UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => chuffing => Topic started by: duncan on September 01, 2011, 09:47:44 am
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After the Comici in July I’m compiling my bucket list of similar routes to keep me syked during the next few months of bouldering walls and occasional day-trips to Swanage.
Inclusion criteria are great climbs of ~8 pitches or longer with minimal death potential. I'm not keen on freezing in a storm or being hit by lumps of rock or ice and crevassed approaches void my BMC insurance (http://www.thebmc.co.uk/modules/insurance/Policies.aspx#rock) (plug for sponsors). BHAGs could stretch as far as E6 trad. and 7b-ish sport. Routes should be mostly free, a little sneaky cheating is acceptable.
I have in mind things like the Rabada-Navarro (http://bristolriche.wordpress.com/2007/11/05/rabbada-navarro-route-naranjo-de-bulnes/) on Naranjo de Bulnes or The Scenic Cruise (http://www.mountainproject.com/v/the-scenic-cruise/105756778.). Routes that might make it into a less Franco-centric version of the Parois du Legend books: Europe (http://www.vagabondsdelaverticale.com/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-parois-d-europe.html) and the Rest of the World (http://www.vagabondsdelaverticale.com/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-parois-du-monde.html) (16 in total so far, since you ask). Don Quixote (http://www.planetmountain.com/english/rock/dolomites/itineraries/scheda.php?lang=eng&id_itinerario=372&id_tipologia=38) is on the list (a bit of glacier on the descent but no need for axe, crampons or crevasse stuff) but Elixier d’Astaroth (http://www.planetmountain.com/english/rock/routes/itineraries/scheda.php?id_itinerario=320&lang=eng&id_tipologia=38) is not (weather and crevasses).
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I doubt that there are many more knowledgable than you on these sort of routes but I'll throw in Pat Littlejohn's original E4 route on Kjerrag, Lotus Flower Tower, various in Verdon and Rainbow Bridge.
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Can't recommend Naranjo highly enough, it fits the bill perfectly - not only Rabada-Navarro but also Murciana (7a/A0 or 7c+/8a). If not the Capucin then how about West Face of the Blatiere? Brown/Whillans is one of the best routes I've ever done: period. Of the harder stuff Fidel Fiasco was class. The front slab on the Peigne is also very good, though obvious and probably too popular.
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Would something like Oceano Irrazionale on the Asteroidi, Mello fit the bill?
http://www.planetfear.com/articles/Oceano_Irrazionale_510.html (http://www.planetfear.com/articles/Oceano_Irrazionale_510.html)
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Can't recommend Naranjo highly enough, it fits the bill perfectly - not only Rabada-Navarro but also Murciana (7a/A0 or 7c+/8a). If not the Capucin then how about West Face of the Blatiere? Brown/Whillans is one of the best routes I've ever done: period. Of the harder stuff Fidel Fiasco was class. The front slab on the Peigne is also very good, though obvious and probably too popular.
I 2nd all of these suggestions!
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Don Quixote (http://www.planetmountain.com/english/rock/dolomites/itineraries/scheda.php?lang=eng&id_itinerario=372&id_tipologia=38) is on the list
A bit easy for the standards you're talking about, surely? Vinatzer-Messner perhaps?
If sport routes can qualify, Wassersymphonie (http://www.bergsteigen.at/pic/pdf/530_Topo_c07741a5-1750-4053-8c6e-486532de8325_wassersymphonie.pdf) in the Berchtesgaden Alps is supposed to be a classic, little known outside the German speaking world. 15 ptiches total, crux 6c+, half a dozen pitches around 6b. (Disclaimer: my experience of this route consists of having read the guidebook and looked at it from the road. It is firmly on my "some day but not yet" list. Along with the V-M)
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Grand Wall and Freeway in Squamish. Storpillaren, Lofoten, Norway.
Have done the first - amazing but maybe a bit easy for you. Have done the "lite" version of the second - the full fat version would be right up your street! E5 (ish) and AWESOME!
Would love to do the last!
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That link gives an interesting list
Rest of the World (http://www.vagabondsdelaverticale.com/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-parois-du-monde.html)
You into a USA road trip? Loads of long trad (or semi-bolted long routes) with no snow, lots of different rock types, and often minmal walk in! Probably all a bit obvious but:
Rostrum (Yosemite), Moonlight Buttress (Zion), Levitation 29 (Red Rocks), Fine Jade (Moab - only ~4 pitches), Naked Edge at Eldorado.
Stuff that might involve a bit of snow but nothing serious: Positive Vibrations/Sun Spot (Incredible Hulk, East Side), them famous lines on The Diamond (yellow wall?)...
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I thought the final list at the bottom of this thread looked pretty good:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=394615&v=1 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=394615&v=1)
Edited due to not having read the original post. I've been looking for that Parois du Legends list since I saw the book in Cham, thanks for that.
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Thanks all, some great suggestions already. Several people have apologised for including "easy" stuff. Don't! I bet the VI+ on Don Quixote feels plenty hard enough after the 18 pitches to get there.
Can't recommend Naranjo highly enough, it fits the bill perfectly - not only Rabada-Navarro but also Murciana (7a/A0 or 7c+/8a).
Andy, I was hoping you'd reply. Naranjo has been in my sights since some pals did the first Brit. ascent of the R-N in 1978. Tentatively next summer... Any idea how much aid the the Murciana needs at 7a?
Pat Littlejohn's original E4 route on Kjerrag,
Good idea, it's an amazing place, but I had a very bad experience with a BASE jumper wiping-out at Kjerrag and it would probably be too painful to go back there. Other Norway suggestions are emphatically encouraged.
<edit> Storpillaren added to the list!
and Rainbow Bridge.
I was interested to read your blog on DWS. I've never partaken and I'm pretty confident I'd be terrified. I really should address this.
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Can't recommend Naranjo highly enough, it fits the bill perfectly - not only Rabada-Navarro but also Murciana (7a/A0 or 7c+/8a).
Andy, I was hoping you'd reply. Naranjo has been in my sights since some pals did the first Brit. ascent of the R-N in 1978. Tentatively next summer... Any idea how much aid the the Murciana needs at 7a?
It really is a remarkable piece of stone. Its a along time ago but perhaps 40ft of bolt ladder (actually a slightly spooky golo ladder when Nick and I did it, hopefully its been beefed up now). The 7a is a complete guess to be honest. Didn't do the R-N, but did do the excellent Amistad Con El Diable (about E2 I think) on the superb East Face, everything here looks brill but not quite give you the length you're looking for.
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A Croatian friend left me a guidebook to Paklenica; at around 350m the routes on Anica Kuk (http://www.summitpost.org/ani-a-kuk-712-mtrs/531557/c-159830) might fit the bill.
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If sport routes can qualify, Wassersymphonie (http://www.bergsteigen.at/pic/pdf/530_Topo_c07741a5-1750-4053-8c6e-486532de8325_wassersymphonie.pdf) in the Berchtesgaden Alps is supposed to be a classic, little known outside the German speaking world. 15 ptiches total, crux 6c+, half a dozen pitches around 6b. (Disclaimer: my experience of this route consists of having read the guidebook and looked at it from the road. It is firmly on my "some day but not yet" list. Along with the V-M)
Sport-routes are definitely 'in', this looks very good, and not one of the usual suspects.
(http://www.mountain-maniacs.at/wp-content/themes/mm6/timthumb.php?src=http://www.mountain-maniacs.at/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/SAM_0138.jpg&w=580&zc=1)
Would something like Oceano Irrazionale on the Asteroidi, Mello fit the bill?
http://www.planetfear.com/articles/Oceano_Irrazionale_510.html (http://www.planetfear.com/articles/Oceano_Irrazionale_510.html)
It would fit the bill very well indeed. I know nothing about the Mello, any other suggestions? It sounds like it could be a (non-climbing) family-friendly venue which would be a bonus.
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Reading this is even more exciting than updating my 8a nu scorecard :bounce:
If you need a partner Duncan...
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If sport routes can qualify, Wassersymphonie (http://www.bergsteigen.at/pic/pdf/530_Topo_c07741a5-1750-4053-8c6e-486532de8325_wassersymphonie.pdf) in the Berchtesgaden Alps
Wow (the thread name is genius too).
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I know nothing about the Mello, any other suggestions? It sounds like it could be a (non-climbing) family-friendly venue which would be a bonus.
Lots of good stuff there. I've only been the once and mainly done stuff a bit easier than that such as Luna Nascente (about E2 and great fun) and the West Face of Pico Luigi Amadeus (which is a big old walk in but great fun at E2ish/14ish pitches). This had some harder stuff on it as well. Well worth taking a look at Solo Granito (http://www.cordee.co.uk/CCE334.php (http://www.cordee.co.uk/CCE334.php)) if you're passing a shop that stocks it... It seems to be pretty comprehensive for the area.
The stuff in the Mello valley itself are pretty accessible and would suit a family holiday (N.B. I have no kids!) but some of the bigger things in the valleys off it may require a bit of logistics.
P.S. Brilliant thread!
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The stuff in the Mello valley itself are pretty accessible and would suit a family holiday (N.B. I have no kids!) but some of the bigger things in the valleys off it may require a bit of logistics.
I'd agree on the accessibility but not on the rest, its a beautiful place but there's not a lot to keep a family and kids entertained (ps I also have no kids either) unless they just want to wander about. I thought Solo Granito was great until I had to use it. I found much more comprehensive hand drawn topos online via google which actually showed when pitches downclimb.
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Kids schmids... I thought they entertained themselves!
True about the usability of the guide, but I thought it was great for building the psyche!
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interested in sport routes too?
if so i'd seriously consider wendenstocke.
amazing destination, vertical céuse-like climbing on bombproof limestone in an alpine setting.
it has a reputation of a tough place for a few reasons that i'd state below but if you are sensible enough to keep a reasonable margin grade-wise, pick the right routes and know when to retreat instead of going for the top at all costs, it is not overly dangerous.
and there's shitloads of quality stuff close by.
what to be careful about :
-runouts. Guidebooks usually give you a mandatory grade. Well let's say you pick a 6c mandatory grade in the wenden...it means that falling on a 6b pitch is very likely to cause you an injury, How serious depends on the route. And don't hope to be able to put in lots of additional protections, the nature of the rock makes for very few placements and most of them are poor (flared pockets)
-walk-down. It can be dangerous if you are very tired, it is mostly a steep hike but in some points it is very exposed and in case of a fall you won't stop.
-weather. All the lose rock is concentrated on ledges at the top of the cliffs. If it rains hard (and it does, often in the late afternoon after a sunny day...) and on the wrong spot in the wall, those cobbles might try to hit you. It also makes the walk-down too slippery and unsecure, which means that in case of weather turning bad you need to make a quick decision, abseil as fast as you can, and get shelter under some overhanging section at the base of the wall.
-grades. believe the hard pitches of your route, not the easier ones. sandbags...
-rescue access. Hard, sometimes virtually impossible. In case of shit, you'd better be able to handle the situation by yourself.
virtually all routes are supposed to be five stars, i've only been on voie du frère and nachtexpress and was very impressed, especially by the second.
A few routes are said to be more forgiving than the rest : patent ochsner, millenium, sonnenkonig, voie du frere (which only has a tricky 1st pitch requiring the ability to find the exact spot where a #3 camalot will fit securely)
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Good thread.
I've heard good reports about the Naranjo. Verdon is an excellent option if you want somewhere easy to get to, zero walk-ins and the option of doing a mix of long multi-pitch routes and short sports routes.
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how about West Face of the Blatiere? Brown/Whillans is one of the best routes I've ever done: period. Of the harder stuff Fidel Fiasco was class.
West Face of the Blattiere is a good bit of rock - no crevasses to cross, just a snow slope
there's a few routes with crux pitches in the e2/3/4 range plus some easier ones
the longer ones are 12 pitches or so - decent by abseil, so no carrying big shoes
it's a good place to learn to get fast on bigger routes - if you get your first route done quickly, then you can jump on the next one
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Grand Wall and Freeway in Squamish. Storpillaren, Lofoten, Norway.
Have done the first - amazing but maybe a bit easy for you. Have done the "lite" version of the second - the full fat version would be right up your street! E5 (ish) and AWESOME!
Would love to do the last!
I probably should have said at the outset that North America is my specialist climbing subject. I was a refugee from Thatcherism there for a while and have done many of the obvious classics. I've done far less in Europe, trips to the Verdon in distant times and one to the Dolomites, so the non-mainstream suggestions like Anića Kuk are great
(http://www.summitpost.org/images/original/203754.jpg)
(http://www.summitpost.org/images/original/38579.jpg)
(I am slightly concerned that it seems to be the place where legendary Slovenian hard-men / nutters like Franc Knez (http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=sl&u=http://sl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franc_Knez&ei=Ao5gTrfPO5K88gOs-7njDw&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CCgQ7gEwAQ&prev=/search%3Fq%3DFranc%2BKnez%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3Dx24%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26prmd%3Divnso) sharpened their teeth!)
interested in sport routes too?
if so i'd seriously consider wendenstocke.
amazing destination, vertical céuse-like climbing on bombproof limestone in an alpine setting.
it has a reputation of a tough place <...>
virtually all routes are supposed to be five stars, i've only been on voie du frère and nachtexpress and was very impressed, especially by the second.
A few routes are said to be more forgiving than the rest : patent ochsner, millenium, sonnenkonig, voie du frere (which only has a tricky 1st pitch requiring the ability to find the exact spot where a #3 camalot will fit securely)
Looks fabulous
(http://www.vyskoveprace-dz.sk/images/Wendenstock%20Svajciarsko%20cesta%20Nachtexpress%207a.JPG)
Points taken about having to contend with more than just technical difficulty. What are the approaches/descents like?
It really is a remarkable piece of stone. Its a along time ago but perhaps 40ft of bolt ladder (actually a slightly spooky golo ladder when Nick and I did it, hopefully its been beefed up now). The 7a is a complete guess to be honest. Didn't do the R-N, but did do the excellent Amistad Con El Diable (about E2 I think) on the superb East Face, everything here looks brill but not quite give you the length you're looking for.
The Murciana gets 7a/A0 elsewhere, so what you say sounds about right. It’s good to have some shorter and less committing targets for warm-ups and slightly dodgy weather days.
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If not the Capucin then how about West Face of the Blatiere? Brown/Whillans is one of the best routes I've ever done: period. Of the harder stuff Fidel Fiasco was class. The front slab on the Peigne is also very good, though obvious and probably too popular.
I’ve never been to Cham. Partially on ideological grounds and partially because quite a number of friends all died mountaineering as I was just starting. In particular, a couple of mates bivied at the base of the S Face of the Fou, the kind of rock route I would be tempted by, and were wiped out by a rockfall. So whilst I know there is no real line between rock-climbing in an Alpine environment and proper mountaineering, I’ve tried to draw a line with that slightly flippant reference to crevasses and insurance. More pragmatically, I have limited holiday time and there seems a high chance of spending your precious 10 days watching the rain in the western Alps.
The stuff in the Mello valley itself are pretty accessible and would suit a family holiday (N.B. I have no kids!) but some of the bigger things in the valleys off it may require a bit of logistics.
I’m a beginner with this offspring stuff. The mixed family-plus-climbing-holiday is an idealised concept and may remain so unless the lad shows any interest himself. For another thread perhaps.
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Points taken about having to contend with more than just technical difficulty. What are the approaches/descents like?
short version : in most cases 2hrs to 2hrs 30', but it can be shorter or longer.
overall, if you are fit and have enough mountain experience (it sounds as you have it) usual low-top shoes, walking poles and constant attention will be enough to get to your route safe and with enough energy in the tank to actually climb.
People have made the approach in teva sandals but we are talking of high-end mountaineers and they didn't choose to, they had forgotten their walking shoes at home!
uh i have 3 more route names. (not been on them, they are said to be the best of the best in their grades)
spasspartout. the easiest route (6a max), easiest walk in, still really good they say. The name means "fun for everyone"
excalibur. one of the oldest ones. Semi-trad, very steep (vertical/overhanging), runout/dodgy protection at times, 6c max 6a+ mandatory i think.
caminando. long route (500 meters). 7a max 6c obbl. mostly steep slabs. Supposed to be the best overall route in wenden unless you can affors the really extreme ones.
long version
for most walls the approach involves a "warmup" of about 1 hour on a steep but comfortable trail : this part is the same for every wall and is just a lovely hike.
at this point you have several bifurcations and things get more interesting. You will have to cross one or two small (but steep) snowfields, follow a smaller and less comfortable trail, and finally get on a final section that is a mix of steep grass and smaller rock buttresses where you alternate a few easy climbing moves and bits of walking.
over this last section the good path is usually marked with kairns but you might have to improvise a bit.
This is also where the approaches really differ between a wall and another : in some cases (pfaffenhut) it's just the last 10' and it's a piss easy scramble, in others (reissend nollen) it is 200 meters (in elevation) of welzenbach II/III climbing with minimal walking and tons of exposure. (and of course no fixed ropes)
total times vary between 2hrs and 2h45' depeding largely on the nature of the last bit. (for a climber who would hike to céuse in 1hr and has the required mountain experience. These times do not apply to Chamonix guides nor to Bas Cuvier boulderers)
exceptions to this description are vorbau (a condensated less steep version, only 1h30' but you still have to scramble at the end. locals think of it as a lesser wall, but it still has world-class stuff, it's just in a less exposed position than the rest) and Mahren (3h or more with no real trail, improvising your way up the grassy slope)
At the cost of being repetitive i'll add that even the easier approaches have to be taken seriously as the second half has several exposed spots, where in case of a fall you have relevant chances of starting to slide on the steep grass, gain speed, and finally hitting something (lucky case) or flipping over one of several 10-15 meters walls that the walk in gets around.
In case of wet grass, of course, the odds against you (easier to slide, possible to be hit by a rock flipping down the slope) get so serious that you might want to wait in some cave as i said in the other post.
People have killed themselves on the walk, mostly on the way down for a combination of tiredness, rain and bad luck
on the good side, this approach adds the sense of exposure. walls "feel" quite alot higher and steeper than they really are.
look at this pic series from a friend of mine, some of them give you a feel of what the last bit of the hike looks like (you can see their stuff at the base of the wall). They are from a route on pfaffenhut, the one with the reasonable approach.
http://www.dademaz1.altervista.org/Roccia1/Wenden-Passion/index.html
(http://www.dademaz1.altervista.org/Roccia1/Wenden-Passion/index.html)
(the first time i went, i was rather unfit and didn't take enough water. As a result i've climbed the whole route with leg cramps and the walk down was a true agony. I ended up throwing up 40 minutes after getting to the car and filling my stomach with frozen water from a fountain)
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more walk in pics here (Dom wall)
http://www.dademaz.altervista.org/Roccia/Wenden-Andorra/index.html (http://www.dademaz.altervista.org/Roccia/Wenden-Andorra/index.html)
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the thread name is genius too.
iirc "Long, Hard and Free" was the title of an article by Pete Livesey about his and Ron's early ascent of Astroman.
But I suspect I may be one of rather few people here old enough to remember that. Duncan, can I borrow your sig picture?
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the thread name is genius too.
iirc "Long, Hard and Free" was the title of an article by Pete Livesey about his and Ron's early ascent of Astroman.
But I suspect I may be one of rather few people here old enough to remember that. Duncan, can I borrow your sig picture?
I'm old enough to remember Mountain 79 which had a great article (http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=109579&msg=109579#msg109579) by Mark Hudon.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-xSV9nXj5YCU/TmM5UWbGJPI/AAAAAAAADOw/EhZqB6NUy8M/s640/P1090151.JPG)
(The issue also had Gill Kent on the West Face of El Cap. with Ron, an interview with Bridwell, Leonard Coyne on a new route in the Black Canyon of the Gunninson, and an account of Phil Burke and Tom Proctor on the E. Face of Cerro Torre. All this and Jim Collins on the front cover too)
The Wendenstock sounds superb and a place for a steady team. This gives a flavour:
Iker and Eneko Pou | The Hardest of the Alps # 6 | Climbing Zahir (http://vimeo.com/15594486)
<disapproving noises about sponsors here>
The hanging arete on the left of that feature is Bears on Toast, hand-drilled by some London punter with a Troll caving bolt kit in the late '80s and named after a typo on the menu board in the Longlands cafe in Hathersage.
A must-do!
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the thread name is genius too.
iirc "Long, Hard and Free" was the title of an article by Pete Livesey about his and Ron's early ascent of Astroman.
But I suspect I may be one of rather few people here old enough to remember that. Duncan, can I borrow your sig picture?
I'm old enough to remember Mountain 79 which had a great article (http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=109579&msg=109579#msg109579) by Mark Hudon.
That's the one I was thinking of too, but it's all so long ago the memory is fading and I misremembered it being our Pete (and/ or our Ron)
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btw on my facebook i have this swiss-italian climber who's looking for a belay on zahir (the route on the pou video)
his current staus id something like "desperately looking for a professional belayer, if not too expensive"
:???:
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Wasn't Pete's Astroman article titled 'a short walk with ron'?
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Before I go mad with suggestions, are you considering stuff in Scotland and/or South Africa?
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Before I go mad with suggestions, are you considering stuff in Scotland and/or South Africa?
Feel free to go stark, raving bonkers. I'd consider either. I've spent some time attempting to climb in Scotland but achieved very little... SA is a complete unknown to me.
I'd love to do Big John, the chances of fitness, partner and weather coinciding put it in the highly unlikely category, but that is partly what this thread is for.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-WKI1Q-h_8WE/TffGjjRpCWI/AAAAAAAAADg/88S8d14OQ6I/s1600/st+john%2527s+head+1.jpg)
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Most routes on Table Mountain itself don't quite get up to 8 pitches (although one or two do) , but check out Yellowwood Ampitheatre http://www.climb.co.za/wiki/index.php/Yellowwood_Amphitheatre (http://www.climb.co.za/wiki/index.php/Yellowwood_Amphitheatre) for starters
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Then there's Klein Winterhoek with several routes including Oceans of Fear (you can see the original vid here http://www.steepedge.com/all-films/uk-climbing/oceans-of-fear.html (http://www.steepedge.com/all-films/uk-climbing/oceans-of-fear.html) or Leo doing it in Psyche II)
And the Hex River Ampitheatre http://www.climb.co.za/2010/03/ben-heatlie-free-at-last/ (http://www.climb.co.za/2010/03/ben-heatlie-free-at-last/)
And Milner Peak http://www.alardsbigwallclimbing.com/milner.htm (http://www.alardsbigwallclimbing.com/milner.htm)
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If you've not been to Strone you really should, its totally unique in the UK for quality long free routes. I think gneiss is amazing for long routes, more varied than granite on the small scale but with similarly grand architecture.
Not done loads abroad but you should think again about the Grand Cap - go up the Italian side and you avoid Cham and get a very short walk-in - under an hour, mostly downhill, and the only crevasse big enough to get in is the bergschrund. Certainly sounds a lot less epic getting in and out than some of the non-glaciated options mentioned above, and the surroundings are off the scale spectacular. Perfect, clean, featured golden granite with US style trad - ie lots of pegs and bolted belays/ ab lines.
I can recommend the Lotus Flower - not all of the route is brilliant bit the headwall is every bit as good as it looks, and the whole adventure of flying in and camping 100 miles from a road is incredible.
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Strone / Sron? :)
Elsewhere in Scotland there are a couple of routes on the Main Bastion of the Shelterstone that run to 8 pitches or so and are 3* routes; Haystack E3, Steeple E2, The Needle E1, Stone Bastion E5. Not done them myself, but they look excellent. There are a few on Creag an Dubh Loch too, although most of the harder routes only run to 5 or 6 pitches.
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If you've not been to Strone you really should, its totally unique in the UK for quality long free routes. I think gneiss is amazing for long routes, more varied than granite on the small scale but with similarly grand architecture.
Not done loads abroad but you should think again about the Grand Cap - go up the Italian side and you avoid Cham and get a very short walk-in - under an hour, mostly downhill, and the only crevasse big enough to get in is the bergschrund. Certainly sounds a lot less epic getting in and out than some of the non-glaciated options mentioned above, and the surroundings are off the scale spectacular. Perfect, clean, featured golden granite with US style trad - ie lots of pegs and bolted belays/ ab lines.
I can recommend the Lotus Flower - not all of the route is brilliant bit the headwall is every bit as good as it looks, and the whole adventure of flying in and camping 100 miles from a road is incredible.
Thanks JB. You lot are chipping away at my resolve to steer clear of The Alps. I don't mind epic approaches, they are often part of the whole experience, it's the death potential that concerns me. It's mainly an emotional rather than objective response though.
I'm waiting for IO#2 to move to BC before suggesting we do Lotus Flower Tower.
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I was going to say you shouldn't dismiss the Alps out of hand - the approach to the Blat, for example, could hardly be simpler and the death potential (which would come very largely from stone fall, certainly not crevasses, inescapability etc.) would be no greater than many of the other recommendations that have been made.
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I almost forgot about Blouberg!
http://www.climb.co.za/wiki/index.php/Blouberg (http://www.climb.co.za/wiki/index.php/Blouberg)
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What about the Dolomites, plenty to go at there without glacial ascents (although rock-fall is fairly common).
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Pah. Weather in The Cirque is bad only by North American/ South of France standards. Compared to the average summer weekend on Skye its a fucking picnic.
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Can't recommend Naranjo highly enough, it fits the bill perfectly - not only Rabada-Navarro but also Murciana (7a/A0 or 7c+/8a).
Andy, I was hoping you'd reply. Naranjo has been in my sights since some pals did the first Brit. ascent of the R-N in 1978. Tentatively next summer... Any idea how much aid the the Murciana needs at 7a?
It really is a remarkable piece of stone. Its a along time ago but perhaps 40ft of bolt ladder (actually a slightly spooky golo ladder when Nick and I did it, hopefully its been beefed up now). The 7a is a complete guess to be honest. Didn't do the R-N, but did do the excellent Amistad Con El Diable (about E2 I think) on the superb East Face, everything here looks brill but not quite give you the length you're looking for.
Another rec for Amistad Con El Diable - a really cool route. Quite a few bolts, but we were glad of cams and wires to reduce the runouts. Saw a French guide do it with nothing but 8 quick draws on his rack, running it out for miles!
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I'm waiting for IO#2 to move to BC before suggesting we do Lotus Flower Tower.
Hmmm ... can I refer you to 5:25 - 6:10 in here:
Genius timing - met with Sparky this weekend and we made plans for the Lotus Flower Tower next summer - your name was mentioned - fancy it?
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I did a route called Sternschnuppe in the Berchtesgaden Alps yesterday. Very much Wassersymphonie's little brother: same area, same first ascentionists. Wassersymphonie is 15 pitches, crux UIAA VIII-, predominantly VI/VII. Sternschnuppe 11 pitches, crux VII- (ok, VI+ A0 :whistle:), predominantly V/VI.
And I have to report: a worthwhile day out, but not *that* impressed. The areas is very beautiful but the situation isn't impressive compared to say, the Dolomites or Verdon. "Just" a thousand feet of high quality limestone sitting at the top of a lot more than a thousand feet of wooded hillside (wooded hillside that is more tiring to hike down in the evening than it is to hike up in the morning). The climbing was decent enough, nice solid water-worn limestone, but there was only one pitch that I really thought was "wow". Pitch nine would be a three star HVS in, say, Dovedale, but one three star pitch isn't enough to make a 400 metre route into a classic. Maybe limestone just doesn't lend itself to really classic lines at easy grades. There was certainly plenty of amazing-looking ground to the left and right, taken by much harder routes.
What about the Dolomites, plenty to go at there without glacial ascents (although rock-fall is fairly common).
Erm, his first post said the whole thing was inspired by doing the Comici on the Cima Grande, and mentioned Don Quixote on the Marmolada as one of the next candidates.
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While we're on the subject does anyone have any beta on Vilanova de Meia? Heading there and Riglos in November but don't know anything about the former and little about the latter
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While we're on the subject does anyone have any beta on Vilanova de Meia?
Only to the extent of driving past - it looked very good.
Heading there and Riglos in November but don't know anything about the former and little about the latter
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-vW1SM9oYlnc/Tav32f8g2bI/AAAAAAAACtA/9LfE6cZDybA/s640/P1070916.JPG)
Riglos is great. It's a rather attractive part of Spain and a popular weekend destination with more than just climbers. The birdlife is amazing, especially the Lammergeiers. There is convenience store, bar and refugio. The latter was full of noisy teenagers when we were there. We bivied discretely which seemed to be tolerated. It might be getting chilly in November, it seemed like a September-October or April-May venue on the basis of a single visit in late April.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-nAB1WIDlcpA/Tav58S4E_BI/AAAAAAAACtc/r6YoUXYOTaI/s512/P1070947.JPG)
El Visor with the line of That Route
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-p5jKCC24mxk/Tav8-k5e4GI/AAAAAAAACuA/D5Hzq_iF7to/s512/P1070939.JPG)
Moskitos
The climbing is solid and well-bolted on the well-known routes but looked like it could get quite adventurous rather quickly if you went off-piste. There is a bit of history to the climbing there which I liked (and the polish to with it on easy classics like El Puro - still well worth doing). It must have needed some cojones to climb there when the place was first developed.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-MtsDOrn_-uA/Tav_aQoy1nI/AAAAAAAACuc/nZ7SCbE1M-U/s512/P1070958.JPG)
Old bolts on El Puro
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Just looking at those bolts made my fingers go sweaty.
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"bolts" ???
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OK, lumps of iron mullered into drilled holes then.
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Wasn't Pete's Astroman article titled 'a short walk with ron'?
I t was called "Only the Best Route in the World".
Chris
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A few suggestions, all towards the easier end of your grade range, but all really good. In no particular order:
Dolomites
Cassin Route, Cima Piccolissima (http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=135857). Shorter than the Comici, but still great (and sunny too).
Yellow Edge, Cima Piccola (http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=51360). Didn’t get chance to try this, but it looks wonderful.
Brandler-Hasse? Too hard for me, and probably already on your list.
Bregaglia & Val di Mello
Cassin Route, Piz Badile N Face (http://www.summitpost.org/via-cassin-piz-badile/348571). A “proper” alpine route, but in good conditions there’s little/no snow involved. The N Ridge is a superb warm-up.
