon my feet (a weakness of mine).
Anyway, I've strayed far enough :off: for today...
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Have I strayed onto UKC? :)
Surely a bit of chalk and a rub to clean some footholds is a community service?
Given the weather in Scotland, if a route is dirty enough that you need to clean some holds, then what is the likelyhood that it's going to get climbed again before your chalk is washed away?
Surely what you do is a milion miles away from donkey lines and tickmarks?
If its scotland chances are it'll be raining before your second reaches the belay anyway.
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Before you've tied in!
Actually not rained here since Friday morning. Unprecedented.
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Before you've tied in!
Normally barely worth using chalk at all. In fact, I might start taking out some waterproof metal markers for my tick marks, then the pesky Scottish rain won't have a chance against my industrial strength tick marks!
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9N17cVHwr10&feature=player_embedded# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9N17cVHwr10&feature=player_embedded#)!
A new low at 4:15.
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Probably worth reading the comments on Youtube before the lynching.
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(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7021/6412654297_bef8ea8da0_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/huwtj/6412654297/)
Not sure whoever was on the Anchor at Brimham today used enough chalk! I cleaned about 5 huge donkey lines off from under the roof but unfortunately didn't have a big enough brush to get rid of all the chalk...
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(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7021/6412654297_bef8ea8da0_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/huwtj/6412654297/)
Not sure whoever was on the Anchor at Brimham today used enough chalk! I cleaned about 5 huge donkey lines off from under the roof but unfortunately didn't have a big enough brush to get rid of all the chalk...
We must have arrived to do this after you had brushed these off as although it was coated in chalk, it wasn't ticked up....Good work for brushing them off, there must have been a monumental amount of chalk on the sloper prior to the rain!!
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Not a tick mark but not cool. Next to the Robin Hood's cave descent, very very obvious from the top path. Words are at least a foot high... (sorry for crappy phone cam)
(http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8941/20111126150924.jpg)
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Not a tick mark but not cool. Next to the Robin Hood's cave descent, very very obvious from the top path. Words are at least a foot high... (sorry for crappy phone cam)
(http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8941/20111126150924.jpg)
Have the twats done that with chalk or a stone?
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Looks like blue and red chalk to me...
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No picture, but did my best to brush off a load of circles that had been drawn round smears on various boulders around Cratcliffe yesterday. Not sure who out of the different groups was responsible, but :spank:
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Have the twats done that with chalk or a stone?
Now I feel like a muppet because I'm not sure. It was blowing an absolute gale and getting dark so didn't take a closer look but I thought it was scratched in. Hopefully I'm wrong.
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You might not get the best impression from this photo but marks roof left hand was heavily caked in chalk to try and dry it out presumably. Especially poor form as it was just left this way and the flake its hollow and fragile so likely to break if climbed on in the wet.
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa426/moomastico/2011-12-14153127.jpg)
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I really don't get how you could dry out a wet holds with chalk. whenever I've tried, the final result was worse than before, I think that's because the dry chalk actually pulls out more wet from the rock.
I think paper tissues and a rag are better. :off:
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(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7167/6544209811_915dc7969f_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/huwtj/6544209811/)
Jess' Roof today. I just don't understand how these help?!
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Not a tick mark but not cool. Next to the Robin Hood's cave descent, very very obvious from the top path. Words are at least a foot high... (sorry for crappy phone cam)
(http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8941/20111126150924.jpg)
Have the twats done that with chalk or a stone?
I was up there today and had a quick look and it looks like it's been done with stone
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Nomina stultorum scribuntur ubique locorum
as they used to say in Rome back in tha day.
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If stanage is a mountain then theres definately a joke there.
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Nomina stultorum scribuntur ubique locorum
as they used to say in Rome back in tha day.
I always preferred 'Ancilla Face Mea Leganum'
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classic, I'd say.
;D
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Hi, first post here and I'm moaning lol. No pictures but some tools had numbered a problem (1-5 on obvious holds) at pleasley vale. Only took 2 mins to clean so why not do it when you leave! Or better still if you need to climb by numbers get a new hobby lol
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A bit off topic but I was not sure where to put it.
Absolutely flabbergasted by this:
http://www.ehow.com/how_8184445_homemade-climbing-rocks.html (http://www.ehow.com/how_8184445_homemade-climbing-rocks.html)
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No worries Dave if they also follow the instructions on the same page for
http://www.ehow.com/way_5403379_homemade-climbing-harness.html (http://www.ehow.com/way_5403379_homemade-climbing-harness.html)
they are not likely to be a problem for very long ... we can but hope
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better yet
http://www.ehow.com/how_4621605_homemade-rock-climbing-gear.html (http://www.ehow.com/how_4621605_homemade-rock-climbing-gear.html)
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Was up at bonehill today just having a look round, and I noticed that the 2nd hold on The Wave Traverse was caked in 1cm of chalk, no joke. I got most of it off but it still looks a mess, but atleast you can feel the small crystal in it now.
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better yet
http://www.ehow.com/how_4621605_homemade-rock-climbing-gear.html (http://www.ehow.com/how_4621605_homemade-rock-climbing-gear.html)
I'm loving that disclaimer!
"Rock-climbing is dangerous, and in no way is this article meant to advise or recommend making your own equipment. Use at your own risk."
Despite describing how to make your own gear!!
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Not a tick mark but not cool. Next to the Robin Hood's cave descent, very very obvious from the top path. Words are at least a foot high... (sorry for crappy phone cam)
(http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8941/20111126150924.jpg)
looks like mohammed doesnt have good spacial awareness of the room needed to write his name,although he learned his lesson and got it right second time round ::)
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(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lyq7n5TYiv1qh0s4z.jpg)
Iron Man Traverse, Buttermilks
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I was going to make some really clever comment about sometimes holds are tricky to see etc etc. Then I noticed the tick marks are annotated. :slap:
Perhaps it's a story and a take on the 5 little piggies. "This little crimp went to market and this little sloper stayed at home. This fat pinch had roast beef and this marginal half crimp had none, and this little finger jug went wee wee wee all the way home".
Twats.
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There was exactly the same thing when we were there, I brushed them all off and a German guy came over a little later and said 'it's so annoying I worked out my sequence and I had marked which holds were for the left, which were for the right and the one I had to match, but they keep on being taken off.' I tried to explain the error of his ways...
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I thought that the ticks were just ticks from a distance because the sun was very bright. It's very odd behaviour to say the least. I carry a large brush these days to clean shit like this off
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Did Paul Mitchell say he was having a good trip?
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No pictures but whoever was up at the Boysen's Groove boulder before us yesterday morning/afternoon is a helm.
There is no need to cover the holds on the witch with the insane amount of chalk we found. They felt slippery as until we spent a good few minutes brushing all of the holds for several minutes (as well as the tick marked footholds all the way across the bottom) and miraculously the friction improved!
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(http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/bellerophon23/ukb/IMG_0488.jpg)
River of life today
Wouldn't brush off; won't get rained off; not even pointing at the good bit :spank:
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River of life by Van Gogh
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(http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/bellerophon23/ukb/IMG_0488.jpg)
River of life today
Wouldn't brush off; won't get rained off; not even pointing at the good bit :spank:
fuck me thats ridiculous - who are these idiots? Thats not even a blind hold, and getting it is about the easiest move on there!
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River of life by Van Gogh
I was thinking Monet.. after his eyesight had gone!
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Tickmark? (http://etienne.seppecher.free.fr./wordpress/wp-content/gallery/cache/459__600x600_ft-2.jpg)
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no, the mark of an idiot.
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going for bully special prize.
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(http://i.imgur.com/BQqfgl.jpg)
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(http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/bellerophon23/ukb/IMG_0488.jpg)
River of life today
Wouldn't brush off; won't get rained off; not even pointing at the good bit :spank:
This was it a little time previous (at night so apologies for the poor image) as you can see it was in fact worse, the tail of the arrow extended pretty much the full width of the flake/feature you hug (what is the correct term for this I wonder)
(http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i177/jshearring/img0048a.jpg)
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Walked past mossattrocity last night. Covered in tickmarks. Looks real classy, thanks.
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Seems to be a lot of it about these days. Even Stanton-in-the-Woods was plastered in lines the other day (Eyes to the Skies, Hangman and Lean-to).
Two words: TOOTHBRUSH and WATER, please!
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that end of stanton was plastered a few days before. seems to have grown in popularity and therefore chalk...
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(http://img.tapatalk.com/577096d7-7fe3-846e.jpg) nice big lines under the footholds on the easy traverse on Ben's Wall block at the Stride yesterday.
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Idiots! At least its easy to wash of :whistle:
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with piss? :shrug:
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That'd work, (although obviously water would be preferable as its not an awkward spot to reach).
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(http://img.tapatalk.com/577096d7-7fe3-846e.jpg) nice big lines under the footholds on the easy traverse on Ben's Wall block at the Stride yesterday.
Fuckers. Some wankers washed off the numbers I'd carefully placed (in Gothic no less) next to each one of those tick marks. Tsk.
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That'd work, (although obviously water would be preferable as its not an awkward spot to reach).
It's OK, I know what you meant.
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From Harmers wood today. Most of it pretty pointless. The letters were scratched in presumably by the nobs who had a party there and left a load of glass/litter. The tckmarks/chalk were I assume from climbers. Mostly pointless. (http://img.tapatalk.com/5284d6f4-795b-c717.jpg)
(http://img.tapatalk.com/5284d6a9-796b-60a2.jpg)
(http://img.tapatalk.com/5284d6a9-7978-68ee.jpg)
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some spark has scratched the legend "HOMMO HADRY" by the belay bolts of Little Plum. Most likely to be by a climber because it's right next to the bolt and what scallies are going to go up there for some ad-hoc graffiti? It's not very deep and will probably disappear after a winter of run off. But, if this was you, don't be such a dick in future.
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some spark has scratched the legend "HOMMO HADRY" by the belay bolts of Little Plum. Most likely to be by a climber because it's right next to the bolt and what scallies are going to go up there for some ad-hoc graffiti? It's not very deep and will probably disappear after a winter of run off. But, if this was you, don't be such a dick in future.
saw this in april and was tempted to put a photo on here, as you said at least it looks like it will wear off.
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Kudos wall is looking a bit of a mess with tick marks at the moment, particularly Miller's Tale and the footholds on Kudos. Unfortunately my brush was rapidly losing bristles, so I felt I might be doing more harm than good scrubbing them off!
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I wish idiots would realise tickmarks on crags which never receive direct rainfall WILL NOT WASH OFF ON THEIR OWN. similarly the right hand side of terrace under the roof was a chalky mess last night.
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Dave Thomas said there's a bad example marking the jug in the break of Skinless Wonder at the moment
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http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/les-indignes-de-bleau.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/les-indignes-de-bleau.html)
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Any French speakers care to give a precis of the post?
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okay, he has a lot to say (and very little specifically about the abuse of chalk although the relatively little frequented - but highly rated- Dampierre-Maincourt is singled out in this regard and photo included) but the general gist is this:
The website is dedicated to preserving the crag environment and does not deal with bouldering itself- though it's by and for boulderers.
There's a shocking amount of detritus out there. he apologises for not updating recently, it's because he's been on holiday - and finds himself and his pals utterly disgusted by the state of the boulders on his return - on this occasion Bas-Cuvier. Problems include litter, chalk, used toilet-tissue, used condoms, and those (of various persuasions) in the act of creating used condoms - not a suitable environment for anyone let alone the youngsters for whom these areas are often an intro to the sport. He'd like the authorities to get a grip, particularly those who use the woods for sex.
They may be about to get support from a major sports retailer who has put forward start of September for a crag clean-up day. He, his pals and various Parisian climbing clubs have had four clean-up days since April this year, removing an average of 250kg of rubbish each time ie 1 tonne shifted so far, added to the 14 tonnes already removed from the car-parks this year by the Forestry Service. As the editor of the Bleausard mag writes - 'wake up, numbnuts' it's time to protect our playground!
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Thanks
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saw some walkers at burbage bridge on saturday who found a chalk bag on the floor... they emptied the contents out into the wind.... also went to try wss and somebody had obviously tried to dry the lowest part of the rigtht hand rail by chalking it to death... tried to brush it off. :chair:
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saw some walkers at burbage bridge on saturday who found a chalk bag on the floor... they emptied the contents out into the wind.... also went to try wss and somebody had obviously tried to dry the lowest part of the rigtht hand rail by chalking it to death... tried to brush it off. :chair:
I saw them too, that was ashes they were spreading!
Saw the chalk on WSS too. That was some guys just before us, I couldn't reach the hold to brush it. Weirdly it was a hold you don't use and it was bone dry
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really? shit thought it was chalk. and we where on wss story about half 12 and we found it like that and tried to brush it. think some one had tried to stop seapage on to the lower hold when it was wet.
