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The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day (Read 129135 times)

Will Hunt

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A good post. I'm lucky that I've never experienced depression, though don't have a completely clean slate when it comes to anxiety and panic.
I was irritated recently when travelling to work and listening to the radio that some gross ignorance regarding depression went unchallenged. The caller to the Today programme, when asked about benefits, brushed depression off as "we all get a bit down sometimes, you still got to go out to work". Education on depression and common mental illnesses should really be a part of education in the most basic sense as is the case with more physically tangible illnesses. Perhaps then people will seek help sooner.

psychomansam

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This Australian website is good.

It's a kind of self done - cognitive based therapy. I've had some patients who think its great, others not so keen.

https://moodgym.anu.edu.au/welcome

Exercise is interesting - lots of people feel it helps, the recent clinical evidence is less encouraging of its role. I still tell people to do some

Cheers for this. I've just signed up and done the first bit. Bought a CBT book a while back but could never be bothered to read it (hehe).
Just started a new job, under massive pressure at the moment and as usual not dealing well with the stress. While I might have logical causes for my anxiety, I know my thought processes don't help.

Today was the worst day yet this time round. I was working from home and ended up feeling too anxious to work for the majority of the day. Have just been for a run and done a stilling exercise (for the first time in a very long time).

The stress has aggravated my gastritis over the last few weeks. I'm now on a better drug and on the waiting list for an endoscopy. I can hardly run at the moment as now it's this bad, that further aggravates it. One of many ways in which mental problems can easily become physical ones.

As other people have said, a mental illness is
A. normal
B. just as real as a physical one.

In fact, the shortsightedness, impinged shoulder, achilles tendonitis, gastritis, minor infection and  cold at the minute aren't stopping me working or severely effecting my quality of life. The anxiety is.

This is great:
http://www.ted.com/talks/ruby_wax_what_s_so_funny_about_mental_illness.html

Falling Down

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Glad to see my post has prompted such a positive response.

I'm no Doctor (well I am but not a medical one) but I was surprised to learn that depression and anxiety are manifestation of a physical illness of the limbic system rather than a mental disorder and that SSRI meds are not doping pills but address some physical processes that impact and effect mood and physiology.

  This book is really good written by a GP and should be required reading by anyone suffering and their close family members. 


Plattsy

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I was given a prescription for Citalopram (sp?) which I'm yet to get. Some of the side effects put me off.
When my depression escalated to depression + anxiety/panic attacks (fun!) my prescription was switched from Prozac to Citalopram.  As well as it addressing the panic quite well, I found it far less intrusive than the Prozac - it didn't make me feel quite as "drugged" and didn't affect my libido as much. I found it a great help.
Had my first panic attack for about 10 years at my desk in the office on the 18 September. Even though I'm no old hand at these things I could feel it coming. I adopted a "bring it on" approach and rode it out. Luckily no one came over and bothered me during else it could've been messy. Not had one since *touch wood*

The libido side effect was a concern when I read about it being temporary. However upon reading about some people having a permanent loss I drew a line. Reading Falling Down's comment on the Limbic system, I'm now re-evaluating that decision and once I've had chance to research/read more I'll make another decision on it.

Glad to see my post has prompted such a positive response.

I'm no Doctor (well I am but not a medical one) but I was surprised to learn that depression and anxiety are manifestation of a physical illness of the limbic system rather than a mental disorder and that SSRI meds are not doping pills but address some physical processes that impact and effect mood and physiology.

  This book is really good written by a GP and should be required reading by anyone suffering and their close family members. 
Bought and due tomorrow.

Plattsy

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I can hardly run at the moment

Is walking alright? Get out as much as you can pal.

Edit: Make sure you get at least 30mins lunch at work for a stroll.

SA Chris

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Are low Seratonin levels linked to depression?

Plattsy

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I believe so. The doctor I saw recently said "There are a group of people who seem to naturally produce lower than normal levels of seratonin". I've not got around to verifying this statement however.

fatkid2000

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Good post for Bubba:

Prozac (fluoxetine) is not often used first line these days - I use it those that had been on it in the past.

Weaning off is a ticky questions. The pharmacologists tell us that we can just stop them & people should get rebound depression. THat's not my experience and I wean doses down over 4-8 weeks patient dependant. Again I do this in spring / summer - slight witch craft medicine but people don't do well stopping in the middle of winter.

Psychoman - I would guess your gastritis is all linked to your mood. Its common for people to suffer with this with mood disorders. Or get IBS - which is how some people stress and anxiety presents itself. Would be worth taking a ppi as the anti-depressants also cause gastritis.

