[lagerstarfish]

I don't understand the question, but I am sure that the answer is Paco de Lucía

I was sure that we were about to get a recommendation for some Yngwie Malmsteen

[Oldmanmatt]

Hendrix Voodoo Child.
 Stratton on Iron Maiden’s Phantom of the opera or Alexander the Great.
For a slow and soulful, Dire Straights, Brothers in Arms.
Aerials, System of a Down?
Shine on you crazy diamond?
Pinball wizard?
Through the Fire and the Flames, Dragon Force? Herman Li has to be on the list.

Jeezus, where do you start? It’s the electric guitar, the voice of the Gods.
Santana?
What about John Williams on Sky’s version of Toccata?
Might not be strictly “Metal” but they fucking rocked.

Actually, it made me think of a conversation with my eldest daughter and youngest son. She lists Black Sabbath as one of her favorite bands, loves Rage against the Machine, System of a Down and Disturbed and… Panic at the Disco(?); he was sat playing Green Day on his guitar, wearing an Iron Maiden shirt and it dawned on me that they just don’t pigeon hole music into genres the way I do (or did). I mean, sometimes Punk sounds like Metal and Mods played stuff that sounded pretty Rockerish and Vivaldi on an electric guitar is pretty metal too.

[jwi]

I don't understand the question, but I am sure that the answer is Paco de Lucía

I was sure that we were about to get a recommendation for some Yngwie Malmsteen

I have always had a hard time appreciating Mr Malmsteen's music.

My fav Swedish metal guitarist:

[Oldmanmatt]

Here y’a go.
Bunch of geeks and classical musicians make Bach, uh, different.

[Falling Down]

It’s gotta be metal right? Which excludes Hendrix, Rush (Alex Lifeson man!), Led Zep, Sabbath, Deep Purple etc.

I think Ozzy’s band just creeps over the threshold from rock to metal, so Randy Rhoads’ solos on Mr Crowley and Crazy train are up there.

Kirk Hammet has several esp. the one in Master of the Puppets. This one is actually central to the whole piece rather than window dressing to the RIFF (which is what metal is all about really IMHO).

The best Slayer solo I reckon is on Skeleton Christ.

Metal is all about the RIFF tho’ right?

[Falling Down]

… and Rock swings in a syncopated rhythm whereas Metal marches in a rhythm on the beat. Rock uses blues scales and Metal uses classical scales too?

Splitting hairs I know… soz.

[SA Chris]

Non metal honourary mentions welcome (apart from the Eagles).

One that catches you by surprise is in this starts at 3:50 and doesn't really stop.

[jwi]

Metal is all about the RIFF tho’ right?

Metal = Heavy distortion + Powerchord

(Punk also use the powerchord and is all about the riff, but cannot be mistaken for metal for some reason)

[andy popp]

Non metal honourary mentions welcome (apart from the Eagles).

Kenny Burrell (from about 3.38, but needs to be listened to in the context of the whole track)

[User deactivated.]

… and Rock swings in a syncopated rhythm whereas Metal marches in a rhythm on the beat. Rock uses blues scales and Metal uses classical scales too?

Splitting hairs I know… soz.

Except modern progressive metal is probably the most syncopated genre in western music! Typical example:



If by classical scales you predominantly mean the harmonic minor then yes that has seen a fair bit of use, but melodically I think the use of atonality is more common, which provides a more unsettled feel to the music.

Metal is all about the RIFF tho’ right?

Metal = Heavy distortion + Powerchord

(Punk also use the powerchord and is all about the riff, but cannot be mistaken for metal for some reason)

Yeah. It's funny how genres can be difficult to classify, yet their sound is unmistakable. This is especially true for subgenres (of which metal has many!)

[AMorris]

This is a thread which has been permanently active in my mind for 23 years.

