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U-S-A! The American Politics Thread. (Read 500077 times)

andy popp

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#2025 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 05:30:38 pm
Propublica does not claim to be a neutral news source. I'm sure you have the ability to parse whatever biases the article contains.

A.Greenhorne

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#2026 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 05:58:24 pm
Award winning independent journalism financed by Golden West Bank etc. I’d write off the whole site. That article really went for the jugular with the emotional lead in to the main text.

Oldmanmatt

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#2027 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 06:39:37 pm
And again...

Either, somebody is incapable of learning, or reading past posts.

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#2028 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 06:41:21 pm
Or simply the latest Dan Cheetham troll account.

Oldmanmatt

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#2029 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 06:42:07 pm
Or simply the latest Dan Cheetham troll account.

That would be “ incapable of learning”.

andy popp

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#2030 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 06:57:08 pm
I’d write off the whole site.

That's your prerogative, of course.

A.Greenhorne

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#2031 Re: Trump
December 22, 2020, 06:58:17 pm
Did I miss a past post? Just responding to the article and site. Nowt else

andy popp

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#2032 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 06:13:19 am
Woke in the early hours, inevitably triggered by my brain wondering what is happening in Georgia. Increasingly - and incredibly - it looks like the Democrats are going to win both of GA's senate seats. It's hard to overestimate how historic these victories will be, and how important in the present moment. No matter how insane the last four years have got, the last few days, and the next few, have reached a new intensity, with the open sedition of Trump and much of the GOP in calling for rejection of today's certification process, the fracturing of McConnell's iron rule over the party, and then the release of Trump's shocking phone call on Sunday, making Watergate look like small change. Today will be very ugly, in and outside Congress. The GOP will indulge in huge depths of cynicism and corruption on the floor, while Trump's mob will cause god knows what mayhem on the streets (there has already been violence between police and "Proud" Boys in DC overnight). Biden will be President, however, in two weeks time.

None of this is anywhere near over though. Trump and the cult will become completely dug in. The GOP and many of their voters have reached a point where they literally don't believe in the possibility of any legitimate Democrat victory. As one small indicator Republicans in the PA State Senate flat out refused to swear in a legitimate, certified Democratic Senator-elect. God knows what the next few years will bring.

But for now, I will gladly take two wins in Georgia (should they both come to pass) and Trump's certain humiliation in Congress later this afternoon.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2021, 06:27:33 am by andy popp »

DAVETHOMAS90

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#2033 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 06:51:00 am
Sorry to disappoint you Andy..

"They're shredding votes, I tell ya. It's happening.. It's so illegal.."  :lol:

Very well worth a listen:

https://news.sky.com/story/extraordinary-audio-recording-reveals-worrying-insight-into-trumps-state-of-mind-12178758

SA Chris

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#2034 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 07:58:07 am
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-scotland-55553493

This amused me. We don't want him here, avoiding the inauguration!

Surely if he does use military aircraft to get here, he can't use it afterwards to get home? Ex-presidents should get a regular flight.

The telephone call is nothing less than horrifying. He's got to go down for it? Is he at the nothing to lose stage??

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#2035 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 09:00:13 am
Come on Georgia you can do it, be a great start for Biden.

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#2036 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 09:27:48 am
Come on Georgia you can do it, be a great start for Biden.

Ossoff now crept ahead in the other race....

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/05/georgia-senate-runoff-elections-live-results

andy popp

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#2037 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 09:47:59 am
Ossoff at 16,000 now - Twitter has been very confident he will win for some hours. He just needs to get to +0.5% to avoid compulsory recount: he's currently at 0.4%. This must be completely frying Trump's brains.

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#2038 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 09:51:27 am
Is Trump going to fly in to resolve this?

Would the Devil rode down to Georgia be too appropriate?

tomtom

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#2039 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 09:56:17 am
Ossoff at 16,000 now - Twitter has been very confident he will win for some hours. He just needs to get to +0.5% to avoid compulsory recount: he's currently at 0.4%. This must be completely frying Trump's brains.

I wonder at what point the GOP will pivot on Trump? I know he's thoroughly embedded at the moment - but if this carries on it will surely happen at some point?

andy popp

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#2040 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 09:57:01 am
Is Trump going to fly in to resolve this?

