[Adam Lincoln]

Ok so i while back i was after wide lens for bouldering shots and such like. I ended up getting a bit of an all round lens as it was cheap, and i would have needed it anyway. I just did a body only deal when i bought my camera.

So, now i have a bit of cash, is it to be the

Tokina 12-24mm

or the

Sigma 10-20mm

I think i know which JB will recommend!

[dave smith]

The sigma is an awesome lens, not played with the Tokina though.

[dave]

they are both great lenses. I made the decision based purely on what was available second hand at the time at the right price.

[tlr]

I have the Sigma. Whilst I am not really qualified to compare the 2, I went into B&H Photo in New York to buy the Canon 10-22 and the guy in there persuaded me not to spend the extra money but to get the Sigma instead. He reckoned it was a better lens then the Canon (or others that were available) and it was cheaper as well. He didn't specifically mention the Tokina, but when I asked him which other lenses I should consider alongside the Canon he recommended the Sigma.

As an aside B&H is amazing, there are 50 staff behind the DSLR counter alone, and certainly the one I spoke to seemed to know what he was talking about. Worth a visit just for the experience even if you don't need to buy anything.

[cofe]

i like my tokina, although the focus ring is a bit stiff. JB would like to accidentally drop his off El Cap i think. And POD reckons it is the sharpest lens he owns. 

[Jim]

why are you going for 2 wide lenses out of interest?

[Johnny Brown]

Good review here

I'm not a huge fan of the Tokina though it is sharp enough. Mine has a communication fault and can't be used without squeezing the barrel at certain focal lengths. This has caused me many missed shots.

Haven't used the sigma much though build quality is superior. I wouldn't expect better resolution though, and the variable max aperture is a negative compared to the tokina. On the other hand the sigma has the HSMotor which is a plus.

Personally I find 10mm, and even 12mm too wide. Am now packing a 16-85 though so the tokina will be seeing much less use. If I could get a 13 or 14mm prime it would go in the bin.

Seeing as these don't exist though, and with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight, I should have bought the Nikon 12-24 /4 instead of the Tokina.

[dave]

I've not found the 5.6 at the long end on the sigma a problem really at least not one that would hace justifed spending twice the outlay on the nikon, although it is undoubtedly a better option if mony is no object. sigma is a lot lighter than the tokina too, which can be a plus, and easy MF override. basically its six of one and half a dozen of the other. Just don't buy a tamron 11-18, they look toss.

[Adam Lincoln]

why are you going for 2 wide lenses out of interest?

I am not going for 2?

[Jim]

though you said you had a 15mm prime?

[Adam Lincoln]

though you said you had a 15mm prime?

Ahh, i am with you. Didn't remember mentioning that.

I have a 15mm Sigma Fisheye. Doesn't give the results i was after, so going to get rid and going to go for the Nikon 10.5mm version.

As for having that and wide angle, i think the results are very different, and serve to very different purposes.

[Johnny Brown]

Have you used this?

Prices seem a lot more uniform recently though, have got excellent deals from my local shop even without having to pricematch. Have also used DigitalRev in Hong Kong though even the savings there aren't so big anymore. Worth it if you spend £600 plus though.

[Adam Lincoln]

Have you used this?

Prices seem a lot more uniform recently though, have got excellent deals from my local shop even without having to pricematch. Have also used DigitalRev in Hong Kong though even the savings there aren't so big anymore. Worth it if you spend £600 plus though.

Yeah prices are ok.... If you dont mind the wait, getting them from Honk Kong is def a little cheaper.

[SA Chris]

In the mix, just got the sigma 12-24. Nice solid built lens, quite heavy though. Yet to use in anger (will do tomorrow - wedding photographer!).

[Adam Lincoln]

quite heavy though

People complain about the weight of Sigmas. I quite like it.

[dave]

RE buying shit from honkers - be careful with warranties etc. For example Nikon UK only honour warranties for european stock (i.e. buying from france is fine, but not asia or USA) - so if you buy owt from honkers or the yanks you've got to send it back there to get it fixed under warranty, and in some cases this will cost a lot more than seding it to surrey. other manufacturers may offer worldwide warranties etc though, so make sure you check thougherly.

[slackline]

I foolishly bought a Nikon 18-200mm VR lens from Digital Rev as it was some £150 cheaper.