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:read:
Hi, first i appologie for my english :sorry:
About chalk and tick mark i published a lot of articles in the webzine of Font and we try to explain climbers how change.
http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.fr/2012/07/la-magnesie-ca-fait-tache-brosser-cest.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.fr/2012/07/la-magnesie-ca-fait-tache-brosser-cest.html)
or like this on 1er april http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2012/04/les-grandes-marques-simpliquent-dans-la.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2012/04/les-grandes-marques-simpliquent-dans-la.html)
:please: If ou have time read some of them, translate it, and tell us what you think about it.
:wall: http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2012/03/des-grimpeurs-blanc-comme-neige.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2012/03/des-grimpeurs-blanc-comme-neige.html)
:spank: http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2011/11/green-climbing-la-preuve-par-limage.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2011/11/green-climbing-la-preuve-par-limage.html)
I know you don't used "pof" in your country but read it to...
fabrication : http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2011/06/fabrication-dun-pof-bleausard-modele.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2011/06/fabrication-dun-pof-bleausard-modele.html)
:goodidea: and how used it in Font and bouldering !
http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2011/06/fiche-pratique-2-lutilisation-du-pof.html (http://latribunelibredebleau.blogspot.com/2011/06/fiche-pratique-2-lutilisation-du-pof.html)
See you in Font, with a brush.
Have nice trip
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(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7167/6544209811_915dc7969f_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/huwtj/6544209811/)
Jess' Roof today. I just don't understand how these help?!
Where is this?
J
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Almscliff. To be fair it's hard to see these from the ground.. Ye
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Hanging rib at burbage yesterday was a bit of a mess of chalk after the weekend. Never seen donkey lines there and cant for the world work out how they help.
I did my best with a brush.
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8038/8070057445_b9217e6590.jpg)
more worrying was this..
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8457/8070058281_50155e677a.jpg)
Looks for all the world the same size as a standard builders bolster chisel. Cant recall it being there, but its been a while since I've been and it didn't look totally brand new. Its just below the start of holds of the Hanging rib.
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The mother of all tick marks on top of the Gorilla Warfare block this morning.
T marks the spot.... but of what? :wank:
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12401191/gorilla_donkey.jpg)
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Terrace frist thing on Sunday. Perhaps not the worst but still a little bizarre.
(http://imageshack.us/a/img594/5025/img1827c.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/594/img1827c.jpg/)
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more worrying was this..
(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8457/8070058281_50155e677a.jpg)
Looks for all the world the same size as a standard builders bolster chisel. Cant recall it being there, but its been a while since I've been and it didn't look totally brand new. Its just below the start of holds of the Hanging rib.
I think that's been there donkeys years, but my photographic memory fails me.
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I think that scar has been there years too.
Terrace area was more ridiculous week before last. I can only assume Stevie fucking Wonder and his cronies had been out trying it. Lines literally a foot long.
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It would be redder if it was recent.
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weird that someone has glued a finger to the wall though, no?
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weird that someone has glued a finger to the wall though, no?
Been there for donkey's years hasn't it? But my photographic memory fails me. It would be redder if it was recent.
What I've never worked out is whether to call it a foothold or a handhold.
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I think that scar has been there years too.
Terrace area was more ridiculous week before last. I can only assume Stevie fucking Wonder and his cronies had been out trying it. Lines literally a foot long.
What use is a donk line to a blind man? Maybe if they'd found a white stick or a labrador glued to the hold....
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I think that's been there donkeys years, but my photographic memory fails me.
Yeah - it didn't look uber fresh and I'm sure I'd have heard about it on here if new, just didn't recall it standing out so obviously. (Finger for scale, innit ;) ).
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http://vimeo.com/48602839# (http://vimeo.com/48602839#)
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That was brilliant. :clap2: Hopefully a few culprits see it and realise how pathetic they look with unnecessary excessive tick marks.
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:lol:
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If anyone is out grindleford way tomorrow you might want to take a brush.
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/2012-10-31_15-30-10_125.jpg)
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/2012-10-31_15-30-28_819.jpg)
Unlikely to be climbers but still looks a mess.
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If anyone is out grindleford way tomorrow you might want to take a brush.
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/2012-10-31_15-30-10_125.jpg)
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d175/beardownproductions/Dave/2012-10-31_15-30-28_819.jpg)
Unlikely to be climbers but still looks a mess.
what they wrote on the lip of the roof sums it up to me, both my feelings and their intelligence
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or they could have been geordies - "WY I" pet.
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Another reason to pic up any bits of chalk that have escaped from overturned chalk bags. Maybe not climbers (hopefully not) but possibly their chalk?
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Biking/bouldering crossover:
(http://www.basquemtb.com/wp-content/gallery/cache/3149__590pxx_orbea-occam-29-review-mountain-bike-4.jpg)
(From doug at basqueMTBs review of the Orbea Occam (http://www.basquemtb.com/orbea-occam-29er-s1-mountain-bike-review/))
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Good spot! Wonder if Doug noticed, he's a climber (or used to be).
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Curbar was a disgrace last night. Great white finishing hold ticked badly, the upper arete of bens wall ticked about 5 times along it, footholds ticked, all of them almost! Bad landing lip holds ticked and numerous ticks on the groove itself. All the lines were thick ones aswell. Gorilla warfare was also chalked up badly, you don't need chalk on footholds!
please brush them off!
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Maybe a repost but these are of Wellington Crack (http://yorkclimbers.com/forum/topics/aving-the-crack?xg_source=activity)...
(http://api.ning.com/files/ubvesjDzwvJU3qQzFQpFqF0om102YUsArNVDnA2hd4*ShwI6aEyWIB1VCqHP*XqNQgRyYRLwrEWz5ZAnrKBcDiUJ-nqTbLcJ/001.JPG?width=750)
(http://api.ning.com/files/kYZTGqO5cZhP5*g6mu09UAgKlJ8aahrtqSzk6oiVuY3hrdHk2AtULYTLR1H8FLrFhzbjMtuXgBfbRxNeAkth1o7aEdNHqNfn/002.JPG?width=750)
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They look like Paul Mitchell's from a couple of years back.
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Some tool had put two big tick marks on the slap on tiger at Burbage south. Toothbrushed them off, but really why?
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8 Ball had so many ticks on it and so much over chalking it was horrible, the rock was still damp underneath but the chalk was plastered everywhere
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I thought Michele had already done 8ball? I can understand ticks on tiger if it's at your limit. That Wellington crack tick marks stuff was just done as a wind up for here, that can't be serious
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They look like Paul Mitchell's from a couple of years back.
They are indeed.
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there where arrows to pebbles on 3 pocket slab yesterday... tried to brush em....
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/77637597@N07/8489369961/#in/photostream/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/77637597@N07/8489369961/#in/photostream/)
On the egg boulder at Cratcliffe...
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I posted this on the other channel this morning. Could not decide where to put it so ended up here. Not really tick marks but just as bad:-
"A month or so ago a few new boulders sprang up in the pleasly area of Mansfield.
Great some one else cleaning up the mag lime (saves me doing it all the time) but what the hell are these guys playing at.
I have visited all the areas they have put up on here and even told them about one of my own forgotten secrets ( wish I hadn't ).
Anyway these venues have been very well cleaned but then the climbers appear to be climbing with mud boots (only way I can explain it), by this I mean all (yes all) the foot holds used on each crag are just covered in sh*t. Then to make things worse this was left on one boulder for all to see, and posted as a topo on here.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=216271 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=216271)
Now in the forgotten quarry I told them about the same is happening, we have a set of problems on one wall all numbered up fro 1 - 12 even with SDS by the side of some of the numbers to denote a sit start.
W T F is this all about boys?
I have asked you respectfully through private messages to use a bouldering mat or a towel, and have also asked you to take down the images of the chalk lines and numbered problems, this after having to wash them off the rock where you left them.
Now you are upto the same tricks again why? If you know Robert Oakton or his freind Mark can you please have words, this is not acceptable and will no longer be tolerated.
I know you want your own bit of fame and glory in the climbing world ( Roberts own words) and this is certainly going the right direction to get you that. Is bouldering taking a huge step backwards?
Oh and if you want to massage your own ego please go and have a look at there problems all the problems are vastly over graded, that's if you can figure out what they have done.
Tony Simpson"
Sorry if the link does not work but please look at the picture I am sure you will be impressed.
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There was the mutha of all ticks on the starting flake of Gorilla Warfare over the weekend.
The fact that a) it's the biggest hold ever and b) it's a starting hold really confused me.
Why would you tick a start hold?
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There was the mutha of all ticks on the starting flake of Gorilla Warfare over the weekend.
The fact that a) it's the biggest hold ever and b) it's a starting hold really confused me.
Why would you tick a start hold?
at a guess it's a mark for those hard-of-thinking folk's heel or toe
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I did consider this, but as it's already pasted in so much chalk it glows, and you can see the heel placement anyway from the next holds just seemed slightly over the top.
Didn't help me tick it anyway...
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(http://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000IJ.N_bqCxik/s/710/climber-midnight-lightning-yosemite-0050.jpg)
:worms: :unsure:
(firmly in the 'it should stay' camp)
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The longer the better...
Big Dragon on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/67206670)
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Shame as well cos I liked the footage of the send... Was nice and bright... But was distracted by the 2 foot long ticks...
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Only recently started bouldering outdoors again after a long lay off (packed in serious climbing in 1996) and this is one of my massive irritations. "Back in the day", bouldering at places like Ilkley and Caley, you just got on with learning the problems and used a bit of spacial awareness and body positioning to work out where the fuck the next holds were. is this a reflection of either the predominance of indoor climbing, the need to "send" problems quickly (someone explain that to me too please) or just the general impatience and need for quick gratification of society today?
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American, contraction of 'ascend' I assume.
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I though it came from being related to 'dispatch', as in - 'I quickly dispatched with the V3 in the corner'.
Nothing like as the bad as the British - 'I smashed-in some good product in the cave of justice'. :sick:
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Think people are used to brightly coloured holds indoors so struggle to see holds outside that are the same colour....
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Blimey. I've "smashed in plenty of good product" in my time but none of it had anything to do with climbing. Or is this about Jerry? ;)
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...
Anyway these venues have been very well cleaned but then the climbers appear to be climbing with mud boots (only way I can explain it), by this I mean all (yes all) the foot holds used on each crag are just covered in sh*t. Then to make things worse this was left on one boulder for all to see, and posted as a topo on here....
I've seen the numbers at Pleasley before and the muddy footholds too- some bizarre stuff goes on there!
Is any of the newly developed stuff any good? Looking at UKC it's virtually all been given two stars and above, which seems unlikely, and judging by your comments the grades seem to be a little out!
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Some blind cunts have drawn a tick mark to the jug on tiger and a massive arrow to the crimp on huggy, about 8 inch long :spank:
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It's a fb pic so hope it shows up:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/q75/s720x720/1005554_332130716918700_182154482_n.jpg)
On the darkside boulder at Huntshams the weekend before last. The arrows are about 8 inches long. None of these holds are blind. Wankers.
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these guys.. from 12:15
https://vimeo.com/90527024
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these guys.. from 12:15
https://vimeo.com/90527024
they might be climbing harder than i can but what a tw@t, can't begin to understand it, they must be borderline blind.
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A pointless exercise too, he didn't even use the foothold!
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Yeh, that's a lot of chalk but who's to say thay didn't brush it off afterwards? It would certainly be shameful if they left it there.
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these guys.. from 12:15
https://vimeo.com/90527024
they might be climbing harder than i can but what a tw@t, can't begin to understand it, they must be borderline blind.
I love the fact that guy doesn't even use the "X marks the spot foothold"
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Font a love story eh? More like someone should be phoning Social Services.
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(http://1drv.ms/1mhMWE9)
Churnet was a total disgrace yesterday when I went down.
Whoever TB is, I hate you.
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Tom what have you been doing? You've been told before :spank:
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I love this thread, about as much as I hate tick marks.
They remind me of the party game, where you try to pin the tail to the donkey, ass, ..hold..? or whatever.
Personally, I think they generally have little to do with pointing out holds, and quite a lot to do with pointing to the climber, donkey, ass, whatever, in a Me, me, me, yes I was here kind of way.
Not super big, but I think this one is a peach. Spotted on the way back from Stanage, the other night (You don't say!).
Cover your eyes now, if you don't want to blow your onsight, as this one points directly to the hidden hold.
(https://photos-4.dropbox.com/t/0/AAB5nRnu0uMky_SW1-Yahv4C1Hu5ofsznlZUl1cHgfkW7w/12/145962941/jpeg/75x75/1/_/1/2/2014-05-04%2020.35.29-1.jpg/SF5aRQmiTysPzDClVVKV1RnxOBGoc4t_d2eC9gyg-VQ?size=1024x768)
(https://photos-4.dropbox.com/t/0/AAD4178gTpMhyiuNQaNlA-rXFMtEstNL2ohNi1cj1p1Ztw/12/145962941/jpeg/75x75/1/_/1/2/2014-05-04%2020.35.29-2.jpg/3HNir8nNHs9OBBh9wbMOQaRzL9lP-GfJLbG3Kycas_E?size=1024x768)
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Your Dropbox acccount is protected so the pictures won't embed.
