[petejh]

All of this sponsorship rubbish is so far removed from my own climbing that I dont let it bother me.

  to the extent that most news of 'cutting edge first ascents' or 'significant repeats' is of litte interest to me beyond a gap filler at work to relieve the tedium (theres only so much Linux stuff I can read).

#Hijackalert: I don't believe Slackers wrote that, too many typo's and not liking Linux 'that' much?!. C'mon!

[Fultonius]

I have seen examples of non-pros doing the whole tagging brands and hashtagging and posing topless and i do find it disheartening but also a bit funny. In some ways it is sad that lesser pros get a bigger slice of the pie but that is the nature of the sponsorship game. You are promoting a brand, that is a major part of your job. nothing in life is for free.

It's really good value money for the brands too as their 'ambassadors' do a fuck load of marketing for them for what appears to be a couple of shoes and some stickers.

Is it though? How much does anyone take notice of what Sponsored heroes wear? I'm not about to buy a pair of 5.10 Moccasyms because Ned climbed 8B in them. Nor am I going to buy a pair of bright orange Marmot trousers because Mawson wears them. Sometimes I'll see a few people using gear that I think looks good/appropriate for what I want and if they are using them for the type of things Im keen for then I might take notice but apart from that it doesn't work on me.

You may be immune to it but if you see all the trendy kids down TCA Glasgow wearing their puffy down jackets to go indoor bouldering in an adequately heated room...you'd know that people are influenced by what they see.

[36chambers]

I have seen examples of non-pros doing the whole tagging brands and hashtagging and posing topless and i do find it disheartening but also a bit funny. In some ways it is sad that lesser pros get a bigger slice of the pie but that is the nature of the sponsorship game. You are promoting a brand, that is a major part of your job. nothing in life is for free.

It's really good value money for the brands too as their 'ambassadors' do a fuck load of marketing for them for what appears to be a couple of shoes and some stickers.

Is it though? How much does anyone take notice of what Sponsored heroes wear? I'm not about to buy a pair of 5.10 Moccasyms because Ned climbed 8B in them. Nor am I going to buy a pair of bright orange Marmot trousers because Mawson wears them. Sometimes I'll see a few people using gear that I think looks good/appropriate for what I want and if they are using them for the type of things Im keen for then I might take notice but apart from that it doesn't work on me.

If Ned and all the other UK wads suddenly started wearing Madrocks I bet you'd considered checking out a pair. We are all slaves to advertising.

EDIT: god damnit I'm so slow at this commenting lark

[Muenchener]

I have a sticker from a Zillertal guiding service on my snowboard, because the powder course I did with them was so great I thought they deserved some free advertising.

But on reflection I'm probably damaging them: anybody who sees me on my board would be more likely to think "ok, better avoid his teacher then"

[dave]

If Ned and all the other UK wads suddenly started wearing Madrocks I bet you'd considered checking out a pair. We are all slaves to advertising.

Madrocks: possibly. Scarpas: no.

[Wood FT]

I have seen examples of non-pros doing the whole tagging brands and hashtagging and posing topless and i do find it disheartening but also a bit funny. In some ways it is sad that lesser pros get a bigger slice of the pie but that is the nature of the sponsorship game. You are promoting a brand, that is a major part of your job. nothing in life is for free.

It's really good value money for the brands too as their 'ambassadors' do a fuck load of marketing for them for what appears to be a couple of shoes and some stickers.

Is it though? How much does anyone take notice of what Sponsored heroes wear? I'm not about to buy a pair of 5.10 Moccasyms because Ned climbed 8B in them. Nor am I going to buy a pair of bright orange Marmot trousers because Mawson wears them. Sometimes I'll see a few people using gear that I think looks good/appropriate for what I want and if they are using them for the type of things Im keen for then I might take notice but apart from that it doesn't work on me.