Oceano Irrazionale, Val di Mello (http://www.valdimello.it/asp/ShowVia.asp?id={B56E8259-A7E9-44E3-9079-BF83A1C714E6}). Already mentioned.
The Kundalini (http://www.valdimello.it/asp/ShowVia.asp?id={A2A99050-7E33-4D02-A708-CC2FD0D58160})and Luna Nascente (http://www.valdimello.it/asp/ShowVia.asp?id={A573857C-816F-48E9-95C0-2FBDC85B638F}), Val di Mello. The latter has already been mentioned and is fantastic. The former is also great and can be used as an approach to Luna if you’re after a long day out (it finishes not far from the start of Luna).
Ecrins
Rankxerox, Tete d’Aval (http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=70386), Ecrins. An amazing wall, split by a big terrace at half height. The full route is 20-odd pitches and is sustained at 6a/b. A couple of 7a pitches to keep you interested. There are loads of other options on this face too, both harder and easier, bolted and bold.
Desmaison Route, Pic de Bure (http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/54479/fr/pic-de-bure-pilier-e-voie-desmaison). Dolomites-esque and a bit “adventurey”. Pitch two is grim first thing in the morning!
Voie de Maitres, Ailefriode (http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/139134/fr/ailefroide-vallee-dalles-d-ailefroide-la-voie-des-maitres), Ecrins. Friendly. Lots of friction climbing plus occasional steep overlaps. A friend blames this route for his toe tendonitis, but it’s still superb. Cut your toenails!
Voie de Savoyards (http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/54089/fr/aiguille-dibona-voie-des-savoyards) and Visite Obligatoire (http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/54163/fr/aiguille-dibona-visite-obligatoire), Aiguille Dibona. The former is trad-ish (lots of pegs); the latter is basically a sport route (though I’m a wuss and still placed some gear). The Face Sud Classique (http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/55760/fr/aiguille-dibona-face-s-panache-en-5-5) is perhaps too easy, but it’s a great warm-up and one of the most enjoyable routes I’ve ever done. A stunning peak!
Switzerland
Westgrat, Salbitschijen (http://www.summitpost.org/w-ridge/157744). Not done this yet. We did the South Ridge (much easier, but still highly recommended) to warm up and then the weather crapped out. The West Ridge is reputedly one of the best and longest rock ridges in Europe: 30-35 pitches, perfect rock, almost all 5c-6a. Some bolts and pegs, but lots of trad too. The descent is easy later in the year (can be done in trainers), but there will be snow earlier on. One of the most inspiring lines I’ve ever seen, and currently right at the top of my rock climbing wish-list. Endless other options around Salbit too - it's a granite paradise.
SW Wall of the Gross Bielenhorn (http://www.summitpost.org/gross-bielenhorn/155104), Furka Pass. The Niederman-Anderuthi (http://stat.ethz.ch/~dettling/bielenhorn.html) route is superb and there are lots of harder options. Short, easy glacier walk to the start early in the season and you can leave your gear at the start and ab back down to it. The glacier can be a bit manky later in the year.
Graue Wand (http://www.summitpost.org/graue-wand/549399), Furka Pass. Not climbed on this yet, but Eisbrecher is supposed to be great. Cannibal (http://www.8a.nu/gallery/Image.aspx?ImageId=45187) also looks amazing (but it’s much too hard for me).
Cheers.
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...
Yellow Edge, Cima Piccola (http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=51360). Didn’t get chance to try this, but it looks wonderful.
...
Westgrat, Salbitschijen (http://www.summitpost.org/w-ridge/157744). Not done this yet. We did the South Ridge (much easier, but still highly recommended) to warm up and then the weather crapped out. The West Ridge is reputedly one of the best and longest rock ridges in Europe: 30-35 pitches, perfect rock, almost all 5c-6a. Some bolts and pegs, but lots of trad too. The descent is easy later in the year (can be done in trainers), but there will be snow earlier on. One of the most inspiring lines I’ve ever seen, and currently right at the top of my rock climbing wish-list. Endless other options around Salbit too - it's a granite paradise.
Belated thanks for this and for taking the time to put in all the links. I know nothing about the Ecrins, yet another place to explore.
We did The Yellow Edge after the Comici and was not that excited by it. Great views perhaps but we were in a cloud most of the time. The Avon version is much better!
Salbit west ridge has been on the list for a couple of years. When I started climbing, there was an Edelrid rope advert which looked a lot like this, but I only recently realised where it was.
(http://www.afrank.net/Salbitschijen/6065.jpg)
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This? (http://www.planetmountain.com/english/News/shownews1.lasso?l=2&keyid=38584)
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This? (http://www.planetmountain.com/english/News/shownews1.lasso?l=2&keyid=38584)
That's impressive. I might manage the first pitch...
Someone should tell those chaps that Hard, Long and Free is the wrong order. I like the Wild prefix and it sounds as if it was well-earned. SWFLMHMF (Somewhat Wild, Fairly Long, Moderately Hard and Mostly Free) trips off the tongue doesn't it?
I know no-one here asks trite questions like "but what has he done on grit" but if they did (http://www.8a.nu/?IncPage=http%3A//www.8a.nu/scorecard/Search.aspx%3FSearchType%3DASCENTS%26CragName%3DMillstone%26AscentName%3DMaster%252527s+edge%26AscentType%3D0)...
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"but what has he done on grit" but if they did (http://www.8a.nu/?IncPage=http%3A//www.8a.nu/scorecard/Search.aspx%3FSearchType%3DASCENTS%26CragName%3DMillstone%26AscentName%3DMaster%252527s+edge%26AscentType%3D0)...
But Johnny did that one-handed, according to an ongoing thread Over There. True? I find it hard to believe, even of Johnny.
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I might manage the first pitch...
I though that too, until I thought about how much protection somebody who can lead runout 8b is likely to feel he needs on 6a ground, and then remembered how scared I was on the 6a last pitch of La Marche du Temps. (Although the hanging belay on a bolt and a bong had already had its way with my head at that point)
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[I like the Wild prefix and it sounds as if it was well-earned. SWFLMHMF (Somewhat Wild, Fairly Long, Moderately Hard and Mostly Free) trips off the tongue doesn't it?
Thought about the west coast of Ireland at all?
http://wiki.climbing.ie/index.php/Cliffs_Of_Moher (http://wiki.climbing.ie/index.php/Cliffs_Of_Moher) :whistle:
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both routes descriptions share a common scary word - Fowler
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Flicking through the Sardinia guide in preparation of a trip in a month I've just found the perfect route....
Crag : Parete del Donneneittu
Route : H.L.F. (Hard Long & Free) *** (29/30 Sept 1999) 7a+, 6c, 6b+, 6b, 7b, 7a, 6c, 6a
Description includes the following "Striking yellow and grey wall"..."demanding though not too long, sustained throughout and psychologically very comitting"
In fact there are tons of options on Sardinia if its not been suggested already.
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Just found this whilst googling around on my lunchbreak: Gundam e Tatiana (http://stat.ethz.ch/~dettling/valdimello.html), 10 pitch 6c+ sport route in Chiavenna.
Val di Mello style granite slabs but with protection! What could possibly go wrong?
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Without starting a new thread (as I think the people who contributed here are likely to be the best people to answer this question). Does anyone have any suggestions for where to stay in Riglos?
We've stayed at the Refugio but its not possible to cook, and the dinner bed and breakfast option rapidly gets expensive. It'll be fly-drive so taking all the camping gear isn't really an appealling option either.
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Sorry clicked wrong button.
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There is a very small kitchen downstairs in the refuge. Unless they've changed policy since last year you should be able to cook down there, unless it's been taken over by a large group (it is small). You'll have to take your own stove though. Last time I stayed there in January last year (on a weekend) we were the only ones staying there so had the run of the place and a 6 person en-suite room to ourselves for about 15euros a night. I don't think that'll be the case outside mid winter though.
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Hey
I think you can use the Refugio facilities to cook, pretty sure they have a space you can store food and use a stove.
It's probably a good option for the few days it takes to do the main routes there. Dossing out is an option too and there's fresh water fountains in the village, but the weather can be pretty bad.
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Refugio was full of Spanish teens so we stayed here:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-8JxOqDGsw7A/Tav7Rt-gLnI/AAAAAAAACtw/qvlkO8rli8s/s800/P1070992.JPG)
A pair of English lads camped in the old olive terraces near the car park; amazingly this seemed to be tolerated. Everyone else was a day-tripper or had a van.
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I've found somewhere to stay that looks very nice and works out cheaper than the Refugio, and also has a shared Kitchen, I'll report back if its any good but its likely more suited for us as a pair than a few blokes.
We also found an 8 person gite in the town itself that looks great if you were going as a big group.
We're thinking of doing a few of the less well travelled lines whilst there and the guide (useless as it is) suggests some trad gear, but what trad gear? I've climbed there before and haven't immediately got a clue what would be best to supplement the bolts on some of the more trad style lines. As we're flying budget airlines I don't really want to take a tonne of gear that will ultimately be useless.
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With regards to the accomodation we found, it worked out fine for us but that was due to the fact they got the price wrong (didn't stop them trying to 'correct' it the night before we flew), and it was empty whilst we were there.
If it had been busy the shared facilities would never have been large enough and the added (nearly 50%) cost we didn't pay woudln't have been justified.
I've actually written up a quick where/what/how for the darkside, including a list of routes worth ticking off (no. of draws required, free-grade and typical euro pull on anything grade). Topos can be found relatively easily on camp to camp or google image search for the majority of the routes in Riglos and there has just been another guide released (the topos seemed more accurate than the guide I had), it wasn't yet available for sale while we were there. For regular readers of this thread the routes list may or may not be of interest (I'll link when/if its up). There's certainly far more there worth ticking than you'd think.
Somebody let slip to Nat that he though the routes we did over the holiday were harder than the Brandler-hasse (I couldn't have paid for a more timely comment), I was thinking I might now stand a chance of getting her to the Dolomites. Whislt I understand weather in that area is decidedly fickle, when IS the most reliable time to plan a trip?
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Somebody let slip to Nat that he though the routes we did over the holiday were harder than the Brandler-hasse (I couldn't have paid for a more timely comment), I was thinking I might now stand a chance of getting her to the Dolomites. Whislt I understand weather in that area is decidedly fickle, when IS the most reliable time to plan a trip?
Only been the once, but poor weather forecast for the two weeks didn't really hinder climbing almost everyday (although we were on relatively easier routes), when we went in the last two weeks of July last year.
My friend who's been a few times before said that this was unusual for that time of year, with the normal pattern being warm & sunny which led to thunderstorms forming in the afternoons. We didn't have any thunderstorms which I was quite thankful for actually as I didn't fancy being stuck on rock faces with bits of metal dangling from me whilst lighting went off around.
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Somebody let slip to Nat that he though the routes we did over the holiday were harder than the Brandler-hasse (I couldn't have paid for a more timely comment), I was thinking I might now stand a chance of getting her to the Dolomites. Whislt I understand weather in that area is decidedly fickle, when IS the most reliable time to plan a trip?
Only been the once, but poor weather forecast for the two weeks didn't really hinder climbing almost everyday (although we were on relatively easier routes), when we went in the last two weeks of July last year.
My friend who's been a few times before said that this was unusual for that time of year, with the normal pattern being warm & sunny which led to thunderstorms forming in the afternoons. We didn't have any thunderstorms which I was quite thankful for actually as I didn't fancy being stuck on rock faces with bits of metal dangling from me whilst lighting went off around.
According to this:
http://travel-weather.net/italy/cortina-italy-weather.php (http://travel-weather.net/italy/cortina-italy-weather.php)
August drier than July on average and September drier than August. I think, though you should check with others, that later rather than earlier is better for the BH as there is a high snow patch most years that drains down the top pitches whilst it is melting. These pitches aren't as hard as the lower ones, but they sound hard enough and might be a bit of a nightmare if drenched.
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Aren't afternoon thunderstorms an issue midsummer too?
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We're going July 7th to 21st, so I'll let you know how the weather is and, hopefully, how hard the BH is :o
Anyone know of any other Fairly Long, Moderately Hard and Mostly Free warm up routes in the area - E2/E3ish and very, very fun?
Also, we're thinking of driving as we have a mix of bikers (road and MTB) and climbers going. I'm guessing it's not too horrendous a slog from Amsterdam?
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The Comici seems like the obvious choice?
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Ah, yes, forgot the pertinent point - the guy I'm going with has already done the Comici...
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Ah, yes, forgot the pertinent point - the guy I'm going with has already done the Comici...
and his take on the rock quality was? Stu portrays it as a teetering choss pile but other members of the trip suggest it "wasn't that bad"... :devangel:
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Sounds like everybody's first impressions of the Dolomites to me.
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Anyone know of any other Fairly Long, Moderately Hard and Mostly Free warm up routes in the area - E2/E3ish and very, very fun?
The Cassin on the Cima Ovest is very, very good - massive exposure, great climbing, lot of history - felt about E2/3 with a couple of peg pulls on the traverse. The UKC database suggests that it's only a smidge easier than the BH, but I know people who've done both and reckoned the BH was considerably harder.
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Me an El Mocho are hitting the Bugaboos in July. Anyone been? Any tips/ recs?
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Beyonce and co liked it enough to write a song.
Destiny's Child - Bug A Boo (H-town Screwed Mix) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9i-y0G8nNA8#)
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...and his take on the rock quality was? Stu portrays it as a teetering choss pile but other members of the trip suggest it "wasn't that bad"...
The rock on the harder pitches was like the better parts of Swanage or not-so-good parts of Pembroke. It gets a bit worse and is often wet in the top chimneys. E2/3 is about right: the hard bits were not as hard as we anticipated (though the second pitch is a bit rude at 7am) but the easier bits were not as easy as we hoped and it keeps on coming at you.
Finlandia on the Cinque Torri (5 pitches, about E1/2 5c) makes a good warm-up for the Comici. There are probably other possibilities here: it's a good, easy access, non-committing crag to get a feel for the area. Lots of people seem to enjoy the Spigolo Gallo (E1 ish) and it is a great line in magnificent surroundings. The actual climbing is pretty mediocre though.
Tre Cima webcam (http://www.umbriameteo.com/webcam/trecime/)
(http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5343/7215087156_76ef0b10d2_c.jpg)
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Quick summary of climbing the in Bernese Oberland: it's amazing! Up to 700m long routes on Verdon-quality rock with Dolomite-quality (and then some) scenery. The Englehorn, Wellhorn, Titlis and Wendenstock all look fabulous. Hintisberg has some fine 4-6 pitch routes, from 6a (feels like E2) to about 7c with great views of the Eiger, Monch and Jungfrau. Then there are the sport routes on the N.Face of the Eiger...
There are plenty of wet-weather alternatives around Meiringen and Interlaken if the big routes are not in. In particular, Neuhaus and Lehn are great little crags and a good change from generic Euro-lime (are you reading Fiend?)
It is expensive: this is the land of the £600 goretex jacket (http://www.mammut.ch/en/productDetail/101010510_v_2016_M/Nordwand+Jacket+Men.html). Camping just outside Meiringen (http://goo.gl/maps/1nT5) at £15 a night for two people and a car was as good as we found. Camping next to Lehn was £30 for two. Some places refused to even talk to us! There is potential for discreet biviing if you keep away from the valleys. Further details on application.
(http://i.minus.com/jbvXx4t1tyx79j.JPG)
Hintisberg
(http://i.minus.com/jbxMIONhYFohLH.JPG)
Climbing on Hintisberg
(http://i.minus.com/jSIAA2wV0Qhz8.JPG)
Eiger alpenglow from Hintisberg
(http://i.minus.com/jbzbm1dDzEN9NE.JPG)
Wendenstock in the mist
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This looks good but fails spectacularly to meet with the original criteria:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67333 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67333)
...but surely there are other routes nearby that do?
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...but surely there are other routes nearby that do?
Indeed there are. Loads.
Wassersymphonie, mentioned early on in this thread, is a bit further along on the same escarpment. On the Feüerhorndl itsef there are two lots of easier routes including two, Sternschnuppe and Astrofant, that get mentions in guidebooks as easy (UIAA VII-) multiplitch sport classics. I did Sternschnuppe last year though and thought it was v. overrated .
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what time of year is best for a visit?
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The escarpment is north facing, so probably not too desperate in summer unless it's really hot, but not that high (a little over 2,000m at the top) so also ok in spring & autumn. Any time from about May to October should be feasible.
Not far away on the other side of Berchtesgaden is the cold weather alternative: Untersberg / Salzburger Hochthron also has mid-grade multipitch sport climbing but is south facing.
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...and how about Rocher du Midi?
http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67339 (http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67339)
and the Vercors region... any suggestions for either?
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Quick summary of climbing the in Bernese Oberland: it's amazing!
There is potential for discreet biviing if you keep away from the valleys. Further details on application.
Duncan, a mate and I have about 6 days off in 2 weeks. Plan A is NW Scotland / Wales. No planning required - follow the blue patches in the Skye!
Buuut, if it's a total write-off we're considering a last minute fly/drive/camp trip somewhere. Do you reckon the logistics are feasible for a wnedestock/Bernese Oberland type trip? Where do you fly to?
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We flew to Zurich and rented a car there (neither cheap). It's about an hour and a half drive to the climbing areas. Berne would be a little closer but didn't have suitable flights.
An alternative suggested to us was flying to Milan, which is about about 3 hours drive. Flights and car hire tend to be cheaper but you need to factor in the cost of a carnet (40 SF) to drive in Switzerland. This puts you on the south side where you could divert to Mello etc., the south Swiss crags, or even the Dolomites depending on weather. Amazingly, the St Gotthard tunnel is free so you could switch sides of the Alps by the day. I might try this next trip.
The camp site at Gadmen (http://www.camping-gadmen.ch/camping/) looks decent and as cheap as it gets. Camping at Meiringen (http://www.camping-meiringen.ch/de/camping) was very good and reasonably priced by local standards.
Wild camping is about as welcome as in North Wales. Be discreet and stay away from built-up areas.
(http://i.minus.com/jNhgVIgHPxpA8.JPG)
You may find yourself woken quite early though (http://d2.minus.com/1345054516/sluAP-WZ2oZU1R-Ir2f5qA/ibkhuw7jjKfz6M.MOV)...
Some higher crags, like Wendenstock itself, are accessed via toll roads (https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=217095865619056253669.0004c74f99d5eadb1715a&msa=0&ll=46.752947,8.386581&spn=0.008218,0.013797&iwloc=0004c74f9dc5b8d84e765). We, erm, didn't pay too much attention to this and were only challenged once ... shamelessly and successfully playing the dumb foreigner card (comes naturally to me).
(http://i.minus.com/jXHkGJA1xhF5q.JPG)
Guidebooks: The Schweiz Plasir series covers climbing to about F6b. The new 'best of the best of' (http://www.bmcshop.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=6572) looks excellent and has most of the relevant information in English. The Extrem west (http://www.bmcshop.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=357_465_403&products_id=6018), mostly F6b and above, covers this area. This is what we took. It's mostly in German but the approach information and topos are very clear. We wished we had had some information on the Grimsel granite (it's covered in the Plasir guides) or the south side crags.
(http://i.minus.com/jbrf1cDu7Y2lzX.JPG)
Webcam 1 (http://en.swisswebcams.ch/webcam/1292757171-Erzegg-Blick-Richtung-Melchsee-Frutt-%283863-Schwarzenthal%29_Weather)
Webcam 2 (http://en.swisswebcams.ch/webcam/1316000260-Alpen-tower%2C-Meiringen-Hasliberg-%283863-Genthalh%C3%BCtten%29_Weather)
Swiss meteo (http://www.meteocentrale.ch/en/europe/switzerland/weather-gadmen/details/N-3514169/#trend)
Yr.no forecast (http://www.yr.no/place/Switzerland/Bern/Gadmen~2660687/long.html)
Currently looking better than one we had back in July:
(http://i.minus.com/jjcYygO9oSMPX.png)
Bring your Walshes or proper hiking boots for the approach to Wendenstock:
(http://i.minus.com/jTTtgmyruOqlw.JPG)
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Riglos is great. It's a rather attractive part of Spain and a popular weekend destination with more than just climbers. The birdlife is amazing, especially the Lammergeiers. There is convenience store, bar and refugio. The latter was full of noisy teenagers when we were there. We bivied discretely which seemed to be tolerated. It might be getting chilly in November, it seemed like a September-October or April-May venue on the basis of a single visit in late April.
Ok folks,
The weather for the whole of the UK looks gash for next week and a mate and I are off from Tuesday to Sunday (possibly Monday).
We had thought Grindelwald, but the forecast there isn't great either. So, one final option in Riglos.
The long term forecast is sun, sun, sun and sun. 29c on Tuesday but the wind is due to swing Northerly and cool down to 23c, then 21c by a week on Sat (likelihood of accuracy poor I know!).
Do you reckon this will be too hot to climb?
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Hmmm, difficult one.
I certainly wouldn't want to be halfway up anything (or climbing all day) in those upper temps but if you're willing to climb early and/or late you'll probably get away with it. As the climbing is quite obvious and heavily chalked you can move fast.
There are plenty of other (single pitch) options nearby (ish) that would offer respite from the full sun if its just too hot.
Temperatures for the Gorges du Verdon at the same time are ~24'c but there's a lot more shade on offer (the duc for starters). You'll just about get away with staying in the nice camping and eating pizza before it all shuts for the winter (Oct 1) too.
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Do you reckon this will be too hot to climb?
Next week's forecast for Riglos:
scorchio! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuSPdsPWit0#)
Seriously, it's south facing and it'll be hot after mid morning. However, you do FDLB or the Murciana in 3-4 hours and if you got up early enough you could be down in time to swim in the river all afternoon.
Verdon has more shade options and is not quite as hot. Picos and NW Scotland have similarly mixed forecasts. Cortina looks a much better bet than Grindenwald. You've just been there but you've still got the Hasse-Brandler to do IIRC...
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Verdon has more shade options
talking of Verdon and shade, i strongly reccommend Alix Punk de Vergons.
-300 meters
-in the shade until 4pm
-80% of it is brilliant steep juggy climbing on tufas and big pockets. Two nice but nasty slabby 7a's. Surprisingly comfy belays for such a steep wall.
-Although well-bolted, abseiling mid-route past the 3rd pitch is not a good idea. Too overhung and traversing...
-Sustained @ 6c/7a with a couple of harder (7b/+), yet aidable pitches. Very enjoyable for the regular 7a onsighter... Freeclimbing every pitch on your 1st visit should be a nice challenge if you regularly onsight 7b/c.
-single rope and haul line should work a treat.
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Série limitée too.
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So we got pretty lucky!
Arrived in Barcelona and the car said 38c.... SCORCHIO. The forecast was for cooler weather though, so we were hopeful.
Day 1 we got up early and started easy with Moskitos - 180m and about F6b+ (with a pokey crux). Good intro.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-kOM_gkGYRFI/UEO4WupHwLI/AAAAAAAAAUU/AqOpK87AXPY/s640/2012-08-29%252009.01.56.jpg)
Andy below the crux of Moskitos.
Day 2 and after a bit of overnight rain and a cool electric storm we decided to do something in the shade, so went round to the West face of the Pison and did a generally fun and straightforward F6c+ called Tiempos Nuevos, Tiempos Salvajes. The two hard pitches had some tricky cruxes! Andy tried them both first but had to rest. I pulled the ropes and managed to Flash both pitches (just) probably some of the hardest moves we actually did all week. High quality route, 5 pitches with abb-descent (fine with 70m single)
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-CdcoZB8juPo/UEO4WMgqIJI/AAAAAAAAAUI/CK7o3UmaxJc/s853/2012-08-30%252010.48.04.jpg)
Andy on the 6c+ pitch.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-skSEhW0832o/UEO4eWiIacI/AAAAAAAAAU8/JjtNcDjYwKw/s640/2012-08-30%252013.23.01.jpg)
Wild abbing!
Day 3 - finally time to let the guns have their party!
Cold start (17c, almost too cold for shorts and t-shirt in the strong winds that were swirling about), but warmed up later on. Outstanding route. Built to be climbed. Quite varied too with the techy 6c+ pitch low down (but not particularly strenuous) and the the monster jug-pulling 6c+/7a pitch near the top. I got both of this and was pretty spent! Managed to onsight the full bifter though, chuffed!
Oh yeah. LUDICROUS. Hmm. Can't think of much else to say!
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-4cgaHEegrNc/UEO4jEAevdI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/hyiHmgxCqUY/s640/2012-08-31%252007.53.40.jpg)
Andy seconding the lower crux. F6c+ or F7a depending on who you ask/which guide you read.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-DpMRiN17bv4/UEO4oQSN04I/AAAAAAAAAVo/KRw-R3ETzec/s576/2012-08-31%252010.05.14.jpg)
Somewhere steep and high on FDLB.
Day 4. Another early alarm (6am) and another cold start (us pasty Scots don't like climbing in the sun for too long) and we trudged up to have a look at Chinatown (after the previous night's beer fuelled bravado of thinking El Zulu Demente would be a good idea had quickly evaporated with the realisation of stiff shoulders and forearms). We did Pitch 1 -3 as per the guide then got a bit lost-confused-offroute. Probably did some of pitch 4 of Naturaleza Salvajes (Wild Nature) and some of Chinatown, then did Pitch 5+6 of Nat Salv (Fr 6c+ into Fr7a and even steeper than anything Fiesta!) After that we found a way of going straight up and not doing the F7b pitch of Nat Salv. A magical mystery tour of PUMP!
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-0ju-MVVCH6E/UEO4reN2dQI/AAAAAAAAAWE/U0UH1oETfWU/s640/2012-09-01%252011.03.31.jpg)
Andy escaping from the 7b pitch of Naturaleza Salvajes via something around 6c+. By this point we were in "escape mode" as forearms were shot an we didn't really know what route we were on so this was the only pitch of the week that one of us didn't onsight/flash. Still, 90%+ onsighted! Nice.
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Good work boys. Shame your partner is such a punter Ali.
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you needn't have worried about Zulu, its like the jug hauling pitches of Fiesta all the way from the Moskito ledge to the change in angle beneath the top, then there are about 3 moves that bumps it from (probably) 6c to 7b and then you're at the top.
You're right about the angle though, ludicrously steep.
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Good work boys. Shame your partner is such a punter Ali.
I know, I know - I'll need to put in for an upgrade soon.
Joking aside, the harder routes were all together a proper team effort. I think I would've struggled on the crux of Tiempos without the beta he figured out.
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A friend did Perestroika Crack in Kyrgyzstan's Ak-Su valley this summer. 800 m of perfect crack climbing of all sizes from rattly fingers to off width on pristine rock, never harder than 7b and most of the pitches in the 6th grade. Must fit the original bill perfect?
I googled for some pics and it doesn't look shit. The political situations seems, on the other hand, seems to be far from perfect.
(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3102/2549447370_e9d718efcc_z.jpg?zz=1) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/27279547@N04/2549447370/)
Perestroika Crack (http://www.flickr.com/photos/27279547@N04/2549447370/#) by Štrankl (http://www.flickr.com/people/27279547@N04/), on Flickr
(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3584/3817287805_ba59d02a54_o.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mammutphoto/3817287805/)
Perestroika Crack (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mammutphoto/3817287805/#) by mammutphoto (http://www.flickr.com/people/mammutphoto/), on Flickr
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Grimer went with a British crew about ten years ago, looked like a great place with lots of cultural 'interest'.
In other news, I can happily confirm the Bugaboos fit the criteria of this thread better than anywhere else I've been: brilliant place. Everything from Diff to E4+, 6-30 pitches on immaculate granite. Mellow approaches by alpine standards, most cross glaciers but we never felt the need top rope up and they can be done in approach shoes if necessary, although light walking boots are more enjoyable.
~5 hours drive from Calgary, ~10 hours from Vancouver. Walk-in to the campsite is about 3 hours heavily laden, less if you stay at the hut. From the campsite the base of the routes are between 20 mins and 4 hours away, with other camping/ bivvy options under the furthest.
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Everyone seems to love Bugaboos, must go there sometime!
(Utah desert legend Alf told me not to bring any food up there, just take left-overs from w/e-warriors)
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any web-worthy snap shots Johnny?
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In other news, I can happily confirm the Bugaboos fit the criteria of this thread better than anywhere else I've been: brilliant place. Everything from Diff to E4+, 6-30 pitches on immaculate granite.
It's been on my list I was told about it by some Canmore locals when climbing in Skaha - still trying to convince the lass that Vancouver should be our new home...
That and the Lotus Flower Tower.
So much good rock in the world, and so little time to climb it...
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I'd rate the Lotus Flower as better than any of the routes we did in the Bugs (its a lot like a souped up version of the Beckey-Chouinard). On the other hand the Bugs are a lot cheaper to get to, have better weather, and offer a much greater variety of routes on quality clean rock. 80% of the rock in the Cirque of the Unclimbables is covered in a luxurious 2" quilt of lichen.
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Just got back from 6 weeks big-walling in Kyrgyzstan, I'll stick a small amount of info and some photos up here to try and get other Brits psyched to go out there - seems like Americans, Germans, and Russians have the most info on the place, we were the second british team in the last decade or something!
So the Karavshin area is about 45km walk from the nearest road in Vorukh, you will need to hire donkeys. There's a company called Ak Sai who if you pay them lots of money will actually sort you out a plane from Bishkek to Batken and then a helicopter to the valley, we didn't want to do that so we got taxis for the entire length of kyrgyzstan and then got Ak Sai to sort out our donkeys, which didn't work so we ended up hiring them off the local garrison. I digress, essentially the point is either you need someone who speaks Russian well enough to haggle with taxi drivers or you need to pay Ak Sai lots of money.
When you get there, there are are two valleys, Ak-Su and Kara-Su. Ak-Su has the Perestroika Crack which everyone does (7b and normally climbed over 3 days, there are two big ledges to sleep on apparently), and Kara Su has Yellow Wall, home to Diagonal Route on Yellow Wall, which, again, everybody does (one pitch of 7a, the rest is much easier I believe, and usually climbed in a day). We didn't do either of those routes though, mainly because everybody does them and we wanted to be a bit different.
