UKBouldering.com
the shizzle => bouldering => Topic started by: r-man on January 27, 2014, 12:32:25 pm
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Got together with Gareth recently and we had a look at what the site needed to improve. We've both been a bit slack in the last couple of years, but now it's time to get things sorted. Gareth has actually done quite a few less obvious fixes in recent times, but I hadn't realised. So here's a list of what's new and improved.
For starters, the server has been switched to Amazon, which should be more reliable, and also scale up whenever it is being heavily used. So it should be faster!
Also, in light of the recent yorkshiregrit demise, it's worth saying that if Gareth ever decides he no longer wants to run the site, he will happily hand over the database free to a good home.
General Changes
- The algorithm for 20 problems has been tweaked so only problems with more than 5 votes appear. Also, it's now top 50. The list looks a lot more like you'd expect now.
- There is a new link to filter problems beneath the recent updates. Several new filters have been added - eg. you can now search by crag, rocktype and area.
- The default view for crags is now to show all problems, makes it easier to use.
- On the home page, top videos have been replaced by random videos, to keep things fresh.
- Recent updates and new problems now show top 50.
New Actions
- You can now reorder buttresses if you click the edit button at the bottom of the relevant crag page.
- You can now reorder problems if you click the edit button at the bottom of the relevant buttress page.
- Moderators can now delete problems and buttresses.
Feeback
There is also an orange feedback tab on the right of the page. Click this if you want to suggest any ideas. If we get the site to a level that people are happy with, there's no reason we can't expand it to include other areas if that's what people want. At the moment I think the wiki functions are better than any other site (though of course there's always room for improvement), but I am aware that user profiles and ticklists are lacking. Oh, and the map still needs fixing. Anything else?
http://peakbouldering.info (http://peakbouldering.info)
Currently in Progress
- I've started adding the Anston Stones problems - if anyone wants to help, feel free. Now that it's easy to reorder and delete, it doesn't matter if you cock up a problem. There are loads of Anston beta videos out there, so it would be nice to get these on the site so that people can see them all in one place.
- If there are any crags/buttresses/problems that were cocked up by mulitple entries in the past, please can you post details here, and moderators can easily delete them, or get Gareth to merge them if they have ascents logged.
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Effort.
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Nice one! :beer2: That's most of my gripes sorted out. I've got a backlog of stuff I need to update.
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Nice work and nice touch sending out emails to people who's videos you are embedding to check that they don't mind.
Great site - use it all the time.
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A bit more spry on the new servers: Excellent.
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Nice one well done
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General Changes
- The algorithm for 20 problems has been tweaked so only problems with more than 5 votes appear. Also, it's now top 50. The list looks a lot more like you'd expect now.
Great effort making the changes, doesn't look like this is working on a regional basis though, looks like crag number, buttress number then problem number is the sort order for problems tied on star ratings. :sorry:
Really hope more people start using it, could be so good with more logged ascents
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Glad people are liking the tweaks. :)
Nai, well spotted! Only showing top 20 as well. It's now on the fix list.
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I know that photos/topos can be put on the same as any other picture, but could they be tagged or listed separately or something to make them easier to spot when you look at a buttress or boulder?
not that I've actually got around to making such pictures, but I do think about it
I realise that I may have missed something really obvious and that this existed all along
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I know that photos/topos can be put on the same as any other picture, but could they be tagged or listed separately or something to make them easier to spot when you look at a buttress or boulder?
not that I've actually got around to making such pictures, but I do think about it
I realise that I may have missed something really obvious and that this existed all along
I've probably missed it too, but how about a bit more of a detailed map for the areas too? Appologies if it's already there and I'm just being an idiot.
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I've probably missed it too, but how about a bit more of a detailed map for the areas too? Appologies if it's already there and I'm just being an idiot.
I'd have thought this something that the users would have to create?
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Great news.
Seems to be running much quicker although I thought i'd link a few vids and keep getting errors and tried to log a problem and got errors too.
:(
All seem to be server errors.
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All seem to be server errors.
:sorry: That was my fault - I was deploying a new version of the site and in a fit of uncontrollable excitement forgot to check if anyone was on there. It's back again now and I will try harder to keep the enthusiasm under control check in future.
