[petejh]

Pete is definitely ahead when it comes to  suggesting pragmatic approaches to mitigate the obvious impacts of Brexit on European travel:  ideas include (i) get visa, (ii) don't bother and (iii) have E27k

Not really.. the underlying point is that, despite protestations by people I labelled moaning cunts in a spirit of tongue in cheek banter (Paul..), for 99% of climbers in the context of going climbing in the schengen area there aren't any obvious impacts of brexit.

For the tiny cohort of trustifarian vanlifers and time-rich retirees, there are still perfectly workable options.

[ali k]

Personally whilst I think Brexit was fucking stupid I don't get exercised by it these days in the same way Barrows/Ali do. Maybe because I hadn't really had the chance to go to Europe for longer than a few months I just don't miss what I never experienced?

I did. I drove down to Spain with a car load of stuff and no real plans. Found a job within a month and ended up staying for 5 years. F*cking migrants! The fact that can no longer happen still makes me sad and a bit angry, especially when there are no upsides to Brexit to balance out all the shit. Less than a year into it I'm ok with still being pissed about that.

Lamenting a past reality, that no longer exists and isn’t coming back, isn’t a productive use of time and doesn’t offer any value in negotiating the present reality.

Irony overload! The only reason we're in this mess is because of all the fuckwits that were looking back with rose tinted spectacles wishing their non-bendy bananas were weighed out in lbs and the Empire still controlled a quarter of the globe.

[Teaboy]

Not really.. the underlying point is that, despite protestations by people I labelled moaning cunts in a spirit of tongue in cheek banter (Paul..), for 99% of climbers in the context of going climbing in the schengen area there aren't any obvious impacts of brexit.

https://www.which.co.uk/news/2021/11/uk-holidaymakers-to-pay-6-visa-fee-to-visit-europe-after-brexit/

Mobile roaming charges returning.

These are the obvious tangible ones at the moment but how long before travel insurance goes up to cover medical eventualities, longer queues at passport control, more stringent border controls etc.

[Will Hunt]

I for one hold Pete entirely responsible for Brexit.

[petejh]

Personally whilst I think Brexit was fucking stupid I don't get exercised by it these days in the same way Barrows/Ali do. Maybe because I hadn't really had the chance to go to Europe for longer than a few months I just don't miss what I never experienced?

I did. I drove down to Spain with a car load of stuff and no real plans. Found a job within a month and ended up staying for 5 years. F*cking migrants! The fact that can no longer happen still makes me sad and a bit angry, especially when there are no upsides to Brexit to balance out all the shit. Less than a year into it I'm ok with still being pissed about that.

In 2003 I travelled to NZ and lived there for a year on a visa, doing fuck all work and just climbing. In 2004 I moved to Canada and lived there for 4 years on successive 12-month visas, doing bits of work and mostly climbing. I really don't get what the moaning cunts (TIC) are moaning about. You can travel the world on visas climbing, including the schengen area. The freedom to have adventures, travel and generally swanning around doing whatever the fuck you want is still there. I'm not sure the mindset is as strong though. The moaning seems to be coming from a small subset of over-privileged folk with limited horizons who seem to view only being able to spend 6-months per year in schengen - which actually can be extended to 12 months - as some kind of prison of their freedoms to explore the world. Excuse me while I go and play my tiny non-existent violin.

[Paul B]

Not really.. the underlying point is that, despite protestations by people I labelled moaning cunts in a spirit of tongue in cheek banter (Paul..), for 99% of climbers in the context of going climbing in the schengen area there aren't any obvious impacts of brexit.

Until the border guard doesn't do a good job of stamping your passport (I'd seen it before Snr Barros brought it up on here)? Or, they're with Three so get until Mar next year before Go Roam gets binned and they're with everybody else? Or, the fact you get slammed into a much bigger queue upon arrival? Granted I've seen bigger problems in life but these are all a pain in the arse and they're pretty obvious to me.

Perhaps I'm a bit touchy as any discussions with my family where there's a tangible downside I get some vague shrug and a "they'll sort it out" 

I'm not saying that there aren't alternatives or ways round the 180-day limit, simply that there are now more barriers to long periods of travel within the Schengen area (which is a fact) and that's something I think is a bit of a shame/shit.

