UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => equipment => Topic started by: skelf on May 16, 2016, 09:09:15 pm
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Please could you approach Five Ten and ask them nicely if you could use their rubber on your rockboots ?
Many thanks, and wishful thinking.
Skelf
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No need. At my (admittedly shite) level, the Vibram compounds are at least as good. Edge for edging, Grip for erm, grip. Just waiting for Instinct VS's in Grip for my perfect shoe.
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I used to be a 5:10 person, but find the scarpa rubber as good if not better now (and they fit my feet much better..)
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Aye, Sportiva use the same rubbers and I've not heard the likes of Ondra etc complaining. Futuras are the grippiest shoes I have ever worn. I have just had a pair of Miura VS resoled with XsGrip (instead of the usual XsEdge) and a first trial was very promising - a bit soft but brilliantly sticky on grit.
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I bought a pair of Vapours a couple of weeks ago and I reckon that they fit better than 5:10. The rubber seems as good so far.
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Yeah i love the fit and build quality of the current Scarpa range but they still don’t feel as sticky on low friction rock. (XSgrip Vs Stealth HF)
Maybe a XS Grip Instinct VS is a more realistic wish.
I like quite soft shoes (Blackwings / Jet7's) but the instinct slipper don’t seem to have that so soft I can smear the shit out of anything feel to them ....
Have i missed something super bendy in the scarpa range ...?
Ho hum still undicided on my next pair....
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Furia are soft and the drago are meant to be even softer. Maybe give them a try?
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The Furias are soft and downturned. Amazingly good on the steep stuff, but they do smear well, better than the Stix, but the edging is compromised, still very good for such a soft shoe. The XS grip feels just as grippy as Stealth HF, and they fit my feet well, unlike Dragons. The heel works brilliantly, very little dead space, unlike 5.10 shoes.
What Scarpa do need to do is make a Stix with a decent heel (they know how to after all) and a velcro strap. :please:
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I really noticed the difference between the XSEdge and XSGrip2 recently - both indoors and out.
I have been using well broken-in bootsics as my all-round go-to shoe for sport, bouldering and trad for the last couple of years - but this has been mainly on granite, gneiss and the occasional bit of limestone.
Recently, on a hard(ish, for me) sport route at Dunkeld I had a session using the boostics and not feeling all that solid on some of the less positive footholds (not smears, just...slopey edges and polished bosses etc.). swapped to to my instinct slippers and the difference was obvious.
I'm not thinking of getting my old boostics resoled in XSgrip2 as they still have good shape.
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I really noticed the difference between the XSEdge and XSGrip2 recently - both indoors and out.
I have been using well broken-in bootsics as my all-round go-to shoe for sport, bouldering and trad for the last couple of years - but this has been mainly on granite, gneiss and the occasional bit of limestone.
Recently, on a hard(ish, for me) sport route at Dunkeld I had a session using the boostics and not feeling all that solid on some of the less positive footholds (not smears, just...slopey edges and polished bosses etc.). swapped to to my instinct slippers and the difference was obvious.
I'm not thinking of getting my old boostics resoled in XSgrip2 as they still have good shape.
Over the last few months I've been using the womens Miura VSs, bought for fit (and price!) which use Grip2. Very impressed and definitely feel more secure on marginal footholds than my previous Miuras (XSEdge) and Tenaya Ras (XSGrip). No sure how much is boot and how much rubber but at the moment very tempted to stay with Grip2 in preference to Edge.
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The Furias are soft and downturned. Amazingly good on the steep stuff, but they do smear well, better than the Stix, but the edging is compromised, still very good for such a soft shoe. The XS grip feels just as grippy as Stealth HF, and they fit my feet well, unlike Dragons. The heel works brilliantly, very little dead space, unlike 5.10 shoes.
What Scarpa do need to do is make a Stix with a decent heel (they know how to after all) and a velcro strap. :please:
Scarpa always have incredibly irritating little problems with their shoes, the lace up instincts were my favourite shoe but the flap of rubber over the toes was worse than useless and would rip off the first time you toe hooked in anger and the heel rubber would also do the same with deep heel hooks.
