And for what its worth cycling seems far more dangerous than climbing and a good friend in S&R backs that up by saying he goes pick up far more mountain bikers than climbers.
Any thoughts on sharing home walls (scheduled, limited to 1 person per time, maybe max 1 per day, wipe down afterwards?)
I am now very much back to thinking that if i avoid any contact with others and stay local i can go climbing.
Will, I suspect you are being a bit of a dick here for the sake of argument. Is your point really that I cannot suggest that people get as close to possible as perfect, because I myself have not been completely perfect? The point I thought was quite clear is that the risk from going out for a short walk run/jog etc really is extremely minimal. It's quite proper to say "try and take no more risk than that", without having to deal with the counterpoint, "ah, but the risk is not zero".If we followed your version of "logic", we could not accept the merit of putting more gear in, because the gear might fail anyway.
So my rule is still simple; if there's a significant chance - even a small one - that you'd have more contact than walking round someone at a wide berth. Don't do it unless you absolutely need to.
The guidance in the USA re restarting the economy is interesting, gyms reopening earlier in the process than I'd have expected.https://www.whitehouse.gov/openingamerica/
while road biking has significantly less risk than mountain biking or climbing
Quote from: gme on April 17, 2020, 02:53:28 pmI am now very much back to thinking that if i avoid any contact with others and stay local i can go climbing. If I've understood your circumstances right (can easily get to a local crag that no other f*cker goes to and doesn't have lots of walkers nearby), then if I were in them I'd be going climbing now. But I'm in Sheffield, so I'll go fingerboarding instead and then moan about being shit and injured on the internet. Plus ca change.
UKC posted an article today that to me justifies going climbing if you want to, and definitely allows for JBs trips to the peak.I assume its been correctly researched and states its not against the rules to drive out to somewhere to exercise but the journey should be less time than the exercise, climbing ticks this box i guess.It says that whilst guidance does not state that climbing is allowed (yoga is apparently) it also doesn't specifically state it isn't. You can go out more than once a day and you can go out for more than an hour.I am now very much back to thinking that if i avoid any contact with others and stay local i can go climbing. Following new guidelines from government and the HSE we have lads out working again, only a few and all thoroughly risk assessed and controlled. We expect the numbers to increase each week with only the issue of accommodating stopping us. Applying what i know re this via work i cant see how going climbing shouldn't be allowed.We need to be careful that if we apply our own rules to the situation, and act self-righteously, we will get left at the back of the list when it comes to re opening everything up. Talk of all the reasons we cant go, such as touching holds and leaving the virus on them (seems very unlikely to me) could be very counter productive in the long term. And for what its worth cycling seems far more dangerous than climbing and a good friend in S&R backs that up by saying he goes pick up far more mountain bikers than climbers.
Can we change to topic title to ‘Pedantry during Covid 19’ SARS Cov2
No need to call me a bit of a dick.
Quote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 03:07:01 pmwhile road biking has significantly less risk than mountain biking or climbingJust to clarify, Ian. When you say "climbing", do you mean high-altitude mountaineering, fast and light alpinism, ski-mountaineering, freebase, The Indian Face, a nice diff, Malham Catwalk, Gordale trad, Stanage sunset soloing, gritstone HVSs, highball bouldering, headpointing, traversing your garden wall, deep water soloing, the-floor-is-hot-lava house climbing, the Olympic speed wall, board climbing in a garage, onsighting at your limit, normal bouldering, sea cliff climbing, climbing Gee Gee Rider out of Gaping Ghyll when the stream has been diverted, aid climbing in Yosemite, aid climbing in the Urals, or lowballing at Windy Choss Clough?
Quote from: Will Hunt on April 17, 2020, 03:26:10 pmQuote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 03:07:01 pmwhile road biking has significantly less risk than mountain biking or climbingJust to clarify, Ian. When you say "climbing", do you mean high-altitude mountaineering, fast and light alpinism, ski-mountaineering, freebase, The Indian Face, a nice diff, Malham Catwalk, Gordale trad, Stanage sunset soloing, gritstone HVSs, highball bouldering, headpointing, traversing your garden wall, deep water soloing, the-floor-is-hot-lava house climbing, the Olympic speed wall, board climbing in a garage, onsighting at your limit, normal bouldering, sea cliff climbing, climbing Gee Gee Rider out of Gaping Ghyll when the stream has been diverted, aid climbing in Yosemite, aid climbing in the Urals, or lowballing at Windy Choss Clough?I mean a general mix of indoor bouldering and leading, UK and foreign sport climbing and UK trad climbing
Quote from: Will Hunt on April 17, 2020, 03:12:55 pmNo need to call me a bit of a dick. In the spirit of pedantry, he didn't call you bit of a dick, he said you were being a bit of a dick.Former is an insult, the other is observing a ( hopefully temporary) course of action.
