[etjoset]

I spent a day or two on this about 5 years ago and got quite close. I know it's lost holds on at least one and possibly two occasions since then. Has anyone here done it in its current state and, if so, what might the current sport grade be and how hard/desperate is the crux past the first bolt?

[Houdini]

Nothing to add other than:  Best route name ever! 

[Paul B]

I spent a day or two on this about 5 years ago and got quite close. I know it's lost holds on at least one and possibly two occasions since then. Has anyone here done it in its current state and, if so, what might the current sport grade be and how hard/desperate is the crux past the first bolt?

I don't know if its lost any more holds (i'd doubt it as it was pretty thin at the time) but I did it the summer before last. The route is far from consistent because of the loss of holds and just generally grim. There are definately better routes, even at Rubicon. 8a seems fair to me, seems Smitton agrees over on 8a.nu....The top was pretty dusty/dirty as well.

Newman had to take a two week break after trying this with me as his fingers wouldn't stop aching  

[robertostallioni]

Did it more than 5 years ago at 7c+ and remember sharing a fag packet sized flat edge???? Then heard it had lost this hold and reported to be 8b! I knew the route so thought I'll have a bit of that! Did it again sharing scarred matchstick crimp?? a la the sissy, at 8a/8a+ I thought, but these short arsed routes are always difficult to grade.

[etjoset]

Thanks for the information. I think I'll give it a swerve and save myself a lot of heartache in the process.

[fatboySlimfast]

[SA Chris]

Which I think in turn may originate from

Abou Ben Adhem

Abou Ben Adhem (may his tribe increase!)
Awoke one night from a deep dream of peace,
And saw, within the moonlight in his room,
Making it rich, and like a lily in bloom,
An Angel writing in a book of gold:

Exceeding peace had made Ben Adhem bold,
And to the Presence in the room he said,
"What writest thou?" The Vision raised its head,
And with a look made of all sweet accord
Answered, "The names of those who love the Lord."

"And is mine one?" said Abou. "Nay, not so,"
Replied the Angel. Abou spoke more low,
But cheerily still; and said, "I pray thee, then,
Write me as one who loves his fellow men."

The Angel wrote, and vanished. The next night
It came again with a great wakening light,
And shoed the names whom love of God had blessed,
And, lo! Ben Adhem's name led all the rest!

Leigh Hunt (1784-1859)

[Paul B]

Did it more than 5 years ago at 7c+ and remember sharing a fag packet sized flat edge???? Then heard it had lost this hold and reported to be 8b! I knew the route so thought I'll have a bit of that! Did it again sharing scarred matchstick crimp?? a la the sissy, at 8a/8a+ I thought, but these short arsed routes are always difficult to grade.

The hold is significantly smaller than the sissy, i think its pretty comparable to Dangerous Bro's (quite easy for its grade given the height) it's definitely not hard enough to warrant a plus.

[Doylo]

Yeah its a bit nasty now the holds gone, very small crimp in its place. Has been done since by smit (and others i'm sure). I'd imagine its now a solid 8a cos it was a spicey 7c+ when i did it. Would disagree about Dangerous Brothers being soft. Its a crimp Paul 

[Paul B]

Yeah I've considered that comment in my head and the comparison I was thinking of was Pump up the power, got a little mixed up with the grades. Ok, so LTTI 8a, DB 8a. Dangerous Brothers is nice climbing as well...

[Shy Ted]

you're right, the crimp is much smaller than the sissy.  i went again doing a massive span, almost full body length, to the good hold higher up.  didn't even consider matching, seemed impossible

[Doylo]

seemed impossible

nothings impossible for you!!!

[cowboyhat]

Thanks for the information. I think I'll give it a swerve and save myself a lot of heartache in the process.

On the contrary, get involved. Its a good introduction to the shorter crimpier routes in Millers dale. Sure there are better routes but they are harder and you've got to start somewhere.

[Johnny Brown]

Does that go for me too? I had teenage designs on this route based purely on the name. Haven't been on it though, though I have failed to do the crux of the sissy. Should I bother even going?

[Nigel]

You might as well get on it, you'll be there anyway to finish off Caviar so why not?

[Bonjoy]

I'd say LTTI is now quite unpleasant for all but crimp loving feather weights. At Rubicon Dangerous Brothers looks better (less gnarly) and easier. Hot Fun Closing is nicer and probably easier than the Sissy IMO, but I find The Sissy very hard and have never done. You'd piss Salar, if you fancy a giveaway 8a at Rubicon. I could point you at various other bouldery sport routes you might like (mostly elsewhere).

[cowboyhat]

Maybe stick with Caviar. If only to say that you skipped 8a and moved directly on to 8a+.

But also because its a lot better.

[davej]

whats salar like ??? did tribe many moons ago when it was easy.

[dave]

salar is like some 5c climbing, make a clip on the steep bit, into a V5 slap, few 5b moves to finish. have not done it but was on it a few years ago and the moves ain't hard at all compared to any other 8a i've been on (rattle&hump, chimes start etc. sissy is leagues harder.). can never find anyone of the peeps psyched to crush it - you mad for it JB?

[Johnny Brown]

I can't do the crux move on Salar at all, and I don't find the moves into it easy either. No chance.

[Doylo]

Salars piss for 8a. Dangerous is solid. Sissy is solid. I'd say Hot Fun is the hardest of them all.

[davej]

thanks for the info dave. Will give salar ago in the next few weeks.

[Bonjoy]

I think you (JB) might like the weirdness of Weedkiller (the route not the boulder prob). A lot of sport climbers don't like it and find it hard at 7c+, but it's fine if you're used to using your brain as much as your fingers. No hard pulls/small holds on it. Well there is one small shit undercut in the roof on it but if you get your weight in you barely have to pull on it.

