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Stiffest down turned shoes (Read 9640 times)

Teaboy

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Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 03:16:19 pm
I have arthritis in my big toes and it’s now reached the point that relieving the pain from this overrides all other considerations when choosing a boot. Down turned toes, I think, help. The best I’ve used recently are old style Evolve Shamans but don’t know if the newer models have the necessary clog like characteristics or they chose to make the newer versions climb well instead! I’ve had lots of La Sportiva VS but the stiff point of these soon wears off which is good for climbing but not so for pain tolerance.

Any suggestions from the similarly afflicted or Weak of feet are sought.

Paul B

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#1 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 03:27:13 pm
Can you still get the old style Sportiva Testarossa?

M1V0

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#2 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 03:30:23 pm
New style Testas are pretty stiff rubber-wise, but surprisingly sensitive in the mid-sole, I found.

What about the Unparallel TN Pros? I recall they're a solid piece of rubber from toe to heel?

Teaboy

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#3 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 03:31:39 pm
Do the Tesstas still use XS Grip rubber rather than Edge?

M1V0

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#4 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 04:03:20 pm
Xs Grip 2

remus

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#5 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 04:08:58 pm
They're not down turned but these are very stiff, could be worth a try if you're in a shop

https://darkventures.co.uk/unparallel-rise-pro-519-p.asp

Teaboy

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#6 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 05:21:02 pm
There seems to be a lot of love for Unparallel but my god those are ugly!

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#7 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 06:28:19 pm
Perhaps try the new Scarpa Boostic? 4mm XS Edge with a full length sole. Probably the stiffest Scarpa for a while!

moose

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#8 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 06:48:23 pm
Not worn them myself, but Scarpa Magos were always regarded as being very stiff.

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#9 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 08:40:54 pm
Bit of a curveball but maybe the EB Strange? Not tried them myself but have wondered about ordering a pair. Described as 'rigid and asymmetrical', 5mm of rubber.

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#10 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 09:38:08 pm
La Sportiva Otaki

remus

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#11 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 10:16:45 pm
Perhaps try the new Scarpa Boostic? 4mm XS Edge with a full length sole. Probably the stiffest Scarpa for a while!

Personally I havent found the new boostics to be particularly stiff (they're softer than the instinct vs for me).

IanP

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#12 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 04, 2021, 10:20:09 pm
La Sportiva Miura XX if you have narrow feet? I prefer a stiff shoe and they're  my favourite for limestone.  Limited edition and have been really hard to get but I've just bought a couple of new pairs from climbing clearence on ebay, they still have a few available in various sizes.

Scouse D

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#13 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 05, 2021, 10:00:48 am
I suffered with stiff and sore big toes for years. This year and last I made some real progress by massaging the arch of the foot focusing on real tender spots/trigger points. I wore toe separators for about a month even in shoes ( bought work shoes with wide toe box)An easy experiment would be to make a rudimentary toe separator out of some tissue paper or cotton wool and wedge it between big and second toe to straighten up the big toe, gave me instant relief.
 In terms of shoes I tried very stiff shoes for a while but it didnt really improve the situation and I felt I was getting more and more disabled. I now wear blue scarpa vcs (a soft shoe) but in a large size and my feet really appreciate it.

mrjonathanr

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#14 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 05, 2021, 10:10:09 am
I have resoled old style Magos. They are very stiff and very downturned. Brilliant on limestone. Probably new style ones are similar?

Teaboy

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#15 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
June 06, 2021, 11:27:26 pm
Thanks for all for the suggestions, I'll do some research on the less popular makes (EB, Ocun) but it looks as though Scarpa might be the new to look at of the big 3 (or 4?).

Yossarian

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#16 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 10, 2022, 12:15:33 pm
I'm in this market at the moment. I'm about to send back some Unparallel NewTros because, though the front of the shoe felt like a dream and the soles / downturn / stiffness looked just right, my heels are totally the wrong shape and they're not going to work...

I've got some semi-worn VS-Rs and Instinct Laces, both of which I've liked, and will probably get some Instinct VSs next.

However, I wondered if anyone has tried out Evolv Phantoms? These look like a decent option being obviously very downturned and apparently quite stiff also. They seem to have a more contemporary, sorry, nuskool, approach to sizing, i.e. buy your street shoesize or similar. Any thoughts?

And any other options I might've missed?

RobK

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#17 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 10, 2022, 12:31:59 pm
I'm in this market at the moment. I'm about to send back some Unparallel NewTros because, though the front of the shoe felt like a dream and the soles / downturn / stiffness looked just right, my heels are totally the wrong shape and they're not going to work...

