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Munich Euro Champs 2022 - Sport Climbing - How to Watch on Beeb (Read 7013 times)

mattbirddog

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BBC info released on Sport Climbing at the Euro Champs.

Looks like they will be showing Semi's and Finals of all events online which is great. If I can dig out word of a qualification stream I will post here. will pop the links for climbing as they go up also.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/62469065

gme

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Its being streamed live on IFSC page. No commentary or scores so not much idea of what is happening.

Women's lead at minute.

gme

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looks like it was a fuck up as it now says not available in your region.

mattbirddog

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Ok, could work but apparently this link will be showing the climbing today over on the IFSC

https://www.ifsc-climbing.org/

Duma

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Works for me atm, thanks Matt!

mattbirddog

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Wmns lead semis on iPlayer now 💪

Bradders

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Wmns lead semis on iPlayer now 💪

How do you find it in the app?

Edit: found it. Had to go here first; https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0bdmc07

GazM

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Who are the BBC commentators? Think I recognise Matt Groom's voice but who's the lass? Quite useful to know who they are so there's some context to their chat.

sherlock

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It's Sofja Yokoyama, Swiss lassie.

GazM

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Cool, cheers Sherlock! Was it my imagination or does she have a vaguely Scottish accent?

moose

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Spoilers re mens's bouldering final

NSFW  :
I thought the mens' bouldering final was a let down.  No one did anything on P1 and only one zone on P4, which didn't really matter.  So the medal positions were determined by numbers of attempts on P2 and P3.  All rather unsatisfying - especially P4 - it was set up for a shoot-out and comprised 10 minutes of all but one competitor repeatedly fail to do the first move!  I wonder if it was a conditions issue? Was the hold set very conditions dependent and the problems set when it was much cooler / less humid? 

I just hope today's mens' lead and women's bouldering offer more sustained drama

Duma

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Semis were even worse, pretty much entirely decided on one problem.

scragrock

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Even accepting that setting for these comps/competitors is near impossible i agree with Moose & Duma on this one, It was a bit of a let down.

Was the setting team different that the usual IFSC World cup make up?
some other factor? or just a bad couple of days?

mattbirddog

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Yeah wasn't great. Remi is a flipping awesome setter but sadly didn't pan out on this one. Women's semis round seems a lot better bar one nuts boulder.

IanP

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Agree on the mens bouldering, however thought the womens lead final route was excellent, impressive to watch with exciting looking climbing but also good separation and despite the fairly obvious outcome (does that count as a spoiler?) got to see everyone try hard.  Last fall could have been nasty though.

sherlock

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Agree on the mens bouldering, however thought the womens lead final route was excellent, impressive to watch with exciting looking climbing but also good separation and despite the fairly obvious outcome (does that count as a spoiler?) got to see everyone try hard.  Last fall could have been nasty though.
The interview with the winner
"I thought I was going to die!"  :o

J_duds

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It was a great lead final, amazing route, and a scary fall!

There's some great pictures of the fall and the scared face (of the winner) in this collection of images on IG:
https://www.instagram.com/p/ChNGlGMDqtD/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

gme

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Any idea why Hamish is DNS in the lead semi.

abarro81

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Commentator said he was ill but didn't elaborate

Duma

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Ievgeniia Kazbekova had food poisoning (hence her lead final result) maybe Hamish ate at the same place?

IanP

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Womens finals live on IPlayer, not easy but seem much better set than mens, some exciting stuff.

Spoiler:

NSFW  :
Peak Janja on W2


Duma

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Thought all the lead rounds were excellent, impressive wall and setting gave some great looking moves without it feeling too gimmicky.

Women's boulder finals good too

Spoilers:
NSFW  :
after W1, when everyone else got further, I thought we might even have an upset! Obvs she  then casually outclassed everyone on the other problems.
Thought Gibert was a bit unlucky to finish 6th after being the only one apart from JG to get the bonus on W2, and finding a great sequence on W4, but you can't afford to miss the "easy" problem, and messing up the start position on W4 twice is pretty slack.
Didn't affect the medals, but my favourite moment was Chloe beating the buzzer on W3, esp after that horrible fall.

mattbirddog

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Womens finals live on IPlayer, not easy but seem much better set than mens, some exciting stuff.

Spoiler:

NSFW  :
Peak Janja on W2

I think by listing all those moments, you showed how much of a better final it was than the men's boulder. It's only been a day or so and already I can hardly remember the boulders. I thought the Lead has been consistently great all around and agree on the crowd and hell, even the mascot felt like a good thing and worth it alone for that picture of Ondra banging a squirrel's drum.

Duma

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Not over yet, first look at the Paris format in action this week...