On the plus side:
doesn't look like this is working on a regional basis though
it is now - top 30 problems with 3 or more ascents for areas and top 10 problems with 2 or more ascents for crags seemed to give a good balance
Really hope more people start using it, could be so good with more logged ascents
I agree - the more logged ascents the better. You should now be able to like / tweet / share most problems / crags etc so hopefully that'll encourage a bit more traffic?
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Last time I went on it I wanted to do something, can't remember what - maybe vote on a problem or add a comment - but it wouldn't let me because I had to log the problem first. Is it still like that? I have no desire for another log book and would only add info that doesn't involve having to log stuff.
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Last time I went on it I wanted to do something, can't remember what - maybe vote on a problem or add a comment - but it wouldn't let me because I had to log the problem first. Is it still like that? I have no desire for another log book and would only add info that doesn't involve having to log stuff.
Short answer: you can post an arbitrary comment on a problem without "logging" it, but pretty much anything else requires a log.
Long answer:
Maybe I shouldn't have used the term "log" - the idea wasn't to form a logbook, but rather to collect a load of structured data about the problem. The site has the option to run an advanced search that lets you find, for example, all of the 7a-7b grit aretes that get at least 3 stars. For this sort of search to work well, you need either a very clever computer, or else lots of structured opinions from people who have climbed the various problems - this is the point of "logging" ascents of problems. If you go to the site and log an ascent of your favourite problem you'll see that this gives you the chance to cast your opinion on the grade, quality and number of mats needed to climb the problem, along with a bunch of yes/no qualities such as whether you thought that it was powerful / scrittly / highball / stays dry in the rain etc. These opinions are then merged and presented as a (somewhat) anonymised distribution of opinion - as an example: 88% of respondents feel that trackside involves using a heel http://www.peakbouldering.info/problems/134-trackside (http://www.peakbouldering.info/problems/134-trackside)
Originally, we thought that if you hadn't climbed a problem, you didn't really deserve to comment. I'm not sure if that's the right approach or not - I always think that every grit problem is desperate, until I get the knack climb it, then I realise it is easy and downgrade it ;)
Basically the best parts of the site only work if people register their opinions (i.e. log ascents), so if you like to use the site and don't take the time to register ascents, there's a fair chance that karma will bless you with poor friction and thin tips...
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I still think you should make it so you don't have to log the problem to vote, that's what will put me off bothering to vote. Just being logged in as a user should be enough IMO, it's not like ticking a box to log it proves you've done it anyway.
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One problem with the no log no vote set-up is that very undercraded problems end up not getting flagged up as such. Nobody or very few folk get up said problems because they are too hard for the grade (even 8b climbers don't like putting in 7b+ efforts on 7as in my experience). Therefore no feedback on just the sort of grade outlier that the system could be correcting.
Not sure how you could get round this. Personally I think the fact that when you vote you're name and your opinion of the grade are logged is enough to stop abuse if you did swithc to log-less voting. You can get round the 'things feeling hard before you suceed' problem by making a vote amendable (if it isn't already).
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I've probably missed it too, but how about a bit more of a detailed map for the areas too? Appologies if it's already there and I'm just being an idiot.
If you mean a map of all crags in an area, it does exist, but is hidden for the time being while Gareth works on improvements.
Worth pointing out that although the map doesn't show right now, it is also quite easy for users to add coordinates for individual boulders and buttresses at a crag. May be especially useful for developers of new crags.
I still think you should make it so you don't have to log the problem to vote, that's what will put me off bothering to vote. Just being logged in as a user should be enough IMO, it's not like ticking a box to log it proves you've done it anyway.
Are you saying you'd like an option for anonymous voting? We have discussed this in the past, but opinions are welcome...
You can get round the 'things feeling hard before you suceed' problem by making a vote amendable (if it isn't already).
It's not already possible, but that's worth considering. Instead of a grade vote, there could be felt soft/felt ok/felt hard options for people who haven't completed the problem?
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How about vote weighting. A vote has value of one for a user who has not logged an ascent of a problem and a value of two if/when the voter has logged the problem? This kind of reflects how we intuitively weight people's opinions anyway.
