[a dense loner]

Ah mctrails I didn't realise you were using a pulley, I assumed you meant you were doing one armed hangs  also for some reason I just assume people are half-crimping which seems to be in vogue, my bad. That's where my 8B statement came from.

Anyone who thinks doing something with moderate stress is as good as doing something with maximal stress may as well buy men's health as opposed to flex. And hope no one has taken photos of them bumming their dog in the garden

[mctrials23]

Ah mctrails I didn't realise you were using a pulley, I assumed you meant you were doing one armed hangs  also for some reason I just assume people are half-crimping which seems to be in vogue, my bad. That's where my 8B statement came from.

Ahh, never assume I am anything but childishly weak (not one of those strong kids either).

Honestly though, I reckon I should be able to one arm half crimp the bottom centre slot on the beastmaker in the next few months but I can assure you I will still be operating in the mid to late 7s if I'm lucky!

I have decided in light of all the comments to keep with my one arm hangs over an appealingly easy medium intensity jolly.

[Sasquatch]

Assuming that both Steve Maisch and Steve Bechtel are reasonable smart people, I'd guess the issues are with terminology and target audience.  Are the articles targeted at Intermediate or advanced climbers?  For Maisch I'd guess advanced, for Bechtel-Intermediate.  What does "moderate" mean?  What does "comfortably" mean?  These types of generic terms are the bane of training communication.  They're like pain tolerance.  Everybody has a slightly different perspective on it, so it really has no meaning.  It's like talking to a sport climber and a boulderer about trying "hard".  Their starting reference is so different, it can seem like a different language.  Most boulderers have little understanding of how pumped you can actually get and keep climbing.  Most sport climbers (who don't also boulder) don't know how hard they can actually pull on a single move. 

If comfortably means maximum with good form, then they're very similar programs except one would lead you to a smaller hold at bodyweight, whilst the other would have you add weight to whatever hold to achieve maximal. 

I do think it's interesting that Steve Maisch's program is remarkably similar to Eva Lopez protocol.   

[petejh]

Ah mctrails I didn't realise you were using a pulley, I assumed you meant you were doing one armed hangs  also for some reason I just assume people are half-crimping which seems to be in vogue, my bad. That's where my 8B statement came from.

What about me Dense? I'm doing exactly what you assumed -  5-8 secs one armed hangs, unassisted, from the bottom middle slot on a BM, in three different arm positions (and I was half-crimping as in the CMP vid). Yet I don't boulder 8B (although I hardly ever boulder..). I know, I'm just awesome.

mctrials - go easy on your fingers. Strong digits are fuck-all consolation if you can't climb.

[mctrials23]

mctrials - go easy on your fingers. Strong digits are fuck-all consolation if you can't climb.

Are you talking about my plan to be able to one arm hang the middle rung on the beastmaker in 6 months time? I am just recovering from an A2 at the moment which is pretty much better now but I really hated having to ease up on my climbing while it healed.

[a dense loner]

Obviously Pete the other caveat is straight on, as per the cwp hangs. If you say you can do this for the time stated then no offence but I don't believe you

[petejh]

mctrials - go easy on your fingers. Strong digits are fuck-all consolation if you can't climb.

Are you talking about my plan to be able to one arm hang the middle rung on the beastmaker in 6 months time? I am just recovering from an A2 at the moment which is pretty much better now but I really hated having to ease up on my climbing while it healed.

yep. 13 months ago I did exactly what you're aspiring to do and strained a pulley very shortly afterward which put me out for 6 weeks. It made me think it wasn't worth the gain. Long term medium intensity for me since then.

Dense, can you explain what you mean by 'straight on'? As far as I'm aware I've done the unassisted one-armers in exactly the same way as per the CWP vid. I might even till be able to do them, might warm up later and try (...pop!)

[mctrials23]

yep. 13 months ago I did exactly what you're aspiring to do and strained a pulley very shortly afterward which put me out for 6 weeks. It made me think it wasn't worth the gain. Long term medium intensity for me since then.

Hows the long term medium intensity working out?

I'm just keen to get stronger faster because I'm a bit bored of being at a roughly similar level for the past 6 months. I know I have got stronger but all I see around me are people much stronger than myself climbing stuff I want to climb! There is the other side of it which is that come a point, you have to be able to hang small holds with a lot of weight on them and without training that, its unlikely you will be able to climb those problems.

[a dense loner]

Oh ffs! I've wrote a lengthy reply twice only to have the net scuppered when sending. I am after all in a bar in Tenerife waiting for the beat freaks, a Beatles rip off band, to enter stage left.
Just was saying Webb stays front on, as in stand under the board as if you're gonna do a 2 handed hang but only put one hand up pull and stay there, without any twisting if poss. Saying this I can't remember what he actually does on vid, but that's how he always used to hang. Shit description I know but 3rd time lucky.

I suspect you twist but doing any one armed hang half crimped is excellent even if twisted! If you're straight on cut your ropes and throw your axes, you're as strong as unkle in his pomp but can climb! A scary thought

[petejh]

Oh ffs! I've wrote a lengthy reply twice only to have the net scuppered when sending.