Women's on Weds:
Boulder 1400 BST
Lead 1600 BST

Men's on Thurs:
Boulder 1400 BST
Lead 1600 BST

edshakey

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Is there a list of finalists anywhere? Can't see it on the app or website but all the qualifiers are done so it should be possible to find out (although I'm not bothered enough to do the calculations myself)

Wil

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Top 8 based on ranking scores from the weekend.


[Edit] A bit small to read:

Women:
Garnbret, Meul, Pilz, Adamovska, Caulier, Moroni, Krampl, Kazbekova

Men:
Ondra, Gines Lopez, Potocar, Uznik, Schubert, Schenk, Avezou, Schalk
[/Edit]

Duma

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Thanks Wil.

Interesting, so if qualification for the combined is just based on sum of ranking points, how is the event itself going to be scored? Multiplication as inTokyo? Addition as in qualification? Or is the weird scoring system they were using in the boulder rounds going to come into it somehow?

Duma

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Also, and OT, but can we have a separate comps board please? Having all the threads (except this one) hidden 2 layers down under

places to visit > indoor walls > competitions

Might have made sense in 2003 or whenever the forum structure was set up, but feels ridiculous now.

mattbirddog

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Thanks Wil.

Interesting, so if qualification for the combined is just based on sum of ranking points, how is the event itself going to be scored? Multiplication as inTokyo? Addition as in qualification? Or is the weird scoring system they were using in the boulder rounds going to come into it somehow?

It is additional... so maximum of 100 points available in boulder (25 per boulder) and 100 points in Lead so the perfect score is 200 points in a combined round.

New things to remember in combined:

2 zones on offer - 3 points for zone 1 and 6 points for zone 2. 25 points for the top - minus 0.1 per additional goes. So 25 for a flash, 24.9 second go etc.

Lead - 100 points divided by number of holds so... say there are 50 holds it is 2 points per hold as you go.

Thoughts:

Having watched the new scoring in the individual events, you can see all the fun/suspense of the event being over by boulder. If Janja or Ondra is one boulder up on the others - it would be quite something to see them make a 25 point gap. If the competitor comes out last knowing the score then you could have quite an anticlimatic ending where they pull on for a bit then pop off and celebrate but here is hoping it doesnt. On the flip side, i can see it being very dramatic if you have a cricket style point chase at the end but not sure this field will lead for that to happen.

SA Chris

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Is this the first event where they've used this new scoring system, or just the first I've watched?

Wil

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Lead - 100 points divided by number of holds so... say there are 50 holds it is 2 points per hold as you go.

The lead isn't scored like this. The last 15 moves are worth 5 points each, the 10 before that are 2 points each, then 1 point each next 5, and nothing before that. So that extra top in bouldering is only 3 - 5 moves higher up the lead route, depending on Zones and attempts.

mattbirddog

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Sorry - I didn't read Annex 1 in the rules!  :(

This format has been tried once before in Spain for a test event with the Spanish federation but wasn't streamed anywhere.

Bradders

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Thought all the lead rounds were excellent, impressive wall and setting gave some great looking moves without it feeling too gimmicky.

Women's boulder finals good too

Spoilers:
NSFW  :
after W1, when everyone else got further, I thought we might even have an upset! Obvs she  then casually outclassed everyone on the other problems.
Thought Gibert was a bit unlucky to finish 6th after being the only one apart from JG to get the bonus on W2, and finding a great sequence on W4, but you can't afford to miss the "easy" problem, and messing up the start position on W4 twice is pretty slack.
Didn't affect the medals, but my favourite moment was Chloe beating the buzzer on W3, esp after that horrible fall.

When was the last time JG didn't top a finals boulder?!

The big shame with the setting for the men's is that the male field is, I think, far more competitive. I looked at the semi finals line up for both the men's lead and boulder and thought any one of them could make finals, whereas about half the women's field didn't look anywhere near. Shame therefore that the men's boulders didn't quite work out.

Duma

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Thanks both. So as I understand it attempts make no difference for bonuses? (That's how it was showing on screen at the weekend) Could be controversial if there's a hard set of problems? (8 bonuses beats a slow top)

Wil

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Thanks both. So as I understand it attempts make no difference for bonuses? (That's how it was showing on screen at the weekend) Could be controversial if there's a hard set of problems? (8 bonuses beats a slow top)

I'm not quite sure what you mean with "8 bonuses beats a slow top". For the boulder round you score either 3, 6 or 25, minus 0.1 for every unsuccessful attempt, so the 0.1 really just acts as a tie breaker.

A hard set of boulders certainly unbalances it, or even just one impossible problem. My rough and ready analysis from previous comps (obviously designed under different rules, limited data etc) is that lead scores will, on average, be higher than boulder.

