[Fiend]

So now you know  :roll:

[Bubba]

That's given me eyestrain!

[petje]

If the writing would be typed and not handwritten, it would be perfect way of giving beta

[Fiend]

Bubba I can send you the full size if you need it ;P Or even the original bit of paper ;P.

[bigphil]

Ou est Le Nose s'il vous plait?

[Bubba]

Burbage West.

[Fiend]

Yer. The Yosemite one starts just as the diagram indicates and then continues for another 3000 feet past various other tricky bits. Ask Lynn Hill for the short person's beta for that (don't think she did the sitter).

[bigphil]

Of course, how silly of me.  I should have known from the lack of insitu tourists.

[Steamboat Stello]

 
Just noticed your little diagram Fiend! Been trying this annoying thing for ages but can't span between the undercut and the big hold so just gave up! You put your left foot out in the big pocket thing on nostril when you've got a knee bar in the undercut it looks like? Ta, will make a return trip. 

[Dr T]

think you might be onto a winner there
when are we expecting the publication of the how to companion to the peak bouldering guide
seriously it would save me shed loads of skin every time I head up and try to remember how to climb grit again

[ferret]

seems a little complex to me. short persons beta = tall persons beta except left foot pocket on nostril right foot toe hook undercut, instead of right foot on back wall left toe hook undercu. great problem, probably more satisfying for the short

[Steamboat Stello]

 
Had a crack with this beta but it still seems very hard if you can't span from the undercut out to the good hold round the lip with your right hand. Can just reach a crap sloper below the good hold then its hard to move left hand of the undercut and onto the sidepull thing even with a knee bar! Maybe I'm just shit. 

[ferret]

move LH to sidepull first, RH still on undercut, LF pocket in roof on nostril, RF toe hook undercut next to RH, now u should be able to take edge with RH more or less static and go again to good hold. hope this helps.

[Johnny Brown]

If it feels a bit burly, just bear in mind Ferret is about 6 grades below his limit here.

[Steamboat Stello]

Cheers dude. Will give it a crack later this week.

[8A]

What are you talking about, Fiend?

Lank it.

[Scouse D]

.

What are you talking about, Fiend?

Lank it.

What he's taking about is a sequence for short people.
The thread title was a little cryptic I know

[8A]

Yes, I know, I was taking trying to wind the esoteric beast that is fiend up.

[dave]

fatboyslimfast once showed me the shortarse beta. can't really remember it though. it involved holding that LH sidepull, though to make it feel hood you don't hold it in the conventional fashion, instead get it a little more diagonal higher up and it feels loads better.

[Fiend]

LOL, this is kinda funny and cool that this is getting some attention, I'd never have thought it.

I worked this out because I had to spend a while working the problem and didn't want to forget what I'd learnt and waste energy re-working the sequence.

Ferret - it might seem complex to you but it is the easiest way that worked for me. I agree it's a better problem for the short though .

Steamboat: If you can't reach the edge marked, god only knows! Sorry. Maybe try a power-spot to confirm whether you really can't reach it?? The kneebar is to get my left hand onto the sidepull without swinging out, then I dig my left toe onto the edge, right toe up into the undercling, left foot out into the pocket, and then go for the big hold with my right hand...

[ferret]

If it feels a bit burly, just bear in mind Ferret is about 6 grades below his limit here.

true but i did climb this back in the day when it was fairly close to my limit, deffor harder for shorties but there seems to be a myth that its impossible, just trying to help

[Johnny Brown]

Ah those long lost days when I was better than you...

Goin Targa this autumn?

[ferret]

Ah those long lost days when I was better than you...

at alot of things yor still alot better than me see help the young post

Goin Targa this autumn?

in squamish right now on road trip of doom, next stop boulder n irish si's ultimate beta, then salt lake, bishop n hueco, back b4 crimbo wen u can still show me how its done on grit

[andy_e]

Tried this today, I'm halfway between lanking it and short-personing it, arse. Will do it this weekend, no sweat.