Ones that stick out in my mind, gonna try and stick to various genres of metal and only one per band/guitarist:

Altitudes - Jason Becker. He deserves to be here

The Unforgiven - Metallica. Kirk is technically outclassed by most lead guitarists (especially nowadays), but my god the man knows how to write a melodic solo. Perhaps one of the most appropriate and best paced solos in history (could also have put One or Fade to Black here)

Floods - Pantera. Immense. Dime has created a lot of amazing solos, but this one is in a league of its own

This Godless Endeavour - Nevermore. Loomis is a titan of metal and deserves his place here

Wake up Dead - Megadeth. Quite a few MD tracks could have made it here, but the solo to this is truly unique and one I come back to time and again

Guitars Suck - Bumblefoot. Almost miraculous skill on guitar which is matched only by Mr Govan himself. When I discovered him in my early teens it broke my tiny mind

Bleed - Meshuggah. Known for its relentless riff and drum work, but the solo, although nothing technically outrageous, is utterly amazing. After the brutality of the first half of the song, the quiet, brooding bridge followed by the disconcerting and weirdly paced solo is terrifying. Amazing track

In My Dreams - Dokken. I spent so much of my teens transcribing Mr Lynch's solos. He absolutely epitomises the best of 80s glam metal playing to me. It was hard to choose between this and solos like Walk Away or Tooth and Nail

Bombers - Bill Ward, this one deserves a special mention as a totally overlooked masterpiece of 80s metal with an amazing solo

No More Tears - Ozzy. Whale sounds followed by a classic Zakk pentatonic solo which builds to a climax. What's not to love

The Wicker Man - Iron Maiden. We can argue about which Maiden song has the best solo, but I have been playing this one for so many years that it holds a soft spot for me


I can think of loads more, but thats probably enough for now. I wanted with all my heart to put a Guthrie Govan piece on here, being my absolutely hands down favourite guitarist, but he is more jazz/fusion/funk/whateverhewantstobeatthetime than metal. I would recommend his solo in Drive On by Steven Wilson though. Transcendental stuff. Keep in mind he pretty much improvises ever solo he plays too.

[AMorris]

oh jesus christ, I only wanted it to post hyperlinks rather than the thumbnails   

[Johnny Brown]

Non metal honourary mentions welcome (apart from the Eagles).

Aztec Camera - Jump


Supposedly a riposte to a comment by Van Halen about them being 'twee', Roddy first strips the song back to find a beautiful core, then delivers an incredible Velvet Underground-inspired solo that both soars, disintegrates, showcases and cocks a snook, proving that just because you can doesn't always mean you should. One of the greatest cover versions.

The Stone Roses - Tears


My first, my last, my everything. I just can't see this solos ever being bettered in my ears. It just soars so effortlessly without ever seeming forced or wanky. Exquisite, and the perfect foil to the vocals which for all Ian's limitations were reputedly delivered in a single take. As Keef said, "Everyone talks about rock these days; the problem is they forget about the roll.”

[User deactivated.]

I wanted with all my heart to put a Guthrie Govan piece on here, being my absolutely hands down favourite guitarist, but he is more jazz/fusion/funk/whateverhewantstobeatthetime than metal. I would recommend his solo in Drive On by Steven Wilson though. Transcendental stuff. Keep in mind he pretty much improvises ever solo he plays too.

I'm not really into the genres Govan typically plays, but purely on his proficiency as a guitarist and not his creative output*, my God if he's not the best electric guitarist who's ever lived!

*This is an interesting concept though. Can the two really be separated? I'm not sure. There are literally thousands of bedroom players on YouTube who are miles better than at least half of the players on any 'top 100 guitarists of all time' list - Hendrix included. Teenage me used to scoff at the like of John Lennon being on those lists, I could outplay him all day, I thought. These days, I'd much rather listen to Lennon's guitar work than Steve Vai's!

