[SA Chris]

For a (pre) teen, definitely get one with a disk drive: his friends will be able to bring their games over and he’ll have access to pre-owned games on eBay etc that will be much cheaper than even discounted versions on the official e-store.

I'd not considered second hand games  as part of this conundrum. Cheers.

My son is of the same age, and loves being able to go into Game or dodgy C-EX shop with pocket money and buy a physical disc from the second hand shelf (I think FIFA 18 was 20p!) and to be be able to put it in and play it without waiting for long downloads etc. We have a Gamepass too (present from gamer uncle) but he only dips in occasionally and apart from Forza, Halo and a few exceptions, a lot of the games on it are pretty old, but still worth it if you grab one of the deals that come up.   

[Stuart Anderson]

For a (pre) teen, definitely get one with a disk drive: his friends will be able to bring their games over and he’ll have access to pre-owned games on eBay etc that will be much cheaper than even discounted versions on the official e-store.

I'd not considered second hand games  as part of this conundrum. Cheers.

My son is of the same age, and loves being able to go into Game or dodgy C-EX shop with pocket money and buy a physical disc from the second hand shelf (I think FIFA 18 was 20p!) and to be be able to put it in and play it without waiting for long downloads etc. We have a Gamepass too (present from gamer uncle) but he only dips in occasionally and apart from Forza, Halo and a few exceptions, a lot of the games on it are pretty old, but still worth it if you grab one of the deals that come up.

 

[T Loughlin]

It's definitely hard to find the balance between ruining the surprise and getting it right! I ended up just having a big chat with my son about what he wanted the device for in the end but I appreciate this isn't for everyone - he likes the anticipation more than the surprise.

Re: the second hand market, I used to be well into going into cex and getting second hand games, but as the number of physical disks sold has decreased and the gamepass has strengthened its library I'd say (for me) the balance has definitely swung away from physical copies now. Here's the gamepass library: https://www.xbox.com/en-GB/xbox-game-pass/games - it's huge, and not all old games at all. As MS hoover up developers they're increasingly released on gamepass at the same time as the retail market. It also means you can try out games you wouldn't normally play and then either love them and play them through or get rid. I think it's remarkable value, but I have kept my old Xbox one for playing 360 games on disk I still love (Knights of the Old Republic I and II, Jade Empire and the 500+ hours on Oblivion = irreplaceable).

[SA Chris]

We've still hung on to our 360 with Kinect as my daughter and her mates still play Kinect Adventures, Just Dance and Dance Central. She's never been bothered with controller type games and while it's not perfect, I think it's a great interface and a shame it never really took off.

Plus I can still beat her at Dance Central, whereas my son beats me at most games (although i can still hold my own with Sonic All Star Racing).

[T Loughlin]

While I'm here I might as well shout out to the OP on the games that I'm playing at the moment. All gamepass - wouldn't have played these otherwise probably.

Citizen Sleeper - this totally sucked me in with the outstanding narrative, the sci fi setting and the table top card playing/ timer design. The aesthetics and soundtrack are spot on. Although on a second playthrough I found that there's less choice than it initially appears I don't think this detracts from the game, just make sure to enjoy the first playthrough as I think it's about getting emotionally involved.

Pentiment - another narrative style game, this time an early 1500s Holy Roman Empire murder mystery. Art direction and characterisation are excellent, very funny dialogue options and there is more replayability with this one I reckon. Get ready to read a lot mind! Never thought I'd care so much about the interpersonal politics of a monastery during the Reformation...

Death Loop - I really rate Dishonored and Dishonored 2 (despite the annoying spelling) as sort-of successor to Thief. Death Loop is by the same developer, but I have to say I'm a bit disappointed. Only a few hours in and I like the Clockwork Orange style 60s dystopia vibe and can see where they're going with the loop game design, but the AI are weak/ stupid and the whole vibe of the game feels off: is it a tightly designed shooter (like Half Life), stealth, or open world game? It seems to want to do all three but ends up being very average, with little structure to the fight settings, but also little actual choice in approach and a wonky stealth mechanic. Shoot at people, hide round a corner and wait for them to walk to you and blow them away one by one. Rinse and repeat. Average at best so far.

[T Loughlin]

We've still hung on to our 360 with Kinect as my daughter and her mates still play Kinect Adventures, Just Dance and Dance Central. She's never been bothered with controller type games and while it's not perfect, I think it's a great interface and a shame it never really took off.

Plus I can still beat her at Dance Central, whereas my son beats me at most games (although i can still hold my own with Sonic All Star Racing).

Xbox 360 = very underrated console, the Kinect system was a hoot. The only downside was it sounding like a 747 taking off once it got hot! Totally agree that they could have pushed the tech further, I also feel the same about MS effectively closing down VR as an avenue for their consoles.

[Stuart Anderson]

Interesting range of views which are all valid and interestingly the sorts of things I've had rolling around my head when trawling through the options.

What's really annoying (the cynic trigger in me is ramped up to full on this issue) is that MS/Xbox make it difficult for a punter like me to know which of the subscriptions are actually needed! He plays Minecraft and Fortnite on Switch and, if I've interpreted it correctly, these don't require the Live/multiplayer subs to access playing online with the Xbox with his mates (whereas something like FIFA does - happy to be corrected).

Take away for me is that the digital downloaders aren't shouting out that it's a dog and to be avoided at all cost; though the aspect of a physical disk isn't without its value too.

Cheers all.

[deacon]

I've had the X since release day and although it takes discs I've never bought one. Basically if you buy games as soon as they come out you can save a tenner by buying a physical copy from a supermarket. If you're prepared to wait for the digital edition to have a  sale on the Microsoft store it'll be cheaper there.
Also the gamepass is absolutely brilliant. Tonnes and tonnes of great quality games all included.