You may be immune to it but if you see all the trendy kids down TCA Glasgow wearing their puffy down jackets to go indoor bouldering in an adequately heated room...you'd know that people are influenced by what they see.

what he said Dunc but you can apply that to that any wall with bumblers and chummers

[Muenchener]

If food did become scarce the first thing he'd have done was eat the sport climbers.

Hardly any meat on 'em, nowt but bone & gristle. He'd be better going after rabbits.

[slackline]

#Hijackalert: I don't believe Slackers wrote that, too many typo's and not liking Linux 'that' much?!. C'mon!

Its not that I don't want to, but I can only concentrate on one thing for so long (i.e. work) and find it awkward switching to another (unrelated) topic that requires concentration, hence watching simple climbing videos in between working rather than learning something new about Linux.

[lagerstarfish]

I can only concentrate on one thing for so long (i.e. work) and find it awkward switching to another (unrelated) topic that requires concentration, hence watching simple climbing videos in between working rather than learning something new about Linux. I am a puny human

[Will Hunt]

Guy, Duncan, have you never been to Font? Its like a fucking catalogue shoot. Succinctly put by Grimer:
http://twitter.com/grimerclimber/status/583921566356008960

Whenever money and the need to get a sponsor enter into a person's climbing, usual rules that apply to climbing (matter-of-factness, hard climbs, etc.) go out of the window, and marketing rules enter.
Pretty, handsome, easy to sell, politically correct, these are the things that count. Compromise, compromise, compromise. You basically accept to forswear the truth. You can't say that a route is shit, because your sponsors would not like it. You can't say that you crushed it to atoms, you can't say that someone doesn't deserve a sponsorship, etc. We can't be friends with everyone and we shouldn't be.

I completely agree.

[Rocksteady]

I don't really see how climbing is different from any other field in relation to this.

Want to be good at something? Do it lots. Want to get paid for being good at something? Build your profile.

Are the bestselling books the 'best' books, the most insightful, the best written? Probably mostly not, they're the ones that are marketed the hardest.
Are the biggest blockbuster films the best films? Same answer.
Was David Beckham the best footballer of his time, or the one who was best at marketing himself as a brand?
Anna Kournikova made a lot of money from tennis sponsorship - was she the best or the best brand opportunity/best looking?

In a world that was perfectly meritocratic, the people who put in the worthiest effort would be paid the most. But that's a bit of a naive worldview. Waste of time getting angry about it.

Train hard, climb lots, climb hard and be satisfied with that. But if you want to make money you have to work, not just do your hobby and expect to be rewarded for it.

[36chambers]

Just saw this and it really made me laugh

https://twitter.com/ClimbingRumours/status/709825506573729793

I would wad you guys if I could

[PipeSmoke]

Five ten appears to have become the brand of the hashtag not the brave. Obviously excluding the wads ( Ned and gang), they have people who just pose about "doing all the moves but one , will send next time" on boulders several grades harder than anything they've done before. Obviously they never return for a next time. Not worth a post is it that you can do all moves but crux and can't link it. Let alone free shit

[Duncan campbell]

Guy, Duncan, have you never been to Font? Its like a fucking catalogue shoot. Succinctly put by Grimer:
http://twitter.com/grimerclimber/status/583921566356008960

I have only spent one evening in Font on the way back from Ceuse, and was mainly concentrating on how fun it was bezzing around a circuit getting spanked and doing really ace problems. Who notices or even cares whether people change their clothes a lot during the day? (I actually struggle to believe this happens)

You may be immune to it but if you see all the trendy kids down TCA Glasgow wearing their puffy down jackets to go indoor bouldering in an adequately heated room...you'd know that people are influenced by what they see.

what he said Dunc but you can apply that to that any wall with bumblers and chummers.

Do we all agree these people would have bought an item of outdoor clothing if there were no sponsored heroes? Because if so, does it matter that they saw Caff wearing those terrible Red and black Rab Euro trou and thought "Ooooh maybe I'll be as good as Caff and if  not Ill look as cool as Caff if I buy those"? Surely more fool them?

