[shark]

I don't think this is logpile material.  Thatcher is the person who had the single biggest influence on UK climbing in the last 50 years in my view.

It can be moved to another board if you like.

[Oldmanmatt]

And don't forget the death of the Building Society, the main reason a first time buyer has almost no chance of a mortgage now.

[Snoops]

I wonder where Arthur Scargill stands on this? He is probably legless.

Lording it in one of his 3 houses I would think.
 
http://www.cpgb.org.uk/home/weekly-worker/944/num-in-court-arthur-scargills-dacha-debacle

[aLICErOBERTSfANkLUB]

Why has everyone assumed this was connected with yesterday's breaking news?

How do you not all know I was genuinely and independently happy, and wanted to convey that feeling to the rest of you?

[Jaspersharpe]

Cos I saw your tweet about drinking Champagne? 

[Baron]

Her true legacy is a less compassionate society. Busiest Monday evening in The Sheaf for a while. The pervading atmosphere of schadenfreude was surreal.

[aLICErOBERTSfANkLUB]

Cos I saw your tweet about drinking Champagne? 

The tweet from several hours later?

[mrjonathanr]

[Jaspersharpe]

Cos I saw your tweet about drinking Champagne? 

The tweet from several hours later?

Bloody pedant!

I didn't bother checking the timing and knew you'd pull me up if I was wrong.....

[lukeyboy]

I'm too young to have lived through the Thatcher era, and I suppose as a result I don't have a strong opinion either way on Maggie.

However, am I alone in finding it fairly unpleasant to celebrate someone's death, whoever they are? 

[mrjonathanr]

Her legacy is of public division, private selfishness and a cult of greed, which together shackle far more of the human spirit than they ever set free.

[SamT]

We all like Robin Hood right? because he stole for the rich and gave to the poor right?

Well - under Thatcher, for the first time in a long time, the rich got richer (which always happened) but significantly - the poor got poorer.

Nuff said in my opinion.

I'm not unpacking the bunting, but neither do I feel any sense of sadness or mourning.  I guess I feel sorry for the kids, only in that they've lost their mum, and it doesn't matter who you are, that's going to be painful.

Was well weird in the Sheaf View last night.  It was rammed and it was clear that a large proportion had come down specifically to celebrate.  Lots of cheering and hammering on tables - very uncharacteristic.

[aLICErOBERTSfANkLUB]

You do all know now that this means John Major is the country's undisputed "Greatest Living Prime Minister"?

[grumpycrumpy]

Major wasn't all bad ....... After all he did broker the Northern Ireland peace deal ........ Sadly, he didn't stay in office long enough for the signing of the treaty, leaving Tony Blair to take the credit and thus start on his long and illustrious career as a 'peace maker' ........


As for celebrating Thatcher's death, yes it might be in bad taste, but it's in no more bad taste than celebrating her life ........ Wobbly jowled politicians endlessly lauding her 'achievments', crushing the unions, selling us that we which already owned, inexorably linking us with U.S. and thus taking us into at least three wars in which we, as a nation, had no interest in being involved in ........ And all flaunted in front of those whose liveliehoods she took .......           

[dave]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/apr/09/russell-brand-margaret-thatcher

[mrjonathanr]

I don't see a lot of rejoicing, actually, beyond the thread title. Not much to rejoice, is there?

To comment on the life of a major public figure on their death is valid. As grumpycrumpy points out, the apologists will be out in force. Yesterday the Daily Mail was taken over by 'The Woman Who Saved Britain' boldy printed at the head of nearly every page.

The framing of her legacy is a commentary on our direction of travel. Her political philosophy is held up for admiration and still emulated  today. If she's a heroine,  it follows privatisation and the free-market ideology  she espoused are the right path, along with austerity and its consequences.  UNICEF are concerned  http://www.unicef.org.uk/Latest/News/report-card-11-child-wellbeing-uk-teens-ignored-by-government/  as were  Save The Children in 2012.


There's no other dedicated thread to comment on this, so to logpile it seems silly.

[jfw]

thatcher is dead

thatcherism is still alive

I'd rather it were the other way around

[slackline]

There's no other dedicated thread to comment on this, so to logpile it seems silly.

Why not un-logpile it and change the title?

[mrjonathanr]

^^+1

It seems I'm not alone in thinking eulogising her life is an attempt to validate current policy:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/apr/10/thatcher-boycott-ex-labour-minister.

Healey talks with some dignity at least.

[lukeyboy]

+1

To clarify, I'm not suggesting that we all express our sorrow at her passing, nor am I saying she should not be subject to political criticism following her death.

I think it is good to have a thread for discussion, as she is undoubtedly an interesting figure who draws strong opinions and has clearly had a huge impact on this country.

My comment above was solely in response to the thread title and a couple of the comments which actively celebrated her death, which personally I find very distasteful.

[Johnny Brown]

thatcher is dead

thatcherism is still alive

Quite, not least in the labour party - Thatcher quipped than Blair was 'her greatest achievement'. I'm genuinely intrigued as to who all the Thatcher haters on here vote for? Is there a real left-wing alternative or is it just (nu-)Labour on tribal grounds, and ignore the policy?
(I can't imagine ever voting either Tory or Labour personally).

[mrjonathanr]

Lukeyboy, decorum is all well and good, but there's nothing decorous about using death for political advantage, which is what's happening.  Rejoice may also be an ironic comment on her own style of PR, you'd have to ask the OP I guess.

Why are so many people so happy at her demise? Are they ALL from some tiny 'fringe loony left' as the Mail would have you believe? Or has there actually been a legacy of harm which is neither forgotten nor forgiven by a substantial number of the population? Which is more distasteful - that, or undignified comments?

Perhaps the attempt to canonise and give (expensive) state funeral honours to a premier who is widely despised isn't the right thing to do?

As for Labour JB, they are just another another vanilla right-wing party. Miliband nailed his colours to the mast with nonsense this week about contribution-based benefits, and his call to his MPs to respect her memory. He's afraid of losing votes, and too weak to oppose.

Another party will be needed for that. Gore Vidal's analysis of the US in the 70s seems relevant:

There is only one party in the United States, the Property Party ... and it has two right wings: Republican and Democrat. Republicans are a bit stupider, more rigid, more doctrinaire in their laissez-faire capitalism than the Democrats, who are cuter, prettier, a bit more corrupt — until recently ... and more willing than the Republicans to make small adjustments when the poor, the black, the anti-imperialists get out of hand. But, essentially, there is no difference between the two parties.

[rginns]

thatcher is dead

thatcherism is still alive

Quite, not least in the labour party - Thatcher quipped than Blair was 'her greatest achievement'. I'm genuinely intrigued as to who all the Thatcher haters on here vote for? Is there a real left-wing alternative or is it just (nu-)Labour on tribal grounds, and ignore the policy?
(I can't imagine ever voting either Tory or Labour personally).

There is no one left to vote for on either side of the centre ground, even the liberals have irrevocably damaged their standing as the protest vote - they've done more to keep themselves out of power than any political party has in the last 50 years, save, perhaps thatcher after the Poll tax...
I abstain nowadays. Sad really.

[andy_e]

Vote green!

[slackline]

Perhaps the attempt to canonise and give (expensive) state funeral honours to a premier who is widely despised isn't the right thing to do?

MPs can claim upto £3750 travel expenses in light of parliament recall

We have

 ☒ No money for the disabled
 ☒ No money for the unemployed
 ☒ No money for the NHS
 ☑ £8 million for a funeral

 It’s called austerity.