[SA Chris]

https://www.lastsundance.com/

Or is it just one of the old ones that's got a facelift?

How many is that in the area now?

[RobK]

It opened last summer I believe.

That apostrophe usage on the front page pains me.

[SA Chris]

OK, not heard of it. Any good? City must be at saturation point now.

Leeds' or Leeds's?

[Will Hunt]

Isn't Leeds' correct? A bouldering wall of Leeds?

[Bradders]

Isn't Leeds' correct? A bouldering wall of Leeds?

Yes.

[RobK]

Leeds isn't a plural, or a place name that is a plural (for example United States' would be correct). So Leeds's.

[Bradders]

OK, not heard of it. Any good? City must be at saturation point now.

Doubt it. Off the top of my head there's now:

- Depot Pudsey
- Big Depot
- The Lab
- LSD
- City Bloc (which is now 3x the size of what it was)
- The Climbing Hub in Bradford
- Freeklime in Huddersfield
- Rokt in Brighouse

Plus a MASSIVE new Depot centre opening up soon about 5 minutes walk from the Lab....

So there are a lot of them, but it's a big city / metropolitan area.

[Bradders]

Leeds isn't a plural, or a place name that is a plural (for example United States' would be correct). So Leeds's.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/topics/zvwwxnb/articles/zx9ydxs

Charles' cat was naughty.
Charles is a singular noun that ends in an "s", so you need to add an apostrophe to show that the cat belongs to Charles.

[dunnyg]

Where is the new megadepot going to be?

[Will Hunt]

Where is the new megadepot going to be?

Your mum's house.

[Stabbsy]

Last Sundance is one of the guys that used to do a lot of the setting at Red Goat in York, not sure if he still sets there now he’s got this place. I always liked his setting though, despite the occasional problem that didn’t suit the taller gent.

[Bradders]

Where is the new megadepot going to be?

Dropped pin
https://maps.app.goo.gl/LfAYjJ4w3GGxDkTs8

Sorry, 20 minute walk from the Lab. 5 minute drive.

[RobK]

Leeds isn't a plural, or a place name that is a plural (for example United States' would be correct). So Leeds's.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/topics/zvwwxnb/articles/zx9ydxs

Charles' cat was naughty.
Charles is a singular noun that ends in an "s", so you need to add an apostrophe to show that the cat belongs to Charles.

Interesting, looking into this both Charles' and Charles's can be used apparently. I always thought only Charles's was correct. Still doesn't sit right with me as you would say Charles's and not Charles' (or I would at least) but I stand corrected. Anyway, both off topic and tedious, sorry!

[RobK]

Where is the new megadepot going to be?

Your mum's house.

Your mums' house?

[SA Chris]

- Depot Pudsey
- Big Depot
- The Lab
- LSD
- City Bloc (which is now 3x the size of what it was)
- The Climbing Hub in Bradford
- Freeklime in Huddersfield
- Rokt in Brighouse

Plus a MASSIVE new Depot centre opening up soon about 5 minutes walk from the Lab....

So there are a lot of them, but it's a big city / metropolitan area.

pop 2.6 m - 9 decent centres.

Aberdeen and Shire - 0.5 million - zero decent bouldering centres. OK, maybe half of one.

[Will Hunt]

Where is the new megadepot going to be?

Dropped pin
https://maps.app.goo.gl/LfAYjJ4w3GGxDkTs8

Sorry, 20 minute walk from the Lab. 5 minute drive.

Still bloody useless for those living further up Airedale 

[ali k]

Still bloody useless for those living further up Airedale 

Where's the closest one you go to Will? I had it in my head it was only about 20mins to the original Depot?

[teestub]

Where's the closest one you go to Will? I had it in my head it was only about 20mins to the original Depot?

It’s super dependent on the time of day, getting through Shipley and Greengates after work can be an absolute nightmare.

[dunnyg]

I heard bizzlewall will be open to a select few once corona is less, should be closer for you!

I guess skipton is too small for a wall?

You could always put some laps in here https://g.co/kgs/69risJ

[teestub]

Apparently Skipton is too expensive for a wall more than anything else. I think Keighley is probably the best more local option, although I’m not sure if the favourable property prices would offset the costs of 24ht security!