Try sticking them on something like Imgur (http://imgur.com) for easy and cheap hosting (also provides BBCode links to copy and paste into here).
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Oh bllocks! No tick marks then, but still a donkey.
I checked on the preview, and they display fine, and on my phone. I did wonder, as Dropbllocks wasn't on the list on wiki. Let me know if anyone else can see them.
Just for the record, the tick mark is for the tiny, subtle, slopey crimp at the top of Buckstone Dyno. Guess you could miss it.
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It probably showed up in Preview because you were logged into Dropbox in another tab/on your phone and/or the image was cached.
Why would anyone need a tickmark for the Buckstone Dyno? :shrug:
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(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2939/14106192346_46975b18c1_b.jpg)
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Can anyone see the starting holds, I'm struggling a bit?
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2919/14129373645_e40f5f034d_z.jpg)
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Yep can see them now Dave. A small tick in the scheme of things. But totally unnecessary none the less. I hope the culprits still missed it.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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And you're right. For good measure I'm surprised the starting holds aren't circled.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Well I for one love tick marks.
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Well, you probably love them enough to take them with you when you leave :thumbsup:
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Very good :clap2:
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(https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/t31.0-8/p180x540/10344386_10152426061391350_682654466720839099_o.jpg)
The snakes have had enough too.
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Is that Bishop? I shat it when I climbed off a boulder to the familiar rattlesnake sound at Ibex. I was on my tod and it's miles from anywhere.
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(http://1drv.ms/1mhMWE9)
Churnet was a total disgrace yesterday when I went down.
Whoever TB is, I hate you.
It is much worse now, some utter utter C*nt has decided to scratch M H about 8 times all over Wrights.
What a complete and utter shit.
(http://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz127/scooba2cv/20140702_183818_zps2734d6e4.jpg) (http://s820.photobucket.com/user/scooba2cv/media/20140702_183818_zps2734d6e4.jpg.html)
(http://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz127/scooba2cv/20140702_183844_zps0a45813f.jpg) (http://s820.photobucket.com/user/scooba2cv/media/20140702_183844_zps0a45813f.jpg.html)
(http://i820.photobucket.com/albums/zz127/scooba2cv/20140702_183856_zps18c4f3f1.jpg) (http://s820.photobucket.com/user/scooba2cv/media/20140702_183856_zps18c4f3f1.jpg.html)
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what a complete Mike Hunt
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Was at roadside cave (toms roof) on Sunday and some one had underlined all the foot holds on the right wall.... No idea why they where all huge.
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four fingers> four lines?
https://vimeo.com/99975358 (https://vimeo.com/99975358)
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what was the towel thing about anyone?
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It covered the worst of the tick-marks.
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It had probably just finished raining, some people like climbing on damp rock
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It had probably just finished raining, some people like climbing on damp rock
maybe it was a wet towel, because he really likes climbing on damp rock ;)
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So was at deliverance when I was met with this monstrosity. It was clear someone had been trying to dry out all the holds. All they had succeeded in doing was making the chalk hold the damp in, the only wet bits of rock were where the chalk was caked on.
(http://i.imgur.com/HZ7NPUi.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/U0vt9WG.jpg)
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These people need shooting :furious:
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What a heel.
No need for that.
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These people need shooting :furious:
maybe educating?
(then shooting if they do it again)
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I note the absence of chalk on the top!
But as a pednat I would say this is criminal overuse of chalk rather than a donkey line.
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Don't show that to over-caffeinated sugary drink company, they might mistake it for the white cliffs of Dover and hack the fuck out of it
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*edit to delete
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Photo of London Wall, back in the summer. Sorry if the large image doesn't convey the mess.
There were about 13 clear tick marks between top and bottom, obviously indicating which peg scars to use. I know it's a route and not a boulder problem, but it highlights the trend in quite a depressing way. As does the photo from Broomgrove wall!
Better go to Specsavers.
(https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7512/15759293649_7c9f225054_h.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8602/15323088734_18a469eff6_b.jpg)
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These people need shooting :furious:
maybe educating?
(then shooting if they do it again)
Too late for that. Go get the gun.
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Photo of London Wall, back in the summer. Sorry if the large image doesn't convey the mess.
There were about 13 clear tick marks between top and bottom, obviously indicating which peg scars to use. I know it's a route and not a boulder problem, but it highlights the trend in quite a depressing way. As does the photo from Broomgrove wall!
Better go to Specsavers.
(https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7512/15759293649_7c9f225054_h.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8602/15323088734_18a469eff6_b.jpg)
Yeah the broomgrove ones this summer were a bit ridiculous. Especially as plenty of them were in the wrong place, so learning which ones to org or was a hard as a learning the footholds would have been without them.
Also the added benefit that as a perma-dry wall they won't wash off by their own accord.
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Ha ha
So you go there (Broomgrove) too! I thought maybe it was only me, and the (other) person needing glasses.
We had a deal - s/he'd kindly put the tick marks on, and I'd kindly scrub the fucking things off again.
The other option was possibly to add a few more - just to confuse matters!
It's, max, a forty move traverse; I scrubbed 60 marks off, the other night!
I think they're doing a 2-for-one on new pairs at the moment. Do me a favour while you're in there (other person struggling to see), and pick up a new pair for me too. I'll send you my prescription.
Ta.
I want to swear now.
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Ha ha
So you go there (Broomgrove) too! I thought maybe it was only me, and the (other) person needing glasses.
We had a deal - s/he'd kindly put the tick marks on, and I'd kindly scrub the fucking things off again.
The other option was possibly to add a few more - just to confuse matters!
It's, max, a forty move traverse; I scrubbed 60 marks off, the other night!
I think they're doing a 2-for-one on new pairs at the moment. Do me a favour while you're in there (other person struggling to see), and pick up a new pair for me too. I'll send you my prescription.
Ta.
I want to swear now.
That's one of lagers hustling moves... Mark up the wrong holds to confuse the opposition. If it's not him then there's a new kid on the bloc(s)
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I feel that a lot of the professional climbers set a very bad precedent in this.
Not to pick on individuals. But there are some whopping tick marks in this recent video of Nalle. Around the 1.30 mark you seem him add a massive tick to the sloper. Anyway I like Nalle, and certainly am not trying to single him out, but I think all the top climbers should take more responsibility about how what they do on videos impacts the rest of the climbing scene. I'm sure this has been said before but that is my 2p. You rarely see them brushing the tick marks off afterwards.
http://www.epictv.com/media/podcast/nalle-hukkataival-nails-his-last-chance-ascent-of-emotional-landscapes-v158c-%7C-epictv-choice-cuts/600557 (http://www.epictv.com/media/podcast/nalle-hukkataival-nails-his-last-chance-ascent-of-emotional-landscapes-v158c-%7C-epictv-choice-cuts/600557)
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I never understand why folk just can't use (and remove afterwards!) fingertape :shrug:
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I never understand why folk just can't use (and remove afterwards!) fingertape :shrug:
This is what I've been encouraging my mates to do.
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laser projectors with sponsors logos
like Batman's thing, but used to point at holds
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I feel that a lot of the professional climbers set a very bad precedent in this.
Not to pick on individuals. But there are some whopping tick marks in this recent video of Nalle. Around the 1.30 mark you seem him add a massive tick to the sloper. Anyway I like Nalle, and certainly am not trying to single him out, but I think all the top climbers should take more responsibility about how what they do on videos impacts the rest of the climbing scene. I'm sure this has been said before but that is my 2p. You rarely see them brushing the tick marks off afterwards.
http://www.epictv.com/media/podcast/nalle-hukkataival-nails-his-last-chance-ascent-of-emotional-landscapes-v158c-%7C-epictv-choice-cuts/600557 (http://www.epictv.com/media/podcast/nalle-hukkataival-nails-his-last-chance-ascent-of-emotional-landscapes-v158c-%7C-epictv-choice-cuts/600557)
I'm with you on this. The climbing media in general really needs to lift its game on this. It wouldn't be such a bad thing if all sponsors, news sites and mags refused to publish photos or vids with tick marks visible. OK you can always argue that of course so-and-so brushed them off afterwards, but plenty of folk don't. And the only guaranteed way not to forget to brush them off is to not use them in the first place.
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laser projectors with sponsors logos
like Batman's thing, but used to point at holds
Yup,got one of those too(without the Batman logo).sends my mates dog berserk! ;D
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I can remember repeatedly failing to hold a sloper that had a big donkey line below it, it turned out to be bird shit and the real hold as 20cm away.
It could be quite fun marking non holds with donkey lines from a ladder, now if we only knew someone who took a ladder to the crag. :whistle:
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thin laser lines would be easier to photoshop out of photos than dirty chalk marks - I assume that the consitent colour of a laser dot/line would make it easier for a computer to identify what needed shopping out
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I think the media maybe could film rock stars brushing the ticks off after they've topped the boulder and stared into the distance for a moment.
I thought ondra speaking before the comp on a few issues last wk was a good idea and would like to see/hear more of this.
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yeah, Ondra should give a talk about responsible shitting whilst at the crag
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not the worst, but pretty excessive given how controlled he looks on the first problem...
Prince of Thieves V11 and Apple Bottom Jeans V10 - Joe's Valley, Utah on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/114520420)
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To be fair though the tick marks might be nothing to do with the guy in the video.
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Excessive but who cares so long as he rubs them off after.
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The proposition is that tick marks are a problem per se as very few people rub them off, hence the number of images on this thread.
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Excessive but who cares so long as he rubs them off after.
If every video or photo representation of tickmarks was accompanied with a photo or video showing someone dutifully cleaning them off afterwards, then maybe "who cares" would be justified. As it is, nobody does, so photos and videos showing tickmarks by nature set a bad example and serve to further popularise them.
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If the sandstone there is like any of the sandstones I've climbed on then they simply can't be removed with a brush even using water. Guess it'd be nice to see an example set by seeing the attempt made.
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What about using a grey chalk that was difficult to see?
That way it wouldn't really matter if people didn't remove them afterwards...
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If the sandstone there is like any of the sandstones I've climbed on then they simply can't be removed with a brush even using water. Guess it'd be nice to see an example set by seeing the attempt made.
Even on granite it is a bitch to remove tickmarks with a brush and water.
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Hmm with all this talk of brushing I'd assumed there were some rock types where this actually worked.
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If the sandstone there is like any of the sandstones I've climbed on then they simply can't be removed with a brush even using water. Guess it'd be nice to see an example set by seeing the attempt made.
Could this be the new "Driving to crag".
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I don't know what else people might want yer publicity hungry climber to do to keep his video off this thread.
A standard disclaimer ? " No tickmarks were added in the filming of this video. Any visible marks are the work of knob or knobs unknown and remain despite Mr I.Amagiantwad and team's best efforts at removal"
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Chalk ball minister at burb North!!
http://youtu.be/NWgB1LK0Eh4
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So many crimes in that video!
Is that a tag on his ankle btw?
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wow that's a lot of chalk ballage.
Is there a significance to chalking footholds on grit or is it as stupid as it looks? I know sometimes on really polished lime it can help to have a bit of chalk on there but I thought it didnt help on the grit?
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wow that's a lot of chalk ballage.
Is there a significance to chalking footholds on grit or is it as stupid as it looks? I know sometimes on really polished lime it can help to have a bit of chalk on there but I thought it didnt help on the grit?
Its a long film can someone give the time(s) of the crime.
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wow that's a lot of chalk ballage.
Is there a significance to chalking footholds on grit or is it as stupid as it looks? I know sometimes on really polished lime it can help to have a bit of chalk on there but I thought it didnt help on the grit?
Its a long film can someone give the time(s) of the crime.
10:15 and 10:50. There might be instances more but I really don't have the inclination to search for them.
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Chalkbag attached with biner to loop of trousers on one side...
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Unnecessary dynamic moves on 2A ground.....
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Chalkbag attached with biner to loop of trousers on one side...
Reminds me of the larger lady I once saw at a climbing wall with one on each side due to reach issues.
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wow, 10-11 mins :o
:spank:
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? I know sometimes on really polished lime it can help to have a bit of chalk on there
I'd be very interested to know if this is a commonly held opinion and what mechanism people think might be involved?
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Very smooth limestone is prone to condensation, so can feel slippy if the rock is dry but the air is at all humid. Chalking and brushing will mop up some of the condensation leaving the foothold temporarily drier and feeling stickier?
Only ever done this on polished, water-worn limestone right next to a river (Dinas Rock) where it definitely made a difference but I'd imagine it might apply in other condensation-prone limestone venues like Raven Tor or Parisella's.
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Given chalk is used as a lubricant in industry, the only thing I can see chalking a limestone foothold might do is to polish it further...
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Given chalk is used as a lubricant in industry, the only thing I can see chalking a limestone foothold might do is to polish it further...
Is that not magnesium silicate as opposed to magnesium carbonate which we use?
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Doesn't preclude the mechanism in coops post from working work, assuming that it's possible to brush off all the chalk.
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Ah, no idea. I'm pretty sure I read carbonates in general were used but can't remember where...
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Who the fuck was still watching that video after ten minutes? Christ.