Big mistake, lots of hassle.  Sent by UPS who used some shoddy local dispatcher at this end who left it at the wrong entrance of the Hallamshire, and completely failed to collect Import Duty.  Lots of hassle getting Import Duty refunded (advertised in the items sale so fully expected to get it, and didn't mind paying Import Duty on delivery) as they tried to make it to my PayPal account which they didn't even have details of as I'd paid by bank transfer to their UK account.  Lots of bullshit from them about how it would take five days to transfer the money to my bank account (after waiting 10 days!).

Lens had worldwide 1 year warranty information slip, but no warranty card.  Contacted them and the warranty was provided (for seven years) by a third party US company Mack Cameras.  DigitalRev promised to send out the warranty card which then arrived 11 days later.  This is now some 36days since receiving the lens, and guess what, Mack Cameras indicate that warranties have to be registered within 30 days!!!  Contacted Mack and they said they would honour it so hopefully all good (haven't had to try it yet, hopefully won't have to as I don't want to fork out for shipping to the US).

DigitalRev were worse than useless though.  Couldn't answer the questions I asked, and just regurgitated the same script ad nauseum, very poor customer service.  Would avoid DigitalRev at all costs more hassle than it was worth, although I'm sure others will have had better experiences.

[Adam Lincoln]

From what i've read, avoid electronicskings also.

HKSupplies seems good, used them before.

[Johnny Brown]

the sigma 12-24 is big and heavy as its designed for 35mm frame. The other lenses aren't usable on 35mm, at the wide end anyway, but are much more compact.

[SA Chris]

the sigma 12-24 is big and heavy as its designed for 35mm frame. The other lenses aren't usable on 35mm

Indeed. Why i plugged for it. Still hanging onto slide for occasional use.

[Andy_P]

Have you considered the Tokina 11-16mm (f2.?  I have heard that it is an excellent lens, if a little limited in range.

[Johnny Brown]

f2.8 - always nice. Ken Rockwell loves it, it looks like a nice option if you don't need the long end of the zoom. The body, and I daresay the build quality, looks identical to the 12-24.

[Oli]

I'm going through a similar process to Adam now, wanting a wider lens. So, has anything changed in the past year or is the sigma 10-20 still the best value for money? I don't think I can justify >£700 for the Nikon 12-24. The new Nikon 10-24 looks quite good, but is also quite a few £££...

Also, are lenses cheaper in Canada and the States as I'm out there in August.

[dave]

if i were buying one now, it'd probably still be a tossup between the sigma 10-20 or the tokina 12-24. If i wanted to spend a bit more cheddar without spending nikon money it'd be the tokina 11-16mm no questions aksed, looks awesome fucking welles.

the other option is the nikon 16-85mm, they're starting to appear on the second hand market now at £350ish. would be wide enough for most stuff no problem.

[Oli]

Cheers Dave, I'll have a look into the Tokina but the Sigma's got good reviews so I'll probably go for that.

I've got the 18-70 kit lens at the moment, so a 16-85 wouldn't really be much wider.

[dave]

the sigma is a good lens, I've got one. their quality control occaisionally dishes out the odd lemon by all accounts, so check you get a decent one.

[SA Chris]

Also, are lenses cheaper in Canada and the States as I'm out there in August.

Depends whay happens with the RoE between now and then. Could save yourself a fair bit if cash. Downside is that if you want one for the trip you will need to do the shopping first. I had this plan when we went to Vegas and Red Rocks a couple of years ago. Spent first day trying to negotiate traffic looking for camera shops, only to find that most of them were less than useless. So research thoroughly before hand.

[cofe]

just seen this. having used both, i'd recommend the tokina.

[Huffy]

Heard nothing but good about the 12-24 elsewhere.

bit of a budget option perhaps but I am shooting (and getting nice results) with Sigma 17-70mm. f2.8/macro/telephoto.

nice one

[slackline]

Where's a good place for getting the cheapest price on lenses, either new or second hand?

I know there's CamerPriceBuster for comparisons (although annoyingly they don't have a list for Nikon fit Simga lenses)

Other places I keep an eye on are...

Fleabay
London Camera Exchange
MPB Photographic
FilterFantastic
Harrisons

Hit me with your top places for buying lenses (I've finally saved enough to splash out on a Sigma 10-20mm and want to get one before I go on one of the Dragon Balloon Rides that my wife got me as a birthday present  , can't make up my mind whether to go over Sheffield or the Peak District  )

[cofe]

MXV
Ffordes

[dave]

peterwalnes
Mifsuds
Aperture
Grays
Camtech

[SteG]

possibly slightly off topic so apologies in advance...

the gf is selling a sigma 10-20mm (nikon fit) and wondered if anyone was looking for one atm? She bought it new and has hardly used it so wants rid.

ste.