[spidermonkey09]

Craven Council apparently seriously considered a proposal to build a massive Ratho style wall in Skipton about 10 years ago which unfortunately had incredibly optimistic/unrealistic projections for visitor numbers and resulting revenue to the area. Once the Council clocked that they were being played they reverted to prioritising unit space for logistics and transport businesses instead which are bigger local employers than leisure and retail. Its also made it much harder for any subsequent wall proposals to get off the ground as the memory of the experience still lingers I'm told.

All this from a chat with Steve Dunning on the catwalk a few weeks ago. Interesting stuff as it could definitely support a wall.

[Will Hunt]

What Stubbs said. Going to the Depot Pudsey is about 30/35 mins if you leave after rush hour. Coming home at kicking out time doable at the speed limit in about 15 if the lights are in your favour.

I always thought Keighley would be a good location when you consider how many young people there are who live nearby in Bradford and the surrounding towns who could be drawn in from the Crossfit type scene (basically what places like the Lab have done), plus a huge number of actual climbers who live in the surroundings (including Colne and Barnoldswick type places which would then be about equidistant to Boulder UK) who don't have a local wall that isn't a 30+ minute drive to get to). It would become the local wall for anyone with the sense to not live in the major cities and not in the sticks but still close to grit and lime. For routes I tend to have to drive 50 mins to the Harrogate Wall rather than sit in traffic trying to get to the Big Depot, so bad is the local wall provisioning.

[tommytwotone]

OK, not heard of it. Any good? City must be at saturation point now.

Doubt it. Off the top of my head there's now:

- Depot Pudsey
- Big Depot
- The Lab
- LSD
- City Bloc (which is now 3x the size of what it was)
- The Climbing Hub in Bradford
- Freeklime in Huddersfield
- Rokt in Brighouse

Plus a MASSIVE new Depot centre opening up soon about 5 minutes walk from the Lab....

So there are a lot of them, but it's a big city / metropolitan area.

After a trip to Depot Pudsey one evening pre-lockdown I'd say no - it was bloody rammed. Completely put me off what used to be my local wall.

The Lab is/was also doing good business, though the demographic there is hugely different - newbies / students "smashing" V1/2s. Often if I head over there I'm the oldest and best climber there.

I've started frequenting Last Sun Dance and can't recommend it enough

It's big, airy, never rammed, I'd imagine due to the out-of-town location (you can normally get a panel or two to yourself of an evening), and the setting is a) shortarse-friendly and b) a good mix of old skool crimping and nu-skool funky parkour nonsense. Oh, and coffee is excellent.

They also have a nice 50 degree board and a 30 (I think) splatterboard thing that I have only ever seen 1 person using.

[Bradders]

Still bloody useless for those living further up Airedale 

The price you pay for living so close to all the real climbing! 

[ali k]

I've started frequenting Last Sun Dance and can't recommend it enough
They also have a nice 50 degree board and a 30 (I think) splatterboard thing that I have only ever seen 1 person using.

You had me all excited for a second then...until I saw it was the wrong side of Leeds!

Seems odd there's such a paucity in Bradford.

[Bradders]

After a trip to Depot Pudsey one evening pre-lockdown I'd say no - it was bloody rammed. Completely put me off what used to be my local wall.

Yeah this is clearly why they want to open a bigger centre as the demand is absolutely there for their main offering (kids clubs, birthday parties, new but older climbers, casual / social climbers), there just isn't anywhere near the space.

Can't count the number of times I've felt kicked out of the back room with the 50 board because the kids club has turned up. They're hardly going to prioritise the antisocial lone climber training for outdoors when they've a 20 strong party of screaming kids and bored non-climbing adults.

My hope is once the new big one is open they keep Pudsey and make it into a School Room esque training facility 

[tommytwotone]

I've started frequenting Last Sun Dance and can't recommend it enough
They also have a nice 50 degree board and a 30 (I think) splatterboard thing that I have only ever seen 1 person using.

You had me all excited for a second then...until I saw it was the wrong side of Leeds!

Seems odd there's such a paucity in Bradford.

Well if it's a further endorsement, I was going twice a week from Batley area, when others are closer...

