UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => diet, training and injuries => Topic started by: fatneck on January 06, 2014, 10:20:13 am
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So I've always been known for being an underachieving fat nature helm and every year I work hard at losing weight before Font and put it all back on over the course of a summer's fishing! I can climb 7a on a really good day but would like to do this more often and expect that losing weight is a key ingredient in being able to do this.
I currently weigh around 90kg and last year I managed a four year low of 87kg before I left for Font, I'd like to beat that this year and would like to be around 85kg. (I say "around" because my weight never settles and varies a kilo either way with great regularity!)
I have always loved fatty foods and seem to be able to put on weight easier than anyone I know (family included) so this is hard for me! Oh to be 25 again and able to eat what I want at stay at 80kg!! :boohoo:
Other info - my wife is incredibly fussy about food, this limits "acceptable" family meals and as I do all the cooking I prefer not to have to cook two different meals. I hate running and always seem to get injured when I try but i do walk to work most of the time (2 miles each way). I'm doing the January Sharkathon, training 3 nights a week and currently climbing indoors twice a week and outdoors when I can.
Here is my current diet plan, please let me know what changes you might suggest and/or alternatives to what I am doing...
Breakfast - 1 banana
Lunch - Large box of salad containing variously - 1 carrot, some onion, a tin of tuna/sardines, some sweetcorn, raw mushrooms (4) half a bag of pre-packed salad leaves, some diet salad dressing.
Tea - assorted meals with the rest of the family with a focus on reduced portion size and increased amount of veg (green beans, carrots, broccoli, peas) - typically from the following list of acceptable meals;
- Toad in the hole
- Spag Bol
- Pasta with various meats/fish, cheese, pesto etc
- Chicken in bacon type affairs
- Pizza/chips/chicken nuggets etc
- Potatoes
Snacks - I will typically eat 2 apples and 2 tangerines through the day.
I have cut out all the crisps, nuts, beer etc. Never been a big fan of chocolate/sweets...
Questions -
1. Am I eating too much/not enough fruit - aware that there is a lot of sugar etc.
2. Should I bite the bullet and cook one meal for me and one for the rest of the family?
3. Will the feeling of being hungry all the time fade?
Many thanks!
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All rings very true, I'm in a similar boat.
It looks good to me non-expert eye. just a question of sticking with it, and also eating sensibly before and after training sessions.
Avoid prepacked salad leaves if you can, some have nasty preservatives in the bag to keep them fresh, tearing up a lettuce every couple of days isn't that hard.
If you are concerned about too much fruit sugar, try snacking on veg; cherry toms and carrots are as easy to snack on as fruit.
When eating with the family keep your portion of the high fat stuff (pizza, chips, chicken nuggets) to a minimum and have bigger potions of veg, boiled new potatoes, rice. Eat with them, but do it right.
Avoid snacking, sugar binging and make sure you hydrate!
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Hydration is a good call, thanks Chris... Also, good knowledge on the pre packed salad shizzle...
Also in terms of eating before/after training etc today is a classic example. Work all day then hitting the wall from work, climbing 4 till 6 then prob wont eat before 7.30 (late for me). What would constitute eating sensibly? Should I pack tea as well?
Am a complete novice when it comes to thinking about protein, should I invest in some shakes for straight after climbing?
Also at home I generally train after tea and once the nipper's in bed between 7.30 and 8. Should I then take on some protein to maximise gains? Again, would seem a protein shake the best way forward?
Sorry for all the questions...
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Like I said, non-expert, but general advice seems to be some carbs before training, hydration during and protein after? I don't bother with protein shakes (maybe I should), opt for milkshake instead, but I'm sure I'll be corrected very shortly if I've got it wrong.
I usually train at the wall late compared to you; get to the wall by 7 and there 'til about 9:30. Usually have some soup or microwave rice or pasta pot at work at about 6 so I don't feel too full when training, and have milkshake on the way home. At home I normally eat with kids at 5:30 -6 or so, then train at about 8 when they are in bed and milkshake afters.
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I am certainly no expert but when has that ever stopped anyone giving their oppinion on the internet? Personally I would never be able to manage on a banana and a salad for the entire day. Any diet needs to be sustainable if you want to keep the weight off. I believe its better to have a larger (but healthy) breakfast to keep you going for the day and then try to restrict later meals.
Personally I am rubbish at limiting my food intake (although I generally eat fairly healthily) and rely on upping my exercise levels to reduce weight (Something that I need to do after the recent feasting period).
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Dump the banana at breakfast for a start - it's loaded with sugar and you're starting the day with a sugar rush and that just sets the tone for what your body wants that day.
Try having protein instead. Salmon and eggs, even lean bacon and eggs will fill you up and you're avoiding that big sugar spike. If that sounds like effort in the mornings (often does to me) then a quick egg omelette may work for you. Just try and avoid having carbs if you can... I find I'm better skipping breakfast altogether rather than having carbs as carbs just leave me ravenous by 9.30am.
I'm no expert, I just have a nutritionist trainer dude of a mate who points me at info from time to time but 6 years ago I did weigh 98kg and now I'm 78kg. Also for me, eating at the right times has made a difference. Same food as before (when I was 85kg) but now I time it a lot better, in conjunction with when I train, which can mean I eat as late as 10pm some days.
Best of luck anyways.
:)
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Personally I'd look into grazing if you're feeling hungry a lot of the time. By eating smaller portions more often you can kick-start your metabolism into getting things going. Your diet looks to do the opposite of this (IMO) and even if you lose weight you may find that you put it on a lot quicker when you stop. /2p
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Hi Fatneck,
For what it is worth I was 90kg this time last year and am now 79kg. I did make some changes to what I ate and it is not that different to what what you are suggesting (probably a bit less strict if anything). I cut out the cakes, biscuits, puddings etc as you suggest. I think What made the whole thing work for me was upping the amount of aerobic exercise. Like you I didn't enjoy running very much but I did like cycling and made that my method of daily commute. This comes to about an hour of cycling per day. This coupled with two to three wall sessions per week helped me lose weight and made a big difference to my general fitness.
The improvement in general fitness has also had a knock on effect so that I can now go running without it being a really unpleasant experience. So now I can have a bit more variation in aerobic exercise and I do think that the running is a more efficient for weight loss than just the cycling which did tends to give me bigger upper legs.
So I would say attack the problem from both directions certainly watch what you eat within reason but try and get 30 to 40 mins of aerobic exercise (with you heart rate up to ca. 75%max) per day.
Good luck and don't be disheartened if you don't see quick or even constant improvments. I found the weight loss stared quite slowly then quickened pace in the summer but with ups and downs throughout.
Edit: I did cut out bananas as well :)
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With everyone dissing the banana you may need an alternative breakfast. Don't know how pressured mornings are for you but they are fairly so for me and I guess many of us; my weekday breakfast is normally a bowl of porridge oats that have been soaked over night - I use soya milk as I'm vegan but am guessing low fat cow's milk (or other) would work. The oats break down to a nice creamy texture, getting rid of the need for cooking and making them very digestible. I've been told the soaking has a similar to effect to sprouting beans in terms of upping nutritional content but I've no idea if its true. Might be a quick alternative to porridge?
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Interesting Andy. I usually do mine from raw in the microwave (2 mins), maybe a quick blast after soaking to take the chill off?
I also hate running, thanks to doing too much in National Service I still can't get back into it, even 25 years later. I cycle or sometimes swim when I can be bothered.
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Thanks everyone!
Going to buy some oats and think about doing some aerobic exercise whilst browsing...
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:agree: with pretty much all of the above - as another opinionated but unqualified internet punter :icon_beerchug:
+1 for the importance of breakfast. If you eat a small breakfast after all night with no food your body thinks it's short of food and slows down your metabolism (or that's why I think everyone says it's the most important meal!).
Porridge truly is unbeatable IMO: relatively high in protein, known to reduce cholesterol, full of roughage, cheap as chips, filling for relatively few calories. I make it with 3:1 water and a sprinkle of salt (essential to make it not taste like wallpaper paste, it does NOT taste salty at all), and put it on the hob while I shower so it takes minimal time out my day. I soak the pot in COLD water while I'm at work and it's then piss to clean. You can also nuke it in the microwave in a couple of minutes but it's never as good.
Snacking on handfuls of raw almonds is a great option for during the day instead of one of those apples. Much better than fruit as they make you feel fuller due to the protein and (good) fats, and you won't overeat them cos they're not that more-ish whilst still being quite nice.
I'd try and avoid the chips and pasta if I was you - perhaps allow yourself them at weekends only? I think potatoes and brown rice are the best two choices if you can't live without carbs. I also wouldn't cook yourself a separate meal, way too much hassle, but microwaving half a head of broccoli and replacing most of the potatoes on your own plate with that is not a big effort.
Even though I watch what I eat I can't lose weight without the cardio. Running and rowing machine are my current favourites; if I couldn't do those I'd do circuit training/bodypump/spin(bike) classes at the local gym as well as using our cross-trainer in the spare room. As well as using calories it weirdly suppresses appetite!
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Hi Fatneck,
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No mention of muesli? :clown:
Could sort out one aspect of your calorific intake with Get Drunk Not Fat (http://getdrunknotfat.com/) (if you're a heavy drinker) :P
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Too Many Capital Letters There.
Isn't whisky meant to be the healthiest drink in the getting drunk vs Calorie intake stakes?
Now if only there was a new company specialising in the suply of decent single malts......
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I've only had a quick scan through this but I don't think you're eating enough in the morning.
Just to give you an idea, a typical day for me is:
Breakfast: Shredded Wheat, Museli or Porridge & Protein Shake
Mid Morning: Cottage Cheese on Ryvita & Green Tea
Lunch: Soup, Green Tea & Mixed Nuts
Mid Afternoon: Banana, Orange, Mixed Nuts & Green Tea
Dinner: Omelette with salad, Chicken salad, Tuna salad, Jacket Potato with Tuna etc. (Loads of options here if it has to be something not so healthy just don't eat too much of it.)
Before Bed/Evening: Protein Shake (or Milk for slow release protein. You could also have a small bowl of wholegrain cereal although some people say you shouldn't have carbs in the evening I've never found it to be a problem.
This is an average day for me. The weekends are a bit more tricky when not in work. I also up to protein shakes or intake before and after a work out. Make sure you drink plenty of water.
This works for me and according to the body fat machine thingy in work I'm 5% body fat...
I'd definitely go for eating more in the morning though. Keeps the metabolism going throughout the day. Never miss breakfast!
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Also at home I generally train after tea and once the nipper's in bed between 7.30 and 8. Should I then take on some protein to maximise gains? Again, would seem a protein shake the best way forward?
Protein shakes are a must! I found them really handy for hits before and after exercise. I also hit the wall straight from work and train when the little one is in bed and find it convenient.
Edit: I also add a powdered Instant Oats to some of my shakes for some good carbs.
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Really useful stuff here guys thanks. I particluarly value other people's experiences.
Luke, what shakes do you use/where do you get them from?
Probably being a tad lazy here...
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I think Luke's diet is too high in protein: quickly jotting things down suggests it has nearly as much protein as carbohydrates and that's just going to fuck up your liver unnecessarily on it's way to being sugar.
Cut to the chase. You want to lose weight. Examine your diet. Now ditch as much as you can bear. It's got to be a bit annoying, and hurt a little bit. You need to lose quantity, without losing quality if possible, but really - just try to keep the balance right but lose as much as possible.
Missing meals? All for it. http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/26/the-risks-and-rewards-of-skipping-meals/?_r=0 (http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/26/the-risks-and-rewards-of-skipping-meals/?_r=0) - just don't eat like a bastard to make up for it or you'll get diabetes.
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Also,
http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?topic=13161.0 (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php?topic=13161.0)
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Missing meals? All for it. http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/26/the-risks-and-rewards-of-skipping-meals/?_r=0 (http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/26/the-risks-and-rewards-of-skipping-meals/?_r=0) - just don't eat like a bastard to make up for it or you'll get diabetes.
Your link only refers to body 'weight' rather than fat loss. I think there's a significant reason to separate generic weight loss and fat loss for anybody who's interested in a given sport.
Edit: This may or may not be relevant to the OP.
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Following what I have read in articles, books and studies;
As long as you are eating as much as you NEED (and no more), and do the exercise, your body SHOULD adapt to the form it needs to be to do the activity you do lots of. Eat when you are hungry, and eat as much as you need until the next meal.
That is the golden rule as far as I have seen, and it seems to be working for me.
I am losing weight slowly, but the weight loss shows and appears to be sticking.
Improve your diet quality, for you and the family.
Ditch Pizza. Your resting calories in 1 meal, in the forms of a bread base must be a sure fire way to put on some fat.
Also, (I don't think you mentioned it, but) don't drink fizzy drinks, or squash if you can avoid it.
