[Gee24]

Having been to Porth Ysgo recently i realised a couple of names of problems; namely Jets to Brazil and Jawbreaker. Then scanning the photos in the NW guide i saw Chris Davies with a Black Flag tatoo on his shoulder. Being from sheffield i only ever see (ok, an exageration but...) very clean cut climbers, all with nice matching pants and tops, always wearing a beanie, and no doubt listen to high-energy house...ahem...ok, so i am playing devils advocate, if i was to hang out more in North Wales would i be surrounded by patches, black clothing, circle A's, leather and spikes?

Sheffield has far too many clean climbers, and not enough filth in the ranks...or is this just from the outside looking in?

[Obi-Wan is lost...]

Plenty of filth from where I'm looking...

So, I got hold of a film in .avi format but it's all in a language I don't understand.

[dave]

wales: dress down
peak: dress nice
yorkshire: dress like a vagrant
lakes: dress in a rock & run shirt
county: dress out of focus

thats the dress code. word.

[cowboyhat]

Is this post supposed to be slagging off the style of sheffield climbers...?
You've obviously never seen pat king at the crag.
If you're using the fact that steal Mclure used to have dreadlocks as an example (which is about as edgy as the relationship between self styled self-righteous 'saviour' dickhead bono's relationship with salman rushdie),  then its easy to see where you might be coming from.
My friend james listens to Autecre on approach;
If i took a walkman to the crag i'd be playing Suicide.

[Pantontino]

Black Flag tattoos are of course the perfect antidote to an embarassing tat from days of youth and foolish behaviour - I'll have to ask CJD what he was covering up?

Most of the punk problem names are down to myself and CJD. That's 'punk', as in the DIY spirit/Dischord/American hardcore way, rather than some cider blitz/Exploited/bad mohawk way.

As for Dave's summary: "wales: dress down" - the days of piss stained lycra and baggy Christmas jumpers is long gone. These days, we are definately the most stylish fuckers to grace the UK crags  (apart from Nodder, who I admit looks like a tramp - albeit a stylish tramp)

"peak: dress nice" - I like the proliferation of retro headbands amongst you Peak hommes, but the word is not 'nice', not ever.

[Falling Down]

Black Flag tattoos are ....

the mark of the righteous ones...

Funny on the US/UK comparison as I have a mate from LA who's the same age as me (and thee roughly) who grew up listening to Exploited, Sham 69, Toy Dolls, Conflict etc. etc and dreamed of living in a squat in Huddersfield whilst the rest of us wished we were in DC or LA and being able to see Minor Threat, Rites of Spring, Black Flag, Minutemen, Huskers etc etc...

On a related note I _still_ have a spare ticked for Slint's All Tomorrows Party at the end of Feb.. The Melvins, Slint, Born Heller, Bright Black and I would hazard a guess that Will Oldham and Matt Sweeny wil make an appearance to showcase their new LP.. Anyone's who's into post-rock, alt.country, wierd Americana will probably enjoy the weekend.  It's £125 including accomodation so drop me a PM if anyone's interested.

Ben

[the_dom]

Funny on the US/UK comparison as I have a mate from LA who's the same age as me (and thee roughly) who grew up listening to Exploited, Sham 69, Toy Dolls, Conflict etc. etc and dreamed of living in a squat in Huddersfield whilst the rest of us wished we were in DC or LA and being able to see Minor Threat, Rites of Spring, Black Flag, Minutemen, Huskers etc etc...

Try growing up in South Africa...

[Gee24]

No i wasn't slating Peak climbers per se, but it does often feel strange to be around people who look like they have made an effort to go out on Grit for the day.

Ok, so Jawbreak et al, aren't your classic punk, just as well really, as i reckon a mohawk would probaly get in the way of any roof-problem you care to mention. What other punk rock named problems are there? 'Waiting Room', 'The Argument', 'Filler', 'Six Pack', 'Good Clean Fun' Anyone into the DC scene still?

[cofe]

people who look like they have made an effort to go out on Grit for the day.

we're not playing games you know.

[dave]

"peak: dress nice" - I like the proliferation of retro headbands amongst you Peak hommes, but the word is not 'nice', not ever.

i don't follow you>?

[SA Chris]

Try growing up in South Africa...

