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What would be the ultimate board? (Read 17509 times)

Bonjoy

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#25 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 02:33:31 pm

 It should not have to be fun, or interesting, or quirky, or colourful, it should only serve one purpose, to improve your climbing specific skill set in the most efficient way.
Maybe is shouldn't have to be, but in reality for most people it's a crucial factor in a boards success i.e how much training benefit the user gets. Motivation to use a board can't be discounted as an irrelavance. Motivation is likely to be higher for a board which is a pleasure to use. Motivation for some people is improved by using the board as part of a group, this is contingent on people enjoying the board enough to return regularly. I'd argue that the primary reason that most peoples boards are super steep is because that's what people find most fun (plus it's good for peer group kudos/showing off), I don't believe this is anything like the most efficient angle for the majority of climbing outside, here or in Font. Seems to me like people train super steep (for the reasons mentioned above) then have to travel far affield to find things suitably steep and 'basic' to apply them on.
 

 I do like the ned/dan symetry board. It's a strong concept and it climbs well. I also used to really enjoy the 50 degree board in the school although I always thought the other boards would be more use to my climbing.

 My perfect board at the moment would be something with a floor which followed the line of the board so I could climb longish (15-20 move) up problems and never be far from the mat. I have climbed on a board like this (but maybe only 10-12 moves long) at a wall in Sydney. This would be great for power endurance routes/probs.

 Things like the skips in the Works could be amazing if more time was spent on the prob setting (not viable at a comercial wall i'm sure). Problems set with lots of possible holds but no obvious easy way (which is often how real climbing is)would train body and brain. The only reason training boards are no good for training technique is that the setting is too formulaic. There is no inhsurmountable difference between indoors and out, they are both just surfaces to climb on. Indoor probs could be made to be as technically demanding in an outdoor applicable way if designers/setters could be arsed to do so. I think the main difference with outdoor stuff is the truely random element.

Jaspersharpe

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#26 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 02:46:25 pm
I take it from the way that you're both referring to The School in the past tense that the chances of it reopening are nil and that the search for a new home has so far been unsuccessful?

Bonjoy

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#27 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 02:58:30 pm
You take it right

Dolly

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#28 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 03:48:38 pm
Quote
Surely you guys are missing the point?  Ideal board would be pretty good for training on for a couple of hours whilst listening to banging tunes, nice sofas to recline on, beer fridge / wine cooler for afters, a wine rack and one of those old fashioned ash trays with the spinny top to cover up the evidence.  And maybe a little portable mirror.  Cool

Sounds like tonight at mine apart from the sofas :) I thought we should get the fridge working for the first time, so I'll get some Belgian beer on the way home

Jaspersharpe

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#29 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 03:59:44 pm
Include some waitresses and it sounds perfect.....


nik at work

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#30 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 04:09:53 pm
Paul I don't doubt some of the problems were very good, but interest would still wane for me with yet another 50 degree problem...
I seem to have insinuated that you (and Uncle, Dylan etc) are VERY serious people who must TRAIN, and I am some happy hairy bundle of FUN FUN FUN. Thats not what I meant. As I have said I am envious of your obvious ability to train. Maybe the failing is with me in not being able to put in the (what I see as) drudge work for the gains? I would be a fool to try and extrapolate the nature of someones personality simply from their ability to indulge in training.


Anyway this is all of topic, suffice it to say the school is/was obviously a pretty good approximation of a very good hardcore training venue, and the works isn't. They both however satisfy their respective design briefs very well.

As for the limitations of the Works, I guess I'm just not good enough for these to be apparent to me.

Johnny Brown

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#31 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 04:45:12 pm
I think you are similar to me Nik, I cannot train for anything as I find it boring. And I'm not so bothered about climbing a problem with a big number to overcome that. Especially as I'd then have to go to Switzerland to climb it.

AndiT

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#32 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 04:59:26 pm
Especially as I'd then have to go to Switzerland to climb it.

Or to some limestone.

richdraws

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#33 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 05:04:27 pm
Especially as I'd then have to go to Switzerland to climb it.

What a chore :boohoo:

unclesomebody

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#34 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 05:11:32 pm
I think you are similar to me Nik, I cannot train for anything as I find it boring. And I'm not so bothered about climbing a problem with a big number to overcome that. Especially as I'd then have to go to Switzerland to climb it (like Fred Nicole, pioneer, hero, chose to do).

Ha ha. It is definitely unfortunate that the UK has a lack of hard problems, I agree with you. The boredom thing is also a salient point. Training is boring, but if it takes you to where you want to be, then I guess you put with the boredom. But if you don't want to be at the end of that path then there is certainly no point in boring yourself.