I've never hear about a group who produce naturally low level of serotonin - sounds like rubbish to me. I'll ask our mental health lead - he knows all the latest evidence. SSRi anti-depressant block the enzyme that breaks serotonin down - hence increase the brain levels.

In my experience the libido loss in temporary - all who have experienced this side-effect have recovered. It's probably more the persistant low mood which is affecting libido than the medication side-effects.

Monolith

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Had my first panic attack for about 10 years at my desk in the office on the 18 September. Even though I'm no old hand at these things I could feel it coming. I adopted a "bring it on" approach and rode it out. Luckily no one came over and bothered me during else it could've been messy. Not had one since *touch wood*

That's precisely the strategy that started helping me out of a long bout of them Plattsy. Visualisation and an acceptance that it was my mind generating them not my body became key to getting rid. At the peak of attacks I wound up in hospital for a few days strapped to an ECG but I think that particular bout was exacerbated due to consumption of a LOT of vodka and Dr Pepper (obviously high in caffeine) and about 30 odd hours of scrolling japanese shoot em up games (hallucinated for days!). "What's the worst that could happen?". I wasn't particularly grateful for being placed in a room with two men in the late stages of lung cancer whilst I was being monitored I can tell you!

I know the feeling very well you talk of Plattsy where anybody asking "are you ok?" makes you almost explode with anger. I still get like this every single time I have a blood test (go white, sweaty as hell, incomprehensible, angry). I wish you all the best with ridding yourself of anxiety.

Again, as others have said, copious amounts of exercise certainly worked for me in conjunction with a reduction in alcohol consumption.


slackline

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I've never hear about a group who produce naturally low level of serotonin - sounds like rubbish to me.

Conversely I'd be very surprised if everyone produced exactly the same amount of serotonin, so there will always be natural variation (most likely distributed under a gaussian/normal distribution) so there will be some who are 'low' and some who are 'high' and the majority of people will be 'normal'.


Never got on with citalopram myself but was lucky (and still am) to have employers that provide counselling which helped.

Plattsy

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Had my first panic attack for about 10 years at my desk in the office on the 18 September. Even though I'm no old hand at these things I could feel it coming. I adopted a "bring it on" approach and rode it out. Luckily no one came over and bothered me during else it could've been messy. Not had one since *touch wood*

That's precisely the strategy that started helping me out of a long bout of them Plattsy. Visualisation and an acceptance that it was my mind generating them not my body became key to getting rid. At the peak of attacks I wound up in hospital for a few days strapped to an ECG but I think that particular bout was exacerbated due to consumption of a LOT of vodka and Dr Pepper (obviously high in caffeine) and about 30 odd hours of scrolling japanese shoot em up games (hallucinated for days!). "What's the worst that could happen?". I wasn't particularly grateful for being placed in a room with two men in the late stages of lung cancer whilst I was being monitored I can tell you!

I know the feeling very well you talk of Plattsy where anybody asking "are you ok?" makes you almost explode with anger. I still get like this every single time I have a blood test (go white, sweaty as hell, incomprehensible, angry). I wish you all the best with ridding yourself of anxiety.

Again, as others have said, copious amounts of exercise certainly worked for me in conjunction with a reduction in alcohol consumption.
Recently when I'm at work and someone asks "are you ok" I'm on the verge of tears and outside work I get irritated which then goes close to anger.

Reducing my alcohol consumption is my next step. Over the weekend I put away far too much ~27 pints and a bottle of wine (birthday party Friday, steady one Saturday and birthday party Sunday afternoon). Hit it hard on Friday after a proper rubbish head week.

I'm running tonight and off to Scotland for a long weekend of walking.

Monolith

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There's a lot to be said for heading to the hills to get some head space. All the best with everything mate.

psychomansam

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Psychoman - I would guess your gastritis is all linked to your mood. Its common for people to suffer with this with mood disorders. Or get IBS - which is how some people stress and anxiety presents itself. Would be worth taking a ppi as the anti-depressants also cause gastritis.


Cheers for the advice, though I'm not on antidepressants and won't even consider it, although I have considered St. Johns Wart. I went through anti-depressant withdrawal after being a healthy volunteer on a clinical trial, and wouldn't want to do that again. I was only on it for 3 weeks and the withdrawal was horrendous. They said we shouldn't have any effects after such a short time! What a fecking piss-take. Anti-depressants also sometimes don't do well against placebo, and if I was to go for something for sake of it, I'd go for one with less side effects(and no patent, since I hate drug patent law), i.e. the wort.

I'm on a PPI already, Lansoprazole 30 once a day although take it twice sometimes when it gets too painful. Symptoms are certainly worsened by stress. Waiting for an endoscopy at which point they'll probably just up my dose.