[Paul B]

Salars piss for 8a. Dangerous is solid. Sissy is solid. I'd say Hot Fun is the hardest of them all.

WARNING: advice from a lanky b*astard!!!

For those who end up pulling instead of jumping its not easy.

[andy popp]

I'd second Bonjoy, I really enjoyed Weedkiller. I've mentioned it before but I'd also recommend The Vision at 7c+ - so long as its ever been rebolted (should be if it hasn't). At a lowergrade, Belladonna (a Welford route somewhere right of WCJ Cornice) is another nice short bouldery thing.

[Doylo]

Salars piss for 8a. Dangerous is solid. Sissy is solid. I'd say Hot Fun is the hardest of them all.

WARNING: advice from a lanky b*astard!!!

For those who end up pulling instead of jumping its not easy.

i locked it off (look at me)

[Nigel]

Salars piss for 8a. Dangerous is solid. Sissy is solid. I'd say Hot Fun is the hardest of them all.

WARNING: advice from a lanky b*astard!!!

For those who end up pulling instead of jumping its not easy.

i locked it off (look at me)

Ouch! Touche Paul, touche.

I can't do the crux move on Salar at all, and I don't find the moves into it easy either. No chance.

Adam, this is either a pathetic effort (in which case man up) or one of your patented attempts to look weak but talented, when in fact you're strong and talented. For Christ's sake I saw you burn off none other KEITH 8B-RADBURY at Rubicon on several problems that involved big moves off small holds. DO NOT BELIEVE THIS MAN! He is a limestone beast!

[Bonjoy]

True. Fact:- Limestone is made up of the fossil remains of tiny prehistoric proto-Long's.

[Paul B]

Salars piss for 8a. Dangerous is solid. Sissy is solid. I'd say Hot Fun is the hardest of them all.

WARNING: advice from a lanky b*astard!!!

For those who end up pulling instead of jumping its not easy.

i locked it off (look at me)

Well thats me told  ....

[Shy Ted]

Salars piss for 8a. Dangerous is solid. Sissy is solid. I'd say Hot Fun is the hardest of them all.

I agree with Chris 100%.  Salar is a piece of.  Dangerous is pretty nails.  Sissy is nails-er.  Hot Bum Fun is very difficult, Font 7a+ (my sweaty undies! - one of the hardest problems at Rubicon) into a tricky upper headwall on trad, with potential to maim yourself in the tree if you fall off (which I did)

[Paul B]

Dangerous is pretty nails.  Sissy is nails-er.  Hot Bum Fun is very difficult, Font 7a+ (my sweaty undies! - one of the hardest problems at Rubicon)

My left-testical, they're not nails for the grade they're just short and fierce.

[Kingy]

Did LTTI last night, I think its up to 8a but no more. The crux move is now about Font 7b I thought, going again for the big glued edge from the scar with RH (where the hold that's fallen off used to be) with LH on a crimp by your waist. RF in break. Only 2 moves into the crux and the top bit is cool but not desparate.

[Jaspersharpe]

Bloody hell Ted, you are a ticking machine! These 8a/8a+ routes are obviously too easy for you. Get on something hard.

[dobbin]

Good effort Ted Vegas!

With your right hand on the good hold, did you finger change it or did you so something else to get your left to it?

[Kingy]

Cheers Dobbin!

After sticking the big glued edge with the RH (the good hold you refer to I think) I made the clip. Then without matching go with LH to small triangular edge up left, only room for 2 tips with thumb on top or 3 stacked. RF way out right on low 'sticking out' edge. LF moves right onto slopey shelf. RH up to small sharp crimp. LF moves up and right again onto low edge with loads of rubber on it just up and right of break. LH up to better crimp - bit of a 'goey' move - pull hard on RH small crimp! Feet are very low at this point and I was a bit stretched out but it was the easiest way I could work out. Then LF up onto glued edge and you're into decent holds again.

[AndiT]

So, are Salar and Tribe both 8a? What's the consensus? I'd heard that Salar was considered 7c+  and Tribe was 8a+ 

[Paul B]

So, are Salar and Tribe both 8a? What's the consensus? I'd heard that Salar was considered 7c+  and Tribe was 8a+ 

Tribe's isn't 8a+ it's just a grim 8a
Salar isn't 7C+ its regarded as soft by many people but still as 8a, personally I found it quite tricky.

[dobbin]

I would agree with that. Tribes is hard for, but still 8a. And Salar is low in the same grade.

[corniceman]

I think the routes on Tonys buttress/majorca buttress are really good and of the rubicon/Raventor bouldery crimpy ilk. Does any one ever go there now?

[dave]

i've been going to have a look but not mustered the interest yet. main worry is that they'll all be dirty as fuck, and/or all mono horrorshows.

[Bonjoy]

I think it's a naturally clean bit of rock, so should be ok. The hardest route has a sick mono move, not sure about the rest. harris went not so long back and might know more

[corniceman]

Funny you suggest all mono horrors as my memory is infact that most routes have some kind of mono on them. However i thought the 8a+ agent provocateur was a top route offering sustained climbing on edges with a mono/side pull move at the top to the finnishing jug. As I remember the mono was a 'kind' mono.

The 8b I dont think has yet been repeated but I could be wrong. I worked it extensively but the crux for me was not holding the mono but using the piss little undercut out left to reach it (easier for the tall) After the mono it was 7b to the top. Again a good route. The horror though is the 8a to the left. this has a genuinely hard sequence and I think must be undergraded. It again is a good route but needs grade confirming. The 7c+ to the right of AP is also good.
The girdle 8a? well who knows!