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And people accuse me of trolling, posting that video shirely has to be a troll?
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Chalk ball minister at burb North!!
http://youtu.be/NWgB1LK0Eh4
Oh my word.
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No need to ever chalk footholds... Just dry 'em off with a rag. As for the video... Can I have twelve minutes of my life back please?
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Who the fuck was still watching that video after ten minutes? Christ.
:lol: well quite. Although it was a particular highlight coating the arete in chalk and then not using that bit on the first attempt.
I know a strong F7c climber who insists on tickmarking footholds with the tick right ON the foothold. Didn't manage to persuade them otherwise.
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I'm not sure why people are complaining about having to watch this film. It's the best thing ever.
Only by the fifth viewing can you truly contemplate the question, "Why the fuck was this made?".
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Can I have twelve minutes of my life back please?
Well done for persevering. I gave up in the first minute.
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I lasted a few minutes before I gave up and asked. To be fair the lad is obviously inexperienced (but keen) and he is far from the worst user of chalk I've seen in the Burb valley (any donkey marks at all on show?.... and don't start me on the muppets I've had to ask to stop wirebrushing there on problems that probably last saw lichen in the 80's): all too often it's experienced folks who should know about this stuff. Education is the key and the BMC, the mags, and all the guidebooks could still do better.
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No need to ever chalk footholds... Just dry 'em off with a rag. As for the video... Can I have twelve minutes of my life back please?
:agree:
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Get a better broadband package then you can scroll through :smartass:
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Look at me I've got a big package!
:smartass:
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Look at me I've got a big package!
:smartass:
I think it's a bit unfair to take my quote from the 'show us ya wanger' thread and use it against me here
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Heavy and highly localised drifting on the left-hand boulder.
(https://i.imgur.com/ZOoGrQy.jpg)
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Absolutely shameful display of punter chalking on nicotine stain and the arete to its left last night, thick chalk, daubed all over footholds, massive amounts on ledges low down, loose chalk all over the floor, and yet not a speck of chalk above 8 foot off the deck.
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http://vimeo.com/125014077
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1 min "cattivo " ie naughty boy. Got that right, that's a mess.
I cannot understand why people can't see what's in front of their face - including the beauty of the place they're in :shrug:
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http://vimeo.com/125014077
I love it when people put tick marks that are 90% useless, from below going to those holds you can't even see the whole line...
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I don't know why I let this wind me up so much but it does. Tick marks of that size are completely unacceptable, especially when on more than one occasion he manages to miss the hold and has to re-position his hand slightly. Learn the problem, learn where the holds are and just get on with it.
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I don't know why I let this wind me up so much but it does. Tick marks of that size are completely unacceptable, especially when on more than one occasion he manages to miss the hold and has to re-position his hand slightly. Learn the problem, learn where the holds are and just get on with it.
I don't think you should, why does it matter when:
1) he may well clean them off when he is finished
2) it looks like the ticks will get washed off in the rain
I am sure the guy who has just climbed 8B (?+) will appreciate the last bit of advice though.
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Not the most beautiful place in the world I'd admit, but Woodhouse Scar was in a terrible state on Tuesday night, stuff coated in chalk that wasn't there on the previous Friday for sure. Ludicrous tickmarks on every hold of the Ian's Traverse cave lip, and it looked like someone had emptied an entire bag of chalk all over the 7c and 7b right of Radium Arete.
I cleaned off what I could but it was seriously OTT...the stuff on the Radium Arete boulder would be marginal in freezing connies, why are people even bothering in this weather, let alone spaffing chalk all over the thing?!
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I think 13th April is the opening day of the spaffing season
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I think the realist has been given 8a(+) by the last few ascentionists Tim, but your point is still valid ;)
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why does it matter when:
1) he may well clean them off when he is finished
2) it looks like the ticks will get washed off in the rain
1) No he won't because it can't be done without a jet wash.
2) No they won't, they don't wash off & even if they did, given your attitude, the moment it stops raining some other knob will just put them back.
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why does it matter when:
1) he may well clean them off when he is finished
2) it looks like the ticks will get washed off in the rain
1) No he won't because it can't be done without a jet wash.
2) No they won't, they don't wash off & even if they did, given your attitude, the moment it stops raining some other knob will just put them back.
Wow that was very vitriolic. Tick marks do brush off (yes I have brushed old tick marks off rock) and they do wash off in the rain (think about it, chalk is basic and rain is weakly acidic).
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:agree:
Water on a toothbrush will remove tick marks completely.
It is perhaps a good idea if folk show marks being brushed off on their vids or put a text caption on to that effect.
There's two things here. Using tick marks and leaving tick marks when you finish. The latter is an issue, the former is a non-issue. You can laugh/ knock style points off folk for using them certainly, like you would for someone wearing orange trousers for instance, but there’s really no need to be starting pogroms about it.
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Admittedly, I've never climbed 8b, or 8a for that matter, and never will. My primary displeasure derives from the need to reduce what are (sometimes in some cases aesthetically beautiful) lines to something nearer to the local bouldering wall.
I am probably living in a bygone era in that respect, and I do realise that its easy enough to brush them off at the end of a session (though how many people genuinely do based on how often I still encounter them at a deserted crag), but its something that visually I don't care much for. One could probably say the same about chalk full stop but don't think that debate is necessary
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I am probably living in a bygone era in that respect, and I do realise that its easy enough to brush them off at the end of a session (though how many people genuinely do based on how often I still encounter them at a deserted crag), but its something that visually I don't care much for. One could probably say the same about chalk full stop but don't think that debate is necessary
Just curious - Are you against all ticking on principal? or mainly the foot long wankfests for those too cool to admit they are nearly blind and can't actually see the holds? (I can't think of any other reason for ticks that long.)
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[ Tick marks do brush off (yes I have brushed old tick marks off rock) and they do wash off in the rain (think about it, chalk is basic and rain is weakly acidic).
In which case I need serious help as I'm either hallucinating chalk & tick marks or hallucinating brushing ( a lot of brushing ) & heavy rain during the last ten days in Bleau.
More seriously, it may well be true that chalk either can be brushed or will wash off on some rock types (although I doubt that as indoor walls struggle to shift it with a jet wash) but it categorically isn't true on sandstone! Simply try it or go out and look after rain.
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I think you must be hallucinating I am afraid.
Just think of all those whopping tick marks you see people drawing on karma, but funnily enough when you go there the rock is utterly pristine.
Here two pictures of a problem/boulder (opium/narcotic) which sees no direct rain but miraculously the ticks are in different places (in the smaller pic there is a tick to the small pocket, in the larger there is a tick to the crimp).
(http://enzo-oddo.fr/news/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/DSC_4467.jpg)
(http://bleau.info/images/vincent.pochon/narcotic001.jpg)
Have Oddo or Ponchon been dragging a jet cleaner into the crag?
or has someone done a bit of gentle brushing? :-\
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I am probably living in a bygone era in that respect, and I do realise that its easy enough to brush them off at the end of a session (though how many people genuinely do based on how often I still encounter them at a deserted crag), but its something that visually I don't care much for. One could probably say the same about chalk full stop but don't think that debate is necessary
Just curious - Are you against all ticking on principal? or mainly the foot long wankfests for those too cool to admit they are nearly blind and can't actually see the holds? (I can't think of any other reason for ticks that long.)
Just the foot long wank fests really. If a hold is obscured then a small mark I'll readily admit is helpful in sighting it and learning where hit. But these can be done discretely and in such a way that they're easier to brush off. It feels to me in some instances at least that it's borne out of either laziness or perhaps just seeing it done elsewhere and assuming it's the norm. I guess methods change and styles evolve and I'm stuck in the past.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Just the foot long wank fests really. If a hold is obscured then a small mark I'll readily admit is helpful in sighting it and learning where hit. But these can be done discretely and in such a way that they're easier to brush off. It feels to me in some instances at least that it's borne out of either laziness or perhaps just seeing it done elsewhere and assuming it's the norm. I guess methods change and styles evolve and I'm stuck in the past.
I'd agree with that.
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Ok dickheads, back to tickmarks.
The old "what's the big deal, he will have brushed them off afterwards" argument doesn't wash - rather like tickmarks in fact. You've only got to walk around most crags to see that a significant proportion of tickmarks do not get brushed off afterwards, this thread is evidence of that.
"Tickmarks get washed off in the rain" - yes and no. In heavy rain rock receiving an actual flow of water will get tickmarks washed off. Tickmarks that don't receive direct rainfall or runoff flow will not wash off, even if the rock gets wet or damp. Tickmarks under roof rarely get washed off naturally. Tickmarks on steep peak limestone crags for example often last an entire season or longer.
To actually completely brush off a tickmark on rock like grit requires a brush and some spit/water. The way people are tickmarking these day using blocks of chalk tends to leave a very thick and ingrained tick, so just brushing it dry with a brush tends to remove the unnecessary bulk of surface chalk (depositing it on the floor), but still leaves a visible tickmark.
A much better way to indicate a blind hold is with just a subtle surface finger dab of chalk, one that the next climber will probably not even notice, and will be easy to brush off.
Aside from just being lazy bad form and disrespectful to other crag users, the fact is most/plenty of tickmarks are not brushed off afterwards. Probably because if you're the type of person with such little consideration for the crag and other users that you would use a donkey line in the first place probably means it wouldn't even occur to you to brush them off afterwards. The type of considerate user who laboriously brushes them off will probably be a minimal user of tickmarks anyway. Every time a tickmark is used there is a finite chance that the user will forget to brush it off. The only way to guarantee you won't forget to brush em off is to not use them in the first place - this should be the gold standard, and is totally acheiveable.
The other problem is that the appearance of tickmarks in high profile videos, guidebook photos, mag articles only serves to proliferate the practice, especially if we all just shrug and say "well they will have brushed them off afterwards" and nobody takes a stand to redress the balance. Anyone coming into the sport these days would read a web article, see tickmarks on every hold, and assume that it is normal procedure to rock up at the crag and indicate every single hold on your problem with a tickmark.
And for those saying it hypocritical to pour scorn on tickmarks when we all use chalk and it's no different, that's just a bollocks cop out clause. Even stevie wonder can see there's a massive difference between considerate moderate chalk use and indiscriminate donkeylining.
Rant over. Get brushing motherfuckers.
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I don't understand how people can't remember where to reach to after working a boulder problem or looking from the floor. I kept missing a hold yesterday till I stood back and thought "it's 2 inch right of that obvious natural mark on the rock...." Simple. Visualise the problem, be at one with the problem....
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A much better way to indicate a blind hold is with just a subtle surface finger dab of chalk, one that the next climber will probably not even notice, and will be easy to brush off.
The other problem is that the appearance of tickmarks in high profile videos, guidebook photos, mag articles only serves to proliferate the practice, especially if we all just shrug and say "well they will have brushed them off afterwards" and nobody takes a stand to redress the balance. Anyone coming into the sport these days would read a web article, see tickmarks on every hold, and assume that it is normal procedure to rock up at the crag and indicate every single hold on your problem with a tickmark.
Dave, well put and a much more well structured version of what I was trying to say. I often put a small finger tip dab between me and the hold I might be aiming for, or better pick out a feature like a pebble or crease between as a sighter. But is easy to brush or dab with a beer towel to remove.
And the other part regarding it becoming common practice in the media does indeed tend to promote that its more than acceptable to do, something which shouldn't just be blindly accepted. I fully recognise that not everyone gets in to climbing purely from the enjoyment of being outdoors but thats a key factor for me and anything I can personally do to keep it that way (like bagging out litter and finger tape for example) is a minimum.
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Yup totally with the finger dab style.
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I often put a small finger tip dab between me and the hold I might be aiming for..
Funny that, being weak, I often do the same :lol:
Plus everything else you said :yes:
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lasers is the best option
no, not those pink and black things from Boreal
laser pens and such like
even just as a thought experiment
if you feel too much of a tit wedging a laser pen in a bit of bluetack or on a tripod to help you with finding a hold, then you sure as hell don't need to draw on the rock with chalk for the same reason
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Every hand held laser I've ever used had to be pressed down to work. They'd work well with spotters I imagine. I think a better option for those who use big 'orrible tick marks could be a trip to an optician?
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Rock type makes a big difference too - a tick on lime is piss to brush off, but down t'churnet it's close to impossible to completely remove firmly drawn ticks, many of which also never get direct rainfall.
I think this thread makes a positive contribution to the scene - when it first started it made me reappraise what I do and I would never now go back to ticking rock, which I think is a good thing - I still like (and use) the old idea of a bit of tape instead, on account of being instantly and completely reversible..
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Haha, I posted this comment on Marco Espamer's vimeo video:https://vimeo.com/125014077#comment_13157866 (https://vimeo.com/125014077#comment_13157866)
Well done, you have been selected as this weeks donkey-line / tick mark hall of shame featured climber. If you can climb this hard, you can do it without the stupid lines. Get a grip.
Just got a reply today:
you are absolutely right .i was wrong.probably it were not necessary so much. i will be more careful the next times. thank you to letting me think about it.
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Good work that man!
