Quote from: Teaboy on December 28, 2021, 11:55:00 amNow this has its own thread maybe we can get a list of those outcrop routes that have genuinely hard climbing free from the miasma of the E grade. A couple that haven’t been mentioned are Captain Invincible at Burbage, Toxic Bilberries at Wilton, Transform and Purgatory at back BowdenThis would be a fun list I reckon! To pick a few from Franco's post that'd fit the criteria and add a few grades to the ones you suggested:Hard cheese, ~8cBarron greenback, I think Pete said it was around 8b?Nothing Lasts, was it Ned or Dan V who suggested ~8A?Captain Invincible, ~8bCaptain Invincible, ~8bToxic BilberriesTranscendence (I assume you meant this, dont think there's a route called Transform at Bowden), ~7C+ or 8bPurgatory, ~8A+
Now this has its own thread maybe we can get a list of those outcrop routes that have genuinely hard climbing free from the miasma of the E grade. A couple that haven’t been mentioned are Captain Invincible at Burbage, Toxic Bilberries at Wilton, Transform and Purgatory at back Bowden
The fall is pretty bad off any of it. You start off a ledge on the right and do a no hands traverse along a rail. This is British 6cish (if you can grade no hands stuff) and really cool (the start to Sky burial). Michaela described the original sky burial as two amazing (and not the difficult) comp boulder problems with a no hands rest inbetween. Shame the block fell of the top crux. This start bit is highball height, but you'd take a minging bashy fall if you fell off. You then get to a very good rest at the junction with the new section of climbing. The next 9 hand movements are almost all of the challenge of the route. If you fall off here you're screwed. The hooks are close by, but having pulled much better hooks, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't hold. I'm struggling to think of a peak equivalent to the fall, but maybe something like falling off the top of end of the affair with no gear? Or from the top crux of knocking on heavens door? I can't really picture those landings perfectly, but it's definitely really bad news. The mats are there as the ground is interspersed with rocks and I hoped they'd bounce me out, rather than limbs getting caught in the brambles, mud and rocks. Me and Tom have wondered about whether you could survive a fall, but falling is our core skill. If one of these people who was actually good at climbing fell off that, with all their muscles stopping their limbs rotating properly, I'd be amazed if they weren't in hospital with multiple broken bones or dead. There is also a subsidiary cliff below this one (that's why I had a 3rd rope with Tom jumping off the ledge). I reckoned I could probably stop before this, but if you didnt, that's another 20m drop. Death gets talked about a lot in climbing, which again is usually hyperbole, but I can't think of many things with a worse fall. I don't know the breakdown of that crux section. I probably havent done a boulder problem in a few years. I've done some stuff in the county like Antihydral and some of the other high font 7s on tiny crimps and it's harder than them, but they're kind of easy if you have good skin... I suppose some of the best stuff for me to use as benchmarks are the routes that I've linked on top rope. It's defo harder climbing than anything I've been on on peak grit for example (except maybe the groove, which I failed on, but then it was really hot...)I've never been on equilibrium, but I watched someone top rope it the other week. From a rope work perspective, it looked eminently safe for a ground up, if you slung that bottom boulder and had a running belay. Can't comment on the climbing like. Sounds hard.Sorry. None of that is very useful. I had intended on repeating some routes before now, as i have a few dialled, but the weather didnt play ball. Hopefully Steve will go for another look. That's what we really need!
So to summarise, Immortal has a crux sequence of 7C+/8A, on snappy Rock, with guaranteed death or unthinkable injuries if you fall.Is there anything else claimed with that level of seriousness and difficulty?
So to summarise, Immortal has a crux sequence of 7C+/8A (harder than all the high 7 boulders you've done in the county), on snappy Rock, with guaranteed death or unthinkable injuries if you fall. I mean it sounds like the real deal, and is surely a huge step up from all other trad routes in the country. Is there anything else claimed with that level of seriousness and difficulty?
Toxic Bilberries... I can elaborate on this having put quite a bit time into it over the years. Essentially F7B+ (50/50 full on morpho dyno for small crimp) with a fall that could go all ways depending on if you catch the edge and pop, or miss it entirely, and your trajectory after. Busted ankle on ledge or upside down deckage into banking or gear rip deck or nice friendly swing across face. After the boulder problem, another 7A/+ boulder and then a rather scary run for the top, with nasty tech 6a rock over to safety. Gaz suggested at the time F8a+/8b as a route.E8 7a in the guide.
I don't think anyone is getting ahead of themselves, you said with quite a lot of confidence that it's harder than all of the high 7 boulders you've done of a similar style, how is that not saying that it's at least 7C+/8A ish? You've also pretty categorically said that it's going to be a simply terrible fall where death is a distinct possibility.
P. S. Please don't do the whole self deprecating "I'm rubbish and weak" thing that some brits seem so partial to, it's a bit tedious!
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