[Paul B]

We're looking at potentially visiting the Dolomites during  the week of the Queens Jubilee (3rd - 10th). However, as I need to book pretty sharpish I haven't really had time to work out if its a good idea.

Opinions seem somewhat divided about the place itself and just how stuck together it actually is. Tonight one friend who was selling it to use in a big way about a month ago completely flipped and spoke of nothing but the seriousness:

Loose rock,
Snow,
Dodgy Descents,
Poor retreat options,
Even worse weather,
and large approaches.

Although ultimately I'd love to jump on the Brandler I'm quite prepared for that to be out of reach for this trip  and stick to more modest routes, getting to know the area for the future. I've got zero intention of taking Nat somewhere way out our depth as that'd soon crush any future trips I have planned.

Can anyone shed light on logistics; if you camp is it feasible to drive/walk/climb and back around in a day or does it often involve huts? We move fairly fast as a team but if its something harder then the lions share will be on me which inevitably slows things down.

One thing that sticks out as a classic must-do is Don Quixote but beyond that its mainly just 'Big' names that I've heard but actually know very little about. Can people recommend any routes that they've climbed?

I guess I'm wondering if its a good idea or if we'd be better elsewhere; Val-di-Mello for example.

Thanks in advance.

[tomtom]

I've only done some low grade multi pitch bolt (and odd bit of gear) clipping - and there are some fantastic locations. Some of the stuff can be pretty serious - a couple of gents in our group (c.15 of us) tried something quite hard, got up 1.5 pitches and came down - choss, couldnt find the route, bad weather etc..

I suspect its about finding the right mountain and the right route.. alot of the rock has tottering tendencies there, but theres also alot of great solid rock too.

That aside, its a lovely place to stay and theres always some VF aplenty.. Avoid Italian holiday season though...

[Paul B]

We passed through previously when the weather was sweltering for a VF (brigata tridentina) and then back through again where my Dad joined us. The latter was a mistake as there was a fair bit of snow on top and the descent gully wasn't great. Everybody else was wearing some kind of crampons/micro-spikes.

Really I'd see that, and the bolt clipping single pitch options as backup options.

[slackline]

On a two week trip last year we camped in Cortina to start with, this provides a good base as you can easily access to crags (drive then walk) in the Falzarego Pass (Lagazuoi, Tofana, Conque Torre although you can be lazy and catch a chair lift up to here to save walking an hour), then north and east you've got Pomagagnon, Cristallo, Misurina and Tre Cima crags (again drive then walk, although the toll for driving upto Tre Cime was +€20!).

We did one climb on Lagazuoi group on Col dei Bos (South Arete Alvera V+) and you could easily walk round and down from the top on old military paths, Cinque Torre is abseil descent and walk back the way you came.  Did a couple of easy routes on Misurina and again you could walk off.

Then camped at Campitello/Canazi which is ideal for accessing Sella, Piz Ciavazes, Sass Pordoi and Langkolfel.  Many of the Sella and Piz Ciavazes routes can easily be done in a day, although the descent from the Third Sella Tower took us about three hours as we were short-roping down scree slopes and scrambling and then my friend missed the very last ab-station in the descent gully which required some improvisation to deposit us on the only snow we encountered (aside from that which gently fell on us whilst climbing that day) in a dirty hidden corner.  The Messner Route (VI-) on the second tower looks amazing definitely doing that next time I'm back there.  Piz Ciavazes descents are fairly straight-forward too (walk along ledge and descend near the Sella Tower by abseil).  Didn't do anything on Pordoi of Langkolfel, although some of the routes on the later are very long (guide book indicates bivvying).

The final place we climbed was in the Civetta and we stopped at the Vazzoler Refuge (about an hour or so uphill...in the pissing rain!).  Topped out Torre Venezia (via South West Arete) and this was the one route where route finding was problematic and scary (but it was my mates who got lost, run out & scared).  Whilst we didn't consider retreating it would have been feasible with care.  Descent from here was piss, a series of huge solid ring bolts down the back to ab off.