Don't avoid carbs. There is good evidence that shows athletes who consume lots of carbs, have more effective training and see a bigger improvement. If you ditch the greatest proportional energy source in your diet, you may not be able to train as effectively. Protein is dead important, but there is a limit to h
Eat balanced meals, in both caloric content and size. Oats, musely and that lark is wicked.
Just eating a banana won't do, as your body gets used to having little in the morning and may store more fat from dinner, to compensate for the lack of morning sustenance to get you through to lunch.
There is research that suggests regularity of meals has no effect on weight gain/loss, but i don't buy it for a second.
The bottom line is that you have to consume less calories then you burn, to lose weight. However, if the calories you put in are no good, don't expect good results. This also goes for improving your body composition, quality of muscle etc.
Not a pro, but its what I have seen work, and seems to be working for me.
1. Stop eating crap, specially pizza and fizzy drinks.
2. Eat what you need, when you need it, figure out when/how much by experience.
3. Eat cabs, specifically eat whole grain carbs - Pearl Barley is a classic example
4. Do the work.
5. Stick at it.
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There is research that suggests regularity of meals has no effect on weight gain/loss, but i don't buy it for a second.
Because anecdotal evidence is better, right?
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Missing meals? All for it. http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/26/the-risks-and-rewards-of-skipping-meals/?_r=0 (http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/26/the-risks-and-rewards-of-skipping-meals/?_r=0) - just don't eat like a bastard to make up for it or you'll get diabetes.
Your link only refers to body 'weight' rather than fat loss. I think there's a significant reason to separate generic weight loss and fat loss for anybody who's interested in a given sport.
Edit: This may or may not be relevant to the OP.
The link was mostly about the fallacy of not missing meals. I couldn't be bothered to really get into the argument about unbalanced meals to lose body fat as if the body can't synthesize it from everything else.
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I think Luke's diet is too high in protein: quickly jotting things down suggests it has nearly as much protein as carbohydrates and that's just going to fuck up your liver unnecessarily on it's way to being sugar.
I've never read anything about taking on too much protien being a problem?
I've been eating the same way for the last 4 years and I haven't had any problems, I'm lean and happy with the results i've had.
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On the climbing thing, losing weight isn't going to increase your grades on its own. climbing/training more will benifit more than weight loss.
I used to climb 7c ish when I weighed around 85-90kg. Now I weight 95kg's and have just started to climb in the 7's again due to illness and injury (done quite a lot inside but not climbed outside much)
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I would suggest that missing meals provides a similar problem to eating lots of sugary carbs.
Careful eaters can probably do either of these things and still only eat the required amount of calories in a day. However, for many people trying to manage their weight, they are in the situation due to eating by instinct. So if they feel hungry, then they will eat more.
Sugary carbs, don't fill you up, so you stuff more food in that isn't required.
Fasting and therefore feeling ravenous at the next meal, can mean that you still feel hungry after your meal and so you go looking for more. Even though, if you waited a while longer, your body should catch up and realise that you aren't hungry anymore.
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Small bowl of muesli with yoghurt (not low fat) is the best breakfast I know of for keeping you full without having to consume too many calories. (or porridge if you like that manky greul...)
I don't think there is a magic bullet and everyone reacts differently. I'm now partially vegetarian because I do all the cooking, my lass is a veggie and I can't be bothered to make 2 meals. This probably won't help you.
Anyway, what I have found is that the only way of having a sustainably lower calorie diet is by making it appealing. I know some people can shove protein shakes down their throats 3 times a day but I find them rank, so can't do it. I'm also a bit lactose intolerant so milk based shakes are a bit of a no-no anyway.
Our diet is relatively high in fat (plenty cheese, eggs, olive oil on salads etc.) but we eat a lot of vegetables. I mean, A LOT. so it always feels like you're stuffing your face.
If you're going to be sticking to the meats, just cut down the volume of the meal in general. Be strict with portions when preparing the meal and you will be less tempted to "have another spoonful". It'll take a while for you to adjust to the new volume of food. Make sure the space in your plate is filled with green beans, carrots, etc.
Pizza is fairly bad (simple carbs from the bread, not much veg, usually lots of cheap processed cheese) but if you only have say 1/3 and have it with salad it's not so bad.
When I say salad, don't think I mean a bit of lettuce and tomato - most of our salads involve no lettuce, but have potatoes, lentils, beans, eggs, spinach etc. etc. I like nice food so I put in a fair bit of effort to make sure it's tasty and has enough protein.
Basically, try not to think of it as a "diet" but a subtle modification of the way you view food in general. Good luck!
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Some simple stuff:
- If it wasn't food 100 years ago don't eat it.
- If it didn't have a face or grow in the ground don't eat it.
- Don't buy anything frozen in a box or a bag
- Get a third of your calories from fat, protein and carbs respectively.
- Drink a lot less or not at all.
- Reduce your portion sizes and don't eat until full
- lift something heavy a couple of times a week as well as the aerobic stuff
It'll drop off....
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Your Facebook photo certainly proved it works for you FD........ ;)
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Some simple stuff:
- Don't buy anything frozen in a box or a bag
:-\ Can you be more specific? We eat frozen peas and spinach quite a lot as it's cheaper, more convenient, and I thought reasonably nutritious...
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Your Facebook photo certainly proved it works for you FD........ ;)
I didn't say I was following it.. ;D Trust me it does work though for us not blessed with a skinny frame. Mines starting today....
Fultonious, frozen veg is great. I meant any ready meals or pizzas, lasagnes, nuggets, fishy fillets etc.
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So I've always been known for being an underachieving fat nature helm and every year I work hard at losing weight before Font and put it all back on over the course of a summer's fishing!
so stop messing about sitting on a box wrestling a pole all day, get yerself some Carp gear and do star jumps and pressups til you hear the buzzer sound. Simple innit :fishing:
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Not a big dieter but did start to watch my weight last year when i got properly back into my climbing and shed 9 lbs by just eating less and starting biking (pretty much the first aerobic exercise i have done since school). Its pretty simple just consume less calories than you use, ideally from healthy stuff but the calories are the important bit.
First thing i did was record what i ate on an app, (i used myfitnesspal) bit of a pain recording it but not too bad. It scares the shit out of you when you see how much you eat. All the little bits add up to a lot, Latte here, flapjack there, quick pint after the wall, glass of wine before bed.
Makes eating a bit of a guilty pleasure but i fond this went away after my second pint, allowing for the Kebab to be eaten guilt free after the pub.
The app also showed up that, despite eating relatively well, i had some massive vitamin gaps. I have therefore asked the broadfield to rectify this in there "wellman" pie.
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Some good stuff here already, some of which I haven't read thoroughly so apols for repeats. Loosing weight is not rocket science, burn more cals than your consuming and you'll lose weight, I know it's made a little bit more complex by your metabolism and some of us are lucky enough to have reasonably high RMR's (resting metabolic rates) so burn off more cals whilst sitting still. So the first thing to do is exercise more and you sound like you are doing this.
The whole missing meals thing is a bit of a red herring, the theory is you starve yourself and your body goes into 'famine' mode and starts storing fat for energy. Where this is a big deal is with pregnant women starving themselves, the baby is much likely to become obese as it thinks it's being born into a famine. Sorry but it's a bit late if this has already happened to you. I think the bigger risk of skipping meals as an adult is you are much more likely to snack on shite.
I don't eat too much crap but do like my food. Last year I wanted to drop a few kgs so cut out crisps, most cakes etc, big sarnies for weekday lunches. I just had a can of soup for lunch, maybe a roll and that was enough to slowly drop a bit over a couple of months.
People seem to be down on bananas and other fruit, personally I think you'd be sick before you ate too much fruit. Yes they contain some natural sugar but it's a world apart from the processed shit in biscuits, coke etc. How many obese monkeys or fruit bats do you see? ;) If you want a snack between meals fruit is probably the best thing you can have.
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Questions -
1. Am I eating too much/not enough fruit - aware that there is a lot of sugar etc.
2. Should I bite the bullet and cook one meal for me and one for the rest of the family?
3. Will the feeling of being hungry all the time fade?
Many thanks!
1) Variety is important, as is enjoying food. If you want a bit more fruit, then eat more fruit. If you're happy with your current, then great.
2) No
3) Maybe, and this is one of the hardest ones to deal with.
From about 1999-2009 I fluctuated from about 85-90kgs every year. from 2005-2009 I got into major endurance stuff including marathons, 200mi bike races, and an ironman. Even with doing 20+ hrs a week of cardio my weight was still around 83-85kgs when I did the ironman. Over the last 4 years, I've managed to slowly drop my weight to around 76-80kgs. My goal is to get it down to 72-76kgs in the next 4 years. You can diet and drop the weight, but your body will want it back, and as soon as you relax it comes right back. People talk about the need for lifestyle changes to really keep the weight off.
Not picking on you GME, but in my opinion and experience Its pretty simple just consume less calories than you use, ideally from healthy stuff but the calories are the important bit.
is mostly a load of crap when it comes to application. While it is true in fact, the problem with it is that what you eat/when you eat/exercise/sleep/stress/etc affect how many calories you use. So if you have a perfectly steady life then great, I'd guess you don't as most of us don't.
The question is how bad do you want to lose the weight? Slow and steady is really the right way, but you have to really take the long view.
To also give credit to GME, First thing i did was record what i ate on an app, (i used myfitnesspal) bit of a pain recording it but not too bad. It scares the shit out of you when you see how much you eat. All the little bits add up to a lot, Latte here, flapjack there, quick pint after the wall, glass of wine before bed.
Makes eating a bit of a guilty pleasure but i fond this went away after my second pint, allowing for the Kebab to be eaten guilt free after the pub.
The app also showed up that, despite eating relatively well, i had some massive vitamin gaps. I have therefore asked the broadfield to rectify this in there "wellman" pie.
is perhaps the best bit of advice on the whole thread as well.
Back to the 3rd question you asked above. At first I was hungry all the time as my body adapted to not eating all the time, but that went away after a few weeks of consistency. The key is not to binge and to sleep well. There are days when I'm hungry no matter what, and 9 out of 10 times now its related to my sleep and stress patterns.
Good Luck!
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If it wasn't food 100 years ago don't eat it.
I apply a similar approach to choosing trad routes.
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Got home and checked my FACTS with Mrs Obi who knows her sh1t when it's comes to this (it's her job)..many interesting things, I might ask her to do a summary on it. Meanwhile some of the stuff I remember...
- Always eat breakfast when you wake up, it's what kickstarts your metabolism into 'awake' mode. Without it you'll be in 'asleep' mode, ie. burning fuck all cals til lunch
- Ignore what I said previously, your metabolism is constantly changing, so if you fast for as little as 4hrs it will kick into famine mode and start storing energy so DON'T SKIP MEALS!
- Porridge is about the best breakfast you can have. You need low glycemic food to slowly release energy. Protein is also good for this (as someone above mentioned)
- Most faddy diets do worse than fuck all, some can be highly damaging. Things like the 5:2 diet sucks donkeys (not her words)
- Banana FACT: As they ripen their sugar content massively increases, so stick to fresh ones! They are HIGHLY good for you.
- Significant weight lose or gain within the first few days of a diet/binge is invariably water storage/dissipation.
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protein shakes give a really good satiety: calorie ratio.
You probably don't need more protein, but you probably like feeling full on 200ish calories. As evening snack works well.
Buy Racing Weight QS (http://www.davemacleod.com/shop/racingweightquickstartguide.html)
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Really useful stuff here guys thanks. I particluarly value other people's experiences.
Luke, what shakes do you use/where do you get them from?
Probably being a tad lazy here...
I've sent you a PM with all the details bud.
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Bit off topic but what weight would you say for a 6ft 2 fella? think I am 11half-12 stone
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I would say "you scrawny bastard" :)
I'm the same height and currently 14 st.
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- lift something heavy a couple of times a week
Does lifting my ass of the couch to go get another beer count? :)
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Small bowl of muesli with yoghurt (not low fat)
Why not low fat yoghurt?
Its what I try and have with muesli most days.
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I'l late to this thread - and skimmed it - so forgive me if this has already been said.. or is not relevant etc.. My tips - which I'm not following at the moment :/ but probably will!
Reduce portions - we get used to 'eating until we are full' - well you don't have to. Put 75% of what you'd normally have on a plate and finish that off instead of eating until you are about to burst..
RE family meals - I understand you're making a meal for everyone - but you could always whop a veg-burger under the grill for yourself instead of a slice of pie (for example)?
Booze.. one pint = 300 calories - ie the amount you're trying to shave off your daily total....
Calorie tracker apps/programs. I had one of these on my ifern a few years ago - and you enter in your meal every mealtime and it tracks how many calories you've eaten - and also sutracts those burnt during exercise... seemed to work for me.. I went for 2-2.2K calories a day intake and lost weight over a 6 week period (then all was good so I stopped). At the least it gives you an idea of how much you're intaking each time...