They remedied this with the vs but they are too soft for routes in my opinion.
I don't find any difference between the grip and edge rubber.
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The new Instinct Lace Up arrived in the UK yesterday apparently. Same heel as the VS, will be interesting to see how stiff it is.
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They remedied this with the vs but they are too soft for routes in my opinion.
Really!? They're like planks. Felt as stiff as 5.10 blanco's to me, though admittedly it's been a few years since I've worn blanco's.
Everyone else I've spoken to (haven't read all this thread) seems to say they're too stiff if anything, hence some resoles with grip.
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They remedied this with the vs but they are too soft for routes in my opinion.
Really!? They're like planks. Felt as stiff as 5.10 blanco's to me, though admittedly it's been a few years since I've worn blanco's.
Everyone else I've spoken to (haven't read all this thread) seems to say they're too stiff if anything, hence some resoles with grip.
I'm with Ben on this, have always found the VS stiffer than the original Instinct Lace, though I realise that's not the consensus. My VS re-soled in Grip2 feel about the same as the Instinct Lace.
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They remedied this with the vs but they are too soft for routes in my opinion.
Really!? They're like planks. Felt as stiff as 5.10 blanco's to me, though admittedly it's been a few years since I've worn blanco's.
Everyone else I've spoken to (haven't read all this thread) seems to say they're too stiff if anything, hence some resoles with grip.
I'm with Ben on this, have always found the VS stiffer than the original Instinct Lace, though I realise that's not the consensus. My VS re-soled in Grip2 feel about the same as the Instinct Lace.
weird, I think they are definitely not a smearing shoe but I think they are fine on grit; if there were a pair of vibram clogs on the market I would go for them however.
I don't think the comparison with blancos is a good one, the shape is completely different but I own a pair of both and blancos are miles stiffer.
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I use the instinct slipper for more smeary things and the VS (which is fairly stiff I think) for things needing more of an edge or a better heel. If I need an ultimate heel - then I go to an old pair of dragons :)
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Furia are soft and the drago are meant to be even softer. Maybe give them a try?
Jesus have i been asleep for the last year or so .....?
Furia - They look like the dogs bollocks, just the kind of softness I’m looking for, will need to find a pair in the shops and get them tried on ASAP.
The Dragos look like a step too far though, only in the UK in limited quantities which will mean if you really like them getting a spare pair might be a pain!
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I've tried the drago's. Too soft for me, and I'm quite partial to a soft shoe. I found getting them the correct tightness meant the rand became very bulgy, limiting the already limited edging ability.
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Tim - the new instinct lace is the best toe hooking shoe I've used so think you'll like that part of them. Softer than the old ones though, feel more like a cross between the old ones and a booster s. Not sure how theyll perform on vert, im mainly using booster s for that kind of thing, but I like them on the steep stuff..
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Furia are soft and the drago are meant to be even softer. Maybe give them a try?
Jesus have i been asleep for the last year or so .....?
Furia - They look like the dogs bollocks, just the kind of softness I’m looking for, will need to find a pair in the shops and get them tried on ASAP.
The Dragos look like a step too far though, only in the UK in limited quantities which will mean if you really like them getting a spare pair might be a pain!
For the Furias, keep in mind that they are alot narrower than the Instinct S/VS. I wear the Instincts in 42 with a nice tight fit and the Furias in the same size are nearly 10mm narrower at the widest point.
I haven't been able to wear them on rock yet because they are so narrow....
To me they seem like Scarpa have tried to make the Team vxi... Same narrowness issue there too for me.
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Baws!, that’s what I like about the instincts. Its like someone has drawn round my (wide) feet and then gone off and made a rockboot that actually matches the shape of my feet. ho hum, def need to try then on then..
