[Bradders]

The repeats of The Boss got me thinking about Ned's interview and his assertion that hard gritstone climbing generally consists of one condition dependent move.

I'm guessing he'll have been thinking about things at a similar level to The Boss, in which case he's clearly right; things like The Ace and Cypher spring to mind as having a very hard move or two / three but really not involving a sustained sequence of physical moves.

However, what are the exceptions? I'm thinking that actually at a slightly lower level, around 7C - 8A, there are quite a lot of problems that are very sustained.

So, in traditional UKB fashion, let's make a list!

Ned / UKC has given us the criteria:

unusual for gritstone bouldering in that it has extremely sustained climbing

All the moves are hard, so there's little chance to readjust: 'you've just got to keep going.'

[tomtom]

It’s a bit relative to what grade you climb - but I found Blind Date pretty sustained up to getting the jug over the lip. 4 or 5 moves that often felt equally drop-able.

Got to be some traverses that tick that too!

[spidermonkey09]

Is High Fidelity sustained or there a heinous move in there surrounded by some more amenable (relatively speaking) climbing?

[Will Hunt]

It sits below your grade range, but Heaven In Your Hands with the undercut bump beta doesn't really have a crux, just a reasonably long sequence of tricky moves.

I've never been on it but is Jason's Roof a contender? Never tried it but Ben's Groove Sit looks sustained. The Lash?

How many moves does it have to be? You're probably only going to be looking at roofs, traverses (The Fonze with the heel-over-hand beta), and tall things to cram in the moves?

Again, below your grade range (or is it, sandbagging Nez?), but what I did of Wepwawet at Great Wolfrey was absolutely relentless.

And again, below your grade range (in which I've next to no experience) but Syrett's Saunter Right-hand in its current guise feels pretty sustained, if not especially long, once you get into the meat of it.

[205Chris]

If you're counting traverses there must be a few.

Back Street Mime Artist for definite. Probably breaks down into something like 3 7Bs back to back.

Low Rider

Mossatrocity

I'm sure there are loads

[User deactivated.]

I've not done it but have done the individual moves and Jason's Roof seems very sustained where all the moves felt about the same level. Red Baron Roof is similar I suppose.

[Duma]

Jerrys traverse at cratcliffe

[Bradders]

Ignore the grade range, the ones that sprung to mind first just happened to be in that range.

Jason's - definitely, no real crux but also no easy moves either really, sustained all the way.

Zoo York - again, one or two slightly easier moves but really every move is pretty tough.

Ben's Sit - yep, can certainly attest to this one!

Mossatrocity is a good shout. Low Rider / Chip Shop Buddy likewise.

The Lash definitely not. One hard move into the mono with the rest of the moves being difficult but nowhere near as hard as that one move.

[Will Hunt]

I normally hold traverses in pretty low regard, but the Green Traverse at the Glen is really excellent (starting, of course, from the very bottom of the boulder). Three 6Cs back to back with no meaningful rest. A sandbag at 7A in my opinion.

The ultimate Yorkshire pumpenhaus - The Virgin Traverse.

[abarro81]

Is it just me or is this a good proxy for a "Things on grit that are actually good" thread!

[tim palmer]

Is it just me or is this a good proxy for a "Things on grit that are actually good" thread!

No....Keelhaul and the demon wall links are pretty sustained.

My problem below DMZ is quite sustained.

I didn't think heaven in your hands was sustained at all, just one height dependent move to and off that crimp. (Much harder than red baron roof though)

High fidelity is more tricksy with two more powerful moves at mid height.

[Bradders]

Yeah I think probably need to exclude tricky/knacky climbing.

Keelhaul & Demon Wall links - definitely in, this isn't about quality 

Although at the Cliff Chiasmata works. Several difficult moves back to back.

[Bradders]

Thinking of the harder side of things, the only one I am guessing might fit besides The Boss is Lanny Bassham, based on what people have told me about it.

[Will Hunt]

I didn't think heaven in your hands was sustained at all, just one height dependent move to and off that crimp

Not sure when you did it or what beta you might have used, Tim. I'd been on it on two previous visits and not stuck the move to the crimp once. I did that move first time trying it with the undercut bump (see Olly Parkinson's footage) and didn't drop it there once thereafter (I think the top took a couple of attempts).

8:49 here.

[tim palmer]

Exactly the beta I used.   It is just quite balancy and spanned out on the feet.  I thought it was fine for 7c/+,  it took me a couple of sessions to get it sussed , mainly because it is technical and reachy.  It is a great problem but not powerful or sustained like the other problems discussed.

[Will Hunt]

Exactly the beta I used.   It is just quite balancy and spanned out on the feet.  I thought it was fine for 7c/+,  it took me a couple of sessions to get it sussed , mainly because it is technical and reachy.  It is a great problem but not powerful or sustained like the other problems discussed.