Buy a leather jacket and move to London (thats for FD ;) )
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Small bowl of muesli with yoghurt (not low fat)
Why not low fat yoghurt?
Its what I try and have with muesli most days.
In most instances Low Fat = High Sugar. Modern thinking points towards sugar actually being worse for weight gain than fat. Your body needs fat it doesn't need sugar. [caution probable over simplification]
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Loads of good stuff here chaps, many thanks and keep it coming!
Just for added info, I'm training 3 x a week (fingerboard - CWP hangs, press ups, pull ups, core etc) and climbing indoors 3 x a week at the moment but no cardio (I hate it but appreciate I might have to start doing some).
I'm also off all alcohol (apart from my birthday at the end of Jan when I will be partaking in a particularly fine bottle of vin rouge I've got saved...), we really only eat pizza every couple of weeks and yes, I will be abstaining from that particular meal.
FWIW I'm now below 90kg so heading in the right direction! Will keep updating the weight as a nice excercise in catharsis...
Really appreciate all the input guys, thanks :bow:
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I lost 8kg back in the early 2000s. What I found really motivating was keeping excel sheets of my weight loss. This was back pre-app days. Just seeing the graph heading downwards was enough to keep up the suffering!
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I lost 8kg back in the early 2000s. What I found really motivating was keeping excel sheets of my weight loss. This was back pre-app days. Just seeing the graph heading downwards was enough to keep up the suffering!
Simple Weight Recorder (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=jp.cbrains&hl=en_GB)
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In most instances Low Fat = High Sugar. Modern thinking points towards sugar actually being worse for weight gain than fat. Your body needs fat it doesn't need sugar. [caution probable over simplification]
From NHS eat smart website:
Nutrition labels often tell you how much sugar a food contains. You can compare labels and choose foods that are lower in sugar.
Look for the "Carbohydrates (of which sugars)" figure in the nutrition label.
high over 22.5g of total sugars per 100g
low 5g of total sugars or less per 100g
If the amount of sugars per 100g is between these figures, then that is a medium level of sugars.
The sugars figure in the nutrition label is the total amount of sugars in the food. It includes sugars from fruit and milk, as well as the sugars that have been added.
The total Yoghurt has 4g per 100g of sugar so I guess its not too bad.
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Eat wholesome unprocessed food.
Take Niagen.
Take high strength EPA/DHA.
Regular moderate exercise.
#2cents
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Wife was avidly watching Food Unwrapped - Diet Special (http://www.channel4.com/programmes/food-unwrapped/4od#3629337) last night.
No real revelations in the bits I caught whilst in the room.
The marketing guy should shoot himself :wank:
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The total Yogurt has 4g per 100g of sugar so I guess its not too bad.
Is that the Total Zero %?? Expensive but very nice, low calorie and high in dairy protein too - presumably this would fit the bill for breakfast protein for helping preventing the 'emptiness' feeling returning? I ask as I have just been on the bathroom scales post-Xmas and it appears some dieting is in order as I couldn't see the scales for belly... :'(
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Good topic and useful information. I was going to start one myself asking about general dietary principles, and I like that a lot of the replies have made sense in that way rather than tedious and inapplicable specifics.
I probably have some more questions later, but for now:
Is Chris's "carbs before, protein after" suggestion wrt exercise/training correct? Further, what sort of timescale is best for before/after training food?
What are the best times for breakfast / dinner? I generally find it hard to eat in the mornings, sometimes eat late at night but try to avoid it.
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http://kfor.com/2014/01/06/science-teacher-loses-almost-40-pounds-on-mcdonalds-diet/
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Is Chris's "carbs before, protein after" suggestion wrt exercise/training correct? Further, what sort of timescale is best for before/after training food?
When I was training for a 70 mile ultra 18 months ago, my post training 'schedule' was eat/drink protein within 30 min and get a decent meal with carbs down me within the hour. The protein being needed whilst the body was raging for materials to repair muscle etc and the meal to replace energy stores. I've always struggled with injury but having protein after exercise has helped change that scenario massively for me.
Carbs before is often said - I find I can train happily whilst empty but only at a low level of intensity. High intensity and I need carbs in me.
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Is that the Total Zero %?? Expensive but very nice, low calorie and high in dairy protein too - presumably this would fit the bill for breakfast protein for helping preventing the 'emptiness' feeling returning? I ask as I have just been on the bathroom scales post-Xmas and it appears some dieting is in order as I couldn't see the scales for belly... :'(
Yes its total zero 0% Greek yoghurt. I tend to have mine at 8am with a respectable handful of muesli. I don't start feeling hungry till 12-12:30.
Now I've started back climbing I have started trying to structure my diet around climbing and active rest days. I try to have things like sushi/ quinoa salads and fruit at lunch, then in the evening I have a fish/chicken meal with veg, and a small portion of rice/pasta/sweet potato and squash mash
I don't know if anyone else has tried forgoing carbs with an evening meal? Its hard as I start craving more food and start eating loads more.
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Skimmed through the thread but haven't seen any specific mention of Glycemic Index (though principles are referred to, ie porridge better than bananas).
As I understand it refined carbs, such as white bread or pasta are as bad as sugary food, since they're absorbed so quickly they cause a spike in blood sugar, and you feel ravenous again sooner. They have a high 'glycemic index' (GI).
Going back to the original post, if you could sneak some wholemeal pasta into your spag bol, that'd keep you going longer.
I understand that the one time you do need high GI carbs are in the hour after training, when your uptake rate is greater. This allows you to recover faster and train again sooner.
(I should add that I'm a punter with no professional knowledge in this area)
The myfitnesspal app is a good suggestion. Gave this a whirl back when I was syked and went from 66 to 63kg over 3 months, with consequent increase in performance on certain types climb.
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Surely all you need is rice & fish-cakes :clown:
Fish and Rice Cakes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYHAR8Xzsyo#)
Rice and Fish Cakes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlll4jGznYI#ws)
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http://kfor.com/2014/01/06/science-teacher-loses-almost-40-pounds-on-mcdonalds-diet/ (http://kfor.com/2014/01/06/science-teacher-loses-almost-40-pounds-on-mcdonalds-diet/)
I just don't believe that, where's the Day-Glo camouflage clothes and shit techno sound track
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I don't know if anyone else has tried forgoing carbs with an evening meal? Its hard as I start craving more food and start eating loads more.
I gave up carbohydrates for 2 days once when the missus was on some fad diet or other. I had meat and salad for lunch and evening meals both days. I swear it was worse than giving up smoking. My body absolutely craved something. The third day I just had to eat a kebab, I instantly felt better.
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Small bowl of muesli with yoghurt (not low fat)
Why not low fat yoghurt?
Its what I try and have with muesli most days.
Because it's full of shit! Glucose-fructose syrup, sweeteners etc. etc. I use a standard tub of yoghurt in my cereal and it has a whopping 4 grams of fat...
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Small bowl of muesli with yoghurt (not low fat)
Why not low fat yoghurt?
Its what I try and have with muesli most days.
Been a while since I've looked at it, but I recall some studies showing some fat goes along way towards feelings of saity. From a health perspective, fats shouldn't really be something to be worried about as long as they are the more naturally occuring types. In other words certain foods are naturally fatty - fish, avacado's, milk, yoghurt, etc. Other are not - domestically produced meats, fried foods, etc. Avoid the latter. The former are actually quite good for you in reasonable amounts.
I find my preference when it comes to yoghurt is real full fat greek yoghurt with a touch of honey (added by me) along with blueberries and an unsweetened muesli. Will keep me fuller than a 3 egg omelet and toast.
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Small bowl of muesli with yoghurt (not low fat)
Why not low fat yoghurt?
Its what I try and have with muesli most days.
Because it's full of shit! Glucose-fructose syrup, sweeteners etc. etc. I use a standard tub of yoghurt in my cereal and it has a whopping 4 grams of fat...
Sorry, just read the remainder of the thread and realised you're on the better 0% yoghurt. Some of them are terrible!
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From a health perspective, fats shouldn't really be something to be worried about as long as they are the more naturally occuring types. In other words certain foods are naturally fatty - fish, avacado's, milk, yoghurt, etc. Other are not - domestically produced meats, fried foods, etc. Avoid the latter. The former are actually quite good for you in reasonable amounts.
Aren't these unsaturated (healthy) and saturated (unhealthy) fats? Or is that something else?
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I don't recall what types of fats, just that the naturally occuring were reasonable in their natural doses. I.e. eating a dozen avacados might be a bit much, but 1 was fine.
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Saturated, polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats are good for you in a 30/30/40 (fat-protein-carb) diet of natural, unprocessed food. Ideally you don't want too much of any one fat type. Lots of research suggests the ratio of omega 6 to omega 3 fatty acids (found in poly and mono unsaturated fats) is too high in most western diets and may exacerbate inflammatory issues.
Avoid trans fat (aka hydrogenated vegetable oil) like the plague. An evil creation which is seriously damaging to you. Found in processed meals, baked goods, biscuits etc. Banned in some US states and Denmark, Iceland, Sweden, Switzerland. But not the UK, although the permitted levels are low. 0.1g is still too much.
I eat loads of fat - my breakfast fave is pancakes made with eggs, banana and almond butter, fried in butter. Lots of oily fish, avocados. lots of olive oil, nuts, butter. I try to stick to lean meat - venison and game rather than processed red meat. Basically a slack paleo diet. Too much sugar is the biggest 'bad thing' for most active people.
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Some simple stuff:
- If it wasn't food 100 years ago don't eat it.
- If it didn't have a face or grow in the ground don't eat it.
- Don't buy anything frozen in a box or a bag
- Get a third of your calories from fat, protein and carbs respectively.
- Drink a lot less or not at all.
- Reduce your portion sizes and don't eat until full
- lift something heavy a couple of times a week as well as the aerobic stuff
It'll drop off....
I second this, especially regarding the lifting something heavy.
Big compound excercises (squat, deadlift, snatch pulls, military press) induce a very high response from the organism in terms of testosterone production, muscle mass, etc. Putting on lean muscle will raise your metabolism (muscles burn calories, fat doesn't) and will make your weight more stable after the "diet". Dropping the calories intake too much, on the other hand, lowers the metabolism, burns down muscles and packs fat. You'll lose weight but you'll be weak, look weak and feel weak. Moreover, every calorie you'll get, later, will be stored into fat more easily.
Also, trying do consume most of your carbs in the "peri-workout time" is another good idea. Fuel the session before, restore muscle glycogen after.
I highly advice a good amount of lean proteins (white meat, fish, etc. as usual) and also some supplements could be of use, like aminoacids, to avoid the risk of losing lean muscle due to the diet.
I am no expert, but I found this works.
Lots of it can be found on http://www.t-nation.com/ (http://www.t-nation.com/), that, despite being a meatheads' site, has loads of good info about dieting and training.
I hope this helps, if I've written something incorrect please someone point it out because it's helpful.
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I think Luke's diet is too high in protein: quickly jotting things down suggests it has nearly as much protein as carbohydrates and that's just going to fuck up your liver unnecessarily on it's way to being sugar.
I've never read anything about taking on too much protein being a problem?
I've been eating the same way for the last 4 years and I haven't had any problems, I'm lean and happy with the results I've had.
Can anyone elaborate on this? I'm intrigued...
Cheers
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I've read about this in the past (sorry don't have time to hunt for links now), pretty sure it was all debunked and is thus nothing to worry about. However, a friend was consuming large (too much) amounts of protein and we were fairly certain that he was just p*ssing it away (quite literally). That's worth thinking about.
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I've read about this in the past (sorry don't have time to hunt for links now), pretty sure it was all debunked and is thus nothing to worry about. However, a friend was consuming large (too much) amounts of protein and we were fairly certain that he was just p*ssing it away (quite literally). That's worth thinking about.
Cheers Paul, yeah, I was of the opinion taking to much would just be pointless rather than harmful. Something to think about though.
To everyone: In thinking I take on too much protein, is this in relation to a protein/carbs ratio or just in general?
Lots of it can be found on http://www.t-nation.com/ (http://www.t-nation.com/), that, despite being a meatheads' site, has loads of good info about dieting and training.
I hope this helps, if I've written something incorrect please someone point it out because it's helpful.
+1 on big compound exercises. T-Nation is a great website, i've learn't a lot from it.
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I think Luke's diet is too high in protein: quickly jotting things down suggests it has nearly as much protein as carbohydrates and that's just going to fuck up your liver unnecessarily on it's way to being sugar.
I've never read anything about taking on too much protein being a problem?
I've been eating the same way for the last 4 years and I haven't had any problems, I'm lean and happy with the results I've had.
Can anyone elaborate on this? I'm intrigued...