[remus]

I like how, within the space of a day, Shark's thread celebrating the youth of today has descended into the usual back and forth 

[SA Chris]

No it hasn't

[Oldmanmatt]

No it hasn't

Oh ffs! It has happened, so just suck it up.
It’s so obvious that once done, it cannot be undone…

[abarro81]

Fucking remus, always moaning about things that have long since past.

p.s. Tesco mobile and a couple of others still had free roaming last time I looked, though the list is dwindling rapidly. (And since it's only a bit of a pain in the ass to buy European SIMs or pay £5 per day for the privilege of replying to work emails from the crag you're not allowed to moan when they also disappear)

[Fultonius]

Fucking remus, always moaning about things that have long since past.

p.s. Tesco mobile and a couple of others still had free roaming last time I looked, though the list is dwindling rapidly. (And since it's only a bit of a pain in the ass to buy European SIMs or pay £5 per day for the privilege of replying to work emails from the crag you're not allowed to moan when they also disappear)

GiffGaff are are still doing EU roaming. 20Gb limit /month

[ali k]

Edit: I fully understand other people’s point of view about the EU and their upset at their preferred option not being the reality. I actually wouldn’t have cared very much if the ref had gone the other way and would happily have gone on with life, perhaps thinking it was an interesting opportunity lost but hey-ho. But that probably doesn’t fit people’s agendas of a ‘leaver’.

Missed this first time around what with your late edit.

There is no equivalence here between just shrugging your shoulders when the status quo doesn’t change vs the monumental upheaval that Brexit will continue to cause for decades and people being pissed off about that.

There has to be a fucking good reason to move away from the status quo, especially one which brings A LOT of benefits to the country. The fact that even the most ardent Leavers can’t now articulate what we’ve gained from Brexit other than some nebulous concept of ‘sovereignty’ shows what a pointless and self-defeating exercise it has been.

[Teaboy]

(I actually wouldn’t have cared very much if the ref had gone the other way and would happily have gone on with life, perhaps thinking it was an interesting opportunity lost but hey-ho.

Lucky for us we didn’t lose that opportunity, any point me asking for more info of what this opportunity is?

[petejh]

I don't understand how it could ever be anything but nebulous - like any social construct, sovereignty is nebulous! Even money, human rights, and the law don't fundamentally exist other than as nebulous concepts in human imaginations. The concept of a sovereign country having political independence is (somewhat, not massively) important to me. But as Sean rightly points out what you do with that independence matters. This is way OT.

[Duma]

Fucks sake, UKB has many more than enough threads of old people grumbling about politics. Can a mod delete all this shit so the decent original thread might have chance?

[petejh]

Agree, delete or move. Apols for having the wrong view everyone 

[Fiend]

Are those caves actually dry most of that time or just "dry" in that they're not seeping but covered in sea grease ming like most seaside caves?

Yeah fuck Spain, they're gonna be mint this week: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-59540474

[petejh]

Dickhead

The vids were from a solo bolting trip I did in December 2019, I wanted to see what a mild winter storm was like. The cliffs in the first vid and the cave in the second are a good 45m+ high. Only got half a route bolted (the upper half!).

For scale:

[lagerstarfish]

No it hasn't

Oh yes it has

[SA Chris]

oh no it bloody hasn't

[chris j]

...longer queues at passport control, more stringent border controls etc.

We have that already for example at passport control going between Schengen and non- Schengen areas at Schipol and other EU airports where we can't use the e-gates any more as we've been shunted from the EU/EEA queue to the 3rd world undesirable queue... Typically this year it's added 45 minutes to an hour to my connection times. Don't understand why we haven't returned the favour and moved EU passport holders into the rest of the world queue at Heathrow. 

[SA Chris]

I don't need to know that. I have a tight transfer at Schipol in late January, sweating already.

[chris j]

It's a pain in the backside, especially while there's been fewer flights and less choice in connections. Coming from Europe to the UK is generally quicker,  but then you have the lottery of how long the queue is at D8 for the UK Covid paperwork check - that can be 5 minutes or stretch down the concourse past the next gate...

[SA Chris]

Flying late on a Wednesday night, so hopefully off peak.