UKBouldering.com

the shizzle => bouldering => Topic started by: Sloper on November 23, 2014, 08:21:23 pm

Title: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Sloper on November 23, 2014, 08:21:23 pm
Right bouldering grades only.

I have managed 6a @ 46 beat that you  :shag:s

For the mathematically able it would alos be interesting to see how the graph has changed shape over time: I suspect 30 years ago the peak would be about 30+ and now it's probably <25
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: joel182 on November 23, 2014, 11:33:53 pm
Klem Loskot, Zunami (http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67733) 8C at 38

Fred Nicole, Le Boa (http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=64179) 8C at 41
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tc on November 24, 2014, 05:40:57 pm
The older I get the better I was.  ;)
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Oldmanmatt on November 24, 2014, 09:54:00 pm

The older I get the better I was.  ;)
+1

And I'm going to get was even better.

It is the inalienable right of all ageing Gits to have been waaay better bitd, than all these upstart, wussy, half hearts; who clearly just benefit from standing on the shoulders of my generation and what's more.........



God, I feel old lately.


Fricken demoralising, watching all these kids getting stronger and stronger as I get creakier and creakier.

Uplifting and rewarding on one hand.

Major bummer on the other.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on November 24, 2014, 10:00:56 pm
Yeah but you get much better at being injured as you get older... ;)
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Nibile on November 25, 2014, 07:26:17 am
Nothing to do with climbing, but I can tell that physically I've never been as strong as I am now. Or was before knee surgery...
So, I imagine that with some time and dedication, to get ze feel of ze rock, I could climb the hardest now.
 :shrug: :tumble:
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Sasquatch on November 25, 2014, 06:29:06 pm
I did my first v13 at 37,  and hoping to keep progressing....   :jab:

Matt Birch is in Bishop working Lucid Dreaming for the winter.  It's reasonably likely he'll send that which would be v15 at close to 40.....  We'll have to wait and see.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Doylo on November 25, 2014, 07:00:04 pm
I did my first v13 at 37,  and hoping to keep progressing....   :jab:

Matt Birch is in Bishop working Lucid Dreaming for the winter.  It's reasonably likely he'll send that which would be v15 at close to 40.....  We'll have to wait and see.

Wasn't he going to Give it v13 before it was done? Yorkshire grades
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on November 25, 2014, 07:27:01 pm

I did my first v13 at 37,  and hoping to keep progressing....   :jab:

Matt Birch is in Bishop working Lucid Dreaming for the winter.  It's reasonably likely he'll send that which would be v15 at close to 40.....  We'll have to wait and see.

Matt must be well over 40.. Was at Leeds same time as me.. 43? Nice bloke - only met him a couple of times then...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: SA Chris on November 25, 2014, 08:23:56 pm
I'm pretty sure none of the original dark horses are the right side of 40
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: davej on November 25, 2014, 08:29:03 pm
I used to bump into Matt at rubicon 25+ years ago way strong!
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Sasquatch on November 25, 2014, 09:06:42 pm
I figured he was over 40, but didn't really know so didn't want to project to elderly....
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: AndyR on November 25, 2014, 09:48:22 pm
I figured he was over 40, but didn't really know so didn't want to project to elderly....
I went to Uni with him - he's 43 +/- 1
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Nibile on November 26, 2014, 02:50:10 pm
Sometimes I think "Had I known what I know now, in terms of training, eating, etc, ten or fifteen years ago, when I could have actually a lot more time to climb, I would have climbed 8a and 8b a lot sooner, etc".
Then I think that the lack of knowledge in the first (ten or fifteen) years of my climbing, is my luck.
I've overtrained for years and years on end, putting in a lot of effort for little rewards, but this allowed me to: 1) tolerate silly amounts of training; 2) get mentally strong to bear the grind.
So, instead of having the knowledge to peak at, say 28/34 years, I have now the knowledge to peak at 43 and onwards.
Of course I could have peaked at 25 and then remained solid until now, but we'll never know this. What I know is that I live in the present, and at present I'm at the peak of my physical abilities, so who cares about what could have been in the past if...?
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Sasquatch on November 26, 2014, 05:27:33 pm
Completely agreed Nibs.  I love to hear about older crushers as it means I realistically (ha) plan to continue improving for many years to come.  Next years goal is 5.14a and another 8B, and I'll see if I can get a sport letter grade every 2 years, which will put me at 5.14B at 40, 5.14c at 42, 5.14d at 44, and 5.15 at 46. The bouldering improvement may be harder to come by, but considering I still can't do a 1-armer or a front lever, there's loads of room for strength improvements, so maybe it will come.

