UKBouldering.com

Calling Of The Gri . . . . . . . . nding?? (Read 9745 times)

Fiend

Online
  • *
  • _
  • forum hero
  • Abominable sex magick practitioner and climbing heathen
  • Posts: 13414
  • Karma: +676/-67
  • Whut
Calling Of The Gri . . . . . . . . nding??
October 28, 2021, 10:05:07 pm
Since the weather is now too warm and too wet for grit, and limestone is still a pile of bollox, maybe it's grinding season?? Angle grinding that is, not skate grinding nor grindcore (although the latter is always valid).

So what are your top picks for angle grinding and chopping bolts and pegs?? For the greater good, the purity of trad, the manning up of not taming sport runouts, or just your own personal maliciousness....

Lots of contenders around at the moment....


Two Tier retrobolts?

Rhoscolyn sport routes?

Wilton 1 lower-offs?

Clogwyn Yr Adar spad routes?

90% of the sub-F6a fucking turd quarried choss that's ruined Peak lime quarries?

Dead Banana lower-off?

All the classic "bit of gear every 6 inches" pure crack lines at Lorry Park Quarry?



Myself I think I'm going to do Twisting By The Pool and Jacuzzi Jive at LPT. Maybe that nice E3 by Pirates too. Just browsing the Toolstation website the now.

mrjonathanr

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 5377
  • Karma: +242/-6
  • Getting fatter, not fitter.
I’d start with Clarion Call and progress in date order from there.

Duncan campbell

Offline
  • ****
  • junky
  • Posts: 764
  • Karma: +47/-2
Supercool for me. The bolts have totally changed the nature of the route for the aid climber now...

webbo

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 5028
  • Karma: +141/-13
Silent Spring
Plague
 :worms:

Fiend

Online
  • *
  • _
  • forum hero
  • Abominable sex magick practitioner and climbing heathen
  • Posts: 13414
  • Karma: +676/-67
  • Whut
Oh I forgot a good un.

Hell's Wall - make it a purer, more aesthetic route in the spirit of mountain trad, by stripping away the 11 (or is it 13?) pegs and reducing the fixed gear to, say, 6 bolts  :yes:

northern yob

Offline
  • ***
  • stalker
  • Posts: 258
  • Karma: +29/-0
Oh I forgot a good un.

Hell's Wall - make it a purer, more aesthetic route in the spirit of mountain trad, by stripping away the 11 (or is it 13?) pegs and reducing the fixed gear to, say, 6 bolts  :yes:

All or nothing surely? Get them all out…. I’m voting for any of the stealth pegs at Gogarth all unnecessary,a blot on an otherwise great venue, closely followed by down the road in Rhoscolyn. The Welsh have lost it.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2021, 10:25:24 am by northern yob »

Duncan campbell

Offline
  • ****
  • junky
  • Posts: 764
  • Karma: +47/-2
 :lol:  Where do you live Northern yob? I really love your staying true to your feelings on this. I want to know so much about you!

I feel very much like this on the issue:  :devangel:

keep up the good work. Ken smiles down on you  :)

cheque

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 3389
  • Karma: +522/-2
    • Cheque Pictures
If anyone seriously wants to debolt anything, now’s the time to do it because everyone will assume it was Fiend. :lol:

northern yob

Offline
  • ***
  • stalker
  • Posts: 258
  • Karma: +29/-0
:lol:  Where do you live Northern yob? I really love your staying true to your feelings on this. I want to know so much about you!

I feel very much like this on the issue:  :devangel:

keep up the good work. Ken smiles down on you  :)

Ha ha we clipped some bolts together this year, and said hi last Thursday…….😜

Get off the fence, you gotta stand up and be counted.

Duncan campbell

Offline
  • ****
  • junky
  • Posts: 764
  • Karma: +47/-2
Wow. That's interesting... I have an idea of who you are but will protect your identity... though if you are who I think you are, you didn't seem too outraged at the bolt/peg on barbarossa when you clipped it.  :P

Edit: though I might have got the wrong person

grimer

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 1576
  • Karma: +144/-1
All good stuff here. Everyone is welcomed to their opinion, but as far as I know it's mainly Fiend who is regularly going out and doing best-style possible ascents of trad routes near his limit, which is where this matters? So much so that he cleans routes so he can do them. Therefore losing climbs to vegetation is an issue for him.