Some muppet had plastered every foothold at Caley in chalk over the past few weeks. It actually made the footholds much harder to see, so I couldn't get up a lot of the problems which had fallen victim (that's my excuse anyway).
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Well done, you have been selected as this weeks donkey-line / tick mark hall of shame featured climber. If you can climb this hard, you can do it without the stupid lines. Get a grip.
Seeing as you have decided to speak for everyone, is that not a little rude?
Rock type makes a big difference too - a tick on lime is piss to brush off, but down t'churnet it's close to impossible to completely remove firmly drawn ticks, many of which also never get direct rainfall.
To be honest I think it is over chalking in general which is the problem at Churnet, wrights rock is a terrible mess.
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Yep. I think you've just echoed what another guy said two days before you; :thumbsdown:just with a little less class.
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I was in a bit of a sour mood and also somehow had missed the first post. Could have worded it better.
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down t'churnet it's close to impossible to completely remove firmly drawn ticks, many of which also never get direct rainfall.
As if to make my point, this 2ft beaut on the nose problem at Gentleman's, visible from the main path - just no need..
(http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/bellerophon23/ukb/480b0bd5-9381-4962-9437-280027bd347e_zpsjterdmp5.jpg)
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I'm not sure that this is all about... If you can't remember where the footholds are for two moves, maybe Font slabs aren't your thing? As far the ones one the top of the thing... NO SHIT.
(http://bleau.info/images/jean.pierre.roudneff/LaDallesonPpre1.JPG)
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Those top ones are pretty terrible. Not sure what is hold and what is non-hold.
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That is pretty idiotic... Maybe its to make it harder? So many tickmarks, not enough holds
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https://twitter.com/Planetmountain/status/601743300526215168
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CFnSV8IWgAIXljh.jpg:large)
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Crag X was such a mess today.
Sorry of you've fessed up to these elsewhere, ahem, but I think they're not the same ones. ...What? ;)
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5443/18685055518_1b9b794e3c_c.jpg)
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3939/18872779925_d57e454ff0_z.jpg)
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5519/18846536196_a530421975_c.jpg)
This is just a selection. footless S' Egg problems, Hulk, S'man, JR - footholds and handholds. Clearly not all by the same person.
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Middle ones mine.. *blushes*
Point taken :)
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Without knowing the crag, I hesitate to say, but these don't look too bad. However why not brush them off tt? Esp somewhere like x
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Brushing stuff off at places like X that don't receive any direct rainfall is especially important.
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Bit of a mess left behind on Zarzaparrilla, the black lines seemed particularly creative
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/b8112549e243181c1bb219e9341b5c0e.jpg)
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/8965d9bd03c21a0a0fdb891f44d078d3.jpg)
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/b90283c173eee087dcfa02e8a216706f.jpg)
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Do people still climb at Embaracin?
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Do people still climb at Embaracin?
Apparently just people with pof rags and sticks of chalk
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Objectionable as they are, I'm not convinced that objectively some of these look any worse than the massive splodges on the holds. Are we bothered about these or is it just the avoidable nature of tick-marks that singles them out?
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What we need is some of that fading squirty stuff that referees use these days
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With apologies for smugness and shaky hands. On the left, knee height - one of the bigger footholds on the crag (Harmer's Wood). Nice and dry, pretty easy to spot from above. Stuff at hip height mostly ornament in the wrong place...
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/e35/12826122_1702598700016009_1143696905_n.jpg)
https://www.instagram.com/p/BDLydbzNie0/?taken-by=steverile
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CFnSV8IWgAIXljh.jpg:large)
Call me a blasphemer, but that really doesn't seem so bad to me.
Getting just the right jam in a finger crack can be really tricky, especially if you're puffing out of your ass. And from the looks of it there's only a handful of ticks through the crux section of the route. Perhaps a little on the large side but again not exactly crime of the century.
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Bit of a mess left behind on Zarzaparrilla, the black lines seemed particularly creative
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/b8112549e243181c1bb219e9341b5c0e.jpg)
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/8965d9bd03c21a0a0fdb891f44d078d3.jpg)
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/28/b90283c173eee087dcfa02e8a216706f.jpg)
The black lines are actually the recomended for of ticks. You use the bark of the trees to tick the rock. Although tour still ment to brish the tick off of course.
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The black lines are actually the recomended for of ticks. You use the bark of the trees to tick the rock. Although tour still ment to brish the tick off of course.
Is English your first language?
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The black lines are actually the recomended for of ticks. You use the bark of the trees to tick the rock. Although tour still ment to brish the tick off of course.
Is English your first language?
Nes.
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ofcoarse inglish is my furst language
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Negative tick marks are all the rage
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Wouldn't they be cross marks?
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The black lines are actually the recomended for of ticks. You use the bark of the trees to tick the rock. Although tour still ment to brish the tick off of course.
Fair enough! Not a fan, but can see the reasoning especially around Albarracin.
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Chalk should not be used for this!! today (https://twitter.com/northlees/status/734447688599625733)
(https://i.imgur.com/AuQN2j4.jpg)
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"I did a new problem but I don't know how to draw a line on a computer"
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Lost for words...
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Went to Longridge today, almost every single handhold and foothold on the traverse was tick marked - 100m+ of ticks. An epic display of fuck-wittery.
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You need something to see after dark.
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You need something to see after dark.
Carrots?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Must have been lots to see whilst passing on your motorbike... ;)
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It was my dog that noticed them, I was too busy chucking litter.
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I was going to number them as well, but I can't count that high and I ran out of chalk.
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Hammer and chisel work well when you're out of chalk. Best after dark so not to disturb the locals.
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I like to sit back on the fence afterwards to see where all the holds are.
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Went to Longridge today, almost every single handhold and foothold on the traverse was tick marked - 100m+ of ticks. An epic display of fuck-wittery.
Here's photos the day before of said muppetry... :shrug:
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13241184_1257532904287119_147500248651856644_n.jpg?oh=dd640622dcf78f1e2981ea5a56654786&oe=57DBDEE7)
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13237726_1257532880953788_8298073577217281762_n.jpg?oh=f4f78273bb2702de927950e5adebf60b&oe=57D62CB1)
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Blimey - someone needs some glasses.
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I've been known to put a few ticks on thigs at longridge but for the record, those aren't mine this time.
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I'm going to self-refer. Not photos, thank god, but was climbing without the requisite brush on a rope at Fairhead and used my chalk rag to scrub off lichen and "green" from some footholds. Nasty big white lines... bit embarrasing when some friends later climbed the route and asked WFT I'd been doing using those footholds.
I hadn't. I'd cleaned the wrong ones. :slap:
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Almscliff was a right mess at the weekend. Saturday morning revealed some horrible 'scrubbing' with chalk balls beneath orchrist.
Worst still were the chalk lines to the sinker foot holds on slopey traverse next to morrell's wall. Whoever did those needs a slap. Luckily been washed away by this week's deluge
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Worst still were the chalk lines to the sinker foot holds on slopey traverse next to morrell's wall. Whoever did those needs a slap.
Can't believe anyone would consider trying this when it isn't about 2 degrees! Always feels desperate unless its baltic!
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Worst still were the chalk lines to the sinker foot holds on slopey traverse next to morrell's wall. Whoever did those needs a slap.
Can't believe anyone would consider trying this when it isn't about 2 degrees! Always feels desperate unless its baltic!
Bizarrely it's not too bad for summer attempts. It never gets the sun (so the rock never gets too warm) and if there's a breeze.....
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I still never did the fucking thing.
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I still never did the fucking thing.
Me neither :D
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(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7366/27891403911_d445f04308_b.jpg)
Hands in the air, everyone who knows what hold that is :ohmy:
Taken from an original photo courtesy of BoB - let me know if you want me to remove this, or provide a link to the otherwise excellent photo :)
:shrug:
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the storm?
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the storm?
Right in the eye of! :boxing:
http://blogofbutters.blogspot.com/2011/03/team-slovenia-day-6.html?m=1
Not very difficult that one though, was it ;)
I hope someone told him you're supposed to hold the top, and not just caress the rock between the lines..
Some nice shots in the blog.
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a route addition to the list - big, lines of red chalk (that is, proper "stick of chalk" stuff) to point to various holds on Supercool at Gordale. Someone evidently went up there prepared - a frustrated teacher?! (or do they all use white-boards and Powerpoint these days?).
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a route addition to the list - big, lines of red chalk (that is, proper "stick of chalk" stuff) to point to various holds on Supercool at Gordale. Someone evidently went up there prepared - a frustrated teacher?! (or do they all use white-boards and Powerpoint these days?).
Red chalk? I hope it's just blood
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(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7366/27891403911_d445f04308_b.jpg)
Hands in the air, everyone who knows what hold that is :ohmy:
Hopefully the last five years of rain have washed it off. :P
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Not many ticks, probably cos they ran out by hideously chalking the footholds.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160911/a8cab6811a08266e61931aed5068c7c6.jpg)
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(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8397/29950610541_cb90c8c6fd_b.jpg)
Oh dear, this is just pathetic :no:
Doesn't look as though it worked, either.
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https://vimeo.com/182977087 (https://vimeo.com/182977087)
He even farts at 55 seconds.
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Those look helpful....
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What an absolute load of complete & utter toss-pottery. Disgraceful.
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Branch dab anyway, back around you tick marking toss pot!
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Is that Lagers?
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That fart is amazing... :weakbench: :lol: :clap2:
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Good volume and decent tone, poor sustain. 5/10
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It's a boot squeak surely :shrug: the heel squishing in a bit
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Protocol for discussing farts vs. other noises:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0kANChxhhQ
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the heel squishing in a bit
I just listened again on high volume and there is a similar noise at 1.33 again when he puts his heel up. It is however, much funnier to imagine it's a fart...
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Torridon and the Ship boulder in particular was a mess yesterday. It hasn't rained for a couple of weeks so you'd expect some build up of chalk, but it was obvious that no effort had been made to brush off the excess.
And then the tick marks. The first photo below is the jug on the slab at the top of Malc's. You can see this hold from the road, fair enough it might be sort of hidden when you are topping out, but if you've got the lip on Malc's I'm pretty sure you can hang around for the one second it takes to find this jug. No need and even if you do need, brush it off afterwards.
There were other ugly and unnecessary tick marks all over the boulder.
Also, someone couldn't be arsed to walk 5 minutes to the toilet block and instead decided to take a shit right in the middle of the boulders. Thanks for that.
I'm really gutted because this is exactly what we feared when writing the guidebook.
I love it when people who have taken a gamble and travelled a long way are rewarded with good weather and get to experience the place at its finest.
And then they leave it like this...
I actually want it to rain now to clean the place up.
(https://c7.staticflickr.com/9/8649/29674471054_45de92c95d.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Mdeqph)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/Mdeqph) by richiebetts (https://www.flickr.com/photos/richiebetts/), on Flickr
(https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5829/29694491054_f6825666d8.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Mf12DG)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/Mf12DG) by richiebetts (https://www.flickr.com/photos/richiebetts/), on Flickr
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Churnet on Sunday - plenty of tick marks that'll never be washed off by the rain and no attempt to brush them or keep them small.
This was the worst, maybe 5/6 inches long, I've no idea how they managed to get the chalk on as thick as they had :shrug: Sorry about the size of the pic.
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15036281_10157751904020581_3798726685439982883_n.jpg?oh=c0fa5d165504181b3dcad358cd7b4e4f&oe=58CA1E54)
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Whoever made such a mess of brad pit should be ashamed. And how they can afford all that chalk I'll never know...
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wow
https://www.instagram.com/p/BNb9NzyBhbg/?taken-by=fabi_buhl&hl=en (https://www.instagram.com/p/BNb9NzyBhbg/?taken-by=fabi_buhl&hl=en)
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Holy cow! It clearly wasn't dry!
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That's appalling. I could totally imagine the right hand end of the crimp rail breaking in those conditions.
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seen the other people there guessing by the tags?
a few who know the grit well...
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Saw another pic on Instagram yesterday of Boyager looking similarly caked. :-\
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Hey, you Nazis! Hey, you fascists! Can't you see that fabi_buhl is trying to #livewithoutlimits? And here's you twats trying to impose limits on him and telling him not to climb. The rock can go fuck itself, fabi wants to send.
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How do we know that it's Fabi's chalk?
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Who gives a shit? We're on the bandwagon now and the next stop is Ragetown! Are you geddin' on?
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How do we know that it's Fabi's chalk?
It may not be his chalk, but by uploading the picture isn't he (unintentionally) promoting that type of chalking?
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He's replied to Dave's Instagram comment:
yes it is way to much but it was already chalked in, probably someone tried it just after the massive rainstorm earlier in the week. No worries we brushed it...
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A Case of Mistaken Identity, at Apparent North, was left in a state on Sunday (at least a dozen tick marks left) after a big group (with at least one coach from The Works, who should know better and be setting a good example) moved on.