Bonjoy makes some excellent points too. Climbing is just a movement over a surface, and you could make indoor climbing just like outdoor climbing if you wanted to, but then why do this when you could go climbing outdoors? I guess for when it rains... The point about 50 degrees is true too. I think the school board is excellent but all the holds are jugs on the 50. It has many shortcomings, such as a lack of small feet, and was not a perfect board, but it wasn't intended to be a super duper training facility. It was built for modest needs and now it's become some hallowed place. I think 30/40 degree is a great angle for training too, because you can actually use really small/bad holds. Basically, I don't advocate the use of one angle only! Also, perhaps the pleasure/fun that comes from training is derived from the fact that you are progressing, not from the actual movement on the board. I don't know if you can even generalise because it's different for everyone.



Houdini

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#35 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 05:21:45 pm
I don't like flat face climbing walls, they're too basic.  I want some features to climb too because these are the lines I scope out when on a foreign mission, not arbitrary steepness.  Good artificial aretes are in short supply.

Paul B

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#36 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 05:47:09 pm
The point about 50 degrees is true too. I think the school board is excellent but all the holds are jugs on the 50. It has many shortcomings, such as a lack of small feet, and was not a perfect board, but it wasn't intended to be a super duper training facility.

Agreed, that's why the 30 and 15 complimented the 50 so well. I would have to say that the other boards especially the 15 were heavily neglected by quite a few people.
You're right about the foot holds as well, two sets of really bad screw-ons, one with edges one without would have made the board a little better.
I know you're being flipant but a lot of the holds on the board were far from jugs, basic Doyle for instance, the crux hold on that was small. I know what you're getting at thought, its unlikely that you can consistently pull on the smallest holds possible at this angle.
A symmetrical board is a nice idea allowing you to be truly balanced but I think as long as you climb problems set by various people rather than just your own problems you'll be forced to deal with any areas of weakness.
JB et al. - Are you sure that a little bit of training (maybe lockoff) wouldn't aid you in ticking something that you aspire to and hence be worth just a little bit of boredom.

Moo

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#37 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 07:49:02 pm
I think uncle has hit the nail on the head there really variation is what you need always climbing on the same angle day after day just leads to injury, plateaus boredom. I have a 40 degree board and though i think its a happy medium a 50 degree and 30  like paul b says right next to one another would be perfect (for me, remember training has to be specific to the person) i reckon the change in angle is enough to keep you interested long enough to make gains i dont mind chugging away though you've gotta look at where you want to be to stay motivated in the now.

dave

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#38 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 08:58:49 pm
The boredom thing is also a salient point. Training is boring, but if it takes you to where you want to be, then I guess you put with the boredom.

training shouldn't/needn't be boring. I never find training boring - if i did i wouldn't do it. I climb for enjoyment and that goes for indoors on winter evenings or in a cellar just as much as it does for stuff on rock. Seriously, if people find training boring then i say don't do it, life is too short to spend your free time doing something that bores you.

Fiend

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#39 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 09:03:28 pm
...except it's the path to Ticking Big Numbers... 8)

Monolith

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#40 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 09:12:37 pm
I feel a few of us were in possession of something truly excellent for a period of time.

The Den is by far my favourite training surface to have moved over. It has its own mystique and charm which I believe is truly inexplicable. A genuine wonder of the training world.

Fj

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#41 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 09:21:24 pm
whats anyones opinion of the moon board?
would it make a good home facility?

r-man

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#42 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 10:52:52 pm
What's this whole aversion to doing "boring" things anyway?

Before enlightenment, the monk chops wood and carries water.
After enlightenment, the monk chops wood and carries water.

Monks are very good climbers, by the way. Climbers could learn a lot from monks. In my ideal training facility I'd have a bucket of water, a nice sharp axe, and a pile of volumes from the works.

Paul B

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#43 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:09:15 pm
whats anyones opinion of the moon board?
would it make a good home facility?

I found a lot of the holds to be very tweaky.

Jim

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#44 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 10, 2008, 09:25:48 am
Used to a a 50 board but I prefer the new board at 40

Moo

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#45 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 10, 2008, 09:43:53 am
I've got the moon board set up i agree with paul b on the holds (twice in one thread bloody hell we're on a roll) get bleaustone holds the moon ones are not tendon friendly as my left ring finger is currently experiencing. Just started to carve out some wooden holds with a surform and a bit of sandpaper its surprisingly gratifying.

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#46 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 10, 2008, 10:58:16 am
In my ideal training facility I'd have a bucket of water, a nice sharp axe, and a pile of volumes from the works.

Is the axe to destroy the volumes?

r-man

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#47 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 10, 2008, 11:52:00 am
By Jove, I think he's got it!  :lol:

Pantontino

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#48 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 14, 2008, 03:04:22 pm
We built a big board in Clwt y Bont recently. Usual stuff: 30 degree, big 50 degree and a roof/hanging wall, plus all the other finger board stuff. Planning on a triple campus board (small edge, large edge, sloper rungs). We based it partly on The School blueprint, just bigger.



http://www.northwalesbouldering.com/gallery1.asp?galleryid=36

philo

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#49 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 16, 2008, 02:42:21 am
looks impressive. wish i had a spare barn to set a project wall up on! id prob be inclined to go down the small kickboard 50° board route tho

 

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