[Nibile]

Five Ten website is awful. It has tha ability to crash any platform I use to visualize it.m
Slow, chaotic and deprived of Team VXi...

[luckyjez]

Scarpa have a new shoe coming out in Spring 15 called the Furia which would be worth a look; toe-down, soft and 'feely', with a very sticky rand and rubber over the toe.
http://eveningsends.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/GT_Climbing_Scarpa_Furia.jpg

[Wood FT]

saw a video somewher of them and they look the softest shoe ever made, I think I'll just get a pair of these instead

[cha1n]

The teams aren't a particularly comfortable shape, not sure I'd want to do long granite slabs in them.

The new (blue) blackwings are just as soft but have the better 'Stealth high friction' rubber on them and they are a more comfortable shape.

[Paul B]

I think the new 'Verdons' and 'Assym' are worth looking out for. Supposedly the Verdons are stiff. I'll believe it when I see it.

[cha1n]

Short granite slabs was more what I was thinking about! The area immediately around my house has several cliffs with slab routes up to 5.13d so it seems rude not to make a modest effort at getting better at them. Right now any slab harder than mid 5.11 seems like the living end.

Do you mean relative to the standard Teams? As far as I can tell, in classic confusing 5.10 fashion, the Team VXi is - or was - a different shoe to the Team and uses - or used - a much softer rubber.

I was assuming you meant the normal teams (new ones are black old version was blue). It's just that they are quite pointy and it feels like you're mainly standing on the big toe, rather than getting a lot of rubber down on the rock. My blackwings (now very worn in) and slipper soft, I can scrunch the toebox up in one hand very easily, when they are new they feel a little insensitive because they have quite a lot of rubber on them which makes them a bit more durable. The teams feel more sensitive out of the box because they are very thin.

I love soft shoes on steep ground but now I've just moved to Sheffield and am climbing on quite a few grit slabs, I find my soft shoes aren't supportive enough for slab work. I've just got a pair of Anasazi VCS and I think they are great for slabs. Not dissimilar to the blackwings but have much more stiffness laterally which helps on those occasions where you are standing on small edges/smears. I usually wear dragons/teams/blackwings.

[cheque]

Five Ten website is awful.

The bizarre terms they use to categorise shoes (Where the fuck are approach shoes- oh here they are, under "Yosemite") are the worst bit- they really just need two. "Shoes we've made since the early 90s" and "Shoes we'll only be making for the next three weeks".

[Stubbs]

The green Teams are near the bottom of a list of shoes I'd want to wear on a granite slab. They essentially have no midsole and very thin rubber, this allows the rubber to deform a lot which doesn't lead to good smearing performance.  Do you not find worn in 'regular' shoes (i.e. what you normally wear on granite) good for these situations?

[duncan]

I recall an article by Jonny Woodward in one of the U.S. rags where he advocated stiff shoes for granite slab climbing. If I recall correctly his reasoning was that stiffness was essential for any small features and didn't stop him smearing. This was shoes of 20 years ago though.

The Five Ten Verdon is said to be good for "precision edges and steep pocketed faces" which sounds promising.

However they are described as “offering the comfort of a shoe you could wear on a ten pitch route at Red Rocks” , are made of suede - five ten use synthetic materials for their most technical shoes - and the laces don't extend to the toes. Sound like they're a Galileo replacement at best.

[Wood FT]

ugly colour as well

"check out my new teals"

[cha1n]

Apologies, I somehow managed to miss that your post was attached to a thread about the new teams. Pretty ironic as I started the thread...

I've tried on the new Scarpa Booster S and whilst not as soft as these teams they seem like they'd smear well. Expensive though.

[AndyR]

Short granite slabs was more what I was thinking about! The area immediately around my house has several cliffs with slab routes up to 5.13d so it seems rude not to make a modest effort at getting better at them. Right now any slab harder than mid 5.11 seems like the living end.

Do you mean relative to the standard Teams? As far as I can tell, in classic confusing 5.10 fashion, the Team VXi is - or was - a different shoe to the Team and uses - or used - a much softer rubber.

I love soft shoes on steep ground but now I've just moved to Sheffield and am climbing on quite a few grit slabs, I find my soft shoes aren't supportive enough for slab work. I've just got a pair of Anasazi VCS and I think they are great for slabs. Not dissimilar to the blackwings but have much more stiffness laterally which helps on those occasions where you are standing on small edges/smears. I usually wear dragons/teams/blackwings.

Thanks. I have tried Anasazi VCS but they don't seem to fit me well. And I do want to try something significantly softer. I have a good collection of stiffer shoes, which work well on steeper granite slabs and walls, but I think a different style of shoe may be optimal for the easier-angled more frictiony slabs.