[Andy F]

move LH to sidepull first, RH still on undercut, LF pocket in roof on nostril, RF toe hook undercut next to RH, now u should be able to take edge with RH more or less static and go again to good hold. hope this helps.

Exactly the way I did it, thanks to another short bloke who came by and gave me the beta. Couldn't reach the big slope static so tried slapping for it and couldn't hold the swing. The toe hook feels precarious but gets better as you put more weight in it. The top-out was green slimy death though....

[richdraws]

Tried the Nose on Tuesday, its a gorgeous line. My mate lanked it, the git. I tried the toe hook but cant get it to stick enough to match the juggy sloper. Can I avoid the toe hook at all or am I gonna have to do bat hang training?

[Paz]

The only time I got the toe hook to stick years ago I muffed the top section.  The secret is also pulling up as soon as you get the thing on t' lip to suck your body in, but this is something Dave And Scouse do all the time and something I've fluked once.  I remember there were foot holds on the right wall that I missed in my over enthusiastic state.  If you were super flexible could you jab at them or maybe even bridge to them?

[r-man]

Tried the Nose on Tuesday, its a gorgeous line. My mate lanked it, the git. I tried the toe hook but cant get it to stick enough to match the juggy sloper. Can I avoid the toe hook at all or am I gonna have to do bat hang training?

You can avoid it. It's a little harder, but not that much. I got fed up of trying to make my toe stick and did it without. Trick for me was getting feet high at the back, one on the starting hand hold, or possibly above. You can then reach the sidepull and the low sloper. I think a kneebar helps release left hand for the sidepull. It doesn't seem to matter whether you go for the sidepull or the low sloper first. Then pop for the big sloper, hold the swing, put your feet back on and finish the problem.

[Fiend]

Tried the Nose on Tuesday, its a gorgeous line. My mate lanked it, the git. I tried the toe hook but cant get it to stick enough to match the juggy sloper. Can I avoid the toe hook at all or am I gonna have to do bat hang training?

Use the beta! I found the toe-hook was to get out from the roof and the left foot in the nostril in control, then most of the weight is on the combination of the left hand sloper and left foot nostril to go to the juggy sloper.

[Andy F]

Tried the Nose on Tuesday, its a gorgeous line. My mate lanked it, the git. I tried the toe hook but cant get it to stick enough to match the juggy sloper. Can I avoid the toe hook at all or am I gonna have to do bat hang training?

As others have said, use LF out left on the Nostril, RF toe hook by RH in undercut, LH on sidepull (get the top part of it and theres a nice dish type thing for your thumb), TRUST the toe hook and reach to the intermediate and then big slope with RH. If your short teh toe hook is pretty unavoidable IMHO, unless you just slap it on and hand the swing...

[Paz]

Is the juggy sloper the thing I can reach statically off the undercut?  I'm glad someone's making use of the nostril because it would be a shame to waste it, but I'm going to stick to my lanky method the next time I'm there. 

[8A]

The nose the lanky persons way is 7a. The method without the toehook is 7a+. The short persons method is 7b IMHO. (Assuming The Nostril is 7b - I think it is nearer 7a+ ... but never mind)

[Bonjoy]

Have a plum, either one I don't mind.

[fatdoc]

thanks for the plum......keeps me at my 5 a day.

suppose I'd better go do the problem now: in yrs gone by i think i did the *jump to the sloper* from the back method - cos i'm short and then i was a little bit strong..... these days it'll be toehooks etc... galore

having said that - it really is a damn good problem: and seems to be equally satisfying whether yr tall or short.... not too common on overhanging grit. seems reasonable that it's harder the short boys way - then then it often is!! i'm not bothered on the grade, just that i get it done.

Fiend -yr beta gets tested by me asap - thanks mate!

[Bonjoy]

 I offer a plum to 8A and all the world think they can take a piece, sheesh!!

[Andy F]

having said that - it really is a damn good problem: and seems to be equally satisfying whether yr tall or short.... not too common on overhanging grit. seems reasonable that it's harder the short boys way - then then it often is!! i'm not bothered on the grade, just that i get it done.

