the shizzle > news

Topic split - how many sessions..?

(1/5) > >>

User deactivated.:

--- Quote from: Bradders on July 03, 2023, 09:09:38 pm ---110+ sessions....absolutely mind blowing.

--- End quote ---

This comment got me thinking. If* we want to climb something really hard, then perceptions on what constitutes a long project need to shift. Currently, any more than about 10 sessions would seem like an unfathomable siege to me, but for how many sessions would a sprinter need to attempt the 100m before they're ready to compete? How many sessions does it take for an author to finish their greatest novel? The answer to both is usually a lot more than 110. So in that context, it almost seems odd to not put in the 110 sessions if we're really trying to accomplish something.

*understandably not everyone will care to.

andy moles:

--- Quote from: Liamhutch89 on July 04, 2023, 04:03:02 pm ---
--- Quote from: Bradders on July 03, 2023, 09:09:38 pm ---110+ sessions....absolutely mind blowing.

--- End quote ---

This comment got me thinking. If* we want to climb something really hard, then perceptions on what constitutes a long project need to shift. Currently, any more than about 10 sessions would seem like an unfathomable siege to me, but for how many sessions would a sprinter need to attempt the 100m before they're ready to compete? How many sessions does it take for an author to finish their greatest novel? The answer to both is usually a lot more than 110. So in that context, it almost seems odd to not put in the 110 sessions if we're really trying to accomplish something.

*understandably not everyone will care to.

--- End quote ---

There's a difference with both of those comparisons though. In the case of the sprint, wouldn't it be like running the same race on the same track with the same competitors? And writing your magnum opus is maybe more like climbing a big wall project, a succession of chapters, rather than re-writing the same paragraph over and over again until it's perfect?

Point being that the best way to achieve a project isn't always necessarily to just keep trying it repeatedly (if only to preserve your motivation and sanity)?

Bradders:

--- Quote from: Liamhutch89 on July 04, 2023, 04:03:02 pm ---
--- Quote from: Bradders on July 03, 2023, 09:09:38 pm ---110+ sessions....absolutely mind blowing.

--- End quote ---

This comment got me thinking. If* we want to climb something really hard, then perceptions on what constitutes a long project need to shift. Currently, any more than about 10 sessions would seem like an unfathomable siege to me, but for how many sessions would a sprinter need to attempt the 100m before they're ready to compete? How many sessions does it take for an author to finish their greatest novel? The answer to both is usually a lot more than 110. So in that context, it almost seems odd to not put in the 110 sessions if we're really trying to accomplish something.

*understandably not everyone will care to.

--- End quote ---

Hmm, a couple of years ago I might have agreed with you but my opinion now is that if you can't do something in around 10 sessions, (assuming good conditions, okay skin etc.) then you're probably not good enough and would be better served going away and training, doing other things and coming back later.

I'm not saying it isn't possible to do things in 12 sessions in close proximity or whatever, and of course there will be exceptions, just that it isn't optimal. It's a bit like turning up to a practical exam where there's no time limit, and without having revised; you might scrape an A through trial and error eventually, literally learning while you do the exam, but it'll be hugely frustrating, and require enormous dedication to stick it out and not quit. Much better to put the time in beforehand and turn up prepared.

Also how many sessions something takes is actually only one of the relevant metrics, and not very informative.

As a for instance, I sunk 15 sessions into Ben's Groove Sit over 2 months in early 2021, and didn't do it. I wasn't good enough then. When I finally did it this year it took 2 sessions, so much faster on that metric, however that would ignore the 6 months I spent training specifically for it beforehand, the however many board sessions trying replicas, etc.

Ned Feehally said something similar when asked to explain how he prepared to flash Trust Issues; he essentially said he climbed and trained for 20 years beforehand. I.e. in a sense it took him 20 years to flash it.

So, without wishing to disparage Jonny at all, and his willingness to keep trying it that many times is as I say mind blowing, I think you could arguably say that for the first 100 sessions he really just wasn't good enough, and persisting was not the best way to approach it. Even though he got there in the end.

abarro81:
Sometimes the sessions could be the training though presumably... So you could spend that six months on the problem or on replicas, it might not matter much which, it just depends on what fits given the location, conditions, how easy it is to replicate, work schedule, how much you like being outside, etc? I'd guess that in racking up that many sessions at least a decent chunk will have been a decision that going and training on the rock was more fun than down the wall?

I think the number of sessions at which you hit diminishing returns also depends a lot in length and style of problem/route. On a basic 2 move board problem I think after about 2 sessions I'd be just bashing my head against the wall and hoping for luck... On a Parisellas link (or The World is Yours) I could imagine it taking 5-10 sessions to really refine all the beta and dial the moves, the same again to develop the necessary flow working sections, then each new season you need a bunch of sessions to relearn the flow before you can even have tries... On something like Chilam Balam I could imagine spending 30 days up there just to optimise all the beta without even doing long links.  Obviously it would be better to come back having levelled up, but that's not always an option if you're near your limit!

Still, I don't think I've ever tried something I like enough to put that level of time in! Might be different if I lived in Spain or France near a good big crag though, then I could imagine it

Duma:
Barrows has covered a lot of the points, but also remember Biiblins is banned 7 months of the year. Jonny wasn't just chilling out October through April!

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page