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Dear Scarpa,
(http://i.imgur.com/VBSjIxm.jpg)
Yours truly,
Blee Dingtoes
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Dear Scarpa,
(http://i.imgur.com/VBSjIxm.jpg)
Yours truly,
Blee Dingtoes
:lol: must be all those roof toe hooks
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Tim - the new instinct lace is the best toe hooking shoe I've used so think you'll like that part of them. Softer than the old ones though, feel more like a cross between the old ones and a booster s. Not sure how theyll perform on vert, im mainly using booster s for that kind of thing, but I like them on the steep stuff..
So scarpa have managed to take what was an almost perfect vert and overhanging rock shoe and fix one problem (the toe rubber) and introduce another one (making them too soft for edging, the instinct vs was too soft for edging routes in my opinion).
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The heel is now one piece on the new Instinct Lace, same as the VS. Which it wasn't before.
Are you a rep for Moon/Scarpa Tim?
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Ha ha, obviously I pay for my shoes and Scarpa are the only shoes I have ever bought pretty much, they fit my feet properly and are well made.
They also don't do stupid gimmicks like no edge or incredibly soft shoes.
For me they are best brand in the market but the little things just annoy me
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..Scarpa are the only shoes I have ever bought pretty much..
..For me they are best brand in the market...
Well I don't know about anyone else but I'm convinced.
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..Scarpa are the only shoes I have ever bought pretty much..
..For me they are best brand in the market...
Well I don't know about anyone else but I'm convinced.
Thanks! I do pay for my shoes but I am on commission
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If I had some scarpas here now I'd get my cock out and piss on them, and I'm sure the rest of the trains passengers would understand
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This is all getting a bit Apple vs Microsoft....
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If I had some scarpas here now I'd get my cock out and piss on them, and I'm sure the rest of the trains passengers would understand
I doubt they would. I reckon they'd wonder what was up with you. We, however, would understand.
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Not really tomtom with shoes you've got a good few brand choices with the other option you only have apple
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I'm obviously not interested in slackers reply of 17 different systems which no one but a geek uses
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My thoughts on shoes....
I've used boreal, scarpa, 5:10 and La Sportiva. Mostly 5:10 and more recently Scarpa.
For me, Scarpa fit my feet well, are well made and last pretty well.
5:10 fit alright, but are a bit too tight, are sized randomly and last pretty well.
I've no fucking idea which grips best in which circumstance, just that sometimes one shoe works when the other doesnt.. this may be due to either how the different rubbers interact with the rock - or how the fit of the shoe (slipper, lace up, velcro) and its stiffness etc. interacts with the hold/smear on the problem in question. I've had times on lime and grip where one will work better one day, and the other better another.
I'm happier buying scarpa online than 5:10 due to the sizing stuff.. However, I am concerned that someone might piss on them if I were to carry them home (openly) on the train. However, I tend not to do the punter thing of having them carabiner'd onto the outside of my rucksack/bag. That would be (a) cruel to the world due to the stench and (b) be dangerously inviting to any passing on train scarpa pisser-inners.
PS. I am fucking bored today - and can't climb at the moment.
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I like 5.10 rubber but I've not had any issues with XSgrip2. I must admit that I dislike XSedge, and it ruins the Scarpa shoes that it's used on but plenty of people seem not to mind.
I use the stix almost exclusively now but plan to swap to the booster s when my current pair run out. They both use XSgrip2.
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stoopid question but i'm assuming the heal on a shoe is made out of the same rubber as on the toe ? say drago's vs instinct VS. same heel, but is it the same rubber ?? cant think why you would want edging rubber on your heel right enough .... confused.com
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It's a very weight-dependent thing. I can't stand shoes with XSGrip because I weigh loads and the edges just deform horribly under my lumbering carcass, but I get on with XSEdge just fine. Quite often the only difference between the men's and women's versions of Scarpa shoes is the rubber, with the latter aimed at lighter climbers.
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I had a longing fondle of a pair of the new blue instinct velcros with the XSGrip (rather than edge) at the Depot last night... felt like just my kind of shoe - as I love the fit of the InstinctVS but often found the rubber a bit stiff and with it feel down... Like the instinct slipper but with a decent heel in other words...
£125 felt a bit heavy though...