I do reckon votes should be by logged in users only rather than anonymous. This avoids multiple votes from one user.
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If we did that, it could just be half a vote for non-climbed problems, wouldn't need to fiddle current data.
It would be possible to allow logged in users to make anonymous votes, so multiple votes is not an issue. What I'd be interested to know is why would people want to be anonymous? I'm not entirely sure that's what Alex was suggesting anyway - or was it?
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i thought Alex's problem was that the effort required to create a user account then log an ascent just to give a problem a rating was too much.
I can see his point but... the usefulness of the site for me is the information you gain when people log an ascent with all the extra details. Would allowing people to just rate a problem mean there is less incentive to log ascents?
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I just ditched bothering to vote on anything as soon as I saw I had to log ascents. I have an account already. Maybe it's just me, be I suspect not and I would guess there'd be more voting if it didn't look like you basically have to use it as a logbook to vote on stuff. If I want to do that I'll use 8a or ukc
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I just ditched bothering to vote on anything as soon as I saw I had to log ascents. I have an account already. Maybe it's just me, be I suspect not and I would guess there'd be more voting if it didn't look like you basically have to use it as a logbook to vote on stuff. If I want to do that I'll use 8a or ukc
Are either of those as comprehensive as peakbouldering.info is/aims to be/will be (if users add content)?
I don't log much bouldering myself as I don't do a lot, but the UKC logbooks look patchy on that front from what I recall.
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I just ditched bothering to vote on anything as soon as I saw I had to log ascents. I have an account already. Maybe it's just me, be I suspect not and I would guess there'd be more voting if it didn't look like you basically have to use it as a logbook to vote on stuff. If I want to do that I'll use 8a or ukc
pb.info isn't a logbook and can't be used as such. You are logging ascents to provide details for other users. I guess in this sense it's quite altruistic as you don't get much back (i.e. as a logbook) for providing info.
Are either of those as comprehensive as peakbouldering.info is/aims to be/will be (if users add content)?
I don't log much bouldering myself as I don't do a lot, but the UKC logbooks look patchy on that front from what I recall.
You add routes/problem to all of these databases quite easily. so they are as comprehensive as you want it to be. What ukc/8a lack is the useful info.
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Crag moderation is variable on UKC though, there are some very popular peak district venues with a lot of problems awaiting verification as they're shown in red.
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Looking at the current top-rated problems is interesting. Suavito the best problem in the peak... 8 out of 20 at Burbage/Stanage...
Suavito (7B)
West Side Story (7C)
Crescent Arete (5+)
Deliverance (7B+)
Brad Pit (7C+ (soft))
Help The Young (7A+ (hard))
Charlie's Overhang (6B)
Monochrome (7B)
Dick Williams (7B+)
Electrical Storm (7B)
Brad's Arete 'the presence of absence' (6C+)
Three Pocket Slab (6A (hard))
Rocket Ride (6C+)
Pebble Arete (5+)
Stall (7A (hard))
Baldstones Traverse (7A+)
Blunt Arete (6B (soft))
The Staffordshire Flyer (6B)
Night Of Lust Sit Start (7A)
T Crack (7B (hard))
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Site seems to be down atm. Shame as I finally have a bit of time to update some bits :(
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It's working now. Just spotted the new reorder method. much better than the old one :thumbsup:
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There currently seems to be a problem with photos. They upload ok but aren't showing up anywhere except for when you open the problem in question (not on new photos bar for instance). It makes it hard for people to find any newly added pics.
BTW have stickified this thread as a place for folk to report any probs with the site.
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not so much a problem as a question about how best to proceed
via YouTube and RealLife I get asked about bouldering suitable for children
We have a few family favorites and I'm sure others do too - there are a plenty of boulders that provide great stuff for little kids that are of little interest to tall folk
I was thinking about posting pics and vids for kids stuff at Burbage North - I was thinking of writing/posting up the kids stuff as being a separate "buttress" or area of Burb North rather than mix it in with other stuff - I was planning on map and topo pics as well
is it worth adding Burbage North Kids Circuit as a separate crag and then the different areas as sub-sections?
obviously this line of thinking will cover other areas, so I thought I'd try to sort it out now
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I love this plan, please do it lagers, be great for a non-local (me) to have something to set the offspring on.
