[T_B]

Might be a size thing? I've had 4 pairs of size 43 laces, which have all been softer than the 44 VS. Smaller shoes tend to feel stiffer overall of course.

[mrjonathanr]

The Instinct lace in Grip 2 are softer, but the XS Edge rubber makes them about the same as the VS in my experience.

I'd get the Furia for grit if they'd used the Instinct last but they used the more cramped Booster last which I'm not so keen on.....if I'm going to buy something which is a bit of a compromise I can do it a lot cheaper. When my old pink resoles die I'll probably just end up with new pinks, though they do look stiffer which is not quite what I'm after so would be interested ion people's views

ie how stiff are the new pinks?

[galpinos]

ie how stiff are the new pinks?

Not very. Stiffer than the green, less stiff than the whites. I like them.

[mrjonathanr]

Sounds good, thanks.

[shark]

 

I'm starting to yearn for a simpler time when Boreal Fires was the only choice

[mrjonathanr]

Me too. Schooldays were great, weren't they? 

[benno]

It strikes me as a bit odd that you'd be yearning for Fires after your recent misadventure!

[Nibile]

 

[lmarenzi]

Finally got around to putting on these little beasties. A bit painful during the current wearing-in sessions.

Fit so snugly that when I take them off it goes pff like a fridge door opening (more so on the right). I tie the laces loose so use them as a slipper because when they are on there is no way they are coming off while climbing, even through ten heal  hooks.

£10 cheaper than the blue ones, which were so far out of line with other top of the range shoes that it would have been unethical to encourage La Sportiva in that direction, and the novelty velcro clasp thingy was crap.

IMO a shoe for bouldering where you need to find something to push against (soft, feel) rather than pushing hard on something you have already found (power, stiffness).

Best of the three no edges shoes by La Sportiva to date by a large margin, which is what you would expect, I suppose.

Colour combo is all a bit boy racer and the name is terrible, but it's probably the best climbing shoe ever made.

[mctrials23]

They have these at the epictv shop for £80 which is a bit of a bargain.

[moose]

Now the earlier adopters have worn-in their Geniuses (Genii?), what's the verdict?  I love my Futuras and was thinking treating myself to a pair of their lace-up cousins.  How do they compare?  What is the sizing like?  I am 42.5 in Futuras  - initially agony, probably worth it in retrospect - though for me to get Geniuses in a similar fit whey would have to be as stretchy.  43 in Miuras of both types and Katanas.

[Stu Littlefair]

Mine are a huge disappointment. I have a slightly dodgy big toe which gets sore in some shoes. The toe box is very steep on the genius which makes them unbearable for me.

It's a shame because the RF feels amazing but I can barely stand on the LF. Back to futuras for me.


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[moose]

Sad to hear you don't get on with them; although, by the sound of it, it's not so much that the shoes have let you down, but your own treacherous left big toe?  What's the sizing like compared to Futuras?

[cha1n]

Genius on the right, futura on the left - sorted.

http://eveningsends.com/climbing/5-ways-to-look-like-you-climb-hard/

[Pako]

I've heard that the rubber on the Geniuses is more liable to wear out quickly than on the solutions or other shoes, is this true? Need to get new shoes, will probably just go with the solutions again because I can't be bothered getting shoes that wear out quickly and apparently can't be resoled due to their strange rubber makeup.

[petejh]

Now the earlier adopters have worn-in their Geniuses (Genii?), what's the verdict?  I love my Futuras and was thinking treating myself to a pair of their lace-up cousins.  How do they compare?  What is the sizing like?  I am 42.5 in Futuras  - initially agony, probably worth it in retrospect - though for me to get Geniuses in a similar fit whey would have to be as stretchy.  43 in Miuras of both types and Katanas.

I still love mine - best shoes for sport climbing I've ever owned. Like them so much I bought a second pair within a few weeks. I currently also own Muira VS's, Muira lace-ups, 5.10 whites.

Whites - slate, specific thin slabby sport and some trad,
Muira lace-ups - trad and warming up on sport
Muira VS's - stopped wearing them, redundant.
Genius - sport (and bouldering when I get around to doing some)


No issue with the toe rubber wearing out - I think the opposite could be true i.e. the toe rubber will last longer than a normal shoe. That's based on a couple of reviews plus mine aren't showing any sign of accelerated wearing on the the toe.

I'm size 40/40.5 in Muira VS/Muira lace-ups; size 39 in Genius.


Stu you could look all specialised and cool by wearing two different shoes..

[Stu Littlefair]

Haha. I'm already doing this, but I need a very specific shoe on my RF at the moment, and it isn't a genius. I wish my right toe was poorly so I could wear the genius on the LF.