Duma

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Climber 1 gets to the second bonus on every problem but no tops : 8x3=24

Climber 2 tops one problem in 11 attempts, but gets no other bonuses : 25-(11x0.1)=23.9

Climber 1 wins, despite no tops.

There's other variations, admittedly all unlikely, but possible.

SA Chris

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second bonus on every problem is surely a better performance than topping 1 plus no other bonuses?

Duma

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More likely to have an impact is not taking account of attempts to bonuses. Seems very strange to me, why not simply make the deductions from the total score for that boulder?? It's so obviously wrong I feel like it must have been a fuck up in the on screen scoring of the individual event

Duma

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second bonus on every problem is surely a better performance than topping 1 plus no other bonuses?

Absolutely not.

Wil

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From the rules:
Quote
The score awarded to a competitor will be the relevant Base Score decremented by 0.1 for
each attempt made prior to that on which the relevant scoring hold was Controlled.

Which implies that you lose 0.1 for every unsuccessful attempt prior to your highpoint, so it would count for zones too. This wasn't happening for the live scores shown last weekend.

Example scores from the IFSC:
Quote
A1 z1 Z1 T1 25.0
A1 z1 Z1 T0 6.0
A1 z1 Z0 T0 3.0
A4 z1 Z1 T4 24.7
A2 z1 Z2 T0 5.9
A2 z1 Z0 T0 3.0
A4 z0 Z0 T4 24.7
A4 z1 Z2 T0 5.9
A2 z2 Z0 T0 2.9
A4 z2 Z2 T0 5.9


Duma

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From the rules:
Quote
The score awarded to a competitor will be the relevant Base Score decremented by 0.1 for
each attempt made prior to that on which the relevant scoring hold was Controlled.

Which implies that you lose 0.1 for every unsuccessful attempt prior to your highpoint, so it would count for zones too. This wasn't happening for the live scores shown last weekend.

Example scores from the IFSC:
Quote
A1 z1 Z1 T1 25.0
A1 z1 Z1 T0 6.0
A1 z1 Z0 T0 3.0
A4 z1 Z1 T4 24.7
A2 z1 Z2 T0 5.9
A2 z1 Z0 T0 3.0
A4 z0 Z0 T4 24.7
A4 z1 Z2 T0 5.9
A2 z2 Z0 T0 2.9
A4 z2 Z2 T0 5.9
Thanks Wil! That makes sense, just the in screen scoring wrong then. Hopefully that's sorted out for today!

This also makes my example above much less likely, as climber 1 would need to flash to all the bonuses.

sherlock

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For those who haven't watched yet, Women's Combined Boulder livestream had technical issues but it does eventually improve around half way through.

Duma

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The last 15 moves are worth 5 points each, the 10 before that are 2 points each, then 1 point each next 5, and nothing before that. So that extra top in bouldering is only 3 - 5 moves higher up the lead route, depending on Zones and attempts.

Just said on the telly 10 pts for a top? 13 holds before worth 5, then as you said

Duma

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Although someone just scored 90 and only got to two holds before the top, so who knows...

Bradders

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Is the combined final on iPlayer somewhere? I can't find it.

webbo

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It was on the BBC 2 feed I think it’s about 45 minutes in. After the diving.

Duma

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I watched on iPlayer this afternoon, assume it's still available somewhere

Duma

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So I've now realised attempts only matter in case of ties, as even one move on the lead wall is almost certainly worth more than any difference in attempts. Not sure I agree with this. A climber flashing several problems and falling one move lower on the lead should beat another who took multiple attempts to do those boulders IMO.

Wil

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A climber flashing several problems and falling one move lower on the lead should beat another who took multiple attempts to do those boulders IMO.

I think the -0.1 for attempts and +0.1 for a + in lead certainly needs to be looked at e.g. a + higher on the lead route could be worth more, or attempts could be scored with increasing consequence. As you say it is purely a tie breaker at the moment.

mattbirddog

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ah man that final for the men's was so cool! Big up to the setters...delivered the whole way through in this round.

Duma

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ah man that final for the men's was so cool! Big up to the setters...delivered the whole way through in this round.

Agreed, setting perfect for this round.

However:

A climber flashing several problems and falling one move lower on the lead should beat another who took multiple attempts to do those boulders IMO.

Illustrates this quite nicely!

NSFW  :
I think Ondra should probably have won, his flashes of the last two boulders are worth more to me than one extra move on a lead route. (Though Jakob did the hardest boulder, so I'm not too outraged)
Could solve this by just adding bonus points (say 3) for flashes, and an equivalent amount to the top of the lead route. obvs means you don't get a nice round 200 pts, but so what?

 

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