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If guess you wanted to, you could even create Kid's Circuits as a completely seperate option on the home page alongside the other areas - Eastern Grit, Western Grit, Limestone etc.. Would that be any use, or would you rather just have all the kids circuits alongside the adult stuff?
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a separate "kids areas" linked from the home page would work well for me r-man - it would make it easy for parents to browse kids circuits only
what do other people think?
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I would thoroughly support this...
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also,
I stuck this pic on the Burb West section
is this stuff useful for non-locals?
could it be improved upon?
I was thinking of something similar for the kids circuits - it's pretty handy that many git crags can photographed from a distance
(http://peakboulderingimages.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/photo/image/1157/standard_Burbage_West.jpg)
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Very Good idea, you're full of 'em.
Can add Curbar's "Backside" circuit to the list.
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yep, great idea for a separate kids circuit Lagers.
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tee hee
he said "backside"
hee hee
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Fnarr fnarr
Honestly it's better than it sounds with the added bonus of adult climbing on the other side of the block.
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I stuck this pic on the Burb West section
is this stuff useful for non-locals?
could it be improved upon?
This might be grade dependent - but I always think of the far area as the Famous Grouse or Breakfast area not West end girls. True git not true git innit? Similarly, I don't know which problem Go west is but everybody knows the Nose don't they? General idea is great though.
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I agree JB
I used the names of the areas as they are listed on PB
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I labelled the current areas based on names already used in guidebooks/online. They could easily be changed if that's what people prefer.
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My only 2-cents about the "kids areas" is that it would be more useful as an overlay... so you find a place that has kids' stuff AND grown-up stuff to keep everyone happy.
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Good idea on the kids probs. It can be surprisingly hard to find good probs for tiny people.
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could we have a "kids" grade on the grade menu when entering new problems? - if this is too much trouble we could just make do with the choices available already
it doesn't make sense to grade tiny folks' problems with big folks numbers
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could we have a "kids" grade on the grade menu when entering new problems? - if this is too much trouble we could just make do with the choices available already
it doesn't make sense to grade tiny folks' problems with big folks numbers
This is the start of the slippery slope of different grades for short people ;)
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My only 2-cents about the "kids areas" is that it would be more useful as an overlay... so you find a place that has kids' stuff AND grown-up stuff to keep everyone happy.
my plan would be to provide a photo of the crag like the burb w one above with both the kids boulders and the big boys boulders labeled
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This is the start of the slippery slope of different grades for short people ;)
just take away one numerical grade for short people - it's sooo much easier for them
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This is the start of the slippery slope of different grades for short people ;)
just take away one numerical grade for short people - it's sooo much easier for them
we've got font sub 5 grades already. Don't see why those can't be used.
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This is the start of the slippery slope of different grades for short people ;)
just take away one numerical grade for short people - it's sooo much easier for them
This is true for some of the little buggers...
Age 7...
http://youtu.be/b_Yd7oou6_A
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I was thinking about posting pics and vids for kids stuff at Burbage North - I was thinking of writing/posting up the kids stuff as being a separate "buttress" or area of Burb North rather than mix it in with other stuff - I was planning on map and topo pics as well
is it worth adding Burbage North Kids Circuit as a separate crag and then the different areas as sub-sections?
obviously this line of thinking will cover other areas, so I thought I'd try to sort it out now
Chatted to Gareth about this. There are several possibilities, including perhaps a function to toggle kids problems on and off. But for now the best thing to do is just have them as a seperate crag - fancy stuff can be done at a later date if people are still keen for it. I've created a Burbage North Kids Circuit crag. All yours...
http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/184-burbage-north-kids-circuit#.VDpsDRbq11g (http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/184-burbage-north-kids-circuit#.VDpsDRbq11g)
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Don't forget I already have a lot of kids stuff listed at Burb, South, North and West (and a few other venues besides) as no one else seemed bothered... my U grades translate one to one for font.