Peak 4810 is the most hellishly impressive mountain-suitable-for-rock-climbing I have ever seen, here is a picture: (sorry it's FB)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/533770_10151100837341225_1433408746_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/533770_10151100837341225_1433408746_n.jpg)
It's about 1200m vertically, takes about 3.5 hours to walk in from base camp with heavy bags and the last bit is up a nasty bit of glacier, I actually ended up leading the fucking-terrifying first pitch (F7a slab climbing protected entirely by RPs and pitons I placed on lead, I am never doing anything like that again ever) to get out of carrying one of the haul bags up the glacier. It faces NW so gets the sun in the afternoons, this means that every morning there is a fairly serious build up of ice on the inside of your portaledge. It would be possible to climb it without portaledges as there are a few good ledges but you would need to move VERY fast and be pretty confident - we packed 6 days worth of food and 8 days worth of water, but right from the beginning we rationed ourselves as much as we could which was just as well as we were on the wall for 10 days. All the routes on the NW face were put up as aid routes in the late 80s and 90s, the first ones were mainly winning entries in the USSR climbing championships. I have no idea about aid climbing and even less about Russian grades (they all got the maximum Russian grade of 6B), but I would say that you do not want to have to aid the first pitch - it would involve copperheads or drilling bolts!
Ok so we did the Mirror Route:
http://mountains.tos.ru/kopylov/pict/g8.gif (http://mountains.tos.ru/kopylov/pict/g8.gif)
We did it entirely free in 40 pitches at about 7b+. The first pitch was absolutely terrifying, there was one other very run-out 7a-ish slab but the rest wasn't too awful (mainly good-but-sometimes-spaced protection and climbing in the 6s), with two well protected pitches of 7b and one of 7b+ (these crux pitches were all absolutely superb on immaculate rock):
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/487606_10151242088259595_1040962822_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/487606_10151242088259595_1040962822_n.jpg)
We did need to take crampons for the summit ridge sadly, I now have a deep seated hatred of rock with snow on it.
We also did a new route on Peak Kotina, we're working on a topo but it took probably the best line on the crag through as much steep ground as we could find, and always taking the easiest line through it. The rock is incredibly free-climbable, all the steep bits turned out to be about 4 grades easier than they looked! The crux pitch (7a) was escaping a groove through a series of blocky roofs to a belay on the prow of the entire mountain at about 3/4 height, we think the route is about 1000m and have called it Dreaming Spires, we would definitely recommend it as the rock is mainly sublime (ok there are a few pitches where the rock is whack but its a 26 pitch route and the good bits are worth it!)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/225971_10151100836096225_557687990_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/225971_10151100836096225_557687990_n.jpg)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/376571_10151100849446225_1969791675_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/376571_10151100849446225_1969791675_n.jpg)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/305033_10151100859431225_846635480_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/305033_10151100859431225_846635480_n.jpg)
There's a vast amount of rock, much of it unclimbed. The hardest route done out there was in the Ak Su valley and had one hard pitch of 7c/+ and a few pitches of around 7a+, there is probably potential for harder though! So there is a lot of potential for new-routing, and a lot of potential for trying to free Soviet aid routes of the late 80s, and a lot of opportunity for bivvying in fairly unpleasant conditions. The Russian climbing team was there and they were the hardest men I have ever met - they did a different route to us on Peak 4810 almost entirely free in Alpine style in 4 days, with 7 litres of water between them and sleeping in slings! They said the hardest pitch was 'quite dangerous', which turned out to mean 7b with no gear for the entire rope length. When they got back they stayed up tol 1am drinking vodka, then got up at 5 30am the next day to chase cows away from the campsite with a shovel. The day after that, one of them casually did Perestroika Crack........
Anyway, I would recommend the place to anyone a bit harder, fitter, and psyched for rock-climbing-based-mountaineering than myself (I nearly died on some of the approaches!). I have to admit for the foreseeable future I am going to be a single-pitch sport-climbing pansy!
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As an aside, if anyone has any suggestions on where we could find out if the Mirror Route has been freed before, I would love to know! All I've found on the English-alphabet based interweb is that is has been mainly freed at up to F7a.
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The backdrop to your photos looks amazing.
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Thanks! (I have to admit I didn't take many of them myself as I'm too cheap to buy my own camera). It was definitely the most impressive landscape I've ever climbed in. Just looked back through that and realised it's a bit self-indulgent, sorry for the 'look-at-me-and-my-amazing-ticklist' nature of the post.
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Didn't read like it. The soviet death bolt on facebook looks terrifying.
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https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/192697_10151242100219595_879387735_o.jpg
Yeah I never want to clip one of these again! you could easily bend the hangers with your fingers...... apparently they won't take a fall of more than 1m, they were originally used for aid. :o
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. Just looked back through that and realised it's a bit self-indulgent, sorry for the 'look-at-me-and-my-amazing-ticklist' nature of the post.
Fuck that - didn't come across that way at all and if I had done that I would have been hollering from the rooftops "LOOK AT ME!
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Cheers guys! Oh and in all seriousness for anyone thinking of going to Kyrgyzstan - you will get food poisoning. Diarrhoea off the side of a portaledge is now the absolute low point of my life... :sick:
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cheers for the write up, certainly an adventure in the real sense of the word. wadded.
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Planning this summer's jaunt I'm making a map of long rock route venues in Switzerland, Austria and Italy (https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1IqRG_akdJ58AsbaNksv0Btw2lbhI2SXf1Bc8fTQAzZs/edit?usp=sharing). Feel free to suggest other places to add.
I've also sketched a rough idea of driving times between centres.
A route or two in each of these should be easily manageable in 9 days don't you think?!
(https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1beJ6J26NxXupEgtl7MIVTCFqzujslB6jObEsDQpHuzU/pub?w=480&h=360)
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A route or two in each of these should be easily manageable in 9 days don't you think?!
(https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1beJ6J26NxXupEgtl7MIVTCFqzujslB6jObEsDQpHuzU/pub?w=480&h=360)
You could always employ a Travelling Sales-person Problem (http://sourceforge.net/projects/tspsg/) solution to minimise your travelling time.
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You could always employ a Travelling Sales-person Problem (http://sourceforge.net/projects/tspsg/) solution to minimise your travelling time.
I think that's entering into the spirit of the venture admirably!
I couldn't spot where to enter the crap weather variable anywhere though.
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;D I'll see if there are any add-on modules that account for weather uncertainty.
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Are any of the venues mentioned in this thread worth a look in March / early April? Riglos perhaps, anywhere else?
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From what I hear about current conditions snowballing the Cima Grande might be an option
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Riglos should be good by then.
Aiglun? (http://www.philippegatta.fr/climbing/aiglun2.htm) 3 'Petit (http://www.camptocamp.org/books/158946/fr/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-escalades-d-europe)' ticks and reputedly better weather than the Verdon.
Presles (http://www.mountainproject.com/v/presles/106696708) or Verdon might be good but more of a risk weather-wise.
Vilanova de Meià (http://climbinspain.com/2010/02/climbing-in-vilanova-de-meia/) just about counts.
I expect there are some good long routes on the Costa Blanca but I'm not really a fan of the area.
Wadi Rum of course!
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also in spain, should be ok (although i'm not 100% sure)
terradets. (the meain wall is pretty long but it can be a bit boring, as on some routes you pull exactly the same move for 500 meters...)
monrebei.
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Riglos should be good by then.
That was my immediate thought but what we have left is going to be a big ask from my better half and she hasn't been that keen on climbing since we got back.
Aiglun? (http://www.philippegatta.fr/climbing/aiglun2.htm) 3 'Petit (http://www.camptocamp.org/books/158946/fr/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-escalades-d-europe)' ticks and reputedly better weather than the Verdon.
Hmmm Aiglun (slightly like above), I've always wanted to go but never found an acceptably affordable solution to where to stay?
Presles (http://www.mountainproject.com/v/presles/106696708) or Verdon might be good but more of a risk weather-wise.
Again, the Verdon isn't the best bet as the things I'd like to do are probably not currently going to be practical. Presles perhaps, I've driven past lots but never got out of the car.
Vilanova de Meià (http://climbinspain.com/2010/02/climbing-in-vilanova-de-meia/) just about counts.
I've been here a fair few times now and think I'm done.
Wadi Rum of course!
Interesting. Wadi Rum looks fantastic in Parois. I was really keen for Taghia but I think that'd be better early May (?).
Thanks
From what I hear about current conditions snowballing the Cima Grande might be an option
Don't be daft, the snow will clearly be strewn with boulders already.
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Rocher du Midi?
(http://s.camptocamp.org/uploads/images/1342979465_106950005BI.jpg)
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rocher du midi in late mars? :o
maybe with skis and settled snow, since it's 2000m from the sea.
also, only gets sun in the morning since it's very vertical and perfectly east facing...
anyway if one goes there:
-Lion is the best trad route, especially in its second part (nice long corners and chimneys, good rock)
-Among bolted routes, De Charybde en Scylla is Verdon-quality with amazing sustained climbing apart from the first two pitches which are merely "good".
-Bille de Clown is apparently very good as well, Carnet d'Adresse too if you can afford it.
-the shorter lines on the right are ok for 1/2 day.
-good bivi spot 20 min from the wall, @"cabane du berger", a very spartan building with fireplace and a sort of table/bed that can comfortably accomodate two short people but will be a little unconfortable for the tall.
Flat groud all aroud though.
-the rock on Rocher du Midi is generally good or very good, but the sourrounding cliffs are famous for their rather big rockfalls (Dent de Crolles) or the object of a strict geological observation as more or less the whole structure could collapse (Piton de Rocheplane)
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Paklenica probably worth a look in April. However, I'm there now and the weather is quite British…
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Well Taghia was quite high on my list but it's been suggested we'd be a little early. This is all tied into the jobs thread and thus it'll likely be very last minute!
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Climbed on the big face at Paklenica today. Bone dry, if a little chilly in the shade with wind. Recommended.
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Climbed on the big face at Paklenica today. Bone dry, if a little chilly in the shade with wind. Recommended.
It looks really good from my brief research, any chance of some photos?
Currently perusing Aiglun as a potential destination.
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in aiglun, everyone who's climbed it reccommends l'artisan de l'huitième jour
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Well, the photos don’t really do it justice, but here they are.
The 45min walk in couldn’t be easier. It’s a bit like ambling down Miller’s Dale, then a 350m crag hoves into view.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7331/13091188224_2b51a1b7ec_z.jpg)
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7414/13091020545_bacecd4585_z.jpg)
Rock is weird grippy fluted limestone, mostly solid, though with occasional loose bits higher up.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7420/13091350914_a83ed6127b_z.jpg)
Bolting was sensible, but I felt happy to have some gear to back up some single anchor belays. The topo could have been clearer in places.
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3091/13091155213_56152eea21_z.jpg)
Pulling into the sunshine on top, with a stunning view out to the islands is something I won’t forget.
(https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2833/13091038925_e8df53f885_c.jpg)
The walk down from the top is a bit of a scramble across amazing karst features, and requires care. It takes about an hour and you wouldn’t want to be doing it in the dark. Also, the wind can be quite extreme round these parts, and has been recorded gusting over 300km/h! At least it dries the crag quickly…
There are also some very sculptural shorter routes on the Stup and elsewhere in the gorge. Il Maratoneta (http://www.planetmountain.com/english/News/shownews1.lasso?l=2&keyid=40589#) is definitely worth a gawp.
It’s a couple of hours drive from Zagreb, and from late April through the summer, Ryanair fly direct from Heathrow to Zadar, about half an hour from the crag.
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Looks fantastic! How much climbing are you doing nowadays Tom?
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We did Jihad/La Guerre Sainte in Wadi Rum the other day. Fits the bill. Sorry for fb-links.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989946231603&l=9e08b1d5bf (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989946231603&l=9e08b1d5bf)
Goes up towards the black streak on the left side of the face.
First pitch was wet and sandy and very hard for the grade (6c). A brutal warm-up on the worst pitch of the route. The rest was brilliant.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989941731603&l=72236ab5e6 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989941731603&l=72236ab5e6)
The crux 7b+ pitch has been polished by lots of ascents on this instant classic and has gotten its hard edges removed. Probably not more than 7b now? But what do I know? I ended up in a bad position and jumped for a sling...
I thought the "Climb or go home"-pitch was quite OK, but my second broke two holds and a foothold a meter short of the third bolt at the end of the longest run-out on the pitch. If the leader falls there they would end up below the belay, I think. So even if the runout is easy, take it slow and consider rock quality.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989940166603&l=1a9d800700 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989940166603&l=1a9d800700)
The white headwall had amazing rock though. Three very niche pitches.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989938731603&l=6fa1f38d45 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151989938731603&l=6fa1f38d45)
We had 12 draws and some extra slings for threads. The extra slings where fairly useless though. Most threads were drilled and wide "sandstone" slings didn't fit through the holes. If I had to climb it again I would bring 7-8 mm slings and a knife to remove the in-situ slings. Some of them were not up to my standards.
Over all a fantastic experience on 400 m+ of vertical rock. All belays except 3 where hanging or semi-hanging. Ascent time should be around 7 hours. Count on taking 2 hours for the rappels.
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Well done! Sounds just as good as it's reputation. Must go back...
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No, not really. I thought the run-outs were absolutely fine, and nothing to write home about (for the area). Just don't break two holds at the same time.
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Well ... the village is a poor, dirty, depressing third world shit hole. That hasn't changed. We stay quite comfortably with Ali H, so that's nice
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I had a quick question about Riglos guides, and I figured here might be the most relevant place to put it up...
From looking on the internet I hope I'm right in thinking that this is the most up to date/best Riglos guide?
http://a0avista.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/nueva-guia-escalada-en-los-mallos-de.html (http://a0avista.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/nueva-guia-escalada-en-los-mallos-de.html)
The UKC article from a year or more back suggests that the previous edition is available in the village - does anyone know if they now stock the new edition or if there's anywhere between Rodellar and Riglos that has stock of the new one?
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That linked page describes two guidebooks, climbing riglos (6th ed) and riglos vertical. As of last week, you could borrow a copy of both from the refugio. Riglos vertical was also on sale in English. Both seemed pretty good and should see you right on a week trip, assuming that's how long you are going for. Have fun.
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Riglos vertical looked like a great book when I thumbed through it in the local shop. I particularly like the Old Skool historical topo's that'd clearly been hand drawn onto ruled A4.
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Riglos vertical looked like a great book when I thumbed through it in the local shop. I particularly like the Old Skool historical topo's that'd clearly been hand drawn onto ruled A4.
That's what we have ended up with, from the Barrabes outlet place in Huesca on our way through.
Might be worth linking to this:
http://p-guara.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/RESE (http://p-guara.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/RESE)ÑAS-VIAS-RIGLOS.pdf
Which seems to be a handy single-file summary of dozens of topos for the most popular routes. I think its been produced for a climbing comp which they are doing here today, so I don't know how long it will exist though.
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This weekend we did Face Sud Est Direct on Pic du midi d'Ossau, 1 h straight north of Huesca, just on the French side of the border.
So if you're in Rodellar, have a reasonably sized trad rack, and it is too hot it may just be the ticket.
The base of the climb is at 2000m and the route is around 500m.
The route is in the parois de legende, most of the pitches are 6a-6c. The decent is 150 m of grade 2-4 scrambling + 2 rappels.
The route had good climbing thorough on very reasonable gneiss. There are a bunch of pitons in varying state on the route, some would have been nice to back up with ball nuts (but thats probably just me being a whimpering nordic piton hater).
The route is uniformly steep but not super exposed. Most of the hard parts are in dihedrals.
We just did that one route, but our friends did a few more and told us that "Not to bolt, or not to bolt" is very good and a bit more serious.
There's another Parois de legende tick on the mountain but the name escapes me at the moment.
There is a refugio at the base of the wall for the so inclined. The approach from the parking is fairly gentle and take around 1h30m carrying camping equipment, a rack and food for a few days.
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Sounds good. Your ability to get around and do some good routes around Europe is impressive.
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I should perhaps add that we short roped the entire decent, and that it would likely have been complicated if we hadn't tagged just behind two Spanish friends who had done it before. The trick was to stay as high as possible on the traverse at all times.
Xavi's advice to find two good sharp rocks to use as improvised ice axes when crossing the bergschrund was also solid. No crampons was necessary (keeping with the spirit of the OP)
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A friend of mine was asking some advice about the Bougaboos as I appear to be the most aid-savvy of his climbing mates.
I think some people from here have been?
He's aiming to do some 5.10/5.11 routes with "1 to 3 pitches of A2" in his words. To me, a similar approach to doing Half Dome in a Day would work, but I'm open to advice.
Any thoughts?
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I have also not been, but pass on the following info on the Bugaboos from legendary desert climber Alf: “Don't bring any food, week-end warriors always bring to much food and they [insert rant about yuppies here] ... so they can't be bothered to bring it back, just eat what they leave behind”
Don't blame me if you starve.
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So I've just returned from a trip that was meant to tackle a few appropriate routes for this thread however it didn't go entirely to plan.
Ablon - Not relevant really, short(ish) stuff to break up the drive, OK but rather wet. Picturesque.
Rocher du Midi - Perfect the day we arrived then ridiculous amount of rain meant we moved on without climbing De Charybde en Scylla. However, this route firmly makes the list for next time as the rock in that section looked incredible. The deserted TB hospitals up there are a site to behold, they've been absolutely gutted and abused by the local population. Leaving our car there whilst we went climbing for the day made me feel like we'd return to a burnt out wreck with a teen sat on top of it.
Verdon - This time we had the full experience; failing to find an ab, finding the wrong ab (better get the prussiks out, again) and of course the almost mandatory abbing to the floor and walking out in rock boots (as well as some quality routes).
There are two new guide options available:
2013 - for 25E (which is a bargain compared to the 2010 book) this is meant to be good and has dates of re-equipping (important if you failed to pack your brown trousers).
Grimpeur Verdon Special - One of the local activists has basically created a guide within the magazine and included a lot of other areas (some on private land) which offers a wide range of alternatives for when the gorge isn't in prime conditions. I intend to scan this in, for personal use of course.
Has anyone done Au Dela Du Delire since ULA was stripped of it's bolts (and ab-chains it would seem)? I ask as I don't much like the idea of doing somewhere between 1-3 pitches of trad requiring big heavy gear and then doing 10 pitches that are 'fully' bolted.
Aiglun - Thunderstorms predicted every day or just solid rain. Damn it! Don't buy the guide for this place, it's the V3 Alpes Maritimes that cover Gorges du Loup and it's appalling and an assault on your senses.
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Duncan and I went to Wendesntock last week, and I stuck some photos and a bit of waffle into a quick blog for other people who might be interested.
Incredible place, very keen to go back.....
http://travelswithrockboots.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/wendenstock.html
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Cheers for the write up, the rock looks stunning.
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(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-2lfbFMd7a14/Vf6s1XhRiUI/AAAAAAAAEe4/VkMUIZWs6nc/s640-Ic42/Morroco-20.jp)
TAGHIA: The limestone valley, PART I
The climbing
It is the world class multi pitch limestone climbing, from 7 to 20 pitches that make climbers travel all the way to Taghia. Some routes have no bolts, most are partly bolted, and some are fully or almost fully bolted.
Some of the older routes follow ridges and are lower in the grades, but they are rarely repeated. To get most out of a one week stay, climbing the easy popular routes, you’d have to be at least a 6c climber, in the sense that seeing the 6c-grade (or 6b obligatory) on a big multi pitch route do not strike fear into you. There is nothing much harder than 8a/+ (or 7b obligatory) in the valley (One 8b and one 8c afaik).
The climbing is technical, steep and fingery throughout. The grades felt in line with Verdon. Bring good shoes. Unfortunately your good shoes will not last long as the rock is very abrasive.
There is also some single pitch climbing around Taghia, one crag with some 4s and 5s, one with 7s, and one rather nice looking tufa wall with some low eights. Kris Erickson, an american guide living in Zaouia Ahanesal, has bolted a number of sport routes around Zaouia with grades from the low sixes to mid eights.
When we went we were the only climbers in the valley, possibly due to the perceived terrorism threat after this summer’s spectacular strike in neighbouring Algeria. (Talking to the Taxi-driver in Marrakesh and to people in Taghia, the consequences for Moroccan tourism has been catastrophic) . There was in other words no hope of rescue if things went bad. Even if there are other climbers in the valley, who are likely to be competent, I would not count on timely rescues being possible—and how would you call on rescue in the first place? Yosemite or the Alps it isn’t.
The trekking
The hiking in the High Atlas in general, and around Zaouia Ahanesal in particular, is spectacular. There are donkey trails that criss cross the mountain range between the villages, but very few roads. Some valleys and canyons can be accessed by “Berber ferratas”, where a certain trust in goat-herder’s engineering skills is required.
Kris Erickson in Zaouia Ahanesal can arrange everything around a trekking trip.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-sPDz9laUNKU/Vf6sPidHBqI/AAAAAAAAEbM/3vrLE1rIUG0/s640-Ic42/Morroco-104.jpg)
Gear
Depending on what you wish to do of course. We went for a sport climbing trip and brought 19 draws, of which 5 where tripled 60 cm draws, one set of wires and one set of camalots from #0.3 to #2. Those who want to do the longest and most serious sport routes probably wish to bring a #3 and doubles in #.75-2. To repeat the less bolted routes a normal mountain rack is necessary, and possibly a handfull of pitons as well.
If the bolts can be accessed by grade 3-4 scrambling, the Berber might find better use for the nuts and hangers than being protection for climbing tourists: thus there are reports of missing bolt hangers on the first belay of some routes on Parois de Cascade. Bring a hanger or two and some M10 bolts, or M10 bolts, washers and some wires to thread the bolts.
Two ropes, at least 50 m. Most teams probably wish to haul the pack on the harder pitches.
Guidebook
The only printed guidebook is Christian Revier’s beautiful 2009 book “Taghia, Montagnes Berbères” available directly from the author, or through internet retailers. An update would be more than welcome, considering the amount of routes put up since the publication.
A print-out of the topos from Taghia on Luichys site is an almost complete Spanish language guidebook for the routes in the area (up to ≈ 2009 or so)
http://lanochedelloro.com/monografs/taghia/index.htm
There are also topos for some of the popular routes on Remi Thivel’s site http://www.remi-thivel.com/topos/topos.html
Parois de Legende, (Bodet & Petit) also list a number of routes with topos and some useful info.
Desnivel #248 (March 2007) contains some handy topos.
A few of the new hard routes put up after the publication of Revier’s book have topos on planetmountain.com, but generally speaking, for routes put up after 2009, the new route book and guest book in Said’s gite is the best bet.
Staying there
There are a number of gites in Taghia offering half pension. Said’s and Youssef’s Gite among them. Said was the first to cater to climbers, and his Gite has a new-route book and guest book full of impressive stories by climbers of all abilities, from 6c-punters to some of the biggest names in European multi-pitch climbing.
Most French climbers stay at Said’s Gite. Said speaks French, his son Mohammed speaks good French and a bit of English, and should be able to help you out if you have no French.
Chez Said Messaoudi, Douar Taghia, Zaouia Ahanesal
22010 Azilal Maroc
Cellphone +212668246536 (bad coverage)
Fixed line +212523 459 290 (directly to the house)
e.mail: gitesaid@yahoo.fr (if you speak no french it is probably best to e-mail them in English. Mohammed will be able to reply)
Chez Youssef Rezki, Douar Taghia, Zaouia Ahanesal
22010 Azilal Maroc.
Tel : 00 212 668909843
Shopping
La Boutique Jamal is always open, or so they claim. They had bottled water, Coke, threaded gas canisters (the smallest size), canned sardines, gigantic bags of couscous, some nuts, candy, soap, and internet access for sale (requires a subscription to Meditel).
Weather
http://www.yr.no/place/Morocco/Tadla-Azilal/Taghia~2531726/
http://www.meteoblue.com/en/weather/forecast/week/31.783N-6.067E2083
Getting there
Book a gite in Taghia beforehand. Fly to Marrakesh and let the gite arrange the transport from Marrakesh to Taghia. We took taxi from Marrakesh to Zaouia Ahanesal (around 6-7 hours with a lunch break in Azilal) (1200 Dh, October 2015). From Zaouhia, hike in with donkey/mule (100-120 Dh per donkey). One donkey will bring up to 70 kg.
We paid 120 Dh per person per night at Said’s place.
Another option is to get from Marrakesh to Azilal by public transport, than get to Zaouia with taxi.
There are stories about Taxis not making it from Azilal to Zaouia, and that one should change to a Jeep there. Our taxi driver had no problem with his 1984 Mercedes 240 D on the potholed narrow tarmac, but then again, he was a ninja.
Another option would be to rent a car and drive to Zaouia Ahanesal yourself.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-dV17MmKQ0Gw/Vf6st1XNggI/AAAAAAAAEeI/CqccaMAiick/s640-Ic42/Morroco-14.jpg)
Hygiene
More or less everyone who’s ever been has been reporting stomach bugs. We put aquatabs in all water or boiled it before drinking, including the water used for brushing the teeth. We also washed the hands and used antiseptic spray like a couple of OCDs. Still both of us got diarrhoea.
Season
Mid-april to end of October. July and August likely too hot (and travelling in and out of Marrakesh would be a nightmare at that time of year). May and October being the most popular months, with up to 40-50 climbers in the village. In the autumn of 2015 the gites are reporting very few bookings, and we were by ourselves in mid September, having very good conditions for climbing in the shade with daytime temperatures in the low 20s. In May it reportedly rains quite a bit.
Modern life is rubbish?
Since 2013 there is electricity in the village Taghia. There is also cell phone coverage, but only through Meditel,: no other Moroccan provider will work. There’s also intermittent 3G coverage, but even though our French sim cards could access Meditel for SMS & MMS, we could not get data roaming (which was probably for the better since they ask 3€/Mb for traffic…). We bought a code good for 800 Mb (200 Dh) in the store in Taghia and Mohammed, Said’s son, set up his phone as a wifi-router for us.
The upshot is that it is possible to get up-to-date weather forecasts. We found the one-day forecasts from meteoblue.com to be reliable.
Vaccines
Hepatitis A. Two shots, separated by six months, some protection after the first shot.
Diphtheria. A single shot protects for three years
Lockjaw/tetanus. (This is included in the vaccine program for children in most EU countries)
What to bring
Climbing gear
Two pair of shoes. The approach/decent shoes will get wet, so it is nice to change to dry shoes after returning to the village
Toilet paper
Head scarf (women who want to pay respect to local customs only)
Aquatabs
Possibly a small gas stove for tea
A small medical kit including diarea tabs, penicillin, antiseptic cream, antiseptic spray and painkillers.
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Part II: PERSONAL NOTES ON ROUTES
À boire ou je tue le chien ** (A drink or I kill the dog) 280m 6c (6b+ obligatory)
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-WTGcOptx_zg/Vf6tDVjZogI/AAAAAAAAEgU/u2_iSU2Il5s/s640-Ic42/Morroco-30.jpg)
Nice climbing on excellent rock. A bit engaged in places. Has been onsight soloed (Alex Honnhold). Possible to combine with Au nom de la reform if you rap after pitch six. The sun hits the wall around noon beginning of September.
12 quick draws, a few wires (Wallnuts #2-#7). Four cams if continuing to the top after pitch 7.
Approach: From Taghia to Taojdad. Go up in the channel between Taoujdad & Oujdad. 30 min after the village, pass a big block on the left. Continue up until a path (cairns) left lead to the two obvious ramps that mark the start of Au nom de la réforme and À boire respectively.
P1 5c. Climb the crack (4) protected by wires or small friends. Then a mixture of wires and bolts to the belay. A bit engaged. Many teams report that this is at least 6a, but if you’re used to climb low-angle cracks 5c is probably fair.
P2 6c. Really good climbing, morpho.
P3 6c. I did something wrong on the start of this pitch. Did a 7a-sequence straight up between the first and second bolt, where a fall would have been unpleasant. My second told me it was easier more to the right rather than straight up, probably closer to 6c, but still engaging.
P4. 6a+ Nice face climbing.
P5. 6b+ Steep and awkward dihedral. Don’t worry, a bolt will appear.
P6. 5c. Reasonably well bolted face climbing. This is the last steep pitch and the last independent pitch as well.
To climb to the top of Taoujdad, change to your approach shoes and climb the top pitches of La Reform:
P7. 4+ Trekking along the ridge. Then some face climbing past a bolt (4+), then some trekking again past a big tree to the last steep face. (75 m or so)
P8. 5a. Two or three bolts. Two-three finger sized cams useful (40 m)
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-EVvhHX3BrPA/Vf6tKkByK7I/AAAAAAAAEg0/T64F9v4ckt8/s640-Ic42/Morroco-34.jpg)
Decent from Taoujdad. From the top, head south-east on a path (plenty of cairns), diagonally skier’s right. Find a tree with slings and rap 40 m to a col, or 55 m down skiers right. Diagonally left and cross the ridge, then follow cairns down and left. Aim for the white water streak in the intermittent creek. Close to this, carefully follow the switchbacks on the right side of the coulouir. About 1 hour down to the point where you took off towards the start of the routes and 2 hours down to the village.
Belle et Berbère *** (The Beauty and The Berber) 300 m, 6b+ (6a+ obligatory)
Very good climbing on a contrived line. Extraordinarily sustained 6b climbing, with most pitches around vertical on good to excellent rock. Very fingery throughout. Probably the most frequently climbed route in Taghia beside La Réforme. The sun hit the face around 12.30 in September.
13 draws. (And a finger sized friend to protect grade 3 scrambling if necessary)
Approach on the left side of the creek to Parois des Sources. Two ledges on top of each other, climb up to the lower ledge further to the right with cairns on top of it (3+). There is a route (bolt) starting on the right side of the ledge, Belle et Berber start further right, just around the corner. 15 min from the village if you find the route straight away…
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8uS8vWIoOks/Vf6tMGF_mcI/AAAAAAAAEhE/lVSBwH2kmQw/s640-Ic42/Morroco-35.jpg)
P1. 6b Traverse right (thee bolts) into a right-facing overhanging dihedral with tufas-in-the-process of growth.
