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Dogs at Crags (Read 75127 times)

Sloper

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#25 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 06:37:26 pm
I don't have a general problem with dogs at crags, just when the dog is a problem, i.e. the best behaved dog at Bamford is a problem, the difficulty is, that I doubt I've ever heard of the owner of a badly behaved dog or one where there shouldn't be any addressing the problem.


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#26 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 06:45:29 pm
hmm might be a case of only becoming aware of the dog when the dog is causing a problem? i realise as well that i live in scotland and our climbing spots are always pretty sparse in terms of climbers so its not really likely to be an issue compared to a well visited crag down safffff.

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#27 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 07:03:00 pm
Dogs are far more pleasant, companionable, controllable, civilised and less downright irritating and distracting than children. I'd much rather have them at the crag.

Sloper

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#28 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 07:18:33 pm
I've always fancied the idea of a big cat (i.e. panther sized) as a pet, how good would it be to take it for a walk in the park.

Of course a panther isn't dangerous, it's just a cat, tigers and lions aren't dangerous either, it's only the ones that have bad owners that are dangerous.

chris j

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#29 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 07:36:15 pm
"Part of the problem is that a significant proportion of dog owners think that their mutt's behaviour is acceptable when a lot of other people find it objectionable."

is there a similar thread relating to children?

Because a dog and a child are an absolute equivalent. 

Moron.

Change it from dogs at crags to children in restaurants (charging round annoying the other diners under their parents' benevolent eyes rather than being told to sit down and eat their dinner) and the man is spot on!

Sloper

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#30 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 08:02:28 pm
Indeed, I've lost count of the times when I've been at  restaurant and a badly behaved child has stolen my food,  beyond number the stories I've heard of diners being savaged by out of control children (check out the restaurant thread for the gory details) the tales of children escaping from their table and attacking wildlife are legion, the difficulty of avoiding kid's turds on the way to my table are a fresh scar on my psyche. . . . so yes absolutely spot on.

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#31 Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 08:06:52 pm
:D was that at the Otley cafe? ;)

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#32 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 09:23:48 pm

Indeed, I've lost count of the times when I've been at  restaurant and a badly behaved child has stolen my food,  beyond number the stories I've heard of diners being savaged by out of control children (check out the restaurant thread for the gory details) the tales of children escaping from their table and attacking wildlife are legion, the difficulty of avoiding kid's turds on the way to my table are a fresh scar on my psyche. . . . so yes absolutely spot on.

I didn't know you'd met my kids...

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#33 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 10:16:30 pm
People not controlling their children can be very irritating but not intimidating. I generally feel sorry for the child as their mother/father is obviously doing a shit job.

The same could be said for dogs as it's not the dog's fault that it's owner is a useless prick.

However, the inability to control little Jacob may rile me slightly, for a minute, and then make me amused at his Dad/Mum being useless.

The inability to control the four legged thing may involve my child being seriously injured.

Big fucking difference.

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#34 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 10:21:04 pm
Shit, I just agreed with Sloper again. Yet more proof that he's not really Tory at all.

chris j

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#35 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 10:50:33 pm
Indeed, I've lost count of the times when I've been at  restaurant and a badly behaved child has stolen my food,  beyond number the stories I've heard of diners being savaged by out of control children (check out the restaurant thread for the gory details) the tales of children escaping from their table and attacking wildlife are legion, the difficulty of avoiding kid's turds on the way to my table are a fresh scar on my psyche. . . .

I'd heard it was grim up north but I didn't realise it was that bad!  ;D

Though I suspect it that the lack of boundaries and control evidenced in small kids being allowed to run riot round a restaurant is just one end of the scale where the other end is ten years later and the feral scroats running round the streets videoing their mates happy slapping or whatever the latest slang is for performing acts of violence and terrorizing the community.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2014, 10:57:25 pm by chris j »

tomtom

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#36 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 11:07:52 pm

Shit, I just agreed with Sloper again. Yet more proof that he's not really Tory at all.

Fuck. Has Sloper hacked your account? Or has Lagers got at it again ;)

ardeer

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#37 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 23, 2014, 11:28:27 pm
well having established that there is no (logical) equivalence between children and dogs, im glad its still socially acceptable to shout at a dog, other peoples kids, now thats a minefield. we could all get into anecdotes about the time that.... blah blah. the under lying point seems to be that people take wee beasties of the two or four leg variety to climbing spots where occasionally they encounter people who use this forum (ie take climbing reasonably seriously) and its basically a matter of manners, be it fido, little tarquin, that annoying stereo etc. pretty much a lack of concern for others the medium, of annoyance is secondary really, its the being a dick that counts...

Sloper

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#38 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 07:45:57 am
Hmm, I think you're missing the point here.

1. Leaving fido at home for 8 hours = fine
2. Leaving 3 year old child at home alone for 8 hours = social services & police calling

Also don't you think children should have the chance to experience the great outdoors, museums, art galleries and so on after all how do you think that they'll develop a love of nature, art and so on.

The fact that you draw no distinction between shouting at a dog says rather a lot (about your lack of a sense of perspective), but more about the change in society, it used to be acceptable to shout at and hit other people's children, perhaps if people got involved in poor behaviour etc then there'd be less social dysfunction.

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#39 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 08:45:01 am
I am most annoyed by the lack of effort demonstrated by land owners in control the behaviour of their invertebrate populations.

It's almost as if they don't care about the impact that ticks and midges have on the other users of their land.

Somebody should do something.

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#40 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 08:56:13 am


The inability to control the four legged thing may involve my child being seriously injured.

Big fucking difference.

