[Steve R]

Saw this morning and whilst I wasn't sufficiently interested to watch much of it, the bits I did see were enough to motivate me to post it here and complain about it.
Firstly, would like to point out I really respect Pete as a climber (and as a person from the handful of times I've met him) and this isn't meant as a personal criticism.  More a general criticism and expression of concern on how increased participation and commercialisation of climbing have/are/will compromise the crags.

Anyway the things which made me wince in the video:
-the whole premise of charging around the plantation in a lame challenge context
-challenging other people/youtubers to do the same
-brushing vigorously (at damp rock for extra squirm factor) and filming it
-making the video on a wettish day, saying the rock's wet, doing it anyway
-etc.

I've nothing against people making money out of climbing (good on them) but I'd argue a line needs to be drawn where anything commercial involving outdoor climbing on real rock has to first off be about education and a (once well established?) culture of respect.   Respect for the environment, rock, other climbers, other poeple there, etc. Pious and boring as that may be.

Also master's edge  - just leave it the fuck alone now.

[Wellsy]

I definitely was surprised to see someone say "ah yeah its wet! Annoying" and then climb loads of stuff. I imagine it was mostly dry but still.

[steveri]

I'm not normally a fan of 'my kind of fun is better than your kind of fun' ...but not my kind of fun. The rock is a playground sure but it's not a flipping playground.

I was just thinking earlier, as a tribe we really do lack imagination. Ah, Plantation! Almost all the offbeat venues I've been to recently have been great days out.

[36chambers]

Anyway the things which made me wince in the video:
-the whole premise of charging around the plantation in a lame challenge context
-challenging other people/youtubers to do the same
-brushing vigorously (at damp rock for extra squirm factor) and filming it
-making the video on a wettish day, saying the rock's wet, doing it anyway
-etc.

- Dragging the pads all over the place.
- At one point, only cleaning one shoe saying he only needs the one, then using the dirty wet one anyway...

It all seems rather poorly thought out. I blame youtube for hiding dislikes.

[spidermonkey09]

Shit, shit practice. Just take it down already.

[Will Hunt]

Anyway the things which made me wince in the video:
-the whole premise of charging around the plantation in a lame challenge context
-challenging other people/youtubers to do the same
-brushing vigorously (at damp rock for extra squirm factor) and filming it
-making the video on a wettish day, saying the rock's wet, doing it anyway
-etc.

-heels on the Green Traverse

- Dragging the pads all over the place.
- At one point, only cleaning one shoe saying he only needs the one, then using the dirty wet one anyway...

It all seems rather poorly thought out. I blame youtube for hiding dislikes.

[Duma]

- V grades

[Will Hunt]

- chalking the foothold on Not to be Taken Away.

I don't participate in witch hunts, and the rock didn't look particularly wet, though it was clearly mizzling at one point, but I'm astonished that social media savvy people would put that up with so much in it to rile up the internet mob.

[remus]

Anyway the things which made me wince in the video:
-the whole premise of charging around the plantation in a lame challenge context
-challenging other people/youtubers to do the same
...

Also master's edge - just leave it the fuck alone now.

It's an interesting pont, but at the same time I feel like as more experienced climbers we can be a bit hypocritical when it comes to heavy usage of particular venues. I guess there's plenty of sheffield based climbers on here who enjoy a good solo circuit up on stanage (for the nth time), or a quick hit to plantation.

[Ross Barker]

Video appears to have been taken down now, just as I was getting ready to see all the fuss.

[Bradders]

Video appears to have been taken down now, just as I was getting ready to see all the fuss.

Ah man, I was saving that till later!

[teestub]

Ah shit, I just found my pitchfork at the back of the shed, what am I meant to do with these flaming torches now?

[Bradders]

Burn the heretics anyway, it's 2021 we don't need evidence!

[Johnny Brown]

Firstly, would like to point out I really respect Pete as a climber (and as a person from the handful of times I've met him) and this isn't meant as a personal criticism.

Pete who?

[SA Chris]

P-Widdy

[36chambers]

Ah shit, I just found my pitchfork at the back of the shed, what am I meant to do with these flaming torches now?

dry the rock at Stanage?

[Steve R]

Anyway the things which made me wince in the video:
-the whole premise of charging around the plantation in a lame challenge context
-challenging other people/youtubers to do the same
...

Also master's edge - just leave it the fuck alone now.

It's an interesting pont, but at the same time I feel like as more experienced climbers we can be a bit hypocritical when it comes to heavy usage of particular venues. I guess there's plenty of sheffield based climbers on here who enjoy a good solo circuit up on stanage (for the nth time), or a quick hit to plantation.