I've got some semi-worn VS-Rs and Instinct Laces, both of which I've liked, and will probably get some Instinct VSs next.

However, I wondered if anyone has tried out Evolv Phantoms? These look like a decent option being obviously very downturned and apparently quite stiff also. They seem to have a more contemporary, sorry, nuskool, approach to sizing, i.e. buy your street shoesize or similar. Any thoughts?

And any other options I might've missed?

I have both the Phantoms and the Instinct Laces. Similar in mid-sole stiffness. The main differences for me are the rigidity of the heel and the position of your toes in the toe box. Although both seem to have a similar down turn, the Phantoms for me put my toes in a much more 'crimped' position (if that makes sense) so they feel more aggressive. This is good on really steep terrain, but the Instincts feel more precise on vertical and slightly overhanging terrain. In practice, for me, this means I wear the Phantoms almost exclusively on steep boulder problems, whereas the Instincts are one of my go to shoes for places like Malham. So very different venues! The Phantom heel is also much more rigid, not really a pro or con, just different. Both heels fit me well. FWIW I wear an EU43 in the Instinct and a UK9.5 in the Phantom.

Edit: maybe take a look at the new Scarpa Boostic too? I haven't tried them but have heard good things, so long as you don't expect them to feel like the old model.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2022, 12:43:34 pm by RobK »

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#18 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 10, 2022, 03:53:37 pm
I don't find the new boostic all that stiff, in fact, Instinct Lace is stiffer.  Don't get me wrong, it's a good shoe the new boostic but really I'd say it's kind of same same with the Instinct VS...

New Mago maybe?  Not tried it, but had the old ones and they were edging beasts.

Teaboy

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#19 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 10, 2022, 04:40:01 pm
I ended up going for the Scarpa Vapour V but won’t have a chance to try them out until the end of the month. I also tried on some others and really liked one of the EB models but the heel cup was a bit too stiff and felt like it would irritate my Achilles. I bought them from V12 in Llanberis who seemed to have a reasonable range and complete sets of sizes.

mrjonathanr

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#20 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 10, 2022, 07:10:19 pm
I don't find the new boostic all that stiff, in fact, Instinct Lace is stiffer.  Don't get me wrong, it's a good shoe the new boostic but really I'd say it's kind of same same with the Instinct VS...

New Mago maybe?  Not tried it, but had the old ones and they were edging beasts.

Disappointingly soft in the shop. Have first model and last season’s which are a bit softer. This new model appears much softer though 🙁

It’s almost as if they think there’s a bigger indoor than outdoor market.

sidewinder

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#21 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 10, 2022, 10:29:13 pm
La Sportiva Otaki
Second this, think they are a great shoe.

MischaHY

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#22 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 11, 2022, 12:39:19 pm
Coming in with a curveball here but considering you didn't spec that's for steep terrain, have you tried TC Pro's? These get billed as a trad shoe but are actually amazing for edging and foot support, even stiffer than Miura VS but still with decent sensitivity for foot placement. Obviously not a downturn but amazing foot support for slab to moderate overhang which is where stiffness would be helping anyway.

Yossarian

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#23 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 11, 2022, 01:36:17 pm
Interesting! I do want to get a pair of them actually, though I was thinking more about steep stuff when I wrote the above.

I have a pair of Miura XXs which totally felt like cheating on steep edges when they were new. They're not completely worn out but the sole has unglued a bit so I've not worn them much recently. I had planned to buy some more via eBay but they've all gone now.

That's the kind of feeling I want to replicate ,which the front of the NewTro seemed to do, albeit with a less pointed toe. In contrast, my Instinct Laces seemed to soften up quite fast. I wonder if the VS remains stiffer than the Lace because of the upper construction?

Re TC Pros - I had two bad experiences with clumsy stiff shoes years ago (borrowed Aces, and then 5.10 Newtons which I loathed) and I've tended to gravitate towards softer things since. But now the prospect of something stiff and precise even if they're sized to be comfortable-ish sounds amazing. When I was in Bregaglia / Mello a few years ago I wore small but floppy (the worst of both worlds, obvs) Katanas and they totally fucked my feet.

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#24 Re: Stiffest down turned shoes
February 11, 2022, 02:51:32 pm

I have a pair of Miura XXs which totally felt like cheating on steep edges when they were new. They're not completely worn out but the sole has unglued a bit so I've not worn them much recently. I had planned to buy some more via eBay but they've all gone now.


As earlier in this thread I'm a big fan of the Muira XX and did manage to get a couple of new pairs on ebay last year.  Also have couple on resoles (from Llanberis) and I think they actually climb better than the new pairs so may be worth considering if not too worn out.   

 

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