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It's a very weight-dependent thing. I can't stand shoes with XSGrip because I weigh loads and the edges just deform horribly under my lumbering carcass, but I get on with XSEdge just fine. Quite often the only difference between the men's and women's versions of Scarpa shoes is the rubber, with the latter aimed at lighter climbers.
I've resoled my Boostics in XSGrip2 and they feel noticeably more "deformable" - they feel a little gripper on smedges and smears, but a little less secure standing around on small edges. They now feel very nice for all-round trad duties, but I'd reach for XSEdge for really sharp edging.
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Quite often the only difference between the men's and women's versions of Scarpa shoes is the rubber, with the latter aimed at lighter climbers.
Really? Like what?
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Different horses for different courses between Scapra and 5:10 for me.
I boulder in boostics for the stiffness, and I lead in slightly loose dragons for comfort.
IMO it boils down to how much body tension you can produce, via how much power you can push out of through the shoe.
I can get a lot of power out of the boostics, because its effectively like standing on a stiff platform (i think whites are an even more extreme form of this). However, I find that my feet get sore fairly quickly if I am trying to do routes with them. Probably because I get the foot sequence a lot more dialled when bouldering.
The dragons are more forgiving, because I think the sets I have are slightly large. I can get away with slightly worse foot placement, as long as I push hard enough. The downside of the dragons is that I cant reliably produce as much power.
A good example is the move on weedkiller traverse, where others use a heal hook and then do the campus move. I push hard through my toe on a spike slightly lower in the roof. I can generate enough tension for the moves with the boostics, but not always enough with the dragons.
I will be interested to try the new instinct lace, to see if it is a suitable replacement for the boostic.
I think if the shoe fits you really well but your feet keep slipping, you probably need to work on core tension and footwork.
Does anyone have any suggestions for a half-way-house between the boostic and the dragon?
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Does anyone have any suggestions for a half-way-house between the boostic and the dragon?
As I said earlier, the Furias are softer than the Boostics, but offer more support than the Dragons. The Booster S is stiffer than the Furia and may also fit the bill.
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Does anyone have any suggestions for a half-way-house between the boostic and the dragon?
As I said earlier, the Furias are softer than the Boostics, but offer more support than the Dragons. The Booster S is stiffer than the Furia and may also fit the bill.
I was going to give the obvious answer and say go up a size in the boostic or down a size in the dragon [emoji14]
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Hopefully 5.10 won't scrap the dragon. I would like to try the Furia, but as others have noted, it's a furious price tag
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Hopefully 5.10 won't scrap the dragon. I would like to try the Furia, but as others have noted, it's a furious price tag
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96 through Banana Fingers....
http://www.bananafingers.co.uk/scarpa-furia-p-3582.html
I have also got a pair of the VSR. Haven't worn them climbing yet but will be in the Gramps with them next week. :tease:
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The VSRs fit me perfectly straight out of the box.... No need to even wear them in.
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Is the fit identical to the VS?
Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
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Though I've a pair of VS I'm hoping to get resoled with XS Grip - so they'll be the same as VSR's right (bit of blue marker pen and who'll know!)
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Is the fit identical to the VS?
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Dunno, I went down half a size cos they're softer
Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk
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For the VS my first pair were 41's - and took about two months to stretch in... Next pair were 41.5's and are still good and tight but didn't take as long to wear in...
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Is the fit identical to the VS?
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I'm on my 4th pair of VSs and they usually take a few weeks to wear in.
In theory they should be the same....
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Quite often the only difference between the men's and women's versions of Scarpa shoes is the rubber, with the latter aimed at lighter climbers.
Really? Like what?
The current Vapour V springs to mind. I don't think the last is any different.
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Quite often the only difference between the men's and women's versions of Scarpa shoes is the rubber, with the latter aimed at lighter climbers.
Really? Like what?
The current Vapour V springs to mind. I don't think the last is any different.
I was more querying which shoes have different rubber between the men's and women's version. As for the Vapour V, I'll agree the lasts are quite similar, but they are definitely slightly different.
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That's what I was giving an example of. The women's have XS Grip 2, the men's have XS Edge.
