[jshaw]

*I suspect that doesnt mean one swab does 30 kids :D

Nah, 30 swabs for 30 kids all pooled then processed together. This would mean the testers intially only have 1 reaction to process to detect covid, rather than 30. In theory, the reaction they use to detect covid is so sensitive that a single intact RNA molecule from the virus could be detected. Only concern would be false negatives which could easy be mitigated.

(I'm a molecular biologist, partner worked at one of the testing centres for a bit during lockdown)

[tomtom]

*I suspect that doesnt mean one swab does 30 kids :D

Nah, 30 swabs for 30 kids all pooled then processed together. This would mean the testers intially only have 1 reaction to process to detect covid, rather than 30. In theory, the reaction they use to detect covid is so sensitive that a single intact RNA molecule from the virus could be detected. Only concern would be false negatives which could easy be mitigated.

(I'm a molecular biologist, partner worked at one of the testing centres for a bit during lockdown)

So completely and utterly possible then!

Good grief! (aimed at UKGovt)

[tommytwotone]

This article in today's Guardian sums up the state of play very accurately IMO:


TL;DR - Govt had plenty of time to prepare for this entirely foreseeable problem, was offered help by universities and other public bodies, ignored this in favour of outsourcing to the usual suspects and now we are where we are:


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/sep/17/england-test-and-trace-public-sector-boris-johnson-covid

[jshaw]

So completely and utterly possible then!

Good grief! (aimed at UKGovt)

Possible, yes absolutely. But say one comes back positive, you have to isolate everyone tested and associated with the group until you can go back through and retest everyone individually. For a class or year group at a school, this could mean absolutely loads of people are isolating. Probably unnecessarily.

It was probably looked at, and seen as a waste of time when speed of decision making was viewed as the priority rather than utilising each test / reaction as effectively as possible.

It's a good idea though and probably should be used on households, or families returning from hols. Loads of e.gs where it'd be useful.

[tomtom]

I really don’t understand what people are allowed to do or not do now... I even followed a couple of news website QA pages and it still didn’t completely make sense. Doesn’t help that Manchester seems to have different rules from all the other places locked down.

I think most people here are making it up... / using (gulp) common sense.

[Offwidth]

I really don’t understand what people are allowed to do or not do now... I even followed a couple of news website QA pages and it still didn’t completely make sense. Doesn’t help that Manchester seems to have different rules from all the other places locked down.

I think most people here are making it up... / using (gulp) common sense.

Nicola Sturgeon put things simply for Scotland.....

You should:

wear a face covering
avoid crowded places
clean hands and surfaces regularly
stay 2m away from other people
self-isolate and book a test if you have COVID-19 symptoms

Other than that most spread is said to be indoors with mixed households not following the above.

https://www.gov.scot/coronavirus-covid-19/

[SA Chris]

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-two-week-national-lockdown-in-october-proposed-by-top-scientists-report-12074645

Be most unhappy if it his happens over school holidays; kids in close contact all day every day, as soon as there is a break in this they want to impose a lockdown?

[galpinos]

Possible, yes absolutely. But say one comes back positive, you have to isolate everyone tested and associated with the group until you can go back through and retest everyone individually. For a class or year group at a school, this could mean absolutely loads of people are isolating. Probably unnecessarily.

That's what happens now though. My daughter is now off for a fortnight (managed a whole four full days) as there was a positive case in her class.

[gme]

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-two-week-national-lockdown-in-october-proposed-by-top-scientists-report-12074645

Be most unhappy if it his happens over school holidays; kids in close contact all day every day, as soon as there is a break in this they want to impose a lockdown?

I would have thought that would be a perfect time to do it. Extended to two weeks when kids are off and many parents take holidays anyway.

[SA Chris]

Even if you have to stay and home and don't spend any money that would keep the economy going?

[tomtom]

The scientists on Sage who said (last weekend) that cases were doubling every 7-8 days were bang on the money.

Despite my testing carping - we are far more informed now about its spread across the population and country now than we were in March. I really hope this means we can manage Wave2.0 better than the last time.

[gme]

Even if you have to stay and home and don't spend any money that would keep the economy going?

There was an assumption that a two week lockdown of some sort is necessary. If one is the damage would be less if it overlapped the half term.

[tomtom]

Half term is in a months time here. Think it would be too late by then....

[gme]

We’re all doomed then.

[sdm]

Despite my testing carping - we are far more informed now about its spread across the population and country now than we were in March. I really hope this means we can manage Wave2.0 better than the last time.

A worrying anecdote on this subject:

A friend had a routine operation with an overnight stay in hospital this week.

They had to get tested in the 72 hour window before the operation and provide a negative result for the hospital to let them in.

They were one of the people affected by the testing administration errors this week. They received a confirmation that their test was booked but never received the QR code. When they went to the test centre, they were turned away (as were other people while they were there). They then couldn't get another test booked before their operation.

They contacted the hospital who said that other people were in the same position and that they had no choice but to let people in without a negative test result.

It seems that lessons haven't been learned, and we are not going to be able to keep the wards covid free the second time around either.

[TobyD]

I think its just shit system design... whilst this might help people cheat the system in the short term - it makes it look more mickey mouse than heath robinson... Give yourselves a round of applause Deloitte / Serco / Dido.

A small point of interest; the Cheltenham festival was mentioned a lot as a failure in March that increased transmission.  I've seen it said in several places that the government was lobbied by a prominent member of the Jockey club to keep it running, as they were considering calling it off. The prominent figure in question with strong connections in government was Dido Harding. 