Anonymity, to me, undermines the strength of online opinions. I mean, I was going to ask NY about his climbing activities, but suspect it'll turn out to be Ian Vickers or someone and I'll have to blush :-)

Duncan campbell

Offline
  • ****
  • junky
  • Posts: 764
  • Karma: +47/-2
I'm sure Fiend isn't the only one...

I have some inklings on NY's identity but both the people I suspect used that "peg" on Barbarossa and didnt complain about it!

northern yob

Offline
  • ***
  • stalker
  • Posts: 258
  • Karma: +29/-0

Anonymity, to me, undermines the strength of online opinions. I mean, I was going to ask NY about his climbing activities, but suspect it'll turn out to be Ian Vickers or someone and I'll have to blush :-)

I couldn’t agree more Grimer anonymity does indeed undermine opinions on here, so in the spirit of standing up and being counted and for Duncan (you were wrong) it’s Jason pickles, in one sense that doesn’t give my opinions any more or any less weight, and it’s never been a deliberate ploy (to be anonymous on here). It is however important to own your opinions. I’ve climbed a few rocks, and whacked in some bolts on some of the worlds finest granite monoliths, it’s fair to say I’ve never been a great onsight climber but it’s an ideal I hold highly,that and respecting the rock. And whilst I have somewhat hypocritically left fixed gear in various places across the globe, I feel quite strongly that certain areas should be left as crucibles to certain styles. I’m definitely not whiter than white( who is)…..

Duncan campbell

Offline
  • ****
  • junky
  • Posts: 764
  • Karma: +47/-2
Aha!!!! Completely forgot about you! Very good. I am wrong!

grimer

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 1576
  • Karma: +144/-1
Jasonnnnnnn :-)

northern yob

Offline
  • ***
  • stalker
  • Posts: 258
  • Karma: +29/-0

Fiend

Online
  • *
  • _
  • forum hero
  • Abominable sex magick practitioner and climbing heathen
  • Posts: 13414
  • Karma: +676/-67
  • Whut
Grimer don't be daft, I'm just a punter punting along, I just happen to write and talk about it (spooging about the good stuff, ranting about the issues) more than average. Which I don't have much shame about because chatting shit about climbing is fun, hell, right down to arguing about merits / validity of having a book wedged inside a kneepad as a point of aid  :blink:

There's lots of punters punting along with a similar/better spirit on similar/harder stuff and beyond including many on this forum even if they're sometimes too slovenly to take part in all important ethical debates. I don't mind anonymity in people who do take part!!

DAVETHOMAS90

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Dave Thomas is an annual climber to 1.7m, with strongly fragrant flowers
  • Posts: 1726
  • Karma: +166/-6
  • Don't die with your music still inside you ;)

Anonymity, to me, undermines the strength of online opinions. I mean, I was going to ask NY about his climbing activities, but suspect it'll turn out to be Ian Vickers or someone and I'll have to blush :-)

I couldn’t agree more Grimer anonymity does indeed undermine opinions on here, so in the spirit of standing up and being counted and for Duncan (you were wrong) it’s Jason pickles, in one sense that doesn’t give my opinions any more or any less weight, and it’s never been a deliberate ploy (to be anonymous on here). It is however important to own your opinions. I’ve climbed a few rocks, and whacked in some bolts on some of the worlds finest granite monoliths, it’s fair to say I’ve never been a great onsight climber but it’s an ideal I hold highly,that and respecting the rock. And whilst I have somewhat hypocritically left fixed gear in various places across the globe, I feel quite strongly that certain areas should be left as crucibles to certain styles. I’m definitely not whiter than white( who is)…..

"it’s Jason pickles" .. can anyone verify this?  ;D

Seriously, great points, and especially re owning your own opinions.
Further, I don't see it as being hypocritical to feel strongly about removing fixed gear in one context, and yet placing it in another.
There are costs/benefits in either scenario.

I do however think that it would be better if bolts were placed if/when they are in fact drilled placements - rather than "Begs/Polts". Is the old placement on Barbarossa bashed out now? Shouldn't be replaced with a drilled piece though. That would create a completely different route - in my opinion.