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Name and shame
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To clarify The Brad Pit situation - I was up there the same day with Fabi and Melissa.
a) Fabi stacked it on white wand and has busted his heel - he didn't climb all day.
b) BP was completely dry, so I dont think there was any chance of breakage - however, at the time of the chalking (on a previous day) that might have been a different situation. Fabi and Melissa both commented on the state of the problem - but it would have taken hours to try and clean the whole thing up. The tick marks were obscene - so they were all brushed off before leaving. I've no idea who put that chalk on there, but they are a f*cking idiot - There's no reason to cover the whole of the topout in chalk. It will need a good rain to clear up.
c) Neither Mason nor Mina were there.
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Name and shame
I don't know their name, I've just seen them Working at The Works, and I'm not interested in witch hunts anyway.
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I'm not suggesting that Fabi and Melissa were climbing BP while wet, but I have definitely seen posts of locals climbing routes while raining. And one's who really should know better.
Considering the number of indoor walls, concrete boulders and perma-dry crags surely there's always another option.
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(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/o8FhJvft01bzWLzIbiJIAqcbzZZcg7jsTP55fTACm2obXTHnDSBMX0eetran9-csv2EqcmFLVdDv6aOt6GO4zv7Fv_gPmxetq0PBSjsOz7_lSBe6kM08vp4pjUAVqARxIwZyHx_taOanWNMFIfSPi7_6Ho9xIBE5WRANpVyRc2_2OM-LkfIJMzY1eaYJtwMzmUn1R2oii6oq1Fd8lx3JxnRkId0UfdXO6Ym2CnE7RbUzqw1t8uvabaJkmKIxbp8iH-pDXvP3rDuWx7RDQRj9UAMpZTBfRKGH8HxoI0PrSkpXCD58dkDUbzkgdQOPxc1feO-BmFSJo-ubo-F49-GwhHED-VYdRxKr-0zwjb3htBpCnBX3pRJ0jZya_XeZClLBIAo2mMh-X7nf2WzndCcpzoRwL7PhcMYUfbzYE4ldvDYyA1kYKHEhIBzABZcA93YRGnx5YKg3yGgEDi410OJF9d6e6r4y9jrGWletw-gA2XoHTrbxQUnf5hkT85YwXFRbz0ER_HiISqmDhu_pnhFeLFLkCnqvxijRQFTlG3oE3AqzoUNHSE5Por1hbTnyFmLxmdXATT8NaMDwfO4wO34bnFeddVQhAti3CtOlpx9j9Ya2ZY4J=w1282-h721-no)Not a massive crime in the great scheme of things, but FFS
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I disagree. People who can't embed photos properly should be shot.
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(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161218/752230eda70b991492df831cdc5815cf.jpg)
Cleaned this up this morning.
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(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161218/752230eda70b991492df831cdc5815cf.jpg)
Cleaned this up this morning.
AGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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Hows this for a little rock painting :slap:
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/691/31722662486_943e652c5a_b.jpg)
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(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161218/752230eda70b991492df831cdc5815cf.jpg)
Cleaned this up this morning.
.....and then you slap your left hand up the arête
What? That litte diagonal seam?
No, where all the chalk is
I'm not sure I can see what you mean
Where the rock stops being rock and starts being air
Can you tick mark it please
OK, there you go
I can't see those as they are disguised by all the other chalk
OK I'll put them 6" to the right
OK, so I go for the tick marks?
No, go 6" left where all the other chalk is and the rock runs out
OK, thanks, I think I've got that now
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Sterling tickwork north of the border by Dave Mac
https://twitter.com/davemacleod09/status/814493094087364608
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To be fair to Dave they may not be his. That boulder has been in a right state for ages - very stubborn ticks that need a pessure wash. There are some locals that should know better...
There's a pic on my blog from a couple of weeks ago here: http://www.gaz-softrock.blogspot.co.uk/2016/12/ticked-off.html?m=1
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No ones posted up the cock jizzing on tits chalk ticks up at Thorn that's been gracing Facebook?
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AKA The Owl?
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/s480x480/15672627_732110476952224_1317114360764965138_n.jpg?oh=a46eb51827fa43c701ba884970ff058c&oe=58F0B018)
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15665678_732110513618887_8435422226653056998_n.jpg?oh=ad1cd010ef6ae421929fc57dce095c06&oe=58F2B5A9)
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That's the one! Twit twoozers!
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Fucking hell this is ridiculous
https://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=289766
(sorry UKC don't allow you embed their pics)
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Fucking hell this is ridiculous
https://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=289766
(sorry UKC don't allow you embed their pics)
I took this photo and have pulled it as I feel I am being held responsible for the absolute fucking state this bloc is. Those who know Deux Faux Plus Reels know how popular it is and the state it gets into- just Google and you'll see. In hindsight I should made more of an effort to remove the ticks and chalk prior to the photo and to be honest shouldn't have posted it up on UKC for punters to point fingers. Sam and I spent quite a time cleaning it up before we left with,ironically, a brush we found under the boulder. Those who know me personally know how much I detest tick marks.
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I was one of the punters that criticised the photo (not you by the way), and tbh what do you expect? It was a fucking disgrace and yes I know the problem, and no I've never seen it as bad as that.
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Another one from the other channel:
https://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=290790
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FFS
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That is a fucking disgrace :wank:
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There were tickmarks up Elder Statesman at Curbar on Sunday, presumably from the day before. Even the jug on Elder Crack was ticked! Good effort to anyone trying it, but still...
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Worst thing about that London wall thing is that it implies someone was likely toproping or at the very least heavily ab inspecting a very safe E5.
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Another one from the other channel:
https://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=290790
:o :o What Dave said. Take up tiddlywinks or something.
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There were tickmarks up Elder Statesman at Curbar on Sunday, presumably from the day before. Even the jug on Elder Crack was ticked! Good effort to anyone trying it, but still...
On a side issue
https://www.facebook.com/edalemountainrescue/?hc_ref=SEARCH&fref=nf
I though at the time 3 ropes was overkill, maybe not
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http://www.pareti.it/climbing-magazine/recensioni-news/news-pareti/638-brutto-incidente-per-michele-caminati-in-inghilterra
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Worst thing about that London wall thing is that it implies someone was likely toproping or at the very least heavily ab inspecting a very safe E5.
:agree: good call Dave, the "climb however you want" brigade might get their Y-fronts in a twist over that but it's definitely worth saying. Correlation between shoddy ethics not respecting the climbing and, errr, shoddy ethics not respecting the climb, who knows??
The Elder Statesman fall, quite surprising that it's MC as I thought he had a lot of good experience and mentoring from previous trips over here??
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We were in Millstone end of feb, and i'm pretty sure the culprits were there camping. There was a couple climbing it and the gear was being practised on top rope, and the route was complete with the tick marks shown in the photo (a fucking mess). I hadn't seen tactics like this before, it was being treated like a sport route. I tried to speak to them but there english wasnt brilliant, they were european couldn't say exactly where. I guess they have different ethics....
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The Elder Statesman fall, quite surprising that it's MC as I thought he had a lot of good experience and mentoring from previous trips over here??
Didn't he deck out on the New Statesman too? Possibly due to gear ripping?
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The Elder Statesman fall, quite surprising that it's MC as I thought he had a lot of good experience and mentoring from previous trips over here??
Didn't he deck out on the New Statesman too? Possibly due to gear ripping?
This says the rope got cut in the fall and a broken arm! Not good!
http://www.edalemrt.co.uk/cgi-bin/createIncidentMap.cgi?mapMode=Specific&mapIncident=17&mapYear=2017
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Two different routes there. Edale MRT not quite on the ball with hard grit aretes ;)
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SHIIIIIT! That's a bad fall for a "safe" route. Didn't Steve Mac do this with 3 ropes to insure against this happening?
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Ouch. Steve McClure definitely had 3 ropes as I remember the comment in the video of him doing it. Pearson had 2, but I think they were pretty skinny and he didn't fall.
Get well soon Michele, nasty fall to take.
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Two different routes there. Edale MRT not quite on the ball with hard grit aretes ;)
Falling off The New Statesman and landing in the Peak is a nasty fall indeed.
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IIRC Michele fell off The New Statesman before placing the first protection. Close call that one. This one is terrifying.
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In case you couldn't see the giant jug, some helpful tickmarks from Eridge >:(
(http://i.imgur.com/xt7o6VU.jpg)
Southern sandstone seems to suffer particularly badly from tickmarking hordes, even more frustrating as its often too soft to feel comfortable cleaning them off!
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It's the proximity to London: the broiling epicentre of twat behaviour.
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I feel like an old man saying it, but i think its a 'wall-bred' climber issue. But as a full-blown, card-carrying London twat, I admit it could just be that too.
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I feel like an old man saying it, but i think its a 'wall-bred' climber issue. But as a full-blown, card-carrying London twat, I admit it could just be that too.
Yep - I'd say more wall-bred than Londoner (I'm in Surrey - much more civilised...).
Seeing ticks on indoor routes is pretty special, though if you need them to find a coloured hold, I imagine having a sandstone coloured jug must require two. :wank:
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as a full-blown, card-carrying London twat
(https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2013-12/enhanced/webdr05/18/9/anigif_enhanced-buzz-24986-1387376051-29.gif?crop=544:360;40,0})
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Instagram post so can't work out how to embed it but this struck me as pretty awful.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BZwMms5lMo6/
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Probably needs a few more there it seems...
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Instagram post so can't work out how to embed it but this struck me as pretty awful.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BZwMms5lMo6/
Especially combined with all the bollocks about "flow."
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Flow doesn't occur randomly at all. She needs a word with professors Froude and Reynolds.
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I snuck around the woods in the Forest of Dean a couple of weeks back to try Labour of Love (https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=183295). Disappointed to see it ticked to pieces. There are a few hard to see footholds under the overlaps, but every hold on the route was ticked! Brushed them off, but didn't have a camera handy.
It's a good, if quirky, route if anyone is down that way. Think Nesscliffe meets valleys sandstone.
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https://vimeo.com/48602839
Dunno how to link it in properly but this needs showing on repeat at every climbing wall.
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Rob Greenwood has added a gallery to UKC for this sort of thing and some of the entries are absolutely vile. I think the worst is the attempted drying of Zippy's with chalk:
https://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=302878
I'm seething.
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:slap:
There's an article due shortly which should help.
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Grim reaper at new mills an absolute disgrace yesterday. A load of foot long arrows presumably drawn by dabbing a chalk ball repeatedly against the rock and in case they still couldn't see the footholds they had underlined all the good edges. Brushed most of it off, hopefully restoring my karma for pulling a hold of bionics wall. :(
Anyone know what happened with the big block that has come of bionics wall? Hopefully no one was climbing it sat the time! Weirdly it seems to have been taken away as it was nowhere in sight.
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I reported this to Punterwatch the other day. The Sugarloaf boulder at Caley. On the side that faces the bridleway. Written in climbing chalk, so obviously done by climbers. Obviously this sort of thing normalises the view that the rock is a canvas for scratching in your initials/marriage proposal or whatever. Incredibly stupid. Fortunately I had a hand brush in the bag and it came off very nicely with some washing.
https://twitter.com/PunterWatchUK/status/1032169573192269825
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Written in climbing chalk, so obviously done by climbers.
Not necessarily, climbers aren't averse to letting lumps of chalk fall out their bucket/bag and not put them back in.
So still, could've been avoided had they not, but would be surprised if it was actually climbers doing the "art".
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Written in climbing chalk, so obviously done by climbers.
Not necessarily, climbers aren't averse to letting lumps of chalk fall out their bucket/bag and not put them back in.
So still, could've been avoided had they not, but would be surprised if it was actually climbers doing the "art".
I'd be amazed if it wasn't climbers.
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Written in climbing chalk, so obviously done by climbers.
Not necessarily, climbers aren't averse to letting lumps of chalk fall out their bucket/bag and not put them back in.
So still, could've been avoided had they not, but would be surprised if it was actually climbers doing the "art".
I'd be amazed if it wasn't climbers.
Something you aren’t telling us Will? ;)
Time for an identity parade.
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There can't be that many Nick and Holls in Yorkshire who have only just started climbing.
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=c1IOfbMqRHA
(Obvs graffiti is bad - v bad - but identity parade reminded me of this :D)
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It could just as easily be non-climbers as climbers. There's often plenty of bits of chalk knocking around that area.
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I'd be surprised if it was climbers.
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Isn't the irony, that it's the local youth copying the fine example set by ourselves?
To that end, the cock-n-balls is entirely appropriate!
I find this sort of thing far less offensive than the self indulgent visual litter that we ought to know better not to leave.
Hope it works out for Nick & Holls. Sounds far more promising than "RIP Maddy's condom" would suggest, which is nicely preserved in permanent marker on the bars in my local park ;)
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https://www.instagram.com/p/BnE1yVqggzW/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1m682asz7om70
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#dickhead
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I sent them a message on Instagram suggesting why it might not be a good idea to do/post stuff like that. I don't think they took it very seriously.
Reply was: "Luv u 2"
:wank:
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looks damp as well #wetrockaction
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Small is Beautiful at Burbage was a state the other day. Caked all the way up and topped with massive donkey lines. Photo doesn't really do it justice:
(https://image.ibb.co/joj0tA/IMG-7551.jpg)
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:o
F*ck me.