[nai]

The home of the jockey Club is Newmarket, a lot of trainers are based there.
The MP for Newmarket is Matt Hancock.
Can guess where most of his donations come from?

[mrjonathanr]

No need to guess:
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmregmem/110516/hancock_matthew.htm

[mrjonathanr]

A small point of interest; the Cheltenham festival was mentioned a lot as a failure in March that increased transmission.  I've seen it said in several places that the government was lobbied by a prominent member of the Jockey club to keep it running, as they were considering calling it off. The prominent figure in question with strong connections in government was Dido Harding.

It’s not a small point Toby, it strikes to the heart of the corruption flourishing under this administration.

There’s a coterie of influencers and beneficiaries related by ideology, interest and personal connection. Large sums of public money are allocated and personnel appointed without due process and scrutiny. Dido Harding and Deloitte are not experts in mass public screening. That expertise lies within the public sector but there’s no opportunity to siphon off funds by supporting the NHS and local occupational health. Why has the expertise of the public screening committee been bypassed?

Faculty, Ben Warner and Peter Thiel- more and more public money is being directed to right wing data crunchers linked to Cummings.

£100bn on  a ‘moonshot’ project. £100bn more of public money to be directed into more private hands! This is serious stuff. We are going to be paying for feathering many nice nests for a long time, while the public sector is starved of proper funding.

Look: austerity has hollowed out services since 2010- NHS underfunded, schools seriously underfunded, shortage of nurses, doctors, police - but if you are a management consultant/ data cruncher, there is a cornucopia of profitable contracts..

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/roberto-saviano-britain-corrupt-mafia-hay-festival-a7054851.html

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/britain-drops-out-of-top-ten-least-corrupt-countries-7tr9dffjw

Given its track record, what  will this administration do once unrestrained by EU state aid laws in directing public money to private business?

[tomtom]

This article (from a N.American perspective) gives a good overview on where the SCIENCE seems to be WRT CV19 transmission at the moment:

https://elemental.medium.com/the-most-likely-way-youll-get-infected-with-covid-19-30430384e5a5

[BrutusTheBear]

I think that the majority of SE Asia was onto this science a long time ago. Hence, the heavy usage of face masks and a seemingly better grip on the spread of the virus.  Culturally the use of masks when poorly, to protect others, was already there too.  I remember asking about people wearing masks when I visited Japan in 1998, the response being they have a cold and they don't want to share it with others..  Hence I Posted this on 12th March:
Given that the primary way the virus is spread is through airborne transmission you can see why schools are ideal places for transmission.  I sat in an assembly with 250+ pupils together in close proximity last week, thinking you could all have perfectly clean hands but if the person next to you coughs or sneezes you’re very likely to breath in whatever they have expelled....  I guess we can extend that to-  if the person next to you breathes out now.

[TobyD]

A small point of interest; the Cheltenham festival was mentioned a lot as a failure in March that increased transmission.  I've seen it said in several places that the government was lobbied by a prominent member of the Jockey club to keep it running, as they were considering calling it off. The prominent figure in question with strong connections in government was Dido Harding.

It’s not a small point Toby, it strikes to the heart of the corruption flourishing under this administration.
....
Given its track record, what  will this administration do once unrestrained by EU state aid laws in directing public money to private business?

No, indeed not,  I was being ironic in using 'small' (an excuse worthy of Trump?  )

Secondly,  they'll probably award an enormous sum of money to a technical company (probably Dyson)for developing some sort of space defence drone dreamed up by Dom in his tedious blog which doesn't ever get built.  Meanwhile Boris Johnson will retire, go back to being a shit columnist,  and the new PM Priti will pour a huge amount of money into giving Chris Grayling a contract to provide a drone defence navy fleet and building a wall around the country for stopping all migration ever.

[mrjonathanr]

I had missed that she was also going to be heading up the national institutefor health protection
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-creates-new-national-institute-for-health-protection

As she sits in the back benches and works and votes for the gov, that’s a massive conflict of interest for heading a public, apolitical body.

Plus she is obviously chosen for her compliance with policy (ie privatisation).

Anyone over the age of 8 who could not foresee that tourists returning from abroad, massively increased attendance at workplaces and the resumption of school for 12milliion children would cause a big increase in testing demand is unfit for the role.

[TobyD]

I had missed that she was also going to be heading up the national institutefor health protection
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-creates-new-national-institute-for-health-protection

As she sits in the back benches and works and votes for the gov, that’s a massive conflict of interest for heading a public, apolitical body.

Plus she is obviously chosen for her compliance with policy (ie privatisation).

Anyone over the age of 8 who could not foresee that tourists returning from abroad, massively increased attendance at workplaces and the resumption of school for 12milliion children would cause a big increase in testing demand is unfit for the role.

She's also married to a conservative MP. She doesn't appear well qualified for anything apart perhaps from owning horses.

[James Malloch]

Had a test yesterday and the person greeting you to check barcodes, ID, tell you where to go etc was there with no mask, head basically in the car in front with windows fully down having a long chat and passing things in/out. 

We covered our faces and spoke through the glass to him.

If there was one place I'd want to work under the strictest conditions covered in PPE it would be a testing centre FFS.

Our MP got back to me very quickly and has raised it with the director of public health to give them a bollocking. Barrow testing center staff - the new superspreaders?