[Nick B]

I've also got a peanut sized lump just beneath my ring finger, been there for about 3 months now. Started with just a pain in the area, then the pain went away and a lump quickly developed there. Specifically, I think training 3 finger drags on the beastmaker was the cause and I'm now avoiding this. Went to see a physio who's also a climber and he said that it shouldn't be anything to worry about unless it starts causing you a lot of pain and it might just go away with a bit of finger stretching and massaging.

[Johnny Brown]

Peanut sized sounds big. Mine are more like lentils.

[Paul B]

I've also got a peanut sized lump just beneath my ring finger, been there for about 3 months now. Started with just a pain in the area, then the pain went away and a lump quickly developed there. Specifically, I think training 3 finger drags on the beastmaker was the cause and I'm now avoiding this. Went to see a physio who's also a climber and he said that it shouldn't be anything to worry about unless it starts causing you a lot of pain and it might just go away with a bit of finger stretching and massaging.

I got a ganglion once which looked a bit like this sounds, does it move with the tendon?

[SA Chris]

Mine are more like lentils.

Green or brown? Split or whole. Where is the SCIENCE?

[Johnny Brown]

I'd say large green, but really I can't say, I can only feel one side. It could be whole, could be split, just no way of knowing.

Its no peanut though, that's for sure.

[Paul B]

Can I just ask for people that have this, is it perma sore? My LH palm (in line with little finger) has been sore for ages now. Door handles, jugs even a bar hurts it.

Do people deep friction it? Stretch? Wear a wacko jacko style orthotic glove to do exercises?

Should I bother going to see anybody or am I just going to get the same response as Timb, until I can't flatten my hand on a table its not worth it?

[Johnny Brown]

Goes through phases. I'm now pretty convinced taking vitamins aggravates it.

[Bonjoy]

Went to see a physio who's also a climber and he said that it shouldn't be anything to worry about unless it starts causing you a lot of pain and it might just go away with a bit of finger stretching and massaging.

This advice would suggest he doesn't know much about DC. I have never read of it going away with stretching and massage. On the contrary I've read that stretching and massage can have a negative effect as they stimulate inflamation. I'd suggest doing your own research before taking his (or my) advice.


I’ve had noticeable DC now for about ten years. I have it in both hands. LH will still sort of sit flat on a table, RH not a chance. Though I’ve passed this threshold for medical intervention I’m inclined to continue avoiding surgery for as long as possible, i.e. as long as the condition doesn’t have a major impact on my climbing. My reason being that ops can go wrong and even if they go well in most cases the condition re-emerges but this time with the added complication of post op scar tissue. Also the op can only be performed a limited number of times on the same site, typically twice, after that you put up with whatever happens, or in worst case scenario require amputation! Normally this isn’t too big an issue because it’s generally old men who have it done and they’re not going to be around long enough to go through more than two cycles of operation and regrowth
My cords and bumps are pretty bad but the contraction of fingers has remained ok for years. Not withstanding what I said above about stretching and massage, I think regular climbing, whilst probably being the trigger and driver of the DC also, perversely, keeps it in check. I’ve also cultivated the habit of lying on top of my bad hand when asleep, a kind of practical low faff alternative to night splinting, which may have helped.
As for pain, sometimes they hurt, sometimes intermittently, sometimes more constant, but more often than not there is no pain. New bumps hurt a fair bit while they develop, but eventually they become like painless scar tissue with tough skin on top. I hate having to slap for jugs, it can be very painful.
Climbing wise, my right hand is pretty useless for handjamming which can be frustrating and can turn familiar ‘easy’ soloes into horror shows. Flat palming on the rock is adversely affected, hence some mantels. It’s nigh on impossible to tell how much finger strength I loose as a result of the DC as it has developed over ten years, but I do think it has led to some weakening.
All in all, hardly a barrel of laughs, but not the end of the world or my climbing. There are many worse things you could be lumbered with and it is usually very very slow in it’s progress.

[dave]

I’ve also cultivated the habit of lying on top of my bad hand when asleep

You sure that definitely not so that when you wake up and punch the clown it feels like someone else is doing it?

[SA Chris]

How do you know that works Dave?

I only have one DC on my right hand, and the only time I notice any pain is when climbing on jugs that pressurise it directly. Otherwise never notice it when climbing, biking or anything else.

[Paul B]

I'd suggest doing your own research before taking his (or my) advice.

This is the problem I'm having, a lot of advice is Conflicting. I did find watching a video of the orthotic glove interesting given how its the exact opposite of what we all do a lot of in climbing.
Reading a lot, radiotherapy seems to have been very successful with halting the degeneration in a lot of people?

[Bonjoy]

Yeah, radiotherapy sounds like the only way to nip it in the bud. It’s only effective if used at an early stage, which I guess is why it isn’t often used, as few people are likely to be sufficiently pro-active at this point.

[jfw]

i think when i read about radiation treatment - i came to the conclusion that there was a risk that in inhibiting scar tissue growth, the treatment was also inhibiting repair of connective tissues, and potentially other tissues that we as climbers like (i.e. tendons).

re massage / stretching : one of the sites had some anecdotal reference to (intense) massage with rounded wood  .  this could, as jonboy says instigate further scar tissue build up (in that we assume that the condition is an over response to micro trauma), but conversely (i was going to write on the other hand but it was too puntastic) massage can be a brilliant way of breaking up scar tissue and preventing it accumulating - I know Andy Brown had surgery for finger tendon injury which involved cutting up his palm - and has no scarring having massged it pretty religiously.

if jon boy says climbing helps - can we assume that using a greater range of hand movement than the average desk jockey helps retain that range.

maybe somewhere there is a balance between stimulating scar formation and breaking it up??