I see no reason this can't happen :)  (lots for why it won't, but I'll just stick my head in the sand and continue dreaming)
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: a dense loner on November 26, 2014, 07:02:57 pm
Ben Moon did voyager sit 8B+ when he was 40.

And of course I agree with the two beasts that have posted before me.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Offwidth on November 27, 2014, 06:46:12 pm
I love to hear about older crushers

I suspect I've come close to crushing several spotters being almost transuranic weight wise for a boulderer of my height, daftly keen and long term pretty shit. Yet if people are claiming 6a in their 40s there is amazingly hope for me yet to escape bottom scraping performances, unless we are talking actual 6a sandbags in Font.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on November 27, 2014, 06:57:04 pm
I've moved up from 6C to 7C (well one.. ;) ) from 40-45...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Monolith on November 27, 2014, 07:08:31 pm
Great thread. Of strong interest to an ailing and ageing cudda been like myself.

Lee Anderson and Lorenzo Frusteri are two of my greatest heroes.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Nibile on November 27, 2014, 08:04:57 pm
Great thread. Of strong interest to an ailing and ageing cudda been like myself.

Lee Anderson and Lorenzo Frusteri are two of my greatest heroes.
;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tc on November 27, 2014, 10:19:26 pm
Two 7Cs in 2013 at the age of 55 is my proud boast. Still training hard when time and motivation allow (and more gently when they are lacking), trying to avoid injury and hoping to get there again this winter.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Mike Tyson on November 27, 2014, 10:40:25 pm
Victory will be ours mate! (Hopefully!)
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Monolith on November 27, 2014, 11:16:00 pm
Two 7Cs in 2013 at the age of 55 is my proud boast. Still training hard when time and motivation allow (and more gently when they are lacking), trying to avoid injury and hoping to get there again this winter.

Beast Tim! That's what an early days schooling at The Breck sets you up for!
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tc on November 28, 2014, 10:49:25 am
Ah, the Breck...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: heelhookofglory on December 31, 2014, 02:30:24 pm
A genuinely inspiring thread, great to see.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: IS2 on January 02, 2015, 11:32:18 am
Just turned 64 and very cross that conditions stopped me doing 7a on my last visit to the forest. Will be back!!! Think my sport climbing trips may be having a detrimental effect on the boulders.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Pebblespanker on January 05, 2015, 10:34:39 am
Just before Xmas found out that a recent upgrade of a local traverse problem meant I had actually completed my first ever 7A aged 50 in 2013 after many sessions working it over the preceeding couple of years.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Nibile on January 05, 2015, 10:40:05 am
 :dance1:
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on January 06, 2015, 09:20:57 am
Eternal youth:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/the-secret-of-eternal-youth-skintight-lycra-and-a-bicycle-9959058.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/the-secret-of-eternal-youth-skintight-lycra-and-a-bicycle-9959058.html)

Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: duncan on January 06, 2015, 11:27:44 am
Nice to see this study getting into the news. I kept bumping into the participants a couple of years ago and they were a picture of vibrant good health. Cycling's equivalents of Jim Donini (http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/2189032/Jim-Donini-man-or-myth).