Totally agree, lost count of the times I'm out walking with my 2 (small) kids, when some big fucking dog comes charging up, with the owner usually 'round the corner' out of sight.
Although interestingly having spent 10 years sewing kids faces back together/back on - 9/10 of them it was their own dog that did it.

Sloper

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#41 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 11:43:28 am
and when the owner comes around the corner the spout plaititudes about the dog 'only being friendly' etc the worst I've heard is that it's the victim's fault for responding inappropriately although I'm sure there are other lame & dishonest excuses available.

Our son was chased by a bloody bog lab on the monsal trail a few weeks back and the owners while apologetic couldn't get into their head that it was their responsibilty to control their dog.

In respect of the injuries to children as a result of a family / friend's dog attacking them, let me guess, staffie type dogs were usually responsible . . .

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#42 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 12:02:31 pm
I am most annoyed by the lack of effort demonstrated by land owners in control the behaviour of their invertebrate populations.

It's almost as if they don't care about the impact that ticks and midges have on the other users of their land.

Somebody should do something.

Well I find that quite insulting. All my invertebrates are very well behaved - and none bite anyone else without asking first.

lagerstarfish

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#43 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 12:13:25 pm
I am most annoyed by the lack of effort demonstrated by land owners in control the behaviour of their invertebrate populations.

It's almost as if they don't care about the impact that ticks and midges have on the other users of their land.

Somebody should do something.

Well I find that quite insulting. All my invertebrates are very well behaved - and none bite anyone else without asking first.

I was talking specifically about the land owners who own invertebrates.

As a propertyless Trot and all round decent chap, you are clearly a responsible mini-beast companion and there should be more of your type in the world

it's not the creepy crawlies, it's etc.

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#44 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 12:38:46 pm
Hmm, I think you're missing the point here.

1. Leaving fido at home for 8 hours = fine
2. Leaving 3 year old child at home alone for 8 hours = social services & police calling

Also don't you think children should have the chance to experience the great outdoors, museums, art galleries and so on after all how do you think that they'll develop a love of nature, art and so on.

The fact that you draw no distinction between shouting at a dog says rather a lot (about your lack of a sense of perspective), but more about the change in society, it used to be acceptable to shout at and hit other people's children, perhaps if people got involved in poor behaviour etc then there'd be less social dysfunction.

riiight, well to start with you cant leave a dog in the house on its own for 8 hours and i certainly not saying you should leave a child at home either. the shouting thing, im merely pointing out that you can shout at a dog and not a child, if said dog is annoying you. please dont make judgements on my assumed behaviour as i can assure you i will never walk by a dog child or old  lady for that matter being treated badly, in fact ive intervened in such situations many times and will continue to do so when i see such things, i am not an archetype of all thats gone supposedly gone wrong with society. not sure at what point i suggested children should be curtailed from nature art and museums etc either?

bottom line,

Dogs, ground screw, shade, water and something to chew

Children, explain to them what they can and cant do, shade water and something to chew.


Sloper

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#45 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 01:28:38 pm
You can't leave a dog at home, really, you'd better tell the millions of people that do that they're inflicting cruelty / behaving unacceptably etc

As for making assumptions about your behaviour, it's perfectly reasonable to infer your attitude and thus behaviour from your comments.

Your comparison with children at crags and dogs at crags show a mindset that tends to underpin irresponsible dog ownership and its consequences.

But let's ask the question shall we, who here has at any time

a. felt threatened by an aggressive child at the crag (and by child I mean under 7, Breck & Pex obviously don't count.
b. had an uncontrolled child eat their lunch, slober all over their kit etc
c. been bitten by child
d. had an controlled child piss all over their kit / bouldering mat etc

I've personally had a,b & d from dogs, never from a child, and I can say with a fair degree of confidence that I won't be in the minority.

So rather than carry on with facile whataboutery why not address teh basis issue which is lots of climbers with dogs act in an irresponsible manner?

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#46 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 01:45:09 pm
You can't leave a dog at home, really, you'd better tell the millions of people that do that they're inflicting cruelty / behaving unacceptably etc 

FOR 8 HOURS, bit of selective quoting there

As for making assumptions about your behaviour, it's perfectly reasonable to infer your attitude and thus behaviour from your comments.

ok well thats your call

Your comparison with children at crags and dogs at crags show a mindset that tends to underpin irresponsible dog ownership and its consequences.

Not sure how you come to that conclusion, seeing as i seem to be repeatedly saying i agree with your points about dogs being under control at crags

But let's ask the question shall we, who here has at any time

a. felt threatened by an aggressive child at the crag (and by child I mean under 7, Breck & Pex obviously don't count.
b. had an uncontrolled child eat their lunch, slober all over their kit etc
c. been bitten by child
d. had an controlled child piss all over their kit / bouldering mat etc

I've personally had a,b & d from dogs, never from a child, and I can say with a fair degree of confidence that I won't be in the minority.

nope none of these have ever happened to me via the medium of dog or child

So rather than carry on with facile whataboutery why not address teh basis issue which is lots of climbers with dogs act in an irresponsible manner?

i agree and refer you to my earlier posts. "Dogs, ground screw, shade, water and something to chew" for example

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#47 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 01:59:29 pm
riiight, well to start with you cant leave a dog in the house on its own for 8 hours

What do you mean by can't ?


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#48 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 02:32:19 pm
what about uncontrolled sharks at the crag?

bellowing power screams and swearing; frightening all the tourists etc.

I blame the owners (agan)

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#49 Re: Dogs at Crags
April 24, 2014, 02:41:23 pm
So rather than carry on with facile whataboutery why not address teh basis issue which is lots of climbers with dogs act in an irresponsible manner?
Which he has done teh entire sodding time...

 

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