[cheque]

oh jesus christ, I only wanted it to post hyperlinks rather than the thumbnails    

If you use the link that YouTube gives you from the “Share” button it’ll show up as the video on here. To use it as a hyperlink you need to just paste the url as it appears in the address bar of your browser- it’ll have the word “watch” in the middle of it

[teestub]

*This is an interesting concept though. Can the two really be separated? I'm not sure. There are literally thousands of bedroom players on YouTube who are miles better than at least half of the players on any 'top 100 guitarists of all time' list - Hendrix included. Teenage me used to scoff at the like of John Lennon being on those lists, I could outplay him all day, I thought. These days, I'd much rather listen to Lennon's guitar work than Steve Vai's!

I’ve heard this discussed quite a few times by various metal guitarists on podcasts etc. they all generally agree that these youtube kids are way more technically proficient than them as you say, but they aren’t creating anything, they are just parroting someone else’s creation (putting aside metals roots in blues etc. has anyone created anything since Robert Johnson sold his soul?!).

[Johnny Brown]

Here y’a go.
Bunch of geeks and classical musicians make Bach, uh, different.

My Dad had a big Sky phase for a couple of years when I was about 8. Given you never hear it anywhere, it's incredibly nostalgic for me. We preferred the first album though... less of an Alan Partridge vibe. Westway was the jam, but I always associate Carillon with seeing the west coast of Scotland for the first time, possibly some mixup with Knopfler's Local Hero soundtrack there.

[User deactivated.]

*This is an interesting concept though. Can the two really be separated? I'm not sure. There are literally thousands of bedroom players on YouTube who are miles better than at least half of the players on any 'top 100 guitarists of all time' list - Hendrix included. Teenage me used to scoff at the like of John Lennon being on those lists, I could outplay him all day, I thought. These days, I'd much rather listen to Lennon's guitar work than Steve Vai's!

I’ve heard this discussed quite a few times by various metal guitarists on podcasts etc. they all generally agree that these youtube kids are way more technically proficient than them as you say, but they aren’t creating anything, they are just parroting someone else’s creation (putting aside metals roots in blues etc. has anyone created anything since Robert Johnson sold his soul?!).

Musing on creativity, I think art has always been about standing on the shoulders of giants. From the time that instruments first become amplified, it took around 50 years for metal to come along; there's no way that at that point around 1970, a band could have released 'Obzen', despite having all the equipment they needed. Meshuggah needed Metallica and Sabbath to come first. But they're not alone; Robert Johnson needed Son House and Mozart needed Bach.

The audience needs to be prepared for a new sound too. Even if someone could have produced NAS's 'Illmatic' in 1950, it would have gone down like a lead balloon. I've heard the claim that chords weren't really used until the a certain point in history because any harmonic complexity above that of a fifth or octave interval would have been too much for the audience, and perhaps the composer. Today's average listener is familiar with hearing chords (even up to sevenths and ninths, which were never used in Bach's music), but the average listener might find a lot of contemporary Jazz harmony to be jarring - same goes for other musical devices such polyrhythms, screamed vocals and... whatever wizardry it is that Autechre use! 

Anyway, I've gone completely off topic and agree that kids shredding to Polyphia in their bedrooms aren't doing anything special 

[Mike Highbury]

What I love about this thread is that I have absolutely no idea what any you are talking about,

and that delights me no end.

[jwi]

chords weren't really used until the a certain point in history because any harmonic complexity above that of a fifth or octave interval would have been too much for the audience, and perhaps the composer. Today's average listener is familiar with hearing chords (even up to sevenths and ninths, which were never used in Bach's music)

I don't think this is true at all. Plenty of spicy harmony (sharp elevens!) in this piece from Pérotin the great (from the early 1200s)



Generally speaking, Bach is also a lot more harmonically advanced than Mozart.
In this piece, chosen more or less randomly, almost any chord that has dominant function has a major or minor seventh extension, and I hear many 9s and even passing 11ths

[User deactivated.]