Pano - my own personal experience of Futuras has been the rubber lasts longer as there's no edge to wear down. This is true unless you're a toe dragger, in which case the narrow strip of rubber at the toe might get peeled away.


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[Paul B]

My final pair of planks are starting to break in and it appears they'll be done before the Verdon is commercially available.

Pete, Stu, how do these no-edge shoes actually perform on small edges (I'm thinking Kilnsey LHS, Malham LHS and Upper Tier etc.)?

It looks to me from your break-down that for anything edgey you'e defaulting to something else?

[cha1n]

I'd be interested to know how people manage it, if they actually do use these for micro edging as perhaps I'm using the shoes wrong. I wear my futuras and speedsters a lot but exclusively indoors (where most of the holds, even the crimps are rounded for comfort) and on the higher friction, rounded rock types like sandstone (incl. grit).

I tried them at the tor as I assumed that they're be good on all those rounded, polished edges but had no luck with them and much preferred a stiffer shoe. As I've said before though, there's various videos of Ondra onsighting at Malham and the tor wearing his speedsters. I know he's really strong but I don't think he'd put himself at a disadvantage by wearing a shoe that isn't appropriate.

[moose]

I've been using my Futuras at Kilnsey all year and found them really good.  I became a "believer" when my Miura VSs kept slipping from a tiny downward sloping foothold on a route I had been working (only around a 10-20% success rate when trying it from hanging off a bolt - pretty much total failure if having to climb into the move via a big rock-over).  Straight from the box the Futuras kept on the foothold during the move with near 100% success rate (and it wasn't just a matter of getting the knack as swapped back to VSs  few times and resumed failing). 

Took them to Malham too - to work Zoolook and didn't have any problems attributable to them (just pitiful early season stamina!).  Better than my VSs on slopey smears.  With small but more positive edges, they look like they should not work (toe just seems too "blunt") but always seem to stick - maybe have to push more with the feet. 

Re sizing, so the consensus is go down at least  0.5 size from Futuras / 1 size down from Miuras?

[petejh]

My final pair of planks are starting to break in and it appears they'll be done before the Verdon is commercially available.

Pete, Stu, how do these no-edge shoes actually perform on small edges (I'm thinking Kilnsey LHS, Malham LHS and Upper Tier etc.)?

It looks to me from your break-down that for anything edgey you'e defaulting to something else?

I guess? I don't think too hard about it - if you have a proper edging shoe (whites / new verdons.. etc.) and a dedicated sport shoe (genius, futura or whatever) then you're covered aren't you.  So why worry if the genius can be excellent on really edgy stuff?

On the only hard route I climbed at Malham (oak) I found them significantly more reliable on footholds then my Muira VS's or whites. Probably not a typical Malham route..

I haven't climbed on Pen Trwyn recently but I'd choose the genius on Mayfair wall stuff. Slate, no.

[TobyD]

On the only hard route I climbed at Malham (oak) I found them significantly more reliable on footholds then my Muira VS's or whites. Probably not a typical Malham route..

careful Pete, you'll have Simon buying some...

Paul, i wear anasazi velcros on basically everything, they seem to work generally fine. Although narrow footed people don't like them I believe?

[shark]

On the only hard route I climbed at Malham (oak) I found them significantly more reliable on footholds then my Muira VS's or whites. Probably not a typical Malham route..

careful Pete, you'll have Simon buying some...

I've had a look at Rob Greenwoods pair and not convinced. He later said in his review "Whilst it was good on steeper ground when it came down to more vertical/slabby terrain on certain types of rock (particularly when small footholds were involved) the Genius were not ideal, being that their soft/lightweight nature simply don't have enough support to make that sort of ground feel any easier. Were you to attempt a route on the slate wearing a pair of Genius you would probably need your toes operating on afterwards!!!"
 
Been inspecting and discussing the Verdons with Steve. They have a very rounded sole - not ideal for edging. Steve had a go at sanding his down to see whether that would sort them out but with not great results. Also they seem to have softened really quick.

Whites are the ultimate. I dont understand why people cant appreciate what you can do with them.  Pearls before swine. 

[Pako]

I got some futuras the other day, and I am liking them quite a bit, although I feel that they are outperformed by solutions on very small incut footers. On anything slopey though, they are much better. I might get some solutions of the same size some time when I scrape together the money, but the geniuses are definitely very good, it's also lovely to wear a shoe that actually breaks in very quickly, and is already fairly comfortable to wear, while also being small.

[Paul B]

My final pair of planks are starting to break in and it appears they'll be done before the Verdon is commercially available.

These are now on pre-order at Outisde for a not too outrageous starting price (39.6FAs) should anyone feel like taking a punt on the 5.10 shoe sizing lottery.