I don't believe you 

I suspect you twist but doing any one armed hang half crimped is excellent even if twisted! If you're straight on cut your ropes and throw your axes, you're as strong as unkle in his pomp but can climb! A scary thought

Yeah i think I probably twisted in when I did the workpouts. But I 100% promise you that when I did the CWP workout 13 months ago, at the start I was using 3 Kg assistance and by the 5th week I could one-arm hang unassisted for 8 secs on lefthand and 5 secs on righthand. This was in three arm positions - straight, half-bent and full-lock.

I could have just made this training diary up I guess ...



I'm going to have to do a few sessions to get the motor neurons firing again, then make a vid to prove it.

[rodma]

Would love to see a video of someone off ukb doing a one armer proper half crimped, as in not just dragging the hold, proper chiselly chiselling fingers

Edit: off not of

[the_dom]

Would love to see a video of someone off ukb doing a one armer proper half crimped, as in not just dragging the hold, proper chiselly chiselling fingers

Edit: off not of

I do all my one arm hangs on a 2cm rung half-crimped/chiselling - hopefully I'll get back to one armer strength soon.

[dave]

Please everyone be aware that if you do produce video evidence of this then Dense'll change the rules or introduce some undeclared specification so that whatever you've done won't count. 😉

[rodma]

Would love to see a video of someone off ukb doing a one armer proper half crimped, as in not just dragging the hold, proper chiselly chiselling fingers

Edit: off not of

I do all my one arm hangs on a 2cm rung half-crimped/chiselling - hopefully I'll get back to one armer strength soon.

Awesome.

Do it. I'd be impressed even if dense isn't, as long as you don't do a French start and chin bob at the "top" of the one armer, that's enough to make me leave the room and look for the eye bleach :D

Actually is be impressed enough if you just lock off half crimped, more impressed than I would be by a clown getting filmed on problems that are too easy for him so he doesn't need his shoes

[Nibile]

Is this half crimped enough?
image by Nibile, on Flickr
Every aspiring climber should know that dragging is the devil and should be left for monos or shallow pockets.

[a dense loner]

Arghh! No Dave what dense said originally was half crimped straight on you should be climbing 8B. The fact that no one understood what straight on meant has nothing to do with me, I thought it was straightforward, or even standundertheboardasif...forward.
That is half crimped nibs but nothing else to do with what I was talking about, not that it's supposed to be. Hold that hold face on for 5secs without twisting, doubt you've got enough room for shoulders tho.
 

[Nibile]

 

[rodma]

Sometimes i  this forum 

[dave]

Arghh! No Dave what dense said originally was half crimped straight on you should be climbing 8B. The fact that no one understood what straight on meant has nothing to do with me, I thought it was straightforward, or even standundertheboardasif...forward.

You are doing one arm hangs for 6-8 seconds to improve your finger strength? Do you climb at least 8B? I possibly know 5 people who could do this and know the same amount who climb 8C

Short memory?

I have enough problems at home having to use telepathy and understand things that were never said, I don't want to have to do it on here too......😱

[Muesli]

Nibile,


Do you find that training fingers at max for a short time / low reps is more or less injury-inducing than training at 80% for a long time / high reps ?


Just curious to know.

[Sasquatch]

 

I love the vagueness. 

What is max? Short time? Low Reps? Long time? High reps?

Because I can workout at 80% till failure and therefore be at my "max". 

This is one thing that I LOVE about Eva Lopez' protocol.  She has very specific guidelines.
   

You are doing one arm hangs for 6-8 seconds to improve your finger strength? Do you climb at least 8B? I possibly know 5 people who could do this and know the same amount who climb 8C

I know one who can do this and he is strong enough to climb 8C and only has the skill/technique to climb 8A+.  I think his goal is to get strong enough to climb 9A so he can then climb 8B+

[a dense loner]

See Sasquatch understands, sorry for all the perceived vagueness Dave.

[cowboyhat]

And you're probably referring to different holds anyway, on the BM they vary a lot.

I would have thought Dense meant the small edge on the BM2000, (hold 3 on the picture)



Which do you mean Pete?

There is a big difference.

[Sasquatch]

I thought both Dense and Pete were referring to hold 9. 

My friend can do #3.  I HATE THE SKINNY STRONG LANKY BASTARD 

I think there're quite a few stupidly strong bast$%^s out there who have that level of strength but not the ability to effectively apply that strength. 

[Nibile]

Nibile,
Do you find that training fingers at max for a short time / low reps is more or less injury-inducing than training at 80% for a long time / high reps ?
Just curious to know.

Hmmmm... I fried my elbows twice from training repeaters Beastmakers' style, the 7/3 hangs.
With max hangs I've had a few issues - one of which just yesterday, pulling front2 and mid2 full crimps on the small rung of the BM.
With lower intensity training you can ease yourself into it more easily, while a proper serious specific and progressive warm up is de rigeur for max hangs.
And as I experienced, higher volume taxes more the elbows, higher intensity the fingers.
The worst injuries I've had were caused by drunken party tricks or rock climbing.