He's going to be rallying his stormtroopers in DC, starting at 11am.

andy popp

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#2041 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 10:01:50 am
Good question Tom. Hawley and Cruz, who both have clear personal ambitions for 2024, have clearly bet on the party remaining Trumpian in vowing to oppose certification today. Tom Cotton, another 2024 contender, who is also ultra conservative has previously been uber loyal, has publicly said he will not oppose today and is clearly betting that Trump's influence will fade quickly. So, the jury is out.

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#2042 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 10:06:54 am
Good question Tom. Hawley and Cruz, who both have clear personal ambitions for 2024, have clearly bet on the party remaining Trumpian in vowing to oppose certification today. Tom Cotton, another 2024 contender, who is also ultra conservative has previously been uber loyal, has publicly said he will not oppose today and is clearly betting that Trump's influence will fade quickly. So, the jury is out.

Yes - especially if both georgia seats go Dem, then that sends the message that Trumps tactics are not going down well with many GOP supporters. Many will have a tin ear I suspect..

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#2043 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 10:10:58 am
Sorry to disappoint you Andy..

"They're shredding votes, I tell ya. It's happening.. It's so illegal.."  :lol:

Very well worth a listen:

https://news.sky.com/story/extraordinary-audio-recording-reveals-worrying-insight-into-trumps-state-of-mind-12178758
Just anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance to go then.

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#2044 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 10:14:09 am
Good question Tom. Hawley and Cruz, who both have clear personal ambitions for 2024, have clearly bet on the party remaining Trumpian in vowing to oppose certification today. Tom Cotton, another 2024 contender, who is also ultra conservative has previously been uber loyal, has publicly said he will not oppose today and is clearly betting that Trump's influence will fade quickly. So, the jury is out.

My guess would be, Hawley and Cruz cast around to see how much party backing they might get for their own ambitions; realised they were screwed and have leapt on the Trump train again as a last ditch action. I actually think the whole “objection” act is a desperate “Hail Mary” by Trump’s “team” as their last, remote, hope of retaining any power post Trump. I’d put money on all those who object, losing out at the first Primary that comes their way and Trump loyalists and Q nut jobs, being weeded out over the next four years. The establishment GOP, ultimately tamed and partially neutered the Tea Party, but I think they underestimated the Trump threat in 2016. Something they will be working on correcting.

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#2045 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 10:38:54 am
Good question Tom. Hawley and Cruz, who both have clear personal ambitions for 2024, have clearly bet on the party remaining Trumpian in vowing to oppose certification today. Tom Cotton, another 2024 contender, who is also ultra conservative has previously been uber loyal, has publicly said he will not oppose today and is clearly betting that Trump's influence will fade quickly. So, the jury is out.

My guess would be, Hawley and Cruz cast around to see how much party backing they might get for their own ambitions; realised they were screwed and have leapt on the Trump train again as a last ditch action. I actually think the whole “objection” act is a desperate “Hail Mary” by Trump’s “team” as their last, remote, hope of retaining any power post Trump. I’d put money on all those who object, losing out at the first Primary that comes their way and Trump loyalists and Q nut jobs, being weeded out over the next four years. The establishment GOP, ultimately tamed and partially neutered the Tea Party, but I think they underestimated the Trump threat in 2016. Something they will be working on correcting.

Have a to feel this might be a bit too much to hope for but you never know. 

Got to says the slow unravelling of it all into a complete disaster for Trump is a real pleasure in a period when are short of good news.

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#2046 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 10:57:05 am
Think the loss of these run offs for the Rep lies squarely with Trump undermining their voters faith in the process, and so suppressing republican turnout. So hopefully should result in further quashing of Trumps personal influence. That said Trumpism (populist, racist, etc) is here to stay in the Rep party IMO, it's basically the only way they have to power.

andy popp

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#2047 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 11:46:03 am
Think the loss of these run offs for the Rep lies squarely with Trump undermining their voters faith in the process, and so suppressing republican turnout.

Agreed, but this doesn't necessarily mean Trump's appeal and power are waning. The real lesson from today is that Democrat's won through massive, sustained efforts on the ground, over many years, led by Stacey Abrams. The Dems owe both these seats and the Presidency to Black Americans. As you say Duma, Trumpism is here to stay. It has to be beaten rather than simply hoping it will whither.

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#2048 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 03:26:38 pm
Assuming Warnock and Ossoff are both seated the Senate will be split 50/50. The Democrats will represent 41,549,808 more people than the Republicans.

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#2049 Re: Trump
January 06, 2021, 03:53:16 pm
Ossoffs count suspended until 8:30am Georgia time so the counters could rest.

 

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