[Drew]

Nobody mentioned this yet?



http://lizardclimbing.com/index.php?id=362

[Fiend]

Nobody mentioned this yet?

It looks almost as bad as something out of Lancashire, the video has more confusing edits than a lawson beta clip, and the hardest boulder problem is based on some semi-inflammatory gobbledegook at: http://lizardclimbing.com/index.php?id=361 

[Schnell]

It looks almost as bad as something out of Lancashire, the video has more confusing edits than a lawson beta clip, and the hardest boulder problem is based on some semi-inflammatory gobbledegook at: http://lizardclimbing.com/index.php?id=361 

From my reading of that blog post, he's pissed that he can't climb a 9a+ so he's decided that bouldering grades are nonsense too and he may as well give himself 8C+ for this.

[dave]

Grading stuff based on numbers of days spent on previous projects generally just doesn't have a great track record. A lot of stuff graded like this in the past have ended up being wrong, or at least more prone to being wrong than just the usual "hard hard does it feel" or "how much do you need to hang onto your free boots deal" grading estimate.

[shark]

Log finish 

[Nibile]

No wonder he found it so hard, he did every move three times in a row.

[r-man]

Nobody mentioned this yet?

It looks almost as bad as something out of Lancashire, the video has more confusing edits than a lawson beta clip, and the hardest boulder problem is based on some semi-inflammatory gobbledegook at: http://lizardclimbing.com/index.php?id=361 

The edits are confusing, and the grade, but I like the fact he's squeezed every inch of his local crag and clearly become very good at a very specific style. Commendable obsession!

[DAVETHOMAS90]

Log finish 

More pulling on wood 

[tomtom]

Its no king line...

But given the UK's ability to drag endless harder eliminate style problems/lines from some of our 'top' lime venues then maybe we should not be so quick to criticise...

Its a fucking awful video though...

[36chambers]

Here's a much better clip of the problem. It's a shame people are so reluctant to show a full unedited one-shot ascent, I find it harder to appreciate how difficult something is otherwise.

[Fiend]

When I think of the world's hardest traversy thing, this is the sort of footage I like:

https://youtu.be/QeR47AQ05Jo?t=2m50s

Quite aesthetic for crabwise shuffling too.

[dave]

Here's a much better clip of the problem. It's a shame people are so reluctant to show a full unedited one-shot ascent, I find it harder to appreciate how difficult something is otherwise.

Having now watched two videos of this problem I couldn't tell you what it looks like or how steep it is. I wish folk would stop filming everything through a fucking fisheye or ultrawide either in the climbers face or from floor level.

[tomtom]

Here's a much better clip of the problem. It's a shame people are so reluctant to show a full unedited one-shot ascent, I find it harder to appreciate how difficult something is otherwise.

Having now watched two videos of this problem I couldn't tell you what it looks like or how steep it is. I wish folk would stop filming everything through a fucking fisheye or ultrawide either in the climbers face or from floor level.

Thanks for perspective Dave

[jwi]

So the boulder is 8C+ because Action Direct is not that hard for Megos/Hojer, and Ondra has thin fingers?

Crystal.

[ghisino]

Since this Is a traverse, then i should mention "fou rire retour aller" 9a... Having passed by the boulder while looking for la mouche (the problem, not the man) i can say it looks proper desperate and very conditions dependent...the main difficulty seems to be able to hang from ugly one pad slopers.

[Doylo]

Grading stuff based on numbers of days spent on previous projects generally just doesn't have a great track record. A lot of stuff graded like this in the past have ended up being wrong, or at least more prone to being wrong than just the usual "hard hard does it feel" or "how much do you need to hang onto your free boots deal" grading estimate.

It's a good yardstick but shouldn't be the sole basis for grading something new.

[abarro81]

Especially for boulder problems.. I certainly find if I take a grade just above my flash limit on boulders that means doing it in anything from 2-3 tries to spending 5 sessions on it and still failing to do multiple moves!

[Fiend]

On the other hand his new 9b does sound rather cool: http://www.lizardclimbing.com/index.php?id=372

[a dense loner]

Worlds hardest Boulder problem? Fuck off

[benno]

In fairness to the guy, in that blog post he does reasonably clearly say it's not as hard as anything else that gets given the same grade, and he's trying to reverse the trend for (what he sees as) overly modest grading at the top end. He's being berated more for being included in this thread by someone else than as a result of his own actions, it would seem.

[jwi]

Climber release chock statement “I found that grade bands seem wider at my limit”

[Fiend]

Surely this is one for Jens to stick his oar in too?

[cowboyhat]

In fairness to the guy, in that blog post he does reasonably clearly say it's not as hard as anything else that gets given the same grade, and he's trying to reverse the trend for (what he sees as) overly modest grading at the top end.