And Plattsy, cheers for the thought. I'm a new schoolteacher and have no chance of taking a lunch break. The problem is more about how to switch off at other times. Exercise is normally my lifesaver, but recently not been able to do too much with gastritis. Thankfully the local wall is a lifeline!

Feeling much better today after coming off quite well in the 'work scrutiny' (headteacher and head of department come into my class, take out 4 students, quiz them and check their books to see if I've been doing my job well enough). I still have a lesson to plan and then teach, marking to do, reports to write  and a 1500 word essay to write before I can even start revising for my first Masters exam. Which is on Monday. But hey, we're making progress and after the next two weeks, my schedule settles down a lot and I don't have so many deadlines.

And if OFSTED decide to turn up, they can fuck off and eat shit.

SamT

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Reading this all with hindsight - seems that alcohol reduction my well have played a part for me too.  It was co-incidental as it happens.  Shortly after being made redundant (I feel for you guys still Plattsy!!) the first thing to do was pull in the purse strings which meant not buying 12 bottles of cobra, 3 red and 3 white in Tescos every week. 
This lead to virtually no weekday evening drinking, healthy weight loss and in hindsight, possibly a general lift of my mood (oh and a healthier bank balance).

Plattsy

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Just a bit of an update on this for anyone interested....

Currently I'm feeling much better about life. Found some joie de vivre so to speak and I'm hanging on to it.

I managed to drag myself out of the heavy depression side of things with exercise. I threw myself into it with the mentallity of "fuck it, I'm gonna do it even if I don't want to do it". Mostly running with some walking over a period of 2/3 weeks. The trip to Scotland helped a lot. Especially the  euphoria of my first runners high I received when the sun peeped through the cloud on the summit of Beinn Bhuidhe. After 3 hours of pushing myself hard to the top the clag was disappointing but I felt good for the exercise and then the sun appeared. Whoosh went the dolphins!

What I found interesting was that the depression had been "hiding" some anxieties. These came to the fore and became a different hurdle all together. Speaking with my councillor has been great and slowly I've started to work on these.

One thing I'm doing is not fighting the feelings of anxiety. I'm starting to "feel" my anxiety and monitor it. A blogger who I thought made a lot of sense said "The more I feel it the less I felt it". This actually helped pretty much clear it up before Christmas but the stress of Christmas brought them back but not as much. Progress.

Had my first professional chat session of the year last night and it went great. Feeling so much more positive about most things. I know I'm not quite out of the woods but I don't have another one booked for another 3 weeks and between now and then I'll have ripped up the Italian Alps on my board for a week (even planning a couple o three nights with little or no booze :o ). Can't wait.

I've set myself some goals for the year. Which cover bouldering, running and travel. Let's see how I do.

I'm happy to receive PMs on this if someone wants a chat/vent.

csurfleet

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#40 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
February 14, 2013, 09:11:03 am
So, after reading all the stuff in this thread, I started using moodscope. At first I'll admit, I found it not only useless but also incredibly patronising (that couple of paragraphs of 'analysis' was making me angry!), but after recording a score 28 times I have to admit that it is helping. I've been holding a steady 44-46% over the last 5 days, which is great as I tend to yo-yo quite a bit - I think my statistical mind is taking on the results of the graph and convincing me :)

Thanks for the thread guys, properly appreciated :clap2:

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#41 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
February 14, 2013, 09:46:37 am
Just found this thread through last post.

I know none of you really know me. Just thought id say Hi,and if anyone wants to discuss anything to do with this on forum or pm me, that's cool.

I've been on maximum dose of prozac for about 18 years. Tricyclic antidepressants before that. Been through various talking therapies including CBT.

i don't wish to into details right now, but happy to share my experiences and offer support about medication, therapies, etc, where i can.

Shaun

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#42 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
February 14, 2013, 09:52:18 am
Prozac (fluoxetine) is not often used first line these days - I use it those that had been on it in the past.

Interestingly, I've begun using this more often now as it (anecdotally) seems to be better tolerated (plus the new QT issues with citalopram have modified my practice).

Although I tenf to go for sertraline first line, or maybe mirtazepine if sleep is a significant issue.

magpie

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#43 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
February 14, 2013, 10:07:25 am

Reading this all with hindsight - seems that alcohol reduction may well have played a part for me too... virtually no weekday evening drinking, healthy weight loss and in hindsight, possibly a general lift of my mood
Nothing has helped me with my anxiety issues more than chucking drinking and caffeine, I can't beleive what a difference it's made and I was never a heavy user of either at all but cutting them out totally and exercising more has made a world of difference.

