[GCW]

So campusing won't help you on a campus style problem that's 7c/+?

I see your point, but if used correctly a campus board is a valuable part of a training scheme.

[carefultorque]

Campussing is for people who want to boulderer campus-style problems of 8A and above.  It's not nesessary for easier-ish problems.

Not necessary, maybe. 

But surely, as part of a wider training regime, any complex neuro-muscular task that taxes your tendons, produces a maximal effort and recruits the climbing muscles can't do any harm, even if you're never realistically going to hit 8a?   One of the things that's come out of this thread is the degree of proprioception that you need to campus properly.  That's something you need in buckets if you want to hit the grown-up stuff.

For those who have limited access to the real stuff, mixing up training regimes & revisiting old methods with better technique can be satisfying in its own right and this produces a feeling of well being that enhances further training.

[Jim]

So what your saying is you want to train to become better at campusing?

[carefultorque]

So what your saying is you want to train to become better at campusing?

That's one way of putting it.  What I'm saying is, there's a limited bunch of things you can do inside to get stronger.  One of them is campusing.  I hit a ceiling with my previous methods and now understand why.
I'll enjoy busting out of that ceiling because who doesn't?  And that's going to give me an effective training tool to add to the mix of things that can be done indoors.

[Jenn]

So what your saying is you want to train to become better at campusing?

That's one way of putting it.  What I'm saying is, there's a limited bunch of things you can do inside to get stronger.  One of them is campusing.  I hit a ceiling with my previous methods and now understand why.
I'll enjoy busting out of that ceiling because who doesn't?  And that's going to give me an effective training tool to add to the mix of things that can be done indoors.

Agreed. I reached a plateau around V4 (very sad, I know) and spent about a month campusing once a week. I noticed a huge improvement and it wasn't just necessarily strength gains - I think a large part of it was confidence. Then I got injured - rotator cuff, not surprisingly, however this happened when I had been away from campusing for a quite a while, but I suspect it had something to do with it.

[carefultorque]

Loving the hatching reptile thing, Jenn.  Did you fix your rotator cuff?

[athletikspesifik]

Why? Ok so it loads the pulleys but so does crimping, slapping for crimps and pulling hard on crimps. If you're going to say stuff like that then you might as well just write off crimping full stop. I think there's some "Dave Mc Science" that says training one grip type does not train the other, I know rich thought otherwise.

People being scared of crimping is daft.

I think that if it's training time and not sending time, it's best to keep it safer.  From your statement, it looks like you concur to some degree.  I would agree that the open hand is not as forceful as the full crimp, but, IMO if you train yourself to GENERALLY use the open grip then use the full version sparingly then, it gives some degree of safety.

A girl who works for me is getting close to finishing her sport science degree...she brought in a hand dynamometer just for fun.  We informally tested ~20 climbers: males (high 40-mid 70 Kg) females (mid 30-mid 50 Kg).  According to Tufts Uni Avg male is ~mid 30 Avg female ~high teens low 20 Kg.  My girl said that her class consisted of general athletes; females ~mid 20s, males low 40s.  My point is that, even though the hand dynamometer is probably the farthest hold type away from climbing reality, there still seems to be some general carry over.  Strong hands=strong hands, and while everyone is going to have some perception of being shite on some aspect of holds, a strong handed climber is still going to hold their shittiest version of a hold better than a weaker climber given equal abilities/anthropomorphic features.

Given a best case scenario, where the climber has access to everything - the campus board is a tool to improve gross pulling power (starting strength and explosive strength), intermuscular coordination for laddering and contact strength at speed.  We all know that there are many other aspects to performance improvement, but, campusing is one aspect that, IMO, helps performance.

Some people are gifted athletes for a particular sport.  I have seen several (started as children - so, it's relative to say they were gifted) who were gifted climbers, they fucked around with 1 arms, but no serious training and climbed 8A.  But everyone plateau's, and not everyone is fine with that - so they want to push themselves and analyze all aspects of performance.  For those that are fine with the level they are at - cool.

[Jenn]

Loving the hatching reptile thing, Jenn.  Did you fix your rotator cuff?

Cheers. It's a Komodo Dragon. 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_6290000/newsid_6295100/6295193.stm?bw=bb&mp=wm&news=1&nol_storyid=6295193&bbcws=1

8 weeks into physio treatment now. I've had some improvement (I no longer live in fear of picking up the kettle), but I think it's going to be a while before I'm 100% and I think it will always be a weak spot for me.

[carefultorque]

Good to hear some improvement.  Must have been horrific to cause pain doing everyday things like kettle manipulation!  Eeek.  Hope it mends okay.


Komodo dragon! Ah yes, the poisonous ones that can fell a deer.  Shame we can't breed 'em up and turn' em loose on the dangerous dogs that we get in these parts.