http://offwidth.uptosummit.com/burbages_boulders.html (http://offwidth.uptosummit.com/burbages_boulders.html)
http://offwidth.uptosummit.com/burbage_north.html (http://offwidth.uptosummit.com/burbage_north.html)
http://offwidth.uptosummit.com/higgar_area.html (http://offwidth.uptosummit.com/higgar_area.html)
etc
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Made a start on the kids' circuit at Burb N
http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/184-burbage-north-kids-circuit#.VFIiCPmsXAk (http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/184-burbage-north-kids-circuit#.VFIiCPmsXAk)
I've named some stuff purely for ease of reference
if stuff already has names, let me know and I'll change them accordingly
got more to add later
some odd issue with adding pics to buttresses/boulders rather than specific problems, but these seem to rectify themselves with time (or some tech wizard does some magic in the background)
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so, if I go to picture that I uploaded, click "edit" and then select a different photo from my hard drive and then click "save" - will the new photo replace the old one?
(for the purposes of adding/changing labels on topo pics)
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Not entirely sure what the scope of these changes are, whether it's just content or functionality, but I have a couple of ideas.
Filter Problems:
This is great for creating tick lists and it would be great to be able to save these filtered lists to your account with a custom name.
It would also be great to be able to add positive and negative attributes at the same time. For example at the moment I can do:
Show only problems that are at least one of...
attribute, attribute
It would be nice if you could then add another set of criteria such as:
Show only problems that are at least one of...
attribute, attributeAnd do not show problems that are at least one of/all of...
attribute, attribute
Or, more simply. Show results that match...
attribute, !attribute
Happy to help out if needed.
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I've added Stanage Popular as a new crag, is it possible for someone to move BAWs Crawl & Verandah Buttresses over?
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Hit up Local Yokel Gareth Cokell on facebook, he should be able to do it.
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It seems more and more people are just uploading video clips and photos of problems to Instagram and or facebook rather than vimeo or youtube, certainly if it is just a single problem rather than a mini film edit.
Is it possible to embed insta videos to the site? It would make life easier if everyone used the #peakbouldering hashtag when they posted videos so they could be easily added in t'site. Does that make sense/seem feasible?
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Burbage North has disappeared from the Areas menu
it all seems to be listed under Chasing The Light
http://peakbouldering.info/areas/1-eastern-grit/crags/7-chasing-the-light#.XA7aSHT7RPY
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I've fixed it.
It appears I have permissions to do so from when adding the yorkshire grit areas.
Any downgrades needed? ;)
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nice one
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:'( oh no it's down and I'm going Roche abbey today. I've never been before and have no Topo
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The descriptions on ukclimbing are enough to get by in a push.
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The site seems to have been down for over a week now. Anyone know what the issue is and if/when it's returning?
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I’ll text Gareth now.
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Cheers
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Has there been any progress on this at all?
It would be a real shame to loose all the info over at PBI :(
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Agreed. I spend a lot of time there nicking beta! I'm missing it.
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Just to point out that an archive of the site is held by the internet archive https://web.archive.org/web/20201020192749/http://peakbouldering.info/
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Good knowledge, i was looking for this the other day
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Any knowledge on peakbouldering?
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No plans to reinstate it as far as I know. I believe if someone competent and keen was willing to pick up the IT mantle/expense of running it, it could be resurrected, but that hasn't yet happened.
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No plans to reinstate it as far as I know. I believe if someone competent and keen was willing to pick up the IT mantle/expense of running it, it could be resurrected, but that hasn't yet happened.
Who owns the domain and stuff? I’d be happy to pick it up.
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I assume it's Gareth?
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Yes, Gareth. I don’t have a contact but I’m sure someone on here can put you in touch. Would be great if you can use your tech skillz to bring it back from the dead.
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I’ve been in touch with Gareth on a few occasions previously but it’s never got anywhere but if anyone else’s manages to make any inroads into taking it on I’d be happy to support it.
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Good to see the site seems to be back up and running! :clap2:
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Just came on to post the same!
Thanks to Gareth, or whoever has taken it on. Time to rejoice!
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The site is down again, does anyone know what's happening?
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So is pb.info now dead forever?
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Seems so.
Some of the content is still accessible via https://web.archive.org/