As it was my first time I was wary of the talk of loose rock but didn't find it half as bad as I was expecting, a couple of small rocks on Col de Bois, a bit more crap coming down on the Sella Tower, but this was mainly due to some Russians who were mainly jummaring up after their leader.  In fact most rock fall was due to people above, so if you want to avoid it get up early and be first on the routes.

The forecast for most of the two weeks was pretty poor with overcast and rain forecast for a lot of the time, but in the end it wasn't that bad (although we did climb in rain, hail, sleet, snow and occasionally sunshine).  This wasn't particularly typical weather though (last two weeks of July), which is normally warm and sunny which leads to thunder storms forming in the afternoon (we heard a few rumbles, but often quite a way away).

[iain]

We had a 2 week trip in June last year, mainly based in Cortina then moved to Canazei.

Weather was very mixed (and we found the local forecasts were not that reliable) with lots of afternoon thunderstorms with maybe 4 dry days in the 2 weeks (and 2 complete days wiped out with torrential rain), so we mainly did half day trips on smaller routes where it was easy to get off (and on much easier ground than you're aiming for.) We did several days of bolt clipping/via ferrata because of the weather.

There was still a lot of snow around, and we didn't want to descend off the Tofana di Rozes and di Mezzo without at least crampons, the highest we walked off from without was around 2700m which needed care. The Giro passed through there yesterday and there's still some snow on the north of the passes which wasn't there at all in June.

Route finding could be tricky, including last route of the trip when we thought we'd got the hang of it (although that's probably me to be fair). Descent was never an issue, but then we were always on popular territory with lots of fixed gear.
Loose rock wasn't too much of a problem (no worse than Swanage) but again we were always on popular ground. Avoid the yellow bands (if you didn't know already)

We had no problems getting access to high car parking/huts and no barriers were down. The road to Cinque Torri was open when we were there and you could drive to within 5 minutes of the towers (and higher if you'd wanted although the road got rougher). We didn't go Tre Cime but this time of year is considered low season so you may be ok!?

Have fun 

[duncan]

I think the Dolomites are well worth a visit for the famous big routes on the Tre Cima and Marmolada but I think June is the wrong time for these.  The shorter cragging style route on places like the Cinque Torri and Sella pass would probably be in condition in June but I wasn't so convinced by the quality of the climbing on the routes we did.  You know how lovely the scenery is.

Approaches: Tre Cima is 45 mins, mostly on a flat well-made track.  We walked up by the chairlift to the Cinque Torri (1 hour) but it looks like you can park by the Rifugio in which case it's 10 mins.   Sella pass routes were 10-15 mins from the road.  The Marmolada (Don Quixote, Vinatzer Messner, The Fish etc.) has a longer approach (90 mins to hut and another hour to the routes) and probably needs a night in the hut.

Getting down: The Sella pass and Cinque torre routes generally have fairly straightforward descents.  The Tre Cima descents are longer and more complex and there was some snow in the gullys last July that was quite awkward in places.  I can imagine this might be a big problem in June and could make  descents very difficult.  Every ascent of the Hasse-Brandler logged here is in August (except one and they had to aid it due to wet).   The Marmolada is more complex still: there is a small bit of glacier plus cable car descent (last car down is about 4pm, so little margin for error on the routes) or two hours hike down a glacier.  Again, people mainly climb here in July and August .

Planet mountain is good for route beta.

[Duma]

There seemed to be a lot of snow about in the background of yesterdays giro stage:

[iain]

Duncan knows his stuff.

I should have finished by saying when we go back it will be later in the year.

[Dolly]

Limited experience in the Brenta Dolomites in August.
Some loose stuff, weather came in in the pm and non obvious descents were my experience. Having said that its beautiful there and I'd go again. I'd also stay in a refugio again, even though they are expensive.

[Paul B]

There seemed to be a lot of snow about in the background of yesterdays giro stage:

Yeah, I was told that yesterday, there are a few webcams:
http://www.umbriameteo.com/webcam/trecime/

http://www.fassa.com/EN/Webcam-Val-di-Fassa--Canazei--Passo-Fedaia-Marmolada-Gran-Vernel/

which seem to show a reasonable amount of snow (and aside from skiing I've got no experience of it on routes / descents other than my dodgy VF experience in a pair of Adidas which I'd rather not repeat).