[moose]

[
I've started frequenting Last Sun Dance and can't recommend it enough

It's big, airy, never rammed, I'd imagine due to the out-of-town location (you can normally get a panel or two to yourself of an evening), and the setting is a) shortarse-friendly and b) a good mix of old skool crimping and nu-skool funky parkour nonsense. Oh, and coffee is excellent.

They also have a nice 50 degree board and a 30 (I think) splatterboard thing that I have only ever seen 1 person using.

I had a trip there during the previous easing of lockdown.  It was rammed but that might have been unrepresentative - the weather was awful and everyone was eager to return to the walls.  I really liked the setting too - something for everyone (even lanky lovers of a crimp ladder). 

I also enjoyed my two trips to the Climbing Hub during that respite from complete lockdown.  The environment was fairly basic and utilitarian (it didn't have Last Sundance's vibe of an upscale coffee shop that happens to contain a climbing wall) but it is a really large, airy building with plenty of room to spread out - which seemed important at the time!

[Oldmanmatt]

Where is the new megadepot going to be?

Your mum's house.

Far more important than wall locations etc.

I think  you were unjustly puntered here Will.

Mums is not a possessive pronoun (like “his” or “ theirs”), merely the plural of mum. Surely the use of an apostrophe is acceptable to imply possession and RobK’s variant merely implied the existence of two or more “mums” (of Dunnyg) with shares in the property?

[Will Hunt]

I think  you were unjustly puntered here Will.

Oh for sure, but you have to cut Huw some slack. He was raised (if you can call it that) in Halifax where he spent his childhood working in a mill. Education was limited to what the wealthy mill owner would afford: one trip to Eureka! per annum.

Anyway. I'm aiming for the big -100 and nothing and nobody is gonna stop me.

[mrjonathanr]

I think  you were unjustly puntered here Will.

Education was limited to what the wealthy mill owner would afford: one trip to Eureka! per annum

That’s really mean.

Eureka tickets automatically allow entry for a year.

[Oldmanmatt]

I think  you were unjustly puntered here Will.

Education was limited to what the wealthy mill owner would afford: one trip to Eureka! per annum

That’s really mean.

Eureka tickets automatically allow entry for a year.

Yes, but would you actually stay that long?

[cheque]

Last Sun Dance is such a strange name for a wall. Did no one tell them about the The Climbing xxxxxx format? 

[G Tubb]

After a trip to Depot Pudsey one evening pre-lockdown I'd say no - it was bloody rammed. Completely put me off what used to be my local wall.

Can't count the number of times I've felt kicked out of the back room with the 50 board because the kids club has turned up. They're hardly going to prioritise the antisocial lone climber training for outdoors when they've a 20 strong party of screaming kids and bored non-climbing adults.

That's a large part of the reason we don't, and will never, have any kids clubs, parties or kids coaching at LSD. It's a climbing gym for adults

[Oldmanmatt]

After a trip to Depot Pudsey one evening pre-lockdown I'd say no - it was bloody rammed. Completely put me off what used to be my local wall.

Can't count the number of times I've felt kicked out of the back room with the 50 board because the kids club has turned up. They're hardly going to prioritise the antisocial lone climber training for outdoors when they've a 20 strong party of screaming kids and bored non-climbing adults.

That's a large part of the reason we don't, and will never, have any kids clubs, parties or kids coaching at LSD. It's a climbing gym for adults

Lucky you have the clientele to be able to afford that.

We’ve just switched to running clubs early in the morning on weekends, before the centre opens to the public. All our school groups etc are outside of normal opening times too (assuming we ever get such groups back, gotta love this joyous pandemic lark).

Actually if my guys allowed their kids to piss around or chase people out of the training room (auto correct changed that to changing room! Haven’t had one of those for over a year now), they’d soon mend their ways or find alternative employment.
Fortunately, since they train hard themselves, they’re pretty good on that.

[Bradders]

After a trip to Depot Pudsey one evening pre-lockdown I'd say no - it was bloody rammed. Completely put me off what used to be my local wall.

Can't count the number of times I've felt kicked out of the back room with the 50 board because the kids club has turned up. They're hardly going to prioritise the antisocial lone climber training for outdoors when they've a 20 strong party of screaming kids and bored non-climbing adults.

That's a large part of the reason we don't, and will never, have any kids clubs, parties or kids coaching at LSD. It's a climbing gym for adults

Interesting. Sounds great!