P2. 6b Follow the bolts. Hard slab boulder in the start, then easier. Mind the rope drag.
P3. 6b Sustained low-angle face climbing
P4. 6b+ Sustained 6b climbing with a boulder move in the middle.
P5 6a+. Short easy pitch, very contrived line where the bolts are placed to force you away from the natural line.
P6. 6b+. Long pitch. Vertical climbing, just when you think it is over, there is a slab crux then face climbing to the top.
P7 6b. Walk across the ledge and then climb a bolted face. The careful climber move the belay to under the face, or just don’t fall. Belay with one bolt and a tree.
P8. 3. One bolt, then hiking diagonally right and scramble up (3b, unprotected or bring a finger sized friend) right to a red big face. Belay in one bolt or stretch up and clip the first bolt on the next pitch as well.
P9. 6b+ A crux on slopers off the first bolt, then easier climbing diagonally right to a steep finish.
P10. 6b+ Hard sequence across the fin, the rest is easier.
Decent from Parois des Sources. Scramble diagonally up left until you see the cairns on the ledge system to the left of the top. Follow the well marked path on the ledges for a few hundred meters, and then track back towards the village along the path. (45 min)
Zebda *****, 260 m, 7b+ (6c obligatory)
Second of the top the line. Better than The holy War in Wadi Rum, and slightly worse than Alix, punk of the Vergons in Verdon. Steep climbing on immaculate rock for 280 sustained meters. One of the most popular and recommended routes in Wadi Rum. Deservedly so.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-wbyxg7moEqU/Vf6t9BLqJdI/AAAAAAAAElk/HiF2RrM8ncM/s640-Ic42/Morroco-68.jpg)
The sun hit the route at around 13:00.
14 draws + belays.
Approach: Walk to Parois des Sources, past the sources and cross the river and track back. The name of the route is written in big letters at the base. 20 min from the village.
P1. 7b+ Tough warm up. Well bolted face climbing (7a) with decent rests up to a short crux at the tufa.
P2. 6a+ for the tall. Morpho. Worst pitch on the route.
P3. 6c+ A fantastic pitch. Steep face climbing.
P4. 7b Sustained climbing straight off the belay. Then a bit easier to the roof. The mantel shelf move above the roof is OK. The belay is hanging and in the middle of a non-trivial sequence. Strong climbers with good ethics are advised to bring plenty of quick draws and a 70 m rope and link it with the next pitch.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-a_YmCV5522o/Vf6uLgUkJbI/AAAAAAAAEms/lN1_fqKkL0I/s640-Ic42/Morroco-77.jpg)
P5. 7a+ Another mind blowing pitch. Steep crimpy face climbing. Engaged and not trivial (6c-ish) near the belay.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-aOtNp5rSfqs/Vf6tS008PMI/AAAAAAAAEhs/ziSfUdxPDPo/s640-Ic42/Morroco-40.jpg)
P6 6c. I found this very hard for the grade. Hard face climbing straight from the belay, and than a tricky traverse on good holds but mediocre feet.
P7 6c+ Steep climbing. At least a grade easier than previous pitch.
P8 6b (50m). Major pitch. Steep stemming up the corner. Belay on a single bolt + a tree.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-x07cRFk9-_g/Vf6teAGvyTI/AAAAAAAAEik/qPL6nvCLth0/s640-Ic42/Morroco-47.jpg)
Scramble 5-10 min to the top and descend as for The beauty and the Berbere
Approach to Canyon Apache/North face of Taojdad
Walk past Parois des Sources, and access the canyon to the left by scrambling up on its right side. A bolt around the corner is used to make the passage 4/A0 (expo). Keep walking up-river with a short passage of scrambling.
After a while you come to a narrow passage where there are two options: either an exposed slab traverse to the left (5, one bolt) supposedly leads to a Berber bridge at a delicate river crossing (this bridge was either under water or gone when we where there) or three bolts on a bulge can be aided and then a short passage of 4+ climbing (one bolt) lead to a glue-in bolt (belay). From this traverse left and up and scramble along ledges until the river can be accessed again-
Further upstream there are some gigantic boulders blocking the canyon. If the water level is very low it is apparently possible to walk up to these and climb up and under them (very exposed) to approach the north face of Taojdad. Again we had to high water for this to be possible, instead we did the more common approach by way of the first pitch of Canyon Apache. Climb up three bolts on the left side of the canyon (the third was really loose) then traverse right 30 m to a delicate passage (6a) leads to a ledge. On the right side of the ledge the second pitch of Canyon Apache can be found.
To approach the north face of Taojdad downclimb from the start of the second pitch of Canyon Apache to the riverbed.
To get from the north face of Taojdad back to the village it is supposedly possible to rap down the passage with the gigantic boulders mentioned above. The water was to high for us and we had to reverse the first pitch of Canyon Apache.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-NEdJa0o9JJs/Vf6trAweAiI/AAAAAAAAEj0/XHPL2zUijLU/s640-Ic42/Morroco-56.jpg)
Classe Montagne Épinal **, 185 m, 6c+ (6b obligatory)
Approach: Scramble up the ledge system from right. The route follows a big pillar system.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-NDW9h_eihlY/Vf6t1f9RtaI/AAAAAAAAEkw/TXw2pQIg25w/s640-Ic42/Morroco-62.jpg)
P1 6b+. A very good vertical pitch
P2 6b. Another good pitch
P3 5+
P4 6c+ Good vertical face climbing with a hard sequence straight up from the belay.
P5 6a+ dihedral. Not so good. A shoulder length sling can be used around a tree at the top of the pitch
P6 6b Straight up to a ledge, then traverse far right on the ledge then straight up. Two ropes useful
P7 6a+ Many bolts. Finish on the ledge with belay on one bolt + tree.
Untie and scramble up diagonally to the right to the ledge system that traverse the mountain on the south east side. Follow the cairns.
Fat guides ***** 250 m, 7b+ (7a obi)
Start to the right of Zebda
For the grade it does not get much better. Dead vertical wall of perfect limestone. Will only improve as a few more ascents clean it up further.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-n5g-Z_qpFRc/Vf6uIos24sI/AAAAAAAAEmc/FNWpbKBcNMg/s640-Ic42/Morroco-74.jpg)
P1 7b+ Hard start for the first few bolts, then steady climbing until a physical traverse out left. Finish up a very thin slab. This pitch probably sees some seepage as it was quite dirty. Felt like 7c/+ in the conditions we had, but it's very hard to guess what it would feel like if its clean.
P2 6c+ Nice short pitch.
P3 6c The same. The 3rd bolt is quite tricky to clip for short climbers
P4 7a+. Magnificent pitch, not alway totally obvious to find the best sequence. Semi-hanging belay. Felt like 7b/+ to me.
P5 7b? Easy climbing up to a short two-bolt crux to a good hold, then some pumpy climbing lead to a comfortable belay. Either I missed something, or this is more like 7b+/c. A bail biner on the bolt before the hardest part told me I’m not alone finding this difficult.
P6. 6c. Another very nice, short pitch to a good belay.
P7. 7a+ An absolutely superb pitch. Might actually be 7a+ as well. The first bolt is put in a bit too high, then there are 18(!) bolts in 50 m. It’s possible to shuffle bolts in a few places, in which case 15 draws should be enough
P8. 4. 15 m. No bolts. Climb a bit to the right, than back to the left to a two-bolt belay, Two shoulder length slings can be used for tying off some shrubs.
P9 3+ Traverse straight left on the sloping ledge. A rope can be nice for the first 15-20 m.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-v6X6gIZ1NG0/Vf6uWcucu9I/AAAAAAAAEns/9lt6lceEqgA/s640-Ic42/Morroco-84.jpg)
Continue to traverse the ledge and exit like Classe Montagne Épinal, or why not finish with the last two beautiful pitches of Belle et Berbère (6b+ and 6b+), if you haven’t climbed that before.
(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-9ZSPkDM0X6A/Vf6twmMT6CI/AAAAAAAAEkY/jN1cF1H658U/s640-Ic42/Morroco-59.jpg)
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gold mine!
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Looks awesome, thanks for all that info! In your "Seasons" bit you didn't mention March. Would a trip in March be a good idea?
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Thanks a bunch jwi.
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Looks awesome, thanks for all that info! In your "Seasons" bit you didn't mention March. Would a trip in March be a good idea?
No. I don't think so.
Mid-April to Mid-October is the best time. Before or after you'd had to be a quick team climbing only on south facing rock.
I have a friend who went in early April and froze his ass off. (OTOH I have another friend who's been there a lot and he have had good conditions in early April....)
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In the unlikely case someone wants to see more photos: http://picasaweb.google.com/111272204514144637665/Morocco?authuser=0&feat=directlink (http://picasaweb.google.com/111272204514144637665/Morocco?authuser=0&feat=directlink)
I had to put them on picasa instead of flickr so that my mother-in-law doesn't see them and freak out.
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:o Sort of like the Chorro walkway, but far shitter.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-fRVZyftSa7c/Vf6sqX1qBQI/AAAAAAAAEdo/iQQeT8Cno40/s1024-Ic42/Morroco-121.jpg)
The place looks amazing. Enjoyed reading about it. :great:
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I don't think anyone has mentioned Corsica on this thread yet. A picture of Arnauld Petit's came up on my instagram this weekend of climbing of a route called "Enterre mon coeur" on Cascioniin and it looked well worthy of inclusion on the list. It's not his route, but apparently he's just retrobolted the belays but debolted the rest. "One of the nicest climbs in France" says Mr Petit...
https://instagram.com/p/9ZA6hiwXL1/?taken-by=arnaudpetit_climb
Some more details here:
https://teamgrandesvoiesffcampaca.wordpress.com/2015/10/31/ouverture-et-reequipement-au-cascioni-en-corse/
Map and so on here:
http://escalade.corse.topo.free.fr/index.php?menu=gdv_gb&page=248%20Cascioni%20Syncope&lg=en
Anyone been here?
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Sophie Whyte has just come back from Corsica, I'll try and get a report out of her to put on this thread (still my favourite)
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Is she? :)
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:-[
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Some more details here:
https://teamgrandesvoiesffcampaca.wordpress.com/2015/10/31/ouverture-et-reequipement-au-cascioni-en-corse/
Map and so on here:
http://escalade.corse.topo.free.fr/index.php?menu=gdv_gb&page=248%20Cascioni%20Syncope&lg=en
Anyone been here?
Thanks for the link! Saw the photo on instagram, but didn't look it up closer. Looks perfect for me and Mrs jwi!
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I don't think anyone has mentioned Corsica on this thread yet. A picture of Arnauld Petit's came up on my instagram this weekend of climbing of a route called "Enterre mon coeur" on Cascioniin and it looked well worthy of inclusion on the list. It's not his route, but apparently he's just retrobolted the belays but debolted the rest. "One of the nicest climbs in France" says Mr Petit...
Anyone been here?
Not been; want to go now. :beer2:
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Ahhhh, this old gold mine comes back in use!
It looks like I might be going for a month somewhere in the world in September. As usual - this thread has many of the places I want to go to, but September might not be quite the best time for them all.
Basically, my mate is going to be spending most of his summer in N.America - so logistically it would make sense to go somewhere there.
Yosemite is an obvious choice, but we did a lot of what we wanted last time we were (separately) there, and I don;t think either of us will be fit enough for the harder things, and we weren't blown away by all the aid malarkey.
Incredible Hulk seems like an obvious choice, but I doubt we'd spend a month there - so what else is around in that area?
We're probably looking for either: E2-E4 trad multi-pitch things (usual caveat, some aid is ok, but try to free it all) OR alpine mixed climbing....which I think...but not sure...that almost everywhere in the World September is just not a good time.
I Kyrgyzstan (Ak Su) doable in September?
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September is perfect for Taghia. Can't recommend it enough. Caveat: it's mostly sport (most of the best trad-routes are at least E4 or harder) You'd have to be quite comfortable on 6c in Verdon to get out the most of a longer stay.
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I'm busy chatting on FB with him just now. The high sierra is looking like a very viable option!
Taghia I might keep in the bag for a Europe trip. It is likely he'll have bought a cheap camper in the US, so makes a lot of sense to be there.
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Ahhhh, this old gold mine comes back in use!
It looks like I might be going for a month somewhere in the world in September. As usual - this thread has many of the places I want to go to, but September might not be quite the best time for them all.
Basically, my mate is going to be spending most of his summer in N.America - so logistically it would make sense to go somewhere there.
Yosemite is an obvious choice, but we did a lot of what we wanted last time we were (separately) there, and I don;t think either of us will be fit enough for the harder things, and we weren't blown away by all the aid malarkey.
Incredible Hulk seems like an obvious choice, but I doubt we'd spend a month there - so what else is around in that area?
We're probably looking for either: E2-E4 trad multi-pitch things (usual caveat, some aid is ok, but try to free it all) OR alpine mixed climbing....which I think...but not sure...that almost everywhere in the World September is just not a good time.
I Kyrgyzstan (Ak Su) doable in September?
If you want to go alpine mixed climbing in September The Darrans in New Zealand are full of Scottish style mixed routes on granite: some existent, much not yet climbed. Also Mt Cook region - the back of the Hooker Glacier. I've climbed in both a fair bit, keep saying I must go back to play in the Darrans in winter doing new mixed routes..
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In California in Sept I'd be looking to hit up the Needles, the Hulk, Tuolomne and the Keeler Needle. There is loads more in the High Sierra that isn't much known in the UK.
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I Kyrgyzstan (Ak Su) doable in September?
Probably unlikely - when I was there, everyone else had left the valley by early/mid August, snow started getting more frequent around then and then it really crapped out at the end of August (i.e. snow on all the holds!)
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In California in Sept I'd be looking to hit up the Needles, the Hulk, Tuolomne and the Keeler Needle. There is loads more in the High Sierra that isn't much known in the UK.
+ 1. Incredible Hulk requires a bit of logistics. You either do it as a long day hit if you're fit and know the tricky approach (plus it's 3500m), or take bivi etc and camp up there (recommended). Positive Vibrations (5.11) is one of the best routes at the grade on the planet. Crofts harder routes are amazing too. It's not somewhere you'd spend a month though.
I went to the Needles with Nic, for whom it was his 3rd visit (says it all). There is everything from 4-star single pitch to 4-star multi pitch. It's immaculate. Probably the best trad climbing area I've been to in terms of mixture of styles/grades.
Tuolomne is awesome if you like runout face climbing on your feet.
All of the above may be chilly in September.
Not sure if Peter Croft's 'Good, the great and the awesome' guidebook is still available?
If I went again I'd be keen for some of the more Alpiney stuff in the High Sierras. September might be optimal for this, as thunderstorms are an issue in high summer?
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In California in Sept I'd be looking to hit up the Needles, the Hulk, Tuolomne and the Keeler Needle. There is loads more in the High Sierra that isn't much known in the UK.
+ 1. Incredible Hulk requires a bit of logistics. You either do it as a long day hit if you're fit and know the tricky approach (plus it's 3500m), or take bivi etc and camp up there (recommended). Positive Vibrations (5.11) is one of the best routes at the grade on the planet. Crofts harder routes are amazing too. It's not somewhere you'd spend a month though.
I went to the Needles with Nic, for whom it was his 3rd visit (says it all). There is everything from 4-star single pitch to 4-star multi pitch. It's immaculate. Probably the best trad climbing area I've been to in terms of mixture of styles/grades.
Tuolomne is awesome if you like runout face climbing on your feet.
All of the above may be chilly in September.
Not sure if Peter Croft's 'Good, the great and the awesome' guidebook is still available?
If I went again I'd be keen for some of the more Alpiney stuff in the High Sierras. September might be optimal for this, as thunderstorms are an issue in high summer?
We can deal with "a bit chilly" better than " a bit roasting" but we could always bail down lower later in the month if it's too chilly. I think ^^^ this sounds like a great option. Not heard much about The Needles, so will check it out. Cheers all.
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Needles is amazing as above, really beautiful and cool climbing. I found it tough partly because I'm crap at crack/granite climbing and partly because it was our first destination and the grades a little stiff (?). So if you aren't used to this style might be worth warming up into it somewhere else?
Re the Hulk my biggest tip is, if you are on a trip go mid-week! We did a day hit from the campsite and ended up at the back of the queue for Red Dihedral which ended up in me and my partner soloing/simuling the fallen leaf variation - chossy as fuck and rubbish. Should have done Positive Vibes but I wasn't confident enough in my ability. One of my bigger regrets if I'm honest.
They are both really cool areas and I would probably head back to them over the shitshow that is the Valley! I really rated Red Rocks as well.
However, whether they are as good as Pembroke/Fair Head/Gogarth/Pabbay & Mingulay... I'm not so sure :shrug: :worms:
Speaking of States climbing areas has anyone been to the Black and/or Eldorado Canyon? They both look fantastic!
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However, whether the weather is nailed on as opposed to Pembroke/Fair Head/Gogarth/Pabbay & Mingulay... I'm so sure :shrug: :worms:
Speaking of States climbing areas has anyone been to the Black and/or Eldorado Canyon? They both look fantastic!
I've climbed in Eldorado Canyon. Was underwhelmed by Naked Edge tbh - a bit like a multi-pitch Millstone route. I suspect the Black is an acquired taste.
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However, whether they are as good as Pembroke/Fair Head/Gogarth/Pabbay & Mingulay... I'm not so sure :shrug: :worms:
Been to Pabbay/Mingulay 3 times now, going to Fair Head in the spring...the others can be done with much less time than a month.
Needles is amazing as above, really beautiful and cool climbing. I found it tough partly because I'm crap at crack/granite climbing and partly because it was our first destination and the grades a little stiff (?). So if you aren't used to this style might be worth warming up into it somewhere else?
Re the Hulk my biggest tip is, if you are on a trip go mid-week!
We did take a wee bit of a spanking in the Valley last time - so we'd heed that advice and start off easy! Also re: The Hulk - is it feasible to lug enough stuff up there for a few days?
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I've climbed in Eldorado Canyon. Was underwhelmed by Naked Edge tbh - a bit like a multi-pitch Millstone route. I suspect the Black is an acquired taste.
Eldorado Canyon is mostly of local interest these days. Imho.
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Black Canyon of the Gunnison
What’s good about it
Awe-inspiring long routes.
Very trad. and often very committing.
Looks like a 1500’ version of Gogarth or a more impressive and malevolent Verdon: and I visited and were quite relieved when it snowed so we could make our excuses and bail.
You won’t be queuing.
Best time
mid-September-October; April-May
What’s not so good about it
Poison Ivy.
Hideous approach gullies - even worse if you have to retreat back up them.
Loose and crumbly rock.
(From West Coast beta (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,21295.msg387459.html#msg387459))
Another strong recommendation for The Needles. I can't believe I've only been once.
I enjoyed a day in Eldo. canyon but it was a bit of a pilgrimage for me as a major centre in the 70s and early 80s, the Tremadog of US climbing in this sense. Not objectively better than Pembroke/Fair Head/Gogarth/Pabbay & Mingulay.
Are these other places better? They are (mostly) on a larger scale, and sometimes it's good just to go somewhere different. And you can go to the UK places, other than P+M, for a weekend. If you've got the time and money for an extended trip it's usually worth considering somewhere that's a bit harder to reach.
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For CO, South Platte is quite good and a bit different. Local knowledge might be necessary to get out the most of it though. September should be good. Obviously, High Sierra is better
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Poison Ivy.
Bear in mind you may not be allergic to Poison Ivy- about a quarter of people aren't.
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Also re: The Hulk - is it feasible to lug enough stuff up there for a few days?
Yes. Or take bivi stuff up there and stash it + your climbing gear, as the walk in isn't massive. We walked in heavy with tent, climbed PV the next day and returned to the valley for steaks etc. Then walked back in light one evening and spent two nights up there.
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Are these other places better? They are (mostly) on a larger scale, and sometimes it's good just to go somewhere different. And you can go to the UK places, other than P+M, for a weekend. If you've got the time and money for an extended trip it's usually worth considering somewhere that's a bit harder to reach.
It's horses for courses innit. We took a friend from Colorado to Pabbay and he thought it was amazing (I personally found the climbing a bit samey and much prefer granite).
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However, whether the weather is nailed on as opposed to Pembroke/Fair Head/Gogarth/Pabbay & Mingulay... I'm so sure :shrug: :worms:
Speaking of States climbing areas has anyone been to the Black and/or Eldorado Canyon? They both look fantastic!
I've climbed in Eldorado Canyon. Was underwhelmed by Naked Edge tbh - a bit like a multi-pitch Millstone route. I suspect the Black is an acquired taste.
Hehe true about the weather and also these places can be climbed at whenever you want. Obviously for a long trip you'd go further afield. I think I will head back to Australia before America if I'm honest!
Been to Pabbay/Mingulay 3 times now, going to Fair Head in the spring...the others can be done with much less time than a month.
We did take a wee bit of a spanking in the Valley last time - so we'd heed that advice and start off easy! Also re: The Hulk - is it feasible to lug enough stuff up there for a few days?
Was mainly playing Devil's advocat. I think it would be feasible to lug a few days stuff up fairly easily. The approach is quite steep and a bit long but if you gave yourself an afternoon/day to do it so you were primed the next morning I think you'd be fine!
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Not sure if Peter Croft's 'Good, the great and the awesome' guidebook is still available?
I wish to fuck I knew who I loaned my copy to! Eastern Sierras would be a awesome if your mate is there already, you could get the high stuff done if the weather is good, and some of the lower stuff in the Alabama Hills and Whitney Portal when not so great. Or even bail to Red Rocks if it really craps out (I've got the guide for that if you need it) it's only a half day's drive.
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Possibly not considered long, but too good to miss:
Boney Fingers, Whitney portal 5.10 or 11b face. 3 pitches
Crazy hidden gem, my pic-
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=247469
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Well that one's now on the hit list, if we do go to that part of the world. Looks ace!
Sent from my XT1039 using Tapatalk
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Possibly not considered long, but too good to miss:
Boney Fingers, Whitney portal 5.10 or 11b face. 3 pitches
Crazy hidden gem, my pic-
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=247469
That looks great - think I'll be there early July so will add to list.
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One well traveled crag for fairly long, fairly adventurous, and mostly free routes (most routes go free in the 6th grade with some aid climbing at around A1/A2) is Mont-rebei near Terradets. I don't think many non-spanish climbers go there, but with a small rack it can be a great divertissement from the more popular sport climbing in the area (Lleida). Two weeks ago I climbed one of the shorter routes on the Catalonia side of the wall, Globeros en Alaska, 7a, 255m. Routes up to around 600 m.
Some previous experience with loose rock is advisable.
More info on the route on my brand new blog http://steepground.blogspot.fr/2016/03/globeros-en-alaska-7a6b-250m-mont-rebei.html
In the upcoming month, I hope to fill the blog with old notes on routes I've done
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Nice blog, looks like a definite change in character for the area. Looking forward to more updates, it will be a good resource.
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...
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One of those shots (Javi on top) looks distinctly like L'Escales!
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Looks can deceive... but it's a good adventure play ground - and locals certainly strive to keep it adventurous/Iberian trad-style. I should perhaps have added some lines about the chopping of the Sharma-project (briefly showed in one of the Reel Rock movies). Someone felt that the route was not opened in acceptable style and chopped the entire route. Most local climbers I asked about this feel that the chopper's act was totally justifiable (but I only know locals from one very particular milieu) but I would not like to pass judgement.
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What's the latest knowledge on insurance?
The last few years I've had the CAF membership & insurance, which was ideal when living in France...but you need to visits CAF office and have a recent medical so that's out of the question now.
It's only a month to the US, and I'm not planning any other trips this year so I'll probably just go for a single trip policy - or the AAC depending on costs.
Any wise words?
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BMC? All I've ever used TBH. Choose type of climbing and duration, pay the price, no bother.
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BMC? All I've ever used TBH. Choose type of climbing and duration, pay the price, no bother.
Is why I'm looking around... I just need the minimum cover for emergencies.
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Some suggestions of this ilk from the unavoidable Sarah Stirling: 5 multipitch sport crags near accommodation owned by ex-pat. Brits (https://www.thebmc.co.uk/5-adventurous-multipitch-sport-crags-europe).
Sinsat does look very good from the road.
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multipitch sport crags near accommodation owned by ex-pat. Brits[/url].
:lol:
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Some suggestions of this ilk from the unavoidable Sarah Stirling: 5 multipitch sport crags near accommodation owned by ex-pat. Brits (https://www.thebmc.co.uk/5-adventurous-multipitch-sport-crags-europe).
Sinsat does look very good from the road.
Yeah, especially the big big roof and the Tower people base jump off. Haven't climbed there yet but driven past a few times on the way to Oliana
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Some suggestions of this ilk from the unavoidable Sarah Stirling: 5 multipitch sport crags near accommodation owned by ex-pat. Brits (https://www.thebmc.co.uk/5-adventurous-multipitch-sport-crags-europe).
Sinsat does look very good from the road.
A few weeks ago I did the first 9 pitches of the very popular “Intégrale d'Anaïs” (6b+, 6a+ obl. on the pyrenees scale...) on Sinsat, as the training program I wrote for my better half said easy endurance and she was singularly unmotivated for this. So I figured a long route would do. The first 5 pitches where great, very nice slab climbing, unfortunately the steeper stuff on top was a bit meh. Too much loose rock, not enough interesting climbing. After 9 pitches (the 14th day on) my better half refused to climb any more, so we missed out the top.
I think Sinsat is more of local interest, or if you are in the area and fancy a change of scenery, tbh. But then again, I'm a snob.
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You climbed in Ordesa JWI?
I bought the new guide last year when I was in Saint Sebastian and it's got me well keen for a trip. I walked through there years ago while walking the GR trail.
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What's with the
John Falkiner is a mountain guide based in Switzerland: www.johnfalkiner.com
in the first bit, when he isn't mentioned and none of the crags are in Swizzy. Wonder if Eldorado was in, but got removed for some reason or another?
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You climbed in Ordesa JWI?
I bought the new guide last year when I was in Saint Sebastian and it's got me well keen for a trip. I walked through there years ago while walking the GR trail.
Alas, no. I'm very keen to do RACS, but my wife refuses. Also keen on the link-up between Las Brujas and the Franco-Espagnol. In fact, I'm looking for a partner for RACS this fall, when my wife is in US.
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I'm very keen to do RACS, but my wife refuses.
How good that my wife usually only asks for the number of pitches and max grade when I suggest a route. :smart:
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...ah that's all very well ... but what is the punishment for choosing unwisely?
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If she complains, then it's mostly some moaning about it being too difficult. But then I give it back by saying that I expected it being easy for her... But a bit more seriously: certainly sometimes an advantage if you can just make your choice and have somebody who will follow. On the other hand, discussing objectives and getting psyched (together) isn't that bad either.
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My partner only complains when I place gear too high. I'm 6ft 2, she's about 5ft 2.
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I think Sinsat is more of local interest, or if you are in the area and fancy a change of scenery, tbh. But then again, I'm a snob.
Thanks, I'm also a snob. The BASE jumping is a big turn-off for me too.
Ordesa on the other hand... this had been vaguely on my radar but further investigation makes it sound ideal. RACS is a Parois de Legende tick that's not in France so must be good. Unfortunately I'll be blowing nearly all my holiday in August this year otherwise I'd be offering my services as belay bunny.
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Btw, Peña Montañesa is another impressive wall in Aragon that also can be seen driving back north from Rodellar, close to Ordesa. I have it on good authority (Albert Salvadó's brother no less) that Lágrimas en la Roca is among the best long adventure routes anywhere
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RACS (7a/+, 6c obl., 8 pitches), Ordesa. Not Euro-limestone.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-XOh1Wzjyjnc/UAq1dzSOn_I/AAAAAAAAAVI/nUIwZ9WqjDo/s1600/IMG_7428.jpg)
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-dBo9wG_a8Go/T9bixKI6C5I/AAAAAAAAKc0/WIwQFtkQc1s/s1600/RACS+Foto.jpg)
From here (http://esquirolfree.blogspot.co.uk/2012_07_01_archive.html) and here (http://korkuerika.blogspot.co.uk/2011/09/racs-cumpliendo-objetivos-por-ordesa.html)
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whoa that looks amazing Duncan!!!
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Hard to tell the scale of the picture. How many pitches of Vertical Death Grass is that at the top?
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I was just flicking through the Arve Guide http://www.rockrun.com/rock-climbing/other-329/guides/vallee-de-l-arve (after getting bit back from a mate who had it on loan for about two years) and the amount of quality looking FLMHMF Routes is pretty amazing. Mostly Limestone, but some Gneiss up around Les Contaimines too. Anyone done much in the area? Be a great Plan B for avoiding shit weather in Cham.
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I've done some stuff around there - it's far from the world's best limestone to be honest. I never got round to doing any of less accessible cliffs and, annoyingly, never got round to doing any routes on Maladiere which ticks the bill -
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crag.php?id=9406
Annoyingly it pretty much catches all the shitty weather anyway and can get mighty hot in summer.
I always wanted to do one of the classics on the Fiz - but the amount of effort required to get there always put me off (more inspiring things to do for the same amount of effort elsewhere)
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I think being based in Les Gets makes it a bit easier than Cham.
I quite look of http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crag.php?id=16974 more suited to punters like me, but approach looks a bitch
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From Let Gets there's also a lot to do it the Valée du Giffre.
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Yep. A lot is single pitch though. Some amazing runelled slabs.
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Hard to tell the scale of the picture. How many pitches of Vertical Death Grass is that at the top?
60 m of dangerous grassy ungraded climbing according to the topo in PdL. Honestly, I suspect that that pitch is the least of worries.
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Routes that might make it into a less Franco-centric version of the Parois du Legend books: Europe (http://www.vagabondsdelaverticale.com/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-parois-d-europe.html) and the Rest of the World (http://www.vagabondsdelaverticale.com/parois-de-legende-les-plus-belles-parois-du-monde.html) (16 18 so far, since you ask).
The Parois de Legende books are now a single volume (http://unevieagrimper.blogspot.co.uk/2011/04/parois-de-legende.html).
