[petejh]

An appropriate way to get to Moat Buttress would be via being shot out of a cannon.

[SamT]

 

[Paul B]

A rope swing is the only way! I've used the cable bridge in Boulder Canyon near Boulder, and with a pack on it feels scary, even with a harness..

Bring a pulley for yourself and put the pack on a trailing sling clipped directly. What is this, amateur hour!??

Surely at least some of you have climbed on the other side of the Verdon or one of several Spanish crags where this is the approach.

[spidermonkey09]

Indeed, at Collegats. Piece of piss with a pulley.

[SA Chris]

Bring a pulley for yourself and put the pack on a trailing sling clipped directly. What is this, amateur hour!??

Surely at least some of you have climbed on the other side of the Verdon or one of several Spanish crags where this is the approach.

Well, I was at the end of a ski season and, funnily enough, those things were not high on my packing list. I barely had room for a harness and shoes. Never needed to do anything like that elsewhere. Steall Bridge doesn't count.

[stone]

Alternatively install a discrete single 8mm stainless wire between trees a little downstream? Harnesses on at the car park...

Isn't the island opposite Moat actually accessible from the other bank? It is a fairly short span from Moat to that island.

[SamT]

Isn't the island opposite Moat actually accessible from the other bank? It is a fairly short span from Moat to that island.

Possibly, but its an absolute wildlife haven, and I doubt the fishermen will be very happy either. 

[Dingdong]

Isn't the island opposite Moat actually accessible from the other bank? It is a fairly short span from Moat to that island.

Possibly, but its an absolute wildlife haven, and I doubt the fishermen will be very happy either.

I love that, walking is bad for the wildlife but fishing, which kills the wildlife and definitely disturbs the habitat more is absolutely fine. FYI I hate fisherman.

[stone]

The fishermen put the fish back anyway. They are defenders of water quality etc. Quite different from the moor-burning, hen-harrier-killing grouse shooters!

[Dingdong]

The fishermen put the fish back anyway. They are defenders of water quality etc. Quite different from the moor-burning, hen-harrier-killing grouse shooters!

No one here is ever going to convince me that fishing is positive. I’m vegan so to me disturbing animals for the sake of personal gratification is pretty much as low as a it gets. You shouldn’t need fisherman to keep water quality high either, that’s such a cop out. Swear this country is going down the drain (no pun intended) all our waterways full of shite pumped out by corporations that lobby the bastard tories to turn a blind eye and dismantle regulation. Disgusting.

[Will Hunt]

corporations that lobby the bastard tories to turn a blind eye and dismantle regulation

Could we have a citation for this? There is a trade body for the water industry (Water UK) but I've never heard of them lobbying to "turn a blind eye" to sewage overflows or "dismantle regulation".

[Dingdong]

corporations that lobby the bastard tories to turn a blind eye and dismantle regulation

Could we have a citation for this? There is a trade body for the water industry (Water UK) but I've never heard of them lobbying to "turn a blind eye" to sewage overflows or "dismantle regulation".

Let’s be honest, you don’t want citations you just want to argue and debate as is almost always the case on this forum.. I could give you them and it wouldn’t make a difference. If you don’t believe think tanks spend time and money lobbying the government to deregulate stuff so they can turn bigger profits then you can live in La la land all you want. I can’t be bothered to send you links.

[petejh]

Stand down Will it's OK - there's an unwritten rule, that Dingdong broke, that when someone says or types the words 'country's going down the drain' it triggers a clause that means everything that follows can be written off as uninformed ranting.

[SamT]

Re the fishermen, its nowt really to do with their effect on wildlife.. its more the fact that they own each river bank, and are notoriously sniffy about climbers there.  Access in that dale is probably quite fragile, with Derbyshire wildlife trust being sensitive about the Lamergayer/pingpong etc on one side, fishermen/baliffs being sensitive about the river banks.   You probably don't remember the times when to access rubicon wall you had to swing round the great big spikey iron turnstyle gate. 

There's no public right of way to these crags, so was just putting it out there that tyroleans, makeshift bridges etc etc might not go down to well with land owners and its probably not worth poking the hornets nest.   

[SamT]

Realistically, if bridge at the weir fully dissappears, the only way to access Cornice/Moat will be from the railway line, accessed from either Litton Mill end, or from the monsal direction.  Bikes from Litton/Millers dale would probably be my preference.

[Wellsy]

Anyone who thinks that the water industry has not completely degraded the water quality of the UKs fresh and saltwater areas while also been paying out huge shareholder dividends seems remarkably uninformed I must say. There was a lot of news about it of late with a lot of science to back it up and a lot of political discontent over it as well? This is hardly a controversial or partisan statement, although if you want to look at who privatised them, and who has crippled the EA in the last decade, well that is rather partisan

[spidermonkey09]

you just want to argue and debate as is almost always the case on this forum

That is absolutely what the forum is for. If you want to sound off with extreme opinions about how fishermen are scum (a more low impact hobby I struggle to conceive of, its literally blokes sitting in silence in one spot catching a fish if they're lucky, then throwing it back) thats up to you but people aren't compelled to just agree with it unquestioningly.

Also what sam said, obviously

[Fiend]

"When I grow up, I want to be....One of those harvesters of the sea."
"I think before my days are done.... I want to be a fisherman."

#justsayin'

[Will Hunt]

corporations that lobby the bastard tories to turn a blind eye and dismantle regulation

Could we have a citation for this? There is a trade body for the water industry (Water UK) but I've never heard of them lobbying to "turn a blind eye" to sewage overflows or "dismantle regulation".