It doesn't of course, contrary to the suggestion in the article, prove that exercise slows the ageing process. Survival bias and all that...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tc on January 06, 2015, 11:56:48 am
Top tip: ditch the osteopath or physio who tells you to stop trying to climb hard stuff so you don't get injured and find a like-minded soul ( in my case a shit-hot remedial masseur who is still into his biking) of a similar age who has a similar attitude to pushing the decrepit old body to the absolute limit and can fix you when the inevitable injuries occur.
Oh, and spending a larger proportion of your disposable income on anti-inflammatory than recreational drugs and more time on the treatment table than the pub  is perfectly normal at 55+...unfortunately.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: rodma on January 06, 2015, 12:37:34 pm
Top tip: ditch the osteopath or physio who tells you to stop trying to climb hard stuff

 :agree:

this is exactly my problem with the over educated "health" professionals

they say "fingers aren't built to take dynamic loads in the first place and at your age, etc. etc. etc................."

all i hear is "blah, blah, blah", whilst visualising achieving that elusive one-arm flick on the campus board  ;D
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: petejh on January 06, 2015, 12:41:16 pm
Eternal youth:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/the-secret-of-eternal-youth-skintight-lycra-and-a-bicycle-9959058.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/the-secret-of-eternal-youth-skintight-lycra-and-a-bicycle-9959058.html)

Maybe the study's partcipants just cycled at really really high speed and everybody else aged a tiny bit more quickly, relatively. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation)
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on January 06, 2015, 01:18:35 pm
Eternal youth:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/the-secret-of-eternal-youth-skintight-lycra-and-a-bicycle-9959058.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/the-secret-of-eternal-youth-skintight-lycra-and-a-bicycle-9959058.html)

Maybe the study's partcipants just cycled at really really high speed and everybody else aged a tiny bit more quickly, relatively. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation)

:D reminds of of catch22 (I think) where one of the characters trys to be as bored as possible all the time, as time passes slower when you're bored...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Falling Down on January 06, 2015, 08:04:21 pm
Top tip: ditch the osteopath or physio who tells you to stop trying to climb hard stuff so you don't get injured and find a like-minded soul ( in my case a shit-hot remedial masseur who is still into his biking) of a similar age who has a similar attitude to pushing the decrepit old body to the absolute limit and can fix you when the inevitable injuries occur.


This definately.  Mark Twight is great on this topic.... Just keep pushing as most health professionals have no idea about athletics.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Sloper on January 06, 2015, 08:14:38 pm
And most sportsman have fuck all knowledge of physiology / health.

'just tape it up' JFC how many of us have said that?

Do you remember the grisly ripping sound from my shoulder that day at Stanage?

Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on January 06, 2015, 08:17:57 pm
Top tip: ditch the osteopath or physio who tells you to stop trying to climb hard stuff so you don't get injured and find a like-minded soul ( in my case a shit-hot remedial masseur who is still into his biking) of a similar age who has a similar attitude to pushing the decrepit old body to the absolute limit and can fix you when the inevitable injuries occur.


This definately.  Mark Twight is great on this topic.... Just keep pushing as most health professionals have no idea about athletics.

The osteo/physio I am seeing said it was OK to start climbing as long as I didn't fall off, and because climbing doesnt involve driving or pushing hard down with the feet (things that compress the spine).... I chose not to correct him (at £40 per half hour I tend to be in receive rather than transmit) but have not chosen to follow this bit of advice ;) Sounds like campusing is OK though :/
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: a dense loner on January 06, 2015, 09:22:52 pm
You've got to look at it from their point of view tho, you don't push down hard with your feet. They've seen cliffhanger. Not falling off is the best thing you can do, just bimble or dead hang for a while. Don't campus at all
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on January 06, 2015, 09:27:15 pm
Yes - he doesn't get climbing... Still he seems to be helping. Might try some gentle traversing at the wall later on this week..
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Falling Down on January 06, 2015, 09:28:51 pm
Do you remember the grisly ripping sound from my shoulder that day at Stanage?

I do, you didn't make a fuss either.  I had no idea it was as bad as it was at the time. 