[cofe]

slackline is after one - see above. Perhaps PM him.

[slackline]

 

[Adam Lincoln]

Ok, as for the Tokina 12-24 f4, anyone got it and found light a problem with it? (Please no jokes about my pics being dark!)

[Johnny Brown]

What do you mean?

I've got one that has a fault linked to the zoom. At certain focal lengths the displayed aperture is f1, and when you take a picture, it doesn't stop down. It you were trying to use an aperture other than f4 that means underexposure in auto, overexposure in manual.

[Adam Lincoln]

What do you mean?

I've got one that has a fault linked to the zoom. At certain focal lengths the displayed aperture is f1, and when you take a picture, it doesn't stop down. It you were trying to use an aperture other than f4 that means underexposure in auto, overexposure in manual.

That was what i had heard. It is ebay i am looking at getting it, and a few problems like this have been noted.

[Johnny Brown]

Mine is a clear fault, if you get one like that it should be easy to return it for a refund.

It did it from the start, and every time. Worse in the cold, can get rid of it by squeezing the zoom barrel, but its a massive pain. Optically its very good.

[slackline]

possibly slightly off topic so apologies in advance...

the gf is selling a sigma 10-20mm (nikon fit) and wondered if anyone was looking for one atm? She bought it new and has hardly used it so wants rid.

ste.

Forgot about this.  Got said lens from SteG, all very well packaged and delivered at a very reasonable price.  Absolutely love the lens, really good (shame I dropped it on the beach at Applecross taking sunset shots, mainly due to having drunk 2/3rd of a bottle of gin with my mate, but fortunately it survived, minus lens cap which was a minor irritation).

[cofe]

my tokina is excellent.

[Adam Lincoln]

Anyone used the 11-16 2.8 tokina yet?

[cofe]

no, but i also have the 10-17 fish which is also excellent. personally, i think the 16mm would be too short on the 11-16.

[Fj]

I've just got hold of a 10.5 fish which oddly enough is really wide and is making some interesting bouldering shots.

[Adam Lincoln]

I've just got hold of a 10.5 fish which oddly enough is really wide and is making some interesting bouldering shots.

I use the 10.5 fish a lot, but for climbing shots you really need to be inches away for a decent look.

[Johnny Brown]

Wouls really like a 10.5, but can't afford it at the mo. Borrowed one briefly and was blown away by the sharpness,

Composing well with ultra-wides isn't easy. Most of the shots I see would benefit from a tighter composition with a less extreme wide, but they instead it's usually rack out to 11 and bung everything in.

[cofe]

Composing well with ultra-wides isn't easy. Most of the shots I see would benefit from a tighter composition with a less extreme wide, but they instead it's usually rack out to 11 and bung everything in.

v. good point. i actually find the fish isn't great for climbing stuff.

[Fj]

yeah, I'm not sure if I'll be keeping it. The intention was to use it for biking shots, but I'd have to get it far to close to the rider to get the shots I want.

[Johnny Brown]

If you want to sell it let me know, assuming its the Nikon one.

[Fj]

will do.

[Jim]

What do you mean?

I've got one that has a fault linked to the zoom. At certain focal lengths the displayed aperture is f1, and when you take a picture, it doesn't stop down. It you were trying to use an aperture other than f4 that means underexposure in auto, overexposure in manual.

wasn't that because you dropped it tho or am I thinking of something else?

I've got a tamron 17-50 2.8 straight through which is pretty wide and a good allrounder

[Johnny Brown]

No, it was fucked when I got it, but as the first thing I did with it was take it big-walling I never returned it. That was a mistake. Proper wide starts at 16 word.

[Tris]

Anyone used the 11-16 2.8 tokina yet?

Yeah - I've got it, had a few minor niggles to start with. Had to use the focus fine tuning on my camera as the focus was slightly out on my body which a bit of a pain to get right. Apart from that it's super sharp now... great lens, it is frickin heavy though

[dave]

No, it was fucked when I got it, but as the first thing I did with it was take it big-walling I never returned it. That was a mistake. Proper wide starts at 16 word.

You went big walling for longer than the 6 years that the sale of goods act covers you for this type of problem? Must have been a long route.