I went through a period of feeling quite vexed about this bolts masquerading as pegs business. New fixed gear was being added at Millstone, with rumours about it being drilled. Old aid bolts were being extended, to create clip-ups out of old problems like Wall Street Crash. It all seemed a bit of a nonsense, so I decided to hammer some of the old bolts off.

On Wall Street, I expected just one light tap with the hammer to do the trick, but they were difficult to remove. Having damaged one old bolt, I decided the best course of action was to complete the job of removing them.
I'd been having a chat with Graham Hoey about the bolts on Adam Smith's, and his view was maybe to remove the old rubbish and put in one nice shiny new one! I doubt it was a serious suggestion, but just echoed the feeling that people were willing to reinterpret the situation on "historical grounds" if it helped claim an ascent.

I have mixed feelings about Wall Street Crash. I'd assumed the old bolts would have been of really dubious condition at the time, and that by extending them, people were creating a bit of a fudge. Johnny is understandably not very happy with me. However, this is the sort of thing that raises questions about which practices get established and accepted, and which not.

Regarding Supercool. I think this is a difficult one too. The route was established with "designer danger", and I'm not sure the FA can claim ownership over how a piece of rock is protected, if it was established using drilled protection in the first place. If however it was subsequently climbed with less drilled gear, then I probably would support that.

Re Gogarth - just take the bolts out. My opinion.

Edit: Fiend, how much do you charge? ;)


mrjonathanr

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 5377
  • Karma: +242/-6
  • Getting fatter, not fitter.

Re Gogarth - just take the bolts out. My opinion.

Well if Fiend is a punter, I don’t get past the ‘p’ of the punt.. but FWIW, my thoughts exactly.

Edit: Fiend, how much do you charge? ;)

Maybe time for an Anti-Bolt Fund?

spidermonkey09

Online
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 2817
  • Karma: +159/-4
Any serious discussion to be had loses all credibility if you're seriously talking about debolting Supercool Dave. Dunc has clearly mentioned it tongue in cheek; it's a sport route and realistically always has been! I don't think you can class it as designer danger compared to some slate routes on the Raindbow or similar, they're different beasts. If I've missed the joke completely, my bad!  :lol:

Duncan campbell

Offline
  • ****
  • junky
  • Posts: 764
  • Karma: +47/-2
Just for the record... I definitely don’t support the bolts being taken out of supercool! That would be super shit if you ask me

DAVETHOMAS90

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Dave Thomas is an annual climber to 1.7m, with strongly fragrant flowers
  • Posts: 1726
  • Karma: +166/-6
  • Don't die with your music still inside you ;)
Any serious discussion to be had loses all credibility if you're seriously talking about debolting Supercool Dave.

On what basis?

It's been changed significantly, with bolts added subsequently, and I'd suggest that where there is a lack of credibility is in claiming something is this, or is that.

I'm not going to compromise my position by saying I wasn't actually advocating taking the bolts out.
However, I think your comment reflects the point I was making, about what things become, and how they get established as such.

It would be like saying "Painted Wall is a sport crag therefore drilled protection is de rigueur.

Aren't you basing your view of what's credible, on what you've already decided is/would be an acceptable outcome?

The threads should go back in Revelations. Does anyone know, were they drilled originally?  ;D

Fiend

Online
  • *
  • _
  • forum hero
  • Abominable sex magick practitioner and climbing heathen
  • Posts: 13414
  • Karma: +676/-67
  • Whut
Any serious discussion
Wait, what?? That sort of nonsense can stop straight away!

jwi

Online
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Posts: 4219
  • Karma: +331/-1
    • On Steep Ground
In my experience no one complains when adding bolts or removing them is the correct decision. At least not for long.

The most well known example is perhaps ULA who had all its bolts except those on the belays surreptitiously removed by someone who did it seeking any consensus or agreements before hand. There were some grumbling after about the lack of protocol, but basically everyone is happy about the outcome. Ten years later, people barely remember that it was almost a clip up for a while.

This is my personal experience as well both when I have added and chopped bolts. The important thing is to keep quite about it.

DAVETHOMAS90

Offline
  • *****
  • forum hero
  • Dave Thomas is an annual climber to 1.7m, with strongly fragrant flowers
  • Posts: 1726
  • Karma: +166/-6
  • Don't die with your music still inside you ;)

 

SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2024, SimplePortal