Cheers
I was being flippant about the damage. As I understand it, the science about protein consumption is this though:
* Proteins are digested through gastrin etc., and end up in the blood as part of the amino acid pool.
http://pharmaxchange.info/press/2013/07/digestion-of-dietary-proteins-in-the-gastro-intestinal-tract-gi-tract/ (http://pharmaxchange.info/press/2013/07/digestion-of-dietary-proteins-in-the-gastro-intestinal-tract-gi-tract/)
* They then arrive in the liver, where they are metabolised. Essentially the liver changes some amino acids into other ones (turning "essential" amino acids (those you need to eat) into non-essential ones (those the liver can make) by transamination), makes albumin, and...
* those proteins you don't need get broken into two bits: ammonia (nitrates) [these are pissed out] and sugars + lipids for the non-nitrate bits
http://www.vivo.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathphys/digestion/liver/metabolic.html (http://www.vivo.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathphys/digestion/liver/metabolic.html)
* Within your active cells, to make energy, the amino acids are catabolised in small amounts with sugar and water and fat to make ATP as part of the ATP-CP cycle yada yada.
http://antranik.org/the-catabolism-of-fats-and-proteins-for-energy/ (http://antranik.org/the-catabolism-of-fats-and-proteins-for-energy/)
Does excess protein consumption bother your liver? Dunno. Why does excess alcohol consumption damage the liver? Dunno that either - nobody does. I suspect you'd have to chronically eat lots of protein anyway, even if it were possible, so hence it was more a pseudo-ironic musing than anything else.
I must point out though that as far as I know, the idea that excess protein means you just piss it out is a fallacy. (Unlike vitamin C.) Only the waste is pissed out - the body will recover what it can in the form of lipids and sugars and yada and store these around your wasteline but with a bit more liver action than if you just ate fat.
Hence: losing weight is all about calories consumed.
As a corollary, in my opinion, a balanced diet is essential and dicking around with eating less sugar/fat/protein at the expense of the others is not only a waste of time but probably less healthy than keeping some kind of balance.
Luke - my jottings on your diet plan said
1237 calories
138g of carbs
30.4g of fat
100g of protein
The balance looks wrong, and 1200 calories is very small for anyone that's active. However, I obviously could have nobbed it up when looking up all the nutritional things, and guessed at portion sizes wrong. Can you elaborate on the quantities? You're not a secret eater are you?
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This paper here:
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/81/1/69.long (http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/81/1/69.long)
... suggests that maybe you should just eat every other day?
On the BMR/RMR debate (Basal or Resting Metabolic Rate) - the key thing indicating whether your metabolism has slowed down or not - the interesting science appears to be that:
* After an overnight fast, it slows down a smidgeon
* After 1-3 days (http://archive.unu.edu/unupress/food2/UID07E/UID07E11.HTM (http://archive.unu.edu/unupress/food2/UID07E/UID07E11.HTM)) the MR goes UP, although there's some discussion about why: it may be that it appears to go up because after a day, your body starts to eat itself by digesting protein (before that it preferentially uses glycogen etc.) < note the implication here for excess protein when you're eating plenty of carbs = stored as fat not burnt, unless you require it for muscle repair
* After that it goes down, more for fatties, who stop burning protein. An interesting piece in here is that skinny (non-obese) people's bodies will prefer to eat protein whilst fasting for ages, rather than fat. So skinny people trying to lose more weight will eat their muscles before their subcutaneous fat I guess.
I tried to find a study on breakfast and metabolic rate. I found lots of things with interesting curves about metabolic rate showing that the time of day was very important in a circadian rhythm sense. (As an aside, insomniacs show exactly the same curve, but displaced higher i.e. they use more calories all teh time, but it varies with circadian rhythms.)
http://www.researchgate.net/publication/14647455_24-Hour_metabolic_rate_in_insomniacs_and_matched_normal_sleepers/file/9fcfd5012d08007e25.pdf (http://www.researchgate.net/publication/14647455_24-Hour_metabolic_rate_in_insomniacs_and_matched_normal_sleepers/file/9fcfd5012d08007e25.pdf)
Whilst I was looking I did find this:
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/55/3/645.short (http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/55/3/645.short)
Fifty-two moderately obese adult women were stratified according to their baseline breakfast-eating habits and randomly assigned a weight-loss program. The no-breakfast group ate two meals per day and the breakfast group ate three meals per day. The energy content of the two weight-loss programs was identical. After the 12-wk treatment, baseline breakfast eaters lost 8.9 kg in the no-breakfast treatment and 6.2 kg in the breakfast treatment. Baseline breakfast skippers lost 7.7 kg in the breakfast treatment and 6.0 kg in the no-breakfast treatment. This treatment-by-strata-by-time interaction effect (P less than 0.06) suggests that those who had to make the most substantial changes in eating habits to comply with the program achieved better results. Analyses of behavioral data suggested that eating breakfast helped reduce dietary fat and minimize impulsive snacking and therefore may be an important part of a weight-reduction program.
So... I think it says that:
* If you are fat and eat breakfast normally, starting to skip it will mean you lose more weight than if you don't;
* If you're a fatty and you routinely skip breakfast, and then start to eat it, you will lose more weight than if you continue to skip it [as part of a calorie controlled diet]
* If you eat breakfast you're less likely to snack if you're a fatty.
So fatties, stop eating breakfast and get some fucking willpower. (Joke.)
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What I think all that is saying is essentially nothing.
Honestly, its not difficult to figure out a moderate, varied and nutritious diet which will take you to an appropriate weight.
You don't need p less than 0.06 to work it out, just a bit of common sense.
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Be a bit careful with the sushi. Usually there is plenty of sugar in the rice along with vinegar. May not taste sweet but your body notices it anyway and craves more.
//Tresor
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Lund what do you think about the bodybuilding advice on protein intake that ranges from 1g per kg of bodyweight to 2.8g per kg!
From my broscience level understanding when trying to gain muscle and loose fat it's important to keep protein intake high to prevent you body from burning muscle for fuel instead of fat.
This is based on the idea that your body will only use your muscles for fuel if:
1) It believes it is in a state of famine - e.g. you are starving yourself.
2) You have insufficient essential amino acids in your diet.
It's because of this 'bro' science that I eat a similar amount of protein as Luke does around 100g.
Is this a load of :shit:
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Lund what do you think about the bodybuilding advice on protein intake that ranges from 1g per kg of bodyweight to 2.8g per kg!
From my broscience level understanding when trying to gain muscle and loose fat it's important to keep protein intake high to prevent you body from burning muscle for fuel instead of fat.
This is based on the idea that your body will only use your muscles for fuel if:
1) It believes it is in a state of famine - e.g. you are starving yourself.
2) You have insufficient essential amino acids in your diet.
It's because of this 'bro' science that I eat a similar amount of protein as Luke does around 100g.
Is this a load of :shit:
I think you've misunderstood. As far as I know anyway.
You will naturally use protein as an energy source, whatever. So you need some for energy. If you go into famine mode, then you will try to get more from protein. When your body starts to eat itself, I dunno.
However, you're not starving; you're dieting; there's a difference I think. And you have some protein intake to offset it anyway.
The body building thing is different. Body builders are trying to build muscle - to GAIN weight, to damage muscles, and have them replaced by fatter fibres with more protein in so they look more hench.
If you're a climber, you're probably not trying to bulk up (if you are, then you do need a load of protein). So you do low reps, high weight, and try to recruit the muscles you have now better. If this is the case... you don't need so much protein, as you're not repairing as much muscle... (some yes, a totally no protein diet would be an equally bad idea, and some recovery protein is a decent idea perhaps - as part of a balanced post exercise meal).
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What an utterly terrifying thread this is. I don't eat half as well as most of you seem to and I'm sure that I'm a ticking time bomb of fatness.
Currently tip the scales at about 63Kg and am 5'11". Think I will do that diet tracker app thing to find out what's what.
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It's nothing to do with height and weight. All you need to do is look in the mirror, flex your gut muscles and see how much you can fat you pinch, if it's a fistful or more, then start to worry about apps and shit. Your metabolism will slow as you get older but until then eat what you enjoy, just be aware and keep an eye on it, you'll have plenty of time to get fat when you are older.
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You know what this thread needs? Stevie Haston. Come back stevie, we need you!
Today the first day of this New Year I did an 8a! Today I weigh 76 kg that's at least 10 kgs overwieght! An 8a with a 10kg weight belt is very good, so the start of the year will be easy.
(From the haston blog: http://steviehaston.blogspot.co.uk/ (http://steviehaston.blogspot.co.uk/))
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With the usual disclaimer that Fatneck isn't a professional climber who can devote every day of his life to training and dieting and climbing...
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Here is my current diet plan, please let me know what changes you might suggest and/or alternatives to what I am doing...
Breakfast - 1 banana
Lunch - Large box of salad containing variously - 1 carrot, some onion, a tin of tuna/sardines, some sweetcorn, raw mushrooms (4) half a bag of pre-packed salad leaves, some diet salad dressing.
Tea - assorted meals with the rest of the family with a focus on reduced portion size and increased amount of veg (green beans, carrots, broccoli, peas) - typically from the following list of acceptable meals;
- Toad in the hole
- Spag Bol
- Pasta with various meats/fish, cheese, pesto etc
- Chicken in bacon type affairs
- Pizza/chips/chicken nuggets etc
- Potatoes
Snacks - I will typically eat 2 apples and 2 tangerines through the day.
I have cut out all the crisps, nuts, beer etc. Never been a big fan of chocolate/sweets...
Right not sure you have done the calculations, but the food plan you have currently suggested would indicate that you are consuming around 1200-1300 calories a day:
Banana: 90
Salad (tuna): 300-350
Apples X2: 100 (so would argue this a calorie neutral)
Tangerine x 2: 80
Spag Bol: 600 (assuming its a relative size)
I would imagine thats no the best way forward.
I went on one of those lose weight calculator website things, I made some assumptions anyway whether they are correct or not kind of give you an indication of what you need to loose.
Male
40 years old
Weekly exercise level: Light
Height: 180cm
Current weight: 90kg
Goal weight: 85kg
Time scale to lose weight: 4 months
On that basis you should be consuming more like 2100 calories a day! There is no point loosing weight super quick unless you want to trim up for a specific trip or problem, otherwise you body won't be used to and it will just default back to eating like a small cow and thus you will put the weight back on.
I would be losing weight over a long time frame, then you can make some life style changes and fully adapt to eating less, I would also suggest doing some running (go for 4 runs and I bet you will start enjoying it, especially if you use strava and can see progress).
Something to think about.
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You know what this thread needs? Stevie Haston. Come back stevie, we need you!
Today the first day of this New Year I did an 8a! Today I weigh 76 kg that's at least 10 kgs overwieght! An 8a with a 10kg weight belt is very good, so the start of the year will be easy.
(From the haston blog: http://steviehaston.blogspot.co.uk/ (http://steviehaston.blogspot.co.uk/))
Fantastic - I started the year at exactly the same weight (I consider it 4-6kg overwieight, hmmm). I'll see if I can track him (weight, not grades). I've had some success so far with the faddish 5:2 diet (4:3 in fact): I eat and drink as normal or to slight excess on climbing / climbing training days, semi-starve on running days - 500 calories plus calories equivalent to those I estimate burned off by the run. My problem in the past with diets has been that I find it hard to combine dieting and training. I'm hoping that this will be the magic solution (unlikely of course).
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Luke - my jottings on your diet plan said
1237 calories
138g of carbs
30.4g of fat
100g of protein
The balance looks wrong, and 1200 calories is very small for anyone that's active. However, I obviously could have nobbed it up when looking up all the nutritional things, and guessed at portion sizes wrong. Can you elaborate on the quantities? You're not a secret eater are you?
It's not really a diet plan as such, it's just how I've been eating for the past 4 years. I like it, it's not a struggle anymore. It was a little tricky to adapt in the beginning...
It started when I was 21, at the time I was 85kg and completely inactive. I started eating healthily like I mentioned previously and did a lot of slow running and weights (I hadn't started climbing at the time) in 2-3 months I lost 15kg.
Right now 4 years on I don't do any running, every bit of exercise I do has climbing in mind. Today I'm 67kg and ~5% body fat (I'm 5ft 10), I feel extremely healthy in comparison to my previous state. My weight only ever fluctuates by a couple of pounds.
I'm not mentioning the above stats to brag in anyway, just to show it really isn't that hard to lose weight and I lost it fast. It's basically just eat less/healthier and move more...
The only concern I have right now is as you say I take on too little calories, but the protein shakes with instant oats added definitely help with upping the calories. My portion sizes are large when I comes to salad and veg.
Secret eater? Hell no!... I don't like sweets, chocolate etc.
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If those calories are right you will still be losing weight, given 1500 and a sedatenary life style will result in weight loss.
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it really isn't that hard to lose weight and I lost it fast.
So you are in mid 20s now?
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When I was using the calorie counter app thingy to reduce weight, I set my daily limit/aim at 2000 calories.. any lower and I think I'd have started eating my own body parts.
