[Bradders]

Difficult to tell but I don't think Bradders employed the beta that I used on Losing My Edge. I don't recall finding the slaps up the arete being overly difficult, but holding the pinch flake at its bottom and matching over it with the right hand is definitely the crux on the original beta. I was able to bump my left hand again to take the pinch higher which turns it into a bit of a jug, thus getting rid of the crux. I put a comment in my logbook describing this improved beta and that it felt about 7A or 7A+.

I remember it making a difference where you started in the crack with your right hand too. If you stack a pad and take it higher up to start you avoid a droppable move bumping it up from low. Can see Dan doing it more clearly here (11:51):

[spidermonkey09]

I honestly don't understand how anybody can really claim that this alternative beta requires some sort of freakishly unusual body shape. It's merely a case of taking the hold that everybody else (including Dan Turner - who probably self-identifies as being in the "short" category) takes and then readjusting on it to hold it literally a couple of inches higher. The flake that forms the pinch on the arete narrows towards its top so taking it even a little higher than the very bottom dramatically improves it. We're not talking about wrapping your hand around the flake at its top, it's just holding the pinch a little higher. I'm 5 foot and 10 inches, with an unremarkable positive ape index.

I suppose its plausible that Dan didn't do it that way because he is so strong it doesn't matter. I don't actually know either way as I haven't done it, but suffice to say I am sceptical that moving your hand 2 inches higher changes the grade by 3 full grades. The more likely explanation, though it pains me to admit it, is that you're probably a better climber than you think you are. What a thing to have to type! I'll report back when I eventually go and do it.

[Ru]

I've never seen Losing Me Edge, but having looked at those two videos, the harder original version looks totally contrived. More like a defined method than an eliminate.

[turnipturned]

Christ, just seen this, is there three pages talking about Losing my edge? Good song mind.

Probably safe to say, just bad beta. I was hoping it would start matched on the undercut, but I soon realised that probably wasn't possible.

Glad people enjoy it.

[Will Hunt]

I honestly don't understand how anybody can really claim that this alternative beta requires some sort of freakishly unusual body shape. It's merely a case of taking the hold that everybody else (including Dan Turner - who probably self-identifies as being in the "short" category) takes and then readjusting on it to hold it literally a couple of inches higher. The flake that forms the pinch on the arete narrows towards its top so taking it even a little higher than the very bottom dramatically improves it. We're not talking about wrapping your hand around the flake at its top, it's just holding the pinch a little higher. I'm 5 foot and 10 inches, with an unremarkable positive ape index.

I suppose its plausible that Dan didn't do it that way because he is so strong it doesn't matter. I don't actually know either way as I haven't done it, but suffice to say I am sceptical that moving your hand 2 inches higher changes the grade by 3 full grades. The more likely explanation, though it pains me to admit it, is that you're probably a better climber than you think you are. What a thing to have to type! I'll report back when I eventually go and do it.

IDK, Jim, maybe actually go and feel the holds before drawing your own conclusions.

FWIW, Paul has updated the guide on Unknown Stones and listed all the frigs and variations with reduced grades, so anybody using this guide should no longer have any excuses.
https://unknownstones.files.wordpress.com/2021/02/13-crow-crag-feb-2021.pdf

[Bradders]

FWIW, Paul has updated the guide on Unknown Stones and listed all the frigs and variations with reduced grades, so anybody using this guide should no longer have any excuses.
https://unknownstones.files.wordpress.com/2021/02/13-crow-crag-feb-2021.pdf

Trying to bring it back to the original thread topic (it just happens that LME is a good proxy), the guide lists the LH variant with an FA unknown; but why would the first ascentionist of an easier version of a problem be worthy of mention?

I get it if someone does a harder version, even if it's desperately eliminate. But easier?

[SA Chris]

So a thread about claiming and over-grading shit eliminates has turned into a great Yorkshire scrittle love-in huh.....

You thought it was bad back on 2..

[Bonjoy]

I don't think anyone here really wants to hurt anyone's feelings, so perhaps we should have a specific downgrade/upgrade/approved sequence thread, where posting in it means you accept all the piss-taking that comes, and then we can straighten things out whilst keep it all in-house?

