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Finance, coronavirus, the economy, etc (Read 9545 times)

shark

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In what sense is Johnson a libertarian? It's an entirely impoverished term and yet he still doesn't deserve it.

Maybe Iím confusing it with libertine  :lol:

tomtom

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The what would Labour have done differently is quite interesting. And itís all hypotheticals - but (and Iíll use a Cummings/Johnson favourite) they did it with a three stage plan. (Or 4 Iím not counting)

Donít forget that over a period of a week to ten days. They first caved in on SSP. Then on business relief. Then small business relief. Then self employed people. And have still left all the zero hours people completely fucked -!and STILL have a 5 week wait for universal credit £££. Theyíve done a lot - but do have most countries - as if they didnít there would be total meltdown.

I would hypothesise that if Labour were in power the phasing would have been the other way around (a bit) starting with the people on benefits and zero hours and then working upwards.

Letís not forget that whilst the chancellor has made big give away S - Iíd argue heís had no choice. Remember his budget speech - all that Stuff about statutory sick pay. Thatís fecking chicken feed now in the big scheme of things.

Rail nationalisation? Itís basically prop up the companies or the trains stop running.

Nigel

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I would hypothesise that if Labour were in power....

If we're hypothesizing about that, can I suggest that if Labour under Corbyn had introduced the (necessary) current social controls then the papers would largely be full of foghorn warnings about Gulags and Soviet-style control. So in some ways (and I can't believe I'm saying this!) we might be lucky to have the Tories in charge of this as they get a free pass on the "slippery slope to dictatorship" front from the media.

petejh

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TT,
Couple of things,
1. if Labour had phased support Ďfrom the bottom up (supporting zero hours employees before they supported businesses etc.) it would be little benefit if companies had fucked off all their employees because they werenít seeing the support for their payroll come through sharpish. Supporting workersí wages is no use if youíve been laid off.
2. Not sure but fact check the 5 week UC. I thought the gov have agreed to fast-track an advance UC payment within the first week?
3. Also not sure but fact check the zero hours wage underwriting  - from reading up on the scheme today I thought the job preservation scheme (I.e. the 80% wage underwriting) does cover zero hours employees?

tomtom

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Hi Pete - the bigger point was that I think the emphasis of the bailout would have been different under a labour govt. but weíll never know eh!

Tory or Labour got s would have both had the same economic tools/mechanisms to use - so there would be some similarity. But Iíd bed the emphasis or what was implemented when to whom might have been different.

All moot now.

tomtom

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This may have been posted before - but I thought this FT commentary summarised quite a lot of what has been discussed in this thread. And some other stuff.

https://www.ft.com/content/7eff769a-74dd-11ea-95fe-fcd274e920ca

Quite remarkable really that 5 years ago youíd have expected something like this being written in a socialist newsletter - not the FT. Incredible times.

shark

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Link is for subscribers only

petejh

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I subscribed for a quid for one month and then cancelled.

sdm

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This may have been posted before - but I thought this FT commentary summarised quite a lot of what has been discussed in this thread. And some other stuff.

https://www.ft.com/content/7eff769a-74dd-11ea-95fe-fcd274e920ca

PSA:
Before posting paywalled links, please:
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petejh

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Here's a musing..

Boris still hasn't recovered from covid19. The tories direction and purpose currently stems in large part from Johnson as front man and Cummings in the background.
My limited understanding of Covid19 is that there's a danger period going into the second week of illness, when you either recover or you risk going into the inflammation over-reaction, lung damage, rapid decline and ventilation, and 50/50 chance of not recovering. *I hope this doesn't happen (to anyone), below is just a musing of what could happen starting next week.

Jonhson's health starts declining next week and he doesn't recover.
Dominic Raab takes the reigns, but doesn't show strong leadership.
Tories flounder for the next month.
Starmer and other select Labour MPs invited to bolster government Covid effort. Proves successful.
Government of national unity formed, remains in place for next 12 months.
A tory government with the largest majority since 1987 never got to leave the starting blocks, stopped in their tracks by the death of its leader and the Covid pandemic.
Labour win next election.

Oldmanmatt

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The thought occurred.

Think thatís the soft end of possible scenarios.

I think losing a head of state (HM not withstanding) would be catastrophic.

I wish the bugger had kept his hands in his pockets.

tomtom

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Yes - looking at the numbers  c.15-20% of those admitted to hospital donít come out.