I think Rocksteady hit the nail on the head. Ondra doesn't need to do social media because the media follows him around and he is a) the best and b) happy to do interviews or whatever.

Nathan Lee gets free shoes because he occasionally puts up nice videos of him doing great stuff on the grit.

Honnold gets paid enough to have started his own foundation and there are some shit bits to his job like loads of interviews/lectures/resoloing stuff for film/dealing with adoring american punters. But I reckon more often than not he just goes climbing.

If the above didn't court media I wouldnt have anyhting to watch in my lunch break so there would be a loss. As for those who maybe I don't feel deserve sponsorship or dont embody the spirit of climbing the way I see it I ignore. And i have no bitterness towards the system.

P.S that sheff rumours thing is hilarious - imagine if we didnt have these people to take the piss out of?!? Be well boring then!

[Bonjoy]

I don't really see how climbing is different from any other field in relation to this.

Want to be good at something? Do it lots. Want to get paid for being good at something? Build your profile.

Are the bestselling books the 'best' books, the most insightful, the best written? Probably mostly not, they're the ones that are marketed the hardest.
Are the biggest blockbuster films the best films? Same answer.
Was David Beckham the best footballer of his time, or the one who was best at marketing himself as a brand?
Anna Kournikova made a lot of money from tennis sponsorship - was she the best or the best brand opportunity/best looking?

Science too apparently http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b072jdqm

[Wood FT]

Guy, Duncan, have you never been to Font? Its like a fucking catalogue shoot. Succinctly put by Grimer:
http://twitter.com/grimerclimber/status/583921566356008960

I have only spent one evening in Font on the way back from Ceuse, and was mainly concentrating on how fun it was bezzing around a circuit getting spanked and doing really ace problems. Who notices or even cares whether people change their clothes a lot during the day? (I actually struggle to believe this happens)

You may be immune to it but if you see all the trendy kids down TCA Glasgow wearing their puffy down jackets to go indoor bouldering in an adequately heated room...you'd know that people are influenced by what they see.

what he said Dunc but you can apply that to that any wall with bumblers and chummers.

If the above didn't court media I wouldnt have anyhting to watch in my lunch break so there would be a loss. As for those who maybe I don't feel deserve sponsorship or dont embody the spirit of climbing the way I see it I ignore. And i have no bitterness towards the system.

You must have some bitterness or at least understand others bitterness becuase I saw your first post on this thread before you edited it  those two chaps are REALLY annoying

[Duncan campbell]

Guy, Duncan, have you never been to Font? Its like a fucking catalogue shoot. Succinctly put by Grimer:
http://twitter.com/grimerclimber/status/583921566356008960

I have only spent one evening in Font on the way back from Ceuse, and was mainly concentrating on how fun it was bezzing around a circuit getting spanked and doing really ace problems. Who notices or even cares whether people change their clothes a lot during the day? (I actually struggle to believe this happens)

You may be immune to it but if you see all the trendy kids down TCA Glasgow wearing their puffy down jackets to go indoor bouldering in an adequately heated room...you'd know that people are influenced by what they see.

what he said Dunc but you can apply that to that any wall with bumblers and chummers.

If the above didn't court media I wouldnt have anyhting to watch in my lunch break so there would be a loss. As for those who maybe I don't feel deserve sponsorship or dont embody the spirit of climbing the way I see it I ignore. And i have no bitterness towards the system.

You must have some bitterness or at least understand others bitterness becuase I saw your first post on this thread before you edited it  those two chaps are REALLY annoying

HAHA!! Dammit!  To be honest I do find those two a little annoying. But probably even more so I think its just laughable how un-self aware they are. Looking through their instagram feeds always gives me a giggle. I think they maybe get a small amount of free stuff from weird unknown companies like holdbreaker (Who TF are they!?!) I edited my first post because I thought it was potentially a little harsh/obvious. I guess its annoying that those two dipsticks are probably getting stuff that better climbers maybe deserve? But its a bit of chalk and maybe the odd t-shirt. They aren't raking in Salaries like Sharma and Honnold.