Its not like all the holds are bleeding obvious on that thing anyway.
Grrrrrr :wank:
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Next level moronic happenings at my local bouldering area:
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1946/44721281855_79eaf3c866_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2b8Sg2H)laramade2 (https://flic.kr/p/2b8Sg2H) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1910/31762821798_d11d9bdc20_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/QoLLjA)laramade3 (https://flic.kr/p/QoLLjA) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
and presumably in case you can't find the way down:
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1946/45584537832_92439f783a_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2cs9EXs)laramade1 (https://flic.kr/p/2cs9EXs) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
Fortunately the spray paint doesn't seem too permanent - looks as though it'll come off with some brushing with water and detergent but still...
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Next level moronic happenings at my local bouldering area:
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1946/44721281855_79eaf3c866_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2b8Sg2H)laramade2 (https://flic.kr/p/2b8Sg2H) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1910/31762821798_d11d9bdc20_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/QoLLjA)laramade3 (https://flic.kr/p/QoLLjA) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
and presumably in case you can't find the way down:
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1946/45584537832_92439f783a_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2cs9EXs)laramade1 (https://flic.kr/p/2cs9EXs) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
Fortunately the spray paint doesn't seem too permanent - looks as though it'll come off with some brushing with water and detergent but still...
Glad you took the photo's Steve, worth saying these dots are spread across all the boulders in this sector.
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Next level moronic happenings at my local bouldering area:
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1946/44721281855_79eaf3c866_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2b8Sg2H)laramade2 (https://flic.kr/p/2b8Sg2H) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1910/31762821798_d11d9bdc20_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/QoLLjA)laramade3 (https://flic.kr/p/QoLLjA) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
and presumably in case you can't find the way down:
(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1946/45584537832_92439f783a_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2cs9EXs)laramade1 (https://flic.kr/p/2cs9EXs) by Steve Ram (https://www.flickr.com/photos/167729159@N03/), on Flickr
Fortunately the spray paint doesn't seem too permanent - looks as though it'll come off with some brushing with water and detergent but still...
What are they for?
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Not really sure, initial guess is that they were sprayed on to show a large group of kids or similar where to try and climb up and where to get down. Definitely 'climbing' related anyway.
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Not a donkey line, but a line of donkeys. And then they pretend to be surprised when bouldering areas are closing due to access issues. If it was my lawn, I would just call the police.
(https://i.imgur.com/hs7aZ7D.jpg)
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Need a bit of context for that one. It's the wagon thingy, but what are the restrictions on pad parties / send train bellends?
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Shawn Raboutou posted this is November last year (https://www.instagram.com/p/BqxIuxaBg83/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_mid=XC4RZgABAAGKuEeHz60QFMBZHTjk):
"I want to mention that there are access issues. You can not try this game from April through October due to the land owner wanting to conserve the grass for his animals. Please be respectful and discreet because it's private land."
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It's on private land. The owner want to use the grass below the boulder for grazing in the summer. It's used to park farm equipment.
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If that is the idea of being discreet and respectful...
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Not a donkey line, but a line of donkeys. And then they pretend to be surprised when bouldering areas are closing due to access issues. If it was my lawn, I would just call the police.
(https://i.imgur.com/hs7aZ7D.jpg)
Team America world police
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Looks like there are a few proper wads there too, who really should know better.......
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On his solo of Fitz Roy, Jim Reynolds "dabbed chalk on key holds in the hope of spotting them on the way down and built cairns to aid route finding"
Ticked up to the eyeballs by all accounts. Absolute disgrace if you ask me, and surely the most egregious happening in Patagonia since the Compressor Route was established.
Karma:
"The descent proved far slower, forcing Reynolds to downclimb wet, technical slabs in the dark by headlamp, where he discovered that his tickmarks had been washed away."
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Don't you just love it when your semi secret traverse you've been trying has been splattered in rookie Stripes and all the footholds marked with fat chalk ball prints. Not so secret anymore I guess.
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That’s disappointing to hear KC. Is it on limestone or something more porous like sand or gritstone? On limestone which I’ve recently started to enjoy, I find a soft brush works wonders for cleaning off chalk. Have you tried the Lapis ones? I find normal toothbrushes a bit inferior
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That’s disappointing to hear KC. Is it on limestone or something more porous like sand or gritstone? On limestone which I’ve recently started to enjoy, I find a soft brush works wonders for cleaning off chalk. Have you tried the Lapis ones? I find normal toothbrushes a bit inferior
Too obvious.
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Don't you just love it when your semi secret traverse you've been trying has been splattered in rookie Stripes and all the footholds marked with fat chalk ball prints. Not so secret anymore I guess.
You can tell us where it is now ;)
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That’s disappointing to hear KC. Is it on limestone or something more porous like sand or gritstone? On limestone which I’ve recently started to enjoy, I find a soft brush works wonders for cleaning off chalk. Have you tried the Lapis ones? I find normal toothbrushes a bit inferior
Too obvious.
I’m not sure I get what you’re saying WFT? What’s too obvious?
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That’s disappointing to hear KC. Is it on limestone or something more porous like sand or gritstone? On limestone which I’ve recently started to enjoy, I find a soft brush works wonders for cleaning off chalk. Have you tried the Lapis ones? I find normal toothbrushes a bit inferior
Too obvious.
I’m not sure I get what you’re saying WFT? What’s too obvious?
That you work for Lapisdan
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I must admit I do find ukb a very strange forum, a bit unfriendly even. When is it acceptable to make a comment about a toothbrush?
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If its any consolation I thought the snark you received just now was totally uncalled for. One the whole it is a friendly place but you seem to be posting constructively and have twice received digs you didn't deserve. I hope you persevere.
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Don't you just love it when your semi secret traverse you've been trying has been splattered in rookie Stripes and all the footholds marked with fat chalk ball prints. Not so secret anymore I guess.
You can tell us where it is now ;)
This season's premier Peak lime crag. The chalk ball prints are a bit of an eyesore to be honest
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Don't you just love it when your semi secret traverse you've been trying has been splattered in rookie Stripes and all the footholds marked with fat chalk ball prints. Not so secret anymore I guess.
You can tell us where it is now ;)
This season's premier Peak lime crag. The chalk ball prints are a bit of an eyesore to be honest
The Billy No-mates Trav? I'm keen for that, need some tarp though or the mud must mean you need a dws style bag of shoes. Shame about the chalk ball prints, is this an attempt at drying or marking the feet?
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I’m guessing they get damp from condensation low down. Looks a good traverse though, good effort to he-who must-not-be-named for making the effort, hopefully the worst of the chalk is cleaned up before long
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Thanks Andy. Is this still about toothbrushes? Can I get ‘in’ on the joke?
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If its any consolation I thought the snark you received just now was totally uncalled for. One the whole it is a friendly place but you seem to be posting constructively and have twice received digs you didn't deserve. I hope you persevere.
Definite odour of faux naïf from a lot of the posts though.... his contributions to some of these threads give me Louis-Theroux-interviewing-a-rotter flashbacks.
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I’m not a massive Louis Theroux fan Moose, and I hope I wouldn’t be tricked by his slippery questioning. I’n much more of a ‘Jeremy Clarkson’ man myself.I’m not sure what this has to do with any posts or overuse of magnesium carbonate though? Or don’t you think it’s important to clean the rock?
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Definite odour of faux naïf from a lot of the posts though.... his contributions to some of these threads give me Louis-Theroux-interviewing-a-rotter flashbacks.
He's definitely Dan Cheetham or somebody doing an impersonation of Dan Cheetham trying to impersonate somebody else :P
Click his name and click on 'show posts'. A disproportionate number of his posts contain Cheetham's much-loved style of question, rhetorical or otherwise.
Is it not ok to ask questions on ukb?..
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What Pete said. I was suckered to begin with, now I'm just bored. The site has been way better recently, don't feed the troll...
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Don't you just love it when your semi secret traverse you've been trying has been splattered in rookie Stripes and all the footholds marked with fat chalk ball prints. Not so secret anymore I guess.
I assume this was me. I went after work one evening and it was piss wet with condensation so had to dry every hold with a chalk ball/sock combo. Went back on a dry day and agree its an eye sore as the rock is black limestone there and the white stands out. Next time I'm down I'll be sure to spend my resting tine cleaning the excess chalk.
I'm surprised someone has been trying it though. As there were a lot of holds lose that I pulled off and unchalked. I thought I was the only one to have tried it. I've stabalised a couple of holds with glue too now.
Maybe we are talking about different traverses though.
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Fair enough, it will clean off.
A couple of years ago I went from the starting jug of drawbridge to no mud and from no mud to tripe. Best go was to the drop down move a couple of meters right of no mud. I only briefly looked at the next section as I was more interested in linking what I'd done first. The rock quality goes a bit shit after morhens till motorhead.
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I’ve tried toilet paper in this situation, but it’s generally clarted the holds up and looks unsightly. Anyway sorry for any offence caused by this suggestion. You’re* right, the site has been an excellent read recently. 👍
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I'm sure any mistaken identity between Dan and JCorbot can be cleared up by a mod looking at both their IP addresses.
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Did you hear the joke about the prince discovering ‘fuck off charlie’ written in the snow outside the palace? Will Carlin’s urine and princess Di’s hand writing.
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Eeek! (sorry is a UKC picture..)
https://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/dbpage.php?id=338082
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Is that Mossatrocity? Damn, looks like its had the Hueco treatment
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Yep, from eth other side
https://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/dbpage.php?id=338083
:wall:
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:wank:
Chalkball used to poff the area of damp rock completely in an attempt to dry it out??
Fucktards.
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Sweet Jesus!!!!
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Fuck me there are some idiotic people about. The weird thing is you never actually see people doing this. It's like they're more interested in painting the rock than climbing....
In fact, are we witnessing the beginning of a strange new sport of 'rock painting'?
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You don't see them loading it on like this because;
1) Most people can figure out connies and not bother going to a crag that will be damp in the first place.
2) Those that do take 1 look and go elsewhere.
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I think it’s bad at the moment as there is a lot of pent up desire to get out as the connies have been so shit. And if the connies are marginal people are making the call to dry and try stuff because they are separate. If it were more sunny and crisp people wouldn’t be so desparete!
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desparete!
If that's not a problem name it should be.
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Burbage South, 7b
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thought it was familiar.
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desparete!
If that's not a problem name it should be.
Classic Dawes innit:
http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/8-burbage-south-edge/boulders/205-desparete-the-rib/problems/836-desparete#.XhY0Juynw0M (http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/8-burbage-south-edge/boulders/205-desparete-the-rib/problems/836-desparete#.XhY0Juynw0M)
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thought it was familiar.
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Every single hold ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MI38fmR7Lg&feature=emb_logo
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And if they can get away with gangsta rap that crass and n***a this n***a that full, well I'm going all out on the soundtrack of my next video, will make 666 sound like Brian Eno.
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Those tick marks are outrageous and the choice of music seems a really bad fit.
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Absolutely awful - the ticks and the “music”
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Music-wise, it's only Drake, Rick Ross, and Nas. As mainstream as you get really. Good viddy.
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Every single hold on every single problem :o
Ive never seen anything like it. Everyone has used the odd dot but that is unreal.
Do we know if the climber has sight issues and we're all having a pop at a semi blind guy :shrug:
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Do we know if the climber has sight issues and we're all having a pop at a semi blind guy :shrug:
Happened at the wall recently. Inner voice tutting and silently judging, and the guy turns around and asks "what colour hold is that, I only have 20% vision" :)
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The light at our local wall is so shit, that I'm usually that guy.
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https://youtu.be/tDmAI5sZBXM
The second boulder clip.
Not only donkey tick marks
Ridiculous over-caffeinated sugary drink company drinking
To top it off that fucking pointless kt tape.
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was very much hoping to put this in BoYD because of the outrageous scenes of the attempt that he blew on the topout, but it seems the actual one was clean. The tick marks though....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axNfsOKvBiA
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Those are gross. Such an eyesore and also seem fairly necessary as the move doesn't even look all that blind? :/
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Those are gross. Such an eyesore
We are talking about the socks, right?
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Now now, leave hadyn alone...
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Now now, leave hadyn alone...
Is this the f*cking sock wearers union or something? :D
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The absolute state of this boulder.
I found the excessive 'dude' chant riling too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeuwTRIZgNM
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Came here to post this ^^ dreadful
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Those are "pew pew" lazerbeams around the Death Star.
Agree it's a bit shit.
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Some feckin' eegits have been making a mess at Frodsham. Hideous tick-marks and big arrows pointing out footholds on the traverse of Cinema Screen buttress. :chair:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CALM0M5D6Cp/
I've had a go at cleaning it up but need a water spray to finish the job without scrubbing too vigorously on the soft sandstone
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https://www.climbing.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=82267&t=22056
next level.
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Saw this on my Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/p/CHNUTCKhT0r/?igshid=g89zu2jurjo3
Not the worst offence but doesn't exactly encourage good behaviour from people who aren't aware of bouldering.