Much as I dislike him / I wouldnít wish any harm to him and now is clearly not the time for anything bad to happen to him.

It does feel like the foot has come off the gas in the last week-ten days (testing, ventilators, Ppe). Dominic Raab eh. Trying to see an upside here...

andy popp

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From what I can tell Lord Palmerston was the last UK Prime Minister to have died in office (1865), so the country would be in very unfamiliar waters. Much as I think he's a reckless and unreliable oaf, the last thing any country needs right now would be such an event.

shark

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Candid nuts and bolts interview with the CEO of one of the UKís largest car dealerships - how him and his team have reacted to events, where the business is now and what the outlook is.

Quite long and suspect probably not of sustained interest to most.


Murph

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I dont know, the system is pretty robust. Precisely because the PM doesn't (normally) have much power. If a Putin were to die though then there could be trouble.

ali k

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"PM can run country from hospital bed", says senior government minister. Not something I ever thought I'd read. During a huge national and international crisis like this I feel pretty uncomfortable thinking about decisions being made by anyone not working at full capacity. Which surely can't happen when you're so under the weather you end up in hospital!

Doesn't say much for his confidence in Raab if he feels better able to handle it while he's hooked up to a ventilator (yes, I know he probably isn't at that stage...yet)

Offwidth

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T_B

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Quality piece of journalism that. Thanks for posting.

abarro81

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I'm surprised that anyone managed to get a news story out of "investors view large market movements as an opportunity to make money"  :shrug:
(I also could tell if your post was sarcastic or not Tom? I'm assuming it was?)

sdm

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"PM can run country from hospital bed", says senior government minister. Not something I ever thought I'd read. During a huge national and international crisis like this I feel pretty uncomfortable thinking about decisions being made by anyone not working at full capacity. Which surely can't happen when you're so under the weather you end up in hospital!

Doesn't say much for his confidence in Raab if he feels better able to handle it while he's hooked up to a ventilator (yes, I know he probably isn't at that stage...yet)

There's not many harsher critics of Johnson than me.

But I think the country is safer with Johnson running things from his hospital bed right now than with greater roles being given to Raab or Gove.

I hope he makes a full and speedy recovery because I think more people will die if he doesn't.

T_B

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I'm surprised that anyone managed to get a news story out of "investors view large market movements as an opportunity to make money"  :shrug:
(I also could tell if your post was sarcastic or not Tom? I'm assuming it was?)

Yeah, sarcastic. Iím not a fan of this type of yoghurt weaving lefty non story.

Bradders

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Another minister hits the finance headlines.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/05/rees-mogg-firm-accused-of-cashing-in-on-coronavirus-crisis

Fuck me what an absolute load of nonsense, literally reporting "fund manager does job". The Guardian really does bark up the wrong tree sometimes.

And the quotes from Starmer and McDonnell are just as bad. They will both surely know that this is neither "taking advantage of this crisis" or "profit seeking from people's misery", but they've stuck their oars in because the soundbite is good and plays to the rich vs poor narrative they're so desperate to write; essentially they're contributing to fake news. Poor form in my opinion.

petejh

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Quality piece of journalism that. Thanks for posting.

 :lol:

Investment company outed for buying low, with a plan to sell at a higher price in the future. Fuck off  :o

petejh

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Another minister hits the finance headlines.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/05/rees-mogg-firm-accused-of-cashing-in-on-coronavirus-crisis

Fuck me what an absolute load of nonsense, literally reporting "fund manager does job". The Guardian really does bark up the wrong tree sometimes.

And the quotes from Starmer and McDonnell are just as bad. They will both surely know that this is neither "taking advantage of this crisis" or "profit seeking from people's misery", but they've stuck their oars in because the soundbite is good and plays to the rich vs poor narrative they're so desperate to write; essentially they're contributing to fake news. Poor form in my opinion.

This.

I invested a few grand last Thursday in two companies I've followed for years, as I felt there were bargain prices on offer in the current market fallout. Am I wrong to try to make my money work for me by doing that Offwidth?

ali k

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It may be a non-story and just stating what is essentially standard practice. But I can imagine itís pretty disheartening for frontline nurses and carers to realise that while theyíre working day in day out in an overstretched system barely able to cope, seeing some of their colleagues dying, and often not equipped with even the most basic PPE, at the same time some wealthy people with spare cash lying around are using it as an opportunity to make a bit more money. It may not be news, and it may not be wrong, but to me it still seems distasteful somehow.

 

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