2 for 1 on gastric bands?
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I'm not mentioning the above stats to brag in anyway, just to show it really isn't that hard to lose weight and I lost it fast. It's basically just eat less/healthier and move more...
Be careful generalizing that for everyone. As mentioned before, you're healthy and in your 20's.... Someone in their 30-40's who has been carrying extra weight for a long period of time will not find it easy to drop that weight.
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There's been alot of talk about calories, but very little about sleep and stress and the impact those have on weight loss. You can be on a restricted calorie diet, but if you are stressed due to family or work, or getting too little sleep(even if you think you're not) and you still won't lose weight.
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On the subject of calorie counters, how do you calculate an hourly average calorie burn off for bouldering? I'm going with approx 1h of climbing for 3h at a wall (-834). This means at my allowed calorie intake (1850) per day I have to almost force down an extra half bottle of wine a day just to not waste away.
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2 for 1 on gastric bands?
I'll go halfs and take the second one??
Will you are a disgrace, skinny and lanky fucks should be banned from this thread unless offering scientific advice.
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I'm skinny, lanky and a scientist. I advise pies and beer :)
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This blew my mind recently: http://www.vice.com/read/this-guy-has-eaten-nothing-but-raw-meat-for-five-years (http://www.vice.com/read/this-guy-has-eaten-nothing-but-raw-meat-for-five-years)
Getting increasingly more ridiculous and making me wonder if Vice is just making this shit up there's also these:
http://www.vice.com/read/rob-rhinehart-no-longer-requires-food (http://www.vice.com/read/rob-rhinehart-no-longer-requires-food)
http://www.vice.com/read/the-woman-living-off-water-tea-and-light-for-100-days (http://www.vice.com/read/the-woman-living-off-water-tea-and-light-for-100-days)
It's worth mentioning food intolerances I think. For reasons that still aren't understood a massive chunk of the population now has them. There could be one thing that you eat that is actually really bad for you, and it could be something you always thought of as healthy, something that everyone else will tell you is healthy, and it may well be healthy for everyone but you. If everyone's saying you're not eating enough calories but you're still fat then what you're eating rather than how much is probably more likely to be the issue. Wheat is a very common one, cutting it out for a while and observing the results would be one option. Rice and oats are good alternative carb sources.
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Buy a leather jacket and move to London (thats for FD ;) )
Fuck me I'm getting some stick on this thread. If you want to lose weight then don't do the following.
- split up from your wife of fifteen years at 42 years old
- spend six months sleeping on mates floors or temporary flats
- go on a course of SSRI anti-depressants (they sap your energy and fuck your metabolism)
- go through a divorce losing house and everything else in the process
- move from a climbing, running cycling area to a big City
All while running a Ģ50 million quid business that requires lots of client dinners and drinks.
I could go on, but I'm amazed I'm only a stone and a bit over. It's coming off though, albeit slower than I hoped.
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I didn't think people were giving you stick?? At any rate, I liked the directness of your general concepts.
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It's just mates ribbing my portlyness :-) and I had a bad day.
The diet stuff is largely lifted from my Gym Jones training. No fatties there.... I should have added, only get your photos taken in black and white, that helps too.
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Sorry FD - I was being a little over-cheeky :/
The corporate wining - dining thing is whats chucked on weight for me in the last 2-3 months... most other things I can control, but when you're breakfast/lunch/dinner for a few days with work/clients its often hard to have a healthy option. When I'm eating in my own environment (home) I can control this - its hard away from home (with the associated social pints etc.. that go with it..)
I remember chatting to our previous VC when he retired - and asked him if there was anything he was glad about leaving - and he replied "buffet lunches" :)
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has there been a decision yet on whether campusing can lead to increased weight loss?
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If you want to lose weight then don't do the following.
- split up from your wife of fifteen years at 42 years old
- spend six months sleeping on mates floors or temporary flats
- go on a course of SSRI anti-depressants (they sap your energy and fuck your metabolism)
- go through a divorce losing house and everything else in the process
- move from a climbing, running cycling area to a big City
All while running a Ģ50 million quid business that requires lots of client dinners and drinks.
right, I'm consistently managing to do none of those things
how much weight should I expect to lose in the next 4 or 5 days?
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Four grams.
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There is a quick way to loose half a stone of ugly fat.
Cut your head off.
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If those calories are right you will still be losing weight, given 1500 and a sedatenary life style will result in weight loss.
I've stayed around the same weight for around 12 months now.
So you are in mid 20s now?
Yeah, I'm 25.
Be careful generalizing that for everyone. As mentioned before, you're healthy and in your 20's.... Someone in their 30-40's who has been carrying extra weight for a long period of time will not find it easy to drop that weight.
Yeah, sorry I forget that makes a lot of difference.
If i'm taking on so little calories i'm not sure why i'm not dead yet...
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If i'm taking on so little calories i'm not sure why i'm not dead yet...
If you do actually have a body fat of 5% you may be closer than you think, as the essential fat that protects your organs is from 2-5%. How did you measure it, calipers, underwater weighing?
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Possible link to;
http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,23330.0.html (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,23330.0.html)
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If i'm taking on so little calories i'm not sure why i'm not dead yet...
If you do actually have a body fat of 5% you may be closer than you think, as the essential fat that protects your organs is from 2-5%. How did you measure it, calipers, underwater weighing?
I only use the one in work which you grasp the handles, also use a scale type body fat calculator. Neither are accurate I know but it give's me a rough idea.
This is grim and I am actually worried now...!
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Just quickly, i've started using one of those Diet Tracking app things, oddly climbing/bouldering isn't listed in the Exercise tabs - but I've literally got no idea how many calories I'd burn in a 2-hour session.
Any ideas how to work this out or ball-park figure?
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I've literally got no idea how many calories I'd burn in a 2-hour session.
Any ideas how to work this out or ball-park figure?
Really hard as the number of movements, muscle mass involved and impact on heart rate across a session will vary enormously.
As a guess (just to get some kind of sane estimation), I would think that an hour of climbing is probably on the low side of an hour of easy weights in terms of calorie consumption, which online estimation thingies put at about 250 calories. This ties in with my (completely impressionistic and unreliable) experience of weightloss/gain while training.
It really won't be much; you have to be working consistently quite hard to get into the 600+ calories p/h bracket.
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I mentioned this back on the last page. I get a figure of 800ish calories burnt for one hour of climbing. I use this figure for a 3-hour session but really this could be a whiole hamburger out.
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I would have thought doing a big volume of stamina plodding would vary greatly from a session trying hard problems?
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Possible link to;
http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,23330.0.html (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,23330.0.html)
That was so obviouse and no one said anything I thought I was the one who knew nothing about these things.
//Tresor
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As a middle-aged man who does a sedentary job, over the last few years I've found a Ketogenic diet (http://www.reddit.com/r/keto/wiki/faq) a very effective way of losing a lot of weight fairly quickly.
I also feel much better day to day with little to no carbs in my system. I don't think it's a good choice over the long term but for shifting weight it's extremely effective.
I only use the one in work which you grasp the handles, also use a scale type body fat calculator. Neither are accurate I know but it give's me a rough idea.
Are any of these scales that measure body fat worth buying or is it just a gimmick? Looking to get some new scales; anybody recommend some?
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What have I started!!! :slap:
In all seriousness, a lot of good stuff...
With the usual disclaimer that Fatneck isn't a professional climber who can devote every day of his life to training and dieting and climbing...
Amen to this. Wife, ex, various kids, fishing, working full time etc etc
Male
40 years old
Weekly exercise level: Light
Height: 180cm
Current weight: 90kg
Goal weight: 85kg
Time scale to lose weight: 4 months
How rude! ;) Actually pretty much spot on although I'm not 38 till the end of the month :)
There is no point loosing weight super quick unless you want to trim up for a specific trip
That is exactly my aim! However, I do want to maintain the weight loss after Font in Feb and hope that all this research and thought going into my diet will help to this end.
I've been thinking a lot about how I was raised and how much that affects my current eating habits/beliefs etc I have a lot of bad habits (bread with every meal for example) that are just a hang over from being raised in a relatively poor family. So a lot of this is habit breaking = good...
There's been a lot of talk about calories, but very little about sleep and stress and the impact those have on weight loss.
Agreed, although I am aware that these have an impact. I sleep very well thankfully, usually 7-8hrs per night with little if no interruption (much to the chagrin of my wife..). I'm generally a laid back person and although work does occasionally cause me to be stressed, climbing/training/fishing/sex all help with this :)
Got myself the Fitness Pal app and according to that I'm taking on approx 1800-1900 a day which is about what I was aiming for. This includes calorie loss relating to excercise performed, which is above average for me at the moment. My salad box is big and reckon it's giving me 400 cal per day. Have started eating porridge for breakfast, ditched the banana but kept up other fruit intake. I am now also filling half my tea time plate with veg. According to the app I'm averaging the following spread of calorific intake;
Carbs - 52%
Fat - 26%
Protein - 22%
This against the app recommendation of;
Carbs - 55%
Fat - 30%
Protein - 15%
Any thoughts on this?
Over all, I'm feeling pretty good and seeing gains in my training almost weekly. Am climbing fairly poorly but expected that with the amount of training and changes in diet etc. Also the hunger thing is much better/easier to deal with...
On the subject of calorie counters, how do you calculate an hourly average calorie burn off for bouldering?
I'd be interested to know this as well as sex, what does that burn?
has there been a decision yet on whether campusing can lead to increased weight loss?
Brilliant!
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As a middle-aged man who does a sedentary job, over the last few years I've found a Ketogenic diet (http://www.reddit.com/r/keto/wiki/faq) a very effective way of losing a lot of weight fairly quickly.
I also feel much better day to day with little to no carbs in my system. I don't think it's a good choice over the long term but for shifting weight it's extremely effective.
I only use the one in work which you grasp the handles, also use a scale type body fat calculator. Neither are accurate I know but it give's me a rough idea.
Are any of these scales that measure body fat worth buying or is it just a gimmick? Looking to get some new scales; anybody recommend some?
I think the consensus is that they are useful for seeing changes over time, but are not good indicators of the actual body fat level. So good for monitoring whether diet and exercise is working but not to compare to others. The Omron scales seem to be recommended the most (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0033AGBVG/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_2?pf_rd_p=103612307&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B001N064JW&pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_r=0X1W6HETHZ8B0GBEAEHY (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0033AGBVG/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_2?pf_rd_p=103612307&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B001N064JW&pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_r=0X1W6HETHZ8B0GBEAEHY)).
Edit: I should add that I haven't used them!
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Are any of these scales that measure body fat worth buying or is it just a gimmick?
Shit in my experience. Things like how hydrated you are are can change the reading a lot.
We bought some and took them back, changed for an older model of these
http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/8334259.htm?CMPID=GS001&_ (http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/8334259.htm?CMPID=GS001&_)$ja=cgid:10847396225|tsid:41370|cid:147345665|lid:48710062385|nw:g|crid:36600229865|rnd:11683713641174560484|dvc:c|adp:1o2
Still going strong after about 7 years use.
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I mentioned this back on the last page. I get a figure of 800ish calories burnt for one hour of climbing. I use this figure for a 3-hour session but really this could be a whiole hamburger out.
Sorry if I missed the earlier reference.
If you use 800 cals for the 3 hour session, that could be in the right area.
800 calories per hour sounds way too much, unless you're talking about lugging a heavy pack while sprinting up mixed and alpine terrain!
I used to do a lot of rowing, which is a sport where there are quite well tested and established ways of measuring output. An hour of unbroken time on a rowing machine would typically be in the 800-1100 calorie zone, but the level of full-body exhaustion would be on a completely different level from what I generate at the wall in any kind of normal session.
It's conceivable that a session of doing back-to-back hard routes, followed by lots of core work with little rest, would get you up into this kind of rate of consumption, but you would look like some kind of demented lunatic.
I work on the general assumption that training for bouldering doesn't do much to directly burn off calories?
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There's also a US Navy thing that works our bodyfat on the net somewhere. I think I mentioned it earlier this year on the UKC fitclub thread when chatting to biscuit. I had my done with calipers, on scales at home and the US thing was right in the ballpark.
Like said above, drink a couple of litres of water and your bodyfat % will come down...
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I think the consensus is that they are useful for seeing changes over time, but are not good indicators of the actual body fat level. So good for monitoring whether diet and exercise is working but not to compare to others. The Omron scales seem to be recommended the most (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0033AGBVG/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_2?pf_rd_p=103612307&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B001N064JW&pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_r=0X1W6HETHZ8B0GBEAEHY (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0033AGBVG/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_2?pf_rd_p=103612307&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B001N064JW&pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_r=0X1W6HETHZ8B0GBEAEHY)).
Edit: I should add that I haven't used them!
Shit in my experience. Things like how hydrated you are are can change the reading a lot.
