[Davo]

Davo, my point was that you are the one that is suggesting that these routes would be better changed with no reasons other than your opinion.

It is for you to justify the suggestion, preferably by researching these routes, their history, and investigate how often they really do (or don't) get done.

Fair points. I guess opinions on routes are what builds consensus which is why I was putting my opinions (with some reasons if you bothered to read) on why I thought Ninth Life could be bolted. I am open to others ideas and genuinely am keen to hear them: so if you have any reasons (apart from the stuff you mentioned earlier) why it wouldn’t be a good candidate then I am all ears.

In all honesty I knew Ninth Life would provoke a response because of the history. Personally I would be happy if it was bolted as I think it looks like reasonable climbing but the rock quality looks dubious. I am not really convinced by the history argument as that can be used to keep almost any routes as trad but I accept it is a stronger argument for Ninth Life. Lastly Two Tier is essentially a sport crag and really is not a trad crag. To me the routes there make much better sport routes than trad routes.

This is all just my opinion obviously

Dave

[Fiend]

I am not really convinced by the routes-getting-done-more-often argument as that can be used to retrobolt almost any trad routes. Lastly Two Tier is essentially a sport crag but really there are many examples across the country where trad and sport can co-exist even where a crag is primarily one of those.

[Johnny Brown]

Does Peak Lime really need another mediocre 7? At the cost of one of it's few storied and regularly climbed hard trad routes?

[Wood FT]

That’s my feeling. The Ninth Life experience looks like it far outweighs the quality of climbing. I’m glad the mud is soft.

[Bonjoy]

I agree NL is better left as is. My alternative Cheedale retrobolt nomination would be Shazam on the Cornice. A good trad route in theory, but just not worth the epic reclean for a single ascent. Have never seen evidence of an ascent in many years visiting the Cornice. Would be popular and much enjoyed as a sport route I suspect.

[abarro81]

There's no good reason to bolt NL in my opinion. Cheedale isn't short of mid 7s like JB said, and popularity isn't everything.

[Stu Littlefair]

The obvious good taste displayed by Jon here leads me to think that he should be made King of these decisions and his word is final.

All those in favour...

[Pat Hill]

Davo you have not got a clue what you're are talking about. If you really have a desire to climb Ninth Life then go up Daylight Robbery 7B (aid it if you have to) and top rope it.

[Fiend]

....and thus leave it clean enough for someone to onsight it 

[Davo]

Davo you have not got a clue what you're are talking about. If you really have a desire to climb Ninth Life then go up Daylight Robbery 7B (aid it if you have to) and top rope it.

Cheers for your constructive comment there. It always amazes me how some people speak online in a way that they would be very unlikely to in person.

Anyway, despite the tone of your comment I will try and address a couple of points. Firstly if by “no clue” you mean I have a different opinion about whether or not routes such as Ninth Life really need to be preserved as trad routes than you then yes you are correct. If however you mean I don’t know where it is, don’t understand the history and don’t know which route I would need to climb to toprope it then you are sorely mistaken.

In fact I probably was going to top rope it at some point this year to see what the actual climbing is like. In general terms I don’t think that this is likely to change my opinion but I like to keep an open mind and you never know if it is good climbing I could be persuaded to lead it (unlikely I admit!).

Dave

[Loos3-tools]

Don’t worry Dave he’s just covert spraying.

[danm]

Don’t worry Dave he’s just covert spraying.

Better that than having an opinion that it's best to retro a route which you haven't even climbed, to my mind at least.

[Loos3-tools]

Ukb loves a pile on

[danm]

Goat boy calls it like he sees it.

[reeve]

Just a reminder that the meeting is tonight via zoom at 7.30pm. Link below to register

https://community.thebmc.co.uk/Event.aspx?id=4251

[Offwidth]

Excellent meeting. Really enjoyed Callum's presentation and the cheesy diversions.

Just a reminder that Lynn and I produced a prize cryptic themed crossword for the Peak Area. Any Peak Area BMC members interested should email Lynn at:

lynn.robinson@bmcvolunteers.org.uk

When the competition closes we will make it public.