[Stuart Anderson]

Thanks deacon.

[ducko]

Plague tale requiem. Over and out.

[slab_happy]

What kind of games do you think you'd like? There are a lot of games that don't require reflexes but are very different from each other.

Some games I've enjoyed recently that might fit:

Baba is You - puzzle game about changing the rules by moving words. Weird and tricky but very cool.
Creaks - really cool art style with nice puzzles, really enjoyed this one.
Roki - kind of a little bit puzzley but nothing that taxing. Just a nice story set in Scandinavian folklore.
Slay the Spire - Excellent card building roguelite. Once you get a good run going it feels awesome. Got a bit addicted to this one.
Her Story - this was amazing! You are searching through an old database of police video clips of interviews with a woman about a missing man, trying to work out what happened. I don't want to say anymore since anything extra is potentially a spoiler. But I thought it was great. I think the guy who made it has now made a couple more similar games in the same vein if you enjoy this one.

If I think of any more I'll add them.

Well, so far I've fucking loved Disco Elysium, enjoyed and been annoyed by Kentucky Route Zero in equal measure, and have been having fun revisiting my teenage AD&D years by playing Planescape: Torment.

So: I'm into narrative and interesting characters, have no objections to walls of text, like mysteries to uncover, have a very high tolerance for weird artsy-ness, and want to feel like my choices make a difference.

In that case I really recommend her story. It’s a great mystery you uncover and the way you find it is unique to the order you search for clips.

I can’t believe I forgot these but both Papers Please and Obra Dinn are amazing. Made by the same one man developer. Cool simple art styles hides their depth. On the surface puzzle games but really much more about the narrative/themes/choices you are discovering/making.

I have Obra Dinned! Got all fates correct in the end without resorting to spoilers, so very smug (though it did take me 20 hours).

[Fiend]

Plague tale requiem. Over and out.

Good call. The first one was nice and really atmospheric.

[Fiend]

On the other end of the "3rd person game" spectrum, here's one for the geeks:

[JamieG]

I have Obra Dinned! Got all fates correct in the end without resorting to spoilers, so very smug (though it did take me 20 hours).

Fantastic. Hope you enjoyed it.

I got totally addicted to dorfromantik recently. Weird name (German I think) but very cool puzzle type game. All about placing hexagonal tiles to build a countryside scene matching biomes on each tile to adjacent tiles for high scores. Very simple idea and billed as a relaxing game but becomes weirdly engrossing and actually stressful trying to beat your high score.

[slab_happy]

Well, I spent the first five hours or so wanting to chew off a limb in aggravation at the game doing hideously unfair things like showing me a person in a drawing and then expecting me to be able to refind that person in the same drawing 30 seconds later, which is hostile to me personally.

Also my ongoing video game issue with walking through doors. Visualize the smoke trail looping its way off to a corpse somewhere else and vanishing while I'm still wedged behind a balustrade ...

(N.B. To be clear, these are issues with my brain rather than the game.)

I stuck with it mostly out of stubbornness, but then I got into the groove and ended up having a great time and feeling very pleased with myself.

[JamieG]

Yeah I can understand it is a little obtuse at first. But I really liked the underlying mystery too. Gets pretty weird.

[slab_happy]

And the initial frustration ended up feeling like part of the experience; I felt like I'd properly achieved something when I beat it!

Though I think I got an extreme version of the frustration because my brain's "interesting" qualities do make recognizing and remembering faces and names particularly challenging for me.

But I really liked the underlying mystery too. Gets pretty weird.

Yup, I was surprised by the number of tentacles involved!

[JamieG]

Ah yeah if you struggle with recognising faces that would make it extra challenging. Good effort finishing it.

[crzylgs]

Have heard good reviews of 'Project Zomboid' its a zombie survival/RPG/sandbox game. Up to 4 players can co-op online.

I haven't picked it up yet but probably will when I've got more time. A friend is really enjoying it and can imagine with a couple of friends it'll be a lot of fun

[Will Hunt]

Finished Disco Elysium last night. Absolutely amazing. So much depth, laugh-out-loud funny, can't wait to play again as a different archetype.

NSFW  spoilers:

I played a psyche archetype sober superstar communist (though I missed the meeting in the apartments as I confronted Ruby that day which triggered the tribunal).
Highlights included the roundhouse kick to Measurehead's face, building a temple to anodic dance music, the conversation with the phasmid, the autopsy, the tribunal etc etc etc

[slab_happy]

God, it's so good! Enjoy your next playthrough -- it's fascinating how much your experience of the game changes depending on your build.

[JamieG]

Well, so far I've fucking loved Disco Elysium, enjoyed and been annoyed by Kentucky Route Zero in equal measure

I have to agree with this. I loved Disco Elysium, but I just recently had to give up on Kentucky Route Zero. Just too pretentious for it's own good. I realised I only liked the art and occasional musical interludes. I had no idea what was going on, what the stakes were, why I was supposed to care about these characters. It has no sense of humour. Everything was so po-faced. Decisions didn't seem to have any influence on the story. There isn't really any gameplay to speak of. There were good moments and vignettes but overall not worth it. Played three acts and the intermission bits. No more!

[Fiend]

I've just started playing Dark Souls 2. I'm cross and grumpy already.

[slab_happy]

I gather that this is the correct and normal Soulsborne experience, so -- enjoy!

[Fiend]

Well, every fucking time I think "now I've played X hundred of hours of soulslikes over multiple games so surely this time i'll feel comfortable and at peace with it". And then....NO. Just no. I won't. It's still grim.

I think I might just be in a gaming-for-fun mood