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That's what I was giving an example of. The women's have XS Grip 2, the men's have XS Edge.
I think you're looking at the old model.
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What have people who used the old Instinct laces moved on to?
They fit my feel so well, and the new ones look very different.
Everything seems to have XSEdge2 now as well damn it Scarpa.
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Everything seems to have XSEdge2 now as well damn it Scarpa.
Except for the following:
Stix
Furia
Drago
VS-R
Mago
Booster
Ignoring the entry level and kids shoes, that's more shoes with XS Grip in the range than with XS Edge.
Being relatively heavy at around 80kg, the XS Edge works really well for me most of the time. Because the fit works so well for me, my shoes going forward will be probably both types of the VS, the -R I'll save for indoors and for gritstone bouldering.
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What have people who used the old Instinct laces moved on to?
They fit my feel so well, and the new ones look very different.
Everything seems to have XSEdge2 now as well damn it Scarpa.
I am trying the new la sportive otaki, too early to fully review yet but initially promising.
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Everything seems to have XSEdge2 now as well damn it Scarpa.
Except for the following:
Stix
Furia
Drago
VS-R
Mago
Booster
Ignoring the entry level and kids shoes, that's more shoes with XS Grip in the range than with XS Edge.
Being relatively heavy at around 80kg, the XS Edge works really well for me most of the time. Because the fit works so well for me, my shoes going forward will be probably both types of the VS, the -R I'll save for indoors and for gritstone bouldering.
Perhaps I should have quantified my statement a little more with shoes for trad :oops:.
My experience of those are they are all super soft, there doesn't seem to be a stiffer shoe with XS Grip. Albeit I've not see the VS-R yet, so maybe that's the answer.
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Perhaps I should have quantified my statement a little more with shoes for trad :oops:.
My experience of those are they are all super soft, there doesn't seem to be a stiffer shoe with XS Grip. Albeit I've not see the VS-R yet, so maybe that's the answer.
My experience with a resoled boostic (stiff shoe, originally with XsEdge) is that XsGrip & stiff shoe is a bit of a weird combo. It's a little better on less positive footholds, but noticeably squirmier on positive edges and it's still no smearing weapon.
Have you tried resoling anything with XSGrip?
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Trad usually means standing around on footholds for ages. This means a stiff-ish shoe with a good edging compound like XS Edge. Using a smearing compound will just compromise performance for the majority of the shoes use?
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Everything seems to have XSEdge2 now as well damn it Scarpa.
Except for the following:
Stix
Furia
Drago
VS-R
Mago
Booster
Ignoring the entry level and kids shoes, that's more shoes with XS Grip in the range than with XS Edge.
Being relatively heavy at around 80kg, the XS Edge works really well for me most of the time. Because the fit works so well for me, my shoes going forward will be probably both types of the VS, the -R I'll save for indoors and for gritstone bouldering.
Perhaps I should have quantified my statement a little more with shoes for trad :oops:.
My experience of those are they are all super soft, there doesn't seem to be a stiffer shoe with XS Grip. Albeit I've not see the VS-R yet, so maybe that's the answer.
Isn't that supposed to be the point of the VS-R? I had my VS re-soled in XSG2 and they work well being a tad softer (though I've worn through the re-sole surprisingly quickly). I think some of the sponsored climbers had 'specials' made of the VS with XSG2.
In answer to your original question, isn't the new Instinct Lace that's coming out stiffer than the VS? I can't remember now. Drew?
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Is the fit identical to the VS?
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Dunno, I went down half a size cos they're softer
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I'm now breaking in the vsr and going down a half size ( up a half size from the instinct slipper) was sensible, since they are way more sensitive than the vs.
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after starting this thread, i got a pair of dragos and they are great - just what i was looking for .... :icon_beerchug:
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I was just about to try and buy a pair of the VSRs online but can't quite work out what size my VSs are (either the printed size has worn off or it was never there in the first place). Is anyone daft enough (/willing and around a size 7, I seem to be 6.5 in FiveTens these days) to measure their boots so I can take an educated guess?