[xelaxela]

for more of a full training session id reccomend these babys

http://www.rockrun.com/products-Rock-Rings_CL-TB-ROCR.htm

i think they make pull-ups more relational to climbing than just a simple pull-up bar, espcially if you do the workout that comes with them. they seem to have worked for me

[Paul B]

for more of a full training session id reccomend these babys

http://www.rockrun.com/products-Rock-Rings_CL-TB-ROCR.htm

i think they make pull-ups more relational to climbing than just a simple pull-up bar, espcially if you do the workout that comes with them. they seem to have worked for me

A bit gimmicky?

[carefultorque]

for more of a full training session id reccomend these babys

http://www.rockrun.com/products-Rock-Rings_CL-TB-ROCR.htm

i think they make pull-ups more relational to climbing than just a simple pull-up bar, especially if you do the workout that comes with them. they seem to have worked for me

thanks for the tip.  they have a couple of these in one of the walls I use and I've been doing L-sits with my fingers in the bottom rung.  haven't done any kind of pull ups anywhere to date, recently, so if I start, using any device from a bar to a sloper, I'll show an improvement in that area.

I've seen a exceptionally well known elite climber using them for a warm down and also (once) to do muscle-ups (ending with arm locked out at the top from a pull up.)  Not many folk can do these!

[saltbeef]

I've seen a exceptionally well known elite climber using them for a warm down and also (once) to do muscle-ups (ending with arm locked out at the top from a pull up.)  Not many folk can do these!

yes they can.

[Paul B]

what he said

[richdraws]

I am spartacus.

[Jaspersharpe]

A bit gimmicky?

Too right.

All you need is a wooden edge and hard fucking work for God's sake. It is not complicated. Scrap evertything else and read Uncle's post on the first page of this thread. Then read it again. Then do what it says. The only barrier to getting strong is a lack of commitment to the cause as it is not fun. Trying to find enjoyable and interesting ways to train is a cop out which most of us take. The path to true power and maximising your abilities is one of drudgery and mental strength and if you wish to take it then the rewards will come. But it's a hard path to start down and an even harder one to stick to.

Inspiring thread by the way. For someone with 8A finger strength but 7A arm strength it's helped hammer home the message that I need to bite the bullet and do some hard work.

[i.munro]

Hi Jas

Seems a bit odd to be offering you advice given our relative abilities but if arm strength is really the issue you think have you considered gym work?
Seem to have sorted my scrawny arms that way. Just a shame that all this did was show me they wern't the problem, or at least not all of it.

[carefultorque]

I've seen a exceptionally well known elite climber using them for a warm down and also (once) to do muscle-ups (ending with arm locked out at the top from a pull up.)  Not many folk can do these!

yes they can.

yeah yeah.  like I said.

(Unless you count going from a starting position with the things at chin height, or something lower.  I don't.  I mean when the the starting position is from a totally straight arm, preferably higher than possible from a standing start.)

[carefultorque]

All you need is a wooden edge and hard fucking work for God's sake. It is not complicated ... The path to true power and maximising your abilities is one of drudgery and mental strength and if you wish to take it then the rewards will come. But it's a hard path to start down and an even harder one to stick to.

Very wise words indeed.  I'm enjoying this thread so I don't want that to be the conclusion. 

But it's hard to top that.

[Paul B]

I've seen a exceptionally well known elite climber using them for a warm down and also (once) to do muscle-ups (ending with arm locked out at the top from a pull up.)  Not many folk can do these!

yes they can.

yeah yeah.  like I said.

(Unless you count going from a starting position with the things at chin height, or something lower.  I don't.  I mean when the the starting position is from a totally straight arm, preferably higher than possible from a standing start.)

Jeez he means from so low down that you have to rotate your false grip so that your palms are facing out to either side. Its as low as you can go without go-go gadget stretching arms. Saltbeef, Dobbin, Monkey Boy etc. all crush Muscle Ups for breakfast.

[carefultorque]

Jeez he means from so low down that you have to rotate your false grip so that your palms are facing out to either side. Its as low as you can go without go-go gadget stretching arms. Saltbeef, Dobbin, Monkey Boy etc. all crush Muscle Ups for breakfast.

'Crush muscle ups for breakfast! ' I will hunt them down and tear their arms off.  Freckin' gymnastic bastards.

Actually, sad as it sounds, I only heard about muscle-ups them earlier this week.  That's another thing I'm adding to my rest-day supplementary exercises as I reckon they look quite handy.  shame about the name.  it sounds a bit sad, but the exercise looks pretty killer for manteling out.

[a dense loner]

are you planning on topping out via 2 ring shaped objects? if not muscle ups are totally pointless. if you're going to do something do pull ups and dips

[carefultorque]

are you planning on topping out via 2 ring shaped objects? if not muscle ups are totally pointless. if you're going to do something do pull ups and dips

dips i guess.

[richdraws]

I just tried a muscle up on my bar. I cant tell if its easier or harder than rings. 

mebbe I should go and have a beer and get off the web....

[The Sausage]

even i've done a muscle up. and i'm basically made of spaghetti. like many things, there's a lot of technique in there. my eyes nearly popped out of my head though.