I've wondered about this, why bouldering grades seem to have become stuck at 8c with great reluctance from all parties to admit to anything harder. Its the new English 6c.

[rodma]

Here's a much better clip of the problem. It's a shame people are so reluctant to show a full unedited one-shot ascent, I find it harder to appreciate how difficult something is otherwise.

Having now watched two videos of this problem I couldn't tell you what it looks like or how steep it is. I wish folk would stop filming everything through a fucking fisheye or ultrawide either in the climbers face or from floor level.

can't tell what angle and what's more, for no good reason, both are edited, so no clean footage.

those crimps look tiny regardless of angle though

[jwi]

I've wondered about this, why bouldering grades seem to have become stuck at 8c with great reluctance from all parties to admit to anything harder. Its the new English 6c.

Also called the Nicole-limit. Up to 8C progress was easy, and done by repeating various Nicole-testpieces around the world.

There is also the chance that very little real progress has been made in the last 10 years. It's not uncommon in sports: for instance the world high jump record is more than 20 years old, and equaling the world record from 35 years ago would still win you almost all big high jump competitions.

[tim palmer]

I've wondered about this, why bouldering grades seem to have become stuck at 8c with great reluctance from all parties to admit to anything harder. Its the new English 6c.

Also called the Nicole-limit. Up to 8C progress was easy, and done by repeating various Nicole-testpieces around the world.

There is also the chance that very little real progress has been made in the last 10 years. It's not uncommon in sports: for instance the world high jump record is more than 20 years old, and equaling the world record from 35 years ago would still win you almost all big high jump competitions.

i think a lot of these long standing records are due to undetected doping though, that Cuban guy who still holds the record had a few drug related bans did he not?

It seems highly unlikely that standards have not improved in an era of better training facilities and a larger group of full time pros 

[Fiend]

As far as 8C/V15 goes, I thought there were a few previous V16s out there (Goia, Ondra's grotty traverse thing, errrr, Bugeleisen SS?), and that some 8Cs had got shunted down to 8B+ too?

[cowboyhat]

I've wondered about this, why bouldering grades seem to have become stuck at 8c with great reluctance from all parties to admit to anything harder. Its the new English 6c.

Also called the Nicole-limit. Up to 8C progress was easy, and done by repeating various Nicole-testpieces around the world.

There is also the chance that very little real progress has been made in the last 10 years. It's not uncommon in sports: for instance the world high jump record is more than 20 years old, and equaling the world record from 35 years ago would still win you almost all big high jump competitions.

i think a lot of these long standing records are due to undetected doping though, that Cuban guy who still holds the record had a few drug related bans did he not?

It seems highly unlikely that standards have not improved in an era of better training facilities and a larger group of full time pros

Yes see womens sprint records. Athletics isn't great parallel.

[Nemo]

All that's happened is grades have become more standardized between different areas.  So things which were getting given 8C and 8C+ (Entlinge, Anam Cara etc) ten years ago in some places, but were only as hard as things getting 8B in other places all now tend to get 8B+...

Stuff has got way harder in the last ten years.  The grades just appear to have stagnated because the areas which orignally evolved with softer grading systems haven't been the areas which have dictated the system which has become standard.  The standard has largely been dictated by travelling americans and has ended up somewhere in between the extremes of grading between different areas from a decade or so ago...

[r-man]

As far as 8C/V15 goes, I thought there were a few previous V16s out there (Goia, Ondra's grotty traverse thing, errrr, Bugeleisen SS?), and that some 8Cs had got shunted down to 8B+ too?

Gioia was 8C. Ondra suggested 8C+ (At around the same time he suggested 8C+ for his traverse, Terranova). Nalle didn't agree.

Bugeleisen sit has been repeated and 8C suggested.

The Process and Hypnotized Minds look like a couple of the strongest contenders for the new grade.

There are a few others, but might not be attractive enough for travelling Americans. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RndNw9F74rvgvqDA1i512MwxHf7PtacojVD4s7DHVz8/htmlview

No two boulderers have yet climbed a problem that they agree is 8C+.

[Doylo]

Nalle seems the be the only one of the top boys committed to a proper seige. That thing in Finland sounds like it will the hardest problem in the world.

[Fiend]

The next hardest boulder problem in the world .

Who repeated Bugle SS?

[r-man]

Jakob Schubert. His first 8C.

http://www.rockandice.com/lates-news/jakob-schubert-gets-second-ascent-of-bugeleisen-sit-austria-s-first-v15

[Fiend]

Wow. Nice one him. Amazing looking problem.

[r-man]

Birtle the beetle is back. No cuts this time...

[tomtom]

Go P-bert