Mine measure roughly 23.5cm from the tip of the toe, to the back of the heel (with the boot arching and the tape measure staying flat).
I'd just go to a shop but I'm running out of time before a trip.
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I suspect the VSR's will stretch more than the VS's... (thinner rubber) so if unsure I'd err on the side of smaller...
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I was just about to try and buy a pair of the VSRs online but can't quite work out what size my VSs are (either the printed size has worn off or it was never there in the first place). Is anyone daft enough (/willing and around a size 7, I seem to be 6.5 in FiveTens these days) to measure their boots so I can take an educated guess?
Mine measure roughly 23.5cm from the tip of the toe, to the back of the heel (with the boot arching and the tape measure staying flat).
I'd just go to a shop but I'm running out of time before a trip.
My 40.5s are 23.5cm, my 40s are 23cm.
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Thanks.
TomTom, I had it in my head to go a half size down but I tried thy old pair on the other night and they were still really snug. They're mainly for routes too.
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Thanks.
TomTom, I had it in my head to go a half size down but I tried thy old pair on the other night and they were still really snug. They're mainly for routes too.
Yes - though my most recent pair of VS were half a size larger than my (crippling for the first month) first pair - and have not bagged at all.. I'm getting the first pair re-soled with the thinner rubber to make my own VSR's :)
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Anyone has any recommendations on how the VSR would do in Font? The VS were obviously way too stiff.
How are they at smearing?
I can only pick up 1 pair and generally prefer something downturned. I really like the VS but don't want to get another pair for the imminent Font trip as they really don't suit the climbing at all.
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Furia? Not tried either mind...
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I find the instinct slipper a really good allround grit shoe (heel is crap though)... plenty of sensitivity and good for smearage. Iirc, the vsr has the same thinner rubber as the slipper...
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I'm really getting into my Vapours now they're a bit more worn in. I only really got them as an indoor shoe, that I could take off easily. I'm now finding in Font that I use them in preference to my (practically new unworn in) pinks on mostly everything except micro-grattons. I find that I'm smearing a lot more than I do with the pinks. Don't know if a perfect Font shoe exists.
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To my feet the VSR feels like an Instinct Slipper with a velcro strap. What the VS was originally pegged as until Bishton had his wicked way. It is noticeably softer than the VS, and has stretched more (although they are a smaller size so not surprising really). I took mine to Font along with some VS, and Dragos. I wore the Dragos a few times, but mostly lived in the VSR.
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My 40.5s are 23.5cm, my 40s are 23cm.
They fit! ;D
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I picked up a pair of VSR the other day. Went down half a size from 40.5 to 40 and they fit like a glove after a couple of days.
The rubber felt significantly softer compared to the VS on the grit over the weekend. Feels like a great shoe so far. Hopefully they soften just a touch more (I'm certain they will) for some smeary action.
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I picked up a pair of VSR the other day. Went down half a size from 40.5 to 40 and they fit like a glove after a couple of days.
The rubber felt significantly softer compared to the VS on the grit over the weekend. Feels like a great shoe so far. Hopefully they soften just a touch more (I'm certain they will) for some smeary action.
After two weeks I wish I'd done the same. However, I'm not sure I'd have got them on!
I've been truly impressed by the VSR straight out of the box and I used them for all but the more vert offerings of the RRG. The rubber is really sticky :2thumbsup:
The toe patch is already showing signs of peeling despite doing no specific toe hooking.
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I picked up a pair of VSR the other day. Went down half a size from 40.5 to 40 and they fit like a glove after a couple of days.
The rubber felt significantly softer compared to the VS on the grit over the weekend. Feels like a great shoe so far. Hopefully they soften just a touch more (I'm certain they will) for some smeary action.
After two weeks I wish I'd done the same. However, I'm not sure I'd have got them on!
I've been truly impressed by the VSR straight out of the box and I used them for all but the more vert offerings of the RRG. The rubber is really sticky :2thumbsup:
The toe patch is already showing signs of peeling despite doing no specific toe hooking.