It's not any harder for the short, just a bit more technical IMHO. Felt 7a to me once I'd been given the beta, the hardest bit was the move off the sloper once I'd got it. Brilliant problem, one of the best I've done in the Peak.

[Steamboat Stello]

Finally went and had a crack using the beta and seems to me its considerably harder than the lanky kids method which is essentially just getting a toe-hook with your hand on a jug (6c?) . I think 7a+/b would not be unfair for the shorties method.   

[fatdoc]

yum yum... thanks bonjoy

anyone got ant more out of season fruit?

i'll prob b on this after my dawn foray to the secret garden on sunday..... get those cons and miss those crowds!!!

i really hope you can get a load of weight onto those toe hooks!!

[8A]

I offer a plum to 8A and all the world think they can take a piece, sheesh!!

Sorry boyo, I'm not very good at this forum lark. What the hell does the above mean!?

[Bonjoy]

Just thought you might want a piece of fruit. It's hungry work this bouldering

[fatboySlimfast]

Have a plum, either one I don't mind.

is plum the new apple.......(OR ORANGE god forbid!)

[Bonjoy]

The apple is a singular and irreplaceable fruit. Plums are but wind in the trees

[cofe]

[Bonjoy]

Take them away! My eyes, they bleed....!

[account_inactive]

Who ever decided to climb the nose on Sunday please not dry the entire face with chalk. 

Why not come back on a day when its not wet you fuck heads?

[highrepute]

To revive an old one - went out to The Nose armed with shortmans beta today. went from thinking this is ridiculous nobody does it like this, to sending on my second or third go. easy!

[ferret]

went from thinking this is ridiculous nobody does it like this, to sending on my second or third go. easy!

told you so..

[Fiend]

Interesting, that does look quite feasible that way, if you're flexible. *Maybe* Ferret has a point. If I'm bored enough one day I might try it.

[dave]

To revive an old one - went out to The Nose armed with shortmans beta today. went from thinking this is ridiculous nobody does it like this, to sending on my second or third go. easy!

nice one, although the tall way is easier l always thought the short beta looks really fly. just make sure the sitstart nazis don't catch you starting on the undercut.

[Darren S]

To revive an old one - went out to The Nose armed with shortmans beta today. went from thinking this is ridiculous nobody does it like this, to sending on my second or third go. easy!

nice one, although the tall way is easier l always thought the short beta looks really fly. just make sure the sitstart nazis don't catch you starting on the undercut.

Yeah the tall way is easier, IF YOUR TALL. Done it a few ways and the short mans way is a great way of doing it, feels really good, first shown it by a young Hugo G who being short of stature could only do it the short mans way. Ah when we were young............

And yeah sorry lads well done on the Vid but it does start sitting.

[Falling Down]

Well done fellas (WTF is the terrible music on the video though...  )

[highrepute]

And yeah sorry lads well done on the Vid but it does start sitting.

Thought the standing start might get a mention, naughty me.

Well done fellas (WTF is the terrible music on the video though...  )

apologies

[nai]

I find it easier still if you match the sloper with the toe-hook still in then campus to the break rather than faffing around trying to get feet back on.

[aly]

There is another easy short-persons method which doesn't use the toe out left.
From matched on the undercut:

- LH out to big slopey sidepull
- RF heel-toe cam just right of the starting hold (heel on chalked edge, use the little overlap on the right for your toe)
- RH out to intermediate below the 'nose' hold
- Sort feet out, put LF into toehook in undercuts
- Take RF off and hold the swing on the toehook
- Slap up to 'nose' with RH, match, take toe out and continue as normal.

Worked for me... 

[tommytwotone]

Hmmm - glad this one has re-emerged.

I'd had a play on this one but given up on ever being able to do it, will give the short method(s) a go...

[nai]

Definitely worth it, I'd given up on it too but went back with some beta and did it in a few goes.

It's a very good problem and possibly even better this way than the regular method.