[TobyD]

Just as a momentary aside from genocide top trumps, is the current situation with masks and covid regulations an attempt by the Johnson government to politicise masks further so that the situation ends up like the US where it seems to be a badge of identity?
The knees culture war seems to be going badly for them, so perhaps they needed a new one?

[mrjonathanr]

Yes.

[Offwidth]

Just as a momentary aside from genocide top trumps, is the current situation with masks and covid regulations an attempt by the Johnson government to politicise masks further so that the situation ends up like the US where it seems to be a badge of identity?
The knees culture war seems to be going badly for them, so perhaps they needed a new one?

Masks might go the same way...wearing them is a socially conservative thing to do, as well as sensible science. It was reported on the BBC that mask compulsion has 70% public support (in an Economist poll?)

[TobyD]

Just as a momentary aside from genocide top trumps, is the current situation with masks and covid regulations an attempt by the Johnson government to politicise masks further so that the situation ends up like the US where it seems to be a badge of identity?
The knees culture war seems to be going badly for them, so perhaps they needed a new one?

Masks might go the same way...wearing them is a socially conservative thing to do, as well as sensible science. It was reported on the BBC that mask compulsion has 70% public support (in an Economist poll?)

The issue I could forsee is that polls usually capture more elderly people who may be more motivated to wear them.

I can't see the bloody fuss to be honest wearing a mask doesn't bother me in the least, and it's not exactly a hassle. As someone who has a potentially weaker immune system enough to mean I get covid vaccines a lot earlier, I'd rather everyone wore them really, and it pisses me off that the government wants to make it all someone else's problem.

In fact trying to make it someone else's problem is pretty much their answer to everything. Immigration, food formulation/ strategy, online racism, Brexit...

[Offwidth]

It was a Mori poll properly adjusted to match the population profile.

https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/majority-britons-support-extending-certain-covid-19-restrictions-not-forever

[Nigel]

The knees culture war....

As stoked by Priti Patella.

(Not mine but made me chuckle).

[SA Chris]

I can't see the bloody fuss to be honest wearing a mask doesn't bother me in the least, and it's not exactly a hassle.

Agree. The only time they have been a hassle is when I forget to take the bloody things. Of all the changes in the last 18 months, it's been the least hassle to deal with.

[petejh]

That ipsos mori poll on the question of 'should restrictions remain in place permanently?' almost looks like it could be broken down by right/left political split. I'd be interested to see the correlation.

I can see both sides.. It appears sensible to keep regulations in place for the wearing of masks in the short term. But I can understand concern over keeping regulations in place for the longer term which could lead to a certain level of public expectation and more fear of change the longer we get used to things being a certain way.
 
Need to keep in mind what is the actual risk now, in perspective with all other health risks that society, including people with compromised immune system, typically live with? If the risk to the 'vulnerable' - depending on the definition of vulnerable - is significantly higher due to this latest covid wave, then taking measures such as keeping masks in crowded indoor spaces seems sensible. If the overall risks revert to some mean that society deems acceptable, then why should people wear masks? I'm not sure which is the case, and it doesn't seem easy to work it out.

[Offwidth]

I'm pleased with the polling. I'd expected the mass of misinformation on the subject to have led to lower levels of support.

The time to drop mask compulsion seems pretty obvious to me: when we were out of this wave. Cases are expected to come close to and possibly exceed UK record levels in two weeks time so there have never been as many infectious people out there, just at the time when most restrictions have gone. The epidemiological benefit of mask use is very well established now (the barrier physics was always obvious): the benefit in protecting people indoors from an asymptomaticly infected mask wearer is as significant as the most equal effect covid measure, vaccination. The benefits to the economy of stopping compulsion are effectively zero. It's all very well the backbench tories blathering on about freedom when that means freedom to risk infecting others (especially when those others have to be there for transport or it's their place of work).

[petejh]

Probably one of the few times you and I are in full agreement.

[Oldmanmatt]

I'm pleased with the polling. I'd expected the mass of misinformation on the subject to have led to lower levels of support.

The time to drop mask compulsion seems pretty obvious to me: when we were out of this wave. Cases are expected to come close to and possibly exceed UK record levels in two weeks time so there have never been as many infectious people out there, just at the time when most restrictions have gone. The epidemiological benefit of mask use is very well established now (the barrier physics was always obvious): the benefit in protecting people indoors from an asymptomaticly infected mask wearer is as significant as the most equal effect covid measure, vaccination. The benefits to the economy of stopping compulsion are effectively zero. It's all very well the backbench tories blathering on about freedom when that means freedom to risk infecting others (especially when those others have to be there for transport or it's their place of work).

I just don’t understand the fuss.  I frequently forget I’m wearing a mask, even when training/working out; or, more embarrassingly, when drinking coffee…

[battery]

As far as I understood it, all the restrictions were about not allowing the virus to run riot in order to ensure the NHS was not overwhelmed.

Having visited A&E twice in the last 2 months (bloody kids!) it is busier than I have ever seen it - I spent 30 minutes at 9.30 last night waiting in a corridor to even get into paediatric A&E and be triaged. The board said it was early 8 hours wait to be seen in the main A&E.

The staff were amazing and are trying their hardest but easing restrictions knowing that it is going to put more patients in hospital seems cruel, thoughtless, ungrateful to the NHS staff and just misjudged.

[Oldmanmatt]

As far as I understood it, all the restrictions were about not allowing the virus to run riot in order to ensure the NHS was not overwhelmed.

Having visited A&E twice in the last 2 months (bloody kids!) it is busier than I have ever seen it - I spent 30 minutes at 9.30 last night waiting in a corridor to even get into paediatric A&E and be triaged. The board said it was early 8 hours wait to be seen in the main A&E.