As Vertebrate don't look to be bringing out an English translation I'm buying one from M. Petit at Ceuse this June. PM me if you'd like a signed copy.
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The Parois de Legende books are now a single volume (http://unevieagrimper.blogspot.co.uk/2011/04/parois-de-legende.html).
Holy shit! I've done one of the routes. :o
Anybody who looked through the contents page for the easiest route in the book wouldn't be far wrong as to which one.
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If sport routes can qualify, Wassersymphonie (http://www.bergsteigen.at/pic/pdf/530_Topo_c07741a5-1750-4053-8c6e-486532de8325_wassersymphonie.pdf) in the Berchtesgaden Alps is supposed to be a classic, little known outside the German speaking world. 15 ptiches total, crux 6c+, half a dozen pitches around 6b. (Disclaimer: my experience of this route consists of having read the guidebook and looked at it from the road. It is firmly on my "some day but not yet" list. Along with the V-M)
[/quote]
Went and climbed Wasser back in 2012.
It's a proper good day out with some stunning climbing higher up. The picture is on one of the easier pitches that must rate as 3* HVS in its own right.
It's well bolted but has a slightly tricky walk back down that we sussed out the day before.
Nice little Gasthof in the village before for a Weizen beer afterwards.
Crags around here look amazing in general.
The routes on the Sonneck (Kaiser) also look stunning.
No queues down there.
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Good to know. I was thinking of shifting it from the "aspriational" to the "realistic" section of the to do list. I have yet to onsight 6c+ though ... but six pitches up on the Alpwand would be a cool place to do it.
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Ok folks - packing for the America trip (just handed in my Thesis YYFY!).
Bivvy kit for the Incredible Hulk - what do you recommend? Bivvy bag & mat, stove?
What's the deal with storing food? I've heard some chat about bear canisters?
Is it likely that the stream will still be flowing in Sendtember?
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Ok folks - packing for the America trip (just handed in my Thesis YYFY!).
Bivvy kit for the Incredible Hulk - what do you recommend? Bivvy bag & mat, stove?
What's the deal with storing food? I've heard some chat about bear canisters?
Is it likely that the stream will still be flowing in Sendtember?
Was there a couple of weeks ago. I took a lightweight tent, though one chap was just dossing in a bivy bag (with his dog!). If you get a permit for overnight use, then they ask to check whether you have a bear barrel or not - I had one anyway, so used it. Bears are always around, though your biggest problem will likely be snafflehounds - people without bear canisters were using all manner of hanging their food out of reach of pesky rodents...
Dunno whether stream will still be flowing - you could ask on supertopo and you may get a reasonable answer (though I wouldn't count on it...) - I used water filter/purification and was glad of it - that area is seeing more and more use...
Great place - enjoy
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Ok folks - packing for the America trip (just handed in my Thesis YYFY!).
Bivvy kit for the Incredible Hulk - what do you recommend? Bivvy bag & mat, stove?
What's the deal with storing food? I've heard some chat about bear canisters?
Is it likely that the stream will still be flowing in Sendtember?
Do Sunspot Dihedral - its better than pos vibes
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Ok folks - packing for the America trip (just handed in my Thesis YYFY!).
Bivvy kit for the Incredible Hulk - what do you recommend? Bivvy bag & mat, stove?
What's the deal with storing food? I've heard some chat about bear canisters?
Is it likely that the stream will still be flowing in Sendtember?
Yeah - you should be using a bear canister up there, you can rent them from the wilderness centre.
Stream, not sure, was a good snow year but water is getting pretty low everywhere in the Sierra.
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You need to get a Wilderness permit as well. These are actually limited.
We used bivvy bag etc. but others there at the same time had tents and it was fairly windy. The fishing shop in a 'nearby' town rents bear canisters (the exact info will be on Mountain Proj.; it's also likely that stream beta will be available).
I thought red dihedral was a bit average and kept looking longingly at Positive Vibrations / Sunspot.
I take it you've got the MP approach beta with the photograph of the 'large flat rock'? Generally the walk isn't as bad as people make out; for one route I'd have been happy to get an early start/late finish rather than as we did, taking in gear to sleep, do one route and walk out in the same day (i.e. the 2nd).
We came pretty much straight from sea level which was a mistake and I had to climb with a constant headache.
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I had to climb with a constant headache.
But you still love her ;)
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I'd agree the walk in is not that bad and it's well doable to do the thing in a long day. Not sure if this has been mentioned but I'd suggest going midweek. We went on a weekend and were behind loads of slow choppers. In fact we ended up soloing/simuling some shit variation to the red dihedral on shit kitty-litter granite.
Wish I had been going well enough to do positive vibes. Was being a bit of a chopper myself that trip.
It's a cool place to go climbing - I'm keen to head back someday
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I thought red dihedral was a bit average and kept looking longingly at Positive Vibrations / Sunspot.
I've just re-read this and realised how negative it sounds; please note it's in the context of being on a 6 month tour of the very best the Western USA could offer.
(https://c7.staticflickr.com/4/3684/9460820406_d756797b9b_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/fq2bid)The Incredible Hulk, 11,020' (https://flic.kr/p/fq2bid) by travelswithmyt4 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/39660023@N03/), on Flickr
Is there also some headache (paying / permitting etc.) surrounding parking?
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Not like you to be negative Paul, must have been the altitude.
Anyone with experience of both able to compare it to the Bugs?
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Not like you to be negative Paul, must have been the altitude.
I'll take overly negative.
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Not like you to be negative Paul, must have been the altitude.
Anyone with experience of both able to compare it to the Bugs?
Just been to both in the last month or so.
They're pretty different - the hulk feels like high mountain cragging (albeit, some of the most stellar granite cragging there is) and the bivy/camping is casual - it's a truly beautiful spot, but the views from it you could be in several places in the Sierra - objective danger is mostly limited to afternoon thunderstorms creeping up on you. Highly recommended.
The bugs definitely feel alpine with all the additional objective hazards that that brings - have to carry axe/crampons etc and you always have an eye on the weather - lots of accidents up there... But they're truly unique, rock quality is mostly excellent and when you're up on a spire looking out, you can only be in one place - most highly recommended! Patagonia-lite for those of us without time to get there...
Both places becoming ever more popular though - it would be rare to have them to yourselves unless climbing off-season. Best stick to Baffin if you want some solitude...
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Lots more great tips, cheers.
We'll aim for our bigger routes midweek and try to travel between places on the weekends. I think by the time we'll be at the Hulk it'll be outside staffed season for the permits, so it's self cert time I think.
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Anyone got some good beta on the best places to grab a shower in the US? We're dossing in a van, usually roadside. My partner needs active encouragement to bother washing...
Long's Peak was fun, trad climbing at 4000m makes grades a bit arbitrary!
Now off to Gunnison...
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Black Canyon?!
Big truck stops on the interstates always have pay to use showers (they were generally good too).
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Quite a lot of State Parks have pay / free showers in the campground. You usually need to pay to drive into the state park or use the campground, but you could just walk into it with a small bag with shower kit in it.
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Five good Alpine rockaneering (https://www.thebmc.co.uk/rockaneering-ticklist-best-long-rock-routes-europe) (didn't they get the memo?) routes from the BMC. The Gelbe Mauer, the Spigolo Nord Monte Agnèr (1600m!), and the W. Grat of Salbitschijen all meet the criteria and are reputedly bonafide classics.
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Black Canyon?!
Hell Yeah! Just had 2 days there, not half as sketchy as the reputation - I'd happily go back but maybe a month later when the south facing stuff I more bareable.
Made it up a 5.11c thin hands pitch (the lightning bolt crack) in my broken-in TC Pros, with comfort - turns out they are the best of both worlds! Happy days!
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Black Canyon?!
Hell Yeah! Just had 2 days there, not half as sketchy as the reputation - I'd happily go back but maybe a month later when the south facing stuff I more bareable.
Made it up a 5.11c thin hands pitch (the lightning bolt crack) in my broken-in TC Pros, with comfort - turns out they are the best of both worlds! Happy days!
Would love to hear more info about the black canyon when you get a chance
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What d'ya wanna know?
It was too hot for the South Side sunny routes (The Cruise/Scenic Cruise Etc.), but everything on the Comic Releif buttress was fine (shady) with an early start. Prime time is late Sep/Early October, or April(ish).
We had no problems with Poison Ivy and if you have survived Gogarth approaches then the descent gullies are a cakewalk.
The climbing is great! Featured gneis, but climbs more like granite than Hebrides gneiss. Grades see friendly, few chimneys/offwidths and the cracks climb quite well due to reasonably featured rock (when compared to yosemite/squamish).
It's quite remote, no phone reception. Campsite is $15/night but the ranger let us doss in the van for free, I doubt this is common though. There's a guidebook in the ranger station (North rim) which they let you make copies of.
Go, GO, GOOO!
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Black Canyon?!
Hell Yeah! Just had 2 days there, not half as sketchy as the reputation - I'd happily go back but maybe a month later when the south facing stuff I more bareable.
Made it up a 5.11c thin hands pitch (the lightning bolt crack) in my broken-in TC Pros, with comfort - turns out they are the best of both worlds! Happy days!
Glad you're liking the TC Pro's :)
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Black Canyon?!
Hell Yeah! Just had 2 days there, not half as sketchy as the reputation - I'd happily go back but maybe a month later when the south facing stuff I more bareable.
Made it up a 5.11c thin hands pitch (the lightning bolt crack) in my broken-in TC Pros, with comfort - turns out they are the best of both worlds! Happy days!
Would love to hear more info about the black canyon when you get a chance
Lets go someday! Well psyched to check out the Black!
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Anyone wise to the potential within striking distance of Munich? Got a meeting there next month and looks like the easyjet schedule will force us to have a day spare...
PS if Dunc C is reading, where's the Lundy trip report?
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Something in the Rofan range?
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Read German and/or got google translate bookmarked? Good.
How hard?
I mentioned Wassersymphonie (http://www.bergsteigen.com/klettern/salzburg/berchtesgadener-alpen/wassersymphonie) in the berchtesgadener Alps right back at the beginning of this thread. 15 pitches 6c+ (on one pitch). I still haven’t done it, but have done another route on the same wall in September and it was fine conditions-wise. But: 15 pitches, long approach, north facing … might not be the best bet in October.
Shorter, south facing, harder & more sustained, supposed to be a classic but way out of my league: Tschi-Tschi (http://www.stadler-markus.de/alpinklettern/sonstige/routeninfos/beschreibung/tschi-tschi.html) on the Martinswand in Innsbruck. There are plenty of other easier multipitch routes on the Martinswand but they’re rather slabby and samey.
Feeling brave? Locker vom Hocker (http://www.alpinrouten.de/files/routen/z_locker.htm) on the Schüsselkarpsitze. Was reckoned to be a contender for hardest rock route in the alps when Kurt’n’Wolfie did it. Gets UIAA “8” which normally translates as 7a, but better thought of as “early 80s cutting edge” so probably around E5/6 or so. And don’t forget the thousand metres height gain on the two and a half hour approach. (The beer is better at the higher of the two huts halfway up. Or down) Not too long though, and fantastic area scenically.
(Sorry, couldn’t find a good online topo for L vom H. Check it out on google images though)
Haven't done much in the Rofan, bu it certainly looks like a good bet for not too long autumn multipitch on good rock, with a lift to take the sting out of the approach. There are other areas closer to Munich that have shorter multipitch routes on immaculate rock - Ross & Buchstein, Plankenstein, Leonhardstein - but they probably don't qualify as "fairly long".
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The climbing is great! Featured gneis, but climbs more like granite than Hebrides gneiss. Grades see friendly, few chimneys/offwidths and the cracks climb quite well due to reasonably featured rock (when compared to yosemite/squamish).
It's quite remote, no phone reception. Campsite is $15/night but the ranger let us doss in the van for free, I doubt this is common though. There's a guidebook in the ranger station (North rim) which they let you make copies of.
Go, GO, GOOO!
That's great. I'd love to go but the season doesn't fit ideally with times I can take off at present.
Anyone wise to the potential within striking distance of Munich? Got a meeting there next month and looks like the easyjet schedule will force us to have a day spare...
Wilder Kaiser or Fleischbank (Kaisergeberge) about 90 minutes just over the border in Austria?
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That's brilliant, thanks. Wassersymphonie looks amazing indeed, but something shorter will be sensible yeah. Just finding the crag and the approach is going to be key I think. Its going to be a day hit in a hire car, although we may be able to bag a doss in Innsbruck.
Shorter, south facing, harder & more sustained, supposed to be a classic but way out of my league: Tschi-Tschi on the Martinswand in Innsbruck. There are plenty of other easier multipitch routes on the Martinswand but they’re rather slabby and samey.
This looks perfect, albeit I haven't a clue what the grades mean. It gets 8 like the other one, just less old-school gnarl?
There are other areas closer to Munich that have shorter multipitch routes on immaculate rock - Ross & Buchstein, Plankenstein, Leonhardstein -
Sounds great too, I'll do some research...
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"8" on the Tschi-Tschi topo is UIAA VIII =~ 7a. (And Martinswand grades are tough)
Martinswand is probably the best bet for a quick single day hit with no navigational difficulties, although it gets a bit loud because its directly above the autobahn. It's a big roadside crag, whereas the other places I mentioned have alpine approaches with a bit of a march where it helps to know where you're going.
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Ross & Buchstein, Plankenstein, Leonhardstein -
There's enough puns there to last a lifetime.
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Black Canyon?!
Hell Yeah! Just had 2 days there, not half as sketchy as the reputation - I'd happily go back but maybe a month later when the south facing stuff I more bareable.
Made it up a 5.11c thin hands pitch (the lightning bolt crack) in my broken-in TC Pros, with comfort - turns out they are the best of both worlds! Happy days!
Glad you're liking the TC Pro's :)
Yeah - more so than I expected and on sale in REI so double winner. I thought I'd maybe got them a half size big when climbing on Long's Peak, but now I'm in the heat of the desert they're spot on! (same size as I run in most scarpas, 43.5) I wee bit stiff and clumsy for those thin fingers/fingers splitters, but in the thin hands and above sizes, best shoe I've used.
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Quick Question: I am in Stanford for a few weeks and have very little time for climbing, but I might have time to go to Yosemite this week end. I have never been, and this will have to be a blitz visit, so I wont have too much time to punter around. Well. Question: Do I need a camalot #5 (new sizes) for Astroman? Do I need a camalot #6 for Rostrum or is it OK to run it out on the offwidths?
(+ I put up some pitch-notes for two moderate routes in Gorge de la Jonte + three in Verdon on my blog, http://steepground.blogspot.fr/ )
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punter around. Well. Question: Do I need a camalot #5 (new sizes) for Astroman?
only know it up to the Harding slot (late start...)
a 5 isn't necessary at all, but a 6 is handy.
without a 6 you are condemning yourself to either of the following scenarios:
1) a hard aid-to-squeeze-chimney transition. much easier with a 6.
2) freeing the boulder problem on the Harding slot.
then in both cases you will run it out for 5 meters of the tightest squeeze, though the 6 is mainly psychological there : i'ts so tight that if you slip, you'll probably get stuck well before weighting the cam... ;D
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A large cam would be an impediment on Astroman. There is good gear by your knee for the transition into the slot and, as ghisino says, you're not going to fall out once you are in.
The Rostrum is a harder call. I had just a number 4 and it seemed OK but I was young, dumb and had climbed a number of Yosemite offwidths already. If I recall correctly, the 10a 6th pitch has a bolt half way up and the last pitch has some 5.9 is fairly low but gradually eases as you get higher. Might be chilly up there at this time of year and the last pitch can stay damp for a short time after rain.
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The off-width on the Rostrum is pretty steady as I remember. I'd only take a big cam if it's a real weak spot of yours. The top pitch is very short, I don't remember it being an off-width, more a layback, but I'm sure Duncan is right. There is repeated footage of it on that Honnold news doc.
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If I remember rightly, there's an RP on the offwidth pitch. That's me casting my mind back 20+ years, so I may have got that wrong though. As JB says it's steady away anyway...
(As an aside, my partner fell out of the bottom of the Harding Slot on Astroman and pulled his (red?) Camelot straight out of the slick crack).
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Haven't done Astroman, but on the Rostrum we had a big cam.
On the 10b offwidth pitch (aka the UK crux!) I think I had a 4.5 in somewhere then, with advice from above, placed the big one. I then spent 20 minutes trying to get past it, before slipping a little and ending up standing on it....
It's kind nice to have it for the final 5.9, but you can only shuffle it so far before it risks getting eaten and joining the stomach of the chimney along wit it's many other meals!
I think that route ranks in my all time top 10, not that I have one, but if I did, it would.
If you're talking about The Rostrum, then no, there aren't any RPs as far I can remember from 3 years ago.
If I remember rightly, there's an RP on the offwidth pitch. That's me casting my mind back 20+ years, so I may have got that wrong though. As JB says it's steady away anyway...
(As an aside, my partner fell out of the bottom of the Harding Slot on Astroman and pulled his (red?) Camelot straight out of the slick crack).
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Still super inspired by this thread, and in the process of trying to plan some sort of Euro trip this summer. In the same spirit, but incorporating a more modest grade and level of commitment.
I wondered if any of you had done much in the Bregaglia, particularly the Bondasca valley? Piz Badile is the thing that's been mentioned previously, but I'm quite interested in some of the stuff near the Sciora hut. There appears to be some cragging up there, and also some slightly longer things like Via Di Mezzo on Torre Innominata (10 pitch 6a+) on clean granite without any snowy complications.
Any intel would be much appreciated...
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On a similar vein...
Any suggestions for a ~10 pitch route, climbable in June, around the 6c/7a mark, with a relatively non-epic walk-in, that is in striking distance of someone driving from/to the uk to/from Briacon? Obviously it needs to be a three star classic in a spectacular isolated location with surprisingly convenient parking.
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Eh... in Briançon perhaps??? There are tons of stuff in and around the Ecrins. Alas, I have neither the guide books nor the knowledge but some friends did “Ici mieux qu'en face” on Tour Termier and said it was a good 7a with a short boulder problem on the 7b pitch.
https://www.camptocamp.org/routes/175360/fr/tour-termier-ici-mieux-qu-en-face
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otherwise Fontainebleau is somewhere in the middle. Do a circuit. ;D
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On a similar vein...
Any suggestions for a ~10 pitch route, climbable in June, around the 6c/7a mark, with a relatively non-epic walk-in, that is in striking distance of someone driving from/to the uk to/from Briacon? Obviously it needs to be a three star classic in a spectacular isolated location with surprisingly convenient parking.
Trad or sport?
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Thanks Jwi :-[ it would be fair to say that i know pretty much nothing about climbing in France (apart from Font...).
Fultonius sport ideally, or sport-esque.
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Nik - there's a lifetime's worth of good stuff around Briancon at roughly that length and grade range. June is a lovely time to visit too. There are a few suggestions in this post (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,18533.msg332275.html#msg332275) from a few years ago. Of those, Voie des Maitres is the only one with a really short walk in (15 mns ish), but the others all have straightforward approaches (up to a couple of hours for the Dibona).
I'd also highly recommend the Tenailles de Montbrison (https://www.camptocamp.org/waypoints/40844/fr/tenailles-de-montbrison), which you can see looking down the valley towards L'Argentiere la Bessee from Briancon. I really enjoyed Vol et Volupté (https://www.camptocamp.org/routes/55073/fr/tenailles-de-montbrison-vol-et-volupte) (just a couple of pitches at 6b), but I'm sure some of the harder stuff is great too. The approach is pretty straightforward, as long as you're willing to drive your car along a rough track for a few kilometres.
Yossarian - the Piz Badile is great. Obviously there's the classic N Face route (Voie Cassin), but also Another Day in Paradise (https://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=5706), which is bolted and very popular.
I haven't climbed in the Bondasca Valley much, but Val di Mello isn't too far away and could be worth considering if you're in the region for a while (again, a few suggestions here (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,18533.msg332275.html#msg332275)).
These are all really beautiful areas - enjoy! ;D
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Jwi had a proper look at your suggestion and it seems pretty bang on so thanks for that :)
Sammo top information thanks :2thumbsup:
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Sammo - thanks for your suggestions. I have the Mellor PDF guide thing which includes Another Day in Paradise. That does look really good. I've also just discovered the Kasper Pillar on the Ago Di Sciora which looks relatively straightforward and in another amazing setting.
I think we're going to have to be quite flexible depending on the weather - more time there if it's good, and if not we'll try somewhere else.
The Ecrins suggestions are really interesting too - the Tenailles de Montbrison particularly. We have about 10-12 days, so might add that to the list of options.
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I wondered if any of you had done much in the Bregaglia, particularly the Bondasca valley? Piz Badile is the thing that's been mentioned previously, but I'm quite interested in some of the stuff near the Sciora hut. There appears to be some cragging up there, and also some slightly longer things like Via Di Mezzo on Torre Innominata (10 pitch 6a+) on clean granite without any snowy complications.
Some further routes that in the Bregaglia region that have not been mentioned:
Cuore di Ferro on Bügeleisen (lower part of Pizzi Gemelli), 14 pitches, 6c. Impressive face, clean granite, good slabby climbing. The parts 6b and harder are reasonably bolted, quite a few runouts in the 5c/6a terrain. Small rack required. Quick abseil descent.
Hofmeister Jubiläum on Torre Innominata (left of the Sciora Group), 9 pitches, 6c. Cool and demanding route on nice rock. Bolts where required, small rack necessary. Quick abseil descent.
Via Diretta Integrale on Sciora di Fuori, 22 pitches, 6c. Classical route to an impressive peak. Hardest bit is short and can be aided, mostly moderate climbing in the 5a-6a range. Long and tricky alpine descent.
Piodakante on Punta Pioda, 1000m, 5c. Long and mostly easy climbing, best way to get down is by abseiling.
In case the weather is not sufficiently stable, there is also some worthwhile multipitch climbing around Chiavenna. See this website for an overview and topos: http://www.campingacquafraggia.com/climbindex_en.htm. I for example enjoyed Gundam & Tatiana on Sench di Dalo (14 pitches, 6c+) very much.
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Piodakante on Punta Pioda looks incredible!
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Has anyone got any useful intel / advice about stuff on or near to the Eiger?
I know there's some harder stuff like Deep Blue Sea (7b+ / 11 pitches) but I'm struggling to find much else.
We've been toying with the idea of trying to include a visit into our summer trip, maybe a bit of the west flank, the Rostock via ferrara, etc. But as much as I want to screw Montaine's wife, waste Pope a little and find Jemima Brown a room for the night, I keep reminding myself it's a teetering pile of choss and we might be better served elsewhere...
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Some very good beta from mde in this thread (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,25756)
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I too am interested in the Eiger routes. But I need some hard-won personal opinion...!
I have a sneaking suspicion that these routes may be more regarded for their proximity to the true north face than their out-and-out quality. If I'm going to put my neck on the line (the Eiger still has loose rock, bad weather etc. etc.) I want to know the route is going to be top notch, with an inspiring line and a great top out. I'm yet to be convinced the Rote Fluhe will provide this? :-\
Other options would be back on the Grand Cap, or Picos de Europe.
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The weather sounds like a major issue. Didn't Dean Potter wait about six weeks before conditions were good enough for him to consider doing his solo?
We've added Salbitschijen to the list. West Ridge, plus Hammerbruch and GKB sound good too...
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This place https://www.mountainproject.com/v/hintisberg/107318024 (https://www.mountainproject.com/v/hintisberg/107318024) is actually more what I was looking for in the Eiger area in the first place. Nice views without quite so much hassle / danger / commitment...
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Does a girdle traverse belong in here? Perhaps a future addition if we can stretch the 'Fairly' to 'extremely'
https://vagabondsdelaverticale.wordpress.com/2017/05/25/la-traversee-de-ceuse/
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This (https://lecturis.nl/en/product/multi-pitch-climbing-in-europe/) looks like it could be good. 4-22 pitches which slighly extends our brief. Fairhead is the only place in the UK to make the cut, which is not unreasonable.
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Friend in Kenya pointed out that the Cat and Mouse formations featured here https://youtu.be/mvOzAB8j5Eg (https://youtu.be/mvOzAB8j5Eg) are not a particularly long drive from Nairobi...
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This (https://lecturis.nl/en/product/multi-pitch-climbing-in-europe/) looks like it could be good. 4-22 pitches which slighly extends our brief. Fairhead is the only place in the UK to make the cut, which is not unreasonable.
The topos look to be of the type that turn out to be next to useless when on the route?
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This (https://lecturis.nl/en/product/multi-pitch-climbing-in-europe/) looks like it could be good. 4-22 pitches which slighly extends our brief. Fairhead is the only place in the UK to make the cut, which is not unreasonable.
I flipped through it at Au vieux Campeur. Nice photos, good layout and I cannot fault the choices destinations and routes. I couldn't see the value proposition compared to Parois de Legend (except being written in English). Didn't like the topos much, and I'm pretty confident camptocamp is a better source for info on most routes in the alps and the pyrenees.
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...Parois de Legend (except being written in English).
I asked on Instagram and was told an English version was in the pipeline.
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I flipped through it at Au vieux Campeur. Nice photos, good layout and I cannot fault the choices destinations and routes. I couldn't see the value proposition compared to Parois de Legend (except being written in English). Didn't like the topos much, and I'm pretty confident camptocamp is a better source for info on most routes in the alps and the pyrenees.
Thanks.
...Parois de Legend (except being written in English).
I asked on Instagram and was told an English version was in the pipeline.
I asked the man himself this time last year my understanding was he's updating Parois de Legend (Saharan destinations sadly unrealistic for the foreseeable) and there might be an English translation of the new version. I tried to persuade him that Hoy should make the cut but I'm not sure he was convinced.
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This (https://lecturis.nl/en/product/multi-pitch-climbing-in-europe/) looks like it could be good. 4-22 pitches which slighly extends our brief. Fairhead is the only place in the UK to make the cut, which is not unreasonable.
I flipped through it at Au vieux Campeur. Nice photos, good layout and I cannot fault the choices destinations and routes. I couldn't see the value proposition compared to Parois de Legend (except being written in English). Didn't like the topos much, and I'm pretty confident camptocamp is a better source for info on most routes in the alps and the pyrenees.
Had a brief look through this in llanberis last week (joe brown have a copy) and wasn't impressed, although I only read the fair head chapter. Perhaps the rest is better.. Only one route described, a completely inadequate topo (you're not to go somewhere like fairhead without the guide..) and written very much in a 'what we did on our holiday' style and then turned into a coffee table book. Nil point
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I've had a closer look at this and broadly agree with the above comments though, typically, Pete is a bit blunt! It's nicely done, some of the photos are good but it's the same people thoughout, a bit like a series of blog posts. It's aiming to inspire rather than guide, and the topos are more or less worthless since, for many of the routes, navigating to the start is not trivial and this is not covered at all. They are there to make sense of the text I imagine. It has lots of good ideas, though no more than this thread.
Martin must be a ukb lurker :wave: since Bears on Toast (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,18533.msg329843.html#msg329843) is featured!
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4203/35279601496_2643e532fe_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/VKxbpj)
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Fuck me. I thought we had proper wasserrillen in the Alps.
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http://www.rockandice.com/climbing-news/ruby-supernova-first-ascent-of-520-meter-trad-route-in-south-africa
Looks like great climbing up an amazing bit of rock (which I've only seen from afar).
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Slightly off topic - does anyone have any suggestions for shorter (1-3) pitch cracks in Val di Mello? Towards the easier end of the scale, though if it's single pitch I might be inclined to go for it...
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Erm, the only thing I did when I was there was this fun run-out bolted single pitch 6c wide flake crack on the huge boulder near the road. Great fun!
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=378411
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Got back from our trip a few days ago. Quite an exciting fortnight. We decided to base ourselves at Chiavenna rather than Bondo (more on that later), which turned out to be a great location. The campsite website has PDFs for a lot of the local crags - http://www.campingacquafraggia.com/climbindex_en.htm (http://www.campingacquafraggia.com/climbindex_en.htm). We climbed at Sasso Biancho, Bette and Sasso del Drago, the latter being my favourite. Went to look at Placche del Boggia - a huge 5-6 pitch slab that you ab into from the side of the road - but it totally shat me up, so we abandoned that idea. There is plenty of decent bouldering within 15-20 mins of Chiavenna too - I spent an enjoyable if unproductive afternoon at Cimaganda - one of the prettiest climbing spots I've visited.
The plan was to climb mountain granite routes, so we got on the Spazzacaldera early in the trip and did the superb Via Felici. Had a minor epic figuring out how to gain the easy ridge to the summit, and then there wasn't enough day left to climb the Fiamma pinnacle on top. The descent freaked me out a bit too, then we realised we'd missed the last cable car down and so had a long walk. Some pics:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4388/36492343760_cd0ea2f163_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4388/36718139982_efd44a322c_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4419/36054667544_1fe4e70341_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4378/36492389630_1aa85fdecd_b.jpg)
I also started to come to the conclusion that, whilst I like the idea of rock routes in the mountains, the reality of putting contact lenses on in the middle of the night with a Fernet Branca hangover, and being constantly reminded of the need to hurry up all day long is not really my cup off tea. Nor is climbing with a rucksack, nor seriously entertaining the idea of shitting into a plastic bag. Anyway, I digress...
Next we nipped down to Val di Mello. I had already pretty much abandoned hope of climbing the longer classics such as Luna Nascente, Kundalini, etc as both my climbing / rope work / crag admin was all over the place after more than a decade of indolent sloth. We had fun on some easier things like Mixomiceto, Tunnel Diagonale, etc. And did some good bouldering at Bagni di Misino.
Then we decided that it was about time we went for one of thew original objectives, Via di Mezzo on the Torre Innominata, back over in Switzerland. The night before we left, we heard about the huge rockfall off Cengalo that had caused the landslide which obliterated most of the valley leading down to Bondo. One of the chaps we'd climbed with some days before had seen a pretty big rockfall a couple of days before - I think he mentioned something about a 1km dust cloud viewed from above the Sciora hut, so god knows what the big one was like. 4 million cubic metres of rock fell down apparently.