I don't think there's danger of hypocrisy here.  People should climb whatever they want as many times as they want*.  It's a question of approach, attitude and having a degree of humility.  (and not trashing stuff and setting a bad example for the sake of making money and/or bolstering fame)

* at least up to a point, as permitted by some version of Rawls' equal liberty principle

[Fiend]

Respect the....



TBH taking the video down so we can't all rubberneck and froth in irate judgementalism is just as bad....

[petejh]

Firstly, would like to point out I really respect Pete as a climber (and as a person from the handful of times I've met him) and this isn't meant as a personal criticism.

Pete who?

Not me, no-one would ever respect me as a climber.

[DAVETHOMAS90]

Anyway the things which made me wince in the video:
-the whole premise of charging around the plantation in a lame challenge context
-challenging other people/youtubers to do the same
...

Also master's edge - just leave it the fuck alone now.

It's an interesting pont, but at the same time I feel like as more experienced climbers we can be a bit hypocritical when it comes to heavy usage of particular venues. I guess there's plenty of sheffield based climbers on here who enjoy a good solo circuit up on stanage (for the nth time), or a quick hit to plantation.

Totally.

Good points raised to be aware of, but I watched the video, and actually thought "good challenge" - as in it would be good to try this, though probably somewhere else.

A lot of the behaviour was at a level somewhat lower than what you'd see any weekend day through the winter - which is not to say "Don't be mindful of your impact". To that end, yes, it could have been presented far differently; a good example could have been set.

However, in terms of impact, the challenge requires being able to climb things relatively well and quickly. In contrast, think about the traffic you'd normally associate with a problem like Zippy's - or The Green Traverse.

My view on pads in general is that they contribute to excessive wear, because you can set nearly any problem up to "session" on it. I did crack a couple of ribs in 2019, landing on my side, trying something new without pads though

So, in Pete's defence, I can come on to a public forum and be critical in my own way, and yes, I noticed the pads, the wet rock, brushing etc, but what registered with me was "That looks fun" - which is to highlight just how selective we can be when pointing the finger 

I notice that no one has said anything about the tick marks on Ryuichi's new problem, amazing though it is.

[Bradders]

On the subject of the general challenge; not having watched the video I'm assuming it was trying to climb as many V points as possible?

If so, in a sport defined by arbitrary challenges that really is one of the best days out you can have. Going to a venue you have wired and climbing loads of great problems in a day, it's great! And as Dave rightly points out, realistically far less impactful to the rock than a sieging aspirant trying to push their grade.

[User deactivated.]

far less impactful to the rock than a sieging aspirant trying to push their grade.

NSFW  :

Ben's Groove must be fucked by now 

[Fiend]

  open goal but top shot anyway.

[SamT]

Not sure anyone has an issue with Pete heading out and doing a whole bunch of problems at the plantation.  Call it a circuit if you like. 

More the framing of it as a 'challenge' thrown down to others, sprayed on Social Media, with the aim of generating personal income coupled with the fact that conditions were less than perfect, yet they ploughed on with the filming, whilst engaging in some less then perfect tactics like over brushing and chalking of footholds.

I blame Magnus, but at least his stuff seems to be largely gym based.

I have much respect for Pete and Tom, and 99% of what they do is top drawer, like all the crack school stuff, bridge climbing etc, but this stepped over a line I think.   Smacks of running out of ideas and having to scrape the barrel a bit to find something 'new' or different.  Bit like James and Caro.

Hence the endless string of 'challenges' that folk are up to now.

Right - this weekend I'll be off to make a movie of me doing all pete liveseys peak routes, in a day, one handed, wearing resoled lasers, but unicycling between them all.

[Bonjoy]

I notice that no one has said anything about the tick marks on Ryuichi's new problem, amazing though it is.

This may be an unpopular opinion, but...
I think there is a general conflation of using tick marks and leaving tick marks.
In my view the former is fine, if frequently ugly and overdone. The latter is when it becomes litter and objectionable.
You could argue that showing videos depicting ticks without footage of their removal at the end of the session encourages the inexperienced to use then leave ticks. Personally I'm happy enough not to see the 'brush off' footage as mandatory on every video (now and again is often enough) as it would quickly get old, tokenistic, and patronising.
I think it's a stretch to expect someone doing possibly the hardest pair of low percentage accuracy moves in the world, without something which helps their execution, something which of itself is harmless to the rock, or other people's enjoyment of it.
I think as community we are big enough to educate sensible, minimal use, rather than demand the baby is thrown out with the bathwater in all and every circumstance.