Yeah, it took a week or two of pain and plastic bags were required to get them on. Like a glove now though...
Would recommend anyone else looking to buy to go down half a size from the VS for sure.
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Same sizing as for VS slippers then
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Yeah, it took a week or two of pain and plastic bags were required to get them on. Like a glove now though...
Would recommend anyone else looking to buy to go down half a size from the VS for sure.
How's your toe patch doing? Mine is starting to peel which given it's only been used for RRG routes (so jamming my feet into the back of breaks but nothing that techy in terms of 'hooks) seems a bit poor.
Hopefully I'll get to test them on some Spanish lime next week rather than basic sandstone and plastic.
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How's your toe patch doing? Mine is starting to peel which given it's only been used for RRG routes (so jamming my feet into the back of breaks but nothing that techy in terms of 'hooks) seems a bit poor.
Hopefully I'll get to test them on some Spanish lime next week rather than basic sandstone and plastic.
Hmmm... Yeah, good point. Mine is actually peeling off a little too. Not much at the moment but, considering I've only used them for a wet week in Font and a few weeks of indoors, it does seem a bit poor.
Also, I've got a few chunks of rubber ripped out / peeling off around the front of the toe edge. Probably from some sharp slabs in Font and perhaps the price to pay for a softer shoe?
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Same sizing as for VS slippers then
I haven't had a pair of those for years, but if that's the same drop in size then yeah.
They're a great shoe but I am still noticing them getting softer and a more baggy on the top of the toe.
Hopefully it doesn't go much further or I'll be able to wriggle my toes about.
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Same sizing as for VS slippers then
I haven't had a pair of those for years, but if that's the same drop in size then yeah.
They're a great shoe but I am still noticing them getting softer and a more baggy on the top of the toe.
Hopefully it doesn't go much further or I'll be able to wriggle my toes about.
Nowadays I pretty much climb in instinct Slippers and VS - slippers stretch more so I get them 1/2 EU size smaller...
If you get them too small persevere (wet then and plastic bags in the feet etc..) and they will eventually stretch out - but it takes quite a while (unlike other brands...)
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Same sizing as for VS slippers then
They're a great shoe but I am still noticing them getting softer and a more baggy on the top of the toe.
Hopefully it doesn't go much further or I'll be able to wriggle my toes about.
Nowadays I pretty much climb in instinct Slippers and VS - slippers stretch more so I get them 1/2 EU size smaller...
If you get them too small persevere (wet then and plastic bags in the feet etc..) and they will eventually stretch out - but it takes quite a while (unlike other brands...)
Sorry, TT. I was referring to the VSR above.
They seem to still be stretching out even more (similar to the slipper) but are in danger of becoming a bit too baggy around the toe if it continues.
I had to use plastic bags to get them on too and there is absolutely no way I could've gone smaller. Those first few sessions were excruciating!
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Bit of an aside, but have you guys found that fitting them really small makes much difference? I found that they just stretched to the size of my foot regardless, it was just more painful getting there in the small shoes, and there was little difference in the final fit. Also, fitting them really small often makes the heel worse because it sits lower on your heel.
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Yes in the slippers - less so in the VS (not had car). Three pairs of slippers - 41, 41 and present pair are 41.5. All right to start with but the 41.5's feel a teeny bit baggy now stretched.
For VS had 41 and 41.5. Both feel same now but 41's took ages and lots of pain to bed in.
I get the impression the vsr's stretch more..
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Bit of an aside, but have you guys found that fitting them really small makes much difference? I found that they just stretched to the size of my foot regardless, it was just more painful getting there in the small shoes, and there was little difference in the final fit. Also, fitting them really small often makes the heel worse because it sits lower on your heel.
I found the same thing with the Booster S to some extent and nowadays wear 1/2 a euro size up from what I originally used in them. Still pretty tight though - tried another half size up again but it messed up the fit around my smaller toes.
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Anyone tried the Chimera yet? Apart from the rather lurid colour scheme they look rather spiffing.
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They look like a multi-coloured five ten Dragon.