So we drove to Bondo and it was immediately apparent that we weren't getting up anything that way. So we continued on to the Albigna cablecar and decided to try our luck that way. We climbed up from the cablecar / bottom of the Spazzacaldera along the path opposite the Albigna hut and over the Cacciabella pass. A pretty awesome adventure in itself. As we began the climb down the various ladders and chains, we saw a helicopter taking off from the Sciora hut with loads of gear hanging underneath. When we finally reached the hut it turned out to be closed up. Made some dinner, fell asleep in the tent, to be woken up by another helicopter and a bloke banging on the tent. It turned out that the Swiss authorities wanted to evacuate the whole valley. So later on that morning we got a lift down. We didn't do the route which I'd been looking forward to for the past 6 months, but we did get our pictures in La Liberte. There was another big landslide later that day apparently.
Cengalo is disintegrating in real time, and I think all the routes near it (the Bügeleisen, etc) are probably no go for the foreseeable future. I imagine the Sciora hut will be closed for a while as the access path and the road up to the parking at Laret are mostly destroyed.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4358/36774280061_0a1a5d1fba_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4387/36774294151_dccc3e1d4d_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4353/36106010593_1227ea2478_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4438/36718018142_682f3f38d0_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4356/36517463940_0fd6c28dae_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4434/36079806324_c15e06d57a_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4380/36492202020_497da48bac_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4398/36717967222_54a0f784a7_b.jpg)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4412/36517473990_08a84aa277_b.jpg)
https://vimeo.com/231514116
So, a pretty decent trip, but with slightly too much excitement of the wrong sort. Really looking forward to lots of uncomplicated sea level trad and sport climbing now...
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Ouch. We are living in interesting times.
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Thanks for this. A bit too much excitement for a first time back climbing in some time
I feel for the people of Bondo, not sure I'd fancy moving back in a hurry. I guess the North side of Piz Badile will need to be approached from Italy for a while.
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Two of the guys we climbed with did the Cassin route 2-3 days before the rockfall. They did the Laret / Sasc Fura approach, then descended the south side via the Gianetti hut to Val Masino. I'd not fully recognised that Val di Mello, etc backs right on to it. Still, doing the Badile North face routes would be a pain as you'd have a big climb up, then have to abseil down the North ridge which by all accounts is not much fun.
I think there's a lot of work to do to sort Bondo out, but there was a lot of heavy machinery arriving when we left - hopefully it won't take too long.
One other thing I forgot to mention - the bouldering around Chiavenna was included in the old Mello bouldering guide, but left out in the newer edition. Not sure what guide it will end up in / or at all, which would be a pity as it was great.
Quite a few of the boulders covered by the new guide were pretty grown over - I think locals develop new areas and then move on, so the obvious roadside stuff remains popular and clean, whilst things off the beaten track return to their natural state.
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Pinzgawurm, SE face of the Birnhorn, 8- (6c), 2150m of climbing in 45 pitches, 1450m height gain. Adi Stocker and Toni Niedermühlbichler, 2012.
Requires "a nice long, if possible sunny, summer day" and probably an early start. I bet the beers taste good afterwards.
(http://www.schmidt-zabierow.at/media/Pinzga009.JPG)
Topo and description (https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.schmidt-zabierow.at/pages/klettern/pinzgawurm-45sl.php&prev=search). Heroic equiping job: imagine climbing ~30 pitches with your recharged batteries before you can start drilling again.
A thread nudge and a reminder of how much climbing there is in the Eastern and Southern Alps off the radar to Anglophones. The Birnhorn is east of Kitzbühel, only two hours from Munich, the lucky bastards.
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I don't know if we have had it before, but L'artisan du 8ème jour in Aiglun is really rather good, a bit on the short side perhaps (225m or so?). It is likely as good as Alix, punk de Vergons on the Duc, but harder and way more physical. It has a gazzillon bolts and no runout parts.
We started in fog, with a forcast calling for thunderstorms in the afternoon. I had just a print out of a topo pinched from camptocamp and no info on the approach so it took us almost one and half hour to find the start, in lieu of the normal 20 minutes.
The first pitch (7b/c) was not an optimal warmup, covered in a layer of slimy dew, but it was OK with some points of aid... It was seriously late already after the first pitch but the second pitch (6c) wasn't even overhanging and looked very nice so I talked us into going up to the third pitch to "check it out". The 2nd pitch was the first and last pitch where the haul bag didn't swing out in space when released from the belay. Very nice though.
The third pitch (7b+) has a tufa that looks absolutely dément from the belay: a fifteen metre long solitary tufa up the very steepest part of the wall. "Surely it's just black because that's the colour of tufas, right?" Brilliant climbing up to the black tufa (one blatantly chipped hold on a blank wall to reach it). The tufa was black because it was absolutely soaked, but submitted to easy gorilla aid/french free (I'm not exactly Adam Ondra). Probably 3 stars if dry. Belay from a big juniper tree sticking out in the middle of the steepest part of the route. From this point bailing starts to be complicated.
The forth pitch (7b) was the cream of the cream. Extraordinary sustained climbing with a bit of everything. Amazing. Wow.
Don't try to link the short fifth 6c/7a pitch and the sixth pitch (6b+) without a few really long slings and at least 15-16 quickdraws. I ran out of quickdraws three draws from the belay. Both these pitches are overhanging as well, even the 6b+ (sustained climbing on jugs). The 7a+ that follows is probably the second or third best pitch on the route, sustained on pockets with a short slightly puzzling crux on my favourite style of pockets. Just slightly overhanging, no more than a two metres in twenty-five.
Then the thunderstorm hit.
The last pitch of real climbing (7a+) is probably quite good, the first part is steep enough to protect you from torrential rain. It ends with an elegant mantleshelf move onto a waterfall. Belay above the lip. Water from above, standing in the stream that forms on the 3b pitch to the top.
I never been as wet in my life. I've been colder though, so it is ok.
My friend's wife called mountain rescue when we didn't return in time, didn't reply on the phone, didn't call (we tried but had no reception), but they wisely refused to go out with a helicopter in the weather. Anyway they managed to get hold of me when we were back at the car. They sounded more relived than I felt not having to go out in the storm.
I'm still wet.
Trouthèrapie, anyone? It's apparently better (but quite a bit harder)
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It ends with an elegant mantleshelf move onto a waterfall.
Sounds wonderful.
i remember doing the Amone slab in wet conditions and actually placing a friend in an underwater crack in a pool. never done that before.
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Haha, character building
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Route sounds great, experience sounds epic, glad you got off in one piece.
Aiglun has been mentioned before but I don't know of anyone who has ever climbed there. Did PaulB ever make it? Anyone done any of the easier stuff?
Had a thunderstorm near miss in the Verdon, deciding at the last minute not to try Les enragés, switched to something much shorter at the south end of l'Escalès on nothing more than gut feeling. This (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,20697.msg375245.html#msg375245) rather underplays the event, fortunately the rain overtook us after we had finished climbing but we were soaked to the skin in the time it took to sprint the 50m to the car. We'd have had a 'mare had it happened 2/3 up the Duc. It was a good warning to not underestimate Provençal afternoon storms.
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(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-CQyo8XIVTGc/WmpRGVm65FI/AAAAAAAAOHs/zx3XWxJXcS0Cpzy89QX3Nqa7ZFTUr0WvgCEwYBhgL/s1600/IMG_20180125_224605.jpg)
Another book to consider?
Im extremen Fels (1970), was arguably the book that launched coffee table selected climbs genre. Ken Wilson acknowledged its influence on Hard Rock (1975) and published a translation as Extreme Alpine Rock (1979). It focuses mainly on eastern Alpine rock routes, so firmly within the remit of this thread.
Moderne Zeiten (https://www.panico.de/moderne-zeiten.html) (Modern Times), has a similar remit with a more contemporary slant. There is a similar emphasis on the German-speaking alpine areas which dovetails nicely with the Francophile Parois de Legende. It’s questionable how modern it truly is when the hardest route is Deep Blue Sea (7b+) but it’s a good name, from the eponymous route on the Marmolada of course.
It’s reviewed here (https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=de&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=http://mdettling.blogspot.com/2018/01/moderne-zeiten.html%3Fm%3D1&xid=17259,15700023,15700124,15700126,15700149,15700168,15700186,15700190,15700201,15700208&usg=ALkJrhgIpy_9RuZGLY7L9NDrrguoGUaIDw) by Marcel Dettling (not unbiased, he contributed to it, but if UKC can get Rob Greenwood to review Nick Bullock...).
It looks good. I’ve only done a few of the routes but can vouch for their quality. It would be appropriate if Vertebrate published a translation in the spirit of their predecessor.
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looking good! What makes PdL particularly useful is that, aside from impeccable route choice, the topos and route descriptions are very good – correct and giving good indication what the actual difficulty is of freeing the route. So I was dismayed that topos wasn't included in this book. Hopefully the online topos / route descriptions that can be accessed through panico verlag's web are good.
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http://www.climbing.co.za/2018/08/slanghoek-amphitheater/
looks nice. So many choices in SA, but almost everyone just goes to Rocklands and boulders...
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I thought the multi pitch climbing in sa was second to none. It combined the proper adventure trad feel that I've only really felt on sea cliffs in this country, with the stunning Rock of the US. I climbed on blouberg and yellowwood amphitheatre, both of which require a fair bit of local knowledge to get to, but would recommend them to anyone.
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Glad you enjoyed it Ged. I did say "almost" everyone.
There is some great multipitch stuff elsewhere in the Cedarberg, as well as http://www.climbing.co.za/wiki/Klein_Winterhoek
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Marcel Dettling and his family have climbed a ten pitch new route Adam and Evi 7a+ (6b+ obl.) in the Freakonomics - Deep Blue Sea area of the Eiger Geneva Pillar. Looks very good. Copious beta and a topo on his blog (https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmdettling.blogspot.com%2F2018%2F08%2Feiger-nordwand-adam-evi-7a-10-sl.html&edit-text=).
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nl0lE4FUYOY/W3HztSPe3-I/AAAAAAAAPyg/cr2ZwklaVKEgcvIc0hKL_EYGLOjoHqgKgCLcBGAs/s640/Routenverlauf.jpg)
Photo topo: Marcel Dettling
Worth noting the hanging glacier above the west flank approach and descent (https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.co.uk&sl=de&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=http://mdettling.blogspot.com/2016/04/eisschlag-in-der-eiger-westflanke.html&xid=17259,15700021,15700124,15700149,15700186,15700191,15700201,15700214&usg=ALkJrhjFi03clcbGpL98k0QERQl0VPu1_A).
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My friend Lionel Catsoyannis recently finished bolting a new multipitch route in Verdon (left side) called Burne Out ("burne" means testicle in french). 7a+/b max, 6b+ mandatory.
as most Lionel's bolted routes it is very well bolted and the grades are not typical verdon old school sandbags - more in line with recent sport crags in south-east france. Yet i strongly suggest that you don't consider the route if you are at your absolute limit on these grades: the last pitch is both the hardest and the less aidable, and retreating from there would be quite an epic.
A very enjoyable outing in summer or any dry&warm period, featuring a spectacular yet relatively easy 30 meters roof pitch, and more conventional climbing. I think it may be the perfect "easy day out" if you are ticking 8's in la ramirole (not far away).
Do not climb the roof if wet, it may be fragile and dangerous in those conditions. you can scramble directly from the first belay station to the one after the roof (easy but unprotected)
There's a many pics and a topo on my blog, i can translate detailed approach instructions if anyone is interested. https://ggrimpe.com/burne-out/
https://goo.gl/maps/z29mJgo2AGu
(https://i0.wp.com/ggrimpe.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/40619886_10215172293494413_5046926128619454464_o.jpg)
(https://i2.wp.com/ggrimpe.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/IMG_20190218_092703.jpg)
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Looks well cool, and Lionel Catsoyannis is the author of one of the best multipitch routes I've climbed, so I'm keen. Looks like a good active restday if your climbing the Old School vertical walls on the right bank as well...
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Love that topo.
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Ok so you need to park your car in pont de l'artuby.
First check from the bridge that the riverbed is completely dry (often the case).
If dry, find a path on the Eastern side of the bridge, going south, parallel to the cliff 's edge. You will soon find a well marked path going down with many fixed ropes, metal steps etc. Normally used to get up after bungee jumping. Once below the bridge, follow the riverbed downstream until the huge cave is on your left.
If there's running water in the river do not go.
If there is some still water, you can abseil down a gully just opposite of the route (visible on the Google Earth link in my blog). Several short abseils on trees threads etc.
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Reviving this amazing thread once again...
Early on there was some mention of the Grand Capucin and related alpine rock routes. I keep thinking about the bit of the Bregaglia in which we failed to get much done two years ago. The Bondo / Cengalo rockfall has rendered that whole area pretty much inaccessible for the time being - you can reach the Sciora area as we did via a pass from the neighbouring valley, but the area is officially closed I think. (Having said that, I think Piz Badile is reachable now.)
Anyway, I’ve looking up routes on the Capucin and also things like the Salluard route on Point Adolphe Rey
(http://p9.storage.canalblog.com/91/00/1292139/98211649_o.jpg)
I’ve got absolutely no alpine or winter experience, though the chap I’d probably do this with has done a fair bit of ski mountaineering / serious off piste. As I understand it, the approach is about as straightforward as this stuff gets, esp from Courmayeur / the Helbronner lift.
I’m thinking ahead to a trip in a year or two, but am slightly unsure as to how much snow / ice preparation / training is required, and also (bearing in mind the lift costs a fortune) is the best plan to aim to camp up there for a few nights to get a decent hit on a few routes? That seemed to be the approach James Pearson and co took when they were working the Voie Petit.
Obviously there are plenty of options for alpine rock without snow approaches, but this stuff does look amazing and realistically it’s not like trying to climb K2 in a pair of tweed trousers...
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So when we were on the Voie Petit we camped on the little col just below the Helbronner lift. Lovely spot to be once the lift has shut. It is also common to camp in the middle of the glacier below the Grand Cap, wilder feel but you'll be more limited in what you can carry for camping - I think a lot of folk who do this walk from the Midi. We went for the stagger out of the lift with the kitchen sink. Seems to be less regulated than the French side where I think it is/was officially banned and occasionally they send some guides to clear all the skinflints.
The valley on the italian side of Mont Blanc is a lot nicer and low key than Cham, but the campsites are pricey.
Crevasses are limited on the main glacier, some small ones on the descent from the lift which can be easily avoided, the main issue is likely to crossing the bergschrund to the base of the route. Depending how cold the nights are you might not need crampons for the approach but they'll probably help mantelling out of a disintegrating 'schrund made of sugar.
Altitude may be an issue. I didn't find it find too bad, but the first day it will likely hit you at some point and definitely felt better the second trip up (we did something like three nights up, two down, two up). Also big temp variations from t-shirt sunburn scenes in the day to well below zero at night. Having pumped up my flagging exped down mattress in the cold of the night I returned after climbing to find the heat of the afternoon had blown it up like a ballloon, splitting the internal seams. Not ideal!
It's an amazing spot to climb and hangout. We didn't get on anything else, but the Petit Cap, Chandelle etc also have easier, shorter routes than the Grand which looked fun. Enjoy.
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+1 to everything JB said.
The walk from the Helbronner lift to the grand cap is easy (like, gentle stroll easy) and will be well tracked.
Safety/training wise, when I was younger I yomped about all over the shop unroped and never fell in a hole - you'd almost certainly be fine doing that on this approach. I'm more cautious now (just because I'm older and more of a coward) and tend rope up where possible/practical on wet glaciers as a rule. Almost all Europeans seem to, Brits mostly don't unless they're punters. I don't know why.
If you choose to rope up, my understanding is that if you're a pair and one of you goes in a crevasse, unless the person who fell can help to get themselves out, you will need someone else's help, so learning loads of complicated hoisting/hauling stuff isn't worth it. Know how to tie on with coils, have a general plan between you and make sure you both have prussiks and the gear you need to build a belay. You can easily learn what you need from the internet, a book or your mate. Avoid anything that looks complicated or needs loads of gear. Doing your best to avoid falling in is the way to go, roped up or not.
Other useful stuff: Don't wear new/expensive trousers the first time you wear crampons. Take a good sleeping mat or you'll get very cold. I was involved in an accident that needed a helicopter out there a couple of years ago and the one thing everybody said afterwards is "I wouldn't have known what number to call for rescue" - it's 112.
Have fun, that side of Mt Blanc du Tacul has some lovely bits of rock.
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I was involved in an accident that needed a helicopter out there a couple of years ago and the one thing everybody said afterwards is "I wouldn't have known what number to call for rescue" - it's 112.
:agree: I only learnt it when I was lying in a hospital bed slurring "what number did you have to call anyway?" to my climbing partner.
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As I understand it, the approach is about as straightforward as this stuff gets, esp from Courmayeur / the Helbronner lift.
Be careful! You have specifically posted the topo of the Salluard route at Pointe Adolphe Rey. My opinion is that you need a solid knowledge on glacier travel to access it. The glacier is really highly crevassed there and by going direct you are walking parallel to the crevasses which is always more delicate. Additionally, the shrund may be huge and the route may even be inaccessible later in the year. In my opinion, all these routes are best done early in the season.
Getting to below the Grand Capucin is easier than getting to below the Salluard route. But also at Grand Capucin, there will be a shrund and depending on the route you even need to go up the couloir.
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What time of year would be best do you think? As early as June? That might actually work better, as potential partner may well have his van left out there from the end of the ski season and we then have a place to stay.
TBH, my first thoughts were to do something like this with a guide and basically quiz him / her about every single decision or thing to watch out for. And do a single day / route in an ultra short weekend type hit. That was after listening to the Will Gadd Enormocast, in which he points out the logic and relative low cost of getting high quality knowledge from guides.
I think it would be wise to read around all this a bit more widely and go through the guidebooks in detail.
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Climbing with a guide would be a great idea. I'd try to get a personal rec to a good one, we had a bad experience when I was young with a guy who was desperate to do the route as fast as possible, get back to the valley and knock off. This of course sold to us with the 'speed is safety, you're in the Alps now etc'.
Safety/training wise, when I was younger I yomped about all over the shop unroped and never fell in a hole - you'd almost certainly be fine doing that on this approach. I'm more cautious now (just because I'm older and more of a coward) and tend rope up where possible/practical on wet glaciers as a rule. Almost all Europeans seem to, Brits mostly don't unless they're punters. I don't know why.
+1 to this. As I was photographing on the big push day I had a lie in and then yomped down on my own, no crampons, sliding along overtaking the guided parties and getting ticked off by them. In my defence the glacier was quite dry but I daresay the longer you spend you there the more you realise the dangers are hidden.
A group of my sister's city friends had a week skiing in Cham and did the Vallee Blanche with a guide. The next day one of them wanted to do it again, but the others didn't fancy it without a guide - so he went on his own. Inevitably, halfway down with no one else in view he went down a crevasse. Although tightly wedged he just managed to free one arm and get how mobile out, which miraculously had one bar. He didn't know the emergency number either, so phoned his wife in London...
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A group of my sister's city friends had a week skiing in Cham and did the Vallee Blanche with a guide. The next day one of them wanted to do it again, but the others didn't fancy it without a guide - so he went on his own. Inevitably, halfway down with no one else in view he went down a crevasse. Although tightly wedged he just managed to free one arm and get how mobile out, which miraculously had one bar. He didn't know the emergency number either, so phoned his wife in London...
Jeezus
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Worth getting a guide for a day to talk you through safe glacier travel. Once you know what to do to avoid them, or to extract one another if you do, some good choices are available. Climbing some of the rock routes in that area with glacial approaches is just brilliant. June could be slightly iffier weather wise still, but the bonus of avoiding the crowds once summer season proper arrives.
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Including routes from the Verdon in this thread is probably cheating, but Kallistée (Καλλίστη = the most beautiful), 11 pitches on Parois Rouge on Escales is particularly good.
It is also something very satisfying with routes like Rideaux de Gwendal, Fete des nerfs and Kallistée that starts at the bottom of the canyon and climbs all the way to the rim.
The first six pitches goes through the big overhanging lower red part of the wall and has fairly athletic climbing on big holds and maybe for that reason feels comparably easy.
In June the sun is high enough in the sky at noon so that the first 6 pitches are shaded by virtue of being overhanging. So we started at 12pm. By the time we reached the grey the wall was already in the shade.
The route starts with two body-lengths of pulling on a fixed static line to get off the ground past some seriously rotten rock, and continues on very average rock up to the first belay, after that the rock is fairly solid up until the last pitch of the red part, an A0-pitch on bolts through overhanging kitty litter.
Do not let the average rock and the two short bits of aid climbing on the first half discourage you. The climbing is steep, fun and athletic, and protected by beefy glue-ins. The middle three pitches are like doing a bunch of fun warmups at a steep sport climbing choss-pile.
The four pitches that follows goes to the most amazing Verdon grey imaginable. They are all 7a+/7b with the grades a bit randomly applied depending on source. I thought they were all the same difficulty except the very bouldery/perplexing 9th pitch (but my climbing partner had 0 difficulties following with the help of some chalk and a quick explanation of the trick). The tenth pitch is the topping on the cake and quite likely the best pitch I've done on the grey.
We did not do the 12th pitch (7a+ one-move wonder reputedly) as that seemed very daft since you already reached the rim, and the first ascensionist recommended to walk around instead.
We had two cars, so we had left one car at the rim and parked the other at Samson/Duc and walked in through the tunnels.
(https://i.imgur.com/SleXiAJ.jpg)
(Alex on pitch 7, which is still fairly steep. For some reason I thought this was 7a, but apparently it's 7b in some topos which makes more sense. Sustained and techy)
(https://i.imgur.com/VVQSXyn.jpg)
(Pitch 8 is a very nice sustained 7a+. I felt this was the easies of the 4 top pitches, but it is always easier when there's chalk on the holds)
(https://i.imgur.com/C7Q2VqQ.jpg)
(Me following Pitch 8.)
(https://i.imgur.com/LF4wNjU.jpg)
(Pitch 9. I was simply not good enough to figure this one out on the fly.)
(https://i.imgur.com/mZzvjQL.jpg)
(Pitch 10 of Kallistée is maybe the best pitch I've climbed on the gray. Ends with an anticlimactic grass-filled crack. Alex took a bunch of pics of me on this part, on every one I am staring at my feet)
We have a bunch of photos from pitch 1-6 as well, but they are all a bit crap.
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Thanks for the trip report Jonas. I wasn’t sure the route was a must or not. Now I’m sure it is :bounce:
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Thanks for the trip report Jonas. I wasn’t sure the route was a must or not. Now I’m sure it is :bounce:
It definitely is. Possibly the best route I've done on Escales I think. In retrospect I should have gone back to the belay to redo the 9th pitch clean, as we had plenty of time. The tenth pitch is interminable (18 draws!) but not so steep and possible to get up even if really really tired as it is mostly about putting the feet in the right spots.
I should add that it is very comfortable to haul on the route as almost every pitch is either overhanging or vertical but free of big features.
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Those photos are making me very jealous (despite not even having the ability to get up that route!).
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It's OK Nick, there's plenty of mind blowing routes in the gorge at all grades! There's nothing like the feeling of abbing in, pulling the ropes and then realising you are on the wrong hanging belay for your route out. At this point you realise the things in the "jardin" ledge below you are the improvised encampments of those who have made the same error as yourself.
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Eperon Sublime was my rude awakening to this! Nasty shock for a sport climber.
Starting from the bottom on La Demande seemed a lot friendlier.
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Verdon always looks amazing. Tried to go last summer but it was (unsuprisingly?) too warm for us and we ran away to the mountains. Cheers for posting up the pictures!
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We made a predawn start for La Demande, started at first light. Felt like a commando raid through the tunnels with headtorches. Brilliant place.
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Kallistée wasn't on my radar - it definitely is now. Looks amazing.
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Thanks for reviving this jwi, sounds great. I'm borrowing 52 years and 520 routes (http://52 ans et 520 voies d'escalade au Verdon) and a visit feels very overdue.
Verdon was my introduction to all this kind of thing, I was wildly inexperienced: had done four months of climbing in the Peak to about E1 and nothing longer than 3 pitches. First route was Luna Bong, we got benighted on the last pitch and had to learn to Jumar in the dark. Second route was Arete du Belvedere, we got benighted about three pitches from the top and sat out the night on a ledge (it gets cold in March). Despite, or perhaps because of, this I was totally sold on the style and the place. It was a good lesson in the importance of choosing partners and of climbing efficiently.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-bIXhduEeojo/TxXkg5IQe6I/AAAAAAAABZc/kXHCG8rBPA0/s720/29_DuncanCritchley_FalaiseDLEscales__VerdonGorge_Apr1979.jpg)
Luna Bong abseil, 1980 I think.
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The Luna Bong rappel still feels totally wild, and I have more than four months of climbing under my belt ...
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Verdon always looks amazing. Tried to go last summer but it was (unsuprisingly?) too warm for us and we ran away to the mountains. Cheers for posting up the pictures!
I keep advising people to go in June, as the sun sets very late and a lot of good sectors are south-east facing and some good sectors are almost east facing. Rap in about 2pm, when most people are topping out. Be at the base at 3pm. Top out 8pm with an hour of twilight to spare. Shade and afternoon thermals help you keeping cool. (As do the occasional evening thunderstorms = the drawback of my strategy, admittedly)
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I'm itching to go to some of these places. The memories of January in Chile are fading.
We went to Aysen, which is on the edge of Patagonia, but more inland and lower, so less affected by the incessant winds. Si and Graham stayed on and went to Cochamo, which sounds like it really ticks the the boxes of this thread. I'm keen to go back to Chile, and visit Cochamo next time. Avellano was so, so wild and beautiful, but I think Patagonian big wall new routing was perhaps a once in a lifetime experience for me.
Trip report here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qLeXRp1VfEGWT4kwCgTSFeXxyyv5shGp/view?usp=sharing
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That looks amazing fultonius!
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Nice!
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I keep advising people to go in June, as the sun sets very late and a lot of good sectors are south-east facing and some good sectors are almost east facing. Rap in about 2pm, when most people are topping out. Be at the base at 3pm. Top out 8pm with an hour of twilight to spare.
We've had some great days using this strategy, notably on Gwendal and Pinchenibule. What I can't work out is when is best for things that get the sun most of the day (La fête des nerfs)? I don't do well climbing in the sun.
Trip report here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qLeXRp1VfEGWT4kwCgTSFeXxyyv5shGp/view?usp=sharing
Amazing photos!
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What I can't work out is when is best for things that get the sun most of the day
The night :)
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And nice one on the S America report Ali, what is MEF?
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Mount Everest Foundation - they threw some cash our way.
Rob did the final publishing effort, and a fine job he did too. Pretty much why we took him along ;D
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Well if you need some publishing effort done next time look my way ;)
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I keep advising people to go in June, as the sun sets very late and a lot of good sectors are south-east facing and some good sectors are almost east facing. Rap in about 2pm, when most people are topping out. Be at the base at 3pm. Top out 8pm with an hour of twilight to spare.
We've had some great days using this strategy, notably on Gwendal and Pinchenibule. What I can't work out is when is best for things that get the sun most of the day (La fête des nerfs)? I don't do well climbing in the sun.
For La Fête des Nerfs and Via Mathis an overcast day in spring or in the fall would be the best bet. For a short trip you have to be lucky... We were lucky last spring in May and had two cold overcast days in a week!
...
And cool report Fultonius!
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For La Fête des Nerfs and Via Mathis an overcast day in spring or in the fall would be the best bet. For a short trip you have to be lucky... We were lucky last spring in May and had two cold overcast days in a week!
Thanks. We've had similar thoughts with other venues (Aiglun for one) that mean for us they're probably better as part of a longer trip to avoid disappointment.
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23 best routes in the Verdon (https://borrbult.blogspot.com/2020/06/verdon.html?fbclid=IwAR1KT-LZrsMozf5XkL9Tgo-YYmBe6Kk9M6VzwXbR1eueuMrdqVh6fwFaakA&m=1) as chosen by jwi. Excellent beta and it’s fun to discover where some of the more arcane route names came from.
In Swedish but google translate offers an entertaining version for Anglophones (apparently you “celebrate” your way down Luna Bong to the Terrasse Médiane. That’s certainly one way of putting it!). Unfortunately the last section of top tips for Verdon climbing was too much for the poor computer and was a bit harder to follow. I couldn’t quite work out how jwi managed to drop his haulbag...
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In Swedish but google translate offers an entertaining version for Anglophones (apparently you “celebrate” your way down Luna Bong to the Terrasse Médiane. That’s certainly one way of putting it!). Unfortunately the last section of top tips for Verdon climbing was too much for the poor computer and was a bit harder to follow. I couldn’t quite work out how jwi managed to drop his haulbag...
My God, google translate english > swedish is really surprisingly bad! (I dropped the haulbag because I was an idiot, is there any other way?)
Since I got help from this forum, I should probably post a short TR on
Sous la griffe de Lucifer, 450m ED-, 6c+>6b+, 14 pitches
Are you in Céüse and bored with hiking for an hour to go and climb the same 15m over and over again? Bring down nine draws, two shoulder length slings and something for belays, drive 50 min from the campground to Dévoluy and climb something completely different. You get a Parois de Legende tick as well!
Unusually sustained and steep face climbing for 13 pitches. No cracks or anything that scratches the back of the hand. In the shade until around 2.30pm.
(https://i.imgur.com/KbBpmBn.jpg)
The wall. Lucifer climbs just to the right of the big dihedral that splits the main wall in two. (There are 3 PdL-ticks on the wall, which is partly explained by the fact that Bodet and Petit used to live 45 min away).
The approach is mercifully short (20 min or so) and easy to find. The route starts at the memorial plaque to Bruno M.
(https://i.imgur.com/tudQN4I.jpg)
“You who pass by, remember Bruno Martel and his love for The Gillards. To our dad, with eternal love”
The first pitch has some average rock but not many bolts so it pays to be careful. Overall the easier pitches still has some tricky route finding and very few bolts, so they take quite a bit longer than you would think to climb.
Here's J. on the 6th pitch
(https://i.imgur.com/LzDiyJN.jpg)
and near the top of the amazing 11th pitch with the banded silica intrusions that gives plenty of small crimpers. Very cool to climb on!