Let’s be honest, you don’t want citations you just want to argue and debate as is almost always the case on this forum.. I could give you them and it wouldn’t make a difference. If you don’t believe think tanks spend time and money lobbying the government to deregulate stuff so they can turn bigger profits then you can live in La la land all you want. I can’t be bothered to send you links.

Wow, you're right. It was so wrong of me to ask you to ask you to evidence your world view and educate me at the same time. I apologise unreservedly.

Anyone who thinks that the water industry has not completely degraded the water quality of the UKs fresh and saltwater areas while also been paying out huge shareholder dividends seems remarkably uninformed I must say. There was a lot of news about it of late with a lot of science to back it up and a lot of political discontent over it as well? This is hardly a controversial or partisan statement, although if you want to look at who privatised them, and who has crippled the EA in the last decade, well that is rather partisan

Putting privatisation and dividends to one side, I think your assertion that the water industry has "completely degraded" water quality across the UK is wrong. Water quality has improved markedly since privatisation, not least because of billions of pounds of investment driven by EU legislation. As much as I might dislike the Tories, and think that the Conservative's Environment Act is a flawed piece of legislation with regards water quality, it will drive an absolutely astronomical amount of investment that will go some way to further improving water quality.

[Dingdong]

corporations that lobby the bastard tories to turn a blind eye and dismantle regulation

Could we have a citation for this? There is a trade body for the water industry (Water UK) but I've never heard of them lobbying to "turn a blind eye" to sewage overflows or "dismantle regulation".

Let’s be honest, you don’t want citations you just want to argue and debate as is almost always the case on this forum.. I could give you them and it wouldn’t make a difference. If you don’t believe think tanks spend time and money lobbying the government to deregulate stuff so they can turn bigger profits then you can live in La la land all you want. I can’t be bothered to send you links.

Wow, you're right. It was so wrong of me to ask you to ask you to evidence your world view and educate me at the same time. I apologise unreservedly.

Anyone who thinks that the water industry has not completely degraded the water quality of the UKs fresh and saltwater areas while also been paying out huge shareholder dividends seems remarkably uninformed I must say. There was a lot of news about it of late with a lot of science to back it up and a lot of political discontent over it as well? This is hardly a controversial or partisan statement, although if you want to look at who privatised them, and who has crippled the EA in the last decade, well that is rather partisan

Putting privatisation and dividends to one side, I think your assertion that the water industry has "completely degraded" water quality across the UK is wrong. Water quality has improved markedly since privatisation, not least because of billions of pounds of investment driven by EU legislation. As much as I might dislike the Tories, and think that the Conservative's Environment Act is a flawed piece of legislation with regards water quality, it will drive an absolutely astronomical amount of investment that will go some way to further improving water quality.

You quoted Water UK who are literally known for closed door events with MPs and lobbying Will  I cba to go ten pages deep arguing with people on here. Truth is water quality has degraded in the UK with only 14% of rivers being “good quality” - not exactly a shining bastion of water quality. Not sure what you’re trying to defend here really… the tories have done an excellent job at fucking up beaches, rivers, lakes in the UK.

Everyone knows since brexit the water quality has dropped in the UK due to not needing to adhere to EU regs too, going from doing chemical and ecological testing annually to every three years. Add to that the fact that sewage systems in the UK are essentially falling apart and not able to handle the capacity of extra rainwater, we get insane amounts of sewage discharge, and why is that? Because the water companies are privatised and have no reason to spend their shareholders profits on upgrading their systems.

[Paul B]

Add to that the fact that sewage systems in the UK are essentially falling apart and not able to handle the capacity of extra rainwater, we get insane amounts of sewage discharge, and why is that? Because the water companies are privatised and have no reason to spend their shareholders profits on upgrading their systems.

Do you think a changing climate has anything to do with this?

[Tony]

Since we’ve made it to yet aaanother page, especially if you’re a despicable lazy Moat user who wants to stay dry

Please consider helping to fund a replacement bridge at Cress-brook Mill by donating to the PDNP Foundation's fundraiser for this at: https://shorturl.at/cesz8

You can also donate by:

Bank transfer to ‘Peak District National Park Foundation’, sort code 20-10-71, account 63364895, Barclays Bank, quoting Cress-brook Bridge
Cheque made payable to Peak District National Park  Foundation with your contact details and marked Cress-brook Bridge to Aldern House, Baslow Road, Bakewell, Derbyshire, DE45 1AE

However, if you want to add gift aid (giving them an additional 25%), you’ll need to email them for a gift aid form to complete.

Nice one to all those people who have already donated.

[Dingdong]

Add to that the fact that sewage systems in the UK are essentially falling apart and not able to handle the capacity of extra rainwater, we get insane amounts of sewage discharge, and why is that? Because the water companies are privatised and have no reason to spend their shareholders profits on upgrading their systems.

Do you think a changing climate has anything to do with this?

Annual rainfall in the UK is fairly static since the 90s…
 
https://www.statista.com/statistics/610664/annual-rainfall-uk/#:~:text=The%20United%20Kingdom%20recorded%20an,178.5%20raindays%20across%20the%20nation.

[Paul B]

Which has absolutely no relevance to a system that responds to 'events' whereby a discharge is made from a CSO when 'capacity' is exceeded (in simplistic terms). It doesn't give a about that averaging out over a year.

I'm not a fan of the split tool but in this instance, I think it's worthwhile for Tony's sanity.

[Tony]

I'm not a fan of the split tool but in this instance, I think it's worthwhile for Tony's sanity.

No, no, keep going. The longer this topic stays at the top of the list, the more that donation link gets clicked (conversions are somewhat disappointing but still some!)