We bought some and took them back, changed for an older model of these
http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/8334259.htm?CMPID=GS001&_ (http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/8334259.htm?CMPID=GS001&_)$ja=cgid:10847396225|tsid:41370|cid:147345665|lid:48710062385|nw:g|crid:36600229865|rnd:11683713641174560484|dvc:c|adp:1o2
Still going strong after about 7 years use.
Thanks guys, since I need some new ones anyway I might get one of these but treat the fat percentage readings with a large pinch of salt.
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Keep the pinches small, too much salt is bad for you too!
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There is a quick way to loose half a stone of ugly fat.
Cut your head off.
Which one?
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Good article today: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/09/end-excess-sugar-consumption (http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/09/end-excess-sugar-consumption)
The evidence that excess consumption of refined sugars is damaging our health is now as clear as the case against tobacco. Nutritionally bankrupt products loaded with sugars have displaced the whole foods our bodies need. To tackle the preventable diet-related diseases that have reached epidemic proportions around the globe obesity, diabetes, heart disease and cancers we simply need to eat less of them. But the vested economic interests of the food, drink and farming industries are blocking change. They lobby ferociously against attempts to set lower targets for consumption or restrict marketing or recalibrate subsidies. They have captured regulators so successfully that a guerrilla campaign is needed to speak directly to consumers. Leading the charge with Action on Sugar is cardiovascular expert Graham MacGregor, veteran of the successful campaign to force the food industry to reduce blood-pressure inducing levels of salt in its products. The fight against sugar will be much tougher and dirtier.
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There was a good programme on telly last year about diets and it touched on sugar addiction (can't recall name of programme) . Seems the initial culprit was a boom in corn crops in the 50s in the US, where all the surplus was converted to corn syrup and was available dirt cheap, so food manufacturers started adding it to eveything they could to keep costs down, add bulk and get eveyone addicted. Cheers guys.
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And why not? The chief concern of food companies is to make profit, not to give us healthy food to eat - that's a mistake lots of people make when they let themselves be deceived into thinking what they're eating is ok for them, based on what food companies tell them. Like anything in life, if you don't DYOR you can't really complain when you get screwed over. I think a lot of fat people are just victims of not being curious enough about what they're filling their faces with. And a lot of people aren't curious enough because they haven't got the time or money to be.
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And why not? The chief concern of food companies is to make profit, not to give us healthy food to eat - that's a mistake lots of people make when they let themselves be deceived into thinking what they're eating is ok for them, based on what food companies tell them. Like anything in life, if you don't DYOR you can't really complain when you get screwed over. I think a lot of fat people are just victims of not being curious enough about what they're filling their faces with. And a lot of people aren't curious enough because they haven't got the time or money to be.
I'm not sure that's fair - even the government were in on the "low fat" ideology, pushing people towards low-fat, but high sugar (or even worse high fructose corn syrup) alternatives.
Also, because they're "cheap" people who are tight for cash are pushed towards the nutritionally poor alternatives. Even if they do thir ow research, they might not be able to (or might not feel that they are able to) afford the better alternatives.
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I mentioned this back on the last page. I get a figure of 800ish calories burnt for one hour of climbing. I use this figure for a 3-hour session but really this could be a whiole hamburger out.
I strongly suspect you are over estimating by about 500 plus calories. when using my heart rate monitor (which base cals burnt on age, sex, weight and max heart rate ) i get about 500 to 600 with a max heart rate 170 to 180+ with an average of about 140ish.
I once used it for a weights session which included a lot of heavy( for me ) leg work squats etc and benching and I hardly got me heart rate above 120 and barely used 300 cals in 90 mins. I suspect bouldering will be pretty similar.
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Absolutely, which is partly what I meant by some people not having the money to be curious about food (i.e. or to act on it). But really, food for the masses in the 21st century is mostly a massive mis-selling of junk shit by people chiefly concerned with money, not health. See through the BS and a healthy diet is staring you in the face. It just doesn't seem as easy or tasty as the heavily-marketed version of food we get pushed at us daily.
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True.
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As someone else pointed out, sleep is fundamental.
Not only for general health issues, mood, etc. but also because many studies has shown a correlation between sleep deprivation and increased risk of gaining weight, due to a higher consumption of sweet, sugared foods.
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Also, because they're "cheap" people who are tight for cash are pushed towards the nutritionally poor alternatives. Even if they do thir ow research, they might not be able to (or might not feel that they are able to) afford the better alternatives.
I think it's more that they are habitually lazy eaters and inherit habits from parents, rather than affordability being the main issue. For example you can make a healthy and tasty meal from some smart price pasta, pasta sauce and fresh veg for the same price or less than a ready meal, just they can't be bothered to do so. And also, lets face facts, sugar, salt and fat tastes great if you have developed a taste for it.
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There's been a lot of talk about calories, but very little about sleep and stress and the impact those have on weight loss.
Agreed, although I am aware that these have an impact. I sleep very well thankfully, usually 7-8hrs per night with little if no interruption (much to the chagrin of my wife..). I'm generally a laid back person and although work does occasionally cause me to be stressed, climbing/training/fishing/sex all help with this :)
So what you're saying is you're sleep deficient :P You really should be aiming to average 8+hr per night. I know for most people this seems unreasonable, but it makes a massive difference. SOuds liek you've got the stress pretty well in hand though, so that'll go a long way.
According to the app I'm averaging the following spread of calorific intake;
Carbs - 52%
Fat - 26%
Protein - 22%
This against the app recommendation of;
Carbs - 55%
Fat - 30%
Protein - 15%
Any thoughts on this?
Over all, I'm feeling pretty good and seeing gains in my training almost weekly. Am climbing fairly poorly but expected that with the amount of training and changes in diet etc. Also the hunger thing is much better/easier to deal with...
Your answer is right below the question. As they say-The proof is in the pudding.
I'm convinced that dieting and training are tricky to combine. With hard training you generally give yourself an "easy" week every 3-4 weeks to let your body fully recover. I think the same goes with dieting. Every 3-4 weeks take one week and eat just to maintain the weight (don't binge), not lose any. It'll help your body and mind to continue in the long run.
Glad the hunger thing is better. It'll still come at you in spells, just fight to control it and you'll get through it.
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So what you're saying is you're sleep deficient :P You really should be aiming to average 8+hr per night. I know for most people this seems unreasonable, but it makes a massive difference.
I think this is too much of a generalisation; different people work better on different amounts of sleep. For me about 7 hours a night is right, and if I get more I feel sluggish. I know some people who require a lot less sleep too.
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yup, a whole nother can of worms
http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,23104.0.html (http://ukbouldering.com/board/index.php/topic,23104.0.html)
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So what you're saying is you're sleep deficient :P You really should be aiming to average 8+hr per night. I know for most people this seems unreasonable, but it makes a massive difference.
I think this is too much of a generalisation; different people work better on different amounts of sleep. For me about 7 hours a night is right, and if I get more I feel sluggish. I know some people who require a lot less sleep too.
Function yes, train and lose weight at the same time, doubtful. Yes, it's a generalization, but that doesn't make it not applicable.
I know some guys who can do one arm pullups without trainign at all, vis a vis I shouldn't have to train to do a one =armer? It's always easy to find outliers. If you are one, then you know it, otherwise you're not and generalizations apply. Assuming he's not an outlier(generally safe assumption), then increasing sleep to 8-9hours average would probably help in dropping weight.
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89.2kg this morning... Heading in the right direction!
Although picked up a bug and been off work for two days = no training for the last four days. Still been eating good and back to the Hangar for a light session with the wife tonight...
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Good work fella.
Seems these sweets guarantee rapid weight loss!
http://slightlyviral.com/beware-sugarless-gummy-bears-on-amazon-com/ (http://slightlyviral.com/beware-sugarless-gummy-bears-on-amazon-com/)
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Good work fella.
Seems these sweets guarantee rapid weight loss!
http://slightlyviral.com/beware-sugarless-gummy-bears-on-amazon-com/ (http://slightlyviral.com/beware-sugarless-gummy-bears-on-amazon-com/)
Ha! I've had a similar experience quaffing a box (small box) of some rather nice fruity sugar free sweets that were given away at some event or other... about two hours later I was shitting my guts out... was fine after though and releived when I read the packet and found out it was a possible effect of the sweetner when enough was imbibed...
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....was fine after though and relieved ......
Relieved - I'm sure you were!
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....was fine after though and relieved ......
Relieved - I'm sure you were!
Well at least I didnt pay for them.. :D
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I've gone from 86 to 82 since the start of December. 7 more to go :P
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You need to check your scales FD. I am 80kg.
Or maybe i need to check mine.
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I think Luke's diet is too high in protein: quickly jotting things down suggests it has nearly as much protein as carbohydrates and that's just going to fuck up your liver unnecessarily on it's way to being sugar.
I've never read anything about taking on too much protien being a problem?
I've been eating the same way for the last 4 years and I haven't had any problems, I'm lean and happy with the results i've had.
Never heard about it beeing a problem? Maybe try google?
Do you think 4 years is a long term study in this case? I know people who are drinking 6-8 Cans of beer a day for the past 4 years and besides always beeing drunk they still donīt have any problems, so what?
Besides the fact that excess proteins are either burnt for producing energy or are going straight into your pee you are wasting your money. Even if you were vegan it would be easily possible to get the right amount of protein without dietary supplements.
The human body is not able to store protein so if itīs not usefull as a carbohydrate substitue itīs going straight to your kidneys.
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You need to check your scales FD. I am 80kg.
Or maybe i need to check mine.
This was at the GPs so I assume realistic. I am much shorter than thee.
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You need to check your scales FD. I am 80kg.
Or maybe i need to check mine.
This was at the GPs so I assume realistic. I am much shorter than thee.
And wider.
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- If it wasn't food 100 years ago don't eat it.
I've been eating a whole roast pig for my tea every night, and it doesn't seem to be helping? Maybe I should avoid the broiled pheasant starter? or the bowl of semolina after? :)
From 14 st 1 on 5th Jan I'm now down to 13st 9 1/2.
Made a few changes in diet;
Breakfast first thing; porridge as per Andy's recipe (if I remember the night before) or muesli and yoghurt at work. No bacon roll or pastries on the way to work now.
Fruit or nuts for snacks
Soup at lunch, or tuna salad wraps if I remember to make them. No big bags of crisps, whole packets of hobnobs or slabs of chocolate for lunch or snacks!
Whole grain crackers for afternoon snacks (no vending machine chocoalte raids)
Healthy meal with kids in evening (resist tempation to hoover up their leftovers)
Small choccy bar in evening.
Trying to do at least some exercise 5 days out 7 (even if it's half an hour) and only drinking Friday night and Saturday night, and even then only a bottle of beer or a glass or two. Not had the opportunity for drinking any more, but probably would if the chance arose.
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Everyone who commented on this thread re: diet, protein, sugar, fat etc. should watch this:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03t8r4h (http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03t8r4h)
incredibly informative and it challenges some popular preconceptions. The long and short of it is all faddy diets are misguided and a 50:50 ratio of fat and sugar (rarely found in nature but [un]surprisingly often in processed foods) are to be avoided like the plague.
Doylo - step away from the cheesecake!
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Doylo - step away from the cheesecake!
Not to worry. My cheescake should be fine! 75% fat:25% Sugar :)
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Damn, my homemade cookies have 170g of butter but 250g of sugar. Will 100g of peanut butter even it out?
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Damn, my homemade cookies have 170g of butter but 250g of sugar. Will 100g of peanut butter even it out?
Only if its brandy butter :)
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The bottom line is really in order to lose weight you just need to put less in your gob.
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So I've always been known for being an underachieving fat nature helm and every year I work hard at losing weight before Font and put it all back on over the course of a summer's fishing! I can climb 7a on a really good day but would like to do this more often and expect that losing weight is a key ingredient in being able to do this.
I currently weigh around 90kg and last year I managed a four year low of 87kg before I left for Font, I'd like to beat that this year and would like to be around 85kg. (I say "around" because my weight never settles and varies a kilo either way with great regularity!)
I have always loved fatty foods and seem to be able to put on weight easier than anyone I know (family included) so this is hard for me! Oh to be 25 again and able to eat what I want at stay at 80kg!! :boohoo:
Other info - my wife is incredibly fussy about food, this limits "acceptable" family meals and as I do all the cooking I prefer not to have to cook two different meals. I hate running and always seem to get injured when I try but i do walk to work most of the time (2 miles each way). I'm doing the January Sharkathon, training 3 nights a week and currently climbing indoors twice a week and outdoors when I can.
Here is my current diet plan, please let me know what changes you might suggest and/or alternatives to what I am doing...
Breakfast - 1 banana
Lunch - Large box of salad containing variously - 1 carrot, some onion, a tin of tuna/sardines, some sweetcorn, raw mushrooms (4) half a bag of pre-packed salad leaves, some diet salad dressing.