(https://i.imgur.com/iB2IOEp.jpg)
Overall, we found the climbing very good starting on pitch 4 all the way to the end of the hard part in the middle of pitch 12. Compared to the topo in PdL we found P9 to be the hardest and P11 to be slightly easier (but more demanding mentally perhaps), otherwise we found the grading in PdL to be closer to our opinion than the grades given in the description on camp to camp (https://www.camptocamp.org/routes/54706/fr/les-gillardes-petite-roche-sous-la-griffe-de-lucifer).
The descent was easy to find (a single footpath from the top of the route all the way down to the small village of Jouves) and makes for a very pleasant hike on alpine prairies.
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In Swedish but google translate offers an entertaining version for Anglophones (apparently you “celebrate” your way down Luna Bong to the Terrasse Médiane. That’s certainly one way of putting it!). Unfortunately the last section of top tips for Verdon climbing was too much for the poor computer and was a bit harder to follow. I couldn’t quite work out how jwi managed to drop his haulbag...
My God, google translate english > swedish is really surprisingly bad! (I dropped the haulbag because I was an idiot, is there any other way?)
Since I got help from this forum, I should probably post a short TR on
Sous la griffe de Lucifer, 450m ED-, 6c+>6b+, 14 pitches
Are you in Céüse and bored with hiking for an hour to go and climb the same 15m over and over again? Bring down nine draws, two shoulder length slings and something for belays, drive 50 min from the campground to Dévoluy and climb something completely different. You get a Parois de Legende tick as well!
Unusually sustained and steep face climbing for 13 pitches. No cracks or anything that scratches the back of the hand. In the shade until around 2.30pm.
(https://i.imgur.com/KbBpmBn.jpg)
The wall. Lucifer climbs just to the right of the big dihedral that splits the main wall in two. (There are 3 PdL-ticks on the wall, which is partly explained by the fact that Bodet and Petit used to live 45 min away).
The approach is mercifully short (20 min or so) and easy to find. The route starts at the memorial plaque to Bruno M.
(https://i.imgur.com/tudQN4I.jpg)
“You who pass by, remember Bruno Martel and his love for The Gillards. To our dad, with eternal love”
The first pitch has some average rock but not many bolts so it pays to be careful. Overall the easier pitches still has some tricky route finding and very few bolts, so they take quite a bit longer than you would think to climb.
Here's J. on the 6th pitch
(https://i.imgur.com/LzDiyJN.jpg)
and near the top of the amazing 11th pitch with the banded silica intrusions that gives plenty of small crimpers. Very cool to climb on!
(https://i.imgur.com/iB2IOEp.jpg)
Overall, we found the climbing very good starting on pitch 4 all the way to the end of the hard part in the middle of pitch 12. Compared to the topo in PdL we found P9 to be the hardest and P11 to be slightly easier (but more demanding mentally perhaps), otherwise we found the grading in PdL to be closer to our opinion than the grades given in the description on camp to camp (https://www.camptocamp.org/routes/54706/fr/les-gillardes-petite-roche-sous-la-griffe-de-lucifer).
The descent was easy to find (a single footpath from the top of the route all the way down to the small village of Jouves) and makes for a very pleasant hike on alpine prairies.
Awesome! You had me at no cracks or anything.
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Great stuff. Keep them coming jwi, inspiration material.
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Great stuff. Keep them coming jwi, inspiration material.
👍👍 even to (me) someone who has no intention of tying in... 😃
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Does look ace, maybe a bit rich for my blood. Got me flicking through the Arvre Guide though, and thinking about something a bit friendlier next summer maybe.
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Recently did some moderately competent bimbling in Sardinia seeing as the Alps were soaking.
First up 'Non Potho Reposare' 6c+ 7 pitches. Absolutely feckin' brilliant. Best easy pitches of the trip and every pitch was a gift.
Seriously, it was that good.
Little video from Lando here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_rTZWRejN0
Next up was 'Cuore in Gola' 7c+ 10 pitches. First 3 pitches are the crux through a bigggg roof (7b,7b,7c+) after which it's 7 pitches up to 7a+ to reach the top. We had a look at the roof pitches on our second day (just the two 7b's for me, Lando checked out the 7c+ so I could have a flash go) and then bivvied in the gorge and went for it early doors. Knocked out the first two pitches steadily enough, then fell off the flash go of the 7c+ on the last hard move due to being a f***king loser and getting scared. That went next go (argh >:( ) so we cracked on with the rest, leaving the haul bag at the top of pitch 5 (7a+). The rest is bolder but steadier and we got to the top in good style to find out that the last pitch just stops in the middle of nowhere 30m below the top of the wall or thereabouts. The wind was blowing a serious hoolie by this point so we started to head down and did some very intense high wind abseiling to get back to the base of the gorge just as it got dark :beer2:
Another vid of that little escapade here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X_4R8OA0sM
And a picture from the Gorge for good measure:
(https://scontent-muc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/104008570_10220456057385261_8919615916297032745_o.jpg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_eui2=AeHOgN_89X5ZI6lDDm1cfKOehPGJdjKMg-2E8Yl2MoyD7bi4ylGw46QU4k3Yrf93ve0&_nc_ohc=mIxMpb-tM5wAX-urWnj&_nc_ht=scontent-muc2-1.xx&oh=84ed0744d30e64762e17dbf1f1a993e1&oe=5F37FDAD)
Other highlights were 'Legitimo Bastardo' 7c 8 pitches which I managed onsight until we hit rotten belays on the easier upper section. This was a funny one as we were expecting a super bold crux pitch, but it had actually been recently rebolted and was actually quite reasonable, whereas the following 7a+ (b) pitches were pant-fillingly bold with some sections containing hard moves with 6m runouts.
(https://scontent-muc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/105395860_10220537220614291_7345998458837879323_o.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_eui2=AeENb-FitO9ncpAVmCfX5r-_syeZFaB4FPizJ5kVoHgU-Ctjiqs4hfDjJDeEcv3RTbg&_nc_ohc=6d4EjrjkQugAX_9at1z&_nc_ht=scontent-muc2-1.xx&oh=c9202f816ab26e8006578e096aad9b9d&oe=5F38C342)
(https://scontent-muc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/104429364_10220537221054302_2113667156733547533_o.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_eui2=AeEPMC2XCWYqinEuz-MIPw2Sl9elow4oXbWX16WjDihdtfiLYVbU5EkTeHMAMWuuUnQ&_nc_ohc=Jym3lRnG3KwAX8KV93Y&_nc_ht=scontent-muc2-1.xx&oh=68a779f8ddb3162902f02328d92f6178&oe=5F35F9A4)
We then followed that up with a team onsight ascent of 'Stella di Sangue' 7b, although I got knackered on the last few pitches and seconded pitifully for the rest.
Onsighting the crux pitch of Stella:
(https://scontent-muc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/105278369_10220537220814296_8688851229632725267_n.jpg?_nc_cat=105&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_eui2=AeHTjCAhRLaE6wamsoJZmfcC-lgJR_t82dD6WAlH-3zZ0Pr_Dj38Upnj9NabpiCDk5w&_nc_ohc=Wf5woeRA7rEAX-zn2L9&_nc_ht=scontent-muc2-1.xx&oh=bd1897c3af96933502abbdc7dfdd51dd&oe=5F35C9ED)
Hardish things aside, we also did a fairly rapid simul ascent of 'Via de L'amicizia' 6b 700m in 6 loooong pitches and about 5hrs total. Absolutely brilliant route, 95% trad with bolted belays and the occasional old peg/bolt. Highly recommended!
(https://scontent-muc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/103981575_10220456057865273_8588633628796918054_o.jpg?_nc_cat=100&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_eui2=AeGhCc8dmPCNVq8G208lCebFedGBfe7imd150YF97uKZ3ZVZ9dp1RsFhC-ktKxgYnGU&_nc_ohc=eSNfVM9-JqUAX_0qcDo&_nc_ht=scontent-muc2-1.xx&oh=8ac04b3dff5410ee91aba1848e6603c7&oe=5F37CAD1)
All in all it's a fantastic place and I will definitely go back, although it must be said the walk-ins are knackering and rotten bolts are not uncommon. We approached and descended for over 30 hours in the 8 days that we climbed!
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Les premiers pas d'Elsa, ED, 7a+>6c
After two routes on the Gillardes, my better half had it with the wall. Suffering from a bit of monomania I wanted to do Premier pas d'Elsa as well as it is included in both “Parois de Légende” and Mussato's book “Itinéraires d'un grimpeur gâté”. I knew that HaeMeS was in the area and suspected that he could be convinced; alas, he had already moved on to more proper alps, but luckily he knew a Belgian climber who was in the area and was keen.
The French climbing establishment insist on this slightly quixotic fight against dissemination of information outside of local topos. After having had Rockfax and Tmms Verlag's topos in the cross hairs, their new pet hate seems to be camptocamp.org (http://camptocamp.org). As Mistral is for noobs and Rockfax tends to have errors like having the wrong number of pitches on routes or simply drawing routes on a pic of the wrong mountain I never considered using them for information, and never really cared. Camptocamp, on the other hand, is a real gold mine with up-to-date user generated information about routes on the continent, the maghreb and the levant. Specifically I learned from comments that there were four hangers missing along the route, so I went to Approach in Gap and bought 5 hangers the day before climbing.
I met Erik in the morning 7.15AM at the parking, and after spending half a minute on discussing the rack we went off.
The route starts with the same first pitch and a half as Sous la griffe de Lucifer, but then continue straight up with a second pitch that was closer to 6c than 6b. Pretty demanding climbing with some runouts early in the morning as well.
(https://i.imgur.com/owEBase.jpg)
The fourth anchor was the first that missed a hanger, and since the hanger in place had a very small hole with a sling already threaded through it I could not get any of our crabs to fit, so I was quite happy to have a wrench and a hanger in the harness and nuts in the shirt pocket...
The fifth pitch had also a missing hanger, on the crux bit. Luckily Erik had margin and put in in place from a free climbing stance. Luckily it was also quite easy for the grade. One of only two pitches I felt was on the easy side. Most pitches felt quite hard for their given grade...
(https://i.imgur.com/ZExB1YG.jpg)
Erik just about to get out the hardware on pitch 5...
Starting on pitch 5 the climbing got very good as well. Basically everything from pitch 5 to pitch 13 is brilliant. Pretty solid rock as well.
(https://i.imgur.com/8mk1gEm.jpg)
Erik towards the end of the sixth pitch.
The eight (crux) pitch was particularly good, and not as easy as you might think... Overall I think that a good level of endurance is needed for the route. There are no slab pitches and almost everything from pitch 6 and onwards is either vertical or slightly overhanging (this part of the crag was the site of France's biggest rope-jump (https://www.ledauphine.com/isere-sud/2019/09/15/devoluy-400-metres-de-vide-10-secondes-de-chute-au-bout-d-une-corde) in 2019) with very few easy sections.
I struggled a lot on the tenth pitch, and close to the belay I was pretty close to falling on the section here:
(https://i.imgur.com/bDv8t6j.jpg)
The eleventh pitch goes through the overhang just above Erik in the pic above. In my experience it is exceedingly rare to climb steeply overhanging rock with 300+ m of pure air beneath the feet at such an amiable grade (7a). Partly explained by the fact that it is not a very long section.
The route finishes with some brilliant but confusing climbing on a band of "pouding" (vernacular for conglomerate).
Overall a brilliant route that is harder to link than a cursory glance at the topo would suggest. Most pitches are very sustained, and the easier parts are quite runout. In my opinion, the global grade of ED is well deserved.
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Does anyone know anything about the Fleischbank in the Wilder Kaiser? A mate has been reading Nanga Parbat Pilgrimage and apparently Herman Buhl soloed I think the south east route, which included something called the Rossi Overhang.
I found a bit of info here https://www.summitpost.org/fleischbank/293951 (https://www.summitpost.org/fleischbank/293951) and it looks quite hardcore.
This was vaguely prompted because we were discussing a possible return to alpine rock next year, and I had fancied going back to the various things we failed to do as a result of the Bondo landslide in 2017. Sadly it appears that the entire Bondasca valley is still out of bounds, and the Sciora hut is permanently closed. There was a paper about the landslide published earlier this year https://www.nat-hazards-earth-syst-sci.net/20/505/2020/ (https://www.nat-hazards-earth-syst-sci.net/20/505/2020/) where you can see the distance the landslide travelled. When we got helicoptered down it blew my mind quite how far down it came - there were truck-sized chunks in Bondo which was way beyond the zone anyone had predicted an event like that would reach.
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Great stuff again jwi.
Yossarian, the SE Diedre of the Fleischbank is in Extreme Alpine Rock (Im Extrem Fels). I can scan the pages if you like. Herman Buhl mentions it several times in Nanga Parbat Pilgrimage including his solo and seems to have enjoyed it.
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TBH alpine limestone has always filled me with dread vs granite. I think if we were to consider it there are plenty of lower stress / easier access routes around Europe that we ought to try first!
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Great stuff again jwi.
Thanks, I wrote up the three routes I did on the Gillardes here, with a topo included (https://steepground.blogspot.com/2020/07/les-gillardes-sous-la-griffe-de-lucifer.html)
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TBH alpine limestone has always filled me with dread vs granite. I think if we were to consider it there are plenty of lower stress / easier access routes around Europe that we ought to try first!
My limited experience of the Alpine limestone classics (eg Yellow Edge, Sella Towers and Piz Ciavazes) is the climbing can resemble a bigger Stoney Middleton with better views. Some of the less celebrated modern sport routes are (whisper) much better...
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Anything specific you want to know? I have climbed quite a few routes on that face. Its quite a big wall with a lot of routes in very different styles. The most famous route on the east face itself is the South-East dihidral (Südostverschneidung) (as already mention an "extreme rock route") - and its really good as well. But theres also a lot less well known routes, from old classics to modern sportroutes and scary trad-climbs from the 80s.
The first UIAA 7, Pumprisse, in the Alps is also on Fleischbank (though not on the east face, but on the "Fleischbankpfeiler"). Thats also where "Des Kaisers neue Kleider", the famous Glowacz route is. .
I think the route Buhl solod was the "Wiesner/Rossi" (Südost-Wand) but not 100% sure.
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I have compiled a list of Twenty-five routes well worth doing in the Verdon (https://steepground.blogspot.com/2020/09/twenty-five-routes-worth-doing-in.html), and some practical advice on gear/raps etc, might be of interest in this context?
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Good article.
Interestingly
Il giochi de prestigio is Italian for “a game of prestige”, i.e. stage magic. (In English as well has French prestige has lost its original sense of ‘conjuring tricks’, if I am not mistaken).
is true apart from resurrecting it for the film title, which i think caused a bit of confusion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Prestige_(film)
A bit like the "III" being dropped from the film version of The Madness of King George, so audiences didn't think it was a sequel..
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good knowledge!
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I have compiled a list of Twenty-five routes well worth doing in the Verdon (https://steepground.blogspot.com/2020/09/twenty-five-routes-worth-doing-in.html), and some practical advice on gear/raps etc, might be of interest in this context?
That’s brilliant! Haven’t been to Verdon since the late 90s but that brings it all back (mostly in a good way)...
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It is an amazing place. Did a 2 day hit when passing, L'Eperon Sublime and La Demande, first experience of multi-pitch sport.
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The second volume of Mussato's œuvre Itinéraires d'un grimpeur gâté (itineraries of a spoiled climber) has recently been published. The first volume is a great classic with 104 routes where the criteria for inclusion is very close to OP
Inclusion criteria are great climbs of ~8 pitches or longer with minimal death potential. I'm not keen on freezing in a storm or being hit by lumps of rock or ice and crevassed approaches void my BMC insurance (http://www.thebmc.co.uk/modules/insurance/Policies.aspx#rock) (plug for sponsors). BHAGs could stretch as far as E6 trad. and 7b-ish sport. Routes should be mostly free, a little sneaky cheating is acceptable.
Philippe Mussato himself has put up hundreds of multipitch routes in all grades up to 8b+ in the area, including famous routes like Ali Baba in Aiglun.
In Mussato's books routes of a wide span of difficulties between 5c and 8a+ are included, most of them at least 8 pitches and nothing with glacier approach. All routes are in the French alps (if the Calanques are a part of the alps...). Every route mentioned has a usable topo and detailed approach and access descriptions. Around a third of the routes in the book are partly or entirely on natural protection, the rest are fully or almost fully bolted.
Volume 2 contains 132 routes. Like in the first volume, for each route a grade E1-E4 details how far it is between the points of protections and a grade F1 (12 mm stainless bolts) to F6 (no fixed gear) gives information of the quality of fixed gear.
So far I have only really used volume 1. I have only done a handful of routes of the selection in the second volume, most have been very good and one of which I do not think should be included in a book of this type, but I'll report back when I have used the book more. (I would trust Mussato's opinions over mine anyway)
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Thanks jwi.
When Graham Hoey was promoting his Gritstone guidebook the second half of his talk consisted of adventures on some of the routes in Musatto's vol. one. I'm afraid to say I found this more inspiring than his gritstone exploits!
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for each route a grade E1-E4 details how far it is between the points of protection
It’ll never catch on.
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Book sounds great.
for each route a grade E1-E4 details how far it is between the points of protections and a grade F1 (12 mm stainless bolts) to F6 (no fixed gear) gives information of the quality of fixed gear.
But no indication as to whether the gaps are easy or impossible to protect with your own gear?
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Book sounds great.
for each route a grade E1-E4 details how far it is between the points of protections and a grade F1 (12 mm stainless bolts) to F6 (no fixed gear) gives information of the quality of fixed gear.
But no indication as to whether the gaps are easy or impossible to protect with your own gear?
If so, it is described in the text, usually in a vague terms like "a few friends might be useful to lessen the runouts on the easier pitches" giving the impression that the author definitely did not bring any gear. To be fair, many of the routes would require gear wizardry on a level rarely found on the continent to significantly improve the security.
Routes requiring gear, indicated with TA (for "terrain d'adventure") or TAP (for "terrain d'adventure protégé" for mostly bolted routes), are also given a grade E1-E4 depending on how spaced the protection is. Only on routes indicated by TAP a specific rack is given.
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Thanks jwi.
When Graham Hoey was promoting his Gritstone guidebook the second half of his talk consisted of adventures on some of the routes in Musatto's vol. one. I'm afraid to say I found this more inspiring than his gritstone exploits!
It looks like there are some excellent adventures to be found by following the recommendations in the second volume as well!
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Strone / Sron? :)
Elsewhere in Scotland there are a couple of routes on the Main Bastion of the Shelterstone that run to 8 pitches or so and are 3* routes; Haystack E3, Steeple E2, The Needle E1, Stone Bastion E5. Not done them myself, but they look excellent. There are a few on Creag an Dubh Loch too, although most of the harder routes only run to 5 or 6 pitches.
Also The Spire at E4 (basically a 2 pitch variation of either The Steeple or Haystack) and the newer route called The Heel Stone (https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/shelterstone_crag_moray-32/the_heel_stone-495885).
Did The Spire yesterday, which was a wake up to the senses - clearly my Cairngorm granite-foo is weak, got up it but was pretty out of ideas in a few sections. Nearly peeled off the "4b" second pitch (5b/c), and the big nuts decided they had had enough mid crux and decided to unclip themselves from my harness and run for freedom. Back to the car at 11pm - proper day out! :great: :great:
Left shoulder feeling a bit poorly, but nothing major I think. Deffo a nudge too short in stature to really feel like the "mini bigwalls" of the thread, but a perfect proving ground and mini adventure in it's own right.
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I have (had while the weather was good) a hankering for something long in the mountains, still not been to Dubh Loch.
Apparently it looked like a mini festival camp up there over the warm spell, about a dozen folk camped by the shore.
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I have (had while the weather was good) a hankering for something long in the mountains, still not been to Dubh Loch.
Apparently it looked like a mini festival camp up there over the warm spell, about a dozen folk camped by the shore.
Aye, even Friday there were 10 or so tents. Went to Beinn a Bhuird for Freebird with Andy on Saturday - nice to get that one done - great fun!
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Three more recommendations from Verdon: https://steepground.blogspot.com/2021/10/three-more-recommended-routes-in-verdon.html
(La Demande, Au-delà du Délire and Dame Cookie. Dame Cookie might fail on the Moderately Hard bit 🤷🏼♂️)
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Great stuff! The first two definitely count and good beta for Au-delà du délire, certainly on the list.
I did La Demande in 1980 on my second Verdon trip when this style really clicked for me. A really enjoyable experience. Had to rescue a well-known South West (England) activist benighted in the final chimneys on the same trip. He wouldn't be the last.
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I did La Demande in 1980 on my second Verdon trip when this style really clicked for me. A really enjoyable experience. Had to rescue a well-known South West (England) activist benighted in the final chimneys on the same trip. He wouldn't be the last.
I do not know when the drilled protection appeared in the final chimneys, but in 1968 they had one piton on the last overhanging stem-chimney bit. Now it has three bolts and is one of the best protected parts of the route. The leader is unlikely to risk their life in the top chimneys anymore, but they are still awkward.
We had a real traffic jam where we got stuck behind a team on La Demande and a french team on La pâte demande, which shares a pitch and a half with La demande. I chatted a bit with the French team and told them I was absolutely sure that the team ahead of us would get benighted, and so would we if we did not manage to pass. (We started fashionably late in the day of course). One of the french guy looked at me and said "You will also be benighted, even if you pass the other team. Count on the chimneys to take twice as long as the total time up to the chimneys".
(It turned out that the slow team was equally slow/fast on chimneys as on hand- and finger-cracks. So I think they managed to get up in time)
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Jonas, have you done 'La Costa', or any other routes, on Les Vuardes in the Arve valley? Wondering how it compares to La Demande. I did costa a few years ago plus some other routes on that cliff, great place!
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I have only climbed a single multi pitch in Haute-Savoie, that was « Zauberberg » on the nearby Parois de Graumusset. Someone I trust said that La Costa felt like 6a/b, so slightly harder than La Demande then I suppose? On Les Vuardes, « Papy fait de la resistance » certainly looks interesting, but I am rarely in that area.
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Just got back from 6 weeks big-walling in Kyrgyzstan, I'll stick a small amount of info and some photos up here to try and get other Brits psyched to go out there - seems like Americans, Germans, and Russians have the most info on the place, we were the second british team in the last decade or something!
So the Karavshin area is about 45km walk from the nearest road in Vorukh, you will need to hire donkeys. There's a company called Ak Sai who if you pay them lots of money will actually sort you out a plane from Bishkek to Batken and then a helicopter to the valley, we didn't want to do that so we got taxis for the entire length of kyrgyzstan and then got Ak Sai to sort out our donkeys, which didn't work so we ended up hiring them off the local garrison. I digress, essentially the point is either you need someone who speaks Russian well enough to haggle with taxi drivers or you need to pay Ak Sai lots of money.
When you get there, there are are two valleys, Ak-Su and Kara-Su. Ak-Su has the Perestroika Crack which everyone does (7b and normally climbed over 3 days, there are two big ledges to sleep on apparently), and Kara Su has Yellow Wall, home to Diagonal Route on Yellow Wall, which, again, everybody does (one pitch of 7a, the rest is much easier I believe, and usually climbed in a day). We didn't do either of those routes though, mainly because everybody does them and we wanted to be a bit different.
Peak 4810 is the most hellishly impressive mountain-suitable-for-rock-climbing I have ever seen, here is a picture: (sorry it's FB)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/533770_10151100837341225_1433408746_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/533770_10151100837341225_1433408746_n.jpg)
It's about 1200m vertically, takes about 3.5 hours to walk in from base camp with heavy bags and the last bit is up a nasty bit of glacier, I actually ended up leading the fucking-terrifying first pitch (F7a slab climbing protected entirely by RPs and pitons I placed on lead, I am never doing anything like that again ever) to get out of carrying one of the haul bags up the glacier. It faces NW so gets the sun in the afternoons, this means that every morning there is a fairly serious build up of ice on the inside of your portaledge. It would be possible to climb it without portaledges as there are a few good ledges but you would need to move VERY fast and be pretty confident - we packed 6 days worth of food and 8 days worth of water, but right from the beginning we rationed ourselves as much as we could which was just as well as we were on the wall for 10 days. All the routes on the NW face were put up as aid routes in the late 80s and 90s, the first ones were mainly winning entries in the USSR climbing championships. I have no idea about aid climbing and even less about Russian grades (they all got the maximum Russian grade of 6B), but I would say that you do not want to have to aid the first pitch - it would involve copperheads or drilling bolts!
Ok so we did the Mirror Route:
http://mountains.tos.ru/kopylov/pict/g8.gif (http://mountains.tos.ru/kopylov/pict/g8.gif)
We did it entirely free in 40 pitches at about 7b+. The first pitch was absolutely terrifying, there was one other very run-out 7a-ish slab but the rest wasn't too awful (mainly good-but-sometimes-spaced protection and climbing in the 6s), with two well protected pitches of 7b and one of 7b+ (these crux pitches were all absolutely superb on immaculate rock):
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/487606_10151242088259595_1040962822_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/487606_10151242088259595_1040962822_n.jpg)
We did need to take crampons for the summit ridge sadly, I now have a deep seated hatred of rock with snow on it.
We also did a new route on Peak Kotina, we're working on a topo but it took probably the best line on the crag through as much steep ground as we could find, and always taking the easiest line through it. The rock is incredibly free-climbable, all the steep bits turned out to be about 4 grades easier than they looked! The crux pitch (7a) was escaping a groove through a series of blocky roofs to a belay on the prow of the entire mountain at about 3/4 height, we think the route is about 1000m and have called it Dreaming Spires, we would definitely recommend it as the rock is mainly sublime (ok there are a few pitches where the rock is whack but its a 26 pitch route and the good bits are worth it!)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/225971_10151100836096225_557687990_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/225971_10151100836096225_557687990_n.jpg)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/376571_10151100849446225_1969791675_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/376571_10151100849446225_1969791675_n.jpg)
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/305033_10151100859431225_846635480_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/305033_10151100859431225_846635480_n.jpg)
There's a vast amount of rock, much of it unclimbed. The hardest route done out there was in the Ak Su valley and had one hard pitch of 7c/+ and a few pitches of around 7a+, there is probably potential for harder though! So there is a lot of potential for new-routing, and a lot of potential for trying to free Soviet aid routes of the late 80s, and a lot of opportunity for bivvying in fairly unpleasant conditions. The Russian climbing team was there and they were the hardest men I have ever met - they did a different route to us on Peak 4810 almost entirely free in Alpine style in 4 days, with 7 litres of water between them and sleeping in slings! They said the hardest pitch was 'quite dangerous', which turned out to mean 7b with no gear for the entire rope length. When they got back they stayed up tol 1am drinking vodka, then got up at 5 30am the next day to chase cows away from the campsite with a shovel. The day after that, one of them casually did Perestroika Crack........
Anyway, I would recommend the place to anyone a bit harder, fitter, and psyched for rock-climbing-based-mountaineering than myself (I nearly died on some of the approaches!). I have to admit for the foreseeable future I am going to be a single-pitch sport-climbing pansy!
Starting to research / get psyched for some potential trips... Do you still have any of the photos - none of the FB links seem to be working.
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Photos and trip report here:
https://biviartistry.wordpress.com/2016/03/13/how-i-started-sleeping-in-stupid-places-or-what-i-did-on-my-holidays-in-kyrgyzstan/ (https://biviartistry.wordpress.com/2016/03/13/how-i-started-sleeping-in-stupid-places-or-what-i-did-on-my-holidays-in-kyrgyzstan/)
Route description for our fairly long, moderately hard and entirely free route here:
https://biviartistry.wordpress.com/2016/03/13/route-descprition-for-dreaming-spires/ (https://biviartistry.wordpress.com/2016/03/13/route-descprition-for-dreaming-spires/)
I'm starting to get extremely psyched to get back there next summer or the summer after, so feel free to message me with dates if you do decide to go as I think that valley is significantly less scary the more climbers are staying there! When it was just us for the last couple of weeks of our trip it was terrifying....
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Fantastic Ian, really out there. Really enjoyed reading about it again.
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Thanks :) Digging that up has got me all nostalgic for the bygone days of slightly cringe climbing blogs.... can't indulge like that these days on Instagram! ;)
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Thanks :) Digging that up has got me all nostalgic for the bygone days of slightly cringe climbing blogs.... can't indulge like that these days on Instagram! ;)
I’m jealous, I deleted mine before I applied for some jobs and I do miss being able to see an older version of oneself.
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I really miss more long form climbing writing, blogs etc. Would happily see instawank fall off a cliff.
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Ian - sent you a PM etc. We're thinking Mid August to Mid September and going to start doing some proper planning up to xmas. Would be good to share some thoughts / poach all of your potential new routes. Any or food stashes we shoud know about?
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I've been going through a severe case of armchair FLMHMF over the past couple of weeks, watching loads of videos, and wondering why I didn't want to climb la Demande (which looks insanely good fun) in August 1997 (I think I was still freaked out by La Costa at Les Vuardes and also thought that the chimneys would be slippery limestone versions of the ones in the Eiger Sanction)
Going back through the Val di Mello guide and the 2nd most recent Plaisir Sud, there appear to be quite a lot more long and not too hard things high up above the Bagni end of Val Masino. I imagine there's harder stuff too, but not sure which guide it would be in (actually, probably ExtremSud?)
I also found this https://paolo-sonja.net (https://paolo-sonja.net) and this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03iWxFeZGmA&t=331s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03iWxFeZGmA&t=331s)
on the higher stuff in Val di Mello that I didn't really take in when we were there. The latter looks pretty awesome...
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Saw this on insta the other day, the Sasso Cavallo, described by Matteo della Bordella as: "Remote, wild and with bulletproof limestone".
https://www.instagram.com/p/CYMkAX5of_r/
Looks like a cool wall, and it's just above Lake Como which is very lovely by all accounts (my better half went there a couple of years ago). Has anyone climbed here? I'm assuming it's in the Versante Sud "Lario Paretti (https://www.versantesud.it/en/prodotto/lario-rock-pareti/)" guide. The route MdB did is probably best described as an ambitious goal for me but it would be cool if there were easier routes on equally good rock. It's also less than an hour from one of Milan's airports.