I'd be interested to hear some comments on them, though the blurb ( http://www.rockrun.com/wp/scarpa-chimera-evolution-of-an-apex-rock-shoe/ ) seems to be claiming to solve quite a few non-issues. I've certainly not suffered from discomfort or lack of sensitivity due to the shoes internal stitching for instance.
They also look very narrow, which rules me out and is fair enough but making them very low volume over the toe area seems pointless to me. If you look at them from the side they taper to nearly a point but most people are going to wear these tight and have their toes bent. Many manufacturers have performed that area a bit to accommodate a bent toe.
I'll reserve full judgement until is tried a pair but would be surprised I'd they differ much from the Drago and furia.
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What's the deal with the VS-R? I've had my VS resoled in XS Grip and they are still stiff as fook, which is great for limestone but lack sensitivity for steepness. Is the only difference literally the rubber or have they softened the midsole up?
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They feel softer. I'd consider half a size smaller than the VS next time (although they might not actually go on my feet).
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I'd be happy with them being fold up in your hand soft personally. I take it they aren't that bad?
My new apprentice steep shoes (Skwama) are good but I don't get on with rock solid heels. The VS heel is prefect for me and fits like a glove. Not usually an issue on routes but I heel hook all the time when bouldering.
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If you want something even softer, have you tried the Drago? It has the same heel as the VS.
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They feel softer. I'd consider half a size smaller than the VS next time (although they might not actually go on my feet).
As a counterpart to this, I've found the rubber itself to be the only significant difference. They might be slightly softer elsewhere but if so I haven't noticed much. I do wear them tight and haven't tried to climb any steep limestone sport in them, which may influence this. I also wear the same size as the oranges, which is perfect for me.
Edit, to be clear, to me the heel and all aspects of the fit feel identical.
I've been through 4 pairs of vs but this is my first pair of vsr, I've had them about 2 months.
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Thanks chaps. Sounds like they're not significantly different then.
I have tried the Drago on but they're too narrow for me. I've also tried the Camera on. They're actually quite wide, but quite narrow right at the toe, which doesn't suit me.
Will just keep persevering with the Skwama and see if I can get used to them or I'll have to go back to using my stix v2 for roof stuff, just don't find the stix very precise when edging. Basically I'm trying to not have to take 3-4 pairs of shoes with me every time I go climbing... Would love an all rounder!
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What's the deal with the VS-R? I've had my VS resoled in XS Grip and they are still stiff as fook, which is great for limestone but lack sensitivity for steepness. Is the only difference literally the rubber or have they softened the midsole up?
Who resoled them? Scarpa use 3.5mm Grip 2. This is softer than 4mm Grip 2, or any thickness of Grip. Certain resolers will use Grip 2, some will use Grip.
The VSR is the same as the VS except in rubber.
They look like a multi-coloured five ten Dragon.
... I've certainly not suffered from discomfort or lack of sensitivity due to the shoes internal stitching for instance.
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I'll reserve full judgement until is tried a pair but would be surprised I'd they differ much from the Drago and furia.
The internal stitching isn't just about comfort or sensitivity (while it is for both these things), it's also for longevity. It means they should survive at least one resole. The current record (as far as I know), is a VS being resoled 5 times. Only retired due to the accumulated sweat turning mouldy!
The last used on the Chimera is the same as the Drago. Same wrapped rand, and same PCB tensioned-rand so should be pretty similar. However they have a stiffer plastic midsole, plus a lump under the toes for support. All in all, they're a bit stiffer.
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Please fix the weak point on top of the big toe on the instinct vs where the stitching always splits. This has happened to everyone I know with these shoes.
Thank you.
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https://www.instagram.com/mattcousins_/?hl=en (https://www.instagram.com/mattcousins_/?hl=en)
Scarpa shoe pr0n on Matt C instagram page.
Two custom built furia's that look pretty sick.
Looks like custom builds might be the next big thing.
Matt's on fire check out the levitation used for the Tamru comp at top of the account (black thumbnail image). :o Pretty static problem he needs to crank up the dynamic movement on the next set.