Tried a pair of bedded-in greens?

[Stubbs]

How about a Moccasaym or maybe a speedster? Try and find somewhere to try before you buy with the vxi's, I can't imagine them being anything but a waste of time on granite slabs.

[Paul B]

Wrecked whites or just broken in greens might be good? I found the greens to deform far too easily when they were getting old, this feels terrifying on the routes habrich is speaking of.

Slippers just twist with fear sweating begins...

I tried climbing something very easy in brand new whites (Diedre) then droe straight to the shop and bought the C4'd Velcro's.

[AndyR]

Those old school slipper designs are too loose in the toe, IMO. I have an old pair of Five Ten 5X, yet another one of their blink-and-you-miss-it shoes, which are a Mocc with the old Anasazi heel and a velcro strap. That's getting close to what I am after. Also all that part of the Five Ten range are either Stealth C4 or Onyxx. I want something with softer rubber.

Speedster were replaced by Futuras in Sportiva's range, I think.

Have you considered that you're just trying to find excuses not to climb slabs?

Take several pairs along to Black Slabbath and try out the first 3-4 moves - a good test for squamish slabs - I still think a well worn pair of verdes are best.

[Paul B]

I think they must've belonged to Nat, but you're welcome all the same!

Dare I suggest Pinks?

[Stubbs]

Go for it, you seem desperate to buy them! Will be intersting to hear how you get on.

[tomtom]

Those old school slipper designs are too loose in the toe, IMO. I have an old pair of Five Ten 5X, yet another one of their blink-and-you-miss-it shoes, which are a Mocc with the old Anasazi heel and a velcro strap. That's getting close to what I am after. Also all that part of the Five Ten range are either Stealth C4 or Onyxx. I want something with softer

Sounds like an Instinct Slipper job...

[william buck]

Ive been wearing the vxi's for over 4 months now, admittedly predominantly indoors. They are pretty much terrible at everything. Whilst the theory seems plausible- more sensitivity means you can be more precise and confident in what you're standing on- it hasn't really come off for 5.10 unfortunately. Because there's no midsole there is literally ZERO support. The rubber is, as previously mentioned, the softest and most flexible I've ever seen. As a result you can't put any power down through your feet because the rubber simply moulds and 'rolls off' the hold. It's incredibly frustrating. The only thing i could suggest that they be used for, and all i use them for now, is training... because it makes all the problems harder than they should be! Honestly i would consider spending your money elsewhere...

[kelvin]

Sounds like an Instinct Slipper job...

I almost posted this earlier (I've just bought a pair) and decided against it, as I thought, whilst I may like slab climbing - I'm in no position to offer advice to habrich. 3mm rubber, support for the big toe and from all accounts a great smearing shoe one broken in.

[tomtom]

Yup.. Only used mine on grit slabs (seemed ok). Now on my second pair and they're my new fave all round shoe.. Fit my wider feet better than 5:10's... Cheap too.

Sorry - only slabs I've used them kin are grit. Fine so far on most things...

[Lopez]

That's exactly the characteristics I want to try: soft, sticky, sensitive, precise.

Sportiva Cobras (When sized right). Nothing i've worn comes close.

[cha1n]

Actually tried these green teams on the other day and wasn't impressed. They didn't seem to have any tensioning in them at all and they were crazy soft, you could screw them into a ball in your hand with minimal effort. They really felt like you had nothing on your feet so i imagine you wouldn't be able to climb anything that you weren't prepared to climb barefoot.
 
I came away from the shop with a pair of La Sportiva Speedsters. Very sensitive and use the 'No Edge Technology' so they smear like a worn in shoe straight out of the box. Don't think I'll be wearing them in horizontal roofs or anything but I think they'll be excellent on the grit. Perhaps another model to consider.

[cheque]

I came away from the shop with a pair of La Sportiva Speedsters. Very sensitive and use the 'No Edge Technology' so they smear like a worn in shoe straight out of the box. Don't think I'll be wearing them in horizontal roofs or anything but I think they'll be excellent on the grit. Perhaps another model to consider.

They're what Ondra wore on his grit day if I remember correctly.

He would probably have been alright in a pair of Crocs of course, but you get what I mean!

[cha1n]

I think they are his main shoe now going by photos and videos.

He wears them a lot whilst onsighting. I believe that at least one of his 9a onsights were done in them.

He wore them on his trip to raven tor when he onsighted a bunch of classic stuff. Crazy really because they're pretty soft.

Watched a video where he claimed they allowed him to be less precise. I sort of see where he's coming from. There's no edge so it's hard to be precise, you sort of smear over edges instead of trying to edge. Only worn them once though so can't comment too much yet.