[Will Hunt]

In defence of the Lab (which is crap by every other measure) and the new Bradford place (The Climbing Hub), they've put in a separate part of the wall that's shorter than the rest and is entirely set for kids. Which is a great idea because it isolates the kids to one part of the wall, and you can put in more slab and vert stuff than the adults would tolerate but that the kids need. Given that most walls need to provide an offering for children it's a good solution to the problem of having them running round the adult's ankles.

[teestub]

Is there a bar at Last Sun Dance? Seem to remember reading that somewhere but can’t see it on their website. Great way to assure you get your malted recovery beverage in the crucial time window.

[tommytwotone]

The bit near reception has a very slick "Shoreditch Craft Ale Bar" vibe...surely a collab with Northern Monk is just round the corner.


Would be a good contrast to the gym that I'm assuming / hoping is being built on the upper tier!


Echo Will's sentiments re: walls for kids - as a parent of a 4 and a 7 year old who both enjoy a visit The Lab is the best solution for the reasons stated. On the flip side it makes me appreciate LSD as a proper adult space as well!

[G Tubb]

Is there a bar at Last Sun Dance? Seem to remember reading that somewhere but can’t see it on their website. Great way to assure you get your malted recovery beverage in the crucial time window.

Our license is on its way

[cheque]

On the flip side it makes me appreciate LSD as a proper adult space as well!

Any climbing wall’s going to be pretty wild if you’re tripping. Probably best to get someone to look after your kids while you do it though.

[AndyP]

I went the other day. The setting is pretty good. Grades were very soft compared to other Leeds gyms, but who cares. The boards are OK but I thought nowhere near as good as those at, say, the new Pudsey Depot. The training area is not yet built, but from the space looks like it will be good when finished. I thought the atmosphere was great.

[Bradders]

I went the other day. The setting is pretty good. Grades were very soft compared to other Leeds gyms, but who cares. The boards are OK but I thought nowhere near as good as those at, say, the new Pudsey Depot. The training area is not yet built, but from the space looks like it will be good when finished. I thought the atmosphere was great.

New Pudsey Depot?

Assume you're just referring to the train station there.

Shame if the boards are only okay but can always improve! Although it would take quite a board to tear me away from the Depot's 50, but that's probably a lot more to do with emotional investment than actual quality 

[teestub]

Yeah the depot board definitely benefits from a decade of tweaking and problems being set.

[NoonThunder]

In defence of the Lab (which is crap by every other measure)

Bit harsh, there are worse walls around.

Setting is good as is the coffee, great hold selection,

[Will Hunt]

Setting is good, great hold selection,

It feels a bit mean to be slagging them off without provocation, but I also very strongly disagree with both of these statements.

[moose]

Setting is good, great hold selection,

It feels a bit mean to be slagging them off without provocation, but I also very strongly disagree with both of these statements.

+1... my few trips to the Lab had me contemplating the purchase of waterproof trousers and sampling the delights of rambling in the rain.

[NoonThunder]

Setting is good, great hold selection,

It feels a bit mean to be slagging them off without provocation, but I also very strongly disagree with both of these statements.

+1... my few trips to the Lab had me contemplating the purchase of waterproof trousers and sampling the delights of rambling in the rain.

🤣🤣🤣

Just me then!

[tomtom]

(I’ve only been to Citibloc and the depot in Leeds disclaimer).

If I were a wall owner in Leeds - I’d be pitching to the market that was available. If a family friendly good atmosphere, serviceable problems vibe is what the Lab is going for fair enough.

LSD has firmly nailed its adult orientated approach too (fair enough).

As the market gets bigger - more diverse and more centres open - there will be more err stratification (?) of the market and it will make less sense for walls to try and be THE wall for everyone.. (something the Depot(s) may have to deal with in the future).

I remember two years ago having a very friendly chat with the owner of a wall (let’s say in Northern England) - he asked me for some views on a few bits about the wall - and I gave him some answers. After which he said - fair enough - completely get it, but he was aiming for (as he put it) the Instagram generation - not some grey haired old moaning tool like me (not his words 😁)

[Will Hunt]

Yep, I totally get that the Lab is going for a different part of the market. That's fine. I kept going back because their kids offering was streets ahead of everybody else (maybe overtaken by the Hub now, which has been started by the same people). They do well at pulling in the CrossFit and student are indoors only climbers (you could argue that these people are easy to please if you play the right music and serve good coffee and have comfy couches).