Gav - I think you must have read the half of that UKC article that looks at what's legally OK, and not the bit in the black box that says please don't go out. Having said, that, there are situations where you could go climbing and satisfy my simple rule. As I've said before, if that applies to you then fill your boots.
Quote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 04:47:23 pmQuote from: Will Hunt on April 17, 2020, 03:26:10 pmQuote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 03:07:01 pmwhile road biking has significantly less risk than mountain biking or climbingJust to clarify, Ian. When you say "climbing", do you mean high-altitude mountaineering, fast and light alpinism, ski-mountaineering, freebase, The Indian Face, a nice diff, Malham Catwalk, Gordale trad, Stanage sunset soloing, gritstone HVSs, highball bouldering, headpointing, traversing your garden wall, deep water soloing, the-floor-is-hot-lava house climbing, the Olympic speed wall, board climbing in a garage, onsighting at your limit, normal bouldering, sea cliff climbing, climbing Gee Gee Rider out of Gaping Ghyll when the stream has been diverted, aid climbing in Yosemite, aid climbing in the Urals, or lowballing at Windy Choss Clough?I mean a general mix of indoor bouldering and leading, UK and foreign sport climbing and UK trad climbing And slightly more seriously it seems that quite a few people are keen to make the 'cycling is just as/more dangerous as climbing' point, I just really don't see any evidence for that, climbing is nowhere near as dangerous as your average lay person thinks but does involve some risk of injury in most of its forms. Certainly travel insurance companies don't believe that, many will cover road cycling for no additional premium I haven't found any that cover climbing, bouldering or downhill mountain biking without significant additional premium.
Quote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 04:59:08 pmQuote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 04:47:23 pmQuote from: Will Hunt on April 17, 2020, 03:26:10 pmQuote from: IanP on April 17, 2020, 03:07:01 pmwhile road biking has significantly less risk than mountain biking or climbingJust to clarify, Ian. When you say "climbing", do you mean high-altitude mountaineering, fast and light alpinism, ski-mountaineering, freebase, The Indian Face, a nice diff, Malham Catwalk, Gordale trad, Stanage sunset soloing, gritstone HVSs, highball bouldering, headpointing, traversing your garden wall, deep water soloing, the-floor-is-hot-lava house climbing, the Olympic speed wall, board climbing in a garage, onsighting at your limit, normal bouldering, sea cliff climbing, climbing Gee Gee Rider out of Gaping Ghyll when the stream has been diverted, aid climbing in Yosemite, aid climbing in the Urals, or lowballing at Windy Choss Clough?I mean a general mix of indoor bouldering and leading, UK and foreign sport climbing and UK trad climbing And slightly more seriously it seems that quite a few people are keen to make the 'cycling is just as/more dangerous as climbing' point, I just really don't see any evidence for that, climbing is nowhere near as dangerous as your average lay person thinks but does involve some risk of injury in most of its forms. Certainly travel insurance companies don't believe that, many will cover road cycling for no additional premium I haven't found any that cover climbing, bouldering or downhill mountain biking without significant additional premium.Perception v reality.ROSPA reports 1,000 accidents per 100m hours for walking and 4,000 for rock climbing. Cycling scores 7,000 and horse riding 10,000.
Perception v reality.ROSPA reports 1,000 accidents per 100m hours for walking and 4,000 for rock climbing. Cycling scores 7,000 and horse riding 10,000.
@IanPTravel insurers don’t really understand risk. One example: you pay less for a shorter trekking policy that goes to high altitude, whereas you’re less likely to get ill (and need evacuation/medical assistance) on a longer trip with more time to acclimatise. It’s perverse. So I wouldn’t draw too many conclusions from how they load policies that include cover you for climbing, compared to a mass participation activity such as cycling.Anecdotally, adventure travel companies that run mountain biking trips have a lot of accidents.