I read a thread on UKC suggesting that it was a fairly non snowy season until recently where a lot fell returning it to around average. I'm not sure how much would go in the next two weeks.

Thanks for the lengthy replies.

[John Gillott]

I was thinking the same thing (about the snow being freshly fallen after a dry winter). You might be in luck as before this fell there was very little consolidated snow on the higher ledges and in the gullies. The fresh stuff should melt fast if there is a warm spell. On the other hand, you might get a fresh dump in early June. If worst comes to the worst, there's a nice little perma dry sports crag with a cake, coffee and beer source next door to it on the road. Number 13 on this list, I think:

http://www.guidedolomiti.com/eng/sport_climbing_and_crags.html#landro

[Will Hunt]

There's a group of us going out in late July and early August. Thanks for the information posted so far, it will be useful. Anyone have any beta on recommended routes that are VS or below and won't result in me having to wash crap out of my undies?

[Paul B]

There's a group of us going out in late July and early August. Thanks for the information posted so far, it will be useful. Anyone have any beta on recommended routes that are VS or below and won't result in me having to wash crap out of my undies?

There's a UKC article with tonnes of suggestions around that grade.

[csl]

There's a group of us going out in late July and early August. Thanks for the information posted so far, it will be useful. Anyone have any beta on recommended routes that are VS or below and won't result in me having to wash crap out of my undies?

Brandler Hasse is Vsomething. Should be fine...

[slackline]

There's a group of us going out in late July and early August. Thanks for the information posted so far, it will be useful. Anyone have any beta on recommended routes that are VS or below and won't result in me having to wash crap out of my undies?

Grab a copy of this, it should cover your needs nicely...



Some easy routes to get going on can be found at Misurina, about three pitches and not harder than Severe/Hard Sever I thought.

[HaeMeS]

I'd say the Dolomites is all about:

Loose good rock,
no Snow,
Relatively easy (but sometimes Dodgy )Descents,
Somewhat Poor retreat options,
Generally Even worse good weather,
and large short approaches.

Be sure to use a good guidebook though. There are a lot of routes that are hideous, dangerous trouserfilling pieces of tottering shit. 

Best guidebooks (but only a selection of routes)are these:
and

Both books are in German - look at it as a good reason to update your knowledge of the German languages - you canuse it on a future trip to the Frankenjura as well...

The Versante Sud guidebooks (Lagorai, Marmolada, Tre Cime) are really good as well (some sell in a Italian, German or English version). The Marmolada guidebook is downright brilliant. It features fullcolour photo-topo's and drawings as well. If you're a first-timer and planning on climbing a route on the south face of Marmolada buy this guidebook of you will get lost - trust me  .

The guidebooks by Stefan Wagenhals cover most of the classic and modern routes: http://www.loboedition.de/dolomiten.html

On www.planetmountain.com you will find a lot of new(er) routes as well as established classics: http://www.planetmountain.com/english/rock/routes/itineraries/home.php

Back to the actual climbing.
Quite a lot of the old routes follow crumbling chimneys or rubble strewn ledges or are silly direttisima style aid-routes (some of the latter go free a pretty hard grades and are fun to climb). Not much fun in climbing a lot of the lesser known routes. Off course the routes that became well known classics are good (Via della Guide on the Crozon di Brenta, Comici of the Cima Grande).

The past 15 years or so a lot of new routes have been put up using bolts. These routes generally have better quality rock than the classic routes. Bolts are mostly placed sparsely and wisely (except on Eddy Boldrin routes...). You'll allmost always have bring some gear as well. 

Good places to start are:
- North facing towers of the Torre Brunico (Ottovolante, Oro e Carbone, Anton aus Tirol, Via Aquafun). Mostly bolted, good rock, easy descent.
- South facing Piz Ciavazes/Sella Towers (north and South facing). Short, good protection, easy descent.
- West-facing Croda da Lago / Lastoni di Formin. Superb rock, relatively short, easy descent, mostly bolted.
- South facing Tofana south face, south-pillars and surrounding westfacing walls. Good rock, all grades, both classics and modern bolt-protected climbs. 

Lots of good sportclimbing in the Dolomites as well! Best area's: XXX south of Transacqua and xXxX on the Grodner Joch/Passo Gardena.