There were a few things about the setting and hold selection that were objectively bad though. They might have improved this now as it's been a year now since I last went.
Firstly they would frequently set problems that showed no restraint whatsoever on the part of the setter. They would have a problem that was hard and sustained at the grade until you got to a move near the top that was just orders of magnitude harder than anything else. You could spot these problems a mile off because the chalk would go up to the third to last hold and stop dead. Nobody had even tickled the two above. These problems wouldn't be tweaked to make them more balanced.
Hold selection was quite grim and skin tearing at times. When they reset a problem they would often take down one section of a panel and just reset that, rather than resetting an entire colour circuit. This means you ended up just having the same holds on the same angle, but just rearranged to give a slightly different problem of the same difficulty: dull. They also had a habit of setting entire problems on one type of hold. A problem ALL on pockets for instance. It's fine to have these novelties every now and again but when you're just shuffling the holds around on the same angle every month it quickly becomes predictable and tedious.

[Bradders]

it will make less sense for walls to try and be THE wall for everyone.. (something the Depot(s) may have to deal with in the future).

Definitely agree this is a problem that the Depot, particularly Pudsey, have failed to negotiate so far, in my humble opinion. That is partly because for a long time they had virtually no competition, so everyone just had to make do, but lately trying to be family / kids with non-climbing parents friendly AND a social venue AND a training facility just doesn't work with the space they have (which is very limited).

To be fair though I think that stratification is already happening. I.e. City Bloc following their re-development are going head-to-head with LSD for the training / performance crowd, the Lab and the Hub are catering for the kids and social crowd and the Depot are opening an absolutely massive new centre so they can keep trying to be all things to all people. And really that just means we're all very spoiled in the Leeds area 

Not that I'll be leaving my shed any time soon 

[Will Hunt]

Unconfirmed rumour is that Depot Pudsey will be closing - conveniently solving its "wall for everybody" problem by becoming a wall for nobody.
If true, thank fuck all my friends have just built boards nearby. Anyone know for definite?

[teestub]

Going to be a bit more of a fight at rush hour to get to the new one if that’s the case! Although new one is only a mile from Leeds station so a train may be viable option.

[Bradders]

Unconfirmed rumour is that Depot Pudsey will be closing - conveniently solving its "wall for everybody" problem by becoming a wall for nobody.
If true, thank fuck all my friends have just built boards nearby. Anyone know for definite?

Well yeah since they're replacing it with the new massive one...makes sense. I don't know it's definite though.

My dream of it becoming Leeds' School Room seems very unlikely sadly.

[teestub]

Unconfirmed rumour is that Depot Pudsey will be closing - conveniently solving its "wall for everybody" problem by becoming a wall for nobody.

Turns out this is entirely untrue so make sure your source is suitably rebuked.

The boss man says it’s not closing and they have big plans for that site.

On further map research it turns out the new site is also one mile from Northern Monk 😍

[Will Hunt]

Unconfirmed rumour is that Depot Pudsey will be closing - conveniently solving its "wall for everybody" problem by becoming a wall for nobody.

Turns out this is entirely untrue so make sure your source is suitably rebuked.

The boss man says it’s not closing and they have big plans for that site.

On further map research it turns out the new site is also one mile from Northern Monk 😍

Rebuking now. Thanks for the beta.

[tommytwotone]

Would be intrigued to see what the plans are for Pudsey Depot - as Bradders says, hiving off the kid's parties and punters to The Mega-Depot Leeds and flipping Depot Pudsey to some kind of Unit E would be an interesting move, not sure how many Leeds wads operating only at the (say) mid-7s and above there would be to sustain it though.

[tomtom]

Would be intrigued to see what the plans are for Pudsey Depot - as Bradders says, hiving off the kid's parties and punters to The Mega-Depot Leeds and flipping Depot Pudsey to some kind of Unit E would be an interesting move, not sure how many Leeds wads operating only at the (say) mid-7s and above there would be to sustain it though.

Tanning salon. Money laundering turnover is greater

[tommytwotone]

Would be a bit of a commute for Adam Lincoln and Gresh though