As has been stated a couple of times already, there is no doubt at all that some people do dry tool / climb marginal routes on mountain crags, that is a given. There are dozens of examples, going back decades.The flaw is in trying to say there is a link from increased DT on mountain crags to an increase in dedicated DT venues, and thus justifying the chopping.
Your flaw is not realising that I am making no claim either way, but providing/linking to one piece of evidence to help determine whether there is a correlation between the two. More evidence will be required to determine the relationship.
"a body of evidence is made from individual cases" (from karma page, thanks for that btw, very mature)But even if there is a documented body of evidence of 100s of cases, it doesn't mean there has been any increase linked to dedicated DT venues, do I need to keep saying that.Or am i being fucking stupid. If so, explain it to me, seeing you are clearly cleverer than me.
Where is the :handbags: symbol when you need it?
So the flaw is that there is no evidence to support (or refute) the assertion used by the The Front of the Lake District Climbing People's to justify their actions, not in the proposal of a hypothesis that DT venues can lead to increased damage on mountains, which appears to be what you are saying is flawed, but its not, its a hypothesis and one that has been acted on by The Lake District Climbing Front of the People's in the absence of any evidence. And the only way of testing a hypothesis is to collect a body of evidence which is made from individual cases.Quite why you think the fact that damage occurring on mountains isn't pertinent to the discussion as its been happening for yreas I've no idea, because its the fundamental tenet behind the actions of The Front Climbing Peoples of the Lake District's.
I think dry tooling should be BANNED ... from ukb discussion. Where is the :handbags: symbol when you need it?
Quote from: lukeh on May 01, 2013, 04:36:39 pmI think dry tooling should be BANNED ... from ukb discussion. Where is the :handbags: symbol when you need it? come on Luke.Stop fencesitting.DT or not DT?Give em tintern i say
Quote from: Adge on May 01, 2013, 05:05:02 pmQuote from: lukeh on May 01, 2013, 04:36:39 pmI think dry tooling should be BANNED ... from ukb discussion. Where is the :handbags: symbol when you need it? come on Luke.Stop fencesitting.DT or not DT?Give em tintern i say Can't say I've ever felt the need nor desire to DT, but then I only brought my first walking axe this winter, maybe it'll all be down hill from here...Doesn't mean I want to ruin others fun though. I say give em Avon Gorge. All of that scratching around is bound to get rid of some of the polish.
Give em tintern i say
Quote from: Adge on May 01, 2013, 04:20:40 pmGive the DTers tintern quarry i say.Creative thinking! Maybe the BMC should set up a polling structure so people can nominate cliffs as DT-only venues?
Give the DTers tintern quarry i say.
Quote from: Adge on May 01, 2013, 05:05:02 pmGive em tintern i say Someone drytooling the fuck out of it might actually improve it. But probably not.