As I said before, they can hashtag pics of their abbs and only managing single moves on 8Cs until the cows come home because at the end of the day it makes no difference to how much I'm going to love going back to Pabbay in the summer. They wont be there when Im in Pembroke and I wont give them a second's thought at these times.

[Duncan campbell]

I sort of understand where people are coming from but I don't understand why you all let it get to you so 

[r2d2]

Just saw this and it really made me laugh

https://twitter.com/ClimbingRumours/status/709825506573729793

I would wad you guys if I could
[/quote

The irony of that climbing rumours feed is the person posting it comes across as sycophantic

[AlistairB]

You must have some bitterness or at least understand others bitterness becuase I saw your first post on this thread before you edited it  those two chaps are REALLY annoying

@fiveten_official @fivetenuk @pitchclimbing @frictionlabs @monkeyfistclimbing #climbing #climbingtraining #climbbeyond #climbing_is_my_passion #climbing_pictures_of_instagram #brandofthebrave #climbyourimpossible


As an aside, they seem really nice in person which just makes their online presence more unfortunate really.

[Wood FT]

I sort of understand where people are coming from but I don't understand why you all let it get to you so 

No-one is losing sleep over it, I think that climbing means a lot to us and that means climbing as a culture not just as an individual activity.

[Wood FT]

You must have some bitterness or at least understand others bitterness becuase I saw your first post on this thread before you edited it  those two chaps are REALLY annoying

@fiveten_official @fivetenuk @pitchclimbing @frictionlabs @monkeyfistclimbing #climbing #climbingtraining #climbbeyond #climbing_is_my_passion #climbing_pictures_of_instagram #brandofthebrave #climbyourimpossible


As an aside, they seem really nice in person which just makes their online presence more unfortunate really.

+1

[slackline]

Science too apparently http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b072jdqm

Yep, science isn't immune since its conducted by humans, a fair proportion of whom want to climb a greasy ladder of promotion or at least get their papers published in high-impact journals so they are returnable for the Research Excellence Framework (REF determines how much of the government funding pie their institution gets) and increase their chances of successful subsequent grant applications.  To which end poor science is often conducted.

[duncan]

Is it though? How much does anyone take notice of what Sponsored heroes wear? I'm not about to buy a pair of 5.10 Moccasyms because Ned climbed 8B in them. Nor am I going to buy a pair of bright orange Marmot trousers because Mawson wears them. Sometimes I'll see a few people using gear that I think looks good/appropriate for what I want and if they are using them for the type of things Im keen for then I might take notice but apart from that it doesn't work on me.

If Ned and all the other UK wads suddenly started wearing Madrocks I bet you'd considered checking out a pair. We are all slaves to advertising.

I'm definitely influenced by the wads. That Simon Lee using 5.10 Blancos on everything for example.

[Duncan campbell]

I sort of understand where people are coming from but I don't understand why you all let it get to you so 

No-one is losing sleep over it, I think that climbing means a lot to us and that means climbing as a culture not just as an individual activity.

I guess but that is one part of the climbing culture. The climbing culture I interact with i.e you, all those other chumps we hang out with, other people around the world who love it for the same reasons as us - we all seem to be 'lifers'. Climbing is a broad church - if it makes people happy to hashtag the shit out of that pic of themselves then as long as they aren't secretly chipping/gluing/bolting things can't we just leave them to it? Or maybe if you feel so strongly about it maybe you should say something?

I think the whole competition thing is a bit of a load of rubbish that imo isnt really something I see fitting in with climbing culture. I'd never say that to anyone who loved comp climbing's face though as it has nothing to do with me what they choose to do with their time.

My opinion may even be wrong in both of these cases. Maybe we are all wrong? I just think that it would be better to get on with what you are doing/keen on/etc and as long as you can still see a core of similar climbers doing the same and the people not within this core aren't stopping you from doing it the way you want, maybe we should allow them the same?