The staff were amazing and are trying their hardest but easing restrictions knowing that it is going to put more patients in hospital seems cruel, thoughtless, ungrateful to the NHS staff and just misjudged.

Torbay has 24 Covid patients with 4 serious/ventilated. Or, it did on Monday.
The Royal Devon and Exeter, is “swamped” according to my sister. She works in Oncology there, however, she’s currently on a ward having had a heart attack last Friday…

[TobyD]

I don't think that it's in dispute that obesity is a significant risk factor for more serious covid as well as its numerous other implications.  So, having commissioned an independent report on a strategy for dealing with it, Boris Johnson says he'll probably ignore it before he's actually read it: https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/national-food-strategy-tax-sugar-salt-plans-boris-johnson-henry-dimbleby-1105129

I give it a few months before Dimbleby resigns in frustration.

[ali k]

To be fair, he’s only dismissed one of the many recommendations before reading it as yet. Still time for him to reject the others too. For me the worst part of this is Johnson opting to give yet another vacuous rambling speech about “levelling up” on the same day as its release in an attempt to overshadow such an important report. Shamefully disrespectful.

And what did we learn in that speech?…that he’s sort of inclined towards more devolution, but only if it means giving more power to Tory leaders. And that he’s open to ideas about how to level up if anyone’s got any.

[TobyD]

To be fair, he’s only dismissed one of the many recommendations before reading it as yet. Still time for him to reject the others too. For me the worst part of this is Johnson opting to give yet another vacuous rambling speech about “levelling up” on the same day as its release in an attempt to overshadow such an important report. Shamefully disrespectful.

And what did we learn in that speech?…that he’s sort of inclined towards more devolution, but only if it means giving more power to Tory leaders. And that he’s open to ideas about how to level up if anyone’s got any.

You're quite right about that speech, I happened to listen to a Specator podcast,  and a bit of Times radio which discussed it and both mocked it remorselessly. 
The Times radio presenter commented that the only reason that Johnson is still so fat despite running every day is because he doesn't do any work.  These are both supposed to be Conservative supporting publications aren't they?

[andy popp]

The Royal Devon and Exeter, is “swamped” according to my sister. She works in Oncology there, however, she’s currently on a ward having had a heart attack last Friday…

Really sorry to hear that Matt, terrible. I hope she's doing as well as can be hoped for/expected.

[mrjonathanr]

I hope your sis has a good recovery Matt.

[Oldmanmatt]

She seems good, thanks guys.

She was re-stented and sent home to recover.
Expecting her down tomorrow for a BBQ.

Quite sobering, mind, when something like that happens to your younger sibling…

[TobyD]

Best wishes for your sister's recovery Matt.


https://inews.co.uk/opinion/boris-johnson-self-isolation-ping-u-turn-rishi-sunak-leaders-contempt-1109564

We have also learned from a book by Sage member Sir Jeremy Farrar that the Prime Minister does not really support anything he is asking the public to do in this pandemic. “I’m with Bonkers,” he said reportedly, referring to The Mail on Sunday’s anti-lockdown columnist Peter Hitchens. “I don’t believe in any of this, it’s all bullshit. I wish I’d been the mayor in Jaws and kept the beaches open.” If people were not suffering and dying, this might all be comedic. But this farce over self-isolation in Downing Street exposes the alarming attitude this Government has towards its fellow citizens.

We are led by a selfish and entitled man who talks about levelling up society yet believes rules are for the little people. He has shown this repeatedly, from his support for a home secretary who bullied her staff through to the peerage for a disgraced donor against official advice.

Johnson sees himself as a cavalier character, unshackled by petty societal mores, something witnessed in both his private and professional life, yet such an outlook is corrosive when running a nation that has lost faith in its politicians – and lethally toxic in a pandemic.

We still need clarity of message and collective response. Instead, we get confusion and these displays of contempt from our leaders

[DAVETHOMAS90]

Further. This rather disappointing from Tom Randall at the end 



MP Dawn Butler may have been asked to leave one house, but I suspect she'd be warmly welcomed in to quite a few others.

 

[BrutusTheBear]

  Dawn Butler.
I wondered who would take up the mantle sinceThe Beast of Bolsover lost his seat.
How can we have a functioning democracy if, at the very heart of it, there are no consequences for lying and you are removed for telling the truth?

[TobyD]

I admire her sentiment, and agree that Boris Johnson is a liar; however I also agree with the fact that MPs aren't allowed to say this outright in the chamber.
The house of commons may be rowdy at times, but if you watch any of the political debate in the US House of representatives, it often seems to deteriorate into really puerile name calling and insults.
Our system has some anachronisms, like having to say honourable member for... which seem silly, but the limit on being directly offensive I agree with.

I should add, it really angers me how much Johnson lies, he's always been a liar in his poor quality journalism, to his unfortunate partners and now as PM. He's also never answered a question in his life, he's an embarrassment to this country and he needs to go.

[ali k]

I admire her sentiment, and agree that Boris Johnson is a liar; however I also agree with the fact that MPs aren't allowed to say this outright in the chamber.

I think this needed to be done at some point. If only to expose the hypocrisy of the speaker enforcing the convention of not calling another MP a liar, but repeatedly failing to enforce the convention of coming to parliament and correcting the record if it has been misled.

[colin8ll]

His lying annoys me too, but the fact that it appears to be politically effective is what really gets me. The guy acts with impunity and is happy to debase our political landscape. I agree that it needed to be called out. I doubt it will have much impact though, as like with Trump, voters have a pretty good idea of his personal shortcomings by now and therefore it's already been factored into their decision making. I think the opposition need a stronger line of attack.