Tea - assorted meals with the rest of the family with a focus on reduced portion size and increased amount of veg (green beans, carrots, broccoli, peas) - typically from the following list of acceptable meals;
- Toad in the hole
- Spag Bol
- Pasta with various meats/fish, cheese, pesto etc
- Chicken in bacon type affairs
- Pizza/chips/chicken nuggets etc
- Potatoes
Snacks - I will typically eat 2 apples and 2 tangerines through the day.
I have cut out all the crisps, nuts, beer etc. Never been a big fan of chocolate/sweets...
Questions -
1. Am I eating too much/not enough fruit - aware that there is a lot of sugar etc.
2. Should I bite the bullet and cook one meal for me and one for the rest of the family?
3. Will the feeling of being hungry all the time fade?
Many thanks!
I know my mere presence on this thread will have some folk in fits of merriment, but this is a question of avoiding the application my own advice
1. routine, get in one and stick with it.
2. lots of celery and other high cellulose content veg as snacks,
3. Eat carbs 40 minutes before you think you'll need them i.e. at 11:00 and 15:00
4. fill up on veg before having a small steak or something similarly nice and then a v. small pud
5. spend more on wine but drink less.
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The bottom line is really in order to lose weight you just need to put less in your gob.
Pretty much what I've been doing.
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Everyone who commented on this thread re: diet, protein, sugar, fat etc. should watch this:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03t8r4h (http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03t8r4h)
incredibly informative and it challenges some popular preconceptions. The long and short of it is all faddy diets are misguided and a 50:50 ratio of fat and sugar (rarely found in nature but [un]surprisingly often in processed foods) are to be avoided like the plague.
Doylo - step away from the cheesecake!
Sugar and saturated fats should be avoided generally if you wanīt to feel fit or lose weight. But that doesnīt include unsaturated fats which are needed for some metabolic processes. ironcally burning fat is one of them and doesnīt work if you donīt eat "healthy fat".
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12 st 13 3/4 this morning. I was hovering around the 13st 3 or 4 mark for a few weeks, then I went on the cortisol diet; last two weeks at work have been utterly manic, and very very streessful. Effective but not recommended as I've managed to climb for a total of about 3 hours in the last 2 weeks.
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I think I've found what you've lost!! Offshore and too much socialising = fatty fat fat boy...
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Sugar and saturated fats should be avoided generally if you wanīt to feel fit or lose weight. But that doesnīt include unsaturated fats which are needed for some metabolic processes. ironcally burning fat is one of them and doesnīt work if you donīt eat "healthy fat".
Lipid based hormones eg steroids are derived from cholesterol, quite important for healthy functioning.
In the main I'd agree, but I think our fat needs are probably rather complex going beyond saturated=bad, unsaturated = good.
Lard-fried Marsbars may be pushing it though...
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An interesting article about aerobics, weight loss and lean mass.
It could be helpful for those who want to lose weight in a good way.
http://www.t-nation.com/training/fasted-cardio-eats-muscle (http://www.t-nation.com/training/fasted-cardio-eats-muscle)
Hope it helps.
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Very interesting article there Nibile, I find it all very interesting but it makes my head hurt!
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;D
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Lard-fried Marsbars may be pushing it though...
What about deep fried twinkie's? ;D
I actually ate one a few years back. Felt ill for days......
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We bought a decent juicer so have been slurping for breakfast and lunch rather than munching. Lost a load of weight without getting hungry at all - lots of protein and fats in some of the recipes. A bit weird doing tiny poos though.
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Bet it's good for making cocktails too ;)
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I would say that getting some exercise in before a decent sized protein rich breakfast is a good idea in order to loose fat. Try have a min of three equal sized meals thro the day rather than your largest meal being in the evening.
Vary your exercise but prioritise resistance training and HIIT over low intensity cardio.
Really interesting podcasts from the pros at 'We Do Science' from @GuruPerformance @laurent_bannock
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Thread resurrection alert!
Was after some advice/kind help regards my diet. I've been doing a hell of a lot better with my whole lifestyle in general this year (keeping off the booze etc) But wonder what I could do better with regards to my food intake. So, diet goes pretty much like this most days/weeks:
Breakfast- Bran flakes with a scattering of sultanas and 1% cow juice.
10.30am Snack- Apple, satsuma and slide of malt loaf.
Lunch- cheddar cheese and pickle sandwich x 2 on wholegrain bread, low fat Yoghurt, another apple and satsuma, small cake of some description, oatcakes and some more cheese.
Afternoon snack- rest of oatcakes, possibly more fruit left over from lunch.
Evening meal- something like chilli with Quorn, brown rice, tuna pasta bake, bangers and mash, plenty of fresh veg etc etc.
I usually have a cup of tea in the morning, 2 litres of water during the day time, and not much more at night but will nail a few none alcoholic beers if I feel the urge.
I personally feel I'm missing something, or over indulging in something else, but I'm not sure what. I wonder if there is too much sugar, and often think I need more savoury things in my bait box.
Over to you.
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Sepsis, Augmentin, close proximity to toilet.
Not great advice, but effective.
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More fat. less sugar. IMO ditch all your low fat nonsense - work of the devil. Swap your
What is your issue? Are you trying to lose weight? Do you struggle with hunger cravings?
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I figured sugar is probably the biggest issue. I was taking carrot and hummus to work with me, good or bad fat? I'm flipping clueless.
I'm not trying to lose weight especially, but it would be handy I guess. Currently about 12st 9lbs so 12st would be the magic figure.
I do a very physical job, so keeping my energy levels up throughout the day is essential. And ideally I'd love to be able to exercise after work, but this isn't always possible to to me being knackered.
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This week sugar is bad. I wouldn't worry about it. You're eating too much fruit, re apples. It looks like you're trying too hard to have a good diet! Bran flakes are doing nothing for you that's why you're snacking, what's one percent cow juice? Sounds pathetic. With your job get a load of porridge in you in the morning, then have dinner and tea. Carrot and hummus is good if you've got a project or an office job, to sustain you moving logs or laying walls for 8-10 hrs a day is as much use as tits on a bull :wave:
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Haha Lee! Direct and to the point, always the best policy my friend. 1% milk is to try and appease my Mrs, she used to drink skimmed which I can't fucking stand, so we made the compromise of getting the 1% stuff which tastes more like semi-skimmed. Porridge is a good shout, and something I like but seem to forget about. I'll get back on it. What should I aim for then in terms of good fat? More cheese?
One other thing I need to consider in all this, is my good lady, who is a very fussy bugger when it comes to food :wall: Good job I love her :wub:
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More fat vote from me too! I've switched to full fat milk and lost weight (by sorting out other areas of my diet). I'd swap some of those fruit for veg if you don't mind ploughing through spinach, beetroot etc at lunchtime. Not much by way of fish or nuts/seeds in there, they're a good source of protein, good fats/oils etc. I get the 1kg tubs of peanut butter, big bags of mixed nuts (go well in full fat yoghurt and fill you fast). I fill myself up at lunchtime with avocado's and tinned fish alongside the usual fruit and veg.
If your job is physical you'll need the calories, main aim should be to make them good quality/nutrient dense ones. I use this diagram: http://www.isismedicine.com/Phytonutrient%20Spectrum_%20Patient%20Handout.pdf on the fridge to keep me psyched for a decent diet.
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There was something on the telly about milk, which the difference in fat between skimmed and full fat is next nothing and the fat actually aids the digestion of the nutrients in milk.
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First things first, get breakfast right - a low fat breakfast is probably the reason you're snacking before midday.
If it's your thing, try some sort of oat-based thing with full fat milk, fruit and nuts. I find that adding salt helps satisfy cravings too - my body seems to need quite a lot of it. Eat until you're properly full, and that will keep you going till lunch time.
Speaking from experience, I find I need to eat a lot more bland food (e.g. cheese sandwiches) to feel full compared to something with strong flavours. Maybe try to get into the habit of adding strong spices to things.
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I agree with others you need more fat with your breakfast. The ultimate filling brekfast for me is rolled oats porridge with a handful of nuts and some protein powder whisked in. Ticks all the boxes and will keep you going forever.
I would question the value of eating all of that cheese, particularly if you are trying to loose weight. Personally I would go for nuts/olives/almond butter/coconut products etc, but that's just me.
There are plenty of 'hacks' that you can use (cjsheps alludes to this) to make yourself feel fuller, all apparantly due to the power of science!
Take longer to eat. Not always possible when you are at work etc but taking an hour for lunch seems to work ok for the French
Split food into smaller portions. Especially at dinner, you'll feel fuller if you have 2x small portions instead of 1x medium portion
Try and go for more colour/flavour. Easy to do without adding calories, e.g salt, pepper, spices, herbs, whatever
Having a snack during a workout means you will eat less after the workout and consume fewer total calories than if you stayed hungry during the workout
Avoid 'liquid' calories like the plague. Train your body to just want water, it just takes time.
It might be worth using myfitnesspal or something similar to estimate how many calories you are consuming in a day, and doing that for a weeks worth of days (not necessarily in the same week) so you have a rough idea. Eating too few calories is just as bad as eating too many for weight loss, as your body gets stubborn because it is essentially starving
I've been reading Racing Weight, Dave Macleod recommended it and it seems quite good, though obviously needs adapting from an endurance focus
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I think that's nonsense that Bechtel stuff. If you get your metabolism sorted and eat the right stuff you can be lighter effortlessly.
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I agree with that^. As have other posters I found I dropped weight without trying and felt more energetic by switching to eating more unsaturated fat; quite a bit of saturated fat - I'll cook in butter a couple days every week/olive oil the other days (but I try to limit the saturated fat somewhat, was overdoing it at one stage) - full fat natural yogurt (not flavoured - full of sugar); keeping protein about the same but going for good quality wild fish and organic chicken as a treat; and reducing carbs - I'll have half a pack of 5 grain rice, never go near pasta or baked potatoes, don't have bread in the house (or I'd demolish it, the bread, in a day); and focusing on avoiding sucrose/fructose aka 'sugar' like the plague - no soft drinks/sugar in tea/coffee, 90% cocoa chocolate, no fruit juice, read the labels on packaged food adn choose the lowest sugar option. As usual awareness and motivation leads to change of behavior.
Low fat yogurts are loaded with sugar and are probably fattening - all that sugar turns to fat especially in the morning when you've just had 10 hours of doing fuck-all exercise ;)..... You should tell your girlfriend there's nothing healthy about consuming lots of sugar after no activity whatsoever - even if it does come in a pot with a picture of a fit white-toothed, , smiling Scandinavian chick in a white dress. (or tell her she needs to engage in high intensity exercise during the 10 hours before consuming it...)
Someone should start a thread about how dogshit sugar is..
Bear in mind I've a sedentary-ish job. Mix of 60-70% office, visiting sites/clients, getting equipment ready, driving, some carrying. Lots of time on my arse reading ukb. Going off the belwo diet I'll virtually never snack between meals except at the crag. Someone with a purely physical trade is going to want snacks. I'm 63-64kg btw, 5'10''.
Breaky: almond butter/banana/2 egg pancake fried in butter served with blueberries/raspberries topped in cacoa (not cocoa) powder. Or scrambled eggs on rye bread. Or mixed nuts/high fat yogurt/cacoa powder/berries on top. Never much carbs. These breakfast leave me satisified until around 2-3pm, I'm never hungry mid-morning.
Lunch: I'm shit at lunch and eat too many 6'' subways (tuna though, never processed red meat) but I'll cut away half the flatbread. Or a tuna salad with lots of olive oil. Avocado on buttered rye bread with lemon and olive oil. Lunches are best prepped at home but I'm too lazy/busy.
Dinners: Learning to efficiently cook 3 or 4 tasty recipies using fresh ingredients helps staying away from shit ingredients like sugar. High fat and protein, a bit of wholegrain cabs. My standard recipes, which I can bosh out in 15-20 minutes, are:
Green Chicken Masala and sweet potatoes with coconut oil and a mint/coriander/lemon/galic/jalapeno sauce;
Stir fry (tons of veg) with a homemade sauce of mint/coriander/ginger/lemon/garlic.
Omelette with broccoli, leek, slices of sweet potatoes;
Butternut squash soup with coriander/olive oil topping and buttered rye bread.
Days when I don't cook I'm down the pizza shop but I get a veggie one and chuck a tin of tuna on top then smother it in olive oil and spinach.
Wine instead of beer, I try to limit it to weekends but fail every other week. If you're serious about dropping weight, water instead of wine except weekends.
On a day at the crag I'll eat a bit of sweets and chocolate, and try to finish the sesh eating carbs/protein ratio 4:1 (but not lots - research grams of each per kg body weight per hour exercised for how much. Basically a choccy bar, banana, plus a pure protein bar or drink, plus lots of water to make you feel full)
After training sesh: small carb/protein hit, 4:1
Winter climbing/hill day: eat anything I like, loads of sugar and fat.