(https://i.imgur.com/Nb5x4Az.jpeg)
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Looks like a nice piece of rock. Plenty of other routes to go at as well https://www.ramellasergio.it/Testo/GRIGNE/SASSO_CAVALLO/_schizzi_sasso_cavallo.html
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Saw this on insta the other day, the Sasso Cavallo, described by Matteo della Bordella as: "Remote, wild and with bulletproof limestone".
https://www.instagram.com/p/CYMkAX5of_r/
Looks like a cool wall, and it's just above Lake Como which is very lovely by all accounts (my better half went there a couple of years ago). Has anyone climbed here? I'm assuming it's in the Versante Sud "Lario Paretti (https://www.versantesud.it/en/prodotto/lario-rock-pareti/)" guide. The route MdB did is probably best described as an ambitious goal for me but it would be cool if there were easier routes on equally good rock. It's also less than an hour from one of Milan's airports.
(https://i.imgur.com/Nb5x4Az.jpeg)
:ohmy:
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RACS, ED+, 7a+, Ordesa Valley, Pyrenees.
I followed the "getting back into trad" thread with some trepidation as this route was high on my list of things to do this spring. We were four climbers out of the Toulouse-Ariege area with the intention of doing this over the French bank holiday in late May, but as one had to pull-out due to family visits I was left a bit on a loose end.
Luckily, while climbing in Rodellar, I ran into a German climber who lives in Norway and likes to climb the Troll wall (a good sign) and stuff. He also had half a rack in his van as he had climbed a bit in Montrebey (a very good sign) earlier in the trip, and took no effort at all to convince to climb RACS, even though he had never heard about Ordesa or the route.
(https://i.imgur.com/RyU3Ivi.jpg)
RACS climbs the Muraille du Gallinero just left of the seasonal water-fall. Geminis or Zarathustra could be alternative routes, I gather.
Ordesa Valley is found in the Ordesa and Monte Perdido national park in the Pyrenees and is the oldest national park in Spain. A stunningly beautiful valley with lots of steep walls, well known to be very traditional, in the Spanish sense (some fixed pitons and threads but only joke bolts allowed, but minimal fixed gear overall).
(https://i.imgur.com/UoletGV.jpg)
Me starting up the first pitch.
The rock is a sandy limestone with very high friction that is really a pleasure to climb. The rock forms big square blocks piled on top of each other with alarming steepness.
(https://i.imgur.com/M8y5sb4.jpg)
It turned out that I remember how to fiddle in gear. I just fiddled in too much, and probably climbed a bit slow. No worries though as David is a complete monster. I most often climb long routes with my other half, where I am the physically stronger climber, or with young much stronger climbers where I am the more knowledgable about the technical aspects of multipitch climbing. I must say that there is something to be said for climbing with a partner that is ones superior in every aspect of the game.
(https://i.imgur.com/1c2LT4R.jpg)
David starting up pitch 2. As I cannot keep the camera straight: the haul line indicate the direction of gravity.
(https://i.imgur.com/s6SqQhv.jpg)
Near the belay of pitch 3
(https://i.imgur.com/o5lItNt.jpg)
Pitch 4 “Para los buenos” or 7a+++ in the Spanish guide was surprisingly OK.
The second half of the route was almost as steep as the first bit, with most pitches overhanging (as the haul bag proved), but also easier and with some sections with either questionable or unprotectable rock, or both.
Overall a stunning classic in a stunningly beautiful valley. The route starts at just under 2000 masl, and while it was 30 degrees in Rodellar it was a cool 15-20 in Ordesa.
I have posted an impossibly long trip-report with more photos and a topo and everything on http://steepground.blogspot.com/2022/05/racs-ordesa.html
I am also happy to announce that I found more than five knee-bars on the route, three of them hands-off. As I do not know if Jesús Gálvez had any I am not sure if our ascent counts.
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Looks incredible, nice one jwi!
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Wowsers, one for the bucket list! Perfect length and looks spectacular.
I must say that there is something to be said for climbing with a partner that is ones superior in every aspect of the game.
I've been lucky enough to have done a lot of this. It is surprising how much less pressure you feel when it won't be you required to pull the team out of the shit, so it's great until you end up getting dragged up stuff barely seconding with rests etc (but gives you probably useful perspective if you've ever done this to anyone). Thinking back to my most satisfying moments in terms of partnerships, they fall into three groups - 1) moving well as a team and completing route well under guidebook team (partner competence regardless), 2) being supposedly well-matched but ending up having to dragging the team out of the shit, 3) being interrogated on the belay by my much better partner about what secret aid I used on the pitch they just barely seconded. So variety is best I think.
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Great stuff. This has been on the list for some time! Sounds like the quintessential two big Gogarth routes day.
What is the Ordesa season, sounds like it might be a bit hot in the height of summer?
I am the older and weaker of the party 95% of the time but try to pull my weight by getting the team to the start and back down with a minimum of fuss and hunger (https://www.instagram.com/p/Cbab3o7taTj/) (p2), not freezing in the headlights, and taking care of the jamming cracks.
Also, it's good to know I can now add my signed copy of Parois de Legend to the retirement fund (with the mint first pressing of Definitely Maybe, numerous rare dub 10"s...).
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What is the Ordesa season, sounds like it might be a bit hot in the height of summer?
I suspect it is a bit warm for challenging climbing in Ordesa in July and August, but routes like the linkup between Brujes and the Franco-Espagnole should be fine: just bring enough water. The parking is closed during peak season (eastern holiday, and July to mid September) and you have to take the shuttle bus from Torla (check this on the internet ahead of time). In spring the walls see quite a bit of meltwater runoff, more after wet winters of course.
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Nice one jwi! Very jealous! I've always wanted to climb in Ordesa ever since walking down that canyon as part of the GR11 trail sometime around 2001. Picked up the guidebook from a shop in San Sebastian around 8 years ago, such a lovingly put-together book:
(https://i.imgur.com/mU1XuO3.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/hBO2Ryu.jpg)
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Christian Ravier's topos are such beautiful pieces of art. As J. has expressed outright hostility to climbing in Ordesa I never bought the topo, but we have his topo for Gorges du Taghia with equally beautiful drawings. I find it interesting to note that we most definitely did not climb pitch 7 as described by Ravier and Thivel.
On this note, Remi Thivel's site is an absolute treasure trove of topos for climbing in the Pyrenees.
South side: https://www.remi-thivel.com/toposmontagnepyreneessud.html
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(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhZEPv91MjxMb33pogarKOkPFgrAU7CuVydhA1psjX1jNEWIojuahTfkvWVfwZyBS0rNxLvmTuxjT41VBx_BPCaP_rylMO5z-rBCgPAHilexNtY2iPBSKl1eY_DtwqVBKPlDkqawZnq7XJqg7a3AIIxCQ_O4qLaObDD4OCz8_9sQai3CKZwk5YFavpbhg/s4000/spigolo9.jpeg)
It has been ridiculously warm in the South-West this summer, and on Friday the forecast was for 40 degrees or warmer. I headed to the High Pyrenees where it was still supposed to be close to 30 at 2000m, but that is still a lot cooler. I have never done the much storied ‘Spigolo’ on Petit Aiguille d'Ansabère, but my wife has. No matter, my mate Alex was up for it, and as he has no AC in his apartment he was up for leaving the night before and sleeping in the hut near the climb.
Spigolo is an ultraclassic, but I feel that it would be better to approach it as a 7a/A0 than to try to free it in warm conditions. There are some other interesting routes on the same formation, including two basque 8as, but also some easier stuff. My guess is that the easier stuff is very alpine and that the basque routes are very hard.
I am a little bit ambivalent about the route, but as it is in Ravier's select guidebook for the Pyrenees, in the Parois de Legende and is a famous historical route it might squeeze in here. No glacier, but we had to navigate some snow due to a pretty serious route-finding mistake on the descent.
Full write up: https://steepground.blogspot.com/2022/06/spigolo-petit-aiguille-dansabere.html
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The new Petit et al. route, Voyage au Buristan, on Pic de Bure looks like a great challenge for the ambitious team! Pic de Bure is the most impressive wall you spy from the motorway when driving towards Céüse from the direction of Aix en Provence, and is usually climbed via the ultra classic Desmaison route.
The route was first free climbed by Fredrica Mignolla, all onsight except the first 8a pitch, with support from Aymeric Clouet.
(https://www.grimper.com/media/022/07%20juillet/292729562_1695267860839222_9179464645997229849_n__fit_720x1080.jpeg)
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Kaffee und Kuchen 7+ on Traunstein. Incredible longline weaving amongst the massive westwand with startlingly good rock quality. Full write up here (http://"http://atouchofgnar.blogspot.com/2022/08/longline.html") (1229 words).
Here's an excerpt:
Upon inspection, the cracks are flared. What seemed like a web of tight fissures from two pitches below morphed into distressingly rounded seams as we approached, taunting our acidic forearms. I gloomily pondered the prospect of the crux, half-closed fingers gently teasing slack as Maya battled through steep terrain below. The previous pitch had been hard enough, and it was two grades easier than the next. As if to confirm my thoughts, Maya explodes away from the overhang with a shriek of fear, nine hundred metres of exposure swinging beneath her feet. Undeterred, she threads prussiks and swiftly ascends to vertical terrain and better holds, and my secret relief. Hauling a hanging partner is exhausting.
Maya arrives at the belay, red-faced and grinning. “Hey, I was so scared!” She glances back down, and shivers. “The rope felt like it would cut in that sideways swing.”
We both share a moment of thankfulness for the wonders of nylon sheaths. Vaporous cloud spirals below our feet, weaving easily between the colossal arena we’ve spent the last nine hours breaching. At this height, peering downwards offers little perspective. Somewhere around three hundred metres, scale is lost. Only looking outwards tells the true tale, across the Traunsee into the mountains beyond. We’re higher than them now, their peaks surrendered unwillingly to a slow, grinding onslaught. Our species excelled through persistence predation, following prey for hours at a time before fatigue won out. The world turns, but these great beasts fall to the same sword. Pitch by pitch, we wear them down, trusting that our endurance will win out. I glance up again at the awaiting seams. Sometimes it’s hard to trust.
Alpine fatigue starts the night before. The brain is a fickle customer, resting best when rest is barely required. In the shadow of the mountain, sleep is too lofty a goal. I content myself with waiting, gazing passively upwards at the tongue-and-groove ceiling and listening to the nighttime song of the crickets. They revel in their sleeplessness, chirping merrily in the treacle-thick night. Maya stirs slightly, and I wonder if she is also contemplating the pine panels. The mountain waits silently. It’s a heavy silence, laying lead-like across my chest as I count the seconds to dawn.
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEiGHZnGVS-nhpKt2gKl6nS7t_UUDS3x7dytiPR8gQ-bLRh6Qou4Mb-BSHfW5oboG42oL0O9LdBvo7Fp0gEOME0utAED3kjUPuyhMwfVfk7rXI-8hnXU2giPknTTji2_wX3rG5fAxEiEhwi81eoiv4C36yIsXllioKTdErtMuVLe1v9MnyVlAX0XNqYt/s1600/Kaffee%20und%20Kuchen.jpeg)
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The link doesn’t work for me.
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The link doesn’t work for me.
Try this https://atouchofgnar.blogspot.com/2022/08/longline.html
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Thanks. That works, good read as well
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That was excellent, thanks Mischa!
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nice! long route!
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Thanks guys, glad you enjoyed it. I feel happy with the piece of writing as it feels very 'tight' to read. I've been playing around with the best ways to write about the process of climbing without getting technical and boring - hopefully that paid off in this.
As for the route, it's absolutely stunning. A proper mission day with many utterly brilliant pitches and perfect protection. I'd recommend it to anyone. My first tick from the Longlines guidebook!
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:'( :o :o :o Sorry for anyone who had Sunshine Crack or (unlikely) the Tom Egan Memorial Route on Snowpatch Spire on your bucket list...they found the bucket first.
https://gripped.com/news/massive-snowpatch-spire-rockfall-famous-climbs-destroyed/
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I did another handful routes in Verdon on a short trip this spring and added two of them, Golem and Le vent souffle où il veut to my list of routes worth doing in the Verdon. I am now listing thirty routes worth doing.
https://steepground.blogspot.com/2020/09/twenty-five-routes-worth-doing-in.html
Le vent... :
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhCpavvWO4u_DzTsECNmhsSHpnDD2O83CJ8o7DwrJwIQIlpB1_DGGi71KhVDmdtUmZSfFlh2S2wy8tB_4PLPXFiLhIHAu2Bb44mdqICLka5fmGRBRx1Hm8_IqyAwG9I_sMP41y9-_myAHwIfbcLYl4tNrT6dtAJpzl0Uf98eHT_QTByjWlHAN6PkozkDA/s2040/leVent0.jpeg)
When I get the time to write some stuff again I will add some more routes from Gorge de Taghia to the thread. They are all worth doing. Amazing place.
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Thanks jwi. The most snobbish climber I know really rates Taghia and your posts on other social media made it look amazing. I will look forward to the trip report.
Do include options for punters. I mentally crossed it off the list after dislocating my shoulder but, 5 years on, it seems to be stable and I feel more comfortable about going a bit off piste again.
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The most snobbish climber I know really rates Taghia...
Arnaud Petit? :D
I suspect Taghia is best from 6b obligatory and up. But anyone who can pull this can have two amazing weeks in the Yosemite of the High Atlas. Funny that what might well be the best mountain limestone climbing in Europe is in Africa. Somewhere where Italians, Iberians and French can all agree that the climbing is of utmost quality, and worth a trip!
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I did another handful routes in Verdon on a short trip this spring and added two of them, Golem and Le vent souffle où il veut to my list of routes worth doing in the Verdon. I am now listing thirty routes worth doing.
https://steepground.blogspot.com/2020/09/twenty-five-routes-worth-doing-in.html
Le vent... :
(https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhCpavvWO4u_DzTsECNmhsSHpnDD2O83CJ8o7DwrJwIQIlpB1_DGGi71KhVDmdtUmZSfFlh2S2wy8tB_4PLPXFiLhIHAu2Bb44mdqICLka5fmGRBRx1Hm8_IqyAwG9I_sMP41y9-_myAHwIfbcLYl4tNrT6dtAJpzl0Uf98eHT_QTByjWlHAN6PkozkDA/s2040/leVent0.jpeg)
When I get the time to write some stuff again I will add some more routes from Gorge de Taghia to the thread. They are all worth doing. Amazing place.
Thanks for this JWI, Really inspiring for me in my hiatus from rock climbing.
Re: Taghia - is a one week trip too short a time to have a decent time with travel etc?
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Re: Taghia - is a one week trip too short a time to have a decent time with travel etc?
Me and oh had ten days, our friends eight (saturday to saturday). They were satisfied despite not having stellar weather.
Fly in to Marrakesh as early as possible, take a taxi (5 hours) from the airport most of the way, and hike in (using donkeys for luggage) or take a 4x4 taxi the last few km. My friend managed to get all the way from Stockholm to Taghia in a day, with a stop over in Vienna. I imagine it is quicker from metropolitan areas in the UK?
One day travel, five days climbing, half a day travel to Marrakesh – a night in a hotel, and back again to Europe.
This should give you an idea of the climate down in the village (1900 masl):
https://www.meteoblue.com/en/weather/historyclimate/climatemodelled/31.788N-6.074E1861_Africa%2FCasablanca
Bear in mind that it will be colder up on the routes (top out at 2900 m max).
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OK. Preparing the lectures was boring, and it is too warm to go climbing today (already!) so I put together a blog post on Gorges de Taghia.
The two world-heritage routes we did this time around were Les Rivieres Poupres and Baraka. The first is universally adored by all repeaters. For the second (Baraka) I've seen some complaints on both ukclimbing and camptocamp that it should be shorter and that pitch 7 to 16 don't add much interest. I thought it was absolutely brilliant, but I love cruising easy terrain in the mountains. (Those who don't should do one of the many great routes on Parois de Sources instead.)
Anyway, unnecessary long write-up on my blog
https://steepground.blogspot.com/2023/05/gorge-de-taghia-revisited.html
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My other half told me that my blogposts are on the dry and factual side. I rarely care for other peoples' experiences on routes, I just want to know the basics.
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What is the best season for taghia? And does it offer lots of variety in terms of climbing in the sun and out of the sun?
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What is the best season for taghia? And does it offer lots of variety in terms of climbing in the sun and out of the sun?
April-mid June, September - October. Walls facing all directions. Maybe not so many routes on the purely south-facing walls. The winter in Taghia is a bit grim, I suspect. Camp to camp is good for checking orientation of routes, e.g. https://www.camptocamp.org/routes/367547/fr/taoujdad-les-rivieres-pourpres show that the route is on a purely north facing wall, and if you look at the list of the routes on a mountain, e.g. Taoujdad here https://www.camptocamp.org/waypoints/43127/fr/taoujdad you see the orientation of the routes. The drawback is that only a quarter of the routes are listed, and few of the very hardest routes.
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:2thumbsup:
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Since I've taken quite a lot from this thread over the years, and have a day to kill before driving home from the Alps, I'll chip in a couple of recent routes that occupy the fairly long and moderately hard space nicely.
I can't work out a low-faff way of adding photos on my phone unfortunately so it's a textfest...
Esprit de Clocher 6c+
Petit Clocher du Portalet
État de Choc is the famous one, and there are plenty of amazing looking harder routes on the Petit Clocher, but Esprit has had a recent makeover, with cracks being cleaned and fixed gear being removed, and deserves some props.
The other routes we climbed, the SE Pillar and Le Chic, Le Cheque et le Choc, are also excellent (the granite on the Petit Clocher is stellar), but Esprit's strong line, sustained climbing and awesome position in the centre of the frontal east face, plus the fact that it's almost 'full trad' with bolted belays, made it the most memorable. More than on the other routes it feels like you're climbing a massive tower, which you pretty much are.
It's one of those routes where you can semi-ignore the pitch grades. The first feels a sandbag at 6a/+, with a pumpy fingers layback that leaves you thinking 'fuck' with regard to the steeper cracks above. But in reality there isn't a huge difference between the pitches - it's nicely sustained. As usual in the Alps, if you can crack climb (and it's perhaps not such a great recommendation if you can't), the more 'cracky' sections feel steady for the grade.
The cracks are nicely varied - a double set of cams up to blue plus a few nuts worked well. There's even a flared squeeze chimney at the top of pitch six (home to one of the two remaining bolts on the line). At the top of this chimney is a somewhat grimly hanging belay that marks a junction (if you're suitably heroic you can skip this belay, as the pitch below is quite short). The original line follows a pegged fault diagonally left to join the final two pitches of the SE Pillar, while the direct finish continues directly into an offwidth (big cams needed if you take this option). We climbed the original, which was the definite crux of the route for me - initially fingery and pumpy with poor feet.
Bivi and approach beta: the pictures I'd seen were of a big flat rock overlooking the north face. This is right next to the approach path and very close to the crag, but it isn't actually flat. We bivied further back on a big plateau in the moraines below the Orny hut, with a snowmelt stream on hand. The chairlift from Champex Lac is the best value thing in Switzerland at €19 return. The crag is about 2h30 walk from there (allow a little more probably if carrying a load of bivi stuff and to account for the final part of the approach being quite scrambly and exposed). We had some snow to cross, all manageable in trainers with poles, which I imagine would be minimal later in the summer.
Separate post for the next one...
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Sale Athée 6c+
Aiguille du Moine
It's in Parois de Légende, and now that Rockfax has somewhat got its shit together and added some more obvious stellar lines to its Chamonix guidebook, this one seems to be more on the radar for Brits (notable upsurge in UKC logbook ticks in the past three years). And rightly so: there isn't much not to love about this for those who like climbing multi-pitch granite cracks.
Like Esprit, this route takes a strong logical line and is pleasingly crack-dominated (and even finishes on a tower on the South Ridge of the Moine - we didn't quite go to the top, more on that later). There is a little bit of more open slabby action (notably on pitch three, the first above the big ledge system, which I thought was quite wiggy with less than perfect protection), but generally it's all about cracks, which vary from hands to fingers and a bit of in between (I did a little bit of straight-in ringlocking and stacking, but not much and it's probably not obligatoire). A double set of cams to gold, plus one big blue and few micro cams and nuts, was about right.
All the pitches are good, but the hand crack on pitch six is pretty exceptional. I'm not sure I've climbed a better straight-in jamming pitch this side of the Atlantic. Oddly it's got a few bolts - like three or four on the whole pitch (other pitches similar - some where it's welcome to have a bolt, others right next to good gear). I'm not really sure of the rationale for bolts on a pitch like this, but the big plus is that you don't have to carry as many cams up the mountain.
Only minor gripe about the route was the odd position of a couple of the belays - they could easily have been placed somewhere slightly more comfortable, with no apparent compromise in the running of ropes on abseil etc. Probably didn't help that it was a bit chilly with cloud swirling around, but I felt pretty stiff a couple of times setting off on second.
Approach and bivi anti-beta: our big plan was to bivi under the Flammes de Pierre, which is en route to the Moine's west face by the old and now-unmaintained approach under the Charpoua glacier, and then to climb a route on the Flammes the following day. Unfortunately, because of the rapid death of the Mer de Glace, we had a bit of a mare finding the start of this approach. The usual story: collapsing moraines mean the fixed lines no longer reach the floor, and you have to do some sketchy scrambling on poorly bonded gravel and perched boulders to get to them. As a result we reached the bivi in the dark with one headtorch between us (not planned), had a later than planned start, and hence didn't climb the final two pitches of Sale Athée. We didn't mind not doing the last one as it's either much easier or involves pulling on bolts anyway, but it was a shame to miss the final money pitch with its spectacular-looking hand traverse.
We brought crampons and axe and needed them, albeit only for a short section of the approach couloir in the morning. Worth knowing for anyone contemplating getting the first train to Montenvers and climbing the route in the afternoon (when it gets the sun), is that this couloir was peppered with rockfall throughout the middle of the day while we were on the route. I suspect the snow is often absent or avoidable later in the season.
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Sale Athée 6c+
Oddly it's got a few bolts - like three or four on the whole pitch (other pitches similar - some where it's welcome to have a bolt, others right next to good gear). I'm not really sure of the rationale for bolts on a pitch like this, but the big plus is that you don't have to carry as many cams up the mountain.
I'd heard that's the exact rational for sporadic bolting on the big alpine cracks - so that you can survive on a standard alpine rack and not need triple cams and >#3. It's logical when you look at it that way.
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Sale Athée 6c+
Oddly it's got a few bolts - like three or four on the whole pitch (other pitches similar - some where it's welcome to have a bolt, others right next to good gear). I'm not really sure of the rationale for bolts on a pitch like this, but the big plus is that you don't have to carry as many cams up the mountain.
I'd heard that's the exact rational for sporadic bolting on the big alpine cracks - so that you can survive on a standard alpine rack and not need triple cams and >#3. It's logical when you look at it that way.
I happened on that reasoning in the process of typing, and it does make sense. The alternative, that it's for hero guides who need only a small rack of quickdraws, makes a bit less sense.
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Verdon guidebooks...
Obviously I've memorised jwi's excellent summary (http://steepground.blogspot.com/2020/09/twenty-five-routes-worth-doing-in.html) but the recommended guidebook - Verdon 2017: 52 years and 520 routes in the Verdon - is out of print and currently unavailable. Does anyone have a copy I can borrow? What do folk use instead?
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Bruno Clément's guide book is the least bad option now. It's worth it to run the descriptions for the descents on camptocamp through Google translate. The pitch descriptions and trip reports as well
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Admittedly it's been a while but I have several and play spot the difference between them. If it's useful I can photograph anything of particular interest.
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Thanks Paul. I've been offered a copy for "52 years..." Hopefully this and camptocamp will be adequate but I'll be in contact if it's not.
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The 52 years guidebook is ace. The only thing I found confusing is the theoretical quicker descent to couloir Samson after topping out La Demande or similar. Would appreciate a detailed explanation or GPX file if anyone has one (I’ll freely admit I haven’t extensively googled this yet and will probably find it directly after posting but just in case…)
edit: I see Camp2Camp recommends abseil access in most cases. Have I imagined this descent route?
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Sale Athée 6c+
Aiguille du Moine
Where is the f6c+ grade from, Parois has it at f7a+. It might mean a move from my "looks amazing but no-chance" list to my "highly aspirational/probably still too hard but a boy can dream" list...........
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The 52 years guidebook is ace. The only thing I found confusing is the theoretical quicker descent to couloir Samson after topping out La Demande or similar. Would appreciate a detailed explanation or GPX file if anyone has one (I’ll freely admit I haven’t extensively googled this yet and will probably find it directly after posting but just in case…)
edit: I see Camp2Camp recommends abseil access in most cases. Have I imagined this descent route?
I tend to take the following route from the road along the crest (so where La Demande tops out for instance) down to the foot of the routes:
park at the first Belvédère on the Route des Crêtes and walk upstream following a wide but rapidly thinning path along the crest. Follow cairns in a big loop down and left to a beautiful grove of old pine trees. Walk down along the small sportclimbing sector Valaute in an ever steeper a gully until you find a rap station at the base of the huge prow of the route Les Naufragés. Two raps (45 m and 30 m) lead to the base of the sector. Walk downstream the beach until you can take a small via ferrata up to a window in the tunnels
From the beach you can also take a tyrolian across to the new sectors to the right of the Hulk.
There are about ten more options to decend. E.g. Dalle Gris + walking down the squirrel garden + the raps to the left of ULA. Or the new raps between La demande and Au Dela, or down the wall to the right of parois rouge + scrambling down. And ... etc ...
But of those I've tried I prefered the one I've wrote up on my blog. I've taken it 4-5 times or so without issues. I think this is the descent you allude to.
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Alright nice I’ll bear this in mind for next time.
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I realise that this might a bit late for Duncan, but the descendant of 520 routes has been released in digital format on https://omegaroc.com/en/rock-climbing-in-verdon/
The topo was made by the same people as 520 routes... and I have plenty of confidence in them.
I have not tried to use it myself, but the advice from the legendary week-end warrior Manu Le Folgoc (https://alpinemag.fr/escalade-manu-le-folgoc-serial-climber/) is
That's all there is to it - throw the rest of the topos in the bin!
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Thanks for the app. suggestion. We’re using seankenny’s “52 ans…” which is very good.
It mentions jwi’s preferred option as the third of three possibilities. Only two abseils is a major plus in my book. There is now also a direct rappel piste (7 abseils) from a few metres downstream of the top of chimneys to close to the start of the route. Hard to spot 😉
(https://i.ibb.co/Dp46GpF/IMG-7828.jpg)
I’m always nervous abseiling: I’ve known too many people who have died this way and had too many ropes hang-ups. Because of this, and because I’m an early 80s climber at heart, we took the traditional route of asking your mates to drop you off at the Couloir Samson and hiking through the tunnels (Thanks again Will, if you’re reading).
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Yeah, you don't want to "do a Carne". I've heard this story a few times (including from Emil (his "fielder", who I used to climb with) and it still gives me cold sweats. https://climbingzine.com/long-run-profile-alan-carne-luke-mehall/ (section just after tent pic).
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I've been meaning to write this up since the summer and decided to use an old shared blog that a group of us used to use. Hadn't realised quite how out of date blogspot is! Anyone got any suggestions for a good format for writing trip reports?
https://scottishclimbers.blogspot.com/2024/01/sognando-aurora-tofana-di-rozes-5-year.html
Probably a bit wordy for JWI, but nowhere near as nicely written as Mischa's last piece (which I thoroughly enjoyed).
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Hadn't realised quite how out of date blogspot is! Anyone got any suggestions for a good format for writing trip reports?
The cool kids seem to be using substack these days https://substack.com/ There's also medium which is pretty popular https://medium.com/
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I've been meaning to write this up since the summer and decided to use an old shared blog that a group of us used to use. Hadn't realised quite how out of date blogspot is! Anyone got any suggestions for a good format for writing trip reports?
https://scottishclimbers.blogspot.com/2024/01/sognando-aurora-tofana-di-rozes-5-year.html
Probably a bit wordy for JWI, but nowhere near as nicely written as Mischa's last piece (which I thoroughly enjoyed).
I liked it plenty! Just missing some info, such as a succint description of every pitch, access/parking info, season/aspect and preferably an artinasal topo :D.
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Is a knife cut lino print the current oeuvre for artisanal topos?
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Is a knife cut lino print the current oeuvre for artisanal topos?
Only if stamped épreuve d'artiste
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I've been meaning to write this up since the summer and decided to use an old shared blog that a group of us used to use. Hadn't realised quite how out of date blogspot is! Anyone got any suggestions for a good format for writing trip reports?
https://scottishclimbers.blogspot.com/2024/01/sognando-aurora-tofana-di-rozes-5-year.html
Probably a bit wordy for JWI, but nowhere near as nicely written as Mischa's last piece (which I thoroughly enjoyed).
I liked it plenty! Just missing some info, such as a succint description of every pitch, access/parking info, season/aspect and preferably an artinasal topo :D.
Good to hear, thanks!
Have you seen the book: (https://assets.bigcartel.com/product_images/368857525/REDES_04.jpg?auto=format&fit=max&w=650)
To be perfectly honest, I'd would love to have half the skill required to make a good hand drawn topo - I think done well (like those for the Marmolada) they can easily outperform a photo topo when the routes get over 200m long.
such as a succint description of every pitch, access/parking info, season/aspect and preferably an artinasal topo
I had actually thought of doing that at the end, but I don't have good notes from the day so it would be a bit of a memory lottery! I think I might try to take better notes in future, maybe I'll get the writing bug again.
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I had actually thought of doing that at the end, but I don't have good notes from the day so it would be a bit of a memory lottery! I think I might try to take better notes in future, maybe I'll get the writing bug again.
I usually try to do this as soon as possible, but even then sometimes I just draw blank. Like, I know that there was a 2n+1 th pitch, becasue I was leading odds so my partner couldn't have lead two in a row, but what that pitch consisted of, what grade it had, how the protection was: no idea.
Obviously more of an issue on really long routes.