We used to have something like that, it was called UKB 

[Will Hunt]

FWIW, Paul has updated the guide on Unknown Stones and listed all the frigs and variations with reduced grades, so anybody using this guide should no longer have any excuses.
https://unknownstones.files.wordpress.com/2021/02/13-crow-crag-feb-2021.pdf

Trying to bring it back to the original thread topic (it just happens that LME is a good proxy), the guide lists the LH variant with an FA unknown; but why would the first ascentionist of an easier version of a problem be worthy of mention?

I get it if someone does a harder version, even if it's desperately eliminate. But easier?

I wouldn't read too much into it. I doubt Paul gave it very much thought.
Personally I wouldn't even mention a version where you start as for LME and immediately match the arete jug. Just start matched there for goodness' sake.

Now that we've thoroughly covered this one at Crow Crag what's next on the list?

[36chambers]

I'm 5 foot and 10 inches, with an unremarkable positive ape index.

Arm span 188cm.
180cm tall.

"Man on £80,000 salary refuses to believe he’s in the top 5% of earners"

Was this you?

[teestub]

Trying to come up with a joke that involves Will, 3 inches, and unremarkable 

[Will Hunt]

I'm 5 foot and 10 inches, with an unremarkable positive ape index.

Arm span 188cm.
180cm tall.

"Man on £80,000 salary refuses to believe he’s in the top 5% of earners"

Was this you?

Would you care to declare publically the difference between your height and span, Nate Dogg? 

Trying to come up with a joke that involves Will, 3 inches, and unremarkable 

No need. I am a joke.

[NaoB]

Now now, we're not 'apist' here on UKB, all body types are warmly accepted!

[tomtom]

Now now, we're not 'apist' here on UKB, all body types are warmly accepted!

Absolutely - but Will consistently claims he's not tall :D

[Fiend]

So a thread about claiming and over-grading shit eliminates has turned into a great Yorkshire scrittle love-in huh.....

You thought it was bad back on 2..

I absolutely despair. I've completely underestimated the downfall of British climbing and am going to scour UKC for Hobson Moor and New Mills Torrs July 2020 first ascents of 7B variants to E1 5cs to try to recover some sanity.

[mrjonathanr]

Now now, we're not 'apist' here on UKB, all body types are warmly accepted!

Absolutely - but Will consistently claims he's not tall :D

Unsurprisingly, if he thinks 180cm converts to 5'10

[SA Chris]

Unsurprisingly, if he thinks 180cm converts to 5'10

Grade creep converting repeatedly between the 2 systems.

[Will Hunt]

Back on topic 

https://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/dbpage.php?id=362478

[Andy F]

Odog is not some punter who massively overgrades eliminate bollocks. But you know that anyway Will.

[BenF]

Yeah, Owen's been seeking out extremely 'local', eliminate nonsense for decades. He loves it and has been getting shit for it for years. No doubt he would be proud to appear in this thread.

Is it wrong that I am actually interested in this problem now its been highlighted? Cheshire sandstone is riddled with obscure, contrived and potentially awful problems like this. Many of them are really fun with cool moves for the local who has done everything else, but I wouldn't put them in a guidebook. Well, maybe some of them...

[andy popp]

I don't know where that is ... but it looks bloody fantastic!!!

[BenF]

I don't know where that is ... but it looks bloody fantastic!!!

Haha, yeah.

[User deactivated]

Back on topic 

https://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/dbpage.php?id=362478

Owen is sound, and he has never said they are any good. Nearly everything at the crag has been given 1 star and they are  named 'local choss' etc.

[Will Hunt]

 

Yes, I know Owen is sound. Didn't he invent the 7 Foot Dyno? That makes him a God in my view.

It's a photo by a UKB regular of a fairly contrived looking sit start. I'm sure it's a gem. Just a bit of fun, you squares.

[BenF]

I was genuinely hoping this thread would involve the sharing of some god awful newly retroclaimed overgraded nonlines. And a subsequent slagfest. Local to me, some people have been logging some truly weird stuff. Like the grotto in Sefton Park.

I was at Otterspool wall, a sandstone block wall by the river, climbed on by locals for decades. Now new arrivals there always seem to spend ten minutes using the ukc cragpage to identify the nonlines before climbing. The joy of making stuff up and just climbing seems to be lost on many when not following the yellow bolt ons at the gym. Its just a man made wall liberally covered in nice crimps. It doesnt need a topo and grades.

#grumpyoldtwat