I feel your pain broer. (thumps chest with fist)

[Pantontino]

I forgot about Throbbins/Stinky Pete - he is one scruffy, baggy arsed tramp, especially considering that most of his clothes are freebies from fashionable climbing labels (or is that an oxymoron?). Mind you, he might live in Llanberis, but he was Sheffield born and bred.

[Pantontino]

To Falling Down: I remember talking to Boone Speed once in Buoux and he kept banging on about how cool Andrew Eldritch and the Sisters of Mercy were. Living in Yorkshire I was overloaded with shite goth music and hated it all.

[AndyR]

' Anyone into the DC scene still?

Dunno about 'into it', but I listen to minor threat when I cycle into work - makes it pass very quickly......

[the_dom]

' Anyone into the DC scene still?

Dunno about 'into it', but I listen to minor threat when I cycle into work - makes it pass very quickly......

Have gotten back into Minor Threat, Black Flag and Dead Kennedys recently. So good.

[Pantontino]

To Gee24:

Here's a few more off the top of my head:

Toxicity – System of a Down - Lower satellites, Pass
Motor Away – Guided by Voices - Upper satellites, Pass
Away from the Numbers – The Jam - Porth Ysgo
Mr, you're on fire Mr – Liars - Craig y Llwyfan, Pass
Zen Arcade – Husker Du - Meadow, Pass
Crucial Times – Youth of Today - Parisella's
Trigger Cut – Pavement - Parisella's
Welcome to Krell – Poison Idea - Dome, Pass
Disorder – Joy Division - can't remember?
Slapshot - Pass
The Punk - Clogwyn y Tarw, Ogwen

...and then in the Elephantitus cave, there's 'Tusk' by Fleetwood Mac - punk as fuck!!!

[Pantontino]

I've used 'The Argument' (Split Infinity) and 'Six Pack' (Grooves boulder, Pass), but where are:

'Waiting Room', 'Filler', and 'Good Clean Fun' ?

[webbo]

children,children.sham 69 are the only punk band that anybody has mentioned.did  anybody else see them live.i recall jimmy pursey hanging upsidedown singing in rafters manchester 1979

yorkshire: dress like a vagrant

as a yorkshire climber i must protest as i think you'll find i own more suits than you mate.

[dave]

unless they are corduroy with leather elbow-patches then i'm not impressed.

[webbo]

unless they are corduroy with leather elbow-patches then i'm not impressed.

funny you mention corduroy.i was only thinking about looking for a nice brown corduroy suit.no elbow patches they are so 2004.

[dave]

or you could go for a homer simpson - leather jacket with tweed elbow patches.

"you've ruined a perfectly good jacket"

"correction: TWO perfectly good jackets!"

[webbo]

or stick with my current wardrobe and be higher up the well dressed boulderer scale than yourself.

[webbo]

or you could go for a homer simpson - leather jacket with tweed elbow patches.

"you've ruined a perfectly good jacket"

"correction: TWO perfectly good jackets!"

or maybe something made to measure such as a jacket with matching apostrophes on either shoulder. :wink:

[dave]

[schild=5 fontcolor=000000 shadowcolor=C0C0C0 shieldshadow=1]wh'a'tev'er[/schild]

[Gee24]

When i say 'into it', i mean still tracking down records and bands, you know the feeling of wanting to hear new bands and see them live at any cost. I'm not really into Dischord and the DC scene(Positive Change collective et al) anymore, the music just doesn't cut it inside me any more, though the classics still want me to cause havoc, especially the first Minor Threat EP (it did make me smile when the Colarado Daydream DVD used Seein Red (not the commie hardcore band from The Netherlands) by the Threat for one of scenes), Embrace, Fugazi (old and new), Dag Nasty (when Dave Smalley was doing vocals).

I guess i just listen to more post-punk/rock/hardcore thesedays. Or anyband that challenges musical stereotypes,eg anyone heard 'Refused:The Shape of Punk to Come'. Theres bands like Godspeed You Black Emperor!, Mono, Explosions in the Sky, all of which sound epically melodic without vocals, but mind blowing nonetheless. Then theres the heavier side, with Isis (like a heavier Tortoise), Neurosis (the best live band ever to play before my eyes), Sunn, Earth etc etc.