On 'Oro e Carbone', a stunning climb (Torre Brunico).



'Baci di Holonulu + Al Fa' on Piz Ciavazes. Superb slabclimbing follwed by steeper stuff

Have fun!

[Paul B]

Thanks for that, what is your opinion on Jun for a trip with the Marmolada in mind?

[Fultonius]

Going on the 7th of July for 2 weeks. Psyched outta may face!!! 

My non-climbing ladyfriend is coming out for 4 days in the middle. She wants to do some VF, but what else non-climbing is there to do around Cortina? Lakes to swim/sail in? sights to see?

She'll either get a bus from Venice, or I'll pick her up. Will Venice be unbearable for a day in July?

[SA Chris]

Venice will be very busy, very smelly, and very hot. Worth it if you've never been before though.

[duncan]

My non-climbing ladyfriend is coming out for 4 days in the middle. She wants to do some VF, but what else non-climbing is there to do around Cortina? Lakes to swim/sail in? sights to see?

Take her shopping.

[HaeMeS]

Thanks for that, what is your opinion on Jun for a trip with the Marmolada in mind?

We went 2 years ago round this time of year (20th may). Had the hut/wall to ourselves. Perfect conditions, most routes completely dry. Snow on the northern slope, so we got down to the pass in 30 minutes by running/sliding through the snow. I've been in june when everything was plastered in snow. Last year I went twice in august, but could not climb a single route on Marmolada because of the storms and the rock being completely soaked. Generally I'd say best time is end of may, early june and september (but no daylight till 06:00).   

The campsite on the approach/next to the cable car is very good. Friendly people, lots of space and good spots in the woods/next to the river.

Advice on the routes: start with a trade route, like Schwalbenschwanz, Don Q, Vinatzer/Messner or Gogna. Then move up a notch to Tempi Moderni and eventually stuff like The Fish (someday...) . Helps you getting used to the climbing, but more importantly, also the routefinding

Have fun.

[Fultonius]

My non-climbing ladyfriend is coming out for 4 days in the middle. She wants to do some VF, but what else non-climbing is there to do around Cortina? Lakes to swim/sail in? sights to see?

Take her shopping.

I'm pleased to say she has as much of a dislike of shopping as I do.   

[Paul B]

Does anyone have any knowledge of this:

The route is beautiful. Many pitches have few pitons and in my opinion the difficulties are higher than reported in Giordani's guidebook. We ran into a fearsome storm on the summit and in the three rappels of the descent, with lightning and hail. I recommend that you gather information on the weather, on whether the fixed bivy on the summit is open, and--imprtant for first-timers--on the descent. We came down with the cable car, but it was happenstance. It was closed, but there was a maintenance crew. They were not glad to let us go down! Aside from this, the south face of Marmolada is really worthwhile... it's stupendous!

Is this ref ferring to a bivacco or something separate? I'm guessing that in all likelihood the entrance to the lift station will be left unlocked if its a regular thing for climbers to be topping out after the last lift?

Edit: It looks like this: http://www.summitpost.org/radek-and-natalia-walking-towards-marmolada-bivy/518403

We've booked it now but with no real expectations, we'll see whats what and how we manage within the environment.

[tomo]

Paul

I did Don Quixote about 4 years back. Memories fade and I don't have a guidebook to hand but I think the bivvy hut you linked to is further along the ridge. Don Quixote tops out near the cable car station - once you've done two abs to get down to the glacier, you are effectively half way between the top and middle stations and can take your pick on which to go to. About 20 minutes / half an hour from the glacier to one of the stations. I'm pretty sure the top station at least is left open.

We didn't bother with crampons / axe - I was in a pair of inov8s.

Going by other stuff you've done, I think you will find the route technically very easy (although I will admit to gleefully pulling from peg to peg on the VII+ pitch). It goes on a bit but it's nicely straightforward in good weather.

We did meet a couple of guys who had done it in a day walking up from the valley but it would be a big day and you'd need to be fit.

Any other advice I can give, just shout.

Tom

[Nibile]

everyone here has much more experience about the Dolomites than I do!!!
nice!!!