Last year when I wanted to experiment with purposely losing weight I just boshed out 1500 calories (roughly) per day for two weeks, dropped all alcohol, and dropped 4 kg. (then got injured, cunt!) Weight hasn't really fully gone back on since, I think I'm still 2 or 3kg lighter now than before my brief 2-week diet despite eating shit loads of fat and plenty of calories, and I'm not doing any mega calorie-burning exercise but do a little most days. High intensity stuff like you'll see in Nibbles vids is a great way to burn calories - a short intense heavy kettlebell workout will leave your body burning calories for hours afterwards.
Look up metabolic effect of exercise and try some intense resistance for two weeks and see how much you drop when combined with cutting out sugar.
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Look up metabolic effect of exercise
Constrained Total Energy Expenditure and Metabolic Adaptation to Physical Activity in Adult Humans (http://www.cell.com/current-biology/pdf/S0960-9822%2815%2901577-8.pdf)
Suggests an alternative model based on experimental data to the linear relationship most commonly considered to underpin exercise and metabolism.
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Whilst thinking about this a bit in a fit of post christmas self loathing I listened to thing on radio 4 about nutrition in running:
Part 1
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06tq3tk
Part 2
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06zqd89
It is very interesting, lots of experts on sports nutrition and anecdotal rubbish too (everyone who seemed to know anything seemed to slam low carb-high fat as a fad and the paleo diet as total bullshit).
But the final statement (in the main show rather than the online extended podcast) was really interesting, a guy from some ivory tower in the states (Harvard I think) simply says (I paraphrase):
"We can argue about sports nutrition all day but in the end it can all be summed up in nine words: Eat real food, plenty of vegetables, not too much"
I realise it kind of strays on to diet for performance but I should think that diet for weight loss whilst maintaining performance is the same can be applied a balanced diet avoiding processed food, within those confines find what works, if it is fermented soy bean go for it, but if you stray too far in favour of fat or carb it is probably going to be problematic in the medium to long term.
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I found the calorie counting apps (my fitness pal I think?) really useful for tracking/logging calorie intake.. of course this is a pretty crude breakdown (lots of assumptions in the calories in various dishes - and the whole what do the calories actually mean - aka the good vs bad calorie shit) but that aside, it gives you a good overall indication of how much you are taking in and allows you to monitor it day by day...
Incidentally, I have a colleague at work - similar age to me (45) similar height and build (scrawny) who's only exercise is cycling 2-3 miles to work and back and drinking coffee. He monitors his weight - and it varies by up to 9lbs a week!!! He fattens up over the weekend (eats more and drinks more) then loses it all again during the week... I was quite shocked at how fast it came and went!
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In one of the TB podcasts, might have been the Steve Bechtel one, the interviewee stated that changing one habit has a high (these figures are vaguely remembered so are only ballpark) ~80% chance of success; try to change two and it drops massively to 30ish; three things was, iirc, about 5%. So two is about as realistic as most will manage.
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I found the calorie counting apps (my fitness pal I think?) really useful for tracking/logging calorie intake.. of course this is a pretty crude breakdown (lots of assumptions in the calories in various dishes - and the whole what do the calories actually mean - aka the good vs bad calorie shit) but that aside, it gives you a good overall indication of how much you are taking in and allows you to monitor it day by day...
Incidentally, I have a colleague at work - similar age to me (45) similar height and build (scrawny) who's only exercise is cycling 2-3 miles to work and back and drinking coffee. He monitors his weight - and it varies by up to 9lbs a week!!! He fattens up over the weekend (eats more and drinks more) then loses it all again during the week... I was quite shocked at how fast it came and went!
I use this app and have been monitoring my weight.
As with you, I thought to use it only as a general guide (it monitors "steps" too, giving a discount against your target). If you can be bothered to upgrade to premium it logs all of your nutritional intake (assuming you are fastidious in entering your consumption).
I targeted a 0.5kg/wk drop and then discovered that I could eat as normal (all the meals I would normally eat) and still not consume enough to meet the 2300 kcal that was my loss target. Often falling 500-600 kcal short.
I was just eating too much crap between meals (I don't really eat my kids leftovers (except crackling/chicken skin)).
And I was eating too much crap because I was hungry.
Because I wasn't eating enough at meal times.
A quick review of the constituents of a few typical meals and their nutritional content showed I was eating fairly well.
For me, the main habit to break was failing to fill up at the table.
I suppose I should/could also try having a calculated snack slotted in at the right time (say mixed nuts at elevenses instead of a sticky bun with Mr Gruber).
Oddly though, despite being very ill the last 5 days, hardly eating at all (though still tracking (1200-1500 kcal per day) and having the Augmentin two-step to boot; I lost the grand total of 0.1kg this week.
This just goes to prove that life sucks big dogs bollocks and even grey clouds have fuckall in the way of silver linings.
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No "Iron Will" required. I just met a girl who is a veggie. I often have to remind myself to eat now. Almost never hungry. In fact, it was a bit of a surprise today at 5pm that I felt a bit light headed and realised I was starving after doing DIY all day. 2 bread rolls and a bowl of soup was far too little for lunch!
P.S. Previously I'd be starving by 11am, starving again by 3pm and always struggling to not put on weight.
So, quite a big change to habits but once the change is made, very little effort required to maintain it.
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Some great info, been mega busy so will reply soon but thanks for the info so far.
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Whilst thinking about this a bit in a fit of post christmas self loathing I listened to thing on radio 4 about nutrition in running:
Part 1
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06tq3tk
Part 2
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06zqd89
It is very interesting, lots of experts on sports nutrition and anecdotal rubbish too (everyone who seemed to know anything seemed to slam low carb-high fat as a fad and the paleo diet as total bullshit).
But the final statement (in the main show rather than the online extended podcast) was really interesting, a guy from some ivory tower in the states (Harvard I think) simply says (I paraphrase):
"We can argue about sports nutrition all day but in the end it can all be summed up in nine words:"
...
This makes me chuckle. People like to slam things with labels - like 'Paleo' etc., as 'fads'. And I agree anything taken to an extreme - like eating raw meat and getting OCD about staying in ketogenisis - is just a little bit bonkers and fadish.
Just like craft ales, beards and obsessing over coffee are fadish. But I love a good coffee and a decent ale, doesn't mean I'm taken in by the other pretentious bullshit surrounding it all.
And then in the next sentence you get the nugget of wisdom from the anti-fad wad: 'Eat real food, plenty of vegetables, not too much'.
So Paleo would qualify then. ::)
Or any other 'fad label' that emphasises avoiding the worst of the food industry and focusing instead on eating lightly processed food that comes out the ground and from other animals and into your mouth with minimal interference/additions from the food industry.
Anyone quoting the 'eat real food not too much...' line in response to a diet with 'a label' should research or maybe try it out... might be surprised to discover when used as a guideline it's pretty much the 'eat real food not too much diet'. I don't know anyone who dabbles with these diets who actually sticks to avoiding carbs and doesn't eat sugary treats and bread now and then. Paleo and other 'labels' are at best just guidelines to keep on track instead of being taken in by the a lot of the shite food on sale made by people with their own profit as the main priority and not my optimum health. And at worst the 'fad' diets are just excuses for some quack to sell diet books (profit again). But just about everything can be found for free on the web if you didn't know.
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And I agree anything taken to an extreme - like eating raw meat and getting OCD about staying in ketogenisis - is just a little bit bonkers and fadish.
But the point is ketosis works by being extreme, you nearly completely exclude carbohydrate forcing your body to create ketones for your brain to feed on. If you dabble it doesn't work (as Dave Mac rightly said in his beta podcast), so it isn't a guideline it is a rule.
As for your facetious comment re-paleo, being "eating real food etc", it isn't really because I am sure you would agree diary and cereals (excluded from the paleo diet) are real unprocessed food.
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This is getting ridiculous. Not 'real food'? In what way is a paleo diet not real food? Maybe you're getting too hung up on what it tries to avoid rather than what it doesn't.
I'm not on a paleo or any other diet btw so have no motive to defend it. I just try to eat real food and minimise refined sugar.
Can't read this till next week now. Off to eat soda bread.
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This is getting ridiculous. Not 'real food'? In what way is a paleo diet not real food? Maybe you're getting too hung up on what it tries to avoid rather than what it doesn't.
I'm not on a paleo or any other diet btw so have no motive to defend it. I just try to eat real food and minimise refined sugar.
Can't read this till next week now. Off to eat soda bread.
I am not saying that paleo isn't real food, I am saying that there are a lot of things which are "real food" which are excluded under the paleo diet.
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Just buy some fucking ephedrine and get on with it
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Just buy some fucking ephedrine and get on with it
had a pretty similar suggestion from South African Mike (a low nonsense blacksmith) when he overheard some climbers whining about weight
"just do some fucking speed" or something like that
works fine as long as you don't need to use your brain for day to day work and looking after kids etc.
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Caveat: avoid if you have or suspect mental health issues
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Caveat: avoid if you have or suspect mental health issues
Well...
That's most of UKB out, then.
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Just buy some fucking ephedrine and get on with it
In the past I've found a weekly dose of MDMA combined with vigorous exercise ((https://themixingbowl.org/static/img/smilies/dancin.gif) :bounce: (https://themixingbowl.org/static/img/smilies/dancin.gif) :bounce: (https://themixingbowl.org/static/img/smilies/dancin.gif) :bounce: (https://themixingbowl.org/static/img/smilies/dancin.gif)) to be beneficial to weight loss.
Not sustainable long term though.
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You madman!
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Caveat: avoid if you have or suspect mental health issues
or if you don't want to risk developing some
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Get tape worm less of an impact on your mental health.
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Get tape worm less of an impact on your mental health.
the documentary i saw about an edinburgh copper going completely off the rails suggests otherwise :whistle:
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Irvin Welsh books are not documentaries Rodma :spank:
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What about that documentary about Trainspotting?
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Irvin Welsh books are not documentaries Rodma :spank:
Next you'll be telling me that film about a top naval flight school isn't a documentary either
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You madman!
Crazy times. (https://themixingbowl.org/static/img/smilies/wacko.gif)
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Finally getting chance to read and reply to this thread.
So, my eating habits are certainly changing, for the better hopefully.
Usual day looks something like this now:
Breakfast - porridge with some flaked almonds, two eggs scrambled on a single slice of whole grain bread.
Mid morning snack - rice cakes with peanut butter on and an apple
Lunch - chicken breast with sweet potato mash, low fat coleslaw, spinach and beetroot. Yogurt.
Mid afternoon snack - mixed nuts and fruit, protein shake.
Dinner - salmon with more sweet potato mash, broccoli, carrots etc
I vary the dinner option, but most of the day time stuff stays the same. Getting breakfast right seems to be the key to controlling my hunger issues. I skipped my mid morning snack a few times last week, which is generally unheard of! So far so good, been using myfitnesspal to monitor things and after some research, I estimate I'd been about 1500 calories short of what I needed as a minimum for someone who does my job!
Finding the balance is going to be the tricky part, with an instant change in eating habits proving tricky. In other words, I enjoy having a curry or fish and chips and I like beer and wine and sweets and cake. I don't think I going to beat myself about it if I do have a treat every now and again. Key is to keep them low in quantity and frequency.
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I try and limit crap to weekends only?
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For 10 weeks I have cut my Carb intake (Potato, rice, Pasta) by 2/3. Otherwise, I have eaten normally. 2-3 glasses of wine per week and either a pint or a half (mood dependant) on a Monday evening. Generally upped my activity levels and restarted training.
Lost 9kg, 5 to go.
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http://www.vox.com/2016/4/28/11518804/weight-loss-exercise-myth-burn-calories
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http://www.vox.com/2016/4/28/11518804/weight-loss-exercise-myth-burn-calories
Yes, I read that yesterday, along with the one about the rapid regain of the "Biggest loser" winners (all of them).
That headline is really misleading.
It should read, "Exercise alone is not going to make you slim".
Honestly, I'm not in the slightest bit shocked that "Basal metabolic rate is pretty similar for all humans"; which seems to be the conclusion of both articles. Or that "people who lost weight, put it on again when they quit the regime that caused the loss".
Nor am I shocked that it seems that my metabolism is slowing as I age, so I can't eat unlimited crap anymore (had a conversation with an Evolutionary biologist about this some years back and she hypothesised that storing more fat as you become less able to gather calories through age, seemed a logical/likely evolutionary outcome).
Healthy life style is a healthy lifestyle. Too much food, too little exercise; is just that.
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Useful site and amusing rebuttal to a Dr Oz show "Expert" (which, taken phonetically, equates to X (an unknown quantity) and spurt (a drip under pressure)).
http://www.overcomeobesity.org/overcome-obesity/research/josh-axe-d-c-spewing-a-bunch-of-nonsense-on-the-dr-oz-show/
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