To be honest i never actaully thought any climbers would be into punk/hardcore, maybe its just the ones i've met and hung out with, even though its 'ethics' seem very much in common, and its asscioated lifestyles, 'work less climb more' etc. Or looking at it differently for the years i was involved with the UK hardcore scene (i.e. putting on gigs, sorting tours, being in bands) i never saw a climber at the gigs...maybe i just didn't get lucky (so to speak).

[Pantontino]

To Webbo: "Hersham boys, Hersham boys, laced up boots and corduroys"

and other such proto Oi classics.

Harrington jackets, 12 hole dms and a bag of glue, eh? Leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds...OI!!!

Does any of that ring a bell?

[Pantontino]

Not forgetting of course:

"If the kids are united, they will never be divided!"

Golden memories... :roll:

[Pantontino]

To Gee24; I've known loads of climbers who had the good taste and foresight to become punk/hardcore fans. I first met Olly Wright at a hardcore gig in Leeds - he went on to briefly become one of Yorkshire's leading climbers, onsighting 8a (this was back in the early 90s when such a feat was particularly notable) and cranking one arm pull ups on request.

As has been discussed on here before, I bumped into John Dunne at a Slapshot gig in Huddersfield, when he was going out with Jules of New Model Army fame.

You say you were involved in the hardcore scene - when was this and whereabouts?

[Gee24]

I guess i got involved in 1998 in the Peterborough hardcore scene and hung out with the sXe kids there, then started putting on gigs, all-dayers etc. I moved out of Lincolnshire to Sheffield and got involved with a gig collective called 'The Secret 9', we did a show every month from Wat Tyler and Hardskin to Spy Versus Spy and other such style bands.  I did a couple of stints roadie-ing for Ensign, and Catharsis which were unforgettable. I went to loads of gigs in Leeds (packhorse), and Bradford (1in12 Club). I did of contributing to the zine 'Reason to Believe' too, and then formed a band a few years ago called 'The Great Refusal' (a phrase used by Herbert Marcuse in One Dimensional Man), we played a few gigs, with the best one being at the Aspire squat in Leeds where a skate-ramp was the stage...we split up as we all became jaded and cynical towards the punk/hardcore scene in the UK...maybe I'll get back into it at some point.

[Falling Down]

...i was involved with the UK hardcore scene (i.e. putting on gigs, sorting tours, being in bands) i never saw a climber at the gigs....

I think I may have been at some of the gigs you mentioned in Sheffield, but I didn't know I was supposed to wear my harness/rope/chalkbag/

[Falling Down]

When i say 'into it', i mean still tracking down records and bands...

Yep, still doing it although my tastes have broadened considerably since
I was in my mid-late teens when it was just Dischord/SST/Blast First etc.

[AndyR]

To Webbo: "Hersham boys, Hersham boys, laced up boots and corduroys"

and other such proto Oi classics.

Harrington jackets, 12 hole dms and a bag of glue, eh? Leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds...OI!!!

Does any of that ring a bell?

Don't forget...."We're goin' dahn the pub"

Was that "Hurry Up Harry"?

Sham 69 = Chas'n'Dave in doc martens........

[webbo]

To Webbo: "Hersham boys, Hersham boys, laced up boots and corduroys"

and other such proto Oi classics.

Harrington jackets, 12 hole dms and a bag of glue, eh? Leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds, leeds...OI!!!

Does any of that ring a bell?

my harrinton jacket and leeds utd era were many years before punk and sham 69 came on the seen. might have been in 1969.however i did my first grit routes[2nd  time out climbing] at ilkley in my doc martins.

[Gee24]

Is Colorado Daydream the only climbing film to have a punk/hardcore song on it?

What's Ian MacKaye's best band then? The raw teen 'positive'-angst of Minor Threat or the musicallity and abstract-lyricalness of Fugazi?

Panton, when were you Leeds watching bands?

[Pantontino]

MT and Fugazi are both classic bands, as you say for different reasons. I think Fugazi made a greater contribution overall, although I only really like the early stuff (first two 12"s and Repeater) and The Argument.

Can't think of much in the way of punk/hardcore on climbing films. Obviously you get plenty on snowboarding vids.

I was a regular gig goer in Leeds from the late 80s until the mid 90s.