As always take my comments with a bucket of salt.  There's pushing it and there's listening to physios who normally treat office workers and golfers.....
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: nik at work on January 06, 2015, 09:29:15 pm
OT (more bad backs than elderly benchmarks) but when I tweaked my lower back lifting heavy things I found dead hanging on a fingerboard with added weight hung off a climbing harness quite effective at stretching out and easing my back pain. Obviously this is totally anecdotal and there is no reason to believe that not doing this would have meant a slower recovery ( or faster for that matter...) and I'm sure any passing physios would be horrified...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Falling Down on January 06, 2015, 09:31:10 pm
TC is right though, find someone who at least has an appreciation of what it is we're all doing... 
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: nai on January 06, 2015, 09:53:20 pm
OT (more bad backs than elderly benchmarks) but when I tweaked my lower back lifting heavy things I found dead hanging on a fingerboard with added weight hung off a climbing harness quite effective at stretching out and easing my back pain. Obviously this is totally anecdotal and there is no reason to believe that not doing this would have meant a slower recovery ( or faster for that matter...) and I'm sure any passing physios would be horrified...

when my back went recently I tried deadhanging after 10 days or so when it was slightly improved and ended up back at square one.  If I have recurrence I will follow your advice and try adding weight  :)
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: IS2 on January 06, 2015, 10:18:22 pm
Key benchmarks for climbing in one's old age may also include:

Minimise injuries.... Probs no more than one a year and no big ones.
Effectively deal with injuries.... Treat and rehab as quickly as possible.

Being very old I've had and dealt with many injuries. I have tried several physio s and the quality varied massively. None of them initially, had a clue what stresses climbers put on their bodies. To be fair I was the first climber most had met. Everyone of them, over a twenty year period, has advised me to stop climbing as being the best solution. Perhaps this is standard advice for all sports injuries.



Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on January 06, 2015, 10:26:28 pm

OT (more bad backs than elderly benchmarks) but when I tweaked my lower back lifting heavy things I found dead hanging on a fingerboard with added weight hung off a climbing harness quite effective at stretching out and easing my back pain. Obviously this is totally anecdotal and there is no reason to believe that not doing this would have meant a slower recovery ( or faster for that matter...) and I'm sure any passing physios would be horrified...

when my back went recently I tried deadhanging after 10 days or so when it was slightly improved and ended up back at square one.  If I have recurrence I will follow your advice and try adding weight  :)

Inversion chairs and hanging from legs etc.. Are treatments for lower back pain... I did a load of dead hangs over the weekend... Can't say they did much either way :-/
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Mike Tyson on January 06, 2015, 10:40:49 pm
TC is right though... 

The only rule I follow in my climbing life  :weakbench:
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Sloper on January 07, 2015, 08:03:52 pm
Do you remember the grisly ripping sound from my shoulder that day at Stanage?

I do, you didn't make a fuss either.  I had no idea it was as bad as it was at the time. 

As always take my comments with a bucket of salt.  There's pushing it and there's listening to physios who normally treat office workers and golfers.....

Yes, it wasn't until a bit later that the damage became apparent, the physio and gp missed it, the surgeon didn't. My view is (with the benefit of hindsight and accumulated injuries and age) is be far more conservative than the people treating you, it may delay hitting your stride by a bit but if you do have something latent it will prevent a far worse injury that takes far longer to recover from.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Rocksteady on January 08, 2015, 02:45:39 pm
My dad did a couple of V7s last year and a V8, aged 61-2. He's been steadily improving since taking up climbing again aged 56. More into sport though, he's going for his first 8a this year.

His trick is (a) being weirdly strong (b) not doing too much in any one training session. He's more into doing individual hard moves on his board than doing whole problems. Seems to work.

Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: BobbyBear on January 09, 2015, 02:30:35 pm
Having only started bouldering 6 months ago (at 40) I've found progress has been good on plastic. But fear of falls without a spotter and technique/finger strength are the limiting factors outside. The power is there I just need to strip some fat and continue to push my flexibility (Plus grow a pair for crux moves). For me the affect on performance when feeling warm and light can be worth a grade indoors. Just attempting V0s at Pex and the Breck make plastic grades seem like a stroll. It's great inspiration to realise I've plenty of years of improvement ahead. Providing I don't fall on my head.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on January 09, 2015, 02:46:48 pm
Having only started bouldering 6 months ago (at 40) I've found progress has been good on plastic. But fear of falls without a spotter and technique/finger strength are the limiting factors outside. The power is there I just need to strip some fat and continue to push my flexibility (Plus grow a pair for crux moves). For me the affect on performance when feeling warm and light can be worth a grade indoors. Just attempting V0s at Pex and the Breck make plastic grades seem like a stroll. It's great inspiration to realise I've plenty of years of improvement ahead. Providing I don't fall on my head.

Take yer time though... muscles grow in weeks/months, tendons take months/years...
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Mike Tyson on January 09, 2015, 09:06:50 pm
Good luck BobbyBear. TC was schooled at the Breck and Pex, check his achievements out.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Duma on June 25, 2020, 02:38:16 pm
Thread resurrection!
Shaun and Brookes mum:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSGFzcuiQr4

Also Martin Keller"s FA of Ninja Skills sit (8C/+) must be of note, or is 39 not considered old enough?
https://youtu.be/FUd8M3Dsdo0
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: T_B on June 25, 2020, 03:05:05 pm
Font 8a at age 56 is very impressive. I wonder if she’s stronger than her comp days?
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Coops_13 on June 25, 2020, 03:23:51 pm
Font 8a at age 56 is very impressive. I wonder if she’s stronger than her comp days?
Think it's actually V12 and the mellow chaps haven't quite got their grade conversion right - even more impressive!
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Nibile on June 25, 2020, 03:39:09 pm
Yeah right, but what has she done on plastic?
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: Bradders on June 25, 2020, 03:55:36 pm
Font 8a at age 56 is very impressive. I wonder if she’s stronger than her comp days?
Think it's actually V12 and the mellow chaps haven't quite got their grade conversion right - even more impressive!

Glad they seem to have dropped the nonsense B grade thing at least.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: galpinos on June 26, 2020, 07:26:23 am
Font 8a at age 56 is very impressive. I wonder if she’s stronger than her comp days?

She climbed her first 8c at 49 having climbing her first 8b+ at 30 so safe to say she didn't rest on her laurels!
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: gme on June 26, 2020, 07:47:30 am
Is this a new level for her. I think she’s been climbing this hard for ages.
Impressive either way but more so if your still improving at 56, especially improving from what was a high level anyway.
I am always more impressed with old people doing hard stuff than teenagers. Everything going against you with age where as it’s all pretty easy when your a teenager.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: sherlock on June 26, 2020, 08:26:58 am
 56? Old people?
Bastard.
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: tomtom on June 26, 2020, 08:42:24 am
56? Old people?
Bastard.

Is that  - bastard, I'm not quite 56 so can't be included in the benchmarks for the elderly or bastard, I'm 56 or older and don't consider myself elderly :)

Asking for a friend. Obvs :D
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: sherlock on June 26, 2020, 04:17:50 pm
Well, I'm nearly 60 don't consider myself elderly but might be considered a bastard. HTH
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: gme on June 26, 2020, 04:36:46 pm
Did we ever agree what the benchmarks for the elderly are?

40- 9b and 8C? (guessing Fred and others)
50- 9A and 8B? (8A+ in video above so guess an 8Bs been done)
60- 8b+ and ?
70- ??
Title: Re: benchmarks for the elderly part deux
Post by: sdm on June 26, 2020, 07:41:53 pm
No idea what they've climbed recently but I expect Jacky Godoffe and Jo Montchaussée must be contenders for some of the hardest boulder problems by someone in their 60s and 70s.
SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2024, SimplePortal