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(https://i.ibb.co/JFBCBRz/IMG-0839.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vvwDwxJ)
(https://i.ibb.co/xHbxGTR/IMG-0841.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KwgT7v3)
(https://i.ibb.co/6w3KmTs/IMG-0840.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QQ2WfTm)
Guess it's difficult to know where to put your feet on three pocket wall..... ::)
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Chalking footholds :wall: :wall: :wall:
Dartmoor footholds are covered these days
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Welcome to Colorado...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrPwaOtEGeU
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0:38 is a particularly good one, given that how high the climber's eyes are they can actually see the damn hold!
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Why use one outrageously long tick mark then two or three will make an even more obnoxious eyesore?
Also, what are the odds on any attempt being made to remove the shameful ticks once finished?
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Starts with 5 min of driving to the crag and close-ups of sponsored items before climbing at my favourite bouldering area in Japan. Lots of strong climbing happening, but someone should tell them that the tick marks are not OK. The worsts I have seen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lm3i9LIo6N4
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That video just makes me sad. I love seeing them climb, but.. the tick marks, the seperately packaged slices, the non-sit-starts :(
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https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/baslow_edge-20/bob_moss-645579#photos&gid=1&pid=1
A beauty here, along with the photos and problem aesthetics.
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Righto i am going try again.
Does this thread actually help STOP people putting excessive amounts of chalk on rock?
Is this thread a tribal " look at them, they are awful. We are great" kind of thing?
Would our time be better spent actually gently educating climbers on a preferred approach?
Just a thought.
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Not everything has to be tailored towards optimally persuading people who are behaving badly to improve their behaviour, some things can just be about an expression of frustration.
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I understand the frustration but i worry this is simply an echo chamber that in the end achieves little but the ridicule of {i suspect} inexperienced climbers.
It just feels a lot like bullying to me.
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No one mentioned those huge ticks on floatin, the new v16? Or are they ok on big numbers?
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It just feels a lot like bullying to me.
It's more mockery than bullying.
TBH, don't want to get called out on dabs or daft tickmarks?? Don't put fucking footage / pictures on the internet. And if you don't know that "the ground isn't in" or that the ethics and behaviour guidelines in almost all bouldering guides to "brush off excess chalk" also apply to you, then don't put your fucking footage up either.
Adam: I think there were at least two shots in that footage showing the holds without tickmarks, implying they got washed off or brushed off at some points. Also they weren't that OTT by the standards of some modern tickmarking.
Edit: Start of Session 4 and Session 9, you can see the holds un-ticked. I was actually going to call this one out but did glimpse the unticked holds.
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I mostly use this thread as a threat of consequences for certain people I know who I could name and shame if they returned to their reprehensible ways
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No one mentioned those huge ticks on floatin, the new v16? Or are they ok on big numbers?
Someone must educate the new generation of Japanese inner-city wads about tick-marks. I have tried to leave polite comments on videos, but I doubt it helps. Mateusz Haladaj once got up a 9a in Santa Linya he had already done with a spray bottle and a brush to clean up some ridiculous tick-marks a Japanese climber had left after dogging the route and then told him that this is unacceptable in Europe. Maybe that helped...
I fear that this is one of the situations when the hierarchical structure of the Japanese society works agains them as Koyamada-sama seem to be very free with his chalk painting.
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Not everything has to be tailored towards optimally persuading people who are behaving badly to improve their behaviour, some things can just be about an expression of frustration.
:agree: Can’t believe it’s got to be said. I can’t speak for anyone else but I don’t feel like the 40 seconds a month I spend clicking on this thread and thinking “hoo that’s bad one” massively eats into the the time or pool of energy I have available for being an advocate for good crag behaviour :ang:.
The most recent example’s of someone who’s needlessly drawn a 60cm line of chalk on the rock with what appears to be a loop-the-loop in the middle. It’s not a hate crime to find that ridiculous.
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I mostly use this thread as a threat of consequences for certain people I know who I could name and shame if they returned to their reprehensible ways
Mob rule? and a little bit heavy handed maybe?
Fiend, i get your point but perhaps the youth/insta gang don't read the Not so small print in their glossy guide advising on the agreed ethics re chalk.
As for dabs, why do you care if they take the tick? they are cheating themselves Not you. the fact that is posted/published on-line only means its recorded for ALL to see.
i think it diminishes us to mock them for it.
jwi, I approve of your direct but subtle approach and perhaps you are right and it has little affect but i apricate you trying.
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I mostly use this thread as a threat of consequences for certain people I know who I could name and shame if they returned to their reprehensible ways
Mob rule? and a little bit heavy handed maybe?
Fiend, i get your point but perhaps the youth/insta gang don't read the Not so small print in their glossy guide advising on the agreed ethics re chalk.
As for dabs, why do you care if they take the tick? they are cheating themselves Not you. the fact that is posted/published on-line only means its recorded for ALL to see.
i think it diminishes us to mock them for it.
jwi, I approve of your direct but subtle approach and perhaps you are right and it has little affect but i apricate you trying.
Tbh it's a joke, and taken as such :)
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Is this thread a tribal " look at them, they are awful. We are great" kind of thing?
Yes.
UK outdoor hobbies are all about tribalism.
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It just feels a lot like bullying to me.
Have you ever been bullied?
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It just feels a lot like bullying to me.
Have you ever been bullied?
Yes, yes i have. as a child and as an adult but for my eternal shame i have also bullied.
my hope is i can steer people away from that pain in all its forms.
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Okay, I’m sorry that’s happened, you know the weight of the word then.
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It just feels a lot like bullying to me.
Okay. I was thinking about this on one of my many tedious kneehab walks around the moors, and I hope I've remember my counterpoint accurately.
I think there are a few key defining features to bullying:
1. Specific individual targeted
- i.e. it's a person, or a group, targeting one particular individual constantly and relentlessly.
2. No justifiable reason
- i.e. although there might be something about the target that the bullies are picking on, it's not a issue which would generally be regarded as justifying any negative response.
3. Subject matter not promoted by target
- i.e. whatever issue the bullies are picking on / using for justification, whilst it might be something publicly known about the target, it's not something that the target actively seeks to promote nor publicise, they're not seeking to draw attention to it.
With regards to Tickmark Hall Of Shame / Bring Out Your Dabs:
1. Specific individual targeted??
No - it's never relentlessly targeting one person, it's about anyone and everyone who demonstrates the behaviour in question, big or small, famous or irrelevant, one-off or repeat offender. Generally the target isn't even named nor given any context, it's just "a climber who did this".
2. No justifiable reaon??
No - the reasons might be very small in the global scheme of things, but they are actual reasons in terms of negative behaviour (excessive marking of rock with chalk / falsely claiming success on a problem with assistance) that could warrant a negative response (even as gentle as "please brush that off" or "maybe try that without walking along the pads").
3. Subject matter not promoted by target??
No - the behaviour is clearly visible in images / videos that are readily available on public social media, with no attempt to keep them hidden for "friends and family", and often promoted by the poster (and the level of mockery on here is sometimes in direct correlation to how heavily they are promoted).
IF the situation was different....Say the following example: A climber with a particular sketchy style puts a series of unlisted videos of him climbing on youtube, and in most videos he's slapping un-necessarily. Someone digs hard, finds these videos, and each time posts about them, mocking that one individual - then THAT would be more like bullying. Targeting one individual, mocking something that isn't generally negative, and finding stuff that the target isn't trying to show off.
That's my 0:02. Sorry yes it was a long boring walk.
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On that subject, the classic three criteria are hurting someone in a manner which is repetitive, which is intentional and where there is an imbalance of power.
This site has loads of useful information, https://anti-bullyingalliance.org.uk/
including free online training, just register https://learning.anti-bullyingalliance.org.uk/
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No one mentioned those huge ticks on floatin, the new v16? Or are they ok on big numbers?
I did actually, but that was shut down.
My point was that fingers point where they find it easy to point - and look for excuses to do so.
What isn't helpful, is that a lot of the shaming is about wanting someone else to feel crap/lower/beneath, and nothing to do with wanting people to be more aware.
A lot of bullying is about excluding people, and Scragrock's comments should be thought about seriously, in my opinion. I do hate tick marks though!
"I understand the frustration but i worry this is simply an echo chamber that in the end achieves little but the ridicule of {i suspect} inexperienced climbers." - which is why (reflecting on Jwi's comments too) - it's good to try to appeal to more experienced/prolific climbers to show the way.
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I don't actually have a huge objection to the odd tick mark here and there, especially on things that are absolutely on someones limit and the hold really hard/awkward to see/hit. So long as they are brushed off afterwards. I think they only deserve a place in this thread when they are just totally un-necessary and overly large/blatant
I have a much bigger problem with people chalking footholds for no apparent reason. Its just like they haven't really thought though the physics of what they're doing and why they're doing it.
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Sometimes I put tick marks on things when it's useful, as I reckon we all do, and that's fine as long as you brush em off after
Also sometimes when I am putting a little smudge on say, the foothold I intend to use, I also think of this thread and laugh. A bit of light hearted joshing ain't bullying.
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Sometimes I put tick marks on things when it's useful, as I reckon we all do, and that's fine as long as you brush em off after
Also sometimes when I am putting a little smudge on say, the foothold I intend to use, I also think of this thread and laugh. A bit of light hearted joshing ain't bullying.
That's how things get re-interpreted though, isn't it? Scragrock makes a really important point.
I think you can post up Donkey Lines ;) and really make it clear how much you find it bloody annoying - and it is, and in a lot of cases just unthoughtful/inconsiderate - but it can very easily become something irrational/tribal, he/she is one of us, this bunch of bells aren't.
That's why those operating at higher levels don't get criticised as much, because we want to be in the Wads' group.
Looking at the photos from the last of Bob Moss, I see it as a symptom of everyone wanting to get out there to grab their FAs - emulating the insta-heros. Unearthing that problem has required removing a lot of moss.
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Morning Folks
Fiend, i really do appreciate the time and thought you put into things and thanks for the clear definitions. I hope the walks weren't without there upsides and the steep incline back to full fitness shallows quickly and easily.
To make it plain, i said it Felt like bullying but i am open to persuasion on this and i will certainly take the time to fully absorb the points you and others have made.
Some more thoughts-
Perhaps a better way to view it might be to bring out yer own dabs, then show the clean ascent or to show clips of brushing off your own ticks after use.
With this in mind if someone{Niall} were to post up a satirical vid of himself pretending to excessively tick and dab, i would like many of his commentary on climbing culture, laugh and carry on but with a positive reference for self awareness and change in the future.
I also think this might have a larger impact on change in the wider climbing community rather than just a poke at folks behaviour on an out of the way forum in a minority sports website.
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The BMC Respect the Rock thing might be a suitable vehicle for that, especially if featuring younger rock stars and plastered all over ukc. (The video, not donkey lines).
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Big donkey(s) at 1:20:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVfYWZVGEbY
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Saw this block in the dabs thread with someone doing the shite looking traverse under the back of the roof. Had a look at this amazing looking prow though and...
https://vimeo.com/123302767
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Saw this block in the dabs thread with someone doing the shite looking traverse under the back of the roof. Had a look at this amazing looking prow though and...
https://vimeo.com/123302767
He didn't even use half of them!
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He didn't even use half of them!
TBF: they may not have been his.
Awesome problem
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They may not have been, but if you look at his comments below on Vimeo, it’s the video of his first ascent.
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Can you chalk it for me so I can see it better? ta
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-5BHBt-hOm9o/YyBVkJm7c5I/AAAAAAAAAHQ/CWS5H9pdyvAuINtvwvdU6SiOdlOUd4sZwCNcBGAsYHQ/s1600/1663063434612879-0.png)
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Disgusting evidence of Colorado ticking:
https://youtu.be/xu7V23rJ9qs?t=61
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Can you chalk it for me so I can see it better? ta
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-5BHBt-hOm9o/YyBVkJm7c5I/AAAAAAAAAHQ/CWS5H9pdyvAuINtvwvdU6SiOdlOUd4sZwCNcBGAsYHQ/s1600/1663063434612879-0.png)
To be fair, the porthole has looked like that for 10 years
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Having seen the Colorado vid is there a man bun / fringe management hall of shame?
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Disgusting evidence of Colorado ticking:
https://youtu.be/xu7V23rJ9qs?t=61
We call this Rocky Mountain tick disease
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I quite like that he gets every hold static and casually so the tickmarks aren't even needed.
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I get the feeling they may not have been his.
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No words ...
https://www.instagram.com/p/CrJt5mPuE2q/?fbclid=IwAR2bGKICvUuQB9cXBlznyH6wcHZj_yjePp3ZXf3tMSVSjqN5JWPNJhkguBY
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No words ...
https://www.instagram.com/p/CrJt5mPuE2q/?fbclid=IwAR2bGKICvUuQB9cXBlznyH6wcHZj_yjePp3ZXf3tMSVSjqN5JWPNJhkguBY
The connies are in
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I didn't know that Christo and Jeanne-Claude climb