[Gee24]

I did see that Stick It uses the Minutemen in the soundtrack, i haven't seen it yet but does 'Amateur Hardcore' have any 'tunes that make you want to turn over a cop car and set it on fire'?

Panton, if you were in Leeds, you were there at the time of the 120 Rats squat? Was the Packhorse a gig venue then?

You're a similar age to a real close friend of mine called Nick who did 'Surehand Records' and did How We Rock fanzine, you don't recall him do you?

I was really impressed to see in the NW Bouldering guide the mention of the 'bouldering zine', I guess it was that that rang a few bells in my head...I get excited when people appreciate and are actively involved with DIY 'culture', even if its away from the the punk sphere.

I forgot to mention 'Egg Raid', 'Teen Idols', and 'Embrace' as MacKaye's other bands...

[Pantontino]

I didn't live in Leeds, but I used to go over on the train most weeks from Huddersfield to gigs in the Duchess of York, or occasionally to the 1 in 12 club in Bradford.

The bloke you mention rings a bell - I've certainly heard of the fanzine (might even have a copy somewhere). He may be the same straight edge guy that was an old friend of my girlfriend at the time. It's so long ago I can't remember his name, but I'd know his face.

Small world, eh?

[the_dom]

I did see that Stick It uses the Minutemen in the soundtrack, i haven't seen it yet

It's a great song. That said, if you haven't checked out Double Nickles on the Dime, get it now. One of the best albums of all time.

Panto - I prefer MT to Fugazi. Stepping Stone and 12xU are 2 of my favourite hardcore songs of all time.

[Falling Down]

I did see that Stick It uses the Minutemen in the soundtrack, i haven't seen it yet

It's a great song.

I'll take a bow.. my suggestion and my copy of Three Way Tie for Last.. we sent a copy of the video to Watt in Pedro too but I don't what he made of it...

Watt and George Hurley have been playing together as The Minutemen over the last couple of years just as a Bass 'n drums combo - I've yet to see them yet, but I've heard good reports.  Watts recent albums have been good tho'

The Firehose stuff is great too - particularly fromOhio and If'n.

Fugazi or MT... Daddy or Chips??  Depends what mood I'm in really, I do prefer the first two Fugazi 12's & Repeater to the later stuff and the Out of Step EP always makes my top ten

[the_dom]

Watt and George Hurley have been playing together as The Minutemen over the last couple of years just as a Bass 'n drums combo - I've yet to see them yet, but I've heard good reports.  

I'm dubious. D Boon was the biggest (haha, pun) member of the Minutemen for me. HIs voice and his guitar work (especially) was the most distinctive part. Hearing it for the first time was like hearing something new, and yet all I could do was recognise stuff that other bands had stolen off them (take a bow Sublime).

[c.j.d.]

You also forgot Downset - Elephantiasis.  I'm very into Black Flag, and no, the tattoo is most definatley not a cover up (unless, that is, I was trying to cover up my indy kid days Mr Panton, ie Spectrum, Sonic Boom etc!

[Johnny Brown]

Brother-in-law's band made it onto radio 1 last night - check out The Early Years
Wouldn't call it Punk or hardcore, but whoever mentioned Explosions in the sky should be in for a treat....

[fatboySlimfast]

and the Out of Step EP always makes my top ten

ahhhh, got it on vinyl bought as unsuspecting youth who didnt really understand what i had bought and like it cos it was so shouty :roll:

Was really into a lot of stuff like Sub Humans, oi polloi, EARLY (i make that a real point there!) Chumbawamba back when i was a Donkey jacket wearing man in black. many an evening was spent in the backwaters of Herefordshire drinking shit cider and listening to crap punk bands, occasionally getting some real cracking gigs

although the album 'Now thats what i call a fucking racket' with the legendary 'pay no more than £1.99' was a real mistake!

[Gee24]

Enough of  punk rock for the moment, but list me some outstanding pieces of music ever written...ground breaking and genre smashing...

[Johnny Brown]

New Order - Blue monday

[the_dom]

System of a Down - Chop Suey
Iggy and the Stooges - Search and Destroy (I know it's punk, but it's uber punk)
Operation Ivy - Sound System (really genre smashing, and it's not punk, it's ska)
Beastie Boys - Sabotage (genre smashing)

(It is me, or is the letter 's' really prevalent in this post)