[Paul B]

as another injury (nothing new here) is keeping me from climbing much I've noticed that my left hand (suspect of the duppywhatsit) doesn't hurt anywhere near as much even when doing DIY and wrestling with a screwdriver (as I did for most of the weekend).

[match]

Had surgery on my left hand late last year to repair two severed tendons and various other bits and bobs I'd severed falling on broken glass. A couple of months ago I suddenly got a lump on the palm of that hand, on my ring finger fascia, nearly 2cm long now, plus a smaller one on my little finger and some puffiness around the top of the palm. Doc diagnosed DC, said there was no link to climbing or trauma.

Reading this thread, it appears likely that there is a link to climbing, albeit annecdotal at present, but with considerable weight of annecdote. My feeling is that the DC was triggered in some way by the trauma of the hand injury and subsequent surgery, someone else mentioned they felt this could be the case earlier in the thread. I have no problems with the other palm, or the left one before my accident, so repetitive micro-trauma prob not a trigger. Plus I don't train or crank hard enough 

I occasionally take vitamin and glucosamine/chronditin supplements, but only when I remember so about once a month if I'm honest. Think I'll stop even that now. No obvious inherited link, not sure if I can discount the possible influence of alcohol, but surely a contributary factor at worst.

[Paul B]

I recently found something that said there was some (not a lot) of research indicating that DC was linked to repeated trauma (minor tears) to the palma fascia.
I think its unlikely that this can't be linked to climbing in my case and a lot of others in this thread.

I've stopped the stretches and the tenderness in the palm is a lot better day to day. It still hurts on jugs and the day after climbing. I'm still not sure if its worth seeking somebody out and discussing radiotherapy at this early stage.

[tedj234]

Very interesting thread. Particularly as I'm writing a review related to Dupuytren's Disease at the moment. The most comprehensive epidemiological study I've read so far is:

J Hand Surg Eur Vol. 2007 Aug;32(4):400-6. Epub 2007 May 25.
An assessment of the effects of exposure to vibration, smoking, alcohol and diabetes on the prevalence of Dupuytren's disease in 97,537 miners.
Burke FD, Proud G, Lawson IJ, McGeoch KL, Miles JN.

They show no significant link between vibration and DD but this is clearly not the same stress as climbing etc.

I think the climbing DD  link is interesting and worthy of further investigation as is the development of DD following trauma.

With regard to treatment, which is more related to the research I have been doing, there are a couple of things that may be of interest (some have already been mentioned earlier). Recurrence/extension is almost inevitable 10-20years following surgery, the amount of tissue removed reduces the chance of recurrence but you enter into a trade-off here with greater risks of complications. Also, in my opinion, surgery is the definitive management for the disease, there doesn't seem to be really good evidence for any other approach.

[Bonjoy]

Any study would need to take great care to ensure it was comparing apples with apples. By that I mean that the type and intensity of hand stress varies vastly between climbers due to many factors including climber weight, volume of climbing, type/intensity of climbing, even competence and the ‘style’ of climbing displayed by an individual. It would probably take a lot of thought and the help of knowledgeable climbers to devise a meaningful methodology.
Regards surgery as the definitive treatment. Don’t you think, given the recurrence rate/timeframe, which can be significantly faster especially in younger patients, that NA is a good idea as a way of delaying the need for surgery for as long as possible? After all, the complication risk of NA compared to surgery is minimal, it’s a fast cheap procedure, the recovery time is very small and although recurrence is quicker than for surgery it’s a much more repeatable process which doesn’t preclude surgery in the future. A botched op or a bad reaction to surgery could put and end to your climbing in a stroke. Also worth considering is the fact that for climbers the cosmetic outcome is of vastly less import than the functional outcome (restored range without loss of strength), which is perhaps the opposite of what joe public wants.

[Robsons]

This painful lump/callused lump seems to be in line with the ring finger and I think I'm right in saying on everyones' palms?
My dad (who climbed a lot back in the 70s and again now) has this peanut size lump under the same finger...his has hardened??

I however, seem to have something different???
I have been resting for the last week with bad elbows and two torn pulleys in the fingers (rh - second finger, lh ring finger).
Yesterday I noticed that there is a pain in my actual hand however, a bruised feeling. This morning I have looked more closely (deciding whether I can climb today or just belay the ol' man) and see that when I close my index finger, a lump appears on the BACK of my hand?? (2/3 of the way down)
It is painful to touch and to clench a fist???
HELP??!

 

[slackline]

NHS Direct

Sounds like injury rather than Dupuytren's.  As it hurts go and see a doctor/physiotherapist for a proper diagnosis and treatment.

[Robsons]

So I went to the Dr and he said it was most likely a ganglion (I see Paul B has this too).

He agreed that there is a lot of conflicting information on the web, stating that hospitals etc always suggest opperation. My Dr was refreshingly (albeit slightly worryingly) non chalant about it all - saying that; he had had one on his wrist that he just massaged and after time it went away.

I said that I climbed 3-5 times a week and he said that I should be fine to continue - it will be slightly painful, but you should be able to put up with it etc...
Having said that, he went on to say if it gets worse - more painful, increases in size etc...then to go back.

I was pleased with this...went climbing on it last night, and it did hurt, felt more pumped (linked??) but was fine to do lapping/4x4s on 6a-6b+...

Tested it on the finger board on the smallest crimps (not beastmaker), and was fine!

[Paul B]

So I went to the Dr and he said it was most likely a ganglion (I see Paul B had this too).

I pretty much got the same advice and it seemed to be correct.

[slackline]

he went on to say if it gets worse - more painful, increases in size etc...then to go back.

Probably the most frequently used line of advice by GPs! 

[Robsons]

haha - true...let's hope I don't have to act upon it! 

[JamesD]

Hit it with a book, thats what my gran said, she did it to hers years ago and it never came back apparently