I should have stayed in my comfy metal lane! My knowledge thins out dramatically before the 1960's...

[AMorris]

there's no way that at that point around 1970, a band could have released 'Obzen', despite having all the equipment they needed.

[SA Chris]

What I love about this thread is that I have absolutely no idea what any you are talking about,

and that delights me no end.

Amen, me all over.

Getting like Louis Balfour

[AMorris]

I wanted with all my heart to put a Guthrie Govan piece on here, being my absolutely hands down favourite guitarist, but he is more jazz/fusion/funk/whateverhewantstobeatthetime than metal. I would recommend his solo in Drive On by Steven Wilson though. Transcendental stuff. Keep in mind he pretty much improvises ever solo he plays too.

I'm not really into the genres Govan typically plays, but purely on his proficiency as a guitarist and not his creative output*, my God if he's not the best electric guitarist who's ever lived!

*This is an interesting concept though. Can the two really be separated? I'm not sure. There are literally thousands of bedroom players on YouTube who are miles better than at least half of the players on any 'top 100 guitarists of all time' list - Hendrix included. Teenage me used to scoff at the like of John Lennon being on those lists, I could outplay him all day, I thought. These days, I'd much rather listen to Lennon's guitar work than Steve Vai's!

I absolutely agree, Govan is beyond belief in the breadth and depth of his technical ability. Truly the most terrifying guitarist alive. I am a big jazz and fusion fan, so I love his creative output too.

Just scrolling through instagram will expose you to some absolutely amazing but relatively unknown guitar players who are orders of magnitude more skilled than the vast majority of rock and metal legends. People like Matteo Mancuso, Josh Meader, and Stephen Taranto are astounding. But that is the case for basically any gradually progressing discipline. It would be like comparing climbers from the 80s and 90s to Aidan and Will. They aren't in the same league (I can already hear people bashing "BUT MUTATION!" into the text box). Any discipline where you can measure greats from a previous generation against the cream of subsequent generations shows an upwards trend in ability*. This just goes to show that creativity play a greater part than skill in how we select musicians for prominence (if you ignore the big money genres, which I am because that is a  ).

*though it is interesting to note that where direct comparison is not possible, people will argue to the ends of the earth that the oldies were better than the current gen. For example, people will argue until they are blue in the face that Muhammed Ali would beat Tyson Fury

[User deactivated.]

I absolutely agree, Govan is beyond belief in the breadth and depth of his technical ability. Truly the most terrifying guitarist alive. I am a big jazz and fusion fan, so I love his creative output too.

Just scrolling through instagram will expose you to some absolutely amazing but relatively unknown guitar players who are orders of magnitude more skilled than the vast majority of rock and metal legends. People like Matteo Mancuso, Josh Meader, and Stephen Taranto are astounding. But that is the case for basically any gradually progressing discipline. It would be like comparing climbers from the 80s and 90s to Aidan and Will. They aren't in the same league (I can already hear people bashing "BUT MUTATION!" into the text box). Any discipline where you can measure greats from a previous generation against the cream of subsequent generations shows an upwards trend in ability*. This just goes to show that creativity play a greater part than skill in how we select musicians for prominence (if you ignore the big money genres, which I am because that is a  ).

*though it is interesting to note that where direct comparison is not possible, people will argue to the ends of the earth that the oldies were better than the current gen. For example, people will argue until they are blue in the face that Muhammed Ali would beat Tyson Fury

I knew exactly where this was going at the part in bold. Anyone who thinks the talent level in boxing is now lower, across every division, and despite there being more participants worldwide is deluded. The talent pool alone should be enough to convince that the level at the top is improving, never mind the advancements in sport science, nutrition and supplementation (legal or otherwise). I will say that the rate of improvement is likely to have been lower than in climbing which is a younger sport, so I don't discount the idea that a phenom like Ali could have been a serious challenger in 2023, but going further back to Marciano? Nah, no chance.