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Many people who don't use UKB because of its culture - why, and how to fix??
jwi:
--- Quote from: stone on April 11, 2024, 12:13:01 pm ---
--- Quote from: jwi on April 11, 2024, 08:50:37 am ---...
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I agree with you to some extent, but I do think being transparent and public causes many people to stop and think -is this really a statement I want to be associated with? -and if not ought I really to be making it?
...
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I have no problem with my statements being associated with my name, but it's an unecessary distraction when students who are beginner climbers figure out how much I climb and at what level (thanks google...).
slab_happy:
--- Quote from: stone on April 10, 2024, 10:00:40 pm ---I noticed in that Careless Talk podcast they chatted about UKB and said it suffers from anonymity causing people to write stuff they wouldn't say face-to-face.
My impression is that people on here don't do much to conceal who they really are and other climbers probably could quickly find out. I've wittered on plenty about how I've not agreed with much derogatory "bants" I've seen on here. I'm not convinced though that (the minimal anyway) anonymity has much to do with it.
I was interested though that the podcast host seemed to think there might be something to fix.
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I think it's one of those beliefs that seems like "common sense", that of course people must be more prone to being abusive if they're anonymous online and that forcing people to use their legal names would improve that -- but research keeps on not showing that, especially when it comes to communities with "persistent pseudonyms" (like UKB).
A friend of mine has worked in the field that's now usually called Trust & Safety (formerly known as Abuse) for decades, and this is one of the topics that makes her go feral.
A few samples of the research:
https://coralproject.net/blog/the-real-name-fallacy/
https://globalnews.ca/news/2855416/forget-anonymity-internet-trolls-are-more-abusive-when-using-their-real-names-study-finds/ -- reporting on https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0155923
https://techcrunch.com/2012/07/29/surprisingly-good-evidence-that-real-name-policies-fail-to-improve-comments
--- Quote from: stone on April 11, 2024, 12:13:01 pm ---I agree with you to some extent, but I do think being transparent and public causes many people to stop and think -is this really a statement I want to be associated with? -and if not ought I really to be making it?
--- End quote ---
Consider how that applies to anyone who wants to discuss, say, being LGBTQ+, experiences of mental illness or neurodiversity, being a survivor of sexual trauma or domestic violence, experiences of discrimination, etc. etc. etc..
There are a lot of things that people might very understandably want and need to be able to discuss without necessarily wanting it to come up instantly when a potential employer -- or a stalker, or a violent ex -- Googles their name.
Dac:
I don’t believe that having to use your real name would have a positive affect on ‘the culture’ on this or any other forum. I am not a big forum user, my experiences are limited mostly to UKB, UKC and singletrackworld (a mountain bike forum), and can only speak based on personal experience, but I find this forum to be better than most, and I think the main reason for this is the relative small number of forum users.
A larger number of people gives any single individual gives a greater degree of anonymity, whether on a forum or in real life. As a analogy, if you lived in a big city you could spend your days acting like a dick, and it may rarely come back to bite you; if you live in a small village it’s only going to be a matter of time before your reputation becomes known to one and all, or find yourself in the only shop / pub / whatever being served by the individual you were being a dick to the day before.
Needing to use your name would also surely either be open to abuse (if you wish to act like a dick them simply register an account as Fred Bloggs and off you go), or require the sort of proof of identity that would mire any forum admin in all manner of GDPR issues, and frankly make most users unlikely to use the forum in the first place (would you bother registering with a forum if it required you to upload your passport or driving licence?)
slab_happy:
--- Quote from: stone on April 10, 2024, 10:00:40 pm ---I noticed in that Careless Talk podcast they chatted about UKB and said it suffers from anonymity causing people to write stuff they wouldn't say face-to-face.
My impression is that people on here don't do much to conceal who they really are and other climbers probably could quickly find out. I've wittered on plenty about how I've not agreed with much derogatory "bants" I've seen on here. I'm not convinced though that (the minimal anyway) anonymity has much to do with it.
I was interested though that the podcast host seemed to think there might be something to fix.
--- End quote ---
Also yeah, I think for most of us who use the board a lot, the "anonymity" here is very limited in relation to other forum users. Just off the top of my head, I can think of multiple other UKB users who've climbed with me and who know my real name and where I live.
What it does mean is that, for example, someone who's heard of me by my real name in another context can't Google me and immediately find this forum and me, say, discussing how exactly many meds I need to take to manage my depression. Because that's information which feels somewhat personal.
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