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Falling Down

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#45 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
November 25, 2013, 07:07:14 pm
I'm tapering off 20mg of Citalopram that I started last April.  I have a week of 10mg to go then down to 5mg for a couple of months.

No side effects tapering off and I definitely feel more like 'me'.  Just started in the gym again after 18 months of doing bugger all; libido has improved  :lets_do_it_wild: and I'm just more engaged with everything. 

Going on the Cit was a literal lifesaver and I would recommend it to anyone with moderate/severe depression where the non prescriptive therapies (exercise, St. John's wort, CBT) aren't really working.

Now I just need to shift the 18lbs I've put on in the last year and a half.   :strongbench:

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#46 The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
November 25, 2013, 08:56:26 pm
Great thread. Had my own battles for a lot of last year and early this year. Climbing was good as a tonic for the most negative feelings at the time. Particularly aid soloing, which was all consuming enough to drown things out for a few days. Didn't really start to see the positive side of life until talking to a counsellor and finding myself in relationship I'm really happy about. I know the potential is always there and have to be aware of that, but right now things are going pretty well.

Thanks to all you guys for being so open. It's taken me a few years to be able to tell people that depression hits every now and then, but I'm amazed by how many people have had similar experiences.


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#47 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
November 26, 2013, 12:21:47 am
Thank you to everyone who has posted here.

Earlier this year I was diagnosed with bi polar 1.

In my life I've had 3 major psychotic episodes, followed by major depressions - not easy - a bit like being hit by a barrage of cruise missiles, then being left to pick up the pieces.

The highs of mania are indescribable - sometimes like being on the best E you've ever had, constantly for three months, other times totally terrifying.  The delusions are totally out there. I have lived in real life episodes of the most fantastic sci-fi thriller imaginable - think The Matrix / Bourne Ultimatum / Alien / Return of the Jedi / Goodfellas. Each mania has landed me in a situation involving the police and then a psychiatric hospital.

The depression that follows mania is terrible. That's it - simply terrible. Complete isolation and darkness. Alone. In February this year I decided I had to look for help, I was drinking heavily, had no job, very rarely saw my friends, life was shit. I was rock bottom. I had to find help.  So I went to my GP; after a few meetings with him, I was lined up to meet a consultant. He told me I was bi polar, and recommended that I start a course of lithium, which I would then have to take for the rest of my life. I asked him what the side effects were: my hair might fall out, I'd gain weight by 30 to 40 %, my hands would constantly tremble (for which I'd have to take another medication), I'd be constantly thirsty. This was all he could offer. I thought - fuck that. I had to get better myself. So, I stopped drinking, stopped smoking, and went to the climbing wall. Twelve months earlier, prior to the psychosis, I had been in the shape of my life, training regularly and climbing very well; so I jumped back into a training routine determined to get my head out of the sand - and injured a pulley tendon really badly, doh ! So I started running and hill walking. By June I was up to about 20 miles on my hill runs, and decided to prepare for the Bob Graham round. At the end of September, on a perfect day, I completed the Bob Graham. I am now back at the wall - albeit jug pulling, but having a good time; have returned to study at college, and got a part time job. 

I am not anti medication - but I believe the complete healing experience must include a lot more: Optimum nutritional strategies - a wide variety of natural wholefoods, and avoiding processed foods; reducing or eliminating alcohol and caffeine; regular exercise; sunshine; and most of all - positive engagement with people who understand what is being experienced and can provide genuine care. I found that I had to look outside my usual social group of family and friends to find understanding, which was very tough, as they are the people I wanted to understand. Most people are clueless about bi polar and depression, it is still very much a no-go subject for many, as I am sure others on this thread would testify.

Being depressed or having bi polar does not make us 'weak' - in fact anyone who has endured a major episode of psychosis or depression, or has to live with a metal health disorder is actually very strong. Being able to write about my experience here is liberating !  It's not very often that I get to 'talk' freely with my peers. So, thank you again for sharing your experiences - you are all awesome.

I found the collection of videos on Youtube - bipolar or waking up - very useful.  :thumbsup:

 

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#48 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
November 26, 2013, 01:36:45 am
Lithium sounds grim but am sure it can help some people. Feels like you dodged a bullet there by going down a different route. Diet, exercise and the right people around you are so important. I hope things continue in a good way for you; I thought your post was really honest, nice one.

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#49 Re: The Black Dog... WHO Mental Health Day
November 26, 2013, 09:14:54 am
If you struggle to tolerate Lithium, you could discuss trying Depakote with your Doctor.
It has a better side effect profile, however it isn't always as effecting in controlling the mood swings for some people.

 

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