Ah, I'd missed the criteria that it should be powerful climbing. Still - the term is relative - having seen you crimp I struggle to think of many moves that would tax your fingers.
Fair enough if you found it tricky - perhaps a height thing - I think the consensus is generally forming that it's at most bottom end 7C for the average punter - roughly in the same ball park as Layby, though Layby is obviously very cruxy.

[tim palmer]

Exactly the beta I used.   It is just quite balancy and spanned out on the feet.  I thought it was fine for 7c/+,  it took me a couple of sessions to get it sussed , mainly because it is technical and reachy.  It is a great problem but not powerful or sustained like the other problems discussed.

Ah, I'd missed the criteria that it should be powerful climbing. Still - the term is relative - having seen you crimp I struggle to think of many moves that would tax your fingers.
Fair enough if you found it tricky - perhaps a height thing - I think the consensus is generally forming that it's at most bottom end 7C for the average punter - roughly in the same ball park as Layby, though Layby is obviously very cruxy.

Grades are weird, I thought layby arete was straight forward in comparison, just pulling hard on your right foot, is it not 7b+

[Will Hunt]

Grades are weird

This is the only conclusion I can draw from somebody finding Layby piss and HiyH significantly harder. Though if you're pulling with your right foot you might have been using a different sequence to me.

[JamieG]

Fish arete sit start is pretty sustained. Every move feels like equally hard compression type moves and there isn't really anywhere to take a breather before jug on the top. And even then the top out isn't trivial.

[User deactivated.]

I think the consensus is generally forming that it's at most bottom end 7C

90% of that data is your own post history 

[Fiend]

Is it just me or is this a good proxy for a "Things on grit that are actually good" thread!

More like "things on grit that are actually a complete waste of everything that makes grit special and really should be on other rock types". I was actually wondering if The Boss was one of the least special, least aesthetic, and least " gritstone" grit problems of it's grade, compared to several other inspiring top-end grit problems.

[teestub]

What makes grit special? All the best problems I’ve done in grit would be equally good if they were made of Swiss granite.

[tim palmer]

Grades are weird

This is the only conclusion I can draw from somebody finding Layby piss and HiyH significantly harder. Though if you're pulling with your right foot you might have been using a different sequence to me.

Yeah it was a summers day about 10 years ago,  I vaguely remember sticking my right toe on something near the side pull out right but it was a few goes many years ago. Do you think you find it harder because it isn't significantly easier if you are over 5'10"? 

other inspiring top-end grit problems.

Which ones? 

[abarro81]

What makes grit special?

British exceptionalism and a desperation to think we live somewhere less shit than it is?

In light of the objections, I'll rephrase my earlier statement to

"Things on grit that are actually fun to climb"

[36chambers]

What makes grit special?

Having to sand down your finger tips after every go, getting scrittle in your eye, dramatic grade changes whenever a cloud appears or disappears.

What more can you want?

[tim palmer]

What makes grit special?

British exceptionalism and a desperation to think we live somewhere less shit than it is?

In light of the objections, I'll rephrase my earlier statement to

"Things on grit that are actually fun to climb"

Yes

[tim palmer]

Back on topic I thought like a hurricane had some fun quite sustained climbing on it. 

[Will Hunt]

Do you think you find it harder because it isn't significantly easier if you are over 5'10"? 

I'll bow out now as it's all a bit off-topic but suffice to say that I suspect you think my grade views are more extreme than they actually are. Don't believe the hype - there really aren't many problems that I think are drastically easier than the given grade where there hasn't been a significant beta change or cleaning etc. In most cases there are others who are of the same opinion (Nez, Nathan Lee, and probably others in the case of HiyH).

Also, I'd love to see that list of problems that are significantly easier if you are over 5'10". All I ask is that we compile a list of all the problems that are harder if you're over 5'10" (i.e. every other boulder problem in existence).

[Bonjoy]

Well now, i've heard these all time classics fit the bill quite well:
Leathered 7b+ - Roaches
Broke Beak Mountain 7c+ - Howshaw
Rubble Rouser 7c+ - Eastweed
Trill Seeker 8a - Bradley (and all the other stuff on the face)

[teestub]

Was gonna say after watching a few vids that your Bradley opus seemed to fit the ‘bill’. Watched Molly’s vid on pinch punch that looked particularly sustained

[Bradders]

Trying to steer away from discussion of grades; what we're after are those problems that don't fit the "one / two conditions dependent moves". I think technical problems are actually okay as long as it's a sustained series of technical moves, e.g. Duel would 100% fit the bill. In that sense I can see where Will is coming from with HIYH, whereas Lay By Arete is very much a one-mover. But neither of them are really what I was thinking about.

At a more amenable grade; Crusis at the Cliff would fit. No really hard moves but quite a few of them back to back.

Trill Seeker looks amazing Jon, can't wait to try that when we're allowed to travel again.

[jamesturnbull97]

Thinking of the harder side of things, the only one I am guessing might fit besides The Boss is Lanny Bassham, based on what people have told me about it.

Yes, the meat of Lanny is 5 or so hard moves in a row

Back on topic I thought like a hurricane had some fun quite sustained climbing on it. 

I'll second that, both Hurricane and Omega are pretty sustained and psychical (i.e You're actually pulling on holds) the whole way through.

[remus]

 

Rubble Rouser 7c+ - Eastweed

I've only had a session on it and haven't done it, but isn't there a big juggy knee on this before you start the hard climbing at the end?

[TobyD]

Westworld?

[teestub]

Were you thinking of Western Eyes?

[Bonjoy]

Rubble Rouser 7c+ - Eastweed

I've only had a session on it and haven't done it, but isn't there a big juggy knee on this before you start the hard climbing at the end?

True. Two pitches of sustained climbing with a camp out on a knee in the middle

[BrutusTheBear]

Does Inertia Reel Traverse fit the bill?  Loads of conditions dependent moves, rather than 1 or 2 conditions dependent moves.  It's certainly very sustained.

[TobyD]

Were you thinking of Western Eyes?

Yes, I was!

[Bradders]

From another thread I was reminded of Tetris. No specific crux moves really but quite a few of a similar difficulty stacked together.

At the same crag The Darkest Cloud looks very sustained.

[mrjonathanr]

eatswood traverse
Green Traverse at the Plantation
Many things preceding the word ‘traverse’ frankly

[Will Hunt]

Shall we just ignore traverses? Just seems like stating the obvious.

[Bradders]

Yes I reckon so. Although something like Keelhaul would still fit.

[nai]

Shall we just ignore traverses? Just seems like stating the obvious.

Although eatswood traverse doesn't totally climb like a traverse, meat of it is steep stuff out of the cave and roof climbing along the lip, it's not just falling sideways.

[Fiend]

What makes grit special?

British exceptionalism and a desperation to think we live somewhere less shit than it is?

Well that's pure bollox and belongs to the same UKC debate as "grit is amazing because foreigners can't climb it". OTOH, this is partly true:

Having to sand down your finger tips after every go, getting scrittle in your eye, dramatic grade changes whenever a cloud appears or disappears.

But seriously. Amazing lines, beautiful aesthetics, pure features, pure friction climbing, slopers, smears, pebbles, climbing that is improbable until you have the faith, climbing that is comparably brilliant from the very easiest to the very hardest grades. Sure it's not the only amazing climbing in the world and maybe not the most amazing (Font?) but it is genuinely good and special - and I'd suggest that 90% of the "problems" with gritstone are actually just problems with British weather (barrows is of course right that that IS shit).

Sometimes I take a weird, detached mental step back and look at the gritstone edges and boulders through an outsider's eye, inadvertently imagining I'm new to the area or indeed new to the country, and it really strikes me how brilliant it can be.

Disclaimer and caveat: Natural grit is not my personal favourite rock for bouldering nor routes.
 

Back on topic - good topic. I concur with Will that traverses are maybe the least interesting suggestions, and with Bradders that problems that are not solely pumpy, but perhaps just very continuous and consistent are also worthy candidates. Would something like Ulysses as a highball fit the bill?? At a lower height, lower grade, but sticking with the "Bonjoy Matlock Area Hidden Gems" theme, I found Peaches and Crust pretty continuous, no one hard move but several hardish ones in a row.

[teestub]

Have you been to Switzerland Fiend? It had pretty much everything you’ve listed, except the pebbles.

[haydn jones]

From another thread I was reminded of Tetris. No specific crux moves really but quite a few of a similar difficulty stacked together.

At the same crag The Darkest Cloud looks very sustained.

My Boulder, Daedalus 7C , nearby to Tetris is powerful sustained roof climbing, don't think its had a repeat yet.

[Fiend]

Have you been to Switzerland Fiend? It had pretty much everything you’ve listed, except the pebbles.

No I haven't, I've seen plenty of footage tho and it does look good, although not quite as distinctive from what I've seen (then again that might be due to higher difficulty footage of basically Swiss versions of The Boss / this entire thread, rather than version of Crescent Arete and Spring Slab). I'd be keen to go, I might miss the pebbles tho.

[mrjonathanr]

From another thread I was reminded of Tetris. No specific crux moves really but quite a few of a similar difficulty stacked together.

At the same crag The Darkest Cloud looks very sustained.

My Boulder, Daedalus 7C , nearby to Tetris is powerful sustained roof climbing, don't think its had a repeat yet.

Where is this Haydn?

[Bonjoy]

It's the cave/roof start to Icarus Allsorts, which is on the rhs of the Apaloosa Sunset wall. Looks really good to me.

[mrjonathanr]

Right you are, thanks